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CNN Analysis: 89 Percent Of Americans Qualify For COVID-19 Boosters; Chauvin Jurors Speak Out For The First Time About George Floyd Murder; Attorneys Say "Rust" Armorer Has "No Idea Where Live Rounds Came From." Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired October 29, 2021 - 07:30   ET



FATHER THOMAS REESE, SENIOR ANALYST, RELIGION NEWS SERVICE: About strengthening the position of the president as he goes to the COP26 climate meeting because it's very important that the president be able to speak strongly against global warming. But if he comes in there limping because Congress isn't supporting him, I think the Vatican is going to be very disappointed.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: You know, very often, what is predominating the conversation about Catholicism in America does not echo the concerns of the church around the world. That's a given.

However, one of the things that probably does matter -- and my question to you is how is this going to resonate in this meeting -- is that this Pope has problems with his clergy in the United States of America in terms of being in lockstep, respecting where he is on things -- even where it comes to this president.

The Pope was very clear in saying look, love, mercy -- focus on that. Don't get caught up on your rules of exclusion. There are rules, yes, but they don't have to be our focus. Biden should be getting communion. The bishops in America did not echo that.

What do you think that means, and how does it play, if at all, in this?

REESE: Well, I think that the Pope is going to be very sympathetic with President Biden's problems with Congress because the Pope, himself, can't always get the bishops in the United States to go along with his program either. So I think there's some sympathy with -- between the two men on that.

Clearly, the Pope has indicated that he has never denied communion to anyone. And this issue is not going to come up in the meeting. This is not the meeting between Joe Catholic and his pastor. This is a meeting between the President of the United States and a world leader who can impact public opinion all over the world.

So, they're going to be talking about global warming. They're going to be talking about getting shots into the arms of people in Africa. They might even talk about Haiti and Lebanon. These are the kinds of issues that the Vatican wants to talk to the president about.

CUOMO: What is your one big question that you are wondering about the answer to at the end of this meeting?

REESE: Well, I think the -- I'd love to be a fly on the wall in the room when the two men are by themselves talking. I think it's going to be a warm exchange. It's going to be a courteous exchange. Both men respect each other very much.

I'm a little embarrassed because I was telling every -- all my reporter friends to watch for the photo op when the president and the Pope come out because I think they're going to be smiling quite a bit, as opposed to when the Pope and President Trump came out of their meeting and the Pope was kind of frowning.

I think a picture tells a good story. And I think that if we do get a picture out of this meeting, we're going to see two men that are relating to one another very warmly and on substantive issues.

CUOMO: Well, I'm sure from the Pope's perspective they may have both been presidents, but the former and current president are very, very different men as seen through the lens of what matters to him.

Father Reese, thank you very much. Appreciate you.

Brianna, this is going to be interesting for me in terms of seeing if President Biden comes out of this meeting with some kind of, like, boost of a sense of purpose. We'll see.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Yes -- is he getting a papal pep talk. I guess we will find out soon.

Chris --

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Nothing like it.

KEILAR: Nothing like it, I'm sure.

BERMAN: Nothing like it.

KEILAR: Chris, stick around for us. So much more ahead with you.

BERMAN: All right. Former presidents -- I'm talking about former presidents don't usually show up at world leaders' events, but that's exactly where Barack Obama will be -- at the U.N. climate conference next week in Glasgow. Obama aides say he will try to win back faith in U.S. leadership after four years, they say, of Donald Trump.

CNN senior reporter Edward-Isaac Dovere joins us now. Isaac, this really is unusual.

EDWARD-ISAAC DOVERE, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: Yes. Look, we usually see former presidents pull back from public life entirely and certainly on international affairs. This is a major international conference on climate -- the big one that comes every year -- and Obama will be there. He will notably, though, wait until about a week after Joe Biden is there to let Biden have the space for it. They're going for more of a tag team situation than like Batman and Robin.


But Biden is there trying to show that the U.S. is back. Obama has a lot of credibility internationally and wants to have a lot of credibility to go back and look at what he did on climate and to say the U.S. -- yes, Donald Trump moved us away from the Paris climate accords and moved us away from working on climate.

But look at what we are committed to. Look at what was happening with mayors and governors on the local level, and look at what Joe Biden is bringing back. Trust us -- we're back at this.

BERMAN: Tag team, like the Von Erichs. Old school wrestling reference right there.

Edward-Isaac Dovere, appreciate you being with us. Thank you very much.

DOVERE: Thank you.

