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U.S. and Jordan; Atlanta Killing Spree; Verdict in Case Against Bernard Ebbers

Aired March 15, 2005 - 11:59   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Unfolding this hour on NEWS FROM CNN, Brian Nichols back in court in Atlanta, but now shackled, under very heavy guard, and accused of multiple murders. We're live from the Fulton County Courthouse with where the story goes next.
On our CNN "Security Watch," Hazmat teams scrambling right here in the nation's capital in fears of anthrax contamination. We're live on the story here in Washington.

Also, a plague on the health of America. We'll talk to an internationally renowned expert on diabetes and obesity and explore some remedies.

First, some other headlines "Now in the News."

Federal prosecutors announced the arrests of more than a dozen suspects for allegedly trying to smuggle in Russian-made weapons, including shoulder-fired missiles and rocket-propelled grenades. It's a story that broke only within the past hour. We'll have details and a live report from New York. That's coming up in a moment.

And just minutes ago, a police S.W.A.T. team in Miami arrested a robbery suspect. After allegedly entering a home, the suspect fled to a rooftop, where local news stations were able to videotape him being apprehended.

Michael Jackson's accuser expected to return to the stand today in the pop star's child molestation trial. In cross-examination yesterday, Jackson's lawyers tried to poke holes in the teenager's story, suggesting he made up the abuse allegations after he felt Jackson had rejected him and his family.

Among the most popular stories we're watching this hour on CNN.com, why did Mario Vazquez quit the "American Idol" competition? That's the question at the center of a lot of speculation today by fans buzzing over the news. Vazquez will only say that his decision to drop out of the talent search is personal.

For a look at what else is popular on the Web, go to CNN.com.

We begin with a developing story over at the White House. The White House has been seeing a meeting unfolding right now, a meeting between President Bush and Jordan's King Abdullah. A very important meeting given what's happening not only on the Israeli-Palestinian front, not only what's happening in Iraq, but dramatically, what's happening inside Lebanon right now, the effort to get Syrian troops to withdraw from Lebanon.

Jordan's King Abdullah, one of America's closest allies in the Arab world.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's my real pleasure to welcome His Majesty back to the Oval Office.

Your Majesty, every time you come, I really enjoy our conversation.

His Majesty leads a great country in the midst of a part of the world that is changing, changing for the better. And I want to thank His Majesty for his leadership, his understanding about the need for reform, his strong alliance, his clear vision that the world needs to jointly fight terror.

And really appreciate you coming. Welcome.

KING ABDULLAH II OF JORDAN: I'd like to thank the president for welcoming me back in Washington. As always, our discussions have been very fruitful, to try and make the Middle East a better place. We had the chance to discuss the issues of the peace process, how we can move that forward, and obviously our commitment to regional reform. And as always, we've come away with some very good ideas and a decent way of being able to look at the future.

Thank you.

BUSH: We'll answer a couple of questions.

QUESTION: The Lebanese Maronite patriarch you're meeting with tomorrow supports integrating Hezbollah into the political mainstream in his country. Are you willing to consider that kind of role for Hezbollah?

BUSH: Well, first, I look forward to listening to the patriarch. It's going to be a very interesting discussion.

One of the messages I want to say is that my meeting with the patriarch is in no way embracing any religion for Lebanon. It is a way for me to speak to people that believe that Lebanese society ought to be free.

We view Hezbollah as a terrorist organization, and I would hope that Hezbollah would prove that they're not by laying down arms and not threatening peace.

BUSH: One of our concerns the majesty and I discussed is that Hezbollah may try to derail the peace process between Israel and the Palestinians. And it's very important that this peace process go forward for the sake of the Palestinians, for the sake of the Israelis and for the sake of all the people in the region.

But Hezbollah has been declared a terrorist organization by the United States because of terrorist activities in the past.

QUESTION: Mr. President...

BUSH: Yes?

QUESTION: ... the Arab peace initiative in Beirut has defined the ground for resolving the Arab-Israeli conflict, which would be also re-articulated in the coming Algeria summit. What would be the role of the United States in the coming stage to push for with that initiative? And when it comes to reforms, how would the United States help the Arab world, and Jordan in particular, in pushing forward?

BUSH: Well, I appreciate that question.

First, let's start with Jordan.

One of the things we've done is enter into trade negotiations with Jordan so that commerce between our countries can flow better.

It's much easier to reform when there's prosperity, when people are able to see His Majesty's vision about a prosperous future.

And the other way to encourage reform is to herald examples of reformers, people who are willing to put mechanisms in place that respond to the voice of the people. And His Majesty has done that.

We look forward to hearing the results of the conference in Algeria. The foreign minister briefed us on His Majesty's plans and the Jordanian government's plans to have accountability measures in place so as to help measure as to whether or not reforms are going forward.

As for the Palestinian-Israeli issue, the role of the United States will be to continue to urge both parties to make the sacrifices and necessary sacrifice, meaning that Israel must withdraw from the settlements, there must be contiguous territory into which a Palestinian state can grow.

The Palestinians, on their part, must continue to work hard to fight any terrorist activities within the territories. And the Arab world must continue to work together to help Palestine build the necessary structures for democracy.

And I believe progress is being made.

I said in my State of the Union address to our country that I believe peace is within hand and that the United States government would do that which is necessary to help move the process forward.

One of the things we've done is we've recently sent a general, Your Majesty, to the region to help the Palestinians have an effective security force.

BUSH: I believe President Abbas is desirous of developing a state that will live side by side with Israel in peace. And we recognize that the Palestinians need help in consolidating security forces and training security forces to defeat the terrorists who would like to stop the march of freedom. QUESTION: Sir, a new poll says 55 percent of Americans oppose your proposals on Social Security. Do you worry you're losing ground here? Is it a question of getting your message across, or does the plan need to be changed?

BUSH: Well, first in that same survey, I was heartened to see that over two-thirds of Americans recognize we have a problem. And, therefore, the administration and members of both parties in the legislative branch must come together to permanently solve the problem.

My first concern was that members of Congress would think the public didn't think there was a problem. But they do.

And I am mindful that when the public says there's a problem, we've got to work to solve it.

And secondly, I was also heartened to see in that survey that many people believe younger workers ought to be allowed, at their option, to set aside some of their own money in a personal savings account. That principle was embraced by a lot of folks in the survey.

My view about taking on a tough issue is that's what the American people expect the president to do.

And I look forward to working with members of the Congress to develop a plan. I've suggested ideas. I've suggested that we stop this partisan bickering and come together to work for a solution.

