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Crew Member Tried to Sink Russian Oligarch's Yacht; Justice's Wife Pushed to Overturn Election; Iryna Matviyishyn is Interviewed about Ukraine; Biden Gives Address in Poland. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired March 25, 2022 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:30:00]

TARAS OSTAPCHUK, FORMER CHIEF ENGINEER, LADY ANASTASIA (through translator): In Russia and Ukraine, and you have to choose. Either you are with Ukraine or not. You have to choose. Will there be Ukraine or will you have a job? I made a choice. I don't need a job if I don't have Ukraine.

DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Back in Spain, Spain's ministry of transport has agreed to the provisional detention of the yacht Lady Anastasia while it confirms its real ownership and determines if it falls under European Union sanctions and can be seized. It's one of a long list of suspected Russian oligarch yachts now frozen in European ports in an effort to apply pressure on Putin through his inner circle of oligarchs to stop this war.

Taras Ostapchuk says others working for oligarchs around the world should expose them and their assets. His effort, to make the profiteers of Vladimir Putin's regime pay for what they are doing.

OSTAPCHUK (through translator): I think what I did is absolutely 100 percent correct. I tried to sink the boat as a political protest of Russian aggression because its owner is connected to the production of Russian weapons. They should be held responsible because they, who with their behavior, with their lifestyle, with their unquenchable greed, they precisely led to this. In order to distract the people from the real plunder of Russia by these rulers, they arrange divisionary wars with other countries that are innocent.

GRIFFIN (on camera): Is there any message that you would like the people of the United States to know right now?

OSTAPCHUK (speaking in English): Help us please. Send guns to Ukraine, please. We must stop it, this war. We must win.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRIFFIN: John, he has no doubt that the military equipment being made by that company, tied to his boss, is killing civilians in Ukraine right now.

As for the company itself, we did reach out to them. They would not comment on the yacht's ownership or its employees and told us if we wanted any information on what's happening in Ukraine we should call the Russian defense ministry.

John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Drew, what a story and just an example of how one man doing everything he possibly can to fight back.

GRIFFIN: The spirit is incredible. I just don't understand how Russia can possibly think it's going to do anything in Ukraine. I really don't.

BERMAN: Drew Griffin, terrific story, thanks so much.

We have new text messages between President Trump's -- former President Trump's chief of staff and the wife of a Supreme Court justice, urging the White House to continue the big lie. So, what's the January 6th committee's next move?

And soon, President Biden will land in Poland for his next set of high stakes meetings. CNN live in Warsaw.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:36:45]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: The January 6th Select Committee has obtained more than two dozen text messages between President Trump's former chief of staff, Mark Meadows, and Ginni Thomas, the wife of Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas, including this one that was sent after the January 6th attack. It reads, we are living through what feels like the end of America. Most of us are disgusted with the VP and in a listening mode to see where to fight with our teams. Those who attacked the Capitol are not representative of our great teams of patriots for DJT. Amazing times. The end of liberty.

Joining me now is CNN chief legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin.

Put this into context for us, if you will, Jeff, including the fact that, remember, in January, Justice Thomas was the only one who dissented in that decision to allow the committee to receive documents from the Trump White House from the National Archive.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN CHIEF LEGAL ANALYST: Right, Brianna. I mean what -- what really is important about these messages is not the really extreme and somewhat crazy views that Ginni Thomas expresses like, you know, that Biden and his supporters should be sent to prison in Guantanamo. I mean it is really, really extreme stuff. But she's a private citizen. She's entitled to her views.

What's extraordinary is that her husband, Justice Thomas, remains sitting on the bench in cases directly relevant to what she's talking about in these -- in these texts. You know, he, as you pointed out, has already voted once in defense of -- the only justice in defense of the Trump position about access to memos about January 6th. There are more cases in the pipeline on this subject. And he has continued throughout his career never to recuse himself in cases in which his wife has been intimately involved as a political figure. KEILAR: And, Trump, I mean, we'll recall, looking back on it, Jeffrey,

that Trump believed the Supreme Court would come through for him because he had appointed so many justices in part, but he would talk about it, my court. I mean he expected some allegiance. How does that fit into all of this?

