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New Day Saturday

Latest Air Strikes Against ISIS Examined; Update on Bobbi Kristina Brown's Condition; Whitney Houston's Daughter Still in Coma; Obama National Security Strategy Revealed; Homeland Security Bill Stalls in Senate; Hernandez Trial Jury Went on Field Trip

Aired February 07, 2015 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: New this morning, coalition air strikes hit ISIS hard targeting weapons depots, training centers, tanks as well. Activists are claiming that at least 47 terrorists were killed in a single strike.

CHRISTI PAUL, CNN ANCHOR: And the family of the remaining U.S. hostage being held by ISIS is begging for word of their daughter, even reaching out to ISIS themselves.

BLACKWELL: Also, new questions surrounding what really happened to Bobbi Kristina Brown. Sources close to the family say she has injuries that need to be explained. And now the focus is on her boyfriend, Nick Gordon.

PAUL: Good morning (inaudible) I'm Christi Paul.

BLACKWELL: I'm Victor Blackwell, and we're starting this morning with Breaking News. Coalition forces unleashing at least a dozen air strikes against ISIS in Iraqi city of Mosul.

PAUL: This is according to a CNN crew that is on the ground there for weeks now. ISIS fighters have maintained their defenses in Mosul. And the intensity and the frequency of strikes on the city now has ramped up following, you know, that horrific burning death of the Jordanian pilot. This is according to Kurdish forces.

BLACKWELL: We're also learning that ISIS has blown up a strategic bridge in the city of Kirkuk. And militants had recently used the bridge to launch an attack.

Also breaking this morning, 36 people have been killed and nearly 100 wounded after two suicide bombers targeted a busy market and restaurant in the Iraqi capital of Baghdad.

PAUL: Want to get right to CNNs Phil Black. He's near Mosul, where those strikes are taking place. And we want to point out Phil's one of the few Western journalist in the immediate area. So Phil, help us understand what's going on there. What are you hearing? What are you seeing this hour?

PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Christi, from this position where I am standing, on top of Mt. (inaudible). We believe we are approximately 10 miles from the southern outskirts of Mosul is. It's over my right shoulder. It's a pretty hazy day, but what you can see is a pretty commanding view from this location.

We're up high and we can see right through that this ISIS-controlled territory from the southern approach to this city. And what we have heard overhead today has been a very constant air presence. And regularly, over the period of around one hour or so, a series of explosions in the distance, pretty close together, loud. As I say, we believe that we counted at least a dozen or so.

Over the last hour or so it's been a little more quiet, but it does appear to be a -- what we believe we have heard, is a very constant air bombardment. And as I say, the presence of fast moving aircraft in the sky has been constant through much of the afternoon that we have been here.

The Peshmerga fighters that we have been talking to at this location, and is worth pointing out, that this particular site is one of the closest locations they occupy to Mosul, to that ISIS-controlled city. They say or they have observed, an uptick in the frequency of air strikes around Mosul over the last few days.

They say specifically, seems ISIS revealed, in that horrific fashion that they had murdered the Jordanian pilot, Muath al-Kasaesbeh. No way to know if there is a direct link of cause. No reason to necessarily believe so. But that is the observation of these fighters that are here at one of these front line positions.

They have really set up a defensive line from around the south-east of the city across the south, cutting off the ability of ISIS to advance further into their territory, Iraqi Kurdistan, which is ruled in a fairly self autonomous way. It's why they have their own fighting force. And together, they have been a very effective ground force, with the help of air power from above and really stopping ISIS from advancing any further.

Not just stopping that advance, but in many cases, rolling back the territory that ISIS had gained so rapidly when they first moved into Northern Iraq last year.

So from here, from this point, the strategy for these Kurdish fighters, as part of the international coalition, is to cut off Mosul, to circle it effectively, and choke it off from any sort of resupply across the border to the west in Syria. That is all taking place ahead of what is expected to be a major offensive to retake Mosul.

The timeframe for that offensive is still unclear. When you talk to Kurdish fighters, when you hear from the Iraqi government in Baghdad, there are various timeframes. But it is very much tied into efforts to rebuild, re-equip, and retrain the Iraqi army, which would lead and do most of the heavy lifting. It is expected on the ground in any sort of street to street fighting aiming to liberate that city. Victor, Christi.

