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Russian Forces Continue Invasion of Ukraine; Deputy Mayor of Mariupol, Ukraine, Interviewed on Efforts at Humanitarian Evacuations of City; Ukrainians Warn They May Not be able to Cool Spent Fuel Rods at Chernobyl Nuclear Site; Parents of American Detained in Russia Discuss Speaking with President Biden And Also Their Son; Russia Says U.S. Has Declared Economic War on It. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired March 09, 2022 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, I think there was also this thought in World War II, oh, they'll just at Poland, right? And people wonder, oh, will he really just stop at Ukraine, like what comes after this? Kim, John, thank you so much for the discussion, really appreciate it.

And CNN's breaking news coverage continues right now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is CNN breaking news.

KEILAR: Good morning to viewers here in the U.S. and around the world. It is Wednesday, March 9th. And I'm Brianna Keilar with John Berman.

We have several new developments breaking just moments ago that we're following here. Russia accusing the U.S. of waging an economic war after President Biden ordered a halt to Russian oil, gas, and coal imports. And a warning from Ukraine that radioactive substances could be released from the Chernobyl nuclear power plant because it cannot cool spent nuclear fuel after its power connection was severed. Russia is in control of that facility. We're going to have more on that, very important development here in just a moment.

And after Ukraine and Russia agreed on a cease-fire to evacuate civilians from six locations, we're getting reports that heavy weapons fire has erupted along some of the routes. In one of the cities under discussion, Sumy, 5,000 civilians have been able to evacuate, but only after 21 people were killed by Russian air strikes, and that included two children. JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: The fighting has been ferocious there. This

drone video shows a Russian military vehicle destroyed in a battle with Ukrainian troops. Elsewhere, we have this eyewitness video. It's a Russian military armored train from Crimea moving into Ukraine's Kherson region. It's nine cars long. It has at least two apparent gunner cars. You can see the letter "Z" painted on some of the cars. That's Russian propaganda.

Also, in southern Ukraine, heavy shelling and explosions overnight in the city of Mykolaiv. Let me show you where that is right here. Mykolaiv has been under attack, fierce attack. Ukrainian forces are blocking Russian advancement into the port city by piling tires at ever entrance to the city to be set on fire in case of an attack. Right now, the Russians remain in control -- sorry, Ukrainians remain in control of Mykolaiv, but it has been coming under very heavy bombardment.

Right now, I want to go to the deputy mayor of Mariupol in Ukraine, Sergei Orlov. Sergei, Mr. Deputy Mayor, your city has been under constant attack, all but surrounded by Russian troops. I know there were talks about a corridor to let civilians out. Any evidence of that working this morning?

DEPUTY MAYOR SERGEI ORLOV, MARIUPOL, UKRAINE: Yes, today is our fifth attempt to provide humanitarian corridor. And we know that no previous attempt was successful. So we hope that this one will be successful. It is about 3:00 p.m. in Ukraine, but we still do not move near Mariupol. So we start our procedure to move trucks with humanitarian goods and buses from Zaporizhzhia to Mariupol. But unfortunately, they are still not near Mariupol because of under continuous shelling on the way. And also there is no cease-fire, any cease-fire in Mariupol. Mariupol is under continuous shelling from the artillery and bombing, each hour, each minute, each second.

BERMAN: I understand yesterday was the digging of what you called the first mass grave in the city. What can you tell us about that?

ORLOV: The numbers really awful. And we faced with up to yesterday, we had confirmed 1,207 victims, I mean dead people who were killed by this war. That's not just usual death. That's only who was killed by shelling and artillery. And we really cannot calculate how many deaths we have. It's three to four times more. So we are not able even to count how many people on streets killed by bombing and artillery. It is truth, and it's real war crimes.

BERMAN: I hadn't heard that number before. You're saying at least 1,200 killed in Mariupol?

ORLOV: Yes, it is official numbers for yesterday of our police office, but I think the number is three to four times more.

BERMAN: How --

ORLOV: They were killed on the streets.

BERMAN: And these are just -- these are not fighters. These are just civilians?

ORLOV: Yes, yes.

BERMAN: How have you been able to keep the Russians out of your city?

[08:05:00]

ORLOV: I don't know. Our Ukrainian army is very brave and defend our city. But we told it many times, we are not able to protect our lives, civil lives while attacking from the air. Just yesterday we had a lot of cases of bombing of Russian aircraft, from Russian aircraft. And you should understand that it is unmanageable. So this night they totally destroyed our biggest steel plant. It's even not exist and cannot open anymore, never.

