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Senators Holding Meeting to Discuss Possible Gun Legislation in Wake of Elementary School Shooting in Uvalde, Texas; Timeline Emerges of Uvalde, Texas, School Shooting Including Multiple 911 Calls from Children in Classrooms; President Biden to Meet with Federal Reserve Chairman Jerome Powell to Discuss Inflation. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired May 31, 2022 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: After this Memorial Day holiday you can expect that lawmakers are going to get on a Zoom today to have a bipartisan discussion, one of the earliest discussions, about what is actually possible. And Senator John Cornyn, a Republican from Texas, addressed this yesterday when he was back in his home state, saying that he thought that there were a couple of things that lawmakers could be discussing, things that were in the universe of the possible. And he specifically cited mental health legislation, access to mental healthcare in this country needing to be boosted. He also talked about background checks needing to be expanded.

Now, those are two areas that he has worked for many months, even years with Senator Chris Murphy, the leading Democrat to try to work out. But he said he hoped, and he was optimistic that lawmakers would be able it lean forward, to lean toward the middle to try to find some kind of common ground on these issues.

He also said there may be a place for states to delve into more specific gun legislation that they thought was necessary. Obviously, what is going to work in California and what is going to pass in Texas, two very different outcomes there.

But very significant that you had Cornyn talking about this yesterday in Texas, that lawmakers are going to be having these discussions. And I'm told the goal and hope is that they might be able to have some framework when they return from their recess. Now, that's not very much time, but as you know, time can really be an enemy if you don't come up with some kind of solution in the interim when there is this kind of momentum to find an outcome.

BERMAN: This is on the Senate side where gun legislation the past 10 years has died. On the House side, Lauren, I do understand we just got word that the House Judiciary Committee is going to mark up gun legislation on Thursday. The English translation of that is they're going to move ahead with the actual legislation on Thursday. What exactly happens here?

FOX: Yes, and remember the House is controlled by Democrats. They passed a series of measures, including expanding background checks over the last year that have gone nowhere in the U.S. Senate. But to show that they are serious, to show that they want to make an impact here, there is going to be an emergency hearing on Thursday to mark up this gun legislation, like you said, to advance this legislation. And the package is going to include things like raising the age of when you can buy a weapon like an AR-15 from 18 to 21 nationally.

Now, the expectation is that's not going to go anywhere in the Senate, but it does send a strong message that Democrats are getting very serious about this, that they think it's so important that the chairman of that committee is requesting that members do try to make it back to Washington.

Now, the logistics of this are obviously very difficult because it's a recess week, but significant that you have lawmakers trying to find a way forward, trying to make an impact showing this is so critical, at this moment, that folks need to be back in Washington to work on it. John?

BERMAN: The work might be more important than the recess. Lauren Fox, thank you so much for that reporting.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Now to the investigation in Texas, including disturbing new questions about whether lives may have been saved if police acted sooner. Remember, 78 minutes passed from the time the shooter entered the school and police shot and killed him. So let's break down the timeline.

Based on information provided by 911 calls and the Texas Department of Public Safety, the first 911 call actually comes in at 11:30 a.m.

before the suspect even enters the school. The suspect had crashed a truck into a ditch near the school. Police say he starts shooting at civilians at a nearby funeral home prompting that call.

Still outside, the shooter then fires shots at the school at 11:32 a.m. One minute later, at 11:33, as seen in this video, he enters Robb elementary through a backdoor that a teacher had propped open, according to law enforcement. He begins shooting into one of the classrooms. Police say he fired more than 100 rounds.

Two minutes later, at 11:35 a.m., three police officers enter the school through the same door the shooter had. The shooter fires at them through a closed, locked classroom door, with two of them suffering grazing wounds according to officials. And two minutes later --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COL. STEVEN MCCRAW, DIRECTOR, TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY: There is more gunfire, another 16 rounds was fired, 11:37, one at 11:37 and 16 seconds, 11:38, 11:40, 11:44.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Gunshots, repeated gunshots. At 11:51 a.m., 18 minutes after the shooter entered the school, law enforcement says more officers arrived at this point. By 11:54 a.m., parents start to arrive, urging police to rescue their children. And it leads to scenes like this one -- police ignoring their pleas, telling parents to move back, even restraining some of them.