TOOBIN: Well, it -- you know, the thing that is so extraordinary about this is that, you know, they have all -- the -- Ginni and Clarence Thomas have talked about, you know, that they are a team. Now, they also say that they do not interfere with each other's work. But, you know, the tradition in courts has been that if a judge's spouse is at all involved in a matter that comes before the court, the judge recuses himself.

Now, what's unusual about the United States Supreme Court is that they have exempted themselves from all the ethical rules that other federal judges are abided by. So, the Supreme Court operates entirely on an honor system. There is no formal rule for when judges should recuse themselves. But, you know, by any reasonable standard, Clarence Thomas should not be sitting in all these cases.

KEILAR: We see in some of the other texts, she's referencing her communications with other people, besides Mark Meadows. Jared, she says. She talks about Sidney Powell.

I wonder, as Trump was hoping that the Supreme Court would go his way, do you think Ginni Thomas' communications were giving any indication to these folks, including Mark Meadows, that, yes, maybe -- maybe they will?

[08:40:10]

TOOBIN: I mean you can only assume that the Trump people knew that Ginni Thomas was Clarence Thomas' wife. And she was given special access and special opportunities to meet with the president throughout the president -- President Trump's term. That does seem to be an effort to appeal to her husband. And it worked, at least in one case. I mean he was the only justice who voted for Trump in the first January 6th case.

You know, I don't know what went on behind the scenes, but this is precisely the reason why judges are supposed to recuse themselves when there is this appearance of possible influence from the outside.

KEILAR: Yes, this -- what a bizarre twist.

Jeffrey, thank you so much for that.

TOOBIN: All right, Brianna.

KEILAR: Intense fighting overnight in several cities with Ukrainian forces making gains east of the capital. Our next guest is a Ukrainian journalist and says although there is a lot of work left to do, they're not losing hope.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BERMAN: One month into the Russian invasion of Ukraine and there is little indication that this will end anytime soon. What more could the west be doing to help the Ukrainians here?

Joining me now is Ukrainian journalist Iryna Matviyishyn.

Iryna, thank you so much for being with us.

You've written that there's more that the west should be doing. What more?

IRYNA MATVIYISHYN, UKRAINIAN JOURNALIST: Thank you for having me here.

Well, it's a complex question, but also a very simple one for every Ukraine who's waiting for this help because we realize the west also is afraid of their own security and everyone is afraid of the potential World War III. But for us, for Ukrainians, the World War III has already started. We've lost so many lives and we realize that humanitarian aid is not enough.

[08:45:01]

Ukrainians appreciate all the humanitarian effort from the west, but they also realize that we keep losing lives because the sky is not closed and civilians are being hit from the sky. You can't -- you can't save lives with constant bombardments, even if you have the most developed weapons on the ground. That's why Ukraine is intensively asking for defensive weapons to intercept missiles and to intercept the planes, to shoot the planes down. That's the only way and the only alternative to help Ukrainians save lives if NATO doesn't want to close -- to impose a no-fly zone.

BERMAN: Do you think Ukraine can win here? Or what would winning be?

MATVIYISHYN: Every Ukrainian, I think, is sure now of our victory. It's just a matter of time and a matter of losses. We realize the longer it takes for the west to respond to these threats and to provide more defensive weapons to Ukraine, the more losses we have and the more casualties we have among the civilians. Ninety-three percent of Ukrainians believe that Ukraine would be able to win this war, according to the latest poll. And I think despite all the devastation and horrors that we see daily, all around Ukraine, we realize that's the only way to survive. So maybe that's -- that's why Ukrainians hope so much and believe so much in this victory, because they realize that's the only way to save the nation.

BERMAN: If there's one thing you can say to Americans, what would it be?