BLACKWELL: Phil, I wonder if your photographer can show us a little more of the landscape there. And the question is, a CENTCOM official tells you -- tells CNN that CENTCOM believes that ISIS, their resources have stretched so thin that they're having difficulty taking new territory or holding on to what they have.

How thin -- Is there any indication of how thin their resources are in Mosul?

BLACK: It's difficult to tell from the outside of Mosul, but what is clear along the frontlines and just awhile I talk to you, we'll see if a camera of ready Chris Jackson is able to zoom in a little behind as he runs through their. It is a hazy day, bear that in mind, so the view is not as highly clear.

It is difficult to see into the distance and that view does change over the course of time. But we'll see what we can do but zooming in pass the Peshmerga fighters here, pass the defensive positions. That is the southern approach to Mosul which I hope you can see there.

Now, in terms of the ISIS's ability particularly militarily in this region, there is no doubt that they are having a much harder time on the ground. They -- you will remember, took a lot of territory very quickly including the city of Mosul then they struck out further south.

And since then really, it is the Peshmerga fighters who are able to mobilize, who were able to draw defensive lines and with the assistance of the international coalition and their air power, they have slowed that advance considerably.

Really, they have, it would appear, diminished significantly the ISIS's ability to try and claim new ground as they were doing initially. So they have not only stopped the advance, they have rolled back the ISIS' advance in many areas.

ISIS is still lashing out. It is still trying to attack on multiple fronts but it is clearly not doing so with the same effectiveness that it did when it took this region by surprise last year.

BLACKWELL: All right. Phil Black, thank you for that report and we thank your photojournalist with you Chris Jackson for giving us a look around the landscape there.

PAUL: Yeah, both of you take good care there.

Meanwhile, warplanes are also in the air over northern Syria and coalition aircraft are pounding more ISIS targets around the militant strongholds specifically of Raqqa.

CNN's Becky Anderson is in Amman, Jordan. Becky, we've seen Jordan, you know, displaying the show of force, this resolve that doesn't seem to be broken. That's what it looks from our vantage point. You're there. Do you get that same sense?

BECKY ANDERSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, absolutely. If ISIS thought they could break the resolve of this coalition then they have woefully miscalculated.

Just in the last hour, we've had it confirmed this morning a new series of air strikes targeting positions around Raqqa. Now, that is the self-declared, as you will, capital of this caliphate that they talk about clearly indicating that the elite force -- special (ph) force that King Abdullah has promised this nation and the world is loaded with an unequivocal message.

This is very much the beginning of what he vows will be the end of this militant group. And the resolve of the coalition also manifested in the news in that past hour from Iraq as Phil was pointing at least a dozen air strikes targeting against the ISIS stronghold of Mosul there.

And what we have heard from officials just so far as who's in the air and who's striking what, is that while it appears to be that the Jordanians are in the air over Syria specifically for the targeting of Raqqa alongside cover from the U.S, that they have also been in flying sorties over Iraq as well.

We don't the details at this point. Military intelligence is pretty tight with the actual details of these air strikes. But certainly it seems that the Jordanians not just targeting Syria but also over Iraq as well.

PAUL: All right. Becky Anderson, appreciate the update. Thank you.

BLACKWELL: While the U.S. is determine if ISIS's claims that a Jordanian air strike killed an American hostage is true or even if Kayla Mueller is alive or dead. The militants say the body of Mueller was buried in a rubble of this building. And they had shown zero proof of death. And Jordan calls it a P.R. stunt.

The 26-years-old's family is imploring ISIS to contact them privately. Overnight, her parents released this statement and here it is, "We are still hopeful that Kayla is alive. We have sent you a message -- a private message, they say, and ask that you respond to us privately. We know that you have read our previous communications. You told us that you treated Kayla as your guest, as your guest, her safety and well-being remains your responsibility. Kayla's mother and I have been doing everything we can to get her released"

Now as we mentioned, the U.S. is still trying to verify whether that claim by ISIS is true. And many experts believe the terrorist group is trying to create friction within the coalition by claiming that Mueller's death was the result of the Jordanian strikes.

Let's bring in Sunlen Serfaty. She's live this morning from the White House. What is the administration's saying about all these, Sunlen?

SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well Victor, the Obama administration says that they're deeply concerned but deeply skeptical about this report. They have not seen any evidence or any proof to backup ISIS's claim.

Now U.S. officials tells us that the working theory right now within the administration is that Kayla could have been killed some time ago maybe week's maybe even months. And this claim by ISIS was really held up as evidence it kind of concocting a conclusion for her death. Now we know that the Obama administration has been working behind the scene to try this secure her and she -- they've been talking with her family and making sure that they're keeping up the communication with the Mueller family. Of course ISIS has demanded nearly $6 million in ransom, something that the United States government does not pay.

Now President Obama has tapped National Security Adviser Susan Rice, she spoke yesterday broadly about ISIS's claims, but also the reason why they don't pay ransom.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SUSAN RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: We do not at the present have any evidence to corroborate ISIL's claims. But obviously we'll keep reviewing the information at hand.

We have a broader policy with respect to hostages around the world we don't make concessions to terrorists and to hostage takers, we don't pay ransom.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SERFATY: And Susan Rice also added that the administration is currently undergoing of broad review of their hostage policy not in terms of making any concessions, they say that point is non- negotiable. But more in terms of how they communicate with families whose loved ones are in a hostage situation of course this is no small comfort for Kayla Mueller's family right now who's waiting to see if she's dead or alive. Victor, Christi.

BLACKWELL: Absolutely. Sunlen Sefraty, the White House horse. Thank you.

PAUL: Meanwhile, as coalition forces continue to pound ISIS targets from the air. One of the big questions obviously is whether the U.S. will send ground troops to fight the terror group.

A U.S. military official tells CNN, the United States is trying to gather as much intelligence as possible about ISIS defenses in Mosul, Iraq where those latest air strikes have taken place and you just saw them there with full black.

Now, as we mentioned earlier ISIS has continued to reinforce its defenses around that city and if that continues, the Pentagon could recommend sending U.S. ground troops.

I want to dig deeper with CNN Military Analyst retired Army Lieutenant General Mark Hertling. General thank you so much for being with us.

LIEUTENANT GENERAL MARK HERTLING, (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Good morning Christi.

PAUL: Good morning I have to ask the question right under the gate, do you think the U.S. will be forced to put boots on the ground here?

HERTLING: They will more than likely, Christi put advisers on the ground if that's what you're talking about. There will not be any large formation of forces. The President has already said that and I agree with that, having fought for almost a year and a half around Mosul. And knowing the difficulties to that terrain and understanding that it is has to be the Iraqi forces that take that territory back and secure it.

So, no. I don't think we'll have large formations but we will have the advisers helping the Iraqis more than likely.

PAUL: You know, the U.S. has seen ISIS moved their families out of Mosul. So what kind of intelligence gathering is ISIS doing in order to know what the coalition is planning?

HERTLING: Well this has been a very tough week for ISIS, Christi. First of all I think they have been strategically hurt by what's happened in Jordan. They are operationally blunted they are suffering loses across the board both in Iraq and in a lesser case Syria.

And they're currently being cataclysmic because they are attempting to reinforce Mosul they are attempting to draw a coalition forces and air power away from Mosul based on the attack in Kirkuk. But they are not being able to do that.

So they realize that the fight is about to come in the city of Mosul which the Iraqi call the mother of two springs, it's the second most important city in Iraq so they want to regain that territory soon or rather than later.

ISIS knows that, ISIS knows that and they're trying to reinforce but they just can't do it. So, I think we're going to prepare for a fight from Iraqi security forces and Peshmerga to attempt to re-take the city of Mosul but even that's going to be very difficult.

PAUL: I'm sure that you've talked to people as I have, general and there is a real sense of fear of this group and what -- and ISIS in what they could possibly do. When you've got the U.K. and Jordan and the U.S. and Saudi, Saudi Arabia and France, all verbally condemning this, what is the hesitation I've heard this question so many times from just general people, what is the hesitation of pulling all of the military resources together and just going in to take them out?

HERTLING: Mostly the places where ISIS and Al-Qaeda are located today, Christi are areas with bad governance. And no matter how many forces you put into an area unless you can back it up with some type of political strength you'll never win against this group. And everyone keep saying why aren't we winning, why aren't we winning. The attempt by military forces is to gain. Currently the President's strategy has seven different lines of operation. Only two of those have anything to do with military forces, the rest have to do with diplomacy, economics and information.