And I'm looking forward to finding that solution. That's what the people expect.

And so, no, I'm just getting started on the issue, and I'm enjoying every minute of it. I like to take big issues to the American people. I like to say to the American people, "You sent us here to Washington for a reason, and that is to solve problems."

And we've got a problem, the American people say we've got a problem, and they're going to expect people to come to the table and they're not going to like it when they see people not coming to the table.

QUESTION: May I ask the king a question? May I ask the king a question, please?

BUSH: It's up to His Majesty. He's a generous guy, unlike me.

(LAUGHTER)

QUESTION: Your Majesty, since the new Palestinian leadership took over, what's your personal vision for the region at this time?

ABDULLAH: Well, I'm, again, very supportive of President Abbas. I think he's a man of his word. And I think that you'll see him give 110 percent to deal with the security issues and to push the peace process forward. I truly believe that in this man Prime Minister Sharon has a partner for peace, and I'm very optimistic that the two leaders that the process will go forward and go forward positively.

BUSH: Thank you. Good job.

BLITZER: President Bush and Jordan's King Abdullah only a few moments ago in the Oval Office, meeting. The president meeting with one of America's closest allies in the Arab world. And there was news there in what the President said, seemingly to suggest that he was leaving the door open somewhat to the possibility of Hezbollah, a group the U.S. considers to be a terrorist organization in Lebanon, the possibility of Hezbollah eventually becoming part of the political process.

Let's bring in our White House correspondent, Suzanne Malveaux. She's listening and watching all of this, together with all of us.

Suzanne, the president made it clear the U.S. government, he considers Hezbollah and Lebanon to be a terrorist organization. But he also suggested, and let me read to you specifically what he said, "I would hope that Hezbollah would prove they are not, by laying down arms and not threatening peace."

Are we sensing a potential shift in U.S. policy towards Hezbollah?

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, I wouldn't actually take it that far. We have heard similar language from senior administration officials over the last couple of days.

Really, the U.S. is in a very difficult position here. As you know, on the one hand, the administration wants to put forward a very tough message to Syria saying, of course, that they have to withdraw all of their troops, that nothing less than that will be acceptable. And at the same time, that they also consider Hezbollah to be a terrorist organization.

But while many Lebanese, as well as Syrians inside of Lebanon, feel that Hezbollah is a legitimate political organization, and that may be an organization that is there to stay even if you have the kind of democratically-elected government that the United States is hoping for in Lebanon, once those Syrian troops withdraw, that is a reality that the Bush administration realizes. It's one of the reasons why you hear some of that language changing there, is that is something that they may have to contend with.

But certainly we're not going to hear them change when it comes to their position. They do believe that Hezbollah is dangerous and it is still a terrorist organization. They hope, at least by having those Syrian forces leave, that they can weaken that organization, at least the military branch -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Suzanne Malveaux at the White House with that. Suzanne, thank you very much. Let's move on to some other news we're following here in Washington and around the nation and around the world. We're watching very closely the case of the accused killer Brian Nichols. He was bound and shackled this morning when he appeared before a judge in Atlanta for the first time since Friday, the day of those deadly attacks against the justice system.

With the story, joining us now live from Atlanta, CNN's Kimberly Osias. She's outside the Fulton County Jail.

What happened today, Kimberly?

KIMBERLY OSIAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, I'll tell you, quite a different feel and a different day than Friday, when all those grisly shootings took place at the Fulton County Courthouse. Today, just a little while ago, 33-year-old Brian Nichols came down seven floors and appeared in front of a magistrate judge. This time not in his own clothes and not unfettered.

He was bound tightly at the waist and shackled also at the feet as well. This time clad in Fulton County Jail garb, all swathed in blue. Flashbulbs were blazing as he stood in front of the magistrate judge, Frank Cox, and he listened to his rights being read and he listened to the charges against him.

Now, interestingly, Wolf, these are the original rape charges, charges that he will never, in fact, be prosecuted on, rape and aggravated sodomy, and also false imprisonment charges. The reason that prosecutors are doing this is really to establish a really strong murder case against Mr. Nichols, to really essentially buy time and keep him firmly behind lock and key.

For their part, the defense came out earlier, Mr. Nichols' defense, fairly tight-lipped, but did speak briefly to the media.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS ADAMS, BRIAN NICHOLS' ATTORNEY: Brian has asked that we represent him, and we've agreed to do so. At this time we're not going to make any further public statements.

This is a time of grief and mourning for the courthouse community, for all the victims. We're going to respect that.

There will be plenty of time for us later to lay out our legal arguments and motions, and to examine the evidence and to search for understanding in this case. But it's not the time now, and I appreciate you all respecting that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

OSIAS: The whole hearing lasted about 10 minutes. For his part, Mr. Nichols seemed somewhat emotionless.

Now, while we are here at the Fulton County Jail, at the same time a memorial service, a public memorial service is about to get under way for the victims. Of course we are speaking about superior court Judge Rowland Barnes, his court reporter, Julie Ann Brandau, Sergeant Hoyt Teasley, and also the U.S. Customs and Immigrations officer, David Wilhelm -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Are there lots of second-guessing going on? Is there lots of second-guessing going on in Atlanta right now in the way law enforcement dealt with the problem immediately as it erupted on Friday?

OSIAS: Certainly that has been subject of much discussion in legal circles, as well as just regular people. And even the Atlanta police chief himself admitted that they were going to carefully critique the situation, look at the rights and the wrongs and try to rectify it.

BLITZER: Kimberly Osias reporting for us. Kimberly, thank you very much. We'll stay on top of this story as well.

There's a development unfolding in New York City right now involving the trial of Bernard Ebbers. Susan Lisovicz standing by in New York.

What do we know, Susan?

SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, what we do know is that a verdict was reached after eight days of deliberation. Bernie Ebbers, the former CEO, the founder basically of WorldCom, one of the largest telecom companies in the United States that ended up not only failing, but resulting in the largest corporate bankruptcy in U.S. history, we -- this is one of the most widely-anticipated trials, and now there is a verdict.

There are nine charges against Bernie Ebbers. They involved conspiracy, securities fraud and false filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission from the years between 2000 and 2002.

Bernie Ebbers is 63 years old. If convicted, and if he receives the maximum on all counts, he could go to prison for the rest of his life, 85 years, in fact -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Susan, do we know how long it's going to take for the jury actually to announce the verdict?

