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New Day Sunday

Million Marches to Join Paris Unit Rally

Aired January 11, 2015 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: -- the U.S. are coming together to show their support after those terror attacks that killed 17 people. Dozens participated in a silent march in Charlottesville, Virginia, yesterday. They carried signs that said show of solidarity. Rallies are planned in Boston and also in Chicago.

(MUSIC)

CHRISTI PAUL, CNN ANCHOR: So glad to have you with us on this Sunday. Take a look at these live pictures from Paris right now.

BLACKWELL: Yes. You're looking at what is the collection of what expected to be up to a million people today for this unity march.

PAUL: I'm Christi Paul. We're so glad you're with us.

BLACKWELL: I'm Victor Blackwell.

PAUL: Again, we do want to continue to show you some of the live pictures out of Paris right now. The massive turnout already two hours before this march begins, this unity march. The message that they want to send, terrorists who gripped this country in fear for three days will never win. This march is unbelievable to see the sea of people there already waving their flags ready to go.

The marchers are going to wind their way from Place de la Republique, all the way to the (INAUDIBLE), along several different routes, about three kilometers I understand.

BLACKWELL: In addition, dozens of world leaders are coming to Paris for this. British Prime Minister David Cameron, you've got Germany's chancellor, Angela Merkel, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov, Palestinian Authority, Mahmoud Abbas, the president there.

But overshadowing the march is the potential new threat. A French police source tells CNN that terrorist sleeper cells have been activated in just the past 24 hours in France.

PAUL: Officials plan to use what they're calling exceptional measures to protect everyone. Thousands of police officers, uniformed and plain clothes are being deployed across the French capital. There are police snipers, anti-terrorism officers who will also be out in force.

Let's take you to Paris with Jake Tapper who is there live now.

Jake, give us a tense of what you're feeling and what you're seeing there this morning.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Well, it's just a massive crowd, obviously greetings. I'm here at the Place de la Republique, and you can see add midst the giant Statute of Liberty -- that's is not the Statute of a Liberty but a woman symbolizing liberty, thousands and thousands of Frenchmen, women and children have gathered holding signs saying Je Suis Charlie, singing the French national anthem, who are you? Charlie. Who are you? Charlie. Or, Charlie, liberty, Charlie, liberty -- I'm translating, of course.

But as you note in addition to this massive demonstration of solidarity and unity and multiculturalism, there is also great concern in terms of this being a right target for an attack. French intelligence authorities have talked about how a few days ago, sleeper cells in France were activated.

Let's go to Isa Soares right now who has more on what French law enforcement and French authorities are doing to protect the massive crowd as well as the gathering of world leaders ranging from Benjamin Netanyahu to Mahmoud Abbas from the Palestinian Authority -- Isa.

ISA SOARES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Jake. Yes, more than a million people, more than 40-plus world leaders coming today rallying against the atrocities we have seen this week and really the French interior minister has been saying this week that all necessary measures have been taken to secure everyone who will take to the street.

This is what we know so far: We know there are going to be 2,300 soldiers deployed throughout the city. There are soldiers as well as police. There will be snipers on the roofs. The gutters are all being checked. There will be police dressed normally throughout the streets.

We also know that they've been told, the police have been told to keep their weapons on them at all times. They're also been told, Jake, to erase all the social media traces. So because you know you and I know, many viewers know if you're on Facebook, if you're on Twitter, if you have GPS enabled, they can track you down.

We heard from the French foreign minister, Cazeneuve, about those security measures. Let's have a listen to what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BERNARD CAZENEUVE, FRENCH INTERIOR MINISTER (through translator): One hundred fifty policemen in plain clothes will assure the security of the distinguished persons and there will be an attempt, there will be sharp shooters on the roof and the drains will be inspected.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: So, it's a three kilometer route. The French government saying they have every single angle covered. In the last hour or so, the French Foreign Minister Laurent Fabius had this to say. This is a Twitter comment. "The reaction of the world is unprecedented. This afternoon, Paris will be the world's capital of the resistance against terrorism and side by side they're all be showing unity from the U.S. We have two representatives. We have U.S. Attorney Eric Holder who has been in a meeting an hour or so with foreign ministers talking about counterterrorism and cybersecurity.