BERMAN: A new CNN data analysis finds the vast majority of Americans -- the vast majority are actually eligible for a COVID booster shot. How do you tell if you're in that category, ahead?

KEILAR: And as we speak, President Biden is sitting down with Pope Francis at the Vatican for a conversation that has gone on rather long -- a good sign. And the White House has just released the list of U.S. officials inside of that meeting. What are they talking about? Is anything off the table? We're live in Rome.



KEILAR: The FDA has now authorized boosters for all three COVID-19 vaccines, and a new data analysis by CNN shows that the vast majority of people qualify for the extra jab.

CNN senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen joins us now to explain. I think people might be surprised by this, so tell us about it.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Brianna. Polling has shown that people are pretty confused about whether or not they're eligible for a booster. It seems like some people think you have to be very old or very sick to get a booster. But when you look at the details that are put out by the U.S. Centers for Disease control, actually, it's really the vast majority of vaccinated adults are eligible for a booster once, of course, they pass the appropriate amount of time.

So we asked the folks at the Computational Epidemiology Lab at Boston Children's Hospital to do a data analysis for us, and let's take a look at sort of what they found and what some of the background is here. So, first of all, everyone who got Johnson & Johnson qualifies to get a booster as long as they're two months past their original shot.

For Pfizer and Moderna, if you're six months past your shot, if you're age 65-plus, if you're a frontline worker, if you have an underlying medical condition such as being overweight or having depression or anxiety or heart disease or a whole host of things, that makes you eligible to get a booster. And that adds up to at least 89 percent of vaccine recipients, so it's really way more than people think.

So, if you are more than six months past your Pfizer or Moderna shot, chances are you are eligible for a booster -- Brianna.

KEILAR: Well, 89 percent. I mean, nine out of 10 people. What's the factor driving that high percentage?

COHEN: The factor is overweight. It used to be that you had to be -- people thought that you had to be obese, but actually, you just have to be overweight. And let's take a look at what that means.

About 75 percent of U.S. adults are overweight. So, for example, if you're 5'4" and 145 pounds or more, you're overweight. If you're 5'10" and you weigh 174 pounds or more, you are overweight. So it's relatively easy to be overweight and that's sort of the basis for that 89 percent.

You add in people who have anxiety, people who have depression, people who have diabetes, people who have asthma, et cetera, you get up to that 89 percent.

KEILAR: Yes, and so many of those exacerbated by the pandemic -- for sure, those conditions as well.

Elizabeth, thank you so much --


KEILAR: -- for explaining that to us.

COHEN: Thanks.

BERMAN: So, for the very first time since finding Minneapolis police officer Derek Chauvin guilty of murdering George Floyd, five jurors and two alternates sat down with CNN's Don Lemon, taking us inside the jury room and reflecting on an experience that several say still haunts them.


SHERRI BELTON HARDEMAN, CHAUVIN TRIAL JUROR: Minneapolis Police Department has a motto. And if I'm understanding it correctly, their motto is "In our custody, in our care." George Floyd was in their custody. He was never in their care. And that, for me, just -- it just hit hard. I don't feel like they ever cared for him.

JODI DOUD, CHAUVIN TRIAL JUROR: I brought up to the fact that this is not what he did but more or less what he didn't do.

NICOLE DETERS, CHAUVIN TRIAL JUROR: All of a sudden, light bulbs just went on for those people I think that were undecided or on the not guilty side. Oh my gosh, you're totally right. There is intent where -- to not provide lifesaving measures when he knew three times there was no pulse.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: If Derek Chauvin had testified, do you think that would have made any difference for you?

BRANDON MITCHELL, CHAUVIN TRIAL JUROR: For me, no. For me, no -- not at all. The evidence was the evidence.

HARDEMAN: I'm still trying to understand nine minutes and 29 seconds why, and I don't think that Derek Chauvin could explain that to me, ever.

DETERS: I mean, I think we got here because of systemic racism within the system, right -- because of what's been going on. That's how we got to a courtroom in the first place. But when it came down to all three verdicts, it was based on the evidence and the facts 100 percent.

LEMON: This was about obviously, the death of a man. But I'm sure you knew the whole racial aspect of it. You're very diverse and nobody was afraid to share their feelings on that?

HARDEMAN: Not at all. Race wasn't even ever mentioned in the 3 1/2 weeks that we were in that courtroom. And it was never mentioned during deliberations, I don't believe.


LEMON: How much of a role did the videotape -- because the videotape was on all the time, right? You said the nine minutes and 29 seconds.



