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Eric Fingerhut is Interviewed about Fox Host's Nazi Comparisons; Roe v. Wade in Doubt; Major League Baseball Announces Lockout. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired December 02, 2021 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


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[06:31:22]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Even after significant backlash, Fox News personality Lara Logan is now doubling down on her damaging comparison of Dr. Anthony Fauci to the Holocaust angel of death Josef Mengele. Mengele forced grotesque and often lethal experiments on prisoners at the Auschwitz Concentration Camp, including on children.

In the meantime, Fox News staying silent.

Joining me now is the president and CEO of The Jewish Federations, Eric Fingerhut.

Eric, thank you so much for joining us to discuss this this morning.

I just wonder what you think is the most alarming thing about this whole comparison and the doubling down of it -- on it by Lara Logan.

ERIC FINGERHUT, PRESIDENT AND CEO, THE JEWISH FEDERATIONS: Well, I think the most alarming thing is that, unfortunately, there is, of course, no comparison whatsoever. The fact that this is seemingly a comparison that is being used more and more in public and not being refuted is a growing sign that we have a real problem with Holocaust education.

You know, Brianna, there was a study in 2020 of millennials and gen z by The Claims Conference that showed that -- it found that 44 percent of Americans ages 18 to 39 couldn't even identify what Auschwitz is. That's why one of the high priorities of The Jewish Federations of North America has been to advocate for Holocaust education. In 2020, Congress passed the Never Again Education Act, which allocated funds to promote Holocaust education. There's about 20 states that require it.

But even as we have a last generation of Holocaust survivors, we now have a growing problem, people that don't understand what this horrific crime and evil was all about. And to allow it to be compared in any way to a public policy debate that you may disagree with in our current society is outrageous.

KEILAR: Fox is just standing by here. What should Fox be doing? FINGERHUT: Well, I think we all have a responsibility, including the

channel that aired this, to be affirmatively telling the story about why this is an outrageous and impossible comparison to be made and to educate people about what, in fact, Auschwitz was about, what, in fact, the Holocaust was about, the Nazis were about, and outrageously what Mengele was about.

And, if it's true, as was said on that report, that this reporter has been hearing this from all over the world, then that's the story. The story is, how is it possible that even, as I said, we have still the last generation of Holocaust survivors who we have to care for, that such a growing number of people don't understand and appreciate the history of this outrage and to allow it to be compared in the same sentence with -- with our -- with a disagreement over what's the appropriate policies today and not have that refuted is completely irresponsible.

KEILAR: It has to be remembered accurately, right? Because we have to remember the conditions that went into creating the Holocaust. And we're seeing over and over this comparison being thrown around. We're especially seeing this from certain Republicans who are bringing up the Holocaust or they're bringing up Nazis in a way that is not at all accurate.

FINGERHUT: Well, look, this is an outrageous comparison wherever it's brought up. And, you're right, Brianna, that we have seen it more and more. I don't think -- and our federations understand that there's a relationship between what we're seeing, the ignorance that is behind lack of knowledge that's behind these comparison and the rise of anti- Semitism.

[06:35:06]

It's why we're undertaking, frankly, the largest campaign -- philanthropic campaign to secure our communities. We've had to because we've seen a rise in violence, which, you know, is a downstream effect of much of this anti-Semitism.

And so back to the point that I made at the beginning of this conversation, we have an affirmative responsibility, and in my view so do all the news outlets, to educate our -- educate society about what really happened. We cannot allow this to be forgotten, to fade into memory and to be normalized in conversation because it was a uniquely evil and horrific time. And, yes, indeed, it was inflicted on the Jewish people. As it -- as it relates to today's rise of anti- Semitism, it's a very obvious relationship.

KEILAR: Obvious.

Eric, thank you so much for being with us this morning to talk about this.

FINGERHUT: Thank you, Brianna.

KEILAR: Up next, it was a big day for the Supreme Court. The conservative-leaning majority seeming poised to uphold Mississippi's abortion law, which now raises more questions on the future of abortion rights.

Plus, the Women's Tennis Association suspending all tournaments in China over concern for Peng Shuai. How China is responding this morning.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: And, I didn't pull the trigger. Alec Baldwin speaking out in a raw and emotional new interview. But what about that claim? How could that be? Ahead.

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[06:40:49]

BERMAN: This morning, the very real possibility that Roe versus Wade, which protects a woman's right to have an abortion, could be overturned. For two hours, the Supreme Court heard dramatic and sometimes tense arguments over a case that could fundamentally alter life and choice for millions of women.

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SCOTT STEWART, MISSISSIPPI SOLICITOR GENERAL: Roe versus Wade and Planned Parenthood versus Casey haunt our country. They have no basis in the Constitution. They have no home in our history or traditions. They've damaged the democratic process. They've poisoned the law. They've choked off compromise.