We also have the U.S. ambassador to France Jane Hartley. She wrote a very moving editorial this week, Jake, in one of the main newspapers here, "Le Monde". She says, "As we pause to mourn the loss of life, I'm reminded how people of France showed support for us in the aftermath of 9/11."

So, a show of support, a show of unity and defiance here in the streets of Paris as police and the French government tell us that they have everyone possible on the streets keeping an eye and keeping it safe -- Jake.

TAPPER: Isa Soares, thank you so much for that report.

But, obviously, as Isa mentioned, there is concern about continued terrorist attacks in France as well as concern among American authorities about what the sophistication and execution of the terrorist attack, particularly the one on the offices of the French magazine "Charlie Hebdo" on Wednesday but also the other attack on the kosher supermarket. What that might mean for American counter- terrorism officials going forward, what lessons can be learned? How can attacks like that be prevented going forward in the United States?

Let's bring in counterterrorism expert Joe Ruffini with more on that.

Joe, what we saw in France last week, the training, the execution of the diabolical evil terrorist plans by the Kouachi brothers, why would that create new concerns if it does at all among American counter terrorism officials or is this just what -- confirming what we already knew was possible?

JOE RUFFINI, ARMY COMBAT OFFICER (RET.): You know, I think, Jake, a little bit of both. Sleeper cells exist and we can be sure they exist in the United States as the United States remains number one target of al Qaeda. And I think what we're concerned about is you never really know how many sleeper cells there are, what their instructions are or when they are going to be activated, which is why vigilance among the American people as far as homeland security goes for us is so critical. You know, the Department of Homeland Security has that saying, if you see something, say something.

And after events like this, when we're reminded there are sleeper cells out here and there are well-trained people that are intent on doing bad things, it's very, very important to heighten our awareness and our alertness. And I would think that every media organization in the world now should be looking at their crisis response plans, should be thinking about lockdown plans and should be thinking about what are we going to do if God forbid a gunman enters our facility?

You know, a lot of the sleeper cells, a lot of these lone wolves, even though our intelligence and law enforcement community does a great job of thwarting these plots, there are unknown that's get through and do things like this. And it's absolutely critical to understand that this thing could happen even though rare at any time. And we just need to prepare now and be proactive.

TAPPER: Joe, one thing I always wondered about and heard from viewers about this as well is that if the French have an estimate of about 1,000 French citizens have gone and fought for ISIS, al-Nusra Front, other rebel or terrorist groups in Iraq and Syria and return, I think they have an estimate of 400 have returned to France.

If the United States has similar numbers, a smaller numbers but around, I think a few dozen have returned to the United States, how do they have those numbers if they don't know who the identities of these individuals are? And if they do know who the identities of these individuals are, why are they not in custody fighting for a terrorist group as against the law?

RUFFINI: Well, you know, Jake, that's a very good question. I always question these numbers. I always ask the same thing, how do they know?

I think when it comes to law enforcement and intelligence in this country and the job that they do, every day citizens like you and myself are not going to really know all they know. There is an old saying, you don't know what you don't know. I have the greatest confidence that they know more than they're able to tell us.

Having said that, though, the numbers to me really don't make that much of a difference, because I keep harkening back to 9/11 when just 12 men and none of them without a firearm brought our nation to a standstill. So, in my opinion of whether there's two that come back, whether there's 50 that come back, whether there's 1,000 that come back, it's do we understand the ones that are going to come forward and do something bad and are we giving our intelligence and law enforcement communities the funds and the resources and the support they need to do their best job?

It's not a question of numbers. It's a question of the capability and the dedication of those people coming back and what they're going to do.

TAPPER: Joe Ruffini, counter-terrorism expert, thank you so much. We appreciate your time and your expertise and sharing it with us this morning.

We're going to have much more coverage of this massive rally, this unity rally that is being held here in Paris, France, with world leaders ranging from British Prime Minister David Cameron to Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, massive security, a very warm feeling of solidarity. All of that when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back to CNN's continuing coverage of this massive unity rally in Paris, France. I'm Jake Tapper. I'm at the Place de la Republique where the unity rally is set to begin in an hour or so. Obviously, they're expecting about a million people if not more world leaders are here ranging from Benjamin Netanyahu, the prime minister of Israel, to Mahmoud Abbas, the president of the Palestinian Authority, to British Prime Minister David Cameron, to German Chancellor Angela Merkel and many, many more.

