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Dramatic Scenes As Protests Turn To Looting In South Africa; Gloria And Emilio Estefan Live On Unprecedented Protests In Cuba; Rep. Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY) Discusses Democratic Party Becoming Too Woke. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired July 13, 2021 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:30:00]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Feels betrayed.

MICHAEL WOLFF, AUTHOR, "LANDSLIDE: THE FINAL DAYS OF THE TRUMP PRESIDENCY": Absolutely. I mean, there -- it is very -- a very clear quid pro quo. He put them on the court. He defended them. Therefore, it is their obligation to defend him.

And, indeed, throughout the election challenge, Giuliani would say to the -- say to the president -- as they lost court case after court case after court case, Giuliani would say well, it doesn't matter because we're going to get to the Supreme Court. He would say -- even say it's good we lost this case. We get to the Supreme Court faster and, of course, the Supreme Court is -- will decide for us. They are in -- they are in our pocket.

BERMAN: I want to leave with this question here. So where does this go from here? What does it mean that there is this person who you think is untethered from reality and borderline crazy saying these things? It clearly has an impact with people who follow him.

WOLFF: Yes -- no -- and I think -- I mean, there are these two interesting sides. All of the people closest to him completely reject almost -- I mean, they acknowledge his delusion and they reject his delusion. But we have a good part of the country -- 25 percent, 30 percent, maybe 40 percent who is totally in the thrall of this -- of this man.

And there are two questions. Where does this -- what does this mean, where does this go, and how did this happen? And maybe the how did this happen question is the one that we have to -- that we have to answer.

And my answer to that is that Donald Trump is not a politician. He doesn't care about being a politician. He is a performer and that's the thing that moves him. The thing that moves him is the attention of other people and he has so connected -- aligned this -- he will do whatever he has to do to sustain that attention.

BERMAN: Michael Wolff. The book is "Landslide." I appreciate you being with us. Thanks so much. WOLFF: Thank you.

BERMAN: Just ahead, Cuban-American hitmakers Gloria and Emilio Estefan join us live. Their hopes amid the sudden and historic new uprising in Cuba.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: And could Democrats pay a price for being too woke? We will ask a top Democrat on the Hill.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:36:39]

KEILAR: South Africa's deploying its military after days of violence and looting. What began as protests over the imprisonment of a former president has since spiraled out of control. At least 10 South Africans are dead and more than 700 have been arrested, according to authorities there.

CNN's David McKenzie is live for us in Johannesburg. And, David, the president is calling for calm as he's deploying the military here. What effect is this having on the chaos?

DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Brianna, the chaos has been just all across the country, particularly where I'm standing. You can see the military behind me. They're on patrol.

If you just join us here for a short moment -- if you could just wait there, sir -- the military has been trying to stop people from looting malls across the city today. Earlier, there was just signs of complete impunity, Brianna. People looting -- taking what they can for hours. No real presence of the police until the military came in. There has been at least one instance of live rounds being used that I witnessed.

And as you can see, this would normally be a vibrant part of south Joburg right now. It's the -- the army is out here with their automatic weapons trying to restore calm. The president said he wants calm to be here in the country but really, they haven't listened.

This is all stemming originally from the imprisonment of a former president of South Africa, Jacob Zuma, which kicked off this violence and looting. Then you really get a sense it's criminal elements that are taking advantage of the situation. We've seen so much chaos today and yesterday throughout the city.

This is Soweto -- the famous Soweto. This mall over my shoulder is one of the shining lights of this area -- completely gutted. And it's very tragic to see that this country, in the midst of a hideous wave of COVID-19, there are even vaccination sites that have been stopped from operating the last few days.

The military is thin on the ground despite what you're seeing behind me and there really is a sense that calm needs to be restored now in South Africa -- Brianna, John.

KEILAR: Wow, the scene is really just unbelievable there, David. We know that you'll keep an eye on it. David McKenzie live for us in Johannesburg -- John.

BERMAN: The government of Cuba cracking down on dissent following the unprecedented nationwide protests. And new information emerging about the suspects in the assassination of Haiti's president.

CNN reporters covering the new hotspots on America's doorstep.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MATT RIVERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on camera): I'm Matt Rivers in Port- au-Prince, Haiti.

The more time that goes by the more we learn about the suspects in this assassination, including from some new reporting from my colleague Evan Perez who reported on Monday night that several of the suspects in this assassination actually had direct ties to U.S. law enforcement agencies as informants, including at least one suspect who worked previously as an informant for the Drug Enforcement Administration. The DEA admitting that in a statement but saying at no time were any of these suspects working on behalf of the DEA during this assassination.

Still, the longer the time goes on the more links between what happened here on the island and the United States seem to be appearing.

PATRICK OPPMANN, CNN HAVANA CORRESPONDENT (on camera): I'm Patrick Oppmann in Havana where Cuba's president has said that the thousands of protesters that took to the streets to call for change are criminals. He has called on supporters of the revolution to take back the cities and towns where we saw these unprecedented protests. And throughout the day on Monday, there was a heavy police presence.

[07:40:11]

There's also been widespread internet disruptions as apparently, the Cuban government is trying to prevent Cubans from posting pictures and videos of the protests on social media.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GLORIA ESTEFAN, CUBAN-AMERICAN SINGER, SONGWRITER, ACTRESS, BUSINESSWOMAN: Singing "Cuba Libre."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: That is "Cuba Libre," the title of this 1998 hit by Gloria Estefan and her husband, Emilio, written as an homage to their homeland.

Gloria Estefan is an award-winning Cuban-American singer, songwriter, actress, and businesswoman, and she emigrated to the U.S. from Cuba in 1959. Emilio Estefan is a Grammy award-winning producer, songwriter, director, and businessman who fled the country as a teenager. Gloria and Emilio joining us now from separate cities here at the moment. I am so eager to talk to both of you about what we are seeing in Cuba. I know that you left when you were just two, Gloria, but it really -- being Cuban-American just defines so much of your art.

And so I'll start with you, Gloria, if you can just speak to what you are feeling as you have been watching these protests and this crackdown, unlike anything that you have seen in your lifetime.

G. ESTEFAN (via Skype): Absolutely. You know, we were raised on Cuban water and soil through our parents because the plan was always to go back. They never thought they would be here this long. Of course, this amazing country opened its arms to all of us -- a lot of Cuban- Americans now that thrive here.

And what we want for Cuba is the freedom that we enjoy here and throughout many parts of the world. It has been frozen in time for a long time.

And seeing these things is both -- is bittersweet because we know that it's necessary. We know that what they're doing is what needs to be done and this has to come from the Cuban people. They have to raise their voices to say they've had enough.

And at the same time, we know the repressive measures that the government takes over people. They are shutting down the electric. They've isolated them from the world. Of course, the minute social media came into play everywhere in the world we knew that this would also be a big opening there and it would be a big danger for the government.

So I think we're seeing the cracks in this system that has been able to keep them isolated so long but through the advent of the internet and social media, it's just getting out of their hands. And I just hope that it's with as little violence as possible because it's a very repressive government.

KEILAR: Yes, we're seeing, Emilio, the government respond by trying to shut down social media. There's only one telecommunications company in Cuba so this isn't particularly hard for the government to do.

Do you think those limits will quell the protests and quell the discontent from many Cubans?

EMILIO ESTEFAN, GRAMMY AWARD-WINNING PRODUCER AND SONGWRITER, (via Skype): Absolutely -- people are desperate. Let me tell you, the worst thing to happen to Cuba right now is technology. So many years, so many people dying, so many political problems, prisoners. It has been so difficult for people.

Even the -- I was thinking this morning, we are only 90 miles from the United States. Sixty years, people have been -- I mean, so bad for everybody.

KEILAR: Gloria, I know that there are many things about this moment in particular that have Cubans extremely frustrated -- that are driving them to the streets. There is a lack of medication. There is a high COVID rate. There is lack of food.

You have sanctions from the United States that means Cubans aren't getting the help that they might ordinarily get from family in America.

What is it to be Cuban at this moment?

G. ESTEFAN: Well, for the Cubans there, it's very difficult. And I have to say, I personally don't agree with isolating Cuba from their family members. I think travel is crucial and I think that's one of the difficulties that they are experiencing is for many years, we exiles were the gross national product of Cuba -- well over a billion dollars a year going to the island, but going directly to the families.

The embargo -- the U.S. embargo -- what it does is sanction the government. And the biggest embargo has been from the Cuban government to its people because they have well been able to buy goods from anyone else. China -- the U.S. buys a lot of goods from -- all of Latin America. Yet, somehow they end up in the tourist shops being sold to tourists at prices that Cubans can't afford.

So the embargo that needs to end is the embargo that the Cuban government has on its people. They have the goods and they don't give it to them. It's a very difficult situation.

[07:45:00]

And the easier it is for family members to help their family there is only going to help the people. Those sanctions are very difficult for the Cuban people there at this moment.

KEILAR: Emilio, what is your message to protesters?

E. ESTEFAN: What I said -- you know, we bring life to Cuba. I think we're really getting close because technology is showing the world everything that we've been doing for so many years. So much pain, so many prisoners, so many people died trying to come. I mean, it's so difficult for the families out there. But I see even the old generation -- how they feel so happy.

But it's happening. It's about time. I mean, so close to the United States. We just ask the world to look at this and to help us to break from this thing.

KEILAR: And, Gloria, your message to the Biden administration?

G. ESTEFAN: To the Biden administration, they need to open their ears and try to find what ways we can help the Cuban people.

When I was in the U.N. -- I was a public delegate in the United Nations in 1992, the year that we -- that the U.S. lost the embargo vote for the first time because of the tourist (INAUDIBLE) act and the Cuban Democracy Act that punished third countries or countries -- U.S. companies in third countries from dealing with Cuba. We need to find new ways. They wouldn't let the emissary that the U.N.

sent to check on human rights on Cuban jails -- they wouldn't let them into Cuba. This is a rogue government that doesn't listen to anyone, that doesn't care what sanctions or what may be put upon them. They want to -- they're punishing the Cuban people for speaking out and saying the things that they need to say.

I think this has to be a world pressure on Cuba. The other countries in Europe are in there. They have businesses there -- France, Italy, Spain. I would ask all of these countries to support the people that are speaking out and that are trying to express their desire to be free. And this needs to be a world event.

There is not one government or one thing that can be done that is going to sway the government, in my opinion. So we have to give as much support to the people that are speaking out and try to get organizations in. I don't know how because it's really -- it's been impossible even for the U.N. to do so. But to try to support these people that are now being jailed for speaking out.

And the more that we spread that word throughout social media and throughout any way we can, the more difficult it is for the Cuban government to keep a lid on what's going on there.

KEILAR: Yes, this unprecedented moment in Cuba that we are witnessing.

Gloria and Emilio, thank you for joining us this morning.

G. ESTEFAN: Thank you very much, Brianna.

KEILAR: And up next, do Democrats have a wokeness problem? We ask the chair of the House Democratic Caucus.

BERMAN: And what former President Trump wanted to do to leakers. New revelations about his last months in office.

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[07:50:44]

BERMAN: Democrats control the White House, the House of Representatives, and they're clinging to the slimmest majorities in the U.S. Senate, but some Democratic strategists are worried that the gains they made in 2020 could be erased.

Here is legendary Democratic strategist James Carville.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES CARVILLE, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I get tired of people saying they're woke and are tired of being woke. People want -- after this pandemic and stuff, people want to go about their lives. They want to enjoy it. They want to enjoy their friends. They don't want to be nervous about how you address them or talk to them or anything. And, you know, that's just where people are. (END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Joining us now is Congressman Hakeem Jeffries, Democrat from New York and the chair of the House Democratic Caucus. Congressman, thanks so much for being with us today.

It's not just James Carville, it's Eric Adams, who is now the Democratic nominee for mayor here in New York City, who says Democrats can't be so idealistic that they're not realistic. What do you think of that?

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): Well, I think that the most important thing -- and President Biden is doing this and I think that Eric, as mayor, will do this -- is to solve problems for everyday Americans.

I agree that the people that I represent in predominantly Black neighborhoods like Bedford-Stuyvesant and other parts of central Brooklyn don't talk like that. They don't use the language woke. They're concerned about housing displacement, gentrification, educating their children, quality of life issues, a rise in gun violence.

And so I think what's continue to be important -- and we're seeing this leadership from Joe Biden -- is for us to solve problems in these areas. And if we do so, we'll continue to be successful politically.

BERMAN: And I want to talk in a second about one of the problems you think is being solved today with people starting to receive money from the child tax credit. But the question is -- and David Gregory put it this way on our show yesterday -- and to a certain extent, it may not be fair, but what he suggested is the way that some of this stuff is being used against Democrats could be harmful to Democratic aspirations.

So how concerned do you have to be about how certain things are being used against Democrats, whether it was defund the police, which was last year and most Democrats say they don't want to defund the police anyway, or the argument over critical race theory, even if it is something that, frankly, is being created by the right?

JEFFRIES: Well, this is an issue that is a result of the fact that the Republicans really aren't a functional party right now. In many ways, they're just a cult of personality relative to Donald Trump. They've got no views. These are people who are supporting the insurrection, by and large, and abandoning democracy.

While at the same time, Democrats are fighting to crush the virus, to provide direct relief and assistance to everyday Americans, as you indicated. We're going to do so in a phenomenal way with respect to the child tax credit payments that begin this Thursday, July 15th. That's going to be transformational.

We're going to revive the economy and build back better and create opportunity in every single zip code.

We've got issues that we are working on and the Republicans don't. So they're always going to manipulate, attack, and try to confuse the American people. Our challenge will be to continue to do the work and to get our message out.

BERMAN: You talk about the child tax credit. Thirty-six hundred dollars for children under six, $3,000 for children six to 17. This is spaced out over time. The first payment, July 15th.

This, at least as of now, is temporary. It's a one-year thing. So you talk about it being transformational. How is it transformational if it's just for one year?

JEFFRIES: Well, because people are struggling right now and President Biden and the Democrats are very clear. When we emerge from this pandemic we're not going to go back to normal because there were challenges pre-pandemic. Almost half the American people reported that they couldn't afford a sudden unexpected $400 expense.

And so, we've got to create a better situation for middle-class families, for working families, and for low-income families. That's what the child tax credit payments are going to do beginning this month and continuing through the end of the year. And then certainly, as we deal with the end-of-the-year spending agreement, we're going to have to work to extend it.

BERMAN: You talked about the select committee investigating the January sixth insurrection. The former president has -- I think even beyond whitewashing, which is the criticism before -- has entered this new phase when he discusses the insurrection -- listen.

[07:55:03]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You had over a million people there, which the press doesn't like to report at all because it shows too much -- too much activity, too much -- too much spirit and faith and love. There was such love at that rally.

The crowd was unbelievable. And I mentioned the word love. The love -- the love in the air -- I've never seen anything like it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: First of all, he's just wrong about the crowd size, as usual. But love in the air. Is that how you see it?

JEFFRIES: You know, I was there on January sixth. I was on the floor of the House and there were individuals who were there to assassinate Speaker Pelosi, hang Mike Pence, hunt down members of Congress. More than 140 Capitol Police officers and Metropolitan D.C. Police officers were seriously injured. Some have lost their lives as a result of the events of January sixth.

It was an attack on the Congress, the Capitol, and the Constitution and it's shameful that the former, twice-impeached president continues to perpetrate the big lie. What's even worse is that House Republican leadership, Kevin McCarthy,

and others continue to provide aid and comfort to the big lie. That should frighten the American people because they are working overtime to try to take back the House of Representatives and move this country in a different direction.

BERMAN: People need to think of the word love and then look at the video that we've all seen from that day and think about that for a second.

Congressman, I appreciate you being with us. Thank you very much.

JEFFRIES: Thank you, John.

BERMAN: President Biden preparing for a major address just hours from now. We're going to go live to the White House.

KEILAR: And Tennessee's top vaccine official tells us why she was terminated.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)