Return to Transcripts main page

New Day

France: Macron Says "Worst To Come" After Chilling Putin Call; Zelensky: Nuclear Plant Attack "Terror At Unprecedented Level"; Russians' Views Of Invasion Shaped By State T.V. Propaganda. Aired 5:30-6a ET

Aired March 04, 2022 - 05:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[05:30:00]

SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Earlier on in the morning an oil depot was struck there and then early in the afternoon, an apartment complex was hit by a series of strikes. And the aftermath looks like a scene out of hell -- watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Speaking foreign language).

(Air raid sirens)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Speaking foreign language).

(Screams)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (Speaking foreign language).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MCLEAN: So, you hear that woman's screams. She says in Ukrainian "Kids -- little kids." She's asked where and she doesn't answer.

Six hours later, 33 bodies were pulled out of the rubble. Eighteen people were injured. Surely, those numbers will rise.

Now, Brianna, look, the Russians continue to insist that they are only going after military targets. The local government, though, says that there are none in that area. What there is, they say, are a series of apartment buildings, schools, and -- well, even a children's hospital just a thousand feet away.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Yes. Look, it seems like one of the toughest things that the Russians are up against are the Ukrainian people, and we're seeing them take the out, quite frankly.

Scott, thank you so much for the live report.

So, we have more on our breaking news. The Russians capturing Europe's largest nuclear plant after attacking it during a chilling standoff.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[05:36:23]

KEILAR: Just an incredibly troubling scene this morning in Ukraine. Russian forces occupying the country's largest nuclear power plant after attacking it and setting it on fire. Now, that fire was put out and radiation levels at the facility do appear to be normal right now.

Let's talk right now about what's going on on the ground with Olga Tokariuk. She is a freelance journalist in Ukraine. Olga, thank you so much for being with us.

And I'm just wondering what are your worries are you're watching this development at this nuclear plant?

OLGA TOKARIUK, FREELANCE JOURNALIST IN UKRAINE, NON-RESIDENT FELLOW, CENTER FOR EUROPEAN POLICY ANALYSIS (via Skype): Hi, Brianna. Well, of course, it's worrying. You know, Ukraine has experienced one nuclear disaster 30 years ago with Chernobyl nuclear power plant and now we are on the brink of another nuclear disaster.

Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelensky launched an emotional appeal to the world, saying that while the whole of Europe could be depopulated and exterminated of the recent explosion at this biggest nuclear plant in Europe near (INAUDIBLE) in the Zaporizhzhia region.

From what we know now, the fire there has been extinguished so, for now, the plant is relatively safe. But I say relatively because it's not under Ukraine control anymore. Russian occupiers control it while nobody can guarantee the safety of the nuclear plant. And there are also reports that they are putting mines in the plant and in general, this could be in danger.

KEILAR: Olga, what is the mood among Ukrainians that you're speaking to? What are they saying to you right now?

TOKARIUK: Well, the mood is still resolute. People are willing and ready to defend the country in each way they can. Army, by repelling Russian offenses and pretty successfully. Actually, Ukraine has received a lot of success on the ground -- in the ground combat.

A big problem is, of course, the missiles that continue to fall from the sky on Ukrainian cities. Yesterday, about 50 people were killed -- civilians -- among them, children.

But another concern is also the humanitarian situation. Several major cities, such as Mariupol, Kherson, and Kharkiv, are in a dire situation. In Mariupol, people do not have electricity, do not have drinking water, do not have mobile internet connection. And my friend, whose parents are there, cannot reach already -- cannot reach them for two days.

KEILAR: Olga, I'm very -- I'm very sorry to hear that, that communications are down with folks that you know there.

As we're watching Russia attack these civilian areas it's hard to draw any other conclusion other than they're trying to demoralize this civilian population, which is so opposed to Russia. You know, is that something you worry about -- that Russia will be able to break the spirit of Ukrainians?

TOKARIUK: Well, I do not think Russia will succeed with breaking the spirit of Ukrainians. But, of course, it would attempt to do that by seminating (ph) terror, by attacking civilian residential areas. While already we know the confirmed figure from the Ukrainian government at 28 children died in this war under Russian shelling and under Russian missiles. This is a scary number and I'm afraid it's going to grow.

The point is that, you know, this is asking at the moment the Ukraine government is -- to protect Ukraine's sky in some way. I know the idea of a no-fly zone was rejected by the NATO level, but -- at the NATO level, but there are other options to supply fighter jets -- fighter jets to Ukraine, to supply air defense systems, and to step up the effort.

