Return to Transcripts main page

New Day

House January 6th Committee Releases New Video of Representative Nancy Pelosi and Senator Chuck Schumer on January 6th, 2021; Rep. Pete Aguilar (D-CA) Interviewed on House January 6th Committee Subpoena of Former President Trump for Testimony; 5 Killed, Including Officer, As Teen Gunman Stalks Neighborhood. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired October 14, 2022 - 08:00   ET



NANCY PELOSI, (D-CA) HOUSE SPEAKER: I worry about you being in that Capitol dome. Don't let anybody know where you are.

SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER, (D-NY) SENATE MAJORITY LEADER: I'd like to know a good goddamn reason why it has been denied.

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Then Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer shouting at Army Secretary Ryan McCarthy after hearing a rumor Trump blocked the National Guard going to the Capitol.

SCHUMER: Please move. If the whole Capitol is rampaged, there is a picture of someone sitting in this chair in the Senate. We've all been evacuated. There have been shots fired. We need a full National Guard component now. She said it was not denied. I'm going to call up the f- ing secretary of the DOD.

HOLMES: A group of lawmakers, including Republican leaders, Representative Kevin McCarthy and Senator Mitch McConnell, calling acting Defense Secretary Christopher Miller urging a faster response.

SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL, (R-KY) SENATE MINORITY LEADER: -- by getting there in one hell of a hurry, you understand?


HOLMES: And Pelosi and Schumer also confronting acting Attorney General Jeffrey Rosen in a heated phone call.

SCHUMER: No, no, no, please answer my question. Answer my question.

JEFFREY ROSEN, ACTING ATTORNEY GENERAL: Senator, we're going to do everything I can do.

SCHUMER: Does that include asking the president to get these people who are followers of his to leave the Capitol?

HOLMES: Finally, word coming from Pence that it was safe to return. MIKE PENCE, (R) FORMER U.S. VICE PRESIDENT: I'm literally standing

with the U.S. Capitol police, and he just informed me they've best information is that they believe that the House and the Senate will be able to reconvene in roughly an hour.

SCHUMER: Good news.

HOLMES: Which they did just after 8:00 p.m.

PENCE: Let's get back to work.

HOLMES: The footage also showing Pelosi before the attack.

PELOSI: And let us hope that they will see the light and have their own epiphany on the other side.

HOLMES: Participating in a video call with House Democrats from her conference room, the same room that was ransacked hours later by rioters.

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: We're going to walk down to the Capitol --

PELOSI: If he comes here, we're going to the White House.


HOLMES: Pelosi later seen reacting to Trump's speech.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You could see them marching up.

HOLMES: And the rioters making their way toward the capitol.

TERRI MCCULLOUGH: Secret Service said they have to dissuaded him from coming to Capitol Hill. They told him they don't have the resources to protect him here. So at moment he is not coming, but that could change.

PELOSI: If he comes here, I'm going to punch him out. We've been waiting for this, for trespassing on the Capitol grounds. I'm going to punch him out and I'm going to jail, and I'm going to be happy.


HOLMES: I'm going to punch him out and I'm going to go to jail and I'm going to be happy. That is the Speaker of House talking about the president at the time. Pretty remarkable there. And the other moment I want to point out is that when she is talking to Vice President Pence, the compassion she shows during that moment when he is in such danger. At the same time, we now know as that was happening, Trump knew that he was in danger and instead was tweeting that Mike Pence didn't have the courage to do what should be done. A very stark juxtaposition here, especially considering that Pelosi and Trump had such a contentious relationship anyway.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: That's a very interest point. Kristen, thank you for that great report.


Joining us now is Democratic Congressman Pete Aguilar of California. He's a member of the January 6th select committee and a vice chair of the House Democratic Caucus. Congressman, thank you so much for joining us this morning. The climax, if you will, of the hearing yesterday with the committee voting unanimously to subpoena Donald Trump for testimony and for records, why did this come at this last investigative hearing and not prior to this?

REP. PETE AGUILAR, (D-CA) JANUARY 6TH SELECT COMMITTEE: Well, this is where our investigation has led us. Over a year that we had been working on this issue, 1,000 interviews, the public hearings that you saw earlier in June and July, we have been gathering evidence and being methodical. These are -- this is a professional staff that helping us. And we have asked thousands of questions to individuals. And time and time again we have come under the realization that all roads have led to Donald Trump. And so it's important as part of the next phase of the investigation that he be asked to come and testify under oath.

MARQUARDT: But Congressman, you signaled very early on that all roads would led to Donald Trump, that he was very much the center of the violence that we saw on January 6th. This is very late in the game, isn't it?

AGUILAR: I voted, as a lot of my colleagues did, to impeach the former president based on the information that we had in January of 2021. But we were very clear when we were all appointed, nine of us, Democrats and Republicans to this committee, that we would have a thoughtful exercise and we would follow the information.