LISOVICZ: Well, I would imagine after eight days, the judge pretty much just wants to make sure that all parties are assembled. Mr. Ebbers has been there. Members of his family have been there. Counsel on both sides obviously. And I would imagine it could come very, very shortly.

BLITZER: Susan Lisovicz, we'll be watching that together with you. Thanks, Susan, very much.

Once again, a verdict has been reached in the Bernard Ebbers WorldCom trial. We'll report on that verdict as soon as we get it.

Now more on a story we reported at the top of this broadcast, the federal operation against a purported racket dealing in Russian-style military hardware. Standing by live with the story in New York, CNN's Mary Snow. A dramatic announcement earlier today from the U.S. attorney in New York.

Mary, update our viewers. What happened?

MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, U.S. attorney David Kelley announced that 18 people have been charged with attempting to smuggle weapons into the United States. This is the result of a yearlong investigation, mostly done through wiretaps.

Now, what you're going to see here are pictures of weapons, shoulder-fired surface-to-air missiles, rocket-propelled grenades. The U.S. attorney stresses that these were only in the discussion stages, that these weapons did not make it into the U.S.

These pictures were taken from a Web site, a Russian Web site. The password was given to a confidential informant working on this case. However, he did say that eight machineguns did enter the United States.

Now, U.S. Attorney David Kelley says that he believes the potential pipeline was disruptive. A potential pipeline coming out of eastern Europe. However, it is unclear, although he says it is suspected that these weapons could have wound up in the hands of terrorists, the end user is unclear.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID KELLEY, U.S. ATTORNEY: It appears that the defendants were planning to obtain that weaponry through contacts they had developed in eastern European military circles. We're now working with our counterparts overseas to secure the weapons and to bring to justice conspirators who may be abroad.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SNOW: Now, the suspects were from various nationalities. The alleged ring leader is Armenian, we're told. Some of the other suspects from Georgia and Russia. The FBI, though, stating that there was no clear ties to any organized group.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDY ARENA, FBI: These defendants may not have been terrorists themselves, but they've shown a transparent willingness to do anything with anybody so long as it generates income for their organization.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SNOW: Now, the suspects are due to be arraigned this afternoon. The two alleged ringleaders, the penalty for the charges that have been brought against them are up to 30 years in prison -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Mary, the U.S. attorney, David Kelley, also used words that were very ominous. When I heard him talk about enriched uranium and the New York subway system, my ears, of course, perked up. I'm sure yours and our viewers' did, as well. But he then elaborated on what was going on, on that front.

SNOW: Yes. And he was very careful to stress, Wolf, that in the yearlong investigation, at one point in the discussions between one of the suspects and the confidential informant, that there had been a reference to enriched uranium, and potentially, use on a subway.

He said, though, in the conversations the rest of the year, which included 15,000 conversations, there was never another reference made again, and that this claim was made by one individual, and according to his knowledge was not discussed with the other suspects. And he really stressed that this was pinpointed to this one suspect that was mentioned once in a conversation.

BLITZER: All right. And Mary's going to have a lot more on this story coming up 5:00 p.m. Eastern on "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS." Mary Snow reporting from New York. Thanks very much.

Let's move on to a Hazmat scare involving the Department of Defense right here in Washington. One day later, nearly 300 workers are awaiting the results of definitive tests for potential exposure to anthrax. The initial tests came back negative.

But working the story for us, our Pentagon correspondent, Barbara Starr.

It's a confusing, complicated, potentially very significant story, Barbara. What do we know exactly?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Not much definitively at this point, Wolf. What we can tell you is the Department of Homeland Security is now taking the lead in this entire matter. If and when they do get those final laboratory results back, it may well be the Department of Homeland Security, not the Pentagon, that has a news conference here in Washington to announce the final disposition of this matter.

Let's review where it stands now.

Several facilities, several federal postal mail facilities are now closed across Washington. One of them is a remote delivery facility right here next to the Pentagon. That is where irradiated mail comes in, is screened before it comes in to the building.

It was last Thursday that an air sample from this building tested positive for the possibility of anthrax. What we now know is there have been 60 additional tests, according to Pentagon officials. None of them have come back positive. But they are still awaiting final word.

Across Washington, other facilities closed down as a precaution, include three buildings here in northern Virginia, a few miles from the Pentagon, that also handle federal mail, as well as a postal facility in downtown Washington. The mayor of Washington spoke about the caution being taken and why that facility was shut down. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think the level of concern now is just that we're trying to find out more about this situation. We don't know the extent of where this anthrax may have come from. But the extent the district could have been involved, we think this is the proper first steps.

I think it's a prudent course of action. I don't think there's cause for alarm or panic or undue worry. But we are following the test results, and we're in close contact with people at the Department of Defense, Health and Human Services and the CDC, who are all involved in managing this response.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STARR: Wolf, let me correct one thing for our viewers who are so familiar with Washington, D.C. It was Mayor Tony Williams standing behind that official. That is the director of public health here in Washington, D.C.

So the testing goes on. They hope to have final results perhaps as soon as this afternoon. But all of these facilities shut down, all of the workers being tested, being offered the possibility of three days of antibiotics, being given public health information, officials say, in an abundance of caution. But so far they say they have no reason yet to believe there is a direct threat to public health.

BLITZER: Barbara Starr at the Pentagon. Thank you very much.

We'll take a quick break. Much more news right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: We understand the verdict in the Bernard Ebbers trial has just been announced. Susan Lisovicz is in New York.

What did he -- what's the news, Susan?

LISOVICZ: The news is very bad for Bernie Ebbers, Wolf. Bernie Ebbers has been found guilty on all counts, nine counts against him. Guilty of conspiracy, guilty of securities fraud. And then seven counts, guilty of false filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission.

Bernie Ebbers was the former CEO of WorldCom, which collapsed and resulted in the largest bankruptcy in U.S. history. $30 billion in debt, the $11 billion accounting error is the largest accounting fraud in U.S. history.

So Bernie Ebbers has suffered, of course, a terrible fate. But so have millions of investors who invested in WorldCom. And as anyone knows, when you -- when a company goes through bankruptcy, the shareholders are the last in a long line of creditors.

Maximum sentencing guidelines found guilty on all counts, Bernie Ebbers could go to prison for 85 years. Sentencing guidelines, of course, could reduce that substantially -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Sixty-three years old right now, Bernard Ebbers. Let's review some of the facts involving WorldCom.

