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New Day

Three Terrorist Attackers Shot and Killed in London; President Trump Tweets on Travel Ban; Interview with Sebastian Gorka. Aired 8- 8:30a ET

Aired June 05, 2017 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: And that was seen as a major indication of the true desire of the ban, which was to target Muslims. So Trump is under fire not just for those tweets and expressions of policy intention but for how he reacted to the London terror attack. Why did the president go after London's mayor when he was in a moment of crisis?

Britain's prime minister says that police now know the identities of the three London terrorists. That's our headline from the investigation. We have it all covered for you. Let's begin with CNN's Joe Johns at the White House. A lot for to you take care of this morning, Joe.

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: That's for sure, Chris. The president's tweets all about immigration and his controversial ban on travelers from six majority Muslim countries, but one of the most interesting takeaways is the president this morning seems to be complaining about the administration policy of Donald Trump and executive orders that, in fact, he's had to sign off on.

Let's begin with the first tweet, "People, the lawyers and the courts can call it whatever they want, but I'm calling it what we need and what it is, a travel ban," this despite many attempts by members of his staff to label it something other than a travel ban.

Then there was this, the second tweet, "The Justice Department should have stayed with the original travel ban, not the watered down, politically correct version they submitted to SC," of course meaning Supreme Court. That's a reference to the first travel ban executive order which could have been construed and was actually shut down by the courts because it appeared to be a pre-textual and discriminatory, especially since the president of the United States, as a candidate, had called for a complete and total shutdown of Muslims entering the country.

Here's the third tweet, "The justice department should ask for an expedited hearing of the watered down travel ban before the Supreme Court and seek much tougher version." And the last tweet, "In any event we are extreme vetting people coming into the country in order to keep our country safe."

So what is the reaction, first of all, from administration aides? I spoke with Kelleyanne Conway a little while ago. She of course is a senior adviser for the president. And when I asked her about it, the tweets this morning, she essentially said why do you obsess so much about the president's tweets as opposed to what he did? I said to her, well, these are tweets by the president of the United States, to which she gave me no answer.

Alisyn, Chris, back to you.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Joe, these are statements, I mean, these statements of policy. We can call them tweets which I think somehow minimizes it, but this is how he really feels. So thank you, Joe, for all of that communication that you've had and you've shared with us.

We will be speaking with one of the president's advisers momentarily. But to our other top story. Britain's prime minister says officials know the identities of the three London terrorists who killed seven people and injured 48 others. CNN's senior international correspondent Clarissa Ward is live in London. What have you learned, Clarissa?

CLARISSA WARD, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Alisyn. Just behind me is Borough Market where the attack took place last night. You can see there is still a large police presence here. We've seen forensics teams going into that cordon. They know the identity of the three attackers. They're not sharing it with the public yet, and they have been continuing with raids, searching four different homes, arresting 11 different people as they tried to determine for sure and conclusively that the network does not stretch any further. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WARD: British authorities are scrambling to determine if the three attackers are connected to a foreign terror network. London's metropolitan police carrying out of a number of raids and arrests as ISIS claims responsibility for Saturday's attack, although no evidence currently exists to back up the claim.

Neighbors at this raided apartment complex stunned after recognizing one of the dead attackers, who they describe as a quiet family man.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The man I know he was a wonderful guy.

WARD: One woman, however, did have concerns which she claims she brought to police.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All of a sudden we saw this gentleman, individual, speaking to the kids about Islam, and showed them how to pray.

WARD: Locals showing CNN the mosque they believed one of the attackers attended, though authorities have not confirmed his identity. London police say the three attackers began their killing spree using a rented white van that sped across London Bridge around 10:00 p.m. Saturday night, plowing into pedestrians.

MARK ROBERTS, EYEWITNESS: It knocked down several people, came within about 20 yards of where I was. It knocked somebody nearly 20 feet in the air.

[08:05:01] WARD: Emergency vehicles rushed to the scene as police responded to more violence at Borough Market, where the attackers had driven, before getting out of the van with knives and randomly attacking people inside restaurants and cafes.

JACK APPLEBEE, EYEWITNESS, LOCAL RESTAURANT OWNER: There were these three men standing there, one with a machete, and this one girls started saying that they're stabbing everyone, they're stabbing people.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He only stepped outside the pub for a second, and a man run up to him, said this is for my family for Islam, looked him straight in the face and stabbed him.

