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New Day Saturday

FBI Investigates Campaign Computer System Breach; Democrats Under Attack From Hackers; First U.S. Non-Travel Related Cases of Zika Found In Miami; Donald Trump Says Gloves Coming Off; More Arrests in Flint Water Crisis; Brazil's Hang Gliding Airspace Closed for Olympics. Aired 8-9a ET

Aired July 30, 2016 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:01] CHRISTI PAUL, CNN ANCHOR: There is so much to talk to you about this morning.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: Yes. The next hour of your NEW DAY starts right now.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: U.S. officials now saying it is likely it was Russia that hacked 20,000 e-mails.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Wouldn't it be nice if we actually did get along with Russia.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The timing raising questions about whether it was an attempt to influence the U.S. election.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't know what their motive is. Do I believe they've done it? That's certainly the way it looks.

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have 100 days to make our case to America.

TRUMP: No more Mr. Nice guy.

TIM KAINE (D), VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: We are going to win. We have to win.

MIKE PENCE (R), VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Hillary Clinton must never become president of the United States of America.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're absolutely sure this is Zika.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A 100 percent, no doubts in my mind.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Three men and one woman in South Florida believed to be the first cases of this kind.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Zika doesn't just bite Republicans or Democrats or independents, it bites everyone.

(END VIDEOTAPE) PAUL: Well, glad you're up early at 8:00 on a Saturday morning. I'm Christi Paul.

BLACKWELL: I'm Victor Blackwell. Good to start this Saturday with you.

PAUL: In just a few hours now, Hillary Clinton and Tim Kaine back on their bus tour in Pennsylvania. The campaign says their computer system meanwhile has been hacked and the data program was accessed. Now this comes, of course, after two other hacks from the Democratic National Committee and Wikileaks editor-in-chief, Julian Assange tells CNN we could expect more.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JULIAN ASSANGE, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, WIKILEAKS: We have more material related to the Hillary Clinton. It is correct to say that because you have to be very precise in reporting our statements. The majority is very precise. Yes, those are extremely interesting and we will see what will come of them if you cross.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: All right, CNN's Diane Gallagher is joining us from Washington. Diane, we know that this data program was accessed, what kind of information did these hackers get?

DIANE GALLAGHER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So, Victor, this is a DNC sort of data analytics program. It's maintained by the DNC, but it's accessed by Democratic campaigns like the Clinton campaign. Basically it is a giant database of voter information like participation rates and their contact information.

But a Clinton aide tells us that it does not contain sensitive information like your Social Security number or credit card numbers. Now the Clinton campaign also says that this hack did not have anything to do with their internal system meaning that their voice mail, e-mails and internal communications were not breached.

But still Senator Dianne Feinstein who is on the Senate INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE said that all the campaigns really need to be worried about this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SENATOR DIANNE FEINSTEIN (D), INTELLIGENCE VICE CHAIR: I think it should be pretty clear that both campaigns should be aware that there's a problem out there. I think until the technical people can come up with some solutions, which are more ironclad, and I don't know whether that can be done or not, everybody should be cautious.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GALLAGHER: And of course, Victor, this is the third hack in less than a week that we have found out about. Of course, the DNC hack that created all of that rocky start to the convention and Debbie Wasserman Schultz stepping down and then the DCCC hack we found out about just hours before the Clinton campaign hack.

BLACKWELL: All right, Diane Gallagher there for us in Washington. Diane, thanks so much.

Let's talk to Michael Smerconish, host of CNN's "SMERCONISH," which starts in just about an hour from now. Michael, good to see you this morning.

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN HOST, "SMERCONISH": Hi, Christi.

PAUL: Hi. The hack we are talking about, whether something gets leaked or not, how damaging is this based on everything you know for the Clinton campaign specifically?

SMERCONISH: Well, I think the implications of this could be enormous. It seems like every four years we talk about the potential of an October surprise and they don't materialize. This really could be one.

And here's how so. Remember that FBI Director James Comey said that he couldn't be sure whether the private e-mail servers of Secretary Clinton were compromised, but that he was sure that individuals who were in touch with her, communicating with her on a regular basis were compromised.

So imagine if between now and November 8, e-mails should surface that were on her private servers that were not given to the FBI, but they were deleted and found in the hands of a hostile actor to use the parlous of the FBI, meaning Russia.