WorldCom's 2002 bankruptcy, Susan, as you know, was the largest ever in U.S. history. WorldCom's $11 billion so-called accounting error the largest accounting fraud in U.S. corporate history. WorldCom is now known as MCI. It's the second largest long distance and data services provider in the U.S.

The jury began its deliberations on March 4. The trial actually began on January 19. In the scheme of things, Susan, this went down pretty quickly.

LISOVICZ: It went down pretty quickly. And it was interesting, Wolf, because there was no hard evidence against Bernie Ebbers.

Bernie Ebbers portrayed himself as a phys-ed major, a guy who started off a very sort of modest life. He was born in Canada, worked as a milkman in 30 -- in minus 0 weather for a time after high school.

He ended up going to a southern Christian college in Mississippi and worked in a variety of jobs. And started this long distance company as part of the deregulation of AT&T in 1983 through a series of very aggressive acquisitions over the next two decades. Fifteen years, I'd say.

It became one of the big players in telecom. But it collapsed under a mountain of debt.

Bernie Ebbers said he really knew he had nothing to do with it. It was the CFO, the chief financial officer, Scott Sullivan, who said, no, he was in on it, and his personal wealth was tied to the stock, and that he, in fact, pressured him to cook the books. Scott Sullivan turned state witness, was the star witness against Bernie Ebbers. He is hoping for a reduced sentence.

The jury coming in against Bernie Ebbers, all nine counts -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Well, legally, if he's convicted on all nine counts, potentially faces what, 85 years in prison given the fact that he's been convicted on all counts? How much leeway is there in terms of how many years he'll actually wind up going into prison given federal prison sentencing guidelines?

LISOVICZ: Wolf, I really cannot speak on in terms of what the judge could give him on legal guidelines. What I can tell you is this, prior to this Bernie Ebbers had a spotless life. In fact, a lot of people in Clinton, Mississippi, say he is a good man.

He has spoken of his relationship with the lord, that during his college years, that while he was there on a basketball scholarship, he discovered Jesus Christ. And it was those, that part, his spiritual life, that really was a turning point for him. He's never been in trouble with the law. He was sort of a late bloomer, did a variety of jobs, as I mentioned. Everything from delivering milk in the pre-dawn hours, to working as a school teacher for a period of time, owned a number of Best Western hotels.

He really got his start, made a real impact in the telecom business in the '80s and '90s. But what brought him great success also, of course, brought him terrible, terrible failure. And now the likelihood of an extensive prison sentence -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Bernard Ebbers, 63 years old, found guilty all nine counts. Susan Lisovicz reporting for us that news. Thank you, Susan, very much.

We're also watching what's happening in Atlanta. Right now there's a memorial service under way. Take a look at this, a memorial service honoring Judge Rowland Barnes, court reporter Julie Ann Brandau, Fulton County Deputy Sergeant Hoyt Teasley, three of the four victims from that shooting spree on Friday.

This is a memorial service happening at the Fulton County Justice Center in downtown Atlanta. We'll watch that. We're watching other news, as well.

We'll take a quick break. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Sudan's humanitarian crisis may be a lot worse than first suspected. The United Nations' top emergency relief official now estimates more than 180,000 people have died in the Darfur region during the last year and a half. That's more than double earlier estimates.

And the figures only include deaths from hunger and disease. Countless others have been killed in a brutal campaign blamed on government-backed militias. An estimated two million people have been driven from their homes in the 2-year-old conflict.

Darfur is only one bleak spot on a continent rich in resources but plagued by serious problems from poverty to AIDS. Now a commission led by the British prime minister, Tony Blair, is calling for some legal change, beginning with the world's wealthiest nations.

Joining us now from London, a member of that commission, the musician, the activist, Sir Bob Geldof.

Sir Bob, thanks very much for joining us. Our viewers, of course, know you from the Band Aid, the Live Aid concerts, all the work that you've done. How did you get involved right now in trying to deal with this issue of poverty, death in Africa?

SIR BOB GELDOF, COMMISSION ON AFRICA: Really, I was there about a year and a half ago, Wolf, and just nothing seemed to be getting any better. All the solutions tended to be piecemeal. Some people were dealing with AIDS, some with poverty, some with the whole slew of catastrophes you've just outlined. And I just thought it wasn't going anywhere. It needed -- we needed to stand back and take a look at the totality of it.

And I asked Tony Blair to set up a commission. He will be president of the G-8 this year, at the same time, president of Europe, at the same time prime minister of Britain. And he did that. And we've come up with this report.

I mean, I have to say that, largely, we took a lead from the Americans with their millennium challenge ideas and took it forward from there. And the root of the problem, of course, is governance and corruption. And from that stems all the other faults that we see inheritance in the continent. And you must deal with that at its root -- root point.

BLITZER: You wrote a provocative piece this week in the British newspaper "The Independent," which I read, and you make the point that it was not all that long ago that we -- that we saw similar problems in Asia, in India, elsewhere in Asia.

GELDOF: Exactly.

BLITZER: Now that continent is doing relatively well. There's a dramatic economic improvement. But Africa is standing still, it's not going backwards. What's the basic difference?

GELDOF: Again you're right. In the last 20 years since Live Aid, Africa is the sole continent in decline. And you have to ask why. Indeed, in the 1960s, average African incomes were twice that of Asians.

And I think that you have far more coherent societies in Africa. The shocks of history were less stressful on Asia. But more to the point, you also had throughout India, for example, you had democracy very early on. And it's been hard to take root in a lot of African states. I mean, whether it was colonialism or the independent states that followed, it was very difficult to get a purchase, very difficult for people to have a say in their governments.

What you're seeing throughout Africa is that change beginning. This sort of great giant is becoming awake from its enforced slumber. And that is what's happening right now.

So Darfur, for example, that you just mentioned. I visited Darfur 20 years ago, and there was still a war going on. But the reason that you can't have peace there at the moment, or one of the reasons, is because China gets six percent of its oil out of Sudan, which is 60 percent of Sudanese production. And they don't want to do anything that upsets the apple cart there, upsets the government there.

Africa, as you again correctly state, is so rich in raw materials, and where you have wealthy countries, with raw materials, you have an awful lot of war.

BLITZER: What's the bigger problem in Africa? And there are so many problems plaguing that continent. Is it AIDS or is it the warfare, the genocide, if you will, that's unfolding not only in the Darfur region, but elsewhere in Africa, as well?