Obviously, we have learned many, many things in that time. But each and every aspect and phase of this investigation we have done in a professional way. And I think that has come off within the hearings. So, I think it is timely. I think it's relevant. And I think that just like other investigations, as we have come down to the end, there are remaining questions, and we feel that it is important for the former president to come and give testimony under oath.

MARQUARDT: I interviewed your committee colleague Zoe Lofgren a couple weeks ago, and she said there was no expectation that the former president would appear before the committee. Has that expectation changed? And if he does not comply with the subpoena, do you believe the committee will vote to hold Trump in context of Congress?

AGUILAR: An overwhelming number of people who have received subpoenas, well, many individuals came before us voluntarily. But countless other who received subpoenas have come before the committee. It really is just a few of the former president's closest advisers who decided to snub the committee. And I'll keep in mind that I think it is in a week or so that Steve Bannon will be sentenced for obstructing Congress by not testifying.

And so there are consequences. But what I would say is, we're just focused on chasing the facts, and there are key questions that remain. We want to make sure that we are true to the investigation and that we chase down every possible question that we have.

MARQUARDT: But if you've been working your way up to the chain to the former president, why not also subpoena the former vice president, Mike Pence?

AGUILAR: Well, we think these are apples and oranges. As you saw in that video, the new video that was released yesterday, the vice president, as I laid out in the hearing that I chaired in June, was acting presidential. I don't agree with the positions that the former vice president took on many issues. I don't -- I think he enabled the former president time and time again. But I will say, just as that video showed, congressional leaders and the vice president were acting like leaders. They were acting presidential.

And it's unfortunate that while they were doing that, the president was at the White House watching TV and letting all of us down at the Capitol on the Capitol police officers, letting us fend for ourselves, and that is unfortunate. But we view the vice president as more of a fact witness than someone worthy of this step.

MARQUARDT: Congressman, we only have a few moments left, but I want to ask you about former White House deputy chief of staff Tony Ornato and the then Secret Service lead agent Robert Engel. They were some who seemed to downplay or deny some of these stories. Do you think that they lied?

AGUILAR: I think that they were less than truthful. And I think that they should come in and talk to the economy again. We said in the hearing yesterday that we would recall a number of witnesses. I think I'll leave it at that, but --

MARQUARDT: Will they be among them that you're recalling?

AGUILAR: Those two individuals either have the foggiest of memories or they were less than truthful. But time and time again the witnesses and the evidence contradict their foggy memories. So I think they should be given an opportunity to come back and talk to us.

MARQUARDT: And before I let you go, do you have an expectation there will be another hearing? And when do you think this report will finally come out?

AGUILAR: Well, the report will come out before the end of the year. I'm not going to get into specifics. And this is the last of the planned hearings I think for a little bit, for a few weeks. However, some things could change, as the committee always maintains the ability to have hearings and call witnesses based on information in front of us. Clearly, with this step of subpoena to the former president, we are open to activity in the near feature.

MARQUARDT: Congressman Pete Gguilar, we have to leave it there. Thank you so much for your time this morning. Really appreciate it.

AGUILAR: Thank you.

KEILAR: The committee also revealed a key piece of testimony from Trump's former acting chief of staff Mick Mulvaney. He corroborated Congresswoman Jaime Herrera Beutler's previous account of a now infamous call on January 6, 2021, between Kevin McCarthy and Trump. This is how she described it.


REP. JAIME HERRERA BEUTLER, (R) WASHINGTON: You know what the president said to him? This is as it is happening. He said, well, Kevin, these aren't my people. These are Antifa.


And Kevin responded that, no, they're your people. They literally just came through my office windows, and my staff are running for cover. They're running for their lives. You need to call them official

And the president's response to Kevin to me was chilling. He said, well, Kevin, I guess they're more upset about the election, in fact, than you are.


KEILAR: And this is how Mulvaney described it to the committee.


MICK MULVANEY, FORMER ACTING CHIEF OF STAFF, TRUMP ADMINISTRATION: I had a conversation at some point in the day or week after the riot with Kevin McCarthy. It was very similar to what Jaime had, the conversation she had retold about how he called and asked the president to get them to stop and the president told him something along the lines of, Kevin, maybe these people are just more angry about this than you are, more upset. I had a conversation similar to that with Kevin in the day to week after the Capitol riot.


KEILAR: Former acting chief of staff for the Trump administration Mick Mulvaney is with us now. Mick, thank you so much for making time for us this morning. Did you think it was important for people to hear that corroboration of this phone call that has been very controversial and the subject of much debate?