MATVIYISHYN: I would say thank you, because Ukrainians surely see all the support from American people, and I personally get dozens of messages every day, from all around the world, but also from Americans. But I would also ask not to forget about this war. Not to let it fade away with time because everybody is getting tired of conflicts and all these terrifying news, but we shouldn't let this happen. BERMAN: Yes, for people who get tired watching it, imagine what it

must be like to live it, your friends and family are getting killed and bombed every day.

Iryna, thank you so much for being with us.

MATVIYISHYN: Thank you.

BERMAN: President Biden will meet with Ukrainian refugees this weekend in Poland, according to the White House. He will also deliver a major address. We're live in Warsaw, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:51:32]

KEILAR: Breaking news.

The White House says President Biden will make a major address in Poland tomorrow.

CNN's Kaitlan Collins is live in Warsaw, where the president is expected.

Tell us, Kaitlan, about this, a major address.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, this is an address that's going to come after he meets face to face with some of these Ukrainian refugees who have obviously fled since this invasion began, Brianna. Obviously, this will be the first time the president is having that experience in this month now that that invasion has now stretched into. And that comes after today he is on the way to Poland right now, first before he comes here to Warsaw, where I am, he's going to go to Jesjev (ph), Poland. That is where he's going to get a briefing on this humanitarian crisis that has been caused by this Russian invasion of Ukraine, because just here in Poland alone, over 2 million refugees have come here since they've been displaced by this Russian invasion. Obviously, they've taken in the majority of refugees. Many others have gone to other nations here in Europe, including Germany and others. But the focus on Poland is really going to be to thank them for their efforts, to help process these refugees, to talk about what these refugees have gone through, Brianna.

He's also going to meet with members of the 82nd Airborne division. Obviously, the president has been talking about bolstering U.S. forces here on the eastern flank of NATO given that's been a major concern for a lot of these NATO allies since Russia invaded is this Russian aggression that you've seen. Ukrainian President Zelenskyy has been offering his own warnings, saying he doesn't believe Putin is going to stop with Ukraine when it comes to invasions. And so that's been an obvious concern.

Now, it's different given Poland is a NATO ally. They are -- that is, they do fall under the every inch of NATO territory that President Biden and other NATO allies have said they would defend if they came under attack. But I think this trip will be in two part focused on just that, the

NATO alliance, but also talking to these refugees about what they've been through, talking to them about how this has gone down.

And it comes, of course, as President Biden himself has announced that the United States will take in up to 100,000 Ukrainian refugees. Certainly, of course, a large number, more than the total refugees taken in by the United States in recent years. So that will really be the focus of the second half of this trip, Brianna.

KEILAR: All right, Kaitlan, we'll be watching with you. Thank you so much. Kaitlan Collins, live from Warsaw, Poland.

As she mentioned, we're waiting the president's arrival there in Poland.

CNN's coverage continues next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:58:22]

KEILAR: This week, CNN Heroes is saluting the strength, courage and resilience of the Ukrainian people as they continue to fight for their democracy and their lives amid the Russian invasion. We share this tribute to them, scored to John Legend's "Never Break."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We came to volunteer because we know that it's our home here.

JOHN LEGEND, MUSICIAN (singing): Our heart.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) Ukraine.

LEGEND: We got a good thing, babe. Whenever life is hard. We'll never lose our way, cause we both know who we are. Who knows about tomorrow? We don't know what's in the stars. I just know I'll always follow the light in your heart. I'm not worried about us.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's a full-fledged war. And in a very difficult situation we all resist and we will continue to resist.

LEGEND: And I've never been. We know how the story ends. We will never break. We will never break. Built on a foundation strong enough to stay.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (speaking in foreign language).

LEGEND: We will never break. As the water rises and the mountains shake, our love will remain. We will never.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KEILAR: CNN's audience, that's you, has already contributed more than $6.6 million toward the humanitarian efforts that support Ukrainians.

[09:00:00]

And if you'd like to find out how you can help, and to watch the full- length salute to the Ukrainian people, just go to cnnheroes.com.

CNN's coverage continues right now.