WARD: These patrons hunkering down fearing for their lives, as others fled the scene.

LUKA MILACIC, WITNESS, CANADIAN VISITOR: People were literally running away as fast as they possibly could.

WARD: Minutes after the first calls for help, London police say eight officers shot 50 rounds, taking down all three attackers. One bystander was shot in a hail of bullets.

THERESA MAY, PRIME MINISTER, UNITED KINGDOM: There is, to be frank, far too much tolerance of extremism in our country.

WARD: Britain's prime minister condemning the three recent terror attacks, vowing a sweeping review of the country's anti-terror laws.

MAY: Enough is enough.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WARD: A lot of people here are hailing the heroism of Britain's police. One policeman who was unarmed except for his police baton actually tried to take on the attackers. Three police men were wounded. And it's important for our viewers to know that the time it took from the moment the attack began to the moment when the police shot the three attackers dead was just eight minutes. This was a very rapid response. Part of the reason they were so quick to use lethal force is because the men were wearing fake suicide vests. Of course police were not to know at that time the vests were fake. Chris and Alisyn?

CUOMO: Fifty rounds were used when they took down those three men, and eight minutes is impressive. Clarissa, thank you very much.

Joining us now is the deputy assistant to President Trump Sebastian Gorka. It's good to have you, sir.

DR. SEBASTIAN GORKA, DEPUTY ASSISTANT TO THE PRESIDENT: Thanks for having me.

CUOMO: So Sean Spicer, everybody else around the president scolded the media, stop calling it a travel ban this executive order. That's not what it is, you fake news people. AND then President Trump says what we've known all along, Sebastian. It is a ban. He likes that it's a ban. He likes the original ban, and that's what he wants everybody to know. Why play the games?

GORKA: There are no games. The president can call it whatever he likes because he has the constitutional authority to control whoever comes into this country, Chris. That's his job. The constitution, tradition, precedents, and administrative law give him that right. If he wants to call it a ban he's the president, he's the chief officer of this administration, and he has every right to do that.

CUOMO: Right. And why wasn't the administration just honest about it all along? Why have Sean Spicer and you and everybody else say it's not a ban. It's just vetting. And you're trying to make it sound like something it isn't. The president just proved what the truth is. All this has been spin, and a distraction. Why?

GORKA: I'm not going to fall into the trap of us being the spin- meisters when CNN is one of the greatest purveyors of fake news. The fact is it's been the same since the beginning, from the first E.O. to the second E.O., it's one thing, Chris. It's about protecting Americans. And if anybody out there has a problem with us trying to keep Americans safe, then they need to look in the mirror and they need to ask themselves whether they are the purveyors of fake news.

CUOMO: Sebastian, it has always been about who it targets, how it targets them, and whether or not that is what will keep us safe, and you guys played games about it and said it's not a ban. I could play you Sean Spicer right now, but you know it's true. And then the president decides to be honest about it this morning. That is spin. You are the purveyor of spin because that was your message, that it wasn't a ban, and it was untrue. That's why I'm asking you.

GORKA: So I guess President Obama was also a purveyor of spin with that calculation, because the executive order is based upon the Obama White House analysis of the seven nations of greatest concern for immigration to America. Is he a purveyor of spin, Chris?

CUOMO: Well that's an interesting question, and while I --

GORKA: It is, isn't it?

CUOMO: And while I like that you must get away from President Trump and policy as quickly as possible.

GORKA: Not at all.

CUOMO: And blame Obama for everything.

GORKA: I'll talk about it for the next hour.

CUOMO: I'm sure you would, and eloquently so. However, the facts are not your friend here because that move with executive order from the Obama administration was about travel to those countries. It was about who's coming in and out and why. Your order is about Muslims, about targeting Muslims and keeping them out.

GORKA: Chris, let's stop that.

CUOMO: And allowing those who are not Muslim a carve-out to come in. Very different.

GORKA: Let's do a little 101, a little trivial pursuit. What is the most populous Muslim nation in the world, Chris?

[08:10:01] CUOMO: You tell me. These are your answers.

GORKA: No, you tell me the biggest Muslim nation in the world. Massive population.

CUOMO: I want to give you the opportunity.

GORKA: You don't know.

CUOMO: Assume I know nothing. Go ahead.