LEMON: That's how it got to be such a big story worldwide is because of that videotape. How much of a role did it play, Sherri, in this for the jurors?

HARDEMAN: It played a huge role. The camera doesn't lie. And it was in slow-motion at times while we were sitting there in court, so we could see every aspect of it. And we saw different angles from different cameras. There was cameras on that street monitoring traffic and crime and things like that.

So, it was hard. It played a huge role, though. It truly did.

LISA CHRISTENSEN, CHAUVIN TRIAL ALTERNATE JUROR: I didn't see it in its entirety until I was in court. And seeing it day after day after day did wear on me. I mean, so much so that sometimes I went home and just went in my room, shut the door, and just went to bed for the rest of the day. It was exhausting.

LEMON: Why is that? Talk to me about that.

CHRISTENSEN: It was just emotional. And to see somebody go through what Mr. Floyd went through when it could have been prevented. I just still can't wrap my mind around how a $20.00 counterfeit bill ended up in George Floyd's death. I mean, how is that even possible? It's surreal to me.

DOUD: How could somebody do that to someone else? And it was a slow death. It wasn't just a gunshot and they're dead.

DETERS: In the back of my head, I'm going oh my God, oh my God -- just breathe, just breathe. And then I think to myself George Floyd couldn't breathe. Like, I'm telling myself to breathe so I don't pass out having to watch this. But I'm watching a man who couldn't breathe.

MITCHELL: I wanted to close my eyes. I didn't -- I didn't want to watch it. I had to force myself to continue to look at it. I mean, you want to turn away. You want to look at a wall. You want to look anywhere else, really. You want to look anywhere else but this.

Like, you know when you look away you still hear it. You still hear him crying and moaning and it's just -- it's like an ongoing nightmare. It's just like you keep on seeing the video and it's just like I'm just tired of seeing it. Like, let's -- I just don't want to see this video ever again.

HARDEMAN: I had a big gasp. I just -- I've never experienced anything like that before and I don't think any of us have.

It was very, very traumatic and it just hurt. Just hurt my whole soul and my whole body. And I felt pain for his family. It was very -- it was very hard.

CHRISTENSEN: After that first week, I did go down to 38th and Chicago and I did pay my respects. And for me, that was a closure -- or at least I thought it was going to be a closure. Seeing everything we saw everything recorded on videos -- but actually being there and seeing it felt really, really, really real to me. So it helped me kind of close the door a bit, but it's -- I think it'll be with me forever.


BERMAN: Such human reactions. Very important to hear from them. That was a very interesting interview by Don there.

All right. Just in to CNN, the first statement from the armorer on Alec Baldwin's film "Rust" saying she's not responsible for the deadly shooting.

KEILAR: And the climate crisis is at the heart of the Biden economic agenda. The plan that was unveiled yesterday representing the biggest clean energy investment in U.S. history -- $550-plus million. Will it be enough?



KEILAR: Just in to CNN, we're hearing for the first time from the armorer on the set of Alec Baldwin's film "Rust" after the deadly shooting on that set.

Attorneys for Hannah Gutierrez writing in a statement, "Safety is Hannah's number one priority on set. Ultimately this set would never have been compromised if live ammo were not introduced. Hannah has no idea where the live rounds came from. The whole production set became unsafe due to various factors, including lack of safety meetings. Not the fault of Hannah."

So, this comes amid allegations that Gutierrez had mishandled weapons on a previous project -- something that this statement also appears to deny.

Let's talk about it with Stu Brumbaugh, who has been in the film industry for almost 25 years serving as a key grip on a number of films. He has also worked with Hannah Gutierrez and the assistant director on the "Rust" film, David Halls. Stu, thank you so much for being with us.

First, you worked --


KEILAR: -- with both of these people. Tell us --

BRUMBAUGH: Yes, I have.

KEILAR: -- what you can about them, their experience, and their work ethic -- the positives and the negatives, in your experience.

BRUMBAUGH: You now, I'll first start with Dave. I worked with him on a -- two seasons on a -- on a T.V. show and he seemed like a consummate professional. I didn't have -- see anything that I thought was -- you know, where he was doing his job incorrectly. Was he pushing schedules, yes -- I mean, but all A.D.s do?

I don't think he did anything that was unsafe or requested anything to be done unsafe, so I really don't have a whole lot to say about Dave.

I also worked with Hannah. I -- you know, I found her to be a great individual. She was very warm.