BERMAN: What about food? What about water?

ORLOV: For last one or two days we move to period, so there is no water, electricity, heating, gas supply, sanitary system. So people just collecting wood on the street, making fire, and use snow to melt it to water. So it's an awful situation, and I cannot imagine in my mind it is possible in 21 century, but it is true.

BERMAN: You're melting snow to make water. I know you have spoken to my colleagues the other day and said you haven't been able to reach your parents. Do you know that your family is OK?

ORLOV: Yes, the situation did not change. The district where they live has fled and I'm not sure that they can see them anymore. But I hope and pray that they are alive.

BERMAN: But you don't know that your parents are alive?

ORLOV: No, for eight years -- for eight days, excuse me.

BERMAN: Eight days now you don't know if your parents are alive. Deputy Mayor, how long -- given the situation --

ORLOV: This district does not exist anymore. There is no any building without damage or destroyed. This district, 138,000 citizens live there. There is no any building without damages or destroyed building.

BERMAN: And Deputy Mayor, how long can you hold out under these circumstances?

ORLOV: I don't know. It's an awful issue. From the point of view of our brave army, it could last up to the last bullet. But the humanitarian situation is awful. At least 3,000 infants do not receive -- do not receive food because their mothers do not have milk and we don't have child food. So I don't know how many days it is possible to keep the city.

BERMAN: Deputy Mayor Sergei Orlov of Mariupol, listen, I'm praying for your parents, I hope your family is OK, and we're all thinking about your city. Thank you so much for being with us.

ORLOV: Thank you. Thank you. Bye.

BERMAN: We have other breaking news, this warning from Ukraine that radioactive substances could be released from the Chernobyl nuclear power plant because they can't cool the spent fuel rods there. This is after its power connection was somehow severed. Russia is in control of the facility, Brianna. This is a warning from the Ukrainians that they don't know what the situation is inside that power plant and they're very concerned.

KEILAR: Yes, so, everyone I think is familiar with Chernobyl, where there was an explosion in the 80s, but what we've heard from nuclear experts looking at this, it sounds like what they're setting up here is more of a Fukushima situation, which is that you have this spent fuel, and it requires even now, even though Chernobyl is not operative, it requires the cooling to stop radioactive material, which could be incredibly damaging from getting into the atmosphere, right? So then you're looking at a contamination thing all over again.

This is very serious. They don't have power. And we also know, John, that the folks who have been working there have been doing so under threat of force since Russia occupied very early on in this conflict.

BERMAN: We're going to have much more on this. A nuclear expert is going to join us to assess this situation. This is CNN's special live coverage. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:12:53]

KEILAR: After months of waiting and pleading for a meeting with the White House, the family of an American detained in Russia since 2019 finally received a call from President Biden, a call that they have been praying for. Joey and Paula Reed, the parents of former U.S. marine Trevor Reed, were staking out the president's motorcade route during his trip to Fort Worth, Texas, not too far from their home, and they were holding signs about their son, and the motorcade passed them without stopping. But then their phone rang with a number that said the White House. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And I just can't imagine what you're going through. And look, I know what you're going through is hell. I don't want you to think it is not something I constantly think about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Joining us now to tell us about their phone call with the president are Trevor's parents, Paula and Joey Reed. "The Dallas Morning News" reported that he appeared to acknowledge you with a gesture, that he seemed to have seen you from the motorcade. Paula, tell us about this phone call and what it meant to you.

PAUL REED, MOTHER OF TREVOR REED WHO HAS BEEN DETAINED IN RUSSIA SINCE 2019: It was great. It was everything we could have hoped for. We thought with just the acknowledgement on the way into the motorcade, I felt, OK, he at least saw me, and I felt validated by that. But then when he called, it put it over the top. It was just great.

KEILAR: Joey?

JOEY REED, FATHER OF TREVOR REED WHO HAS BEEN DETAINED IN RUSSIA SINCE 2019: Yes, we had -- we just wanted to yesterday -- we wanted to get some media attention for our son, and hopefully set up a meeting with the president, which they already said on Air Force One on the way in, that they were planning on having some sort of meeting with us. But he confirmed that directly, and the phone call we received from President Biden is exactly how you want a president to be. And we're very thankful.

KEILAR: So, Joey, he was very compassionate, he was very sympathetic to what you're going through. What else did he tell you?

J. REED: We want to reiterate that we've always said that we believe President Biden is probably one of the most compassionate, caring presidents we've had in modern times. But he just reinforced that he's always thinking about Trevor, and that -- talked briefly about his son and why he couldn't stop in the motorcade, and the Secret Service frowns upon it when they have a large convoy.