GORKA: It's Indonesia. I will assume you know nothing. What is the largest Arab nation in the world?

CUOMO: You tell me.

GORKA: Egypt. So if this had anything, and I mean anything, to do with race or religion, why would those two nations, the most populous Muslim nations, and the most populous Arab nation, not be included on the executive order? Explain that logic to me, because this is where your spin fails. This is where the fake news propaganda collapses, because if we had some dark, dread ulterior motive, then those are the first two nations you would put on the list, not the seven nations that the Obama White House identified as greatest concern. So please answer that question.

CUOMO: I will, I will. First, what the Obama administration did was target travel from places that were known as hubs for terror, and that's different than what you're doing because you're targeting nationality. You could add Saudi Arabia. Fifteen of the hijackers came from there. They're not on your list. There's speculation as to why.

But instead of looking who you didn't involve, you must look for legal and policy purposes in who you did involve. And those countries are all Muslim majority. You did a carve-out for non-Muslims. And that's why it got struck down originally, allegedly recognized as being overreaching by people like you, which is why you drafted a second one, which the president said he authorized and approved of and is now before the courts for scrutiny. So the intention is clear that you wanted to target Muslims from those places. I see that you're a little slow to want to own that.

GORKA: No, I'm still waiting for you to answer why would you not include Indonesia and Egypt. You still haven't answered the question. If it was about what you said it was about, then those would be the logical nations to include, but we didn't. So how do you explain that, Chris?

CUOMO: I explain it by you going with the original model to make it easier to pass because you were mimicking what Obama did and therefore masking your true intention was to not make it about travel, make it about Muslims. And as you well know not just in your own rhetoric but the president, he has said time and again that he thinks there's a problem with Islam, and that he thinks that the Muslims may have a problem with us. And as you know, with what we're seeing in the U.K. right now, attachment to the community of Muslims is so important, and the concern is that a move like this, trumpeted by the president in the midst of crisis in the U.K. sends an ugly message to our Muslim community here in the United States.

GORKA: Well, unfortunately, what you've just spun is classic fake news.

CUOMO: What is fake about what I said? What is factually inaccurate?

GORKA: There are no facts there. You are saying we used an Obama era analysis to quote --

CUOMO: You used his executive order.

GORKA: -- to cloak our intention. Can you give me one piece of evidence for that?

CUOMO: Yes, the language. You picked the same countries, was that a coincidence? No.

GORKA: No, because that's what government does. Government looks at analysis.

CUOMO: You picked the same countries. That's a fact.

GORKA: What is your proof we had another intent? Give me a piece of proof.

CUOMO: The language from the president.

GORKA: That's not proof.

CUOMO: The same thing district courts seized upon was that he clearly wants to keep Muslims out of the country, right or wrong. The people voted for Donald Trump in part on that issue, but his intention is clear.

GORKA: So that must be the intention of the Obama order as well, to keep Muslims out of the nation.

CUOMO: Again, the language is different which is why it wasn't challenged in the courts the same way. It was about who is traveling in and out of there and the potential for those governments to let or even harbor bad guys.

GORKA: Your selective choice of fact is really quite telling, because you do know that we did this with Iraq under the Obama administration and the administration didn't even tell anybody. Why is that?

CUOMO: I don't know exactly about their not telling people. What I do know is that the United States administration worked very closely with Iraq in particular to build up its vetting capabilities, because of the unique nature of the threat there, and that's why there was the concern, when you guys included Iraq, and then you took Iraq off the list, which then raised questions about security intentions because obviously you have more concerns of people coming out of Iraq than the other countries.

GORKA: Let's get beyond your spin, let's talk about facts.

CUOMO: I don't think it's spin. I think that it's a little bit of logic that you're having a tough time dealing with, especially in light of what the president said this morning.

GORKA: We're here to do one thing. We're not here to discuss your spin. We're here to protect Americans. So answer me this question. When the last administration forbad the State Department looking at the public postings on the Facebook pages of foreigners applying for visas to America, do you think that was a good move?

CUOMO: I think that you have to judge the administration on how safe --

GORKA: Yes or no?

CUOMO: It's not for me to opine on an administration's --

GORKA: You're opining the whole time about the Trump administration, Chris. Be honest. You're opining the whole time. Your show is opining.