GELDOF: The singular condition is poverty. We have AIDS in our countries, but we can put a halt to its rampage. It doesn't devastate our societies. And we can look after those people who've been afflicted by it. Our medicines are relatively cheap for our societies. And the means of delivering -- the infrastructure exists to look after people.

That is not true in Africa. It devastates the entire continent. It is really unbelievable. I mean, I'll give you a small -- I spent the last three months in Africa, making a television series. And I'll give you a small example.

Where they use pipes to irrigate the fields in some farms, they've stopped working, so the fields are now fallow. And they've stopped working, because the brass pipes that turn on and off the water have been stolen to make coffin handles for the dead. So even in a small little area, you can see how this impacts more horribly.

It is the active, the sexually active people, the young people who are the producers and they, of course, die first, so production stops in an economy. But that leaves very old people orphaned, in effect. And those old orphans now have to look after the young orphans, and there's a general collapse.

But those are only excrescences of poverty. Were they a normal functioning economies with normal government, you would usually be able to deal with a situation like that, which is why we must deal with the central issue of impoverishment.

And the only way out of that is for African countries to be able to trade their way out of poverty, to allow them to get to a base level, a base means, a base level of civilization. And they're not allowed to do that. They have trade rules imposed upon them by the rich part of the world. And there are tariffs and subsidies imposed upon them.

And their debt, which America is dealing with right now today. Secretary Snow has been holding a conference with regard to 100 percent debt relief, which again ties in totally with the Commission for Africa report. Things are beginning to move. But we need to do a lot more.

And again it's a place where nothing will happen without the leadership of the United States. And you have broad support across the Senate. Of course, the Democrats support the issue. But more importantly, the Senate majority leader, right across to Rick Santorum.

BLITZER: Sir Bob Geldof's been nominated for a Nobel Peace Prize three times. Maybe one of these days, Sir Bob, you'll win one. You're doing incredibly important work for people in Africa, around the world.

GELDOF: Wolf, appreciate it.

BLITZER: Unfortunately, we have to leave it there, because we're out of time. But this subject is not going to go away.

GELDOF: No problem.

BLITZER: We'll continue it down the road. Sir Bob Geldof joining us, member of the Commission on Africa...

GELDOF: Thank you.

BLITZER: ... set up by Tony Blair.

When we come back, he's accused of shooting and killing four people, including a judge and a federal agent. But Brian Nichols is still not charged with murder. I'll talk with a former U.S. attorney about the legal plan of attack against the killing spree suspect. That's coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back to NEWS FROM CNN. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington.

If you're just joining us, breaking news only a little while ago here on CNN. Bernard Ebbers, the former CEO of WorldCom, now known as MCI, convicted all nine counts, could face as much as 85 years in prison. Sentencing scheduled now for June 13.

Eight days of deliberations by the jury. The federal jury convicts him all nine counts of helping to mastermind an $11 billion accounting fraud at WorldCom.

We're also watching a memorial service in Atlanta, memorial service honoring three of the four victims of that killing spree down in Atlanta. Right now the service honoring Judge Rowland Barnes, court reporter Julie Ann Brandau, and Fulton County Deputy Sergeant Hoyt Teasley.

These are live pictures -- actually these are taped pictures of the memorial service. We're watching that.

But let's talk about that Atlanta killing spree. A court appearance by the suspect, Brian Nichols, and new details emerging suggesting the suspect's original motives went beyond escaping custody.

Joining us now from Atlanta, the former U.S. attorney in Georgia, Kent Alexander. He's a senior vice president and general counsel at Emery University.

What do you make of the legal proceedings that unfolded about 10 minutes -- we saw him inside a courtroom earlier today? Explain to our viewers what this means, Kent.

KENT ALEXANDER, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY: Sure. Basically, the Fulton County, Georgia, prosecutor, Paul Howard, needed to get Nichols back into state custody. He'd been held in the federal pen.

So this was just an initial appearance on the pending charge, the rape charges, to keep -- keep Nichols in custody. The next step is going to be for the district attorney to decide what kind of charges to file. Obviously, there will be murder charges here. The big decision is whether to seek the death penalty.

BLITZER: Will he stay inside that federal penitentiary in Georgia? Yesterday, he was there for security reasons. It's considered to be more secure than a state facility in Atlanta. What's your sense on that?

ALEXANDER: That will be something worked out between probably the U.S. attorney, Dave Nahmias, and the district attorney, Paul Howard. Generally, if you're being prosecuted on state charges, though, you're held in a state facility. So I would not be surprised to see Nichols brought back to a state facility.

And the bottom line, as long as you keep somebody shackled and under heavy guard and not in a situation that resulted in this tragedy, you can keep somebody -- you can keep everyone safe.

BLITZER: Remind our viewers why, in this brief court appearance today, he was shackled, he was clearly bound up, yet last Friday when he was in that court -- courthouse, he was not shackled.

ALEXANDER: Well, today was just an appearance in front of the judge to hold him, to detain him. The trial was in front of a jury. So the thought was not to have him shackled so the jury wouldn't be prejudiced.

Right now I think this case has gone well beyond prejudice. People are too concerned about safety. So this particular hearing didn't matter a whole lot. He could be shackled. It was just a judge.

But even in front of a jury, when there is a jury trial, I would not be surprised to see him shackled. The shackles might be hidden under a desk or something or table, but it's just a changed situation now, obviously.

BLITZER: And the theory being that if he's there in front of the jury, and he's shackled, it could be prejudicial to his case, because he looks like a criminal if he's shackled. That's the theory behind going in before a jury, at least not being seen as being shackled. Is that right?

ALEXANDER: Yes. That's the theory. And sometimes what they'll do, when this rolls around to trial they could keep somebody's legs shackled, keep his legs, but hidden from the view of the jury. Have the jury leave, and then handcuff him and bring him out.

But whatever situation this man is in, in the future, he will be under heavy guard, and what happened last week will certainly never happen again with him. BLITZER: There's reports in Atlanta today that the -- someone in that courtroom on Friday, in Judge Barnes' courtroom, maybe Judge Barnes himself, did trigger a silent alarm, but for 10 minutes, no one seemed to pay attention to that as the situation unfolded. Is there a silent alarm system that's normal inside those courtrooms?

ALEXANDER: I don't know about the Fulton County Courthouse. But in courtrooms, generally, there is a silent alarm. But, I think that what's going to happen here is there will be a head-to-toe review and revamping of security, not just in that courthouse, but I think that's going to be going on around the country. And it's probably overdue.

And it's just a shame -- it's more than a shame, it's an absolute tragedy this happened.