[08:15:12]

And so then the thing that really kind of put it over the top for us was he said he prays for our son every day and he had said a rosary before he came to fort worth for our son.

KEILAR: Paula, you've been fighting for so long to try to get Trevor home. And more people are paying attention now. They're watching Russia. They're seeing this war happening. What has been going through your mind as this war has been going on?

P. REED: It is kind of a double edged for me because finally we're getting the media attention that we deserve, and like you said, the attention from the world in general. But it comes at a horrible price. We feel horrible for the Ukrainian people and the Russian people who don't want to be in a war. And then also we had some more publicity after Brittney Griner got arrested, and we feel sorry for her and her family.

KEILAR: Yes. Certainly. And I think she's elevated certainly Trevor's case as well with now being in detention herself. So I know, Joey, you haven't spoken, you haven't spoken to Trevor in a very long time. Then out of the blue he was actually able to call you a few times on Friday and yesterday. Can you tell us about that, tell us how he sounds?

J. REED: Yes, we hadn't heard from him in 232 days until this past Friday. Then he was able to call us again on Monday, and then we actually -- he called us again this morning. He's been sounding horrible. He's coughing constantly, said he's coughing up blood throughout the day. He has fever off and on, over 100 grows, and he has pain in his chest. Just all the signs of tuberculosis, which we're afraid he's contracted. And then we had even worse news this morning. He called and he could barely talk. Some sort of accident, and he believes he might have broken a rib. So now as he's coughing, he has shooting, stabbing pains in his chest.

P. REED: Every time he calls.

J. REED: So he said they said that they'll send him to a hospital prison to be checked on Friday. So again, it just seems to be getting worse and worse.

PAUL: Paula, what kind of accident? Did he shed any light on that?

P. REED: I think he said something fell on him from a shelf. And he was immediately felt pain after it occurred.

J. REED: Another strange update is that in the last three weeks they have not put him in solitary confinement where he's been for most of the last seven months. So he's in a regular barracks right now. And something happened there, he said something fell on him. And he's hurt -- his chest is hurting in a different way now.

KEILAR: Do you think he can be honest with you? Do you think he can be fully honest with you, Paula, about what's going on with him and his health?

P. REED: Yes, I do. Absolutely.

J. REED: I'm not sure of that.

KEILAR: That's my question, I think, Joey, is do you have reason to believe that it is something other than something fell on him?

J. REED: I don't, but you have to always leave that open. His calls are monitored and sometimes there might be -- not sure there is someone with him, but there could be. For the most part he's pretty open with what he says. He's not concerned about going into solitary confinement, that's for sure.

KEILAR: Look, the last time we spoke with you guys, we said what would you say to Trevor? And here you've had this chance to tell him. What did you say to him, Paula, after so many days of not being able to speak with him?

P. REED: Well, we told him the good news that we had gone to the event yesterday and that President Biden waved to us and that he actually called us. And he said he was very excited for us, but he's still -- cautiously optimistic. I think that's the best way he can cope with things. I think he doesn't want to get his hopes up too much. So for him it works better if he just kind of downplays everything. But he could tell that we were very excited.

KEILAR: Joey, does he understand what's going on? How much were you able to fill him in and tell him what's happening with the war and how much pressure Russia is under?

J. REED: Yes, surprisingly they are not censoring what he says to us. So he's telling us what they're hearing there in the barracks from Russian TV. Or there is a TV somewhere where they're getting information. And they're getting ai completely different story. In fact, when he called Monday, the news they're getting is that Ukraine was all but conquered, the Russians had covered most of Ukraine already. And so we're -- and then he says what's actually going on, and then we try to fill him in. And he's, like, oh, wow, that's not at all what we're hearing here.

KEILAR: And what was his reaction to learning that? When you said to him, actually, Ukraine, the expectation was that it would topple and yet the resistance is incredible and Russia is really kind of on its heels or flat-footed here, what did he say to that?

J. REED: Well, he didn't say this, but I can speak for him. If the Russian government speaks, you should pretty much consider that it's false or largely false.

[08:20:06]

P. REED: And he had a little chuckle, I think, when we first told him, too.

KEILAR: Well, I -- it must have been amazing for him to hear your voices after so long, and for you to hear his, and I just can't imagine how much that buoyed him to be able to talk to you guys. And I thank you so much. Thank you for telling us about your conversations with him and about the president, Paula and Joey, appreciate it.