So you can't kill your way out of this. No matter how many terrorist you kill, you're still going to have an organization that's viable unless you have strong government. And the only government that can help in this kind of situation is the government of Iraq and Syria.

PAUL: Very good point. General Mark Hertling, we always appreciate your expertise thank you for being here.

HERTLING: Thank you, Christi

BLACKWELL: Next, new developments in Ukraine. World leaders are racing to stop the bloodshed there. Of course, as the shelling continues this morning, top U.S. officials and their European counterparts in Germany right now trying to workout a peace deal before more lives are lost.

Plus, new revelations overnight in the case of Bobbi Kristina Brown. We'll tell what new discoveries are now being revealed.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PAUL: Nineteen minutes past the hour. More than 5,000 lives have been lost and still no peace deal in Ukraine's vast unfolding humanitarian crisis there. While deadly artillery fire continues in the streets of Ukraine this morning, world leaders are in Germany, and are there right now racing to stop the bloodshed. CNN's Nick Paton Walsh has the latest for us from Donetsk.

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Christi, Victor, but you can't hear it in my microphone behind me is the consistent heavy thud of artillery strikes. That's been happening all night and again this morning increasingly close towards Donetsk City center or the capital of the self-declared separatist, People's Republic here. And it's not a backdrop conducive to peace at all.

We have that extraordinary (inaudible) throughout the Kremlin of the heads of two of largest colonies in Europe, Angela Merkel and Francois Hollande going to see Vladimir Putin suggesting a peace proposal and leaving very early the following morning with the idea that if (inaudible) to say other than the talks have been constructed.

Yes, there maybe more on Sunday but nobody went back to the ceasefire that already signed up for (inaudible) last year in Minsk. And behind me, continually that thud suggest that the separatists are continually having clashes with the Ukrainian military, perhaps mainly increasingly confident. They are disciplined, effective, well- equipped here too. And many I think concern that given how Angela Markel characterize those peace talks as being perhaps uncertain in their success.

Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, Donetsk.

BLACKWELL: All right, joining me now, Roman Popadiuk, the former U.S. Amabasador to Ukraine. Good to have you sir,

ROMAN POPADIUK, FORMER U.S. AMABASADOR TO UKRAINE: Good to be with you, Victor.

BLACKWELL. So, let's talk about these meetings. What do you think is going on behind closed doors right now in Munich this morning?

POPADIUK: Well, I think what we have to take into consideration in terms of the discussions they had with President Putin is two things. Number one, there was nothing negative said about the talks that took place. In other words, there seems to have been some positive developments during the course of the talks because when Merkel and Hollande left, they didn't have anything negative. They weren't exactly very positive, but at least they weren't negative.

And secondly, I think it's important to notice that nothing has really leaked in terms of what the talks were all about. And that's a good sign in itself because the success in a lot of diplomacy is the secrecy involved in order to have each side give their points of view openly and candidly, and be able to negotiate back and fourth.

So those two developments, I think, are some grounds for hope that maybe oral mucositis positive can develop out of these talks that talk place in Moscow.

BLACKWELL: So what has changed, if you could detail for us, between the Minsk agreement which all sides can say with some degree of certainty have not been abided by. And now, what has changed in Russia that would encourage Putin to stop supporting the rebels there?

POPADIUK: Well, I think the number of things are changing. The war is expanding and that's a cost to both sides, the separatist, the Ukrainians and the Russian support of the separatists. And that's a heavy burden that's taking place.

Since the Minsk record, the sanctions have taken a deeper bide on the Russian economy, world oil, prices as you notice have fallen over the past few months and that's taken an extra deep bide in Soviet (ph) Russia and -- so in terms of the cost to Russia, in terms of the cost to the separatists, and the cost to Ukrainians, there's a lot of development along the lines I've just mentioned that kind of warrant the sides to get together and try to get some kind of solution that is peaceful.

BLACKWELL: So, Mr. Ambassador, there are reports that the U.S. is considering sending defensive lethal aid, we're talking anti-tank, anti-air, anti-mortars systems. Angela Merkel has said that sending this lethal aid, the weapons to Ukraine won't stop it, it won't help essentially. What do you think?