BLITZER: And I'm being updated now. He has been transferred, Nichols, to the Fulton County Jailhouse from that federal penitentiary in Atlanta. That's where he's going to be staying, at least for the time being.

Kent Alexander, former U.S. attorney in Georgia, thanks very much for joining us. We'll continue to discuss the legal ramifications of this case.

Here's a disturbing statistic: more than one-third of American children born in 2000 will develop diabetes in their lifetime. And there's a direct link between obesity and diabetes. Coming up, I'll speak with a leading authority about the crisis and possible solutions. Francine Kaufman will join us when THE NEWS FROM CNN continues.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Diabetes is clearly on the rise in the United States. And doctors say our sedentary lifestyles and high sugar diets are contributing to this growing epidemic.

Take a look at this statistic. Nearly nine out of 10 people with Type II diabetes are overweight. Type II diabetes is the most common form of the disease.

My next guest explores the link between obesity and diabetes in her powerful new book, "Diabesity." Dr. Francine Kaufman is a former president of the American Diabetes Association and now leads the Center for Diabetes, Endocrinology and Metabolism at Children's Hospital in Los Angeles.

Francine, thanks very much for joining us.

FRANCINE KAUFMAN, AUTHOR, "DIABESITY": Thank you, Wolf.

BLITZER: Congratulations on this important new book. Why is it so important that people right now understand this plague of diabetes?

KAUFMAN: Well, it's important because we can alter your course; you can alter your course if you take action about your lifestyle. And the point of my book is to talk about what the individual can do and then what we have to do collectively.

We have to change communities. We have to change schools. We have to change the workplace and make those places where we can get good food options, good activity options, and improve our health.

BLITZER: How does someone know if they're -- if they're at risk for diabetes?

KAUFMAN: Well, if you've got a family member who had diabetes, you are likely at risk. If you're overweight, you are at risk for diabetes. If you're over 45, you're probably at risk for diabetes. And if you're particularly a member of one of our ethnic racial minorities, African-American, Latino, Native American, Asian-American, then your risk is even higher.

BLITZER: And yow do you definitively determine if you do have diabetes?

KAUFMAN: The diagnoses of diabetes is made by a blood test. It's your blood sugar. If you hit a number above 126 when you're fasting, or about 200 any other time, you likely have diabetes. If you don't have symptoms, though, blood tests need to be repeated. If they're still that high, you are diagnosed with diabetes.

BLITZER: I interviewed last week Governor Mike Huckabee of Arkansas.

KAUFMAN: Right.

BLITZER: He lost 100 pounds plus. He was at risk. In fact they had diagnosed him with pre-diabetes or actual diabetes. But when he lost all that weight, it all went away. Is that a normal circumstance for diabetes? Simply to go away if you loses weight?

KAUFMAN: It absolutely can happen. I'm here at an NIH study right now, looking at how we can treat children with Type II diabetes. At the very onset if we can get them a good, healthy lifestyle, they may be able to eventually, at some point, be treated with just one medication or no medications.

And the same is true for adults. So we have to really invigorate people to have a healthy lifestyle.

BLITZER: And so the most important thing is to exercise and lose the weight if you're overweight, is that right?

KAUFMAN: And the good news is, Wolf, you don't have to lose 100 pounds. It's great that the governor did, but not everybody has to lose it. It's about seven to 10 percent of your body weight. Walking 30 minutes a day, five times a week, looks like we can reduce people progressing to diabetes by 60 percent.

BLITZER: But there are some people who are not overweight and do work out, and they still come up -- come down with diabetes.

KAUFMAN: Well, you can get Type II diabetes, some people get it if they're not overweight. But then there's the other form of diabetes, Type I which most often does occur in children and in people of normal weight.

BLITZER: What about children specifically? What do parents need to know right now, the information they can get in your book "Diabesity"? What do parents need to know in dealing with this problem?

KAUFMAN: Well, we need to look at the bad habits, so drinking sweetened beverages, those should be diminished or eliminated if possible.

BLITZER: What if you drink diet?

KAUFMAN: Well, diet sodas have a lot of chemicals. They're probably not the best choice. A lot of them have caffeine. That's not good for children.

BLITZER: What should parents be giving their children to drink?

KAUFMAN: Water.

BLITZER: Really? What about juices?

KAUFMAN: Well, juice in moderation. Juice is filled with calories. We don't actually need to drink juice. It would be better to eat a piece of fruit. Water...

BLITZER: Everybody seems to think orange juice, for example, apple juice, grape juice, those juices are great for kids.

KAUFMAN: Well, they're not really great for kids. I mean, a glass a day perhaps, but they don't need more. We'd rather see them eat an orange or an apple that has the fiber and has all the micronutrients, rather than having this concentrated juice, which is mainly sugar.

BLITZER: So the old notion that you simply have too much sugar it's going to put you at risk for diabetes.

KAUFMAN: Too much sugar, too many calories, too much fat, too much saturated fat and not enough activity. I mean, it's really a balance, and we want to get people back in balance.

BLITZER: And even though you can treat diabetes, this is a potentially awful disease that can be deadly.

KAUFMAN: Like I illustrate that in my book. I tell the stories of the people I've met who have diabetes, the patients I've cared for, the people I've met through the American Diabetes Association and at meetings around the world, and their stories are devastating. They -- they lose a lot of their function, and they can lose their life as a result of this disease.

People used to talk about just a touch of the sugar. There is nothing farther from the truth. This is a devastating disease. We need to prevent it.

BLITZER: And people can learn a great deal by reading your book "Diabesity." Francine Kaufman, congratulations on the new book.

KAUFMAN: Thank you.

BLITZER: You're doing very important work. Thanks for joining us.

KAUFMAN: Thanks, Wolf.

BLITZER: I'll be back later today, every week day 5 p.m. Eastern for "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS." Weapons for sale: arrests this week in New York shedding some light on the problem of keeping arms out of the hands of suspected terrorists. I'll talk live with New York City Police Commissioner Ray Kelly about these arrests. That's coming up, 5 p.m. Eastern later today.

Until then, thanks very much for watching NEWS FROM CNN. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. LIVE FROM with Kyra Phillips and Tony Harris, that team standing by to pick up our coverage right at the top of the hour.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired March 15, 2005 - 11:59   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Unfolding this hour on NEWS FROM CNN, Brian Nichols back in court in Atlanta, but now shackled, under very heavy guard, and accused of multiple murders. We're live from the Fulton County Courthouse with where the story goes next.
On our CNN "Security Watch," Hazmat teams scrambling right here in the nation's capital in fears of anthrax contamination. We're live on the story here in Washington.