JUSTICE SONIA SOTOMAYOR, THE SUPREME COURT: Will this institution survive the stench that this creates in the public perception, that the Constitution and its reading are just political acts? I don't see how it is possible.

If people actually believe that it's all political, how will we survive? How will this court survive?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: The case revolves around a Mississippi law that seeks to ban abortions after 15 weeks, with no exceptions for rape or incest. In the end, the court seemed poised to uphold the Mississippi law, 15 weeks, with a conservative majority split about whether to stop at 15 weeks or overturn Roe completely, which would allow states to ban abortions at any time or entirely.

Joining me now, assistant professor of Brooklyn Law School, Alexis Hoag, and CNN columnist and lawyer Jill Filipovic.

Alexis, Professor, I want to start with you. That distinction seems to be the most important thing this morning where you have at least three justices who want to just throw out Roe altogether. And then you have maybe two who want to say, Mississippi law can stand beginning at 15 weeks.

What's the distinction? Why is this important?

ALEXIS HOAG, ASSISTANT PROFESSOR, BROOKLYN LAW SCHOOL: I think it's important to identify which justices are which. So, on the far right we have Alito, Gorsuch and Thomas. And then those two sort of in play perhaps, Kavanaugh and Barrett. And so what could happen is Chief Justice Roberts does want to maintain the legitimacy of the court. So he may try to thread the needle so that we retain somehow Roe but yet uphold this Mississippi ban. And, to me, that that is the best case scenario. Jill and I actually classmates from law school. That is terrifying. And I assume you're on the same page with me there.

JILL FILIPOVIC, CNN COLUMNIST: Definitely. Getting rid of the viability standard, which is currently what's in place -- so essentially the law right now says that states cannot completely ban abortion after the point of fetal viability. So after the point that the fetus can survive outside of the woman's body. That happens well after 15 weeks of pregnancy. So even if the Mississippi law gets upheld at the 15-week standard, as Alexis says, the best case scenario, we're doing away with now decades of established Supreme Court precedent and throwing this huge wild card out to the states. If not longer viability, well, why 15 weeks, why not six weeks, why not four weeks? It creates total legal chaos and functionally guts Roe without actually doing it outright. And that's the best case at this point.

BERMAN: That's what you consider to be the best case. The alternative is the Gorsuch, Thomas, Alito way, which is just do away with it completely. Overturn it completely, which mean each state gets to decide. Which means as many as 20 states, maybe more, what, just outlaw each and every abortion.

HOAG: Exactly. And that's what is so terrifying is leaving this decision up to the individual states. And if we can return back to our period of reconstruction following the Civil War, the whole point of the 14th Amendment was to protect the rights of people that were marginalized. And I'm speaking about enslaved back people. And so the fact that the 14th Amendment protects individual's rights to bodily dignity, to liberty and then to leave that up to the states, the whim of a majority vote of state legislators, cuts directly against what we have with the 14th Amendment and a due process clause.

BERMAN: Let's talk about Brett Kavanaugh. You identified Brett Kavanaugh as one of the big unknowns here, along with Amy Coney Barrett. Look, maybe John Roberts too.

[06:45:00]

John Roberts seemed to indicate 15 weeks might be OK with him. But we'll leave that aside.

Let's talk about Brett Kavanaugh because, during his confirmation hearing, Brett Kavanaugh talked about the importance of precedent and really seemed to indicate that he believed in relying on precedent here. He talked about Roe and he talked about Casey.

Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. DIANNE FEINSTEIN (D-CA): What would you say your position today is on a woman's right to choose?

JUSTICE BRETT KAVANAUGH, SUPREME COURT: Well, as a judge --

FEINSTEIN: As a judge.

KAVANAUGH: As a judge, it is an important precedent of the Supreme Court. By it, I mean Roe v. Wade and Planned Parenthood versus Casey, been reaffirmed many times. Casey is precedent on precedent, which itself is an important factor.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Precedent on precedent. It was enough to convince Susan Collins, who is pro-choice, to vote to confirm Brett Kavanaugh.

This is what she said at the time.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. SUSAN COLLINS (R-ME): We talked about whether he considered Roe to be settled law. He said that he agreed with what Justice Roberts said at his nomination hearing in which he said that it was settled law.

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BERMAN: But yesterday, Jill, Brett Kavanaugh could not have been more different. He listed -- he put together a laundry list of cases that the Supreme Court had overturned to suggest precedent didn't matter as much to him, or these are the places where precedent didn't matter. And then he also said this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JUSTICE BRETT KAVANAUGH, THE SUPREME COURT: The reason this issue is hard, is that you can't accommodate both interests. You have to pick. That's the fundamental problem.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: And he went on to say, if you have to pick, it should be the states, more or less, who have to pick, or indicated that's what he might think.

