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Pastor Says Church, Family Homes Destroyed by Hurricane; Bolsonaro Outperforms, Forces Runoff in Tense Brazil Elections; ; U.S. Reportedly Considering Response Options If Russian President Vladimir Putin Decides to Use Nuclear Weapons in War with Ukraine. Aired 8- 8:30a ET

Aired October 03, 2022 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Now is the time for liberal democracy to show its strength and resilience. As we rally around disaster response after the horrific hurricane that hit Florida, it's a reminder that government does not need to be a warfare of interests but rather people working together across party lines for the common good. We can't wisely ignore the challenges we face, but we can resolve to not let the dividers define us as a nation.

And that's your Reality Check.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: John Avlon, thank you so much.

And NEW DAY continues right now.

A rising death toll and questions being raised over evacuation orders. This morning Florida continues to reel from hurricane Ian. I'm Brianna Keilar with Alex Marquardt this morning. Great to have you. John Berman is off this morning. And officials are saying that Ian has killed at least 76 people in Florida after the monster storm barreled through the state. Governor Ron DeSantis says more than 1,600 rescues have been made since the storm made landfall. Communities, look at this, they have been left unrecognizable. And this morning more than 613,000 customers are still without power. Many Floridians still without clean tap water.

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Just shocking pictures. Meanwhile, Florida Governor Ron DeSantis is defending officials in Lee County, that's where more than half of the storm-related deaths have been announced so far. They are now facing criticism for issuing evacuation orders a day later than neighboring counties. Here is what Governor DeSantis told CNN's Nadia Romero.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

NADIA ROMERO, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Is that one of the things you'll be reviewing once we get out of the aftermath, people get their power back on, looking at those evacuation orders, because even Lee County, if they would have followed their own evacuation orders, from what we've reviewed, they should have had that mandatory evacuation order sooner.

GOV. RON DESANTIS, (R) FLORIDA: But the issue, though, is also that they informed people, and most people did not want to do it. That's just the reality. So you're in a situation, are you going to grab somebody out of their home that doesn't want to. I don't think that's the appropriate use of government. I think that takes it a little too far.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MARQUARDT: CNN's Boris Sanchez joins us live from Fort Myers this morning. Boris, what is the latest this morning?

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, Alex and Brianna. This morning we are faced with the news that we were dreading over the weekend. Officials had warned that the death toll was likely to climb as they gained access to areas like Sanibel and Captiva Island and Fort Myers Beach which is just down the road from where I am right now. As you noted, at least 76 people killed in the sunshine state. When officials got to those areas and combed through the debris and found, sadly, bodies.

This morning, we're also hearing harrowing stories from survivors as well as learning more about those lost in the wake of hurricane Ian.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

SANCHEZ: The death toll rising from hurricane Ian as people recall harrowing tragedies and those lost.

KEVIN BEHEN, HOME WAS DESTROYED IN FORT MYERS BEACH: Storm surge came all the way up, and the windows were sucked out. These guys pushed their wives out the windows to where a tree was. And they were looking at them, and guys were holding on, and they just looked at their wives, and they said we can't hold on anymore. We love you. Bye. And that was it.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Did they all make it?

BEHEN: No, no. The two guys didn't make it.

SANCHEZ: "The Miami Herald" speaking to Fort Myers resident John Galatro, saying, quote, "We've seen bodies everywhere," and that his group counted at least 10 people from his building who died trying to get to the roof during the height of the surge. "I personally covered one with a blanket. We made deceased signs so the helicopters could see them."

Also, a devastating tragedy involving one of Fort Myers' most vulnerable residents, Scott Lumley. According to "The Washington Post," Lumley walked with a cane. His legs and right arm were progressively paralyzed by Lou Gehrig's disease. He was sheltering with friends as the floodwaters rose quickly in their single-story home, forcing them to try to break through the ceiling. They tried to lift Lumley up to safety. One friend recounting, quote, "We tried to get him, but we couldn't. I feel awful about it. But I think if we kept trying, we three would have all been washed away."

I spoke with Captain Lewis MacDonald, a boat captain who has operated in the marina since 1986. His boat miraculously sustained limited damage despite being lifted up by the storm surge and tossed hundreds of feet into a mangrove.

LEWIS MACDONALD, BOAT CAPTAIN: Since my dad and I built the boat and I've been doing this since 1995, and then a few years later he died of cancer. So to me it wasn't just a boat or a business.

[08:05:01]

It's part of my family. Sorry. So I'm thankful that God spared it and let it come down like this.

SANCHEZ: Amy Lynn with CNN affiliate WFTX weathered the storm at a friend's parents' house. As hurricane Ian worsened, the wind knocked light fixtures from the ceiling and broke glass. Eventually Lynn had to shelter in a closet with her dogs for six hours. The damage to the home was extensive. This was the garage after the storm. Lynn says two cars were blown through the garage doors. They were eventually rescued by chinook helicopters.

And one Fort Myers resident sheltered aboard this boat during the worst of the storm. He was able to rescue three men who were stranded in a building.

DOUG MCGILL, FORT MYERS RESIDENT: I ripped over beside a two-story building. There were three guys trying to get out of the second story window. It was just about underwater, and they were trapped inside. I got them out the other side, and they were done. Got them on the boat. Being in the right spot at the right time. I lost my boat, I lost everything I had, but I saved three guys. It was worth it.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

SANCHEZ: So many stories like that that we're hearing across southwest Florida. It's really hard to capture the scope of the devastation in a single image or in a single anecdote. But as you can see behind me, this is one of dozens of boats that we have seen that were picked up by the enormous storm surge and cast about, strewn like toys through this landscape. We've spoken to several people at this marina at Fort Myers Beach that essentially say they don't have an opportunity to start over. They've lost everything. A lot of folks rode the storm out here on their boats and came back to their businesses and homes only to find nothing. Alex?

MARQUARDT: Just devastating scenes and stories down there in south Florida. Boris Sanchez in Fort Myers, thank you so much for all your reporting.

KEILAR: And now to some new CNN reporting on Russia's invasion of Ukraine. The U.S. becoming increasingly concerned by Vladimir Putin and his escalating rhetoric. And now CNN has learned the Biden administration is considering how to respond to a range of potential scenarios including the grim possibility of Russia turning to nuclear weapons. CNN's Jim Sciutto here live with the latest. Tell us about this.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: This is a measure of how seriously the U.S. is taking the possibility that Vladimir Putin escalates the war in Ukraine even to the extent of using nuclear weapons. Now, to be clear, they have not detected movements or changes in forces to prepare for a nuclear attack. We should note that. But they're taking the possibility seriously enough that the U.S. has for some time been developing contingency plans in the event Vladimir Putin orders such an attack.

And to be clear here, the range of possibilities they are considering goes from the use of a tactical nuclear weapon -- they have to consider it, and they're doing so seriously -- to other steps short of use of a tactical nuclear weapon. As one source described it to me, a nuclear display, which could be along the lines of a direct military strike on the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant that would disable it and perhaps create nuclear fallout. A big dirty bomb, another source described it to me.

But also, the possibility of a nuclear display in the category of using a tactical nuclear weapon but away from a target, in effect, away from a populated area, perhaps even at altitude as a show of bravado, which is the way another source described it to me.

Again, they haven't seen movements of such forces or weapons to date, but as a measure of how seriously they are taking this possibility, they've been developing contingency plans for some time to deal with it or to respond. I spoke to Representative Mike Quigley, he's a member of the House Intelligence Committee. The way he described it to me, he said that Putin is capable of anything. You have to take him seriously. Another source said to me part of the calculation here is that defeat is not an option for Vladimir Putin. So that's the scenario that they have to prepare for.

MARQUARDT: Jim, do you believe that we are seeing an escalation right now that is that one step short of a nuclear escalation. We have got a mobilization underway. We've got this attack on the Nord Stream pipeline that looks like it could have Russia behind it, Ukraine warning about a potential cyberattack. Are we in a new phase right now?

SCIUTTO: He's definitely escalating. He's mobilized. He's attempting to mobilize some 300,000 forces, though their quality is definitely in question here, whether they're battle ready. He is escalating. The concern here is that he escalates more to a degree with which in the early phases of this war was considered a distant outlier, right, the idea of a nuclear strike. It remains an outlier. It's not considered likely, but serious enough that they have to make preparations for it. And it's a category, right, of escalation. And this is a different category of escalation that they're making contingency plans for.

KEILAR: It's important, a different category of escalation here. Jim, thank you for the reporting. We appreciate it.

[08:10:00] Joining us now is National Security Council Coordinator for Strategic Communications at the White House, John Kirby. John, it's great to have you. Just give sort of, give us the administration's assessment here. Do you think Putin is closer to using tactical nuclear weapons or even this power plant as a nuclear weapon?

JOHN KIRBY, NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL COORDINATOR FOR STRATEGIC COMMUNICATIONS: What I can tell you, Brianna, is that we're watching this as closely as we can, and we've seen nothing that would make us change our strategic deterrent posture. So I think we take these threats seriously, as we must, and we have since the beginning of this war, because it was very early on that Vladimir Putin was using bellicose nuclear rhetoric. So we have been taking it seriously for quite some time. Again, nothing that would cause us to change our strategic deterrent posture at this time.

KEILAR: You haven't detected any preparations for any kind of nuclear attack?

KIRBY: We haven't seen any indications that Mr. Putin has made that kind of a decision.

KEILAR: Some of these tactical nuclear missiles, they might be on the smaller side. Could movement of them or preparation of them evade detection?

KIRBY: We monitor as best we can, Brianna, the strategic forces that Mr. Putin has available to him, that is to say his nuclear forces. And we watch it as best we can. I think that's about as far as I can go.

KEILAR: Has the U.S. formulated a response?

KIRBY: We have been taking this seriously, as I said, from the very beginning of this reinvasion back in February of this year. We obviously take that rhetoric seriously. It's irresponsible rhetoric coming from a modern nuclear power. So of course, we have been thinking through how we can make sure we can preserve our national security interest and those of our allies in NATO.

KEILAR: We also, I want to ask you about this, we have some new reporting this morning that Ukraine is offering the U.S. oversight, essentially veto power, of targets if the U.S. gives Ukraine the longer-range weapons that they're asking for. Would that assuage U.S. concerns about giving Ukraine the weapons they want at extended range?

KIRBY: I would just say that we are in constant communication with our Ukrainian counterparts. The secretary of defense just spoke with the Ukrainian minister of defense just a day-and-a-half ago. This is an ongoing conversation, Brianna, and they're constantly trying to assess their needs on the battlefield, both present and future, and making sure we can adapt to those needs going forward. And we've been doing that, again, over the course of seven months.

KEILAR: Would the U.S. accept veto power, this oversight?

KIRBY: I'd rather not get into a hypothetical situation here or speculate about what it's going to look like going forward. You can see we've done already more now than 20 presidential drawdowns of capabilities for the Ukrainians, and each one evolves with this situation on the battlefield. I think you're going to see that continue going forward. They have been using the systems and capabilities we have been providing quite effectively. You can see that in the Donbas region, progress they made over just the course of the last 24 hours in that town of Lyman, and even down in the south where they continue to make some good, steady, incremental progress. That's all a testament to this relationship we have with the Ukrainian armed forces and the kinds of capabilities that we're going to continue to provide.

KEILAR: I don't know if it is hypothetical at this point because it is something that Ukraine does want to offer, right, so it is something that is out there at this point. But nonetheless, I want to ask you, would the U.S. support Ukrainian military action in the four regions that were illegally annexed by Russia now that Russia is saying an attack there is an attack on Russia?

KIRBY: It's not an attack on Russia. It is Ukrainian soil. It was Ukrainian soil. It is today, and it will be tomorrow. And we're not in the business of telling President Zelenskyy how he goes about conducting military operations. What we are doing is making sure he has the capabilities and the systems that he needs to do that effectively, and he is.

KEILAR: John, we appreciate your time this morning. It's such a critical juncture in the war in Ukraine. Thank you very much.

KIRBY: Yes, ma'am.

KEILAR: So next, we'll hear from a pastor in Fort Myers Beach whose church is barely standing.

And new, never-before-heard interviews with former President Trump, we're going to bring you the new clips with Maggie Haberman ahead.

MARQUARDT: And Kim Kardashian charged by the Securities and Exchange Commission for her role in promoting a crypto asset. We'll have those details ahead. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:18:26]

MARQUARDT: A church totaled, like so much in Fort Myers Beach, Florida.

Inside the Beach Baptist Church, you can see there a scene of wreckage. As the Pastor's daughter put it, "The structure of the building is there, but there are no walls. There is nothing inside. It is just a shell."

That devastation also hitting home for the family that leads this church. Pastor Shawn Critser shot video outside of his bedroom window showing his father's house destroyed after it was hit by a wave and washed off of its pillars. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PASTOR SHAWN CRITSER, WORSHIP LEADER, BEACH BAPTIST CHURCH: In case anybody has trouble identifying stuff, that's Mimi and Papa's house that used to be over there is now there, right outside our window.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MARQUARDT: Just extraordinary.

Joining me now are pastor Shawn Critser and his wife, Sherri Critser who is a worship leader at the church. Thank you both so much for joining me this morning. I really appreciate your time. And of course in these very, very difficult circumstances.

I want to ask you both first, how are you holding up? How is your family holding up?

SHAWN CRITSER: Doing well. We finally got off the island yesterday. So, we're starting to get back there. Actually, just now, it is kind of starting to sink in, you know, when you get back to life.

We kind of lived on the island there for a few days with no power, nothing like that. So, we are right in the middle of the destruction, you know, your mind never really gets off of it until you get away from it.

[08:20:01]

MARQUARDT: Sherri, can you tell us what happened to the church and what you're going to do? Are you going to try to rebuild? Are you going to move the church? What will you do?

SHERRI CRITSER, WORSHIP LEADER, BEACH BAPTIST CHURCH: Well, right now, there's just nothing there and it is going to take a very, very, very long time to get anything, even power, water, anything.