Also, a plague on the health of America. We'll talk to an internationally renowned expert on diabetes and obesity and explore some remedies.

First, some other headlines "Now in the News."

Federal prosecutors announced the arrests of more than a dozen suspects for allegedly trying to smuggle in Russian-made weapons, including shoulder-fired missiles and rocket-propelled grenades. It's a story that broke only within the past hour. We'll have details and a live report from New York. That's coming up in a moment.

And just minutes ago, a police S.W.A.T. team in Miami arrested a robbery suspect. After allegedly entering a home, the suspect fled to a rooftop, where local news stations were able to videotape him being apprehended.

Michael Jackson's accuser expected to return to the stand today in the pop star's child molestation trial. In cross-examination yesterday, Jackson's lawyers tried to poke holes in the teenager's story, suggesting he made up the abuse allegations after he felt Jackson had rejected him and his family.

Among the most popular stories we're watching this hour on CNN.com, why did Mario Vazquez quit the "American Idol" competition? That's the question at the center of a lot of speculation today by fans buzzing over the news. Vazquez will only say that his decision to drop out of the talent search is personal.

For a look at what else is popular on the Web, go to CNN.com.

We begin with a developing story over at the White House. The White House has been seeing a meeting unfolding right now, a meeting between President Bush and Jordan's King Abdullah. A very important meeting given what's happening not only on the Israeli-Palestinian front, not only what's happening in Iraq, but dramatically, what's happening inside Lebanon right now, the effort to get Syrian troops to withdraw from Lebanon.

Jordan's King Abdullah, one of America's closest allies in the Arab world.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's my real pleasure to welcome His Majesty back to the Oval Office.

Your Majesty, every time you come, I really enjoy our conversation.

His Majesty leads a great country in the midst of a part of the world that is changing, changing for the better. And I want to thank His Majesty for his leadership, his understanding about the need for reform, his strong alliance, his clear vision that the world needs to jointly fight terror.

And really appreciate you coming. Welcome.

KING ABDULLAH II OF JORDAN: I'd like to thank the president for welcoming me back in Washington. As always, our discussions have been very fruitful, to try and make the Middle East a better place. We had the chance to discuss the issues of the peace process, how we can move that forward, and obviously our commitment to regional reform. And as always, we've come away with some very good ideas and a decent way of being able to look at the future.

Thank you.

BUSH: We'll answer a couple of questions.

QUESTION: The Lebanese Maronite patriarch you're meeting with tomorrow supports integrating Hezbollah into the political mainstream in his country. Are you willing to consider that kind of role for Hezbollah?

BUSH: Well, first, I look forward to listening to the patriarch. It's going to be a very interesting discussion.

One of the messages I want to say is that my meeting with the patriarch is in no way embracing any religion for Lebanon. It is a way for me to speak to people that believe that Lebanese society ought to be free.

We view Hezbollah as a terrorist organization, and I would hope that Hezbollah would prove that they're not by laying down arms and not threatening peace.

BUSH: One of our concerns the majesty and I discussed is that Hezbollah may try to derail the peace process between Israel and the Palestinians. And it's very important that this peace process go forward for the sake of the Palestinians, for the sake of the Israelis and for the sake of all the people in the region.

But Hezbollah has been declared a terrorist organization by the United States because of terrorist activities in the past.

QUESTION: Mr. President...

BUSH: Yes?

QUESTION: ... the Arab peace initiative in Beirut has defined the ground for resolving the Arab-Israeli conflict, which would be also re-articulated in the coming Algeria summit. What would be the role of the United States in the coming stage to push for with that initiative? And when it comes to reforms, how would the United States help the Arab world, and Jordan in particular, in pushing forward?

BUSH: Well, I appreciate that question.

First, let's start with Jordan.

One of the things we've done is enter into trade negotiations with Jordan so that commerce between our countries can flow better.

It's much easier to reform when there's prosperity, when people are able to see His Majesty's vision about a prosperous future.

And the other way to encourage reform is to herald examples of reformers, people who are willing to put mechanisms in place that respond to the voice of the people. And His Majesty has done that.

We look forward to hearing the results of the conference in Algeria. The foreign minister briefed us on His Majesty's plans and the Jordanian government's plans to have accountability measures in place so as to help measure as to whether or not reforms are going forward.

As for the Palestinian-Israeli issue, the role of the United States will be to continue to urge both parties to make the sacrifices and necessary sacrifice, meaning that Israel must withdraw from the settlements, there must be contiguous territory into which a Palestinian state can grow.

The Palestinians, on their part, must continue to work hard to fight any terrorist activities within the territories. And the Arab world must continue to work together to help Palestine build the necessary structures for democracy.

And I believe progress is being made.

I said in my State of the Union address to our country that I believe peace is within hand and that the United States government would do that which is necessary to help move the process forward.

One of the things we've done is we've recently sent a general, Your Majesty, to the region to help the Palestinians have an effective security force.

BUSH: I believe President Abbas is desirous of developing a state that will live side by side with Israel in peace. And we recognize that the Palestinians need help in consolidating security forces and training security forces to defeat the terrorists who would like to stop the march of freedom. QUESTION: Sir, a new poll says 55 percent of Americans oppose your proposals on Social Security. Do you worry you're losing ground here? Is it a question of getting your message across, or does the plan need to be changed?

BUSH: Well, first in that same survey, I was heartened to see that over two-thirds of Americans recognize we have a problem. And, therefore, the administration and members of both parties in the legislative branch must come together to permanently solve the problem.

My first concern was that members of Congress would think the public didn't think there was a problem. But they do.

And I am mindful that when the public says there's a problem, we've got to work to solve it.

And secondly, I was also heartened to see in that survey that many people believe younger workers ought to be allowed, at their option, to set aside some of their own money in a personal savings account. That principle was embraced by a lot of folks in the survey.

My view about taking on a tough issue is that's what the American people expect the president to do.

And I look forward to working with members of the Congress to develop a plan. I've suggested ideas. I've suggested that we stop this partisan bickering and come together to work for a solution.

And I'm looking forward to finding that solution. That's what the people expect.

And so, no, I'm just getting started on the issue, and I'm enjoying every minute of it. I like to take big issues to the American people. I like to say to the American people, "You sent us here to Washington for a reason, and that is to solve problems."