Security here is very tight, very intense. There's a lot of concern that terror cells have been activated in France. Obviously, this all started on Wednesday with the Kouachi brothers attacking the offices of the French magazine Charlie Hebdo and killing 12 innocent people, ten individuals who were there at the magazine, the newspaper that day as well as two law enforcement and security officials.

On Thursday, Amedy Coulibaly who is the third terrorist killed a French police woman and then on Friday he took hostages around 20 or so at a kosher supermarket. He killed four innocent individuals, four French men, all of whom were Jewish. There were 15 at least hostages who escaped.

Today there is word that ISIS, the terrorist group, the Islamic State, has released a videotape of Coulibaly, the terrorist who took hostages at the kosher supermarket. In it he is described as a soldier of the caliphate. He is identified as Abu Basser Abdullah al- Rafiki (ph). He pledges his support to the head of ISIS, al-Baghdadi. He exercises and gives speeches in this video. It is chilling and fascinating.

Let's talk about it with Samuel Laurent who is an expert, a counter-terrorism expert.

Samuel, this seems remarkable that here we have an ISIS soldier, an ISIS terrorist working hand in hand with the Kouachi brother who had pledged allegiance to al Qaeda, and had been trained, at least one of them, by al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula. I believe this is the first time we've seen any collusion between these two evil terrorist organizations.

SAMUEAL LAURENT, COUNTERTERRORISM EXPERT: Yes, well, actually, it's not a collusion. It's rather a drift. It's a gap.

What we saw is original cell that was created in 2005 from 2005 to 2008. And that was entirely loyal to al Qaeda.

Actually, what we see is the same pattern that the one we see all over Middle East in which old cells are basically getting a rift between some members staying loyal to al Qaeda and some others pledging allegiance to the caliphate in ISIS, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi.

So what was so basically is a replication of the pattern that we see in Sahel, that we see in Sinai, that we even see in Pakistan, with groups that were formally and 100 percent loyal to al Qaeda and with some members now shifting towards the ISIS, which is getting the upper hand into global jihad.

TAPPER: But correct me if I'm wrong, there have been times in the past when al Qaeda expressed concern and even disgust with the methods of the Islamic State. Originally al Qaeda, there was that tension back when the Islamic state was known as al Qaeda in Iraq and headed up by Zarqawi, when al-Zawahiri they sent that letter chastising Zarqawi. And then al Qaeda in Iraq became ISIS. And even recently, al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, I believe, or maybe it was poor al Qaeda in Pakistan and Afghanistan that said that they disagreed with the methods of is because of their methods of brutal slaughtering Muslims in public places, right?

LAURENT: Let's put it this way. Al Qaeda disagrees on the methods for the public show. But actually al Qaeda is using exactly the same methods. The al Qaeda branch in Syria, for example, never hesitated to claim to basically request the help of the Islamic State prior to its own creation for logistics and so on. So, the two have been intertwined in times of need, and after that, they started to become rivals. But we saw that until September this year, for example, in Syria, the two were enemies and this is only the start of the coalition in this country that put them back together.

So, what we can say is al Qaeda on some occasion become open opportunistic and basically blames the methods of ISIS. But Jabhat al-Nusra also practice beheadings, would it be in Syria, would it be in Iraq in earlier times, would it be in Afghanistan.

So, therefore, even nowadays you speak about Yemen, once ISIS started to basically gain the upper hand this summer, we saw al Qaeda and Yemen capturing 12 soldiers, 14, I'm not sure and beheading them exactly the same way that ISIS did in front of the camera. The footage was shot and put on YouTube.

So, therefore, we cannot give credibility to al Qaeda when it is saying that ISIS is too brutal. This is purely rhetoric and this is among the competing interests of the two.

TAPPER: A fair point. And, yet, the fact that we have now evidence that the terrorist attack in France in the last week was a result of working together, cooperation between two terrorists who were allegiance to al Qaeda and at least one who had allegiance to ISIS is chilling and rather disturbing.

Samuel Laurent, counter-terrorism expert, thank you so much for your time. We'll come back to you. We appreciate your time.

We're going to take a quick break. But as can you hear from me in the Place de la Republique in Paris, France, the crowd is getting excited about this unity rally. People are chanting. They're very happy. Spirits are high.