[05:40:08]

Well, you know, it's not just Ukrainian civilians who are dying. We are seeing that nuclear power plants are in danger of Russian missiles and of Russian offenses. So it's not just Ukraine's security that is at stake. It's Europe's, it's global security. And it's better to act now before it's -- before the cost, the human toll, and the other consequences -- dangerous and tragic consequences of this war are there.

KEILAR: Olga, thank you for being with us. We really appreciate -- we really appreciate you and we hope that you and your loved ones stay safe.

TOKARIUK: Thank you, Brianna.

KEILAR: Thousands of Ukrainians desperately fleeing to Poland to escape Russian rocket fire. The vast majority are women and children separated from the husbands and the fathers with no idea what the future holds for them. We'll have their stories next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[05:45:15]

KEILAR: As missiles strike Ukrainian cities and Russian forces approach the capital, thousands and thousands of civilians are fleeing to safety in Poland. Many of them are women who are having to leave their husbands behind as they escape with their children amid a harrowing journey to an unknown future.

CNN's Sara Sidner reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SARA SIDNER, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A Ukrainian family's mad rush to safety, parents' desperate attempt to shield their two children from the terror only war can bring. The family lives just outside of Kyiv. The explosions rattle their

bones. We fell to the ground. We were shielding our children with our bodies. We got so scared. This is beyond words. We ran. We just ran.

But the adults will shed no tears here. They have made a pact -- smile and pretend everything is OK even when they had to take the children to a shelter as bombs exploded.

SIDNER (on camera): How are you still smiling?

MARGARITA, UKRAINIAN REFUGEE, MOTHER OF TWO (translated by Sidner): Why am I still smiling? Because it helps us stay alive. My youngest daughter was crying all night long and she asked me, "Why are you laughing, mom? Why are you joking?" And I told her it keeps us alive and keeps us mentally strong.

SIDNER (voice-over): We saw that strength on display by hundreds of mothers traveling along with their children across the border into Poland. Their husbands left behind to fight. But not everyone at the Medyka border crossing is coming into Poland. We witnessed men going the other way to join the fight in Ukraine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): I'm Ukrainian going to fight against Russians. This shall not pass.

SIDNER (voice-over): But for a million other Ukrainians, fleeing is the best option to save themselves and their children.

For this family, the husband, though, remains with them even though Ukraine's government has demanded men of his age must stay put. He's been allowed out. His duty is to his family, he says. He is the only breadwinner because his wife's duty is to the children who struggle with disabilities.

At the train station, their youngest smiles and clutches her most prized possessions, her old fuzzy tiger, and a new keepsake -- a handful of gravel from her homeland.

SIDNER (on camera): And what you are seeing is an incredible outpouring of help for anyone that is running away from war. We are 20 minutes from the border between Ukraine and Poland. And what you are seeing are people here trying to find a safe space to sleep tonight, get a ticket, and try to somewhere within Poland.

But it is incredible. If you look to my left, that is sim cards -- that "Play" that you see there are free sim cards for people so that they can make a phone call and make sure that they can stay in touch with their families.

And just here, what you are seeing is you are seeing hot food all day and all night. We are in the wee hours of the morning and this has been nonstop and it has been this busy.

If people need medical help, they can get medical help. If people need rides, they can find rides. If people need a job, there are numbers they can call to apply for jobs. The bottom line is what Poland wants to do is to make sure that people

feel welcome. And the first sign that they see when they show up here at this train station 20 minutes from the border is a sign that says "You are safe. Welcome to Poland."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: You are safe.

Joining me now is Irene Bubis. She is a Ukrainian American collecting aid and sending it to those in need. Irene, thank you so much for being with us.

IRENE BUBIS, UKRAINIAN AMERICAN COLLECTING AID: Thank you for having me.

BERMAN: You were born in Odessa and you still have family there.

BUBIS: Yes.

BERMAN: How are trying to help? What are you doing?

BUBIS: We have people on the ground there that are getting people in and out, and people donating supplies and money here. And so, I'm connecting the two and trying to just help evacuate people and get supplies in.

BERMAN: What do you need?

BUBIS: Vests for the military, boots, medical supplies. We have plenty of food and clothes so, really, medical supplies and anything that the military can use because --

BERMAN: So you're trying to help the military. Vests for the military. What do you mean?

BUBIS: Vests, combat boots, any kind of walkie-talkies. You know, things that they can use on the ground. Because everybody's been drafted into war and so they're not really particularly ready to have all the things that they need to fight the war.

BERMAN: Do you know people who are now entering the fight?

BUBIS: Yes, I do.

BERMAN: And how do they feel?

BUBIS: Everybody is trying to defend Ukraine against -- they've seen invasions before. I come from generational PTSD. My grandmother tells me about 1941 when they stormed Ukraine. And now, I'm watching it happen again.