That would confirm all of what Republicans have been saying in terms of how she jeopardized national security by going the private e- mail server route.

Now, the other fly in the ointment is that Donald Trump might bobble this gift before it even lands in his lap by inviting the Russians to do exactly what is now suspected of their having been done.

[08:05:06]And that then allows the Democrats to cast him as being more on the side of Vladimir Putin than the American public. So it's awfully complicated but it could be enormous.

PAUL: What do you make of the statement by Julian Assange that essentially he is promising there is more to come. Is there -- do you think this is solely directed to the Democrats or is there any possibility we could see something like this happening on the Republican side of things?

SMERCONISH: Well, the short answer is I don't know. But it would seem odd that there would be interest only on the Democratic side of the aisle, right? If you were Russia, China, North Korea or Wikileaks, I can't justify why their interest would be focused only on the DNC and not the RNC.

So look, when Julian Assange says there's more to come, I take him seriously. I also note that earlier in the week when I talked about this on radio and was crediting, if that's the right word, the Russians with this hack, Wikileaks tweeted at me and said, give credit where credit is due. We have been on this for ten years.

So they have a proprietary interest in this sort of thing and I believe there is more to come.

PAUL: So politics aside of this, as we're talking about security and we have been talking about security for the last several years. But it's always been about airports, it's always been about the safety of soft targets.

Now we're talking about computer, something that we all use on a daily basis. Shouldn't people be more concerned with the fact that there is a foreign entity hacking into our systems than maybe the political ramifications of it or is it all together? Is it all just lumped as one?

SMERCONISH: I think it's a wake-up call for all of us and also a wake-up call in terms of our vulnerability. It's interesting, Richard Clark who is a national security adviser, has served both Republican and Democratic administrations.

This has been his issue for the last several years. In fact, just to wake up the American people, he's taken to writing novels about the subject. And from my many interviews with him, I can say that he's concerned about the impact on say the electrical grid, right?

Because everything now is based on computer models and computer programs and sometimes we tend to focus solely on boots on the ground and forces like ISIS and Syria when, in fact, we're vulnerable here at home to exactly this sort of thing that's now playing itself out. So hopefully, we wake up as a as a result of it.

PAUL: But when you say hopefully we wake up about it, have you changed the way that you use the computer at all? I know that it certainly makes me a little more aware, but as I'm very honest with myself, I don't know that I've made a whole lot of changes. Should we individually?

SMERCONISH: Christi, I can remember in not the too distant past being nervous to even order Christmas gifts online and so quickly I got over that. And frankly, no, I haven't changed any of my methodology and probably more like you in that regard and I'd hate to think that we now have to do so because of this type of a hack.

PAUL: All righty, Michael Smerconish, so much insight there. He's going to be back with you at the top of the hour. Thank you, Michael.

SMERCONISH: Thank you. Have a good day.

PAUL: You, too. Again, you'll see Michael at 9:00 a.m. Eastern right here on CNN.

BLACKWELL: Up next, we'll ask a former CIA official if hackers can access even more classified information and how this threatens cyber security in our country. We'll talk about that.

Plus, mosquitoes carrying the Zika virus in Florida. The area impacted and how quickly this could become a major problem.

And new charges, criminal charges in connection to the Flint water crisis with more possibly in the works. How high prosecutors say this cover-up went.

PAUL: Also ahead this hour, it's a beautiful birds-eye view of Rio.

(VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL: Look at this. Arwa Damon has found out, though, that views like this are about to be grounded.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:12:21]

BLACKWELL: Democrats are increasingly worried about the recent hacks into their computer systems especially as U.S. officials now believe the Russians maybe behind those attacks.

Let's bring in Phil Mudd, CNN counterterrorism analyst and former CIA counterterrorism official. Phil, good morning to you.

PHIL MUDD, CNN COUNTERTERRORISM ANALYST: Good morning, Victor.

BLACKWELL: So we've talked about the degree of danger that could be related to these hacks, but I wonder after the hacks of the DNC, DCCC, we know this now database, what's the potential that some protection and security will be offered for the nominees and the committees?