POPADIUK: Well, I think it's very important to realize that the only solution to this conflict is a peaceful solution, along the lines that Merkel and Hollande have been trying to achieve in the discussions in Moscow. But having said that, there are parallel tracks here for Ukraine to be a little bit stronger at the negotiating table, it's probably good for Ukraine to have a defensive arms space (ph) along the lines that you just outlined.

In other words, strong diplomacy sometimes needs a strong military backing in order to be able to achieve things at the table. So, I see both the talk of the peace process, as well as talk of supplying arms to Ukraine by the U.S. administration as running a parallel and being supportive of each other for a peaceful solution.

BLACKWELL: So would you support the sending of that defensive lethal aid, not in the effect of having them actually use them but to have that big stick probability.

POPADIUK: As I mentioned, I think it's important for Ukraine to have some kind of underpinning to its diplomacy and arm shipments and defensive arms can give them that strength at the negotiating table that's been lacking over the past few months.

BLACKWELL: All right. Former U.S. Ambassador, Roman Popadiuk, thanks so much.

POPADIUK: Thank you.

PAUL: Coming up, we have new revelations in the case of Whitney Houston's daughter, Bobbi Kristina Brown. There are some new discoveries we need to tell you about, and a shift for investigators who they maybe focusing in on now.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PAUL: Twenty-seven minutes past the hour. I want to share some new developments with you from overnight in the case of Bobbi Kristina Brown, the daughter of Whitney Houston and Bobby Brown, and still in medically-induced coma. But according to CNN sources, the 21-year old has injuries that have still not been explained. Now, what those injuries are, that hasn't been revealed.

But in another development, investigators apparently are focusing on Bobbi Kristina Brown's boyfriend, Nick Gordon. All of this as they're trying to determine how it is that she ended up face down in a tub full of water last weekend at her Georgia home.

Let's bring back HLN legal analyst Joey Jackson. So Joey, if Gordon had something to do with Brown's current condition, what would be the next step in the case then?

JOEY JACKSON, HLN ANALYST: Good morning, Christi. You know, first, let's certainly hope that Bobbi Kristina progresses, develops and is OK. But, you know, the indications are and we don't know how factual it is or exactly what the injuries are but the indications are that there are injuries that are not explained, and of course that police as part of what should be doing is focusing a broad net or looking and seeing whether it could be criminal.

Now in the event, Christi, that she does have these injuries, it wouldn't necessarily mean that he would be responsible for the death, perhaps there was some history there, we don't know, perhaps there was some argument that morning, we don't know, you know, perhaps as a result of dispute that they had, you know, if she took matters into her own hands, we don't know. But certainly, the police are going to focus, they'll be questioning him. You know, certainly he'll get a lawyer at some point, they'll be questioning Max Lomas, who was the friend do actually found her, and they want to determine exactly how she ended up in this condition.

PAUL: Yeah, could the alleged injuries be enough though? Do you think to prompt a criminal investigation? I guess I'm asking, what has to be there, in order for that to happened? JACKSON: Sure, Christi. I think certainly it's a start and, you know, whenever you look at an incidence where someone who is healthy, 21-year old ends up in a bath tub and is unresponsive, you wonder how that could occur. Now, I think, at some toxicology will be done to determine what, if anything, she had and her system that lead to that, but I think any circumstances surrounding that will be investigated. Who did she text or not text before that. Where there any posts on social media. Who was in that household then? Who was in the household before. What if anything did Nick have to do with this particular incidence? What was the relationship between him and her?

Was there any past violence? Was there abuse? What happened in the moments before? There are other reports that he cleaned up the house or took blood, you know, that was in the house away? Are those true or not true? We don't know. But I think the police will be looking at that to determine what if anything he had to do with her being put in that particular situation.

And of course if they find that he had a lot to do with it, then I think you'll see the criminal investigation broadened and perhaps some potential trouble for him. But again, it's still early, we don't know the exact fact but the police are focusing on what they need to do, which is to get to the bottom of how a healthy 21-year-old ended up, Christi, in that position.

PAUL: Yes. I think that's what stood out to everybody is that she was faced down in the water and that seems strange to a lot of people.