J. REED: Thank you.

P. REED: Thank you. Thank you for having us.

KEILAR: Of course.

BERMAN: All right, and we do have breaking news. A warning from Ukraine now that radioactive substances could be released from the Chernobyl nuclear power plant because they can't cool the spent fuel rods after its power connection was severed. Russia is in control of that facility.

Joining me now is Joel Rubin, former deputy assistant secretary of state and former policy director at Ploughshares Fund. It's a global securities foundation focused on nuclear nonproliferation and conflict resolution. Joel, thanks so much for being with us. What does this mean? Decode that for us.

JOEL RUBIN, FORMER DEPUTY ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF STATE: John, it's great to be with you. This is a very dangerous situation. IAEA, the International Atomic Energy Agency, has been warning for several days now of a potential catastrophe because of Russian control of nuclear facilities. Cutting off electricity at Chernobyl, eliminating its ability to cool, could risk meltdown. Chernobyl, as we all know, is the site of the original nuclear catastrophe in the former Soviet Union, then the Soviet Union. It contaminated unending kilometers of farmland, harmed tens of thousands of people. This is extraordinarily reckless. It's energy extortion, nuclear energy extortion in this case. And it also is extortion of the Ukrainian people because it's going to harm their ability to eat, have electricity. This is a diabolical maneuver by Vladimir Putin.

BERMAN: I suppose we don't know for sure if this is being done on purpose or whether it is just ineptitude. Either way, the consequences could be the same. I think the Ukrainians are saying that they have diesel generators which can do the work for about 48 hours. They're running out of time. What does happen if you can no longer cool the spent rods?

RUBIN: I'll tell you, the reason I believe this is intentional is because it is not as if Russia wasn't warned about this, it is not as if Vladimir Putin hasn't been signaling time and again that he wants to use nuclear energy or nuclear weapons as a tool in his arsenal in this illegal invasion of Ukraine. And so if we don't get control of it, if the international community, Ukraine scientists don't get control of this facility, don't get it running, don't get it cooling again, off of diesel and onto legitimate electricity that's reliable and it's sustainable, then there is a risk of a meltdown. And that cannot be something that is continually held as a trigger to the head of the Ukrainian people or Europe.

BERMAN: I get your point here. Cooling the spent fuel rods is not some ancillary concern. It's the job. That's what you do to manage a nuclear power plant. And if that's not happening, obviously a huge concern. Joel Rubin, thank you very much.

RUBIN: Appreciate it. Thank you.

BERMAN: So with companies cutting ties to Russia and the president banning -- President Biden banning Russian energy imports, the Kremlin says the U.S. has declared an economic war. How this escalation could affect average Americans next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:27:27]

BERMAN: All right, the breaking news this morning, the Kremlin says, quote, "The United States has undoubtedly declared an economic war on Russia, and they are waging this war." This after President Biden announced a ban on U.S. imports of Russian oil, and more and more U.S. companies, this entire list, and this list is growing by the day, are pulling their business from Russia.

Joining us now, Larry Summers, former director of the White House National Economic Council under President Obama and Treasury Secretary for President Clinton. Secretary, thank you so much for joining us. An economic war, is that, a, a fair assessment, and, b, worth it for the United States?

LAWRENCE SUMMERS, FORMER TREASURY SECRETARY, CLINTON ADMINISTRATION: "Economic war" is a very strong term. But this is as serious an effort to do economic damage to a major country as we have engaged in at any point. I think it is worth it. I think ultimately the question of whether aggression is resisted, whether some kind of international order is maintained, will be remembered by historians much longer than what happens to the CPI inflation rate over the next nine months.

I think to be truly effective we're going to have to figure out a way not just to restrict our own imports of Russian oil, but to restrict exports of Russian oil generally. If we don't do that, it's going to lead simply to rearrangement of the flows that won't do much -- won't do as much damage to Russia, will still do some potential damage to us. But I think that taking strong action is broadly the right thing to do.

BERMAN: It seems to be what you're saying is, yes, it might raise gas prices at the pump some cents maybe, maybe half a dollar, but that's worth it. Is that what you're saying?

SUMMERS: That is what I'm saying. Frankly, it could be more than that. But we need to remember that relative to what was true historically, there is some room for gas prices to run. President Obama was decisively reelected in 2012. In today's dollars, gas prices then were about $4.50. And in addition, we've had substantial fuel economy gains since then and gains in people's income. So the burden of gas prices at that time was probably closer than what we go to -- what we go with $5 gas today.