MUDD: Victor, I have wagered that there's been protection already offered by the U.S. government, but I think moving forward the questions get bigger. We are late in the game here after we have two candidates already nominated in the future going into the election cycle, for example, for 2020.

Does the federal government step in earlier before candidates are nominated to offer them assistance? Because by the time those candidates go to a convention, already if they have viruses in the system, with good hackers, there is not a lot that you can do with that point.

So I think this raises big questions in the future about intervention by the federal government very early in campaigns.

BLACKWELL: All right. Let's talk about the briefings given by the director of National Intelligence to the nominees. I want you to listen to something that Harry Reid told our Manu Raju this week. Actually I think he said on the floor. Let's listen to it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SENATOR HARRY REID (D), MINORITY LEADER: The word is out that he hasn't paid any taxes for ten years. Let him prove that he has paid taxes because he hasn't.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Sorry, that was the wrong sound. That was from 2012 a discussion of Mitt Romney's taxes, which we knew that was untrue. The sound that I wanted to play was Senator Reid suggesting that Clapper gave fake briefings to Donald Trump.

There have also been requests to not give the intelligence briefings to Hillary Clinton. First, let's talk about what the difference between what a nominee gets and what the president gets.

MUDD: Night and day, Victor. First of all, frequency, the president gets a briefing every morning and he's allowed to ask whatever he wants to ask. The candidates will be offered briefings on both sides covering areas like China or Russia or Iran.

Those briefings won't be daily, they won't be weekly. They will be irregular and they won't include either the kind of detail or the kind of breath that the president gets.

There will be updates on broad issues so the candidates have an opportunity to think about what the U.S. government knows about China, Russia, Iran in advance of talking to the American people. So a big difference between what they will get and what the president gets every day.

BLACKWELL: Is it possible to think that the government would ever really lie or mislead a presidential nominee?

[08:15:05]MUDD: Heck no. That's a ridiculous suggestion. What will happen is the White House will go to the Intelligence Committee and say, you can talk about these issues, don't get into detail, for example, for how we collect information on Russia.

Don't talk about issues that aren't approved by the White House, but give each candidate a lay down of what the U.S. government and the Intelligence Committee knows about security officials so the candidates can start understanding what this sort of breath of knowledge is that the Intelligence Committee can bring to bear on issues that affect the American security.

They will not, the intelligence briefers, offer anything that is a lie or misdirection. That's ridiculous.

BLACKWELL: You know, I wonder, we have talked a lot about Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, but we know that Gary Johnson of the Libertarian Party, he is their nominee. He's working to get to the debate stage. If he gets to 15 percent in five major polls he'll get there. At that point, would he also get those briefings, do you know?

MUDD: Boy, that's a good question. If I were the White House, I would approve those briefings. I've not heard that done before. It's a pretty standard process for the Republican and Democratic nominee to get briefings, but if he's on the stage and I were at the White House, I would suggests that he does get the same information they get. BLACKWELL: Any way they can lose that briefing?

MUDD: If they leak classified information, but that's hard for me to imagine. I have heard the political debates. I live here in Washington, I've heard whether Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton should get the briefings based on their histories.

Inside the beltway, inside this game, Victor, there's no way the White House is going to turn down briefings for either candidate and for them to lose that access, it's going to have to be a pretty dramatic episode on their part.

BLACKWELL: Yes, the director of National Intelligence and the president have both said that they will -- the nominees will receive those briefings. The president committed to a smooth transition. Phil Mudd, thanks so much for the clarity.

MUDD: Thank you.

BLACKWELL: All right, Christi.

PAUL: Following a developing story out of Belgium this morning, the Belgium federal prosecutor's office saying two men are under arrest, both suspected of planning a terror attack. Now Belgian authorities the arrests came after a series of home searches. Right now, there's no connection to earlier terror attacks at the airport in Brussels and a subway station, of course.

Also, breaking overnight, in Washington State, a party in suburban Seattle ended with three people shot dead. Police say 15 to 20 people were at this home when it happened. One person was wounded. The alleged gunman is in custody. He was taken later at a traffic stop. Police haven't said or indicated a motive for that shooting.

BLACKWELL: Ahead, Donald Trump changes his tune and goes on the attack.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: You know what? I've been saying, I've been saying let's just beat her in November. But you know what? You know what? I'm starting to agree with you, I'll tell you. I'm tired of it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: But can his message help Trump win the White House?