Joey Jackson, we appreciate it so much. Thank you.

(CROSSTALK)

PAUL: It's just a sad, sad situation. Thanks.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BLACKWELL: And the breaking news this morning ISIS is getting hit on multiple fronts in Iraq and Syria. A CNN crew tells us at least a dozen airstrikes have targeted the ISIS stronghold of Mosul, Iraq's second largest city. The crew saw the impact in the distance and heard the coalition jets striking or streaking, rather, overhead.

And Kurdish forces, they say that the frequency and intensity of the strikes on Mosul has picked up sharply since the word of the burning of Jordanian pilot by ISIS was announced. And we'll have a report from CNN's Phil Black, one of a few Western reporters in the region. That's at the top of the hour.

Also, across the Iraqi border, coalition war planes are also hitting ISIS in northern Syria. Activists say there have been at least 10 explosions near the militant stronghold of Raqqa.

PAUL: The White House has released the president's national security strategy including how the U.S. plans to battle ISIS.

CNN White House correspondent Michelle Kosinski has more for us this morning.

Good morning, Michelle.

MICHELLE KOSINSKI, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Victor and Christi. Right. So at the same time these reports were emerging we see the White House spell out the president's national security strategy, looking forward but also defending decisions that have been made.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KOSINSKI (voice-over): ISIS claiming a Jordanian airstrike killed an American hostage. Against this brutal backdrop the White House today lays out its broad security strategy and defense of the president's blueprint for the use of American force around the world.

SUSAN RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: With the world united in condemnation of its executions, ISIL should know that the barbarism only fortifies the world's collective resolve.

KOSINSKI: Emphasizing defending that collective effort against ISIS and other threats even when progress is slow, as in Syria where the U.S. is still in the complex vetting stage for arming and training local fighters, which critics even some former members of the administration say should have been done a long time ago.

RICE: Fighting terrorism is a long-term struggle. There will be setbacks, and there are no one-size-fits-all solutions.

KOSINSKI: The White House says the goal is strong and sustainable. Global leadership and military being only a part of that but which they say needs more funding. Also in what's been called the Obama doctrine, avoiding long-term conflict, maximizing diplomacy and what sounds like a hit back at critics not over reacting.

RICE: Yes, there is a lot going on. Still, while the dangers we face may be more numerous and varied, they are not of the existential nature we confronted during World War II or during the Cold War. We cannot afford to be buffeted by alarmism.

KOSINSKI: As early as next week the president will ask Congress for more tailored authority to go after ISIS. The challenge, trying to gain bipartisan support for what could be a three-year plan targeting ISIS in both Iraq and Syria. But will the president leave open any possibility leeway for using American ground troops? As some in Congress would like if necessary. So far he's repeated said, not an option.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOSINSKI: National Security Adviser Susan Rice also talked about this process, this review that's been going on as to how the U.S. government deals with and communicates with families of hostages. This came up in past cases with James Foley and Stephen Sotloff. That's what prompted this review. But she emphasized again the U.S. does not make concessions to terrorists, does not pay ransoms -- Victor and Christi.

BLACKWELL: All right, Michelle Kosinski at the White House for us. Thanks.

Up next the political fight brewing over an agency designed to keep the U.S. homeland safe. Why the fight over the president's immigration executive orders could impact critical funding for the Department of Homeland Security.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLACKWELL: Twenty days, the date February 27th, that's when the Department of Homeland Security runs out of money.

Funding Homeland Security is turning now into a political fight. Three times this week Senate Democrats blocked Republicans from moving the funding bill forward. The reason, all three bills had immigration amendments tacked on. And then we have President Obama who threatens to veto any bill that goes after his executive orders on immigration.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Legislation is going to be going to the Senate that again tries to block these executive actions.

I want to be as clear as possible, I will veto any legislation that got to my desk that took away the chance of these young people who grew up here and who are prepared to contribute to this country that would prevent them from doing so. And I am confident that I can uphold that veto.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: So let's talk more about this with CNN political commentators. We've got Ben Ferguson, he's on the right, Maria Cardona, she's on the left.

Food morning to both of you.

BEN FERGUSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning.

MARIA CARDONA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning. How are you?

BLACKWELL: Very well. Maria, I want to start with you. OK. So we know what the president's stance is. He's going to veto the bill.