MICK MULVANEY, FORMER ACTING CHIEF OF STAFF, TRUMP ADMINISTRATION: Well, I thought it was -- by the way, thanks for having me, Brianna. I thought it was important to answer the questions truthfully. The committee called me several months ago and asked me if I would testify. I told them I would be happy to. I have nothing to hide. And as we walked through that particular day on January 6th, and the days afterwards, also talked a lot about the election itself, they asked a bunch of questions, and I answered them truthfully. They asked me if I had talked to anybody about that day, if I talked to McCarthy, and I gave them a truthful answer. So it doesn't bother me. I don't think it is news that I'm corroborating what Jaime Herrera Beutler had said any way. In fact I think one of my criticisms of the hearing yesterday was there wasn't anything new in terms of what Trump did or didn't do. But I have no difficult with giving that testimony.

KEILAR: You felt like there was nothing new in terms of what Trump did or didn't do? Did you feel like there was new information that we learned from the hearing yesterday?

MULVANEY: Yes, you did a really nice piece on the Nancy Pelosi video, which is very compelling. It is, and it's informative. I'm not sure what it does to shed light on what Donald Trump did or didn't do that particular day. Again, it makes for really good television. But if the point of the matter is either Donald Trump broke the law or didn't, Donald Trump cooperated with rightwing extremist groups to storm the Capitol, I'm not sure what seeing half-an-hour's worth of video of Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer adds to that analysis.

It makes, again, for very compelling television. It's really good politics. But as someone who has followed these hearings very closely, and you and I have talked about these hearings several time, and has been watching what the president did and didn't do, what was going on behind the scenes at White House, behind the scenes in the Trump campaign, I didn't learn anything new yesterday. I saw some new material, but there were really no new allegations, no new facts, no new evidence as to what the former president did or didn't do, and that was a little disappointing.

KEILAR: The video also showed Mitch McConnell, we saw him speaking to the defense secretary. We saw John Thune there gathered along with congressional leaders. We saw Chuck Grassley, these are Republicans, right. So it wasn't just Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer, although certainly we saw much more video of them. Was it important to see these congressional leaders filling a role that seemed pretty obvious to them that President Trump was not filling?

MULVANEY: I don't know, if you're accusing somebody of breaking the law, which I guess is what they're doing, I assume that is what they're doing, that's what this is all about, does showing someone else not breaking the law really establish the first person's guilt or innocence? I don't think that it does.

I could not help but get the feeling, Brianna, as I watched this yesterday that there was a reason we were seeing it now. But I hate to be cynical, but I've been in Washington, D.C. for 10 or 12 years so I think I've earned that cynicism. It struck me that we were having this yesterday on television because the midterms, and it was designed to make Pelosi look good and the Democrats look good. In fact, if you watch other networks this morning, you're going to hear praise of Pelosi and how well she runs government.

Again, I wanted to see more about Donald Trump. I watched these as an interested sort of third person. I was sort of involved with the campaign. I wasn't involved with January 6th, but I'm a Trump insider. So I'm watching this very, very closely. And I kept scratching my head yesterday, going, when are they going to show me new material about what Trump did or didn't do. And I don't think they did very much of that at all. Much of the video we saw from the insiders we had seen in previous hearings. I think there was one clip from Steve Bannon that I've not seen before.

So again, I don't want to be cynical, but I walked away from that hearing yesterday thinking that was even more political than some of the other stuff we've seen up to this point.


KEILAR: There is no disputing, we are close here to a midterm election. Trump has been subpoenaed now. Do you think that he should testify? It sounds like there is -- at least there is some discussion on his part about testifying if he could testify live.

Do you -- how do you think that would serve him? How do you think that would serve the committee? How do you think that would serve the American public?

MULVANEY: I don't think there is in chance that he's actually going to do that. Is he thinking about it? Sure. That is his nature. Does he want to he tell his side of the story. He does.

There's no way that he's actually going to testify. This is not -- keep in mind, this is legislative process. This is Congress. This is the not the Justice Department.

I think you played a clip or quoted a member of the committee saying that the president needs to answer for his action. That's true. We all do. We're all responsible for our actions. But Congress is not responsible for holding us to that. Congress is responsible for passing the laws that sort of set the expectations how all citizens are supposed to behave.

It is the executive branch and the Department of Justice and the phish that enforces that law. It is not Congress's job to hold Trump accountable. It is the executive branch's job to do that. And I think that's where the lines have been blurred and one of the reasons you'll never see Trump testify, this is not a criminal investigation. A lot of this evidence with not be allowed in a criminal investigation because it is hearsay or double hearsay.

So, I think that's important for people to realize. This is a political process from the beginning. We have learned a great deal.

There's no question about it, if you walked into these hearings thinking that Donald Trump won the 2020 election, there is no way you could watch these hearings and still maintain that belief. That is just not reasonable. You can't think that the riots of that day were a peaceful protest.

