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New Day

Frontlines of Russian Invasion; Petro Poroshenko Is Interviewed about the Attack on Ukraine; Adm. James Foggo is Interviewed about the Escalating Fighting; Athletes and Entertainers Condemn Putin's War; U.S. Cuts of Russia's Central Bank; Putin Lashes out at Sanctions. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired February 28, 2022 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:30:00]

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Their own neighborhoods. And so we are seeing this extraordinarily heroic defense of the Ukrainian capital. And it's very effective as well. You know, we saw those images there northwest of the city. There have been other examples of a quite significant, I would say, Russian -- Russian defeats or Russian losses at the hands of this, you know, very, very strong, at the moment, Ukrainian defense. And that's all well and good.

But the point I was making in that report, and I think it's worth making again, is that, you know, flush with that victory -- those victories, the Ukrainians are now in talks with the Russians demanding that there is a cease-fire and demanding that Russian forces pull back. And it's not clear yet what the response of the Russian forces and the Russian political leadership will be. The coming hours and the coming days are going to be crucial to decide what happens here, what the outcome of this brutal conflict will be, John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: And, Matthew Chance, I mean the issue is, are these setbacks -- is that what's bringing Vladimir Putin and the Russians to the table or, as you laid out there on the scene of this destruction of Russian forces, are they more likely to cause Putin to act, I should say, with greater violence or maybe irrationally? You've got experience covering him, Matthew. What are your thoughts?

CHANCE: Well, I mean, you know, we don't know, as always, with Vladimir Putin, what his next step is going to be. No one really seriously predicted -- well, I mean U.S. intelligence did. But, you know, people who have been living in that country for a long time, a lot of the people that I work with, you know, in our heart of hearts didn't really believe he would -- he would go and take this step, but he did.

And so, you know, it comes -- it comes back to the issue of how to predict what his next move will be. I mean my hope is, and I think the hope of a lot of Ukrainians, is that this will give Vladimir Putin pause. Perhaps the military strategy he adopted, you know, has been not -- has obviously not been as successful as he wanted it to be. And maybe that will make him rethink this whole idea of, you know, taking Ukraine, toppling the leadership or whatever his plan was. But you could equally see, and the record might support this, you

could equally see how he would want to double down, triple down and not back down in a situation like this. And, again, I think that's the big danger for Ukraine right now.

BERMAN: Look, how do you predict a man who ordered this type of invasion of a country, how do you predict what he'll do next? There's just no way of knowing.

Matthew Chance, we appreciate the work that you continue to do. To you and your team, thank you.

We have much more on the breaking news. The U.S. taking the major step now, just this morning, of cutting off Russia's central bank from dollar transactions.

Also, two oligarchs now calling for an end to this Putin invasion of Ukraine.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:36:59]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Breaking news. Talks between Russia and Ukraine are underway as the fighting rages on in Ukraine. And, moments ago, Russia says -- said that it was closing its airspace to dozens of countries after those countries did the same for Russian jets in their airspace.

Joining us now is Petro Poroshenko, the former president of Ukraine.

Sir, thank you so much for being with us.

And you hear this move, the latest move by Vladimir Putin to close airspace to dozens of airlines, and he's also talking about nukes again. What do you think of his mindset?

PETRO POROSHENKO, FORMER PRESIDENT OF UKRAINE: I said from the very beginning, Putin is a crazy person. He's a mad person. And this reaction is -- just demonstrates that fact.

We -- first of all, I want to thank CNN for the objective source of information as a contradiction against Russian information (INAUDIBLE). We have already 100 -- more than 100 hours. We Ukrainian count in hours. But -- because every single hour this is their lives of Ukrainian soldiers, lives of Ukrainian civilians and exhausting our resources. But we appreciate very much for the strong support of our western partners.

Altogether, Russia, under the official information of the Ukrainian minister of defense, already paid 2,000 -- or, sorry, 5,300 soldiers who lost their lives during the last five days. Can you imagine every single hour, every single day, Russia lost 1,000 soldiers. This is significantly more than in Chechnya, in Syria, in Libya or wherever in the world. This is the biggest price Russia ever paid for his mad, crazy, president decision. And losses on Ukrainian side is at least 3,000, 4,000, smaller, but we are very much (INAUDIBLE) to be fighting for our own land.

And Putin expected to launch the panic. Putin expected to make a blitz creek with a very short period of time. On the second day of the war, he planned to capture Kyiv. Instead of that, 5,000 lives of Russian soldiers go to hell.

And with this situation, I think, that Putin refused to recognize his failed plan in Ukraine, he shelled deliberately to -- into Ukraine, to military and civil, by the way, almost 500 Ukrainian civilian was also killed, including children. He attack kindergarten school, university, museums, and this is completely disastrous. But Ukraine not surrender. We --

KEILAR: What -- sir, what do you think -- what do you think that he will do if he doesn't -- I mean if he is not -- if he decides that he is not turning around or he is not given an off-ramp to leave, do you worry that he'll try to make like an Aleppo out of Kyiv?

[08:40:10]

How far do you think he'll go?

POROSHENKO: We keeping them on the same place for already fourth day. Altogether we have a fifth day of the war. And with that situation, I think that, if you said what Putin do further, my answer, nobody knows because Putin don't know what to do because Putin go as far as we allow them to go.

And on the negotiation, I think this is a very positive that we have a dialogue. But Putin should understand, point number one, we do not accept any capitulation. This is the strong position of the whole Ukrainian people. Point number two, we do not accept any compromise on our future, on the European Union future, on the NATO future. And point number three, Ukrainian future would be decided only by Ukrainian people. We never plan to ask the permission from Putin and don't do that now.

But, at the same time, I think that the west should be strategic. The time now has come forward looking decision. And I am very much happy about yesterday's decision of the European Union commission, the European Union council, with the absolutely new approach that they are welcoming Ukraine for -- happy to be -- to see the -- Ukraine as a member of the European Union.

Now we need the same message to -- about NATO. Ukrainian NATO choice. And right now return back from the parliament where we, together with other initiated -- the official application of Ukrainian state to the European Union, to the NATO about future membership, we definitely need to obtain the status of candidate in EU. We definitely launch -- need to launch the official procedure about the negotiation for being a future member. And with this situation, this is extremely important.

But the point number two, we definitely need to increase the military assistance. Every single penny, the people from the United States, Britain, EU, invest in the Ukrainian security, the Ukrainian defensive weapons, we save the lives of your own countries because we here are fighting, not only for our soil, not only for our sovereignty, but for freedom, for democracy, for Europe and to make the global security more reliable.

And with that situation, this is very positive news that we plan to obtain military jet because Russia has a complete control on our airspace. Point number two that we need to have a closed airspace of Ukraine based on request of the --

KEILAR: And I will say -- I will say, former President Poroshenko, certainly, as you are well aware, that is something right now that the U.S. has said they are not going to do. But, obviously, you are calling for that, for a no-fly zone.

POROSHENKO: (INAUDIBLE).

KEILAR: And we do appreciate you being with us. Thank you so much.

POROSHENKO: Thank you.

BERMAN: All right, back with us, Admiral James Foggo. He is the dean of the Center for Maritime Strategy at the Navy League of the United States, and distinguished fellow at the Center for European Policy Analysis.

And one of the things we've seen over the last several hours, Ukrainians pushing back the Russians in Kyiv, in Kharkiv, although we haven't heard from Kharkiv in a while here, also down south in Mykolaiv.

Admiral, if you can, I want you to get us inside the heads of one of these Russian troops. Who are these 109,000 Russian forces that are trying and so far failing to push toward Kyiv?

ADM. JAMES FOGGO, U.S. NAVY (RETIRED): John, it's a tough question.