Why are Democrats in the Senate blocking that from happening? Just vote, pass it, because it's going to pass, and then let the president veto it.

CARDONA: Because it is -- what is in it right now, Victor, is what we call a poison pill. What Republicans need to do in the House is to pass a clean funding Department of Homeland Security bill.

When you have Republicans and the two past Republican heads of the Department of Homeland Security along with the past Democratic head of the Department of Homeland Security are urging Republicans to pass a clean funding bill, and not tack on those poison pills that have absolutely nothing to do with defending our nation, and in fact would actually put our nation in jeopardy. That's when you know that frankly the real fight here is not between Democrats and Republicans it's between the Republicans House and the Republican Senate. Because we also have Republican senators telling the Republican House --

BLACKWELL: I hear that.

CARDONA: -- that they need to pass a clean funding bill.

BLACKWELL: But it's DOA when it gets to the president's desk, why not let it die there?

CARDONA: Because why not let -- let's have Republicans do the people's job essentially. When they got elected in November, Victor, let's remember they promised to govern. This is not governing. This is purely putting politics over governing because they want to make a point. If they really wanted --

FERGUSON: Maria --

CARDONA: -- to stop the president's executive action, you know what they could do, Victor? They could pass an immigration bill which they failed to do for over a year and a half.

BLACKWELL: Ben, why put it in this bill? I mean, they knew this was going to happen and you can't play around with the funding of Homeland Security.

FERGUSON: Well, I think -- I think Maria should take her own advice. Let the people that representatives they sent to Washington do their job which is not having executive action when you know that Congress will not give you what you want on immigration reform.

I mean, I would say that the president of the United States of America, go ahead, take your executive action to Congress. Have it independent. Don't do it through executive action. When the American people sent people to Washington to actually vote on the legislation that deals with immigration instead of it being amnesty through executive order. But the president won't do that. And Maria knows he won't it and the reason why is because he doesn't have the votes on the Hill to let the people's representatives do their job.

So if you're Republican and you're looking at this, you're saying, hey, Mr. President, you went around Congress, you went around the people that were elected just to elected to Washington, to legislate so we're going to force the issue here. And that's exactly why they're having this discussion right now with the president of the United States of America and when he says, you know, he's vetoing it, this isn't a fight between Republican in the House and Senate.

When the president is arguing that I'm going to veto something, that is a direct fight between Congress that this president does not like and doesn't want to work with, even though their job is to actually legislation and he went around them.

BLACKWELL: Ben, so we're hearing this proposal from main GOP senator Susan Collins that we've seen these three votes now.

FERGUSON: Yes.

BLACKWELL: She's proposing possibly a new bill originating in the Senate that would not fund the 2014 executive orders but let the Dreamer executive order of 2012 stand. There any appetite or support for that on the Republican side?

FERGUSON: I think there is going to be some, and I think that may be part of what you may see, ultimately when we get down to this deadline. Look, Congress always loves to get down to the wire. We know that. And that's something that they obviously are planning for right now and Susan Collins are saying, OK, here's a plan B, let's take a look at this.

But I do think this is going to be a fight that the president of the United States of America needs to really look at and say hey, do I really want to go all in on a veto that deals with the Department of Homeland Security that deals with national security, with all the threats of ISIS and the threats of ISIS, with all the cyber threats that we have, with everything else going on with our security at the border, which again Republicans are sent to Washington to actually deal with.

And this president says I do not want to deal with it and so I'm going to allow Congress to do. I'll do it through executive action. And I think he's putting himself in a corner where it may actually get him in trouble.

BLACKWELL: Maria, quickly. Do you think Democrats will go for that proposal?

CARDONA: No, I don't, because, again, Republicans had plenty of time to do exactly what Ben is talking about, which is taking immigration reform legislation which the majority of the American people want to the floor. They refused because they knew that it would pass and they don't want it to pass. So now what are they doing? They are putting the nation's national security in jeopardy --

FERGUSON: Maria, they just got there.

CARDONA: -- because they're pounding their feet. They're pounding their feet. And they are not getting what they want so they're putting politics over policy, and the American people know that. And what the Republicans are in jeopardy of, they've already shut down the government once and it didn't go over well for them.