[08:05:00]

The Department of Public Safety says that at 12:03 p.m., as many as 19 police officers are in the hallway near room 111 and 112 where most of the victims were later found. At 12:03 p.m. a 911 call comes from inside one of those two classrooms. Around this time police begin evacuating students and staff from the rest of the school, as you can see here in these photos, taken by "The Uvalde Leader News." And just a few minutes later, the student calls 911 again.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COL. STEVEN MCCRAW, DIRECTOR, TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY: At 12:10, she called back in room 12, advised multiple dead, 12:13 again on the phone. Again at 12:16, she has called back and said there was eight to nine students alive.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: So at the time of that 12:16 p.m. call, there are up to 19 police officers down the hallway from that child's classroom, including members of the Border Patrol BORTAC unit that had arrived a minute earlier. BORTAC is very similar to a SWAT team, they have the same kind of capabilities, and they're there, on the ground, when the next 911 call comes in at about 12:19 p.m.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COL. STEVEN MCCRAW, DIRECTOR, TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY: At 12:19, a 911 call was made, and another person in room 111 called, and I won't say her name. She hung up when another student told her to hang up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: One question that even law enforcement officials in Uvalde raised last week was whether dispatchers informed police about these desperate calls. But listen to this audio obtained by ABC News.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We have a child on the line advising he is in the room full of victims.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: CNN has not been able to independently confirm the source of that audio or at what point during the timeline it came. But the Texas Department of Public Safety also notes this --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COL. STEVEN MCCRAW, DIRECTOR, TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY: At 12:21, you could hear over the 911 call three shots were fired.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Those shots make it clear the suspect is alive at 12:21 p.m., and firing his weapon, and the officers in the hallway are probably able to hear him. Only at 12:21 p.m. do the officers move down the hallway closer to the classroom. And after that --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COL. STEVEN MCCRAW, DIRECTOR, TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY: A 911 call, it lasted for 21 seconds. The initial caller called back, student, child, called back, was told to stay on the line and be very quiet. She told 911 that he shot the door. At approximately 12:43 and 12:47 she asked 911 to please send the police now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: At 12:50 p.m., a source in the agency says the BORTAC unit finally gets keys from the janitor to open the locked classroom door and kills the suspect. The first officers are inside the school within two minutes. And within a half-hour up to 19 local officers were in the hallway near the classrooms. The first classroom door was only open 75 minutes after officers had first arrived. Police heard sporadic gunfire during all that time, and 911 dispatchers received multiple desperate pleas for help from terrified children saying that there were dead and alive children inside of that room. Those callers included Miah Cerrillo, who spoke to our producer Nora Neus. Miah played dead by wiping her dead friend's blood on herself and then she used her dead teacher's phone to call 911.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NORA NEUS, CNN PRODUCER: She told me that she assumed the police just weren't there yet, but then afterwards she heard the grown-ups say that the police were there, but waiting outside. And that's first time that she really started crying in the interview. She had been pretty stoic up until then, but that's when she started crying, saying she just didn't understand why they didn't come in and get her.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Miah is clearly not alone in wondering why.

BERMAN: It is so important to get that timeline right. And it was important a week ago. It has taken a long time to piece together the facts there, to understand exactly what happened, and it's so crucial, and these families, they need this information for closure.

KEILAR: They do. Nothing is going to bring their children back, but I think they do want to know for sure, and what they can know is that there were gunshots that were heard. I think we know that there were police outside hearing these gunshots. And we're learning certainly it appears that some of these 911 calls were being relayed, but all of these classrooms at the school had children in them. There was no reason to believe that in rooms 111 and 112 there were not kids, and that the gunman was in there alive with a weapon.

[08:10:07]

BERMAN: They need honesty and they need clarity. Thank you so much for letting that out there.

The Uvalde school district police chief at the center of this response will not be sworn in today as a member of the city council as originally planned. He is reportedly the official who made the decision not to go into the classrooms while the shooter was locked inside. CNN's Nick Valencia is live in Uvalde, with the latest on this. Nick, explain what I guess is not happening on that front.

NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, good morning, John. This ceremony, which was expected to happen this morning, or later today, has been postponed. According to the mayor who sent us a statement, he said today he wanted the focus for this community to be on the families who lost their loved ones as they prepare to bury some of the smallest victims. There will also be some viewing services later today.

But Pete Arredondo is a very controversial figure. He's currently the police chief for the Uvalde school district and had been elected to the city council. He was expected to be sworn in today, but that is going to happen at a later date. He has been the focal point for much of the anger and outrage of the families here who are questioning his decision.

As you mentioned, he's reportedly the person who held back law enforcement officials from going inside the Robb elementary school as the gunman was barricaded inside. The mayor added to us in a statement, saying that the role that Arredondo played in this shooting should not impact and is expected to not impact his role and ability to serve on the city council. John?

BERMAN: So Nick, we also have some new audio that sounds like the child saying they were shot. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you injured?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I got shot.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where? Where?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They shot a kid.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: That is just so terrifying. Nick, what do we know about that clip?

VALENCIA: Yes, it is really triggering for so many people to hear that and to see these jarring videos that continue to emerge of what happened during the shooting.

This was obtained by our CNN crew from an individual who did not want to be identified but said this was part of a Facebook livestream. We don't know exactly at what point during the shooting this was captured, but according to that individual who did not want to be identified, you could hear that radio call going on between an adult and a child who says that they have been shot. We don't know exactly why that radio call was on Customs and Border Protection traffic, but according to an individual who recorded this video, he said as soon as the agents realized that he could hear this radio call, they turned it down.

We are working to get more answers about what happened, and this video is one of the examples and more -- provides more details about what happened in those moments that the shooting was unfolding.

BERMAN: Tragic details but important ones. Nick Valencia, we appreciate your reporting, thank you.

VALENCIA: You bet.

PAUL: Happening today, President Biden will meet with Federal Reserve Chairman Jerome Powell to discuss inflation. And ahead of the meeting, the president outlined his plan to tackle the issue in a "Wall Street Journal" op-ed, writing in part, "With the right policies the U.S. can transition from recovery to stable steady growth and bring down inflation without giving up all these historic gains. Things should also look different from the decades before the pandemic when too often we had low growth, low wage gains, and an economy that worked best for the wealthiest Americans."

Here to discuss is Brian Deese. He is the director of the White House National Economic Council. Brian, thank you so much for being with us this morning. When you read this op-ed, it is a pretty ambitious array of policies here. We do have a graphic of all of the things that are laid out in this. And many of them do require help from Congress, as the president says. This obviously isn't the political season for compromise on an economic growth bill. So what can he really achieve?

BRIAN DEESE, DIRECTOR, WHITE HOUSE NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: Well, you're right it's ambitious. And it reflects the fact that the president has made fighting inflation his top economic priority. We can do that from a position of economic strength because of the historic recovery that we have seen, strongest job market rebound in modern history, most small businesses created ever during a recovery, and household balance sheets have improved -- savings is up and debt is down.

So now the question is how do we make progress? The president outlined the steps he can take. The good news is that some of them we can do directly with our executive authority. Releasing oil from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve, building more affordable housing, helping reduce internet bills for millions of Americans, helping to unclog our supply chains and our ports, these are steps we can take on our own. But absolutely we need some help from Congress as well.

And you take something like reducing the cost of prescription drugs, for many Americans that's among their top -- their top bills at the end of the month. And so that's something that we will need Congress's help and we're hopeful we can make progress on, even though this season there is a lot of focus on this issue, and our hope is that for any member of Congress, Republican or Democrat, who puts a fighting inflation as their top priority, they will focus on actual steps to lower costs for Americans, rather than engaging in the political scrum.

[08:15:12]

KEILAR: But at this point in time, why -- why would they do that? I mean, you know where we are ahead of the midterms.

DEESE: Well, look, there is strong support across the Democratic Caucus for doing things like lowering the cost of prescription drugs. A bill already passed the House and is in consideration in the Senate. There is every reason why we can move forward on something like that, reducing the cost of utility bills that Americans are facing by passing a package of energy investments and tax credits.

That's, again, something that has passed the House, is in consideration in the Senate, and reforming the tax code, addressing some of these manifest unfairnesses where, you know, if we have 50 companies that don't pay anything in federal taxes, even though they are recording record profits, there is real support for taking on those types of issues.

