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Ex-Officer Guilty On All Counts in George Floyd's Death; Biden After Chauvin Guilty Verdict: "We Can't Stop Here". Aired 5-5:30a ET

Aired April 21, 2021 - 05:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to viewers here in the United States and around the world. I am Brianna Keilar, alongside John Berman. And it is Wednesday, April 21st.

The front page of the "Minnesota Star Tribune" says it all: Convicted. The newspaper describing the guilty verdict in Derek Chauvin's murder trial of a moment of victory in a history of injustice.

[05:00:02]

Overnight, spontaneous celebrations breaking out across the country. America collectively exhaling, nearly one year after the murder of George Floyd.

In George Floyd Square, large crowds gathered with fist raised, a better sweet victory that came with the stiff price particularly for George Floyd's family.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PHILONISE FLOYD, GEORGE FLOYD'S BROTHER: Being able to know that it's justice for African-American people, just people of color, period, in this world, this is monumental, this is historic, this is a pivotal moment in history.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Derek Chauvin waking up in prison this morning. The judge revoking his bail immediately after the verdict. Sentencing takes place in eight weeks, the other three officers at the scene with Chauvin go on trial together in August.

President Biden said he believes the conviction can be a giant step forward in the fight against systemic racism, although he insists it's not nearly enough.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSEPH R. BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Knee on the neck of justice for black Americans.

Those are George Floyd's last words. We can't let those words die within. Keep hearing those words. We must not turn away. We can't turn away. (END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: We can't turn away.

Let's go straight to Minneapolis and CNN's Adrienne Broaddus, live on the streets.

Adrienne, good morning. A different morning in Minneapolis and the country.

ADRIENNE BROADDUS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Indeed, John, a calm and quiet morning. And on this morning, that officer who made arrest here in the city of Minneapolis was taken into custody wearing handcuffs. Derek Chauvin is waking up if prison today, a place he could spend the next 40 years of his life and as he wakes up in prison members of the Floyd family say they were finally able to sleep.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BROADDUS (voice-over): After more than ten hours of deliberation --

JUDGE PETER CAHILL, HENNEPIN COUNTY DISTRICT COURT: Members of the jury, I will now read the verdict.

BROADDUS: The jury deciding the fate of the former Minneapolis police officer who held his knee on George Floyd's neck for more than 9 minutes last May.

CAHILL: We the jury on the above entitled matter as to count one, unintentional second degree murder while committing a felony find the defendant guilty.

BROADDUS: Derek Chauvin, guilty of second degree unintentional murder, third degree murder, and second degree manslaughter, the judge revoking Chauvin's bail before he was handcuffed and taken into custody.

BEN CRUMP, ATTORNEY FOR GEORGE FLOYD'S FAMILY: This is a victory for those who champion humanity over inhumanity. Those who champion justice over injustice.

BROADDUS: Marking the end of three weeks of testimony, in a trial centered around a bystander video showing the final moments of Floyd's life.

KEITH ELLISON, MINNESOTA ATTORNEY GENERAL: I would not call today's verdict justice because justice implies true restoration but it is accountability, which is the first step towards justice.

BROADDUS: Outside the Cup Foods store now known now as George Floyd Square, silence erupting into cheers of cautious celebration and sorrow. Mixed emotions shared by Floyd's family here in Minneapolis and watching on screen more than a 1,000 miles away in Texas nearly one year after his murder.

PHILONISE FLOYD, GEORGE FLOYD'S BROTHER: I'm going to put up a fight every day. Because I'm not just fighting for George anymore, I'm fighting for everybody around this world. Today, we are able to breathe again.

BROADDUS: President Joe Biden and Vice President Kamala Harris speaking with them on the phone Tuesday.

BIDEN: We're all so relieved. Not guilty on one verdict, but all three. Guilty on all three counts. And it's really important.

BROADDUS: Biden and Harris later addressing the nation, but the president warning that while the verdict may be a moment of, quote, significant change, it's not enough.

BIDEN: We can't stop here. In order to deliver real change and reform, we can and we must do more to reduce the likelihood that tragedy like this will ever happen and occur again.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROADDUS (on camera): Earlier this morning, I spoke with Floyd's aunt and cousin. They call him Perry.

And they told me, Darnella Frazier's courage led to this moment and it reminded me of the conversation I not only had with Darnella Frazier but her 9-year-old Judeah Reynolds. She testified at the start of the trial about a month after Floyd was killed, she told me that the entire day she asked Darnella to take her to the store because she wanted to purchase some Starbucks.

[05:05:04]

And she said, finally, her cousin said, okay, let's go. And the little girl told me, if we didn't go to the store at that time on that day, they would still kill us. I said who is "they"? She said police.

So, through the 9-year-old she saw the magnitude of the video her cousin captured -- John.

BERMAN: What would have happened if not for that video? They truly were America's eyes and ears that morning, a heavy burden for children.

Adrienne Broaddus, thank you so much for being there for us. Appreciate your reporting.

Derek Chauvin has been convicted but sentence is yet to be decided. Here to explain what he could be facing, CNN legal analyst, Elie Honig. He's a former state and federal prosecutor.

Elie, maximum penalty that Chauvin could face.

ELIE HONIG, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yeah, John, well, Derek Chauvin has now been convicted of all three charges against him. Murder in the second degree, maximum of 40 years. Murder in the third degree, maximum 25 years and manslaughter, maximum 10 years. Now, if these charges related to different conduct, they could be run

what we call consecutive, meaning back to back to back. However, all three of these charges relate to the same conduct the killing of George Floyd. So, they'll run what we call concurrent, meaning at the same time.

So, as a practical matter, the maximum sentence Derek Chauvin faces is 40 years.

BERMAN: Forty years the maximum. How much is he likely to be sentenced?

HONIG: Two different questions, right? Minnesota has what we call sentencing guidelines. What these guidelines do is tell the judge where he should, doesn't have to, but should sentence any defendant.

Now, if we do the calculation for Derek Chauvin, you have to start with the person's criminal history score. Derek Chauvin has never been convicted of a prior crime. So, he's going to be in the lowest category, which is zero. Then you have to find the highest conviction, the highest crime he was convicted of.

Here, that is going to be doing this, murder in the second degree unintentional. And so, that leaves us with a range, a recommended range of 128 to 180 months, the recommended sentencing for a judge is 150 months, which is 12-1/2 years.

BERMAN: Twelve and a half years, the likeliest possibility. But there are aggravating factors. The judge during this moment said he's going to take eight weeks to review what's called the Blakely matter here. This deals with aggravating factors in this crime. What does that mean?

HONIG: Exactly. So, the prosecutors have made clear to the court. They put in the motion saying, they're going to ask the judge to go up from that 12-1/2 years based on five factors that the prosecutors are arguing.

First, that George Floyd was a particularly vulnerable victim because he was handcuffed when this all happened.

Second, that Chauvin acted with particularly cruelty. They talked about the method of snuffing out a man with your knee, while the crowd stood by and beg --

BERMAN: Nine minutes --

HONIG: Nine minutes and 29, exactly.

Third, abusive position of authority. Derek Chauvin abused the badge. He was a police officer.

Fourth, Chauvin committed the crime as part of a group of three or more people. Now, this is interesting. Remember, three other police officers are charged here they're going to be tried in August. That's the state's argument that this was a group of four people committing this crime together.

And then, fifth, there were children present. Of course, we heard from some of those children, as young as 9-year-old eyewitness who testified at the trial.

And you remember that moment when Eric Nelson, the defense lawyer, talked to Derek Chauvin in front of the judge because normally the defendant has the right for the jury to find those factors. Chauvin said no thanks. I'm going to have the judge find those factors which given what the jury just did to Chauvin, probably was a good call.

BERMAN: Yeah, the jury didn't seem to have any trouble convicting him all three counts. If he had left to the jury, it's possible that may give him an even stiffer sentence.

What do you think the judge is likely to come up even with the aggravating factors, which in this case seems somewhat definitional? I mean, you can't argue the fact there were kids there.

HONIG: Yeah, I got to tell you, John, in my experience, any time I've done murder case and I haven't gotten convictions, the judge goes to the top. I mean, usually, the ones I've done in the federal system have resulted in life sentence.

Now, this is a state system. It's different. But I think the argument as a prosecutor is he took a man's life, 40 years is the appropriate sentence. It depends how many of those aggravators the judge finds.

BERMAN: Elie Honig, very interesting. Thanks for helping us understand.

HONIG: Thanks, John.

BERMAN: Brianna?

KEILAR: Joining us now, we have CNN legal analysts Joey Jackson and Paul Callan. Joey is a criminal defense attorney. Paul is a former New York City homicide prosecutor.

This case, Joey, there's something different about it, there are many things that are different about it and even the 9-year-old who was a witness to what happened knows that the video is the biggest thing, how key was that?

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Brianna, this is a compelling moment in history. Good morning to you. Good morning, Paul. Good morning, John.

Look, the bottom line here is you have a video capturing exactly what happened here. It was very difficult I think to watch the video for everyone waking up a year ago, right, looking at this -- and almost a year ago, and saying, what is this? How inhumane is this? What happened? Is this even real?

And so, then, the question became, after looking at that video that everyone had a visceral reaction to it. What now? [05:10:00]

what's going to happen? And then the fight began. So, you had a case where everything was documented.

But notice, Bianna, Not withstanding the documentation of this, there was a level of discomfort based upon the history of police being prosecuted. What is that history? We see officers if they're arrested to begin with, right, they are not indicted. If they're indicted, they're not convicted. So many examples.

You have New York with the Eric Garner case. No indictment there. Even though he said, I can't breathe. I can't breathe. We all saw that. No indictment, no accountability as to the officer.

You have Philando Castile right there in that jurisdiction in Minnesota, only four years ago, right? And you have a lack of conviction there. So, here, I think with the visceral reaction to that, I think with the blue wall of silence crumbling down and people in positions of authority, Brianna, saying, you know what, this is not what we do. This is not the sanctity of life that we value, as the chief had indicated.

You had Lt. Zimmerman, of 40 years, saying, that's not how we operate here. And you have other officers, and so, that crumbled. People told it like it is.

And as a result of that, you had the jury having the courage and strength to see the evidence for what it is, coming back with a conviction, big moment in time and I think this just represents a new era that everyone, everyone has to have accountability. No one is against the wall or above the law and here we are with a conviction as to all three counts, as Elie Honig very well explained on that wall.

BERMAN: You know, Paul, what Brianna is asking, we took about it before the show too, is as we look at this going forward, will it take all of this, though, to get a conviction? Yes, this was different. We got a conviction here. There was a conviction here, which is different in cases in the past.

But look at everything that was required to get that conviction. You know, will future cases always meet this incredibly high bar?

PAUL CALLAN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, you know, John that's a great point because everything that Joey just said, I agree with completely as the reasons for the conviction. I think, obviously, the blue wall of silence did collapse. Other police officers came in and testified.

This was a case involving really very unusual degree of cruelty in the way the way death was inflicted on George Floyd with innocent bystanders saying, please, he's dying, leave him alone. But you had another factor. You also had.

You had Derek Chauvin who just protected arrogance and cruelty throughout the act. You had extreme amounts of public pressure in the way of demonstrations across the United States. But you had something else, and I think this is what you're getting at.

But you had something else. I think this is what you're getting at. There were enormous resources dedicated to the state of Minnesota. There may have been anywhere from 10 to 15 lawyers affiliated with the attorney general's office of Minnesota devoted to developing this case.

They went out and got the finest experts in the United States, on expert for -- the use of expert force by police officers, excessive force, as well as medical experts, toxicology, pulmonology, medical examiners, cardiovascular experts. And they put it all together magnificently.

And then they brought in two outside lawyers. You know, both of those lawyers who we saw were private lawyers who came into the A.G.'s office to try the case. All of that in one case. Now, we're not going to see that in other cases.

So, I think this is a watershed moment. This is an important case because it demonstrates if you put the resources into a case, you can convict even a police officer of commission of a murder like this. And I think it sets a precedent for the nation. But we can expect they will be devoted to all of these cases in the future.

KEILAR: Joey, one of the lawyers who was brought in, one of the outside lawyers, he issued a plea pretty much yesterday after the verdict came down. He said that he was asked to help, and he said to other lawyers, if you're asked to help, don't overthink it. Say yes.

Do you think that at least -- I mean, it's not going to be in every case. But do you think in more cases that is a plea that is going to fall on the ears of receptive lawyers who will aid a prosecution or defense?

JACKSON: I think without question. And I think even before taking the step of looking at lawyers and examining. And, by the way, Paul, being a former prosecutor myself, a number of us were in that that position. So, let's not forget, they're very competent and responsible prosecutors who are to the task, who can do the job.

But even before going and pivoting to the issue of having to prosecute these cases, these cases even more significant than that. Why? Because what you do when you convict is you deter. You send a message that, you know what, you are going to have your reckoning.

You are going to have your coming to justice moment. You are going to actually sit before a court and you're going to have to account for your conduct.

And so, what this does I think, even before getting to a courtroom is it gets to the street, and it lets officers know that, listen, and let's be clear. You have officers out there. My dad, may he rest in peace, you know, love to them, obviously. We all love our parents, right, was out there on the beat doing his job and always told me that the best tool he had, gun, night stick, anything else, was the ability to communicate, to have empathy, to have compassion, to have sympathy, to have understanding.

But I think what this does Brianna to the heart of your question, it lets every officer know that they need to use the discretion in a way that really values the law, that values the sanctity of life, and take such importance into their dealing interactions with people. So, let's hope that based upon that, we don't get to the courtroom. We will, because things will happen. But on the street level from a cultural level, a training level, an experience level, on recruitment level, let's get the officers who are doing the job, doing it well and who are respecting communities and not violating them.