BLACKWELL: Yes.

CARDONA: If it shuts down -- if the Department of Homeland Security, with all of the threats that Ben just underscored shuts down, Republicans will get blamed for it.

BLACKWELL: All right. We've got to call it here.

Maria Cardona, Ben Ferguson, we'll continue this conversation a little later in the morning. Thank you both.

CARDONA: Thank you, Victor.

FERGUSON: Thanks.

PAUL: Stay with us, though. Jurors in the Aaron Hernandez murder trial, they take a field trip to the crime scene as well as the athlete's home.

We're breaking down what the judge wanted them to see and what she wanted them to avoid seeing at that house.

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PAUL: Mortgage rates were mixed this week. Here's your look.

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PAUL: Well, as another week of testimony begins in the Aaron Hernandez murder trial, jurors are mulling over their field trip to several key locations from this case. Yesterday they travelled by bus to the home of victim Odin Lloyd, the crime screen and Hernandez's house. But before that visit there was a major point of contention regarding what was inside the former athlete's home.

Because the prosecution argued it was lined with newly added religious objects and sports memorabilia that was not in the house at the time of the murder so the defense agreed to remove those items before jurors stepped into the house.

We want to talk about this with CNN legal analyst Mel Robbins.

First of all, Mel, good morning to you. And is it common for jurors to take field trips like this?

MEL ROBBINS, CNN COMMENTATOR AND LEGAL ANALYST: Well, good morning, Christi. It's not common unless it's a huge politicized case and the judge feels that a field trip like this will help the jury in weighing all the evidence. We saw a field trip like this, for example, in the George Zimmerman case, so while it's uncommon for most cases, in a big case that's being scrutinized, if either side asks, it's well within the judge's authority to allow it, Christi.

PAUL: And does it really make a difference in a juror's mind as opposed to seeing pictures in the court?

ROBBINS: It makes an enormous difference. So, for example, as a former trial lawyer, we used to call it putting the jury at the scene when we would meticulously describe a scene to a jury because we would want them to imagine it. But nothing, absolutely nothing, gives the jury a huge impact as actually visiting the place where Odin Lloyd, for example, was murdered. So there's a couple things here that's important that the jury is

going to be thinking about. First of all, this is a very remote location. Secondly, it is extremely close, less than a mile from Aaron Hernandez's house. Third, the prosecutors are going to try to establish in addition to the DNA that's found at the scene, they're going to be using really technical testimony, Christi, about cell phone triangulation.

And so now the jurors have actually seen the cell phone towers that the technical experts are going to be talking about and the fact that they've seen them will likely mean that they'll be paying closer attention and be saying oh, yes, I remember that tower, it was super close. I could see it from the industrial park. And so it makes an enormous impression on a jury for them to actually be able to look, feel and be at the scene, Christi.

PAUL: All right. We so appreciate that sense that you've given us there, Mel.

Thank you, Mel Robbins. Appreciate it.

ROBBINS: Great to see you.

PAUL: You too.

BLACKWELL: Coming up, new details in the moments leading up to the TransAsia plane crash, and all of this as we're getting new video, look at this, of a frantic attempt to save a passenger. You see the person there just banging on the window trying to get out.

Also we're following breaking news this morning, ISIS is being hit on multiple fronts in Iraq and Syria. We'll have a report from the CNN crew in Mosul on the latest airstrikes.

That's at the top of the hour.

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BLACKWELL: About five minutes until the top of the hour now. Here's a look at other developing stories.

PAUL: You may have seen this video. You're just transfixed with it. From TBBS of a TransAsia Airways plane crashing into Taiwan on Wednesday. Well, we're learning now that pilot error may have played a role in this deadly crash. Taiwan's Aviation Safety Council still investigating here but they say a pilot may have shut off the left engine in response to a warning about the right one. So essentially may have turned off the wrong engine.

TransAsia is ordering pilots of that model plane to take proficiency tests in order to fly again.

BLACKWELL: I'll tell you, every time I see that video I can't take my eyes off it.

PAUL: I know. BLACKWELL: I can't take my eyes off it.

Hey, still ahead we've got breaking news out of Iraq where coalition forces unleashed a new round of airstrikes against ISIS. We will have a new report on the bombings coming up at the top of the hour.

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