First of all, they are Slav. And this is a Slav-on-Slav fight, which is really unfortunate. Same culture and, in many cases, same language. So, Ukraine's speak Ukraine but they also speak Russian. And so when you get out of your tank, you know, it's almost like you're back home and bringing violence to people that look just like your mom and dad. That's point number one.

There's a lot of conscripts in here too. They're not the best trained. They only have about a year, year and a half of service up in Belarus, as you and I were talking, maybe about a year in Russia before they're thrown into a conflict like this. And can you imagine, without a good set of orders, understanding what you're doing, and a strategy, they're just driving down the road. And, in many cases, the Ukrainians are hitting with unmanned aerial vehicles and ordnance. They're hitting them with anti-tank weapons, stinger missiles in the air.

And the fight is not going well. I think if I was General Gerasimov (ph), the chief of defense in Russia, I'd be a little worried about my job right now. And I don't know what's going to happen if President Putin clamps down, because the next steps could be even more severe.

[08:45:07]

BERMAN: Yes, look, one of my friends who spent years in Russia said to me yesterday, it's like invading grandma's house. Put yourself in the mind of a Russian soldier invading grandma's house.

I do want to ask, though, we talk about the resources that the Russians still have to bear. This is the convoy. A three-mile-long column at least.

FOGGO: Three miles, right.

BERMAN: And so people know where this is -- let me see if I can show people where this is. It's here. It's Ivankiv right here. This is right here. It's only about, you know, 30 -- 30 kilometers from Kyiv. I mean do the Russians have unlimited resources to put in play here?

FOGGO: No, that's a very good point. And they found out thus far they've been running out of gas and they've run out of ordnance in some cases and ammunition. They don't have unlimited resources.

And, you know, frankly, neither do we. I mean we have supply line problems. And this is going haunt them. And I'm not sure how much longer they can keep up the intensity of this invasion. You know, it takes a production line to reproduce missiles, short-range ballistic missiles, medium-range ballistic missiles and ammunition. And then you've got to get it there to the fight.

We've closed off -- the European Union has closed off their airspace. So that has restricted them in many ways of moving supplies around inside Russia.

BERMAN: Yes, look, this is -- this is a look -- all this airspace, and actually more too, this is all closed off here, this is closed off here. Can't fly that way. So that's happening to the Russians now also.

Admiral Foggo, great to see you. Thank you so much for being with us.

FOGGO: Thanks very much, John. Great to be here.

BERMAN: It was really, really helpful to have your expertise.

FOGGO: Super. Thanks.

BERMAN: So, this morning, thousands of Russians openly protests the war their country is waging in Ukraine, including sports stars, celebrities, significant acts of defiance.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:50:44]

KEILAR: Russia's invasion of Ukraine sparking widespread reaction in the world of sports and entertainment. Famous athletes, actors, singers, all of them using their platforms to urge for peace and support for the Ukrainian people. CNN's Camila Bernal is live for us in Los Angelis with more.

Camila, what are we seeing?

CAMILA BERNAL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Brianna. Just so many celebrities who are speaking out. And that includes Russians who at times are a lot more careful with what they say, with the words that they use. But, nonetheless, they're finding ways to express their opposition to this conflict.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BERNAL (voice over): No war, please. This is what a number of athletes and celebrities are advocating for.

Russian tennis star Andrey Rublev asking for peace after his win Friday. And another tennis star, men's world number one Daniil Medvedev, also saying he's all for peace.

DANIIL MEDVEDEV, TENNIS PLAYER: In this moment here, understand that tennis sometimes is not that important.

BERNAL: And from the court to the ice --

ALEX OVECHKIN, RUSSIAN HOCKEY PLAYER: I'm Russian.

BERNAL: Washington Capitals superstar Alex Ovechkin calling the Russian invasion of Ukraine a hard situation.

OVECHKIN: I have lots of friends in Russia and Ukraine. And it's hard to see the war. Like, I hope soon is going to be over and there's going to be peace in the whole world.

BERNAL: But he also said Vladimir Putin is his president and said he was not in politics.

On Instagram, a black screen posted by Russian soccer player Fedor Smolov, who captioned his post "no to war."

Soccer players around the world showing their support for Ukraine. The national teams of England, the Czech Republic, Poland and Sweden refusing to play in any potential soccer matches against Russia in the World Cup qualifiers.

Some international gymnastics and boxing organizations taking similar positions.

And the International Judo Federation suspending Putin's status as honorary president and ambassador of the federation.

This while celebrities also speaking out.

Among them Russian-born singer Regina Spektor asking for peace in two different Instagram posts. A sentiment also echoed by other American celebrities. Ashton Kutcher, Blake Lively, Angelina Jolie, Miley Cyrus and others

speaking out. And former "Dancing with the Stars" professional dancer Maksim Chmerkovskiy telling his followers on social media that he is in Ukraine.

MAKSIM CHMERKOVSKIY, "DANCING WITH THE STARS": This is a crazy situation. It's insane.

BERNAL: He's now using his influence to beg for the end of the conflict.

CHMERKOVSKIY: This needs to pause. Stop, stop, stop the shooting.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BERNAL: And a lot of these celebrities asking for two things, prayers and donations, many of them partnering with non-profit organizations to raise money for refugees. They have millions of followers. So, in the end, Brianna, this does make a difference.

KEILAR: Look, it's really something to see in those Russian athletes as well. That is particularly something to see.

Camilla, thank you for the report.

BERNAL: Thank you.

BERMAN: All right, more breaking news this morning. The U.S. has cut off Russia's central bank. The Russian currency has plunged nearly 30 percent. Two Russian billionaires are now calling for an end of Putin's invasion of Ukraine.

CNN chief business correspondent Christine Romans joins me now.

And, Romans, the Russian stock exchange won't even open.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it won't even open because if it opens it's going to open down so big.

Look, the Russian president has spent eight years, John, trying to build this fortress balance sheet, this fortress economy, while he can go off on his Ukrainian invasion and be safe at home. In a weekend, the west has cut that off and paralyzed that fortress economy.

Global markets, you can see, Europe has opened sharply lower here. This is really following from a rally rebound on Friday. So, I wouldn't pay too much attention here to Asia. But look at U.S. futures.

[08:55:01]

You're going to see a tough day out. It is the ramifications of isolating this huge energy producer, right, and what could happen with the banking system around the world as you're trying to isolate Russian banks out of the system.

Oil, an incredibly important market here as well. We've seen big jumps in oil prices. That's going to feed into the global inflation story.

Here's your Russian stock exchange. It's closed right now. It's closed for a reason. The Central Bank of Russia closed it because it would open down big.

BERMAN: It would be here from here or here.

ROMANS: Yes. And, look, and the central bank has been sanctioned by the EU and by the U.S. I mean this basically cripples the country's ability to finance this war, which is exactly what the Europeans and the Americans want to do.

This is not just an energy and a, you know, your 401(k) story as well. This is about the supplies of energy to the EU. It's a huge intwined geopolitical story there. All of this commodities from Russia and from the Ukraine, by the way. All of this could feed into that global inflation story we've talked about. We have supply chains that are going to be more snarled and we have questions about how European and western purchasers of these goods are going to be able to pay for them if indeed the world is going to isolated Vladimir Putin and if the Russian economy has a panic. It is on the edge of financial ruin in the near term here.

BERMAN: And that's what we're waiting to see, when those markets open. They are -- they are getting squeezed. The Russians are getting squeezed now in ways that I do not think Vladimir Putin anticipated.

Christine Romans, thank you very much.

ROMANS: You're welcome.

BERMAN: Brianna.

KEILAR: And joining us now, CNN senior political analyst and the author of the new book "Lincoln and the Fight for Peace," John Avlon here with us.

I do want to talk to you about those oligarchs. But, first, can we discuss some new rhetoric out from Putin that I think is pretty noteworthy here. He says as he has gathered government officials together, he's talking about the so-called western community that has lobbied these sanctions or the empire of lies, as I called it in my address. He said, that's like his -- that's like an axis of evil kind of rhetoric that he's using there. What do you think of that?

JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: He's at war with reality. He's at war with truth. But that's what people like him try to deploy. And he's seeing it all crumbling. I think you're watching Vladimir Putin, someone usually known for great discipline, as a man unhinged, railing against even the support structure that surrounds him. After 22 years, I don't think his grasp on reality is clear but the people of Ukraine and the world are suffering because of it.

KEILAR: The support system around him, what do you mean by that?

AVLON: I mean the oligarchs, and the military, and the people who have perpetuated this regime for two decades, he's lashing out at them. They have been sort of trying to pump the brakes a little bit in the run to this. He is insisting in a strong man will to power that he can take Ukraine. But the rest of the world is showing a much more united front and Ukraine is showing a much more united front in defiance. And that is driving him crazy.

KEILAR: Oligarchs may be lashing out at him at least to a limited degree as well you have Oleg Deripaska who is saying that this war has to stop. You have another one, Friedman (ph), who's saying it has to stop. He's actually -- his family is from western Ukraine, which I think a lot of Russians, you know, sort of have that family connection as well. What does this mean that the oligarchs are saying enough?

AVLON: I think it's a sign that the strategy of going after the oligarchs is working. The risk-reward ratio for Putin and the Russian elites has changed because we're going after SWIFT, we're punishing the banks, we're going after the families. This is about making the elites feel the pain. It's not enough to simply have sanctions that affect the Russian people. Putin shrugged that off in 2014 after Crimea.

This is unlike anything the west, the world has ever done before. It's a way of punishing military aggression and making the oligarchs feel the pain so that they start speaking out against Vladimir Putin, too. That's what we're seeing right now. That's why this is significant.

KEILAR: Explain, how are they feeling the pain? I mean what are -- in their day-in, day-out life, because it is severe, it's really being changed in a way that they've never seen it before.

AVLON: Look, you're seeing the U.K. go after dirty money. They have a lot of dirty money parked in the U.K. Go after the yachts. Go after the houses. Go after the transfers of wealth. All the money they've put overseas to protect themselves. Take them off SWIFT. An extraordinary change in tone by Europe.

So, these are things that bring direct pain. It cuts them off from their ability to insulate themselves through money, even and especially with Putin's sovereign wealth fund (ph).

KEILAR: Does it unhinge Putin even more perhaps, though?

AVLON: Yes. But I don't think you can -- you've got to -- bullies only respect strength and sometimes it's just that simple, a strong, united response holding nothing back is necessary to pull this back. You can't worry about a madman's reaction. You need to create an off-ramp, yes, but not through a reduction in pressure, when the fighting is still going and Ukrainians are fighting for their sovereignty and their lives.

KEILAR: Avlon, thank you so much.

AVLON: Thank you.

BERMAN: Berman.

BERMAN: Yes, look, we've seen a lot over the last several hours we've been on, Brianna.

Number one, we've seen this Russian attack being pushed back north of Kyiv. Our Matthew Chance on this bridge. The destruction of some of those Russian forces.

But, meanwhile, there are still these talks happening in Belarus between the Russian and the Ukrainian delegation. The Ukrainians have said they want -- they want a cease-fire, an unconditional cease-fire and all Russian troops out.

[09:00:05]

What more will we hear from those meetings over the next few hours? What other examples of Ukrainian defiance might we see over the next few hours? Remarkable events unfolding before our eyes.

KEILAR: Yes, certainly. And we'll be keeping our eye on them all day.

CNN's coverage continues right now.