Return to Transcripts main page

New Day

Russian Military Forces Continue Invasion of Ukraine; Ukrainian Civilians Attempting to Evacuate Cities Through Humanitarian Corridors Experience Shelling from Russian Forces; Former Boxer Wladimir Klitschko Discusses Defending Ukrainian Capital of Kyiv. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired March 08, 2022 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Overnight, the Ukrainian government agreed to an offer from the Kremlin to set up this escape route. Sumy has seen heavy fighting in recent days. Just last night Ukraine says 21 civilians were killed by air strikes, including two children.

Now, the reason to be skeptical is that these corridors have not worked, at least not so far. Moments ago, the Ukrainians report that a humanitarian convoy headed for Mariupol was shelled by Russian forces. We're monitoring that situation.

The defiant President Zelenskyy, he has been seen in his office in Kyiv for the first time since the invasion started. He says he will not hide and does not trust any offer from the Kremlin.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): There was an agreement on humanitarian corridors. Did it work? Russian tanks worked instead. Russian grads. They even mined the roads, which was agreed to transport food and medicine for people and children in Mariupol. They even destroyed the buses that have to take people out.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: And new suffering for Ukrainian civilians this morning. In Chernihiv, a school and residential building there pummeled. And in Zavorychi near Kyiv, a devastating fire at St. George's church. Parishioners say it was hit by the Russian military. And near Kherson, protesters clashed with Russian troops who are occupying their town.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) (CHANTING)

(GUNFIRE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: You hear those chants. They're saying, "go home, go home." And you hear the gunshots. Russian troops, it appears, shooting their guns in the air. No one appears to be hurt, however.

And in the Zhytomyr region, two fires raging at oil depots according to the Ukraine's foreign ministry. Ukraine state emergency services say that these were caused by Russian air strikes. and this morning we learned more than 2 million Ukrainians now have fled the country. That is according to the U.N., and that is a number that could soon swell, we're told to 5 million.

BERMAN: We want to go to CNN's chief national security correspondent Jim Sciutto live in Lviv this morning. Jim, we keep getting word that despite efforts to get humanitarian aid to people inside Mariupol there, a city of 200,000, it is not working. While there still continues to be some kind of hope from humanitarian corridors elsewhere, what do you see as the situation this morning?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: I think the fact is we have to put that phrase, "humanitarian corridor," in quotes to date, because they have proven neither humanitarian or reliable corridors out of these cities, because people on those corridors, we know, we located the videos, we have stories, eyewitness accounts, have died in those corridors.

And that's happened as Russia amps up, doesn't tamp down its attacks, its bombardment from the air, also from artillery on civilian areas and cities. And that's why you're seeing the civilian death toll go up. Sumy just one issue, one vision of that, right, with 21 people killed overnight, including two children. That's the challenge.

And you heard that frustration coming from President Zelenskyy's mouth, because, yes, there are men in suits negotiating these humanitarian corridors on the border, there are men in uniform, right, that are violating those agreements in practice on the ground. And by the way, probably not an accident, given that Russia's playbook involves in past wars in Grozny, in Chechnya, and in Syria, and Aleppo more recently, it involves the deliberate targeting of cities and civilian targets. So that's the reality on the ground. You have what's said over negotiating tables, and you have what the Ukrainian people and what reporters here are witnessing on the ground.

BERMAN: I was speaking to the mayor of Kharkiv, one of the hardest hit cities in Ukraine. And Jim, it was your reporting that the United States and NATO members have sent in 17,000 anti-tank weapons and missiles, some 2,000 anti-aircraft missiles. And the mayor Kharkiv made it sound like there are still supplies getting to the Ukrainian forces defending that city. What are the concerns you're hearing from U.S. military officials about how much longer this supply of weapons and material can get in? SCIUTTO: So we know the supply lines are open, that they have been

able to get these missiles in. But we also know that there is concern among U.S. and NATO allies that they won't always be open. So there has been an acceleration of that lethal military assistance since the start of the invasion, particularly in recent days, that gets you to those numbers, 17,000 anti-tank missiles, the vast majority of them coming in since the start of the invasion, 2,000 stingers, and in addition to that there were other versions of the MANPAD, as it's known, coming from other NATO allies.

[08:05:06]

That's a remarkable pace, but it's driven by the urgency that the U.S. and its partners fears that they won't be able to get them in, in those numbers, forever, because Russia, as it makes advances, particularly in the south, is going to, according to the U.S. intel assessment, start to target those lines.