PAUL: Also, how quickly can the mosquitos carrying the Zika virus spread beyond Florida?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:21:34]

PAUL: It's 21 minutes past the hour. And blood centers in South Florida are screening now all of their donations for the Zika virus after the state reports the first non-travel related cases of the virus in the U.S.

The CDC saying the infections were from mosquito bites north of downtown Miami and the state is responding to try to stop the virus from spreading now.

We have Dr. William Schaffner with us. He's a professor of Preventive Medicine at Vanderbilt University. Dr. Shaft, it's so good to see you again. First and foremost, wondering what your level of concern is with this news?

DR. WILLIAM SCHAFFNER, PROFESSOR OF PREVENTIVE MEDICINE, VANDERBILT UNIVERSITY: Well, it's obviously something we have expected. We knew there would be many introductions of Zika into the United States and we thought from time to time there would be some spread because our own mosquitos became infected and then spread it to some other folks.

That's happened. We anticipated it. The public health has been on it. They've been going out there and testing and controlling and I think they have it under control this time.

PAUL: OK, when you say under control, how expeditiously can this spread outside of Florida?

SCHAFFNER: Well, that would depend, Christi, on other people coming into the United States, into any state, really, where there are the mosquitos that can transmit this infection. Those mosquitoes would bite the individual and then transmit it to others.

PAUL: But you are not concerned about the mosquitos that they believe in Florida are the perpetrators so to speak of this particular infection?

SCHAFFNER: Well, yes, the mosquitos in Florida are not going to fly even throughout Florida. They haven't -- they have a very limited flight range. So they are not going to fly to Texas, for example. That would require new people introducing Zika into the United States and we're going to see probably a few more instances of that.

PAUL: Here's the thing, the CDC advises pregnant women or women who hope to become pregnant to avoid travel to Puerto Rico and other places at risk. But I'm wondering what you would tell people who live in Miami, pregnant women who live there, should they say proactively get tested for Zika?

SCHAFFNER: Well, I think the obstetricians are counseling all of those pregnant women and if there is a pregnant women, testing is available. These cases in Florida occurred early in July. There's been no evidence of transmission since then so my fingers are crossed. I think this introduction has been contained.

PAUL: OK. So you would say to pregnant women in Miami, specifically, what?

SCHAFFNER: Obviously, if you get sick and you feel poorly, aches and pains, you get a rash, you get conjunctivitis, see your obstetrician right away and keep those lines of communications with your doctor open. If you have anxieties, talk to your obstetrician.

PAUL: You mentioned that we were expecting this at some point, so you are confident with the CDC precautions and with the response that is readily available right now?

SCHAFFNER: Well, all public health authorities have been preparing for these sorts of introductions. I think for months now and you can see that one it occurred it was detected rather quickly and the response was instantaneous and comprehensive. So far so good.

[08:25:07]But we anticipate there will be more of these little clusters of infection as the season goes on.

PAUL: All right. Very good to know. Dr. William Schaffner, I always feel like I'm going to get a lollipop after I talk to you. You're so reassuring. Thank you so much. We appreciate it.

SCHAFFNER: My pleasure, Christi.

PAUL: Of course. Now listen, according to the CDC, there is no vaccine that exist remember to prevent Zika so you have to try to avoid mosquito bites using repellants and wearing long sleeves and long pants, which I know is really tough in these high humid weather that we have.

But the CDC also says keep in mind mosquitoes that spread the Zika virus bites primarily during the daytime.

BLACKWELL: Donald Trump says no more Mr. Nice Guy, and get this, he is changing his tone and his mind over cause to jail his Democratic opponent.

Plus tainted water, now six more people, officials, face criminal charges for the dire situation in Flint, Michigan. Prosecutors say some reports were altered and buried.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: U.S. officials now saying it is likely it was Russia that hacked 20,000 e-mails.

TRUMP: Wouldn't it be nice if we actually did get along with Russia.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The timing raising questions about whether it was an attempt to influence the U.S. election.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't know what their motive is. Do I believe they've done it? That's certainly the way it looks.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[08:30:05] PAUL: We are so grateful for your company as always. 29 minutes passed the hour, I'm Christi Paul.