KEILAR: It is obviously a widespread issue, a series of issues that need to be addressed here. Thank you so much, Joey. Thank you, Paul. There is new audio of President Biden's conversation with George Floyd's family, what he told them about the verdict and the future of a police reform bill named in George Floyd's honor.

BERMAN: Plus, another police shooting, minutes before the Chauvin verdict was announced, the brand-new bodycam footage coming up.

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[05:20:42]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: Most men and women who wear the badge serve their communities honorably, but those few who failed to meet that standard must be held accountable, and they were today, one was. No one should be above the law and today's verdict sends that message.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: President Biden addressing the American people after Derek Chauvin's guilty verdict calling it a potential giant step forward in the march toward justice in America.

Vice President Harris stressing that racial injustice is a problem for every American regardless of their race and she called for change.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Today we feel a sigh of relief. Still, it cannot take away the pain. A measure of justice isn't the same as equal justice. This verdict brings us a step closer and the fact is we still have work to do. We still must reform the system.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: CNN's Jeremy Diamond is live for us at the White House with more -- Jeremy.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Brianna. President Biden describing the killing of George Floyd yesterday as

murder in the full light of day that he said that ripped the blinders off of the systemic racism that too many Americans know all too well. This is what we saw from President Biden yesterday, was trying to measure the fact that on the one hand, this was a giant step forward potentially in the march towards equal justice while at the same time acknowledging that verdicts like this are all too rare in the United States of America.

Vice President Harris making similar comments saying, feeling a sigh of relief. But both of them really trying to seize on this moment to talk about changes to go forward in the future. We heard President Biden yesterday also in the form of audio and video released by Attorney Ben Crump as President Biden after watching this verdict come down while he was sitting in the White House with Vice President Harris, both of them then calling the Floyd family.

I want you to listen to this remarkable audio of President Biden speaking with the Floyd family.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hello?

BEN CRUMP, FLOYD FAMILY'S ATTORNEY: Say hi, how are you doing?

BIDEN: Feeling better now, and nothing is going to make it all better. At least God now there's some justice.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Right.

BIDEN: You know, I think -- I think of Gianna's comment, my daddy's going to change the world is going to start to change now.

CROWD: Yes, yes. Amen.

BIDEN: Start to change it now. You're incredible family. I wish I was there. And I could put my arms around you I'm standing here. (INAUDIBLE) we've been talking, we've been watching every second of this, the Vice President, all of us.

We're so relieved, not just for one verdict, but all three, guilty on all three counts. It's really important and I'm anxious to see you guys. I really am. We're going to get a lot more done. We're going to do a lot. We're going to stay at it until we get it done.

CRUMP: Hopefully, this is the momentum for the George Floyd Justice in Policing Act to get passed to have you sign.

BIDEN: You got it, pal. That and a lot more. (INAUDIBLE) a lot more.

(END VIDOE CLIP)

DIAMOND: And that George Floyd Justice in Policing Act is what we heard from the Floyd family and from President Biden and Vice President Harris yesterday as they reacted to this verdict. This policing act would ban chokeholds, ban no-knock warrants, established a national registry for police misconduct. It's been passed by the House and the White House is hoping to use the momentum from the verdict to get it passed in the Senate. That's the call to action we heard from President Biden just yesterday -- John.

BERMAN: Really interesting to hear the audio of that phone call, to hear the full phone call play out. There does seem to be a connection between the president and the Floyd family that now goes back a year.

Jeremy, thanks so much for being with us.

So, former President Obama and former first lady released a statement overnight. It reads: Today, a jury in Minneapolis did the right thing. But if we're being honest with ourselves we know that true justice is about much more than a single verdict in a single trial.

[05:25:01]

True justice requires that we come to terms with the fact that black Americans are treated differently every day. It requires us to recognize that millions of our friends, family and fellow citizens live in fear that their next encounter with law enforcement could be their last. And it requires us to do the sometimes thankless, often difficult, but always necessary work of making the America we know more like the America we believe in.

Again, the former president and first lady which was eloquent.

Amanda Gorman, though, the poet, whom I like to refer more of than almost anyone, said, you know, victory would be George Floyd being alive.

KEILAR: That's right, this is a turning point and I think that's why it's a turning point but it does not erase the tragedy of what happened. And that is what I think so many feel it yesterday as they were watching this.

It was so bittersweet --

BERMAN: Right.

KEILAR: -- because this may be bending that arc but where do you go to get to the point where someone doesn't die in first place?

BERMAN: Necessary but not sufficient, it can't be an end, right, it can't be an end. It has to be a step along the way.

So just as the Derek Chauvin verdict was handed down, a teenaged girl fatally shot by police in Columbus, Ohio. We got the body camera video in overnight. We've had a chance to see it, what does it show? That's next.

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