You know, I witnessed some things on set that I thought were unsafe in, like I say, my personal opinion -- you know, the way that she was handling firearms. We had a couple of firearm discharges that were unannounced on set.

There were these protocols on set that need to happen for everybody's safety. Why those didn't happen, I couldn't tell you. I have -- I have no idea. I'm not here to vilify anybody. From the onset of this, I've never been wanting to vilify anybody. The reason I've come forward is because there is other issues that are going on in our industry that have led to incidents like this.


KEILAR: Yes, look -- and we're going to talk about that in just a moment. I just want to follow up on something that you said. You said that there were accidental discharges on the set that you were on with Hannah Gutierrez.

In this statement from her lawyer, it says "Hannah still, to this day, has never had an accidental discharge."

So in your opinion, that claim is incorrect?

BRUMBAUGH: Look, whether it was accidental or not -- whether it was accidental or not, that I -- that I can't answer. I know that there were discharges on set that were unannounced and they were -- there are protocols on set. Were they test-fires? I don't know. All I know is that there was no -- there was no announcement about hot guns being on set.

I know there were several times -- excuse me, two times that there were discharges on set. It's not just me that saw this. It was the entire crew.


BRUMBAUGH: It was our -- it was our star in our film that had actually yelled out about the unannounced discharge.

So, I'm sure Hannah's dealing with a lot and look, I really feel for her. And like I said, I'm not here to vilify her. I know that right now everybody wants -- everybody wants a villain. Everybody wants a villain in all of this.

But the root of the issue is that these films -- these films get done on these shoestring budgets. And why are we paying actors three, five, 10 million dollars on these movies but yet we can't pay for an armorer to have an extra set of hands.


BRUMBAUGH: And that's really what's going on is that there's this hamstringing of every department in this industry and that's really why I'm coming forward. It really -- this happening on a set which involved somebody that I'd worked with before was just the catalyst for me coming forward --


BRUMBAUGH: -- to say hey look, there needs to be some changes in this industry. There needs to be some more safety protocols. And I understand there's a checks and balances with these firearms but

in my personal opinion, a lot of those are futile. An armorer who has been around guns their entire life, who has worked with prop guns and with real guns and with blank firearm weapons can walk onto a set and show it to a -- let's say an assistant director on set -- show them that the barrel is clear or that the gun is clear.

They may have never met that assistant director prior to that day. They have no idea what that A.D.'s background is. That A.D. may have never seen a gun in their entire life.

And so, he or she is looking at a weapon -- they don't know what they're looking at. But yet, that gun is being passed from the armorer to an actor and that actor is also expected to look into a gun and realize it is empty or not loaded --


BRUMBAUGH: -- loaded with a blank or whatever. And that actor may have never worked around a firearm in their life.

So, these protocols are just -- they're -- it's lip service.

KEILAR: Stu, I want to ask you because there are a number of things in this statement from Hannah Gutierrez's lawyer that really speak to what you're speaking to, which is cutting of corners, OK? And even some --

BRUMBAUGH: Absolutely.

KEILAR: -- of these are maybe what you wouldn't have expected in earlier pictures.

The lawyer says that she was hired on two positions on this film, which made it extremely difficult to focus on her job as an armorer.

We'd also heard that there were safety meetings. But now, her lawyer here says that the production set became unsafe due to various factors, including lack of safety meetings. It says that she fought for training, days to maintain weapons, and proper time to prepare for gunfire but ultimately, was overruled by production and her department.

You can see how this stretches people thin. You could see how this creates room for error. What has to be done?

BRUMBAUGH: Look, I've been in Hannah's shoes and I totally understand what she's going through, and I agree with her. You can't operate two departments. There -- that's why there is two departments because you need two department heads to run those departments.

And look, I wasn't on the movie "Rust." I can't really speculate of what happened. But I do believe what Hannah is saying to be true on that film -- that she was overwhelmed with everything going on. And look, these producers found somebody who would come in and work for less money than, let's say, a Hollywood veteran. Because a Hollywood veteran is going to push back on production and say I need more manpower, I need more time, and I need -- we need to do our jobs safely and efficiently.

Where maybe a young person who is getting started in this business -- they don't want to push back on production as hard because they're afraid that they're not going to work again or they're not going to get the next job. And they're trying to make a career for themselves.

And look, we were all 24 years old at one point --


BRUMBAUGH: -- and we were all trying to establish ourselves in whatever industry it is or even figure out what industry we want to be in. And Hannah's in that same situation.