BLACKWELL: I'm Victor Blackwell. Good morning to you.

Hillary Clinton and Tim Kaine are straight from the convention into the battle ground states. They're on a bus tour right now in Pennsylvania. That's happening today. Then they will cross over into Ohio, hitting Cleveland and Columbus tomorrow.

Now, the Clinton campaign says that a system, a database that is vital to its effort to win the White House was the target of a cyber attack. Now, the FBI is investigating this later breach which comes after, as you know, two other hacks on the Democratic Party including the DNC, the DCCC. Officials say, Russia may be behind the attacks, but the Russians have denied having anything to do with it.

PAUL: Donald Trump meanwhile says, the gloves are off. The Republican taking jabs at Hillary Clinton in the swing state of Colorado attacking a Democratic rival as being, "Crooked as a three dollar bill."

CNN National Correspondent Jason Carroll has more for us

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Just remember this. Trump is going to be no more Mr. Nice guy.

JASON CAROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Donald Trump on offense taking aim at Hillary Clinton on the heels of this week's Democratic National Convention.

TRUMP: I've been saying, let's just beat her in November. But you know what? No, no. You know what? I'm starting to agree with you, I'll tell you. After watching that performance last night, such lies. I don't have to be so nice anymore. I'm taking the gloves off, right?

CAROLL: Donald Trump is also ignoring the advice of a friend who he says told him to stay focused on Clinton.

TRUMP: I was going to hit one guy in particular, a very little guy. I was going to hit this guy so hard his head would spin. He wouldn't know what the hell happened.

CAROLL: Trump going after Former New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg who delivered a scathing attack against Trump at the convention.

MICHAEL BLOOMBERG, FORMER NEW YORK CITY MAYOR: Trump says he wants to run the nation like he's running his business? God help us. I'm a New Yorker. And I know a con when I see one.

CAROLL: Trump tweeting this response. If Michael Bloomberg ran again for mayor of New York, he wouldn't get 10 percent of the vote. They would run him out of town." Trump's prolific tweeting not lost on Clinton.

HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: A man you can date with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons. CAROLL: Trump firing back.

TRUMP: If somebody tweets, I do what I do, who cares? I think -- I'll tell you, I think I have the best temperament, or certainly one of the best temperaments of anybody that's ever run for the office of president, ever. Because I have a winning temperament.

CAROLL: The GOP nominee as he has done so many times in the past calling Clinton several names on twitter. All this while his running mate, Indiana Governor Mike Pence, took issue with name calling after the president referred to Trump as a homegrown demagogue during his speech Wednesday night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

GOV. MIKE PENCE (R-IN), VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: I don't think name calling has any place in public life. And I thought that was unfortunate that the president of the United States would use a term like that let alone laced into a sentence like that.

CAROLL: At his events here in Colorado Springs, Trump attacked everyone from the local fire marshal to the New York City's former mayor. The question is, will those types of attacks work in terms of bringing others into the campaign, bringing in other supporters. It certainly works with these base supporters. Will it bring in moderates? Will it bring independents? That still remains to be seen.

Jason Carroll, CNN, Colorado Springs, Colorado.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: All right. To talk about this, I want to bring in Raphael Warnock, he is the senior pastor at the Ebenezer Baptist Church in Atlanta, a Hillary Clinton supporter. Along with Republican Strategist and Donald Trump supporter Ashley Bell. Good to have both of you back.

RAPHAEL WARNOCK, SENIOR PASTOR, EBENEZER BAPTIST CHURCH: Good to be with you.

ASHLEY BELL, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Good to be here.

BLACKWELL: So, Ashley, I want to start with something that Donald Trump said yesterday at one of those rallies. That he complained that Hillary Clinton did not congratulate him on winning and beating his opponents. Donald Trump didn't congratulate her. Why is that a point of contention?

BELL: You know, we take these converses too seriously. Donald Trump is speaking to his supporters, he's having a conversation with them, not really the press. He was being a little tongue and cheek just he was -- just as he's been with other comments, I wouldn't read too much into that. He knows that Hillary Clinton wouldn't call him if he was on fire. So let alone to say congratulations.