We'll have much more on this unity rally come willing forward right after this break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back. I'm Jake Tapper in Paris, France with, our continuing coverage of the unity rally here in Paris. I'm standing at the Place de la Republique.

You're looking at live pictures right now at the palace. You see French President Francois Hollande and other world leaders. You see David Cameron, British prime minister.

Eric Holder, there to Hollande's right, behind him. He is one of taller guys there. And other world leaders are coming, are expected ranging from Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, to Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas. They're now going inside. German Chancellor Angela Merkel, other leaders from Jordan and Turkey are expected.

It is a day unity, although obviously it is also a day of mourning here in France as well with 17 innocent individuals having been brutally slaughtered by terrorists in the last few days. Obviously, it started on Wednesday with the murder by terrorists of 12 individuals, one policeman, one security officer, ten others in the offices of the French magazine "Charlie Hebdo".

On Thursday, a policewoman, a French police woman was murdered in cold blood by one of these terrorists. And then on Friday that, same terrorists, Amedy Coulibaly took a hostage at a kosher supermarket here in Paris, killed four innocent people, other hostages managed to escape. Coulibaly was ultimately killed by police as they stormed the supermarket and rescued the others.

Let's bring right now, Suzan Johnson Cook. She is former U.S. ambassador on International Religious Freedom.

Ambassador Johnson Cook, thank you so much for joining us.

This is a day of unity, of solidarity and people here at the Place de la Republique seem optimistic and happy. It is also, I would think, for someone like yourself who focuses on religious freedom, this is a disturbing and worrisome time in Europe.

SUZAN JOHNSON COOK, FORMER U.S. AMB. AT LEARGE FOR INTL. RELIGIOUS FREEDOM: It really is a disturbing time. I think first of all, our condolences go out to all of the families and to France as a whole.

But it's very disturbing. Religious freedom ambassador, we saw so many issues and evidence of extremism and, you know, we found that there was religious freedom, there was less extremism. What we're seeing is, you know, I was also on the front lines of 9/11. What I can say is that life will never be the same for France because things will change.

But what is very enlightening is they're bringing light to a very dark situation.

And, you know, Martin Luther King who we're celebrating the Selma, 50 years of Selma march, said, you know, darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that.

What they're seeing is exceptional members of light coming to a very dark situation. So, I'm glad that people are marching not just in France but here in America and all around world displaying unity, because what we have to do is cross ethnic racial lines because terrorism affects all of us. And so, it's very important.

Congregations today, you know, in the Christian faith, we'll be praying all over the world for France. And so, it is our prayer that all things will work together for good.

TAPPER: Yes. People are hearing the chants behind me and wondering what is being said, it's a lot of who are you? Charlie. Who you are? Charlie. And Charlie, liberty.

Charlie, obviously, the name of the magazine, "Charlie Hebdo" whose members were slaughtered by terrorists on Wednesday. It is a chilling time.

You talked about 9/11. There was a headline on Friday I believe in "Le Monde" newspaper in France that referred to the (SPEAKING FRENCH), meaning this is France's 9/11. I think a lot of people in the United States don't understand that because 17 people while horrific is not 3,000.

But explain if you would, Madam Ambassador, why this is seen in France as their 9/11? They seem to see the date of January 7th whether this all started happening as a demarcation line. Things are now different than they were before. If you could, explain.

COOK: Yes, because they hadn't had to deal with this terrorist attack as we did, we were not prepared for it to happen here. And so, when I was in Nigeria, Abuja also right after the bombings a few years ago, they talked about with Boko Haram, that was their 9/11. It means life is not the same. We have to deal with counter-terrorism.

But we have the best security leaders in the world and they are partnering with France to let them know that we're with them, to teach them the lessons that we learned in terms of that. Life will not be the same. We will remember the day after 9/11 that we were able to go back to a new normalcy -- you know, airport security change, the way that we live changed, going in and out of public structures. And France is going to have to deal with that as well because post today, they're going to have to live a different way.

But what was exceptional was the force of law enforcement and the troops that came out as they were looking for the terrorists. And what France is showing today is we're putting on a full-court press to let the terrorists know we'll not tolerate it. As the mayor said in Paris, says, you know, we'll not tolerate this. We're not going down like this. So, with this being the new 9/11 for them, it means they're going to have to live life a different way than they expected.