But, but they are getting through. And we're seeing an effect on the battlefield, both in terms of lost personnel on the Russian side but also lost equipment. So that's a pretty remarkable effort to see play out in the midst of the chaos on the ground here, that they're able to get those to those forward units that need them.

BERMAN: Jim Sciutto in Lviv, Jim, great talking to you. Thank you so much.

SCIUTTO: Thanks.

KEILAR: This morning I spoke with Wladimir Klitschko, the former Ukrainian world champion boxer and a member of the Kyiv Territorial Defense Force. His brother, Vitali, is the mayor of Kyiv. And here's part of our discussion.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

KEILAR: Can you just give us a sense of what things are like there on the ground and what you've been seeing as part of the Territorial Defense Force?

WLADIMIR KLITSCHKO, KYIV BRIGADE OF UKRAINIAN DEFENSE FORCE, BROTHER OF KYIV MAYOR: On the ground it's clear that Russian army is trying to attack and planning to attack on the capital of Ukraine, city of Kyiv. Obviously territorial defense as well as military are standing together against this Russian aggression and senseless war where children, civilians are getting killed. And not to forget, Ukraine is under huge threat, and the world under huge threat. But we cannot count days, weeks, not even hours, minutes.

So the shooting is constant. In city of Kyiv, when you go to bed, you hear the explosions and launching of the rockets to defend the city as well as landing from bullets to rockets here on the territory of city of Kyiv. So this pressure is enormous and gigantic, pressure on us, Ukrainians. But we stand together against this Russian aggression.

KEILAR: You are a hall of fame boxer. You're a favorite among many people, including a lot of Russians. And I wonder if you think that they're getting information, that they know what side you're on, and that that may be raising questions for some Russians about what their country is doing.

KLITSCHKO: It's not about sides. It's about peace, because Ukraine is the most peaceful country, which never started any attacks. And if we're talking about any military equipment that Russia doesn't like us to receive, that is to defend ourselves. So our children, women, men, will be start to be killed by the Russian army. And there is -- one more time, there is no sides to choose. We're on the right side. This is our home. This is our country. And I'm proud to be Ukrainian.

KEILAR: Do you hope it is giving some of your fans, some of your Russian fans, pause to see where you are?

KLITSCHKO: Yes. They should see where I'm at. And, yes, they should know that their country, and in this case the politics of the president, Putin in this case, is aggression, killing the innocent. This is not OK. The truth is on our side, and we stand for our right for freedom and choice to be part of the European Union and the western world.

KEILAR: Your twin brother is the mayor of Kyiv, also a hall of fame box, well known, certainly, before he got into politics. How is he dealing with his city being under siege?

KLITSCHKO: It's stressful, unexpected. We were not prepared for this war to be started, an attack of Russia. And we learn every day and mobilize every day. And I could feel the spirit of the Ukrainians that are coming back from the other countries from the western world, doesn't matter where they are in the world, coming back home to defend their homes. Today's International Women Day, not to forget. And I've seen a lot in territorial defense as well as in army, a lot of Ukrainian women stand in arms with the men to defend this country.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

KEILAR: All right, thank you so much to Wladimir Klitschko for that interview.

BERMAN: Back with us, retired Brigadier General Mark Kimmitt, the former assistant secretary of state for political and military affairs.

[08:10:00]

General, thanks so much for being with us. We have been talking about these proposed humanitarian corridors out of some of these besieged Ukrainian cities, and we keep getting reports that efforts to get people out of Mariupol and supplies in have failed. I don't think you're surprised by that. Why?

BRIG. GEN. MARK KIMMITT, U.S. ARMY (RET): I'm really not. Russians are doing this offer of humanitarian corridors for public relations purposes only. That's why they want to bring them back into Russia, into Belarus, so they can show their people these starving refugees seeking assistance from the Russians. No more than that. There is no humanitarian basis for which they are considering doing this.

BERMAN: One of the thing that you have been thinking about is, where does this conflict invasion go next? And we have seen Russian tanks operating in Irpin, this suburb of Kyiv right here. And, clearly, they want to get to the city center of Kyiv. Urban combat, what does that mean? What does that entail?

KIMMITT: It's absolutely the most brutal form of warfare that is. It's house to house, block to block, half the city to half the city. It's incredibly manpower intensive, very, very high casualties. It takes an awful long time. And if you have civilians in that city as well, that just multiplies the problem immensely.