BLACKWELL: All right. So we wrapped up the DNC this week Reverend. And last week when Ashley was here, we asked about possibly was the RNC a little too pessimistic, the tone, too dark, too depressing. I want you to watch a moment from the DNC this week.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(SINGING)

(END VIDEO CLIP

[08:35:16] BLACKWELL: So, we've got a singing, literally love songs on the stage, "What the World Needs Now Is Love, Sweet Love" and "You've Got a Friend".

WARNOCK: That sounds like my church on a Sunday morning.

BLACKWELL: Yeah, but people aren't looking for the church, they'll looking for jobs in Northeast Ohio. They say "you've got a friend" if they need a job. Was it too rosy in Philadelphia?

WARNOCK: No, these are very serious times. And I think if you saw the entire convention, the Democrats dealt with the issues that are really confronting America. I was deeply moved that in just a position to what we saw in Cleveland. Hillary Clinton was bold enough and engaged enough to put the "mothers of the movement", we call them on the stage to deal with this issue of police brutality, behind of it of course is this issue of mass incarceration. She didn't distill it and reduce it to law and order. These issues are much more complicated. And so I thought, we saw a very serious engagement of very serious issues and we need a serious president.

BLACKWELL: Understood. But even the Clinton campaign -- and we heard it from the Trump campaign, that the descriptions were of two different Americas. And the people who were hurting in Northeast Ohio, from Pennsylvania, Michigan, may have watched the DNC and said, they think everything is fine.

WARNOCK: I saw both of these conventions. And as a pastor, I move through the community. I see the suffering and the pain that people feel in contrast distinction to Donald Trump who has tried to exploit this pain and the division. The pain is real in America.

And I think that's why you have seen the kind of election we've witnessed over the past year. A lot of people are in trouble, white people and black people, of course we feel it in a particular kind of way in communities of color. And I think Donald Trump is trying to exploit that pain. And to exploit the divisions in America in a path toward political policy, ultimately it will fail.

BLACKWELL: You want to jump in?

BELL: Yeah. I think Hillary Clinton made herself once again the secretary of status quo. She is consistently saying that everything is just fine. When you saw the mothers on stage, you know, it touched my heart, but at the same time, I agree with pastor. It is bigger than just the criminal justice movement, the new Jim Crow. All these issues are bigger than just "Black Lives Matter" as a hashtag.

And they said that she would say "Black Lives Matter", but she didn't. She didn't going to say that. For us as Republicans, we have to make a better case, I understand, for a different direction. This is a status quo versus change election once again.

BLACKWELL: Has Donald Trump made any change on criminal justice reform?

BELL: You know, that's a very good point and I could say, you know, I'm the first one to sign up to help him write the criminal justice reform platform. But here's what Hillary Clinton didn't do. She did not get on stage and say, "You know what, let me take responsibility for the overreach of the war on drugs that has incarcerated one million African-American males and females in the '90s." I didn't hear that.

BLACKWE: But it's also -- is it also not too easy to suggest, that she approach criminal justice reform in the wrong way when your candidate didn't approach it at all?

WARNOCK: I have read her plan on mass incarceration. I'm yet to read Donald Trump's plan.

BELL: No, no. I want a 100 percent. This is the one thing I would to be absolutely critical for my nominee. Until Donald Trump comes up with a criminal justice reform platform, he is going to be in a strange territory right here and there's many Republicans, conservatives like myself we'll write it for him. So, that is a very earnest issue that we have to get towards. Because we get to the debate you can't just say you support police officers because I support them, he supports them. But do we also understand that there is a problem with our federal criminal justice system.

BLACKWELL: Let's talk about the question of temperament. I like it this in, , this is what Donald Trump told ABC and then we'll talk about that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I think I have a great temperament. I beat 16 very talented people. And I've never done this before. You don't do that with a bad temperament. I'm leading her in the polls as you probably have noticed. And I think I have a great temperament. I have a temperament where I know how to win. She doesn't know how to win. She's not a winner. She doesn't know how to win. And this country, if they choose her, this country will not be in good shape.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Donald Trump says he has a great temperament. We've seen and read the twitter rants. We've heard him ask his supporters to attack people, protesters in the crowd. We have watched him curse while on the stump. Do you think he has the right temperament, the best temperament?

BELL: You know, what I think when you put them side by side, when we look at what we saw at the Democratic convention, once again, Hillary Clinton says the one thing and her judgment is completely different. She didn't once address the fact that they went to Libya ...

BLACKWELL: Donald Trump, his temperament, that is the question. Does he have a winner temperament?

BELL: Of course. He wins. When he did lose? He had lose -- he'd be -- I have supported two candidates before I got to him, he's beat everybody. So yes, he does have a winning temperament.

[08:40:06] But until Hillary Clinton addresses the lies of Benghazi in Libya, people can't just hear her say these great things and trust her, because even the president of the United States had to admit, well this is one his failed flaw, I had no plan when Libya was over

(CROSSTALK)

BLACKWELL: Let me ask the question is about temperament. He says he has a winning temperament. He's right there. He beat people who, you know, governors, senators, people who have thought this was just a flash in the pan.

WARNOCK: As a child of the south who understands my history, there have been many candidates in the past who've won with the kinds of divisive message. Just because you're winning some people over does not mean that ultimately that's a winning message. Martin Luther King Jr. said that the moral arc of the universe is long. But it bends toward justice.

And so, we've seen this kind of thing with Donald Trump over the past year. My good brother is struggling because, you know, he said that when he switched from Rand Paul to Marco Rubio, that he was trying to get behind a candidate in your own words, quote, "who is not divisive and who would appeal to the broader segment of Americans." So my brother has a very difficult horse to ride.

Let me finish because this is someone who disparages Muslim Americans, Mexican-Americans, who makes fun of disabled Americans. Who pointed to one black person in the crows and says, that's my African-American, he disparages prisoners of war. And so, that leaves a very small base that he continues to appeal to and is very limited.

BELL: And look, we can go all day on tit for tat on racial stuff. But if you look at the Democratic Party's e-mails, the first thing you see in there, the picking a black woman saying they're ghetto. They call Latino engagement taco ball engagement. All absolutely out of the box outrageous stuff, the Democrats put in an e-mail. They may not say it out front but this is legitimate stuff ...

WARNOCK: Well, we're talking about your candidate.

(CROSSTALK)

BLACKWELL: ... since talked about taco balls when Donald Trump on ...

(CROSSTALK)

BLACKWELL: ... and I love Hispanic.

BELL: I agree that no party is clean. But what I'm saying is that my brother can't get here to say, he supports taco ball engagement. He's not going to sit here and pick a black woman's name ...

(CROSSTALK)

WARNOCK: ... and the only thing worse than ignorance is ignorance with enthusiasm. And we've seen this with this whole movement behind Donald Trump. Times are too serious. We can't afford Donald Trump in the White House.

BELL: And we can't afford more lies from Hillary Clinton.

BLACKWELL: Reverend Warnock, Ashley Bell, thank you, both. I enjoyed it.

Christi, back to you.

PAUL: All right. Still ahead, the criminal investigation over the tainted Flint water is getting even bigger now. Sara Ganim is following the latest developments.

SARA GANIM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Christi. Altered reports, deleted e-mails, how investigators are now saying that officials in the State Of Michigan covered up the water crisis in Flint. That's coming up next.

PAUL: All right, Sara, thank you. Also, a popular tourist attraction giving visitors a birds-eye view of Rio. Souring in the sky that was about to be grounded.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:46:31] PAUL: Well, six more current and former Michigan state employees are now facing charges in the Flint water crisis. They're accused by Michigan's attorney general who's trying to cover-up news of Flint's lead poisoned water by altering or burying crucial reports. Now, this brings the total count to nine people facing charges in this crisis.

And they've mentioned this week, Democrats promised that Clinton administration would keep the focus on Flint.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JENNIFER GRANHOLM, (D) MICHIGAN GOVERNOR: And this, too, when Flint's water poisons its children, it hurts all of us. These are our children. We are all Flint.

(END VIDEO CLIP) We should also point out Donald Trump talked about it as well, not necessarily at the convention, but he said it's a shame what's happening in Flint, Michigan. A thing like that shouldn't happen.

CNN Correspondent Sara Ganim is joining us now. State official, Sara, say that more charges may be coming, is that right?

GANIM: That's right. And officials saying that this is on track to be the largest investigation in the history of the State of Michigan, more than 200 people interviewed at this point. As you mentioned now, nine are facing charges. Some of those who are charged in the spring actually helped in this investigation leading to the charges of the six new officials.