BERMAN: Generational PTSD.

BUBIS: Yes.

BERMAN: These people you know who have joined the fight -- and again, you have a half-brother, I know, in Odessa still.

BUBIS: Yes.

BERMAN: What do they say they need to fight the Russians?

[05:50:00]

BUBIS: You know, again, medical supplies and anything for the people that are actually fighting the war. So, vests -- mostly bulletproof vests if we can get those over there. We're really trying to do that. Any kind of armor -- body armor, medical supplies, pills, gauze -- stuff like that.

BERMAN: And do you feel as if the U.S. government is helping? Are you doing this because you don't think the government is doing enough, or are you doing this to help the effort?

BUBIS: I just think that it's not -- it's not getting to the right hands quick enough. So, there's delays in shipping and we have people on the ground that are able to get people both out over the border and then get supplies in -- across.

BERMAN: And then how much support have you received so far?

BUBIS: So much support. I come from a very large Russian-speaking community -- former Soviet Union people that came into America in the late '70s. And everybody has either family there or has offered so much support over here. We're all kind of feeling helpless watching from this side of the world and trying to help the people there.

BERMAN: Irene, thank you so much for being with us this morning.

BUBIS: Thank you.

BERMAN: We appreciate it.

So, around the world, revulsion and rage at the Russian invasion of Ukraine. But what about the Russians, themselves? CNN asked them what they think of the war. Hear what they are learning or being told in Russian propaganda T.V.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[05:56:07]

KEILAR: Video seen around the world of the war in Ukraine -- of the Russian invasion there. Footage that is informing the global view of Putin's invasion. Almost none of this, by the way, is being seen inside of Russia and that is very important. The propaganda that is being shown is shaping how many, but not all, Russians view this war.

CNN's Nic Robertson is live for us in Moscow. And you got a sense of what Russians are thinking and what they're saying about this war. What did they tell you when you spoke with them, Nic?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes, it's really interesting. You take the older generation -- sort of the Putin generation -- they're used to state media. They rely on state media for their information.

The Kremlin relies on state media to get its narrative out that they didn't start the war. That the Ukrainians have been pushing this war, backed by NATO. That this is a special military intervention. That they're helping civilians in Ukraine.

You go out on the street and you talk to the older generation and you hear some of those words quite literally being quoted back at you. And at the same time, you have the Kremlin shutting down the very few independent media outlets. Another one was shut down this morning by the Kremlin.

But despite that, there are a lot of young people here who are getting their news on the internet. They've got friends in Europe -- you know, who left Russia for jobs in Europe. They're talking to them on the phone. They're hearing what they're seeing.

And they told me yesterday that they think their government is lying to them here.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Almost all of us are understanding this thing that there is a lot of lies around. So we do not know what's happening.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): I think this is a crime. An aggression against a neighboring country. Our government invaded. Now, they are killing people.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's awful but what can we think about it? Normal people understand everything but we can't do anything because we're afraid, like everyone else.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERTSON: And what these people were telling me is they know that the state is shutting down these independent outlets but they know the independent outlets are going to try to find other forums on the internet to come back up and they're going to watch them there.

But watch this. The Russian State Duma today -- the lower house of Parliament -- passed a bill that if it becomes law would criminalize what the Kremlin would see as criticism of their military operations going on in Ukraine, and that could put somebody in jail for 15 years. It's just got to go through the upper House of Duma and then get President Putin's signature and that will become law. And I think that's what we can expect -- Brianna, John.

KEILAR: Yes. I mean, look, they don't do that if there isn't some sort of internal threat from this information getting out. That is what's very clear.

Nic Robertson live for us in Moscow. Thank you so much. And NEW DAY continues right now.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BERMAN: All right, good morning to our viewers here in the United States and all around the world. It is Friday, March fourth. I'm John Berman with Brianna Keilar.

The breaking news, Russian forces are now in essential control of Ukraine's largest nuclear power plant. You can see it right here -- the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant toward the south of the nation. This is after an attack set parts of it on fire overnight. Ukraine's president calling it terror at an unprecedented level.

Now, the fire was extinguished after the Russian shelling. It started in a training building just outside the main reactor. Radiation levels at the plant -- they do appear to be normal this morning. The head of the International Atomic Energy Agency says the situation is unprecedented and very fragile but there has not been a release of radioactive material and the integrity of the reactors has not been compromised.

Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelensky warns the worst could still come.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKY, PRESIDENT OF UKRAINE (through translator): There are 15 nuclear reactors in Ukraine. If one of them blows, that's the end for everyone.