That's a big change. What he said yesterday, really, it's an important thematic difference from what he was saying out loud in 2018.

FILIPOVIC: Well, women's health groups, feminist groups knew that in 2018, when Kavanaugh was being confirmed, that he didn't support Roe v. Wade, that he would be a conservative vote likely against abortion. Of course, none of us are fortune tellers. None of us can tell exactly what -- how a justice is going to vote in the future. But feminist groups were screaming about the Kavanaugh nomination because we knew that he would be a vote against Roe.

Susan Collins knew he would be a vote against Roe. Any sentient person paying attention to Brett Kavanagh's history and his views knew that what he was saying about precedent was a bit of a weasel dodge. You know, he was saying, all right, well, I care about precedent, and that's fine, he can say that and that can be true, and then he can also, as a judge, decide that in this particular circumstance, he doesn't think that the arguments for precedent are as strong as other arguments, which is exactly what he indicated in the arguments yesterday.

None of this is a surprise. It was entirely predictable. Susan Collins could have, should have predicted it.

BERMAN: She was asked about this last night by CNN. And at the time her response was, she hadn't seen it yet. She needed to go look at the video to find out how she felt about what Brett Kavanaugh was now saying.

Jill, Alexis, classmates. I'm glad for the reunion here. Thanks so much for being with us.

HOAG: Thank you.

FILIPOVIC: Thank you.

BERMAN: So, as of this moment, baseball canceled. Major League Baseball, shut down. The owners lock out the players. New information this morning over whether there will even be a 2022 season.

KEILAR: And, ahead, there are four big trials happening right now in America. We'll get you up to speed with all the admissions, the regrets and key witness testimony.

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[06:53:28]

KEILAR: Major League Baseball announces a lockout as players and owners fail to reach a new collective bargaining agreement.

Andy Scholes has this morning's "Bleacher Report" for us.

You know, Andy, I love almost everything about the '90s. I want to bring it all back with like the exception of Tamagotchis (ph) and the MLB lockout.

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, the year we lost the World Series because of the players' strike. You know, that was terrible, Brianna. And, you know, really right now no reason for baseball fans to panic just yet. They have a few months to figure this out. But, you know, this does show the state of the relationship between the players and the owners.

This is the first work stoppage in baseball since the players went on strike back in 1994. And the two sides meeting in Irving, Texas, ahead of the deadline this week. But according to ESPN, their final meeting yesterday lasted just seven minutes before they decided to go their separate ways. And then at midnight the owners locking out the players. Commissioner Rob Manfred says it was necessary despite the league's best efforts to make a deal.

The Major League Baseball Players Association releasing a statement as well, saying in part, the shutdown is a dramatic measure and it's not required by law. It's the owner's choice.

Now, the lockout freezes all league business until an agreement is reached. That means no trades. No more free agent signings. And no players are allowed inside club facilities. And, if you got to mlb.com or your favorite team's website, you're going to notice all images and videos of players have been completely removed.

And, you know, Brianna, like I said, you know, right now, there's time. You know, pitchers and catchers don't report for spring training until February. But that being said, you know, in 2020, when they were trying to figure out how to restart the season during the pandemic, the owners and the players couldn't agree on anything.

[06:55:04]

So, you know, there is a, you know, reason to be a little worried about this situation.

KEILAR: Yes. Oh, my gosh, I do not want to see this. I'll also tell you, I don't want to see the macarena again. I think that's one of the other things that I'm really not into. But I don't want the lockout for sure.

Andy, thank you.

SCHOLES: All right.

KEILAR: And I know Berman -- Berman, you feel the same way about the macarena.

BERMAN: I do I feel like it was a year or two after the '94. You know, it was more of a -- I think more about the Expos who were robbed, Andy.

KEILAR: (INAUDIBLE)

BERMAN: The Expos were robbed in '94.

SCHOLES: Hey, my Astros were doing well that year. Jeff Bagwell (ph) winning MVP.

BERMAN: Yes, I have no memory of that whatsoever. The Red Sox traded Jeff Bagwell.

Andy, thank you very, very much.

SCHOLES: All right.

BERMAN: So, companies are complaining about the supply chain issues and wages. But the same companies are doing well. Christine Romans here to lay it out for you.

KEILAR: And, ahead, a federal judge suggests that Trump stoked the crowd on January 6th and should be held accountable for the riot.

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[07:00:02]

CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: I'm Meteorologist Chad Myers. And this weather here is brought to you by Servpro, making fire and water damage like it never even happened. The number one choice