And so, we -- you know, we're hopeful that Congress will focus on those types of issues when they come back, and as you know, you've been covering, there is bipartisan support for taking on the issue of semiconductors and supply chains. There is a bill that is in conference right now between the two chambers. They are hard at work on that. And at is the kind of thing that they should focus on.

KEILAR: We also, though, covered the build back better plan, right, and as you move closer to the elections, which we have considerably since then, everything gets harder, you know that, that floundered over and over again. So I mean, what -- what is the reality, why has that changed in your mind to do something that sounds pretty comprehensive what you're talking about?

DEESE: Well, what we're talking about is actual practical steps that would have those two impacts. One, lower costs for families, and, two --

KEILAR: I'm talking about the politics of it because the policy -- look, you're talking about the policy, you're talking about what people think about it, you're talking about what people on the hill think about it. Let's talk about the reality of the politics of getting this through, because the policy doesn't matter if you don't have the votes.

DEESE: Sure, but I think that we have now seen this president made clear that fighting inflation is his top priority, you hear a lot from members of Congress, both Democrats and Republicans, that fighting inflation is their top priority. Now is an opportunity for folks to step up and actually do something practical to do that. I think we have broad support in the Democratic Caucus to do that. We

have passed a bill through one house of Congress. There is an opportunity to do so now. And so I think the politics of this are pretty straightforward. If your focus is on fighting inflation --

KEILAR: The politics --

DEESE: -- if you believe that that's the most important thing, then are you going to support things like lowering the cost of prescription drugs? If you -- if not, then you have to answer for how that squares with your stated position of lowering inflation.

KEILAR: Okay. Well, the politics are straightforward and that you need more than Democratic support. I just want to be really clear about that. And also on the timing of when this might have been, you know, easier to do something like this. Do you acknowledge that the president's $1.9 trillion stimulus in March of 2021 may have been inflationary?

You had people in your camp and others in your camp, Larry Summers for one, among others, saying, yeah, it was, but the White House disagreed. Do you acknowledge now that that contributed to this?

DEESE: What we have seen over the course of the last year plus in the United States is a historically strong economic recovery. And that has been supported by this president's economic policies.

If you step back and you look at the inflation challenge we face, it's clearly global in nature. We're seeing record high inflation in Europe. In the U.K., in France, in Germany, and it is driven principally by supply chain challenges coming from the restart of the economy and now exacerbated by Putin's war in Ukraine.

The real question now is how can we actually address that issue? And to the point you raised before, some of these issues could be passed through using a reconciliation vehicle. Some of them will need to work with Congress to get Republicans and Democrats to support.

But we're at a moment right now, where if inflation is a top priority, which it is for this president, then there's going to be a question and a choice. Are members of Congress going to step up and help support measures that would clearly help on this issue or they're going to stand on the sidelines? That's the case that the president is going to be taking to Congress and to the American people.

KEILAR: Joe Manchin -- just real quickly -- Joe Manchin, Kyrsten Sinema, they've given you assurances that they're good with the reconciliation vehicle?

DEESE: I -- we are not going to have those conversations here, not going to have those conversations in public, and we are partnering with -- with them, with other members of the Democratic Caucus, to try to --

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: You're part -- how are you partnering with them?

DEESE: We are in ongoing conversations that I'm not going to read out and not going to get specific about. But I will just -- suffice it to say that there is a focus on the kinds of things that we could try to get done right now.

[08:20:01]

Something like lowering the cost of prescription drugs has broad support and would clearly help. It will help families right now.

And so, we're trying to focus on those types of areas where there's broad support, it would clearly address the inflation challenge in front of us and we could get something done.

KEILAR: All right. Brian, thank you so much.

Obviously, as you know, with the cost of some things right now, Americans -- I hear what you're saying about the recovery and the job market, but this inflation is killing a lot of people and they want answers about it. So, we appreciate you being on this morning. Thank you.

DEESE: Absolutely.

KEILAR: As senators on both sides of the aisle begin talking about gun safety, we're going to speak with a self-described gun nut and a Parkland father about the areas where they actually agree.

BERMAN: Plus, Russia seeing the harshest punishment yet for its invasion of Ukraine.

And heart stopping video of three young people coming just inches from a speeding train.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: A bipartisan group of senators plans to continue talks today in the wake of the Uvalde elementary school massacre. Texas Senator John Cornyn says that that group will meet over Zoom to, quote, see if we can agree on a basic framework going forward.

Joining me now is the father of Parkland victim Jamie Guttenberg and gun safety advocate, Frank Guttenberg. Also with me is former Republican presidential candidate, former congressman and self- proclaimed gun nut, Joe Walsh.

[08:25:05]

Gentlemen, I really appreciate you being with us and I want to tell our viewers, you guys know each other. It's not like you're meeting for the first time. You've had discussions here.

FRED GUTTENBERG, FATHER OF PARKLAND SHOOTING VICTIM JAIME GUTTENBERG: Yeah.

BERMAN: I also don't want to pretend that there are easy solutions here.

However, a lot of people look at this and, say, hey, if we can just get rational people in a room together, they could figure out some solutions to this. So that's what I want to do here. You guys are in a room together. Figure it out.

Fred, you go first.

GUTTENBERG: Yeah, you know, listen, first things first. It starts with me telling somebody like Joe that I respect his rights as a gun owner, and that like him I support the Second Amendment.

And it starts with both of us agreeing we hate gun violence. The conversation from there is not that hard.

And I just want to say regarding my friend Joe, I give him all the credit in the world. He took the first step towards me last year around Father's Day when I started an initiative and amazingly we just started talking about this. Not yelling at each other. Not going off into sides and we agree on a lot of things.

And I'll let Joe talk to this, but Joe may even go further than me on some things because I just really desire to start somewhere to get things done. But he and I both agree, background checks, let's do it. I can't speak for Joe, but I think he would probably agree, let's raise the age to 21.

I'm certain he would agree with me, we need to do something with extreme risk protection orders, because when you start with the premise, how can we reduce gun violence deaths, how can reduce the instances of gun violence, it's not hard for two dads like Joe and I to talk.

BERMAN: Go ahead, Joe.

JOE WALSH (R), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: John, what's really important here is Fred Guttenberg and Joe Walsh agree on more than we disagree. I've been so impressed with Fred and so many others the past few years, out there working their tail off to try to get something done. John, I don't think anything is going to get done at all until responsible gun owners like me, passionate Second Amendment people like me get off of our ass and pressure these Senate Republicans to do something.

It's got to come from responsible gun owners like me. I'm sure a few years ago Fred called me a crazy gun nut. I probably deserved --

GUTTENBERG: I did.

WALSH: I probably deserved that. I'm a huge gun rights advocate.

But, you know what, John, Fred and I got together, we spent an hour together about six months ago, we disagreed on more than we agreed, but we agreed that focusing on up front, before a gun is bought, is where our focus should be. That should be easy stuff. Most gun owners like me want that. Expand and strengthen background

checks, red flag laws. John, a week ago, I mean, an 18-year-old in Texas, a week or two after his birthday, bought two long AR-15s and a bunch of ammo. If that doesn't make us examine what we're doing, nothing will.

BERMAN: So, John, concrete, raise the age to buy an AR-15 to 21?

WALSH: I'll tell you what. I'm not there yet, but I'm listening. That's something on the table and, Fred, doggone it, is making a lot of sense on that issue with me. John, 18 or 21, someone to have a long gun, any firearm, has to undergo some training. I'm sure -- I'm open to the age.

BERMAN: Fred, what about that?

GUTTENBERG: No, listen, Joe and I actually had this conversation last week. And he doesn't -- he's not there yet. But, you know what, he will be because I'm not done talking to him. The reality is it makes sense.

You know, you look at these shootings, you look at the age group of the majority of people who are conducting these shootings, you look at the fact -- and the only real argument against it is, well, but they can go to the military at 18. Yeah, but, the military is a controlled environment with very specific training and requirements around weapons storage and other things.

So it is different than our streets. Raising the age to 21, in my book, is a must.

WALSH: Hey, John, Republican senators are not going to move until responsible gun owners like me put a boot up their ass. And isolate the NRA. I'm no longer a member of the NRA, haven't been for a few years, because they don't even want people like Fred Guttenberg and me speaking.

[08:30:00]