CUOMO: I am not opining. I'm asking you questions and I'm pushing back on your own arguments and you're good at making them. The word forbade that you use is not the one that I would have used, and when you look --

GORKA: It's a good idea not to look at Facebook postings.

CUOMO: It wasn't just Facebook postings. It was instant messaging which isn't public so it would have been going into her private communications.

GORKA: Don't change the subject.

CUOMO: No that's a fact. I'm adding a fact to what you're putting out there.

GORKA: But you're not answering the question. They were forbidden from looking at public Facebook postings, is that smart protecting Americans?

CUOMO: We have concerns here about privacy. It is an evolving dialogue with the American people.

GORKA: Facebook is not private, Chris. Facebook is not private. You know that, right? Twitter is not private.

CUOMO: Instant messaging --

GORKA: I'm not talking about instant messaging.

CUOMO: I know but that's where the information was contained with the wife in San Bernardino.

GORKA: I'm asking about the regulations.

CUOMO: It's easy to over talk when you don't like the answer.

GORKA: You won't answer the question, Chris, it's really telling.

CUOMO: I just did.

GORKA: No you changed it, you pivoted to messaging.

CUOMO: I'm including the actual salient fact for you, Sebastian, which is --

GORKA: But you're not answering my question.

CUOMO: It's not about her Facebook public posts. It's about her private instant messaging.

GORKA: That's a good policy.

CUOMO: It's a debate to have about your policy as is banning Muslims. Is that what you want? It's a policy consideration.

GORKA: I think it's fascinating that you will go to any degree not to criticize the last administration but will opine in conspiracies --

CUOMO: I don't think that's true or fair at all.

GORKA: That's why your viewing figures are in attack.

CUOMO: Actually we're up over 100 percent year over year. Don't let the facts get in your way. You're good at avoiding them.

GORKA: Unless you're being mandatory in every airport in America you're in a tank, Chris.

CUOMO: We're up 100 percent year over year, Sebastian. So what you said is foolishly wrong. Not just abuse of fact but it's silly with its own logic. It's the CNN has benefited so greatly from the current dialogue and the demand for fact and testing power that it is demonstrable by any metric you want to use. But I don't care about that. Let's put that to the sides.

GORKA: Chris, you're just comedy now. It's just comedy.

CUOMO: Let's put this on. You may think it's comedy, but I want to address things that really matter to people.

GORKA: Getting two viewers is not a 100 percent increase.

CUOMO: That's not the numbers. Those aren't the numbers involved.

GORKA: Chris, you're playing games. You're playing games.

CUOMO: Good try. Good try. I give you points for that, Sebastian. Next time I see you --

GORKA: Good spin, Chris.

CUOMO: But this isn't about CNN's success because that's obvious.

GORKA: It's about relevance.

CUOMO: How the president is doing and what's relevant are the tweets that the president put out this morning where he said what we believed all along and you guys have denied, which this is a ban and he put his arms around the original order which obviously targeted Muslim populations, which is a fine political argument to make and let people judge it. We saw it play out in his response to London. Are you OK with him going at the London mayor in a time of crisis?

GORKA: I just find it really disappointing that not only did you have one of your staff on before me for several minutes to discuss the president tweets that now we're eight minutes into this interview and you're doing it again. Let's talk about policy. I'd like to talk about policy --

CUOMO: That is the policy. His tweets are the policy. They are statements from the president of the United States.

GORKA: They are not policy. It's not policy.

CUOMO: Of course, it is.

GORKA: It's social media, Chris. It's social media. You know the difference, right?

CUOMO: It's his words, his thoughts.

GORKA: It's not policy, it's not an executive order. It's social media. Please understand the difference.

CUOMO: I think that you need to have a little bit of an understanding here. The president says this is what I want.

GORKA: You're a journalist.

CUOMO: What are you saying we shouldn't listen to what the president says?

GORKA: You shouldn't obsess about it for now 12 minutes, Chris.

CUOMO: But if he says this is what I want to do on this particular issue, why would I say, well, until he says it, I guess what, to my face that I'm not going to pay attention? GORKA: You're talking about one tweet, Chris, should we spend the whole program on it?

CUOMO: I think that to call it a tweet is to run away from significance.

GORKA: It is a tweet. What else is it, a bowl of petunias?

CUOMO: If I wrote you a letter saying one thing or I said it to your face, what's the difference?