BERMAN: We have pictures, we had pictures a second ago, of tanks that were operating in Irpin, in the suburb, right next to Kyiv right there. There are the images right there. These were the tanks taking up positions yesterday. What kind of forces, what were the numbers of forces that the Russians would need to have to fight inside Kyiv?

KIMMITT: If they wanted to take Kyiv from a well-armed defender like the Ukrainian troops, you're talking 100,000 as a minimum to take parts of the city.

BERMAN: This is just to take parts of Kyiv.

KIMMITT: Absolutely. Absolutely. Enormously manpower intensive. Remember, those tanks are going to be of no value to the Russians inside the city, because that's not the way the Ukrainians are going to want to fight. They're going to want to fight in the side places. They're going to want to fight in the tough areas. And remember, every building that has been knocked down by the Russians is a potential bunker for the Ukrainian forces.

BERMAN: So you say 100,000 just to take Kyiv alone there. This is something your old friend General Mark Hertling has been bringing up, is that the Russians, at least as far as we know, they don't have enough troops here to do what it appears to be they're trying to do, which would be to occupy Kyiv, which would be to occupy parts of this country. If it is south of 200,000 troops, how do they do that?

KIMMITT: Well, it is the proverbial dog catching the school bus. Once they do this -- and that goes to the fundamental point, which is why the Ukrainians, so good at partisan warfare, will eventually make this miserable and deadly for the Russians as the mujahadin did in Afghanistan. They will bleed the Russians, not only inside the city, but outside the city and in the countryside as well.

BERMAN: Retired Brigadier General Mark Kimmitt, great to see you this morning. Thanks so much for coming in. I appreciate it.

So breaking this morning, energy giant Shell says it will stop buying Russian oil and gas as President Biden faces growing calls to end all Russian oil imports. What this means for U.S. gas prices.

Plus, why the letter "Z" has emerged as a symbol for the Russians of this invasion. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRESIDENT VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINE (through translator): The fault is with the occupants, but the responsibility is with those who for the last 13 days somewhere out there on the west, somewhere in their offices, can't approve a necessary decision. Those who haven't protected our cities from air bombings and rockets when they actually can.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: A new video message just released by Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy with harsh words for Western nations who he says are not putting any full effort on Ukraine's behalf.

Joining us now is Senator Chris Coons. He's a member of the Foreign Relations Committee. He's also a close ally to President Biden.

I'm wondering, let's talk first about oil, because that is one way that it appears the U.S. may be stepping up here. Are we going to see the White House announce that they are done with Russian energy?

SEN. CHRIS COONS (D-DE): Likely, yes, Brianna. I don't know if that will be today or tomorrow. But two things if I could up front about banning Russian oil and gas from the American market. It's a fairly small percentage of the energy coming into the United States, but it's critical for Western Europe.

The strength of our sanctions, of the costs we're imposing on Putin for this brutal invasion of Ukraine are more successful and more sustainable when they're coordinated. So I respect the fact the administration is coordinating with our European allies and making sure that we have done the ground work to understand how to effectively implement a ban on Russian energy.

I support the initiative by Senators Manchin and Murkowski. There are Republicans and Democrats in Congress calling for this, and I expect the administration to continue its forceful leadership on imposing costs on Russia.

KEILAR: Okay. So you're expecting that that's what the administration is going to do. Say no to Russian energy.

But to your point, it only accounts for 8 percent of U.S. energy, I think it's 3 percent of American -- of the crude that America consumes. So, it's not that much.

You recently traveled to Germany where it is a much bigger fraction of the energy consumption. You were there with a congressional delegation. They're not on board with this.

Will the White House do this without Europe and can they?

COONS: Look, first, we have to be working in close consultation with our European allies and we have to provide support for their transition to renewables, and for the temporary but urgent need they're going to have to replace Russian gas with other sources.

Fortunately, the United States is a major producer of LNG. And I'm meeting with a Republican colleague right after this interview to talk about how we can find a path forward that is both climate ambitious in terms of renewables and uses American energy to buttress our critical allies.

[08:20:07]

Brianna, this conflict is going to go on for a while and we need to be able to sustain our Western allies and to support the people of Ukraine. I'm working hard to secure $10 billion in additional humanitarian aid for Ukraine and Ukrainian refugees.

We're less than two weeks into this war, and there is already 2 million refugees flooding into countries like Poland and Hungary and Romania that need our support.