I think what's really important to know about what happened yesterday, the allegations that were brought forth, what it shows is that there were officials at two different state agencies who on the same day in July of 2015, both agencies altered -- allegedly altered reports. One report that showed that there was raising levels of lead in the water. Another that showed rising levels of lead in Flint's kids and with children.

And officials at this two separate state agencies both at the same time decided to take a turn to go in another direction, to alter reports. There are allegedly deleted e-mails. And people were told not to talk about this anymore. Take a listen to what the special prosecutor had to say about this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILL SCHUETTE, MICHIGAN ATTORNEY GENERAL: This put children of Flint in the cross hairs of drinking poison. They put the children of Flint on the backburner, ignored them and ignored the truth about what was happening in the city of Flint.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GANIM: Now, as the investigation moves forward I think it's important to remember the human toll of all on this. You know, kids who over the past year, kids who are lead poisoned not growing, kids whose parents have told me they're having problems being in a noisy room, they're having auditory issues. This is the kind of thing you need to remember when you read through the reports. This does have a human toll as well as, you know, really the allegations that are quite stark about whether or not the officials knew about this and covered it up, Christi?

PAUL: Yeah, I mean, there's so much connected to this. Autoimmune disorders, skin lesions, brain fog as it's called. Do we have any indication, who's paying for the investigation? The investigation itself has to be obviously very significant but on the civil other things that's going to be as well.

GANIM: So, it's interesting. The city of Flint doesn't have a whole lot of money to flow around right?

PAUL: Right.

GANIM: That's how they got into this dilemma in the first place. Now the investigation itself is being paid for by the state legislature that has given money.

[08:50:02] But the people who are being interviewed, if they don't want to talk, it came up yesterday it came up yesterday that at least ten city officials have refused to talk at first without a criminal defense attorney. And the city is actually paying for those attorneys to sit with them which raises the issue of whether or not the city really has the money to be giving defense to these city employees who may have some information. While, at the same time, they're begging for money to change their lead pipes.

PAUL: Yeah, very good point. Thank you so much, Sara Ganim, appreciate it. And we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLACKWELL: So this is a really popular tourist attraction in Rio, hang gliding. But for the Olympic Games, everything and everybody there will be grounded.

CNN, Arwa Damon explains why.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MANUEL NAVARRO, HANG GLIDING: Well, the hang glide is very popular in Rio de Janeiro here in Brazil. The hang gliding is the best in the world.

ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: And expert pilot Manuel Navarro is among the best in the biz here.

NAVARRO: Well, demand is about 45,000 a year. There's lots of flights.

DAMON: Good luck.

NAVARRO: OK. You'll be all right.

DAMON: I'll be all right.

NAVARRO: Yeah.

DAMON: OK, so maybe I was a little nervous.

[08:55:04] NAVARRO: OK, Arwa, are you ready to run?

DAMON: I'm ready to run.

NAVARRO: I don't feel confident. Are you ready to run?

DAMON: I'm ready to run.

NAVARRO: OK, one, two, go run, blast off. DAMON: Oh, this is terrifying spectacular.

This is beautiful, the views from up here are unlike anything else and the air is just so crisp and fresh. I love it.

NAVARRO: Are you OK?

DAMON: Yeah.

And what makes this unique among hang gliding spots is its location. Starting up in the forest, flying over a sprawling urban landscape and Rio's stunning coastline, it's one of the best ways to experience the city.

It is a shame that people coming here for the Olympics won't able to do this?

NAVARRO: No.

DAMON: And that is because the Brazilian government is closing the air space for the Olympic Games. It's a security measure. They did the same thing for World Cup. But it's big bucks lost for the industry.

Manuel says he understands why the city needs to take these precautions. So if you want to try it out, schedule it in before or after the games. I totally recommend it.

Brilliant, absolutely brilliant.

Arwa Damon, CNN, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL: Hey, that's gorgeous.

All right that's going to do of course. We'll going to be back here with you though at 10:00 eastern with a live interview with the RNC Communications Director Sean Spicer at that time.

BLACKWELL: But keep it right here because "SMERCONISH" starts right after a break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)