GORKA: This is national security.

CUOMO: That's right. Maybe you shouldn't tweet about it but he chooses to.

GORKA: To judge national security in a time of things like the Manchester and London attacks based upon social media statements is irresponsible of you, Chris.

CUOMO: Irresponsible of me to report --

GORKA: Of you.

CUOMO: -- what the president of the United States says?

GORKA: It's obsessed for now 20 minutes, yes, you're obsessing.

[08:20:04]I just want to get this straight. I want to make sure everyone understands your point. The president of the United States decides multiple times to tell the entire world what he wants our travel policy to be with respect to these Muslim countries, and you're saying ignore it because it's a tweet, and not a piece of paper that says executive order on it. That's what you're saying?

GORKA: Now you're arguing from extremists and it's again disappointing. Did I say ignore? I said don't obsess about it. We're 20 minutes into this and this is clearly an obsession, Chris. Let's talk about the executive order and what that says, because I would love to discuss the substance of that, because that's what we're doing to protect Americans. But if you want to keep talking about the tweet, then you're not serving your audience well or the American public.

CUOMO: I think I'm giving them exactly what they need which is the information and the analysis about the heart and mind of the president --

GORKA: You're not analyzing the facts.

CUOMO: -- on an issue, listen, the fact is that he took the opportunity in the wake of London to say this is why I want the travel ban, and the original one.

GORKA: You're doing it again. CUOMO: -- the one that targets Muslim majority populations. That's what he wants, Sebastian. You may not like it. It may be inconvenient for you --

GORKA: That's a lie, Chris, I work for the president.

CUOMO: So he didn't tweet those things?

GORKA: That we are targeting people based upon religion, if we were Indonesia and Egypt would be on the executive order.

CUOMO: The fact that you did not make it worse does not defend what you made it original. The fact that he took these countries on Muslim majority is a fact and you made carve out for non-Muslims, that's a fact, and you should own those facts. The president is.

GORKA: Chris, Chris, you're doing a disservice to your viewers and to America, and security of this nation. The president is interested in one thing, making sure that terrorism doesn't happen in America. That's what the executive order is about, but if you want to keep talking about a tweet, then you're not serving that purpose either. You have responsibilities as well.

CUOMO: It's a message from the president, one policy question while I have you. It's in a tweet.

GORKA: Another tweet now? This is crazy.

CUOMO: Has there been other to the word to of the consulate to review visas more stringently, has there been official change in policy that we should know about where vetting is concerned?

GORKA: Well, this is not the Obama administration. We don't give away sensitive information, OK? That's up to leakers, that's up to people who thought that you can give away your game plan, like when we're going to attack ISIS in Mosul. We don't do that. We take this stuff seriously.

So the procedures we are following are being followed in the way the bad guys can't gain them. Don't ask me to tell you what we're doing on television so the bad guys can game it. That is irresponsible, Chris.

CUOMO: Giving information as the president to the Russians though about intelligence, that was OK though, right? What's coming out of the White House on a regular basis to the media about what's happening --

GORKA: Chris, you are obsessed. This is amazing. Just amusing. Let's talk about national security, not conspiracy theories.

CUOMO: Sebastian, obviously when the president tweets about what he wants out of his executive order for travel policy --

GORKA: You're doing it again. You got to move on, Chris.

CUOMO: Sebastian, that is what it is though. It just is. Listen, I appreciate you being here to talk about it.

GORKA: It's a tweet.

CUOMO: The president tweets that's method he chooses.

GORKA: Social media, Chris.

CUOMO: The mind and intentions of the president. I appreciate you coming on the show to discuss your perspective as always.

GORKA: Thank you, Chris.

CUOMO: You be well, Sebastian Gorka.

GORKA: You, too.

CUOMO: Alisyn.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: All right, let's discuss that interview and more. We have conservative opinion writer, Jennifer Rubin, who wrote a piece for "The Washington Post" denouncing the president's response to the London terror attack, and also with us, former U.S. ambassador to Russia, Thomas Pickering. Great to have both of you here.

So Jennifer, just so I can understand what Sebastian Gorka I think was telling us, pay no mind to the president's tweets. Those aren't important.