Your viewers this morning, many of them, are wondering, what can I do to help Ukrainian refugees? You can feel proud the American people are going to step forward and provide critically needed support, both military support for the Ukrainian resistance and humanitarian support for food and housing and healthcare for the millions of refugees who will be pouring out of Ukraine in the coming weeks.

KEILAR: You're aware, just to touch back again on oil, that Russia is threatening to completely cut off energy sales, which would be something to behold.

COONS: Yes.

KEILAR: And Russia is saying that oil, which, of course, is priced globally, the U.S. only gets a smidge of Russian energy, it doesn't necessarily matter, it can hit $300 a barrel. For comparison, it is less than half that right now and gas is at $4 a gallon.

Do you think that can happen?

COONS: Yes. I think it is important to realize that both Republicans and Democrats here in Congress are pushing and pushing urgently for us to ban Russian gas and oil. We have to realize that it is a global integrated market, as you just put it. It is tough to turn on the taps and increase production quickly. It's not like phoning up Amazon and saying deliver this tomorrow.

And we are going to see increased gas prices here in the United States. In Europe, they will see dramatic increases in prices. That's the cost of standing up for freedom. And of standing alongside the Ukrainian people, but it is going to cost us and I'm already getting calls from Delawareans concerned about high gas prices.

We need to see the cost and benefit here.

KEILAR: Yeah. To that end, the Biden administration officials there are approaching Venezuela, which is sort of a -- maybe not someone that the U.S. wants to be associated with, but nonetheless they are maybe looking to Iran to make up a possible gap in sales of Russian oil.

Do you support that?

COONS: Look, I know they are talking to our close ally and our largest source of oil and gas, that's Canada, as well as to American producers and other countries around the world. I think there are good reasons to explore conversations with Iran about their nuclear program, with Venezuela, about human rights and the American hostages they're holding.

But I think we should start by focusing on Canada, and the United States, but frankly we are going to be in a global energy crisis. As you just said, Brianna, we might well see energy prices double because Putin realizes he's got Western Europe over a barrel. This is his single greatest conventional weapon, nonmilitary weapon, that he can use to push back the west and to divide us. It is the weapon he used after he invaded Crimea in 2014 to dissuade our European partners from joining us in tougher sanctions.

I expect him to use it and I expect that will make energy prices spike and I think there will be a genuine race to produce more around the world.

KEILAR: I think you have a lot of people's attention with the picture you just painted. Senator Coons, thank you so much for being with us this morning.

COONS: Thank you, Brianna.

KEILAR: The letter Z is fast spreading across Russia as a show of support for the invasion of Ukraine. A CNN report of how it started and what it means next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:27:56]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: So in Russia, the letter Z has become a pro war symbol of President Vladimir Putin's invasion of Ukraine. It was first spotted on tanks and military vehicles, but now it seems to be gaining support from Russian civilians.

CNN's Phil Black has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PHIL BLACK, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's impossible not to notice, many of the Russian vehicles invading Ukraine carry a distinctive mark, trucks, tanks, fighting, engineering and logistical vehicles, they are advancing through Ukraine with the letter "Z", painted conspicuously in white. The people being invaded have noticed. Here in the eastern Ukrainian

town, an angry crowd swarms after and attacks a single vehicle. It is its only obvious connection to the war the letter "Z".

ARIC TOLER, DIRECTOR OF RESEARCH TRAINING, BELLINGCAT: There is a million different theories about what it means, but I think it is a marking, just an easy thing to mark, like a square or a triangle.

BLACK: In a war where the wannabe conquerors are not flying their national flag, that single character has taken on special significance.

At a recent gymnastics world cup event, 20-year-old Russian competitor Ivan Kuliak accepted his bronze medal wearing a "Z" prominently on his chest. He was standing next to a Ukrainian athlete. The sports governing body described it as shocking behavior.

But how do you describe this. Terminally ill children and their careers formed a giant "Z" outside a hospice in the Russian city.

BRIAN KLAAS, ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR, UNIVERSITY COLLEGE LONDON: The city is co-opting young children to be propaganda mechanisms for their war. It is dangerous when small little symbols become proxies for being a loyal citizen in an authoritarian regime during a time of war. Those who don't wear it, those who don't show the "Z" could be targeted by the state.

BLACK: And in this highly produced propaganda video, Russian men wearing that letter declare their support for the invasion, chanting -- for Russia, for the president, for Russia, for Putin.