We've learned some things from the hearing. But that doesn't change the fact that they are political and I doubt very seriously that Donald Trump is going to participate in that process. BERMAN: Can I go back, Mick, just before I let you to go something

you said about how we didn't learn something new. Didn't we learn something new about what the Secret Service knew, warnings that they gave to the FBI? Didn't we learn something new about Brad Parscale saying that Donald Trump had decided back in July of 2020, well before the election, that if he lost that he was going to say that he had won. Here we have a list of some new information. Some of which has particularly to do with Donald Trump and that is one of those things.

MULVANEY: I think the point especially, I don't think the par scale thing was particularly revealing. I thought --

KEILAR: It was new. I mean, Mick, it was -- it was new. We haven't heard that before.

MULVANEY: No, you haven't heard from Parscale. But I think if you make the point that the president had intended to do this before the election, I think there have been some commentary about that before, and maybe I'm wrong.

But your point is well made about the Secret Service. That is fair. That is a good point in that we have access now to the texts of the Secret Service, which we have not seen before.

Again, is it interesting? Yes. And I suppose if you could draw a line from Donald Trump to the Secret Service, to say, guys, I want you to downplay this, then it is the wrongdoing of Donald Trump. If it is just the Secret Service, not doing their job properly, which I tend to want to defend those men and women because I know many of them and they're really good folks.

But if they didn't do their job properly, that is a value and something that many could look into and say we need to fix that. But I don't think it goes to the heart of matter whether Donald Trump committed crimes on that particular day.

KEILAR: Yeah, also important to look at systemic issues here as well. Mick, it's great to have you. Thank you so much for being with us.

MULVANEY: Thanks, Brianna.

KEILAR: So just in: we're getting word that North Korea has fired artillery rounds near the border with South Korea.

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN ANCHOR: And what we're learning this morning about the American veteran who died while fight ago long side Ukrainian forces. His sister will join us live.

Plus, five people, including an off duty police officer shot and killed in a North Carolina neighborhood. We'll be live in Raleigh, next.


MAYOR MARYN-ANN BALDWIN (D), RALEIGH, NORTH CAROLINA: You pray that something this will never happen here. It did. (END VIDEO CLIP)




GOV. ROY COOPER (D), NORTH CAROLINA: Tonight, terror has reached our doorstep. The nightmare of every community has come to Raleigh. This is a senseless, horrific and infuriating act of violence.


MARQUARDT: Another mass shooting in America this morning, this time in Raleigh, North Carolina. We're told that five people have lost their lives including an off-duty police officer at the hands of a teenage suspect who is now in custody.

CNN's Ryan Young is live in Raleigh, North Carolina.

Ryan, a tragic night there. What more are you learning?

RYAN YOUNG, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. When you think about this, the real pain that's in this city, you can look behind me, you could see the crowd of people that are gathered because in about eight minutes there will be a news conference because the details are still so very murky. The public is hoping the police chief and the mayor could add more details.

We know that near a walking trail yesterday around 5:00 some shooting started happening. Five people were dead including that off-duty police officer. And in the end it took about two hours for them to surround the suspect and take him into custody. Right now what we know is that he's a juvenile suspect and everyone is wondering why this person opened fire in this beautiful city. And people are trying to figure out what the motive was.

All that has not been answered just yet. But what do know there is a city in pain asking about what led up to the shooting and how did someone start running through the neighbor in camouflage and they were wondering where this person was running from block to block before being captured by police.

KEILAR: The mayor did not mince words when she spoke about this shooting, Ryan.

YOUNG: Yeah, we've done so many of these and you see public officials are who exasperated by the pain surrounding shooting is why and nothing or any kind of warning has been presented. Listen to what the mayor had to say last night.


BALDWIN: We have to end this mindless gun violence that is happening in our country. We have work to do but there are too many victims and so, we have to wake up.



YOUNG: This is a particularly nice neighborhood. A lot of walking trails, over 30 miles of walking trailing. Around 5:00, families enjoying their evening when the shooting started to happen and then you think about also how particularly violent this week has been for police officers all across this country and then you have another shooting of an off-duty police officer and another officer who is still in the hospital right now. So many questions.

Hopefully in the next five or six minutes, when we have the news conference we'll learn more about the motive and how police were able to surround this young person who we still haven't had any details about to figure out exactly what happened here in Raleigh that shattered so many lives just last night.

MARQUARDT: One thing we can all agree on is that this gun violence is really mindless.

Ryan Young in Raleigh, North Carolina, thanks so much.

And he wrote a will and bought a one way ticket to Poland. The sister of an American veteran who died while fighting alongside Ukrainian forces will join us next.

KEILAR: And what did the secret service know about the potential for violence on January 6. A former member of Oath Keepers joins us ahead.


REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D-CA0: Groups like the Oath Keepers were standing by at the ready should POTUS request assistance by invoking the Insurrection Act, agents were informed.