JENNIFER RUBIN, "WASHINGTON POST" OPINION WRITER: It's astounding to me. This is a man who works for the president of the United States and they're trying to run as far away from it as possible because, of course, it completely undercuts their entire spin for weeks and this is the problem with the president. He's like the world's worst client or the world's worst witness.

You get them all prepped to say one thing and boom, he's off and running in another direction. The problem is that we have a president who is not focused on the right things, who creates controversy, who has taken the worst possible opportunity to attack the mayor of a city that has been attacked by terrorists?

That's a serious problem. There are serious concerns about this president's mental stability and there are serious problems when you have a president of the United States so erratic, so unreliable.

This is incredibly damaging and the notion that what the president says and what he communicates to the world is not policy, is ridiculous.

[08:25:04]What the president says matters. It does make policy and if you're afraid for the president to use social media, take it away from him.

CAMEROTA: Ambassador, should the president's tweets on the travel ban, et cetera, et cetera, matter? AMBASSADOR THOMAS PICKERING, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO RUSSIA: Of course, they should, and district courts and the Courts of Appeal have already decided that they do, so I think for the judicial process, on which we're about perhaps to go to another higher step that's undoubtedly true.

I agree with what Jennifer has had to say. She and I don't agree on everything, but on this one she certainly reflects the views that I have that you can't have a president one day says tweets are not germane, what I say doesn't count, I'm just president of the United States.

On the other hand, have a whole tradition of 230 years of experience where what the president says is U.S. policy, and it's lunatic to believe in fact that people can look at the president and somehow divide does he have a green light above his head on the tweet that says this is policy and a red light that says it isn't?

We have no possible way of knowing. It's kind of what I would call studied lunacy, if that's what we expect to have in terms of a president who one day is obviously reflecting the policy, the next day is reflecting some personal hang-up, that shouldn't be counted at all.

The president has access to the media because he's president and what he says in the media counts and words mean something.

CAMEROTA: Yes, what the president says means something, or it doesn't, if you listened to his staff some days. Some days they say the tweets speak for themselves. Some days they say may no mind to those tweets. They're just social media. Hardy har.

It's very hard to know which ones to take seriously. Jennifer, you had a very I think strong response to the president's response to the London terror attacks.

You write this in "The Washington Post," "Sure, Trump's policies and rhetoric are incoherent and based on a tower of lies, far worse, however is his appalling character, which accelerates the erosion of Democratic norms and social cohesion, a diverse democracy requires.

The London attacks bring out the best in Britain and in western leaders on the European continent, it brings out the worst in Trump and his followers."

But Jennifer, just to push back on you, he didn't offer condolences first. Condolences, maybe those are cold comfort at this point. Maybe people want to hear what the president is going to do. So he talked about his travel ban and his political agenda instead of condolences.

RUBIN: Well, I think this is not the behavior of an ally. What you do when an ally is stricken by a terrible, terrible attack is you do express condolences. That does matter, it demonstrate to the world that we stand shoulder to shoulder with Britain who was arguably our closest ally. Secondly, it was not simply a sin of omission but a sin of commission over and over again. Why would he attack the mayor of the city that was attack? Why would he use that as a political opportunity to push his political agenda which is the travel ban which has nothing directly to do with the attack?

We don't even know where those people were British citizens or not and likewise, when he goes on about we have to get smart. We're not doing this, it's like he's not president of the United States.

If he thinks there's something that we're not doing and we're not smart enough, where is the evidence that he has changed policy that he has adopted policies that are improved from the last president?

So it's his tone, his vulgarity, his lack of self-control. That communicates something to the international community, it communicates that America is unreliable, is off kilter, is a little loony right now, and I think it's incredibly difficult.

At the same time we're asking our allies to do a lot of things for us, join the war on ISIS, share intelligence, and perhaps reinstate some sanctions against Iran. Why would they do us a favor, if this is how we behave in an emergency? It makes no sense.

CAMEROTA: Ambassador, the president seems to think that his travel ban is the best step that he can take towards protecting the U.S. do you agree?

PICKERING: No, I don't, and I think I need to pick up on some of the things that Jennifer just said at the end. The president doesn't think strategically. Three years ago when ISIS became in fact the ruling organization in Northern Iraq and Northeastern Syria, we were totally concerned with the caliphate.

That was a reasonable concern, and we mobilized the military force to deal with it, but we forgot the fact that as the caliphate began to crumble and it's taken more time than I'd like.