So, right now we are located close to our kids, and just going to go back when they can let us back on the island, take a look and see what happens.

MARQUARDT: Shawn, what are you hearing?

SHAWN CRITSER: We will always have some sort of presence there. Just as far as you know, they're saying 10 to 14 days before we can get back on the island, you know, to really even get an assessment before you can even do anything, mean, we know that pretty much the whole campus is a total loss.

You know, our house, upper floor did survive, but that's it. There are five buildings on our campus. You saw my dad's house was one of those. My mother-in-law's apartment was under our house, all of that is gone.

Our food pantry, which, you know, was the one of the main reasons we existed on that island was, you know, to feed people, it washed away. So, it's not even there anymore. Another retreat building that we had for others folks to come and stay and be just be able to respite and take care of themselves or help out on the island, that's gone.

So you know, we weren't really just a church that met on Sundays. We were full-time, six days a week trying to serve that community. We are usually the people bringing relief, that trailer that's sitting behind us is what we use to feed almost a thousand mouths a month or a week, I'm sorry, a thousand mouths a week, and you know, it was sitting underwater. We didn't have -- we don't have any way to do that and there is nobody to actually do that for us.

So, that's kind of where we are.

MARQUARDT: Sherri, your husband mentioned the community, where is that community now? Did they spread out all over the place? Have you been able to stay in touch? And how are they doing?

SHERRI CRITSER: Everybody is really, really sad because we are a very, very close community and circle of people, tiny, tiny little island. And we know -- everybody knew each other and everybody is just dispersed and gone their separate ways. And it's very sad because knowing that most won't come back, they have to go find jobs somewhere, they have to go find a place to live somewhere. And by the time the island is ready for habitants, everybody is going to be -- found a new life somewhere else. So our -- that's what sad is our journey on FMB is probably over.

MARQUARDT: There may be a lot of reluctance by some to come home.

Shawn, I want to ask you about much of the discussion today is why there was a delay in the evacuation orders in Lee County. What are your thoughts on that? Do you think the evacuation order came soon enough?

SHAWN CRITSER: You know, we actually said that that day, you know, a lot of people are used to longer evacuation orders, but we got it the day before and even in the evacuation order, up until the night before the storm, you know, it was still Tampa, you know, that is as far as the cone had sort of dropped.

And people around us, you know, we've been through hurricanes, we've been through a lot of storms and when it is going to hit that far north, you know, you're just going to have to batten down and buckle up.

And then when that evacuation order came, more like 24 hours. That's not a lot. But you know, we'll still kind of make it and it wasn't until Wednesday morning when we woke up and saw that it had had made another adjustment.

And at that point, it's just too late. We just hadn't done -- we hadn't done enough at our place. I mean, we were actually -- it was already starting to rain and storm by that point. So we made as quick preparations as we could and then just said, you know, the house we built was in 2008 is supposed to sustain it. It's supposed to be able to, you know, make it based on all of the, you know, the permitting and regulations and we thought okay, we'll be all right.

But the way it socked us was nothing anyone had ever anticipated, I don't believe.

MARQUARDT: Five-hundred-year storm is what we heard from the Governor. I cannot imagine what you and your community have gone through over the past few days. I'm happy of course, that you're near your children, and great to hear that you plan to go back and certainly wishing you all the best of luck, to you, to your family and to your church as you start the rebuilding process. You will certainly be in our thoughts, Pastor Shawn Critser and Sherri Critser. Thank you so much for your time this morning.

SHAWN CRITSER: Thanks, Alex.

MARQUARDT: Now, just in, new tapes of Maggie Haberman's interviews with Donald Trump including his remarks on classified documents and January 6th. Maggie will be joining us live.

And protesters and police clashing at a university in Tehran and a woman detained for not wearing a headscarf in a restaurant. We will be discussing the third week of unrest in Iran, that's coming up. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:29:14]

MARQUARDT: Brazil's polarizing presidential race is now heading to a second round. With more than 90 percent of the ballots counted, the results show left-wing candidate and the former President Lula da Silva with a slight lead over the incumbent right-wing President Jair Bolsonaro, neither reached the 50 percent threshold to claim victory that is why it is heading to a runoff later this month.

Now, Bolsonaro actually surpassed expectations. Poll had him trailing Lula by double digits. The two candidates will face each other at the end of October.

Joining us now is chief international anchor, Christiane Amanpour.

Cristiane, so great to have you with us this morning. This has been a really remarkable race for many different reasons, two very different candidates. What has stood out most to you?

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Well, that it is really about the personalities. Lula, if you remember was President for two terms and as the world knows, the figures show that he raised 20 million Brazilians out of extreme poverty.

[08:30:12]