And we've got a problem, the American people say we've got a problem, and they're going to expect people to come to the table and they're not going to like it when they see people not coming to the table.

QUESTION: May I ask the king a question? May I ask the king a question, please?

BUSH: It's up to His Majesty. He's a generous guy, unlike me.

(LAUGHTER)

QUESTION: Your Majesty, since the new Palestinian leadership took over, what's your personal vision for the region at this time?

ABDULLAH: Well, I'm, again, very supportive of President Abbas. I think he's a man of his word. And I think that you'll see him give 110 percent to deal with the security issues and to push the peace process forward. I truly believe that in this man Prime Minister Sharon has a partner for peace, and I'm very optimistic that the two leaders that the process will go forward and go forward positively.

BUSH: Thank you. Good job.

BLITZER: President Bush and Jordan's King Abdullah only a few moments ago in the Oval Office, meeting. The president meeting with one of America's closest allies in the Arab world. And there was news there in what the President said, seemingly to suggest that he was leaving the door open somewhat to the possibility of Hezbollah, a group the U.S. considers to be a terrorist organization in Lebanon, the possibility of Hezbollah eventually becoming part of the political process.

Let's bring in our White House correspondent, Suzanne Malveaux. She's listening and watching all of this, together with all of us.

Suzanne, the president made it clear the U.S. government, he considers Hezbollah and Lebanon to be a terrorist organization. But he also suggested, and let me read to you specifically what he said, "I would hope that Hezbollah would prove they are not, by laying down arms and not threatening peace."

Are we sensing a potential shift in U.S. policy towards Hezbollah?

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, I wouldn't actually take it that far. We have heard similar language from senior administration officials over the last couple of days.

Really, the U.S. is in a very difficult position here. As you know, on the one hand, the administration wants to put forward a very tough message to Syria saying, of course, that they have to withdraw all of their troops, that nothing less than that will be acceptable. And at the same time, that they also consider Hezbollah to be a terrorist organization.

But while many Lebanese, as well as Syrians inside of Lebanon, feel that Hezbollah is a legitimate political organization, and that may be an organization that is there to stay even if you have the kind of democratically-elected government that the United States is hoping for in Lebanon, once those Syrian troops withdraw, that is a reality that the Bush administration realizes. It's one of the reasons why you hear some of that language changing there, is that is something that they may have to contend with.

But certainly we're not going to hear them change when it comes to their position. They do believe that Hezbollah is dangerous and it is still a terrorist organization. They hope, at least by having those Syrian forces leave, that they can weaken that organization, at least the military branch -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Suzanne Malveaux at the White House with that. Suzanne, thank you very much. Let's move on to some other news we're following here in Washington and around the nation and around the world. We're watching very closely the case of the accused killer Brian Nichols. He was bound and shackled this morning when he appeared before a judge in Atlanta for the first time since Friday, the day of those deadly attacks against the justice system.

With the story, joining us now live from Atlanta, CNN's Kimberly Osias. She's outside the Fulton County Jail.

What happened today, Kimberly?

KIMBERLY OSIAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, I'll tell you, quite a different feel and a different day than Friday, when all those grisly shootings took place at the Fulton County Courthouse. Today, just a little while ago, 33-year-old Brian Nichols came down seven floors and appeared in front of a magistrate judge. This time not in his own clothes and not unfettered.

He was bound tightly at the waist and shackled also at the feet as well. This time clad in Fulton County Jail garb, all swathed in blue. Flashbulbs were blazing as he stood in front of the magistrate judge, Frank Cox, and he listened to his rights being read and he listened to the charges against him.

Now, interestingly, Wolf, these are the original rape charges, charges that he will never, in fact, be prosecuted on, rape and aggravated sodomy, and also false imprisonment charges. The reason that prosecutors are doing this is really to establish a really strong murder case against Mr. Nichols, to really essentially buy time and keep him firmly behind lock and key.

For their part, the defense came out earlier, Mr. Nichols' defense, fairly tight-lipped, but did speak briefly to the media.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS ADAMS, BRIAN NICHOLS' ATTORNEY: Brian has asked that we represent him, and we've agreed to do so. At this time we're not going to make any further public statements.

This is a time of grief and mourning for the courthouse community, for all the victims. We're going to respect that.

There will be plenty of time for us later to lay out our legal arguments and motions, and to examine the evidence and to search for understanding in this case. But it's not the time now, and I appreciate you all respecting that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

OSIAS: The whole hearing lasted about 10 minutes. For his part, Mr. Nichols seemed somewhat emotionless.

Now, while we are here at the Fulton County Jail, at the same time a memorial service, a public memorial service is about to get under way for the victims. Of course we are speaking about superior court Judge Rowland Barnes, his court reporter, Julie Ann Brandau, Sergeant Hoyt Teasley, and also the U.S. Customs and Immigrations officer, David Wilhelm -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Are there lots of second-guessing going on? Is there lots of second-guessing going on in Atlanta right now in the way law enforcement dealt with the problem immediately as it erupted on Friday?

OSIAS: Certainly that has been subject of much discussion in legal circles, as well as just regular people. And even the Atlanta police chief himself admitted that they were going to carefully critique the situation, look at the rights and the wrongs and try to rectify it.

BLITZER: Kimberly Osias reporting for us. Kimberly, thank you very much. We'll stay on top of this story as well.

There's a development unfolding in New York City right now involving the trial of Bernard Ebbers. Susan Lisovicz standing by in New York.

What do we know, Susan?

SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, what we do know is that a verdict was reached after eight days of deliberation. Bernie Ebbers, the former CEO, the founder basically of WorldCom, one of the largest telecom companies in the United States that ended up not only failing, but resulting in the largest corporate bankruptcy in U.S. history, we -- this is one of the most widely-anticipated trials, and now there is a verdict.

There are nine charges against Bernie Ebbers. They involved conspiracy, securities fraud and false filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission from the years between 2000 and 2002.

Bernie Ebbers is 63 years old. If convicted, and if he receives the maximum on all counts, he could go to prison for the rest of his life, 85 years, in fact -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Susan, do we know how long it's going to take for the jury actually to announce the verdict?

LISOVICZ: Well, I would imagine after eight days, the judge pretty much just wants to make sure that all parties are assembled. Mr. Ebbers has been there. Members of his family have been there. Counsel on both sides obviously. And I would imagine it could come very, very shortly.

BLITZER: Susan Lisovicz, we'll be watching that together with you. Thanks, