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President Trump Orders Russia Documents And FBI Texts Declassified; Stormy Daniels Shares Details Of Alleged Affair With Donald Trump; CNN Reality Check: Shaming The Shamers. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired September 19, 2018 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:33:04] JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: President Trump defending his order to selectively declassify secret documents and text messages from the FBI related to the Russia investigation. The materials include portions of the FISA application on former Trump campaign aide Carter Page, along with interview notes which are normally closed -- normally closely-guarded by the FBI.

Democrats say this is an abuse of power, so is it?

Joining me now is CNN national security analyst, Gen. Michael Hayden. He is the former director of the CIA and the NSA.

Let's listen to what the president said here before we start, General, about this. About why he wants all this information out in the open.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We want transparency. What I want is I want total transparency.

This is a witch hunt. Republicans are seeing it. The Democrats know it's a witch hunt, too, but they don't want to admit it because that's not good politics for them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: So is this just transparency, General?

GEN. MICHAEL HAYDEN (RET.), CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST, FORMER DIRECTOR, CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY AND NATIONAL SECURITY AGENCY: No, of course not, John.

And it's odd that a president who would not release his tax returns demands transparency from an ongoing, still active counterintelligence investigation in which he's a least a person of interest, could be a subject, and could eventually end up being a target.

This was done for political purposes.

So let's just parse out the different parts. He's taking a FISA application that's already been made public but heavily redacted, and now demanding that agencies of the U.S. government unredact about 20 additional pages. So that by definition, John, he's saying making public those things that you have already decided their exposure would put at risk sources and methods. And that's beyond just the corruption for political purposes of the process.

And then, he wants the interview notes and the text messages from his enemies list put out there in the public so, frankly, I think that his conspiracy-minded surrogates can go through it, seek -- searching for the unguarded moment of the incomplete thought, the unwise word to further stir this pot and delegitimize the ongoing investigation.

[07:35:19] BERMAN: So let's break this up a little bit.

We are talking about the FISA application for Carter Page and what they want unredacted is about 20 pages from, I guess --

HAYDEN: Yes.

BERMAN: -- the fourth renewal as it were. We already know a great bit about what these FISA applications were for Carter Page because they were released and parts of it were unredacted.

And they were concerned about meetings he was having with Russians in Russia prior to the election. They were concerned, in part, about his past as being involved in an FBI investigation about his connections with the Russians.

So what could be in the redacted part that would be a threat to national security -- that would tell us something we don't know or something that you would deem to be dangerous?

HAYDEN: Sure, it would be to my -- to my way of thinking -- and since they've already been redacted I suspect that I'm onto something here. It would be additional sources and methods that were used to justify the FISA application.

And oh, by the way, in one sense John, it's a win-win for the president because if the institutions push back on the grounds that I just suggested, the president has another talking point about the so- called deep state not be willing to either follow his direction or be open with the -- with the American people.

And oh, by the way, John, the White House announcement has directed that the organizations reveal this information.

BERMAN: Right.

HAYDEN: And all they've committed to doing publicly -- Justice, FBI, and the director of National Intelligence -- is to review the information. So we may have a real bureaucratic roadblock in our future.

BERMAN: Well, what do you mean here because John Brennan, former CIA chief, has said that he thinks that Director Wray and others should push back actively? I think the implication there is that this is a request that is perhaps worth their jobs.

Do you think that's the case?

HAYDEN: It's getting very close to it John and I'm slowly moving to the point -- now look, this is really easy for a guy out of government with his pension to talk about.

And now, you've got these men in these jobs with family and personal considerations. And above all, the consideration they have of trying to make things right for their institutions. So in many ways, all day, they're heroic by staying there.

But sooner or later we're going to come to a point where what the president demands is so egregious -- and oh, by the way, John --

BERMAN: Right.

HAYDEN: -- not beyond the president's authority here -- it's just wrong, though that he exercises the authority in this way -- that the right thing for them to do to signal the alarm, to send up the flare is to simply say if you want this done, Mr. President, it's going to have to be done by someone else.

We may be getting close to that point.

BERMAN: We may be getting close -- are we there, though? Is this that time? Is this such -- you used to call it unprecedented. You call it egregious.

Is this so unprecedented, so egregious that you think that Dir. Wray and maybe DNI Chief Coats should quit?

HAYDEN: I think it becomes quite clear that we are at that point. If in this process where the president says reveal, they say we're reviewing -- and after review they come up and say Mr. President, this stuff here just can't go out and he insists that it does -- at that point they have to conclude that they're no longer a guardrail on illegitimate presidential activity.

They're no longer able to protect their institution and therefore, by leaving they may be doing the greater good. A tough call.

BERMAN: And there -- and there's the FISA stuff there. The text messages are peculiar. He wants all the Russian-related text messages from James Comey from the time he was director of the FBI.

Is that even legal?

HAYDEN: Well, you may have really genuine privacy concerns now in addition to whatever classification concerns you might have with regard to the FISA application.

So, once again, we could -- we could easily see the Bureau pushing back, saying law does not permit us to do this without a thorough redacting. And if the president simply says do it, you now have this crisis moment for the leadership of the Bureau.

BERMAN: And we've just got about 10 seconds left.

There are people who will look at this and say you're talking about this on CNN. Isn't CNN always about getting as much information as possible, and we are. And if this information does come out we will report it.

So what's wrong with that?

HAYDEN: So, John, I was thinking this through.

When I was on the other side of the ball and I was getting the phone calls from you guys, there were many times when I thought I could tell you something that would convince you your story was wrong or you should not be running with this story. But I could not do it because what it was I would need to tell you would create further harm to the United States.

[07:40:13] The president doesn't seem to be making that decision.

BERMAN: General Michael Hayden, great to have you with us this morning -- appreciate it.

HAYDEN: Thank you.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: John, I don't know if you're aware of this but Stormy Daniels has a salacious new tell-all out.

BERMAN: I hadn't heard.

CAMEROTA: Well, let me tell --

BERMAN: I hadn't heard. What are some of the most salacious parts?

CAMEROTA: Oh, OK, listen to this. There are graphic details about her alleged affair with Donald Trump before he was president. We have all the details, John --

BERMAN: You don't say?

CAMEROTA: -- just for you --

BERMAN: You don't say?

CAMEROTA: -- next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAMEROTA: John, let's get to your favorite segment of the day.

Stormy Daniels is sharing exclusive details of her alleged affair with Donald Trump. The adult film star's new book is called "Full Disclosure" and it comes out in two weeks.

But, Twitter is already buzzing about certain graphic parts that are comparisons to video game characters.

BERMAN: Let's be clear, I'm a PG guy in a PG-13 world.

CAMEROTA: OK, we're --

BERMAN: So what's going on here?

CAMEROTA: We are going, I would say, XXX here.

BERMAN: I'm PG.

CAMEROTA: Sara Sidner has read the book and she joins us live with her book critique from Los Angeles. Hi, Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We're the only ones that have the book right now. I've read every single word. I wish I could forget some of what I read but I cannot.

[07:45:02] I will get to -- one of the first parts of the book where she sort of talks about when she met Donald Trump and they were at a golf tournament. She was there with her porn company. They were some of the entertainment, sort of meeting and greeting people.

And then at some point, she ends up, as we all know -- we've heard the story -- she ends up in his hotel room in Tahoe. And she writes that when she walks into the hotel room she gets a shock because she says, "Trump came swooping in, wearing black silk pajamas and slippers."

BERMAN: As one would.

SIDNER: And she says -- as one does -- and she says "What are you doing? Go get some f-ing clothes on."

So the reason for that is she thought she was going to dinner with him, she said, and she walks in and he's like in his pajamas. And she was like, what's going on here? She says that he did actually put his clothes on and they had a conversation.

Now, here's where things -- and a lot of people are like I can't believe this happened. So as they're having a conversation he starts asking about family. They start talking about family and Melania comes up.

And she says to him hey, "What would your wife think of you being here with me?

And she says that he responds, "Oh, don't worry about that. It's not a big deal. And anyway, we have separate bedrooms."

Then he pulls out a picture of Melania holding their newborn baby, who was just four months old at the time, Barron. That has a lot of people talking because after that the two of them, she writes, had sex.

CAMEROTA: And then there's this part where she describes it as "the least impressive sex I've ever had." Can you expound on that for us?

SIDNER: Sure. There is explicit -- and I do mean explicit details about the president's genitalia she describes both in size and shape. She is very, very candid in her writing.

You may be wondering why? Why would you do that?

She's already told her story and -- but the president has been very clear through his spokespeople and through his attorneys. He has all this time denied that there was ever an affair -- or excuse me, ever a sexual encounter, although he himself has never uttered her name. But he's always done it through spokespeople or an attorney.

And so, she is -- does not like being called a liar and so she decided that she was going to describe things very explicitly.

BERMAN: So, Sara, having read the whole book, and especially this part, do you think this is either a) to sell books, b) to --

CAMEROTA: Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.

BERMAN: Well, but it could be more -- b) to provoke a response from the president to keep this back-and-forth -- this political back-and- forth going, or c) all of the above?

SIDNER: Look, there is no way that this doesn't have anything to do with selling a book -- I mean, part of these details. But I will tell you that most of the book is really about her life and it's about her early life. And there are some extremely heartbreaking segments in there.

She talks about being raped as a 9-year-old child repeatedly. She talks about her difficulties growing up in the home that she grew up in -- neglect.

There are some very, very personal stories in there that have nothing to do with the president. In fact, that is a very small portion of the book. But, of course, it's getting all the attention because we are talking about the man who would become president and who is currently the President of the United States and so, of course, that's what everybody sort of jumps to.

But it is a very revealing book and I have to say it's quite good. I got through it very, very, very quickly but I remember a lot of the details of that book and that doesn't happen every single time.

But yes, I think she doesn't like being called a liar. She does want people to read the book. And, you know, there's a certain sense of pride, I think, that she has as well.

If you ask her attorney, Michael Avenatti, he will tell you she is trying to show proof that this actually happened because it has been denied continuously.

BERMAN: So, Hillary Clinton had that cameo -- albeit on the phone, I should note -- in this book -- explain.

SIDNER: That was really surprising. It's one of the big reveals in this book.

Basically, she said look, when she met Donald Trump, the reason why she kept going back and talking to him and seeing him -- she saw him three times -- is because he kept promising her that she would be on "THE APPRENTICE." And remember, he was starring on "THE APPRENTICE" at the time.

So in 2007, she ends up in a hotel room in Beverly Hills at the Beverly Hills Hilton and she's with him in there watching "SHARK WEEK" on T.V. -- he hates sharks -- and the phone rings, she says. And she writes look, the phone rings. I can hear Hillary Clinton's voice -- he says her name -- and I can hear her voice on the phone.

And here's what she says happened after Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton hung up. According to her book she says, look "When he hung up, he was effusive about Hillary. I love her," he said. "She is so smart."

[07:50:04] Fast-forward to the next election and -- well, things have changed, let's just say.

CAMEROTA: Of all of the juicy details in there, that one may be the most eyebrow-raising. And we never even got to her love of video game --

BERMAN: All right, Sara Sidner -- Sara Sidner, thank you very much. Thank you for this week's edition of book club.

Next week, "Charlotte's Web." Appreciate it, Sara.

(LAUGHTER)

All right.

President Trump heads to the Carolinas this morning to see the damage from Hurricane Florence and the destruction. It is far from over. More than a dozen rivers in North Carolina are currently at major flood stages.

The governor is telling thousands of evacuees not to return home yet -- it's not safe.

The storm is blamed for at least 36 deaths.

CAMEROTA: All right.

Meanwhile, "SESAME STREET" is making it clear that Bert and Ernie are not lovers -- they're just friends. The creators of the show released a statement saying the puppets had no sexual orientation after a former writer told an online LGBT magazine that the puppets were gay.

"SESAME STREET's" response prompting outrage on social media, with some calling it anti-gay. BERMAN: So the deal here is Frank Oz, who is the original Bert -- Jim Henson was Ernie -- has come out and said look, we created these characters, and when we created them they were not gay.

Frank Oz also says but who cares? Who cares what they are?

CAMEROTA: Great point. I mean, why must everything be seen through that lens --

BERMAN: Right.

CAMEROTA: -- after we've done our Stormy Daniels segment? Why does everything be seen through some sort of sexual lens? I mean, that -- they are obviously, very close friends.

BERMAN: Very close friends.

CAMEROTA: Yes. I have more questions, now seeing it, about the uni -- the monobrow that -- I guess that Bert is sporting, yes.

BERMAN: It is Bert. I can confirm that from a second source (ph).

Up next, a cautionary tale of how kind and just how cruel we can be to one another. So have you seen this viral video? You may have.

We have the whole story, and the whole story will surprise you. Our "Reality Check" is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:56:19] CAMEROTA: OK.

And now to a video that went viral, that demanded more explanation.

John Avlon joins us with a very interesting "Reality Check." Hi, John.

JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Hey, Ali.

So, cruelness, cruelty, and a cautionary tale about the mob mentality of social media.

You may have seen this video of a man named Anthony Torres, shaving on a New Jersey commuter train. It went viral, gaining nearly three million views since it was posted less than a week ago.

Now, filmed in secret, it tapped into the trend of stranger shaming and without any sense of context, commenters piled on.

"He's a pig," they wrote -- a slob. "Disgusting, entitled, an animal." One person called him just a "dumb drunk."

And it wasn't just the social media trolls. Soon, several media outlets joined the pile-on, calling the video "the grossest thing to happen on anybody's commute." And the shaver, the "rudest commuter in America." And then, real journalism happened. The "Associated Press" found out the stranger's name -- 56-year-old Anthony Torres -- and told his story.

It turns out he's a man who's faced hard knocks his entire life. A man who suffered two strokes in as many years. A man who's been in and out of homeless shelters and had just left one that morning.

What the video captured was not some arrogant slob, but a man who just got a fighting chance to start again. A man on a borrowed train ticket who just wanted to look presentable when he saw his brother for the first time in a long while.

Quote, "They don't know the real me," he later told "The Washington Post". "It's been rough. There were a lot of nights where I laid under the bridge and cried."

Now, social media has done amazing things to shrink our world and remind us of our common humanity. But it can also do the opposite, sparking a mob mentality that attacks individuals for the sin of being different. It helps divide the world into us against them.

There is a silver lining here, though. Some of the same community that tore Anthony down is now trying to build him back up.

A GoFundMe page set up by a stranger has raised more than $27,000. Anthony's now staying with his brother who told the "Post" he'll help manage the money.

And several of Torres' critics have taken to Twitter to apologize.

The case of Anthony Torres is a challenge for us all to do a bit better. To rise above reflects of cynical snark and to find our better angels.

Perfect's not the on the menu for any of us but we need to at least try to make kindness cool again.

The technology may be new but the lesson's as old as time. As the old adage goes, "be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle."

And that's your "Reality Check."

BERMAN: It's a nice one. If you're looking for better angels on Twitter though, you're going to have to look really, really hard.

CAMEROTA: But I mean, as John said, some people apologized. That's unusual.

That was a tearjerker of a reality check, John. That was really nice. I mean, I think that we do need to have this conversation about social media.

AVLON: Yes. CAMEROTA: And, of course, everybody just jumps to sort of the snarkiest, nastiest response. And this is a good lesson -- a teachable moment for all of us.

BERMAN: It's why you left. Why you --

CAMEROTA: That is why I left.

BERMAN: Yes, why you left.

CAMEROTA: That's why. And I'm not convinced that it's time yet to go back to Twitter, but stories like this are encouraging.

BERMAN: All right. We are following a lot of news, so let's stay on it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LISA BANKS, ATTORNEY FOR CHRISTINE BLASEY FORD: Any talk of a hearing on Monday, frankly, is premature.

SEN. BOB CORKER (R), TENNESSEE: If she does not want to come Monday, we've got to move on and vote.

SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D-NY), SENATE MINORITY LEADER: If you don't want the hearing to be just a he said-she said, an independent investigation by the FBI is essential.

TRUMP: I feel terribly for him. This is not a man that deserves this.

REP. ELEANOR HOLMES NORTON (D), DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA: I don't see how you could throw her cold into a hearing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's important that we hear from witnesses, not least of which is Mark Judge.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is wildly unlike anything Brett Kavanaugh would do.

SEN. MAZIE HIRONI (D), HAWAII: This is what they did to Anita Hill. It is time for all of us to say end this kind of treatment.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Alisyn Camerota and John Berman.

CAMEROTA: And good morning, everyone. Welcome to your NEW DAY. It is Wednesday, September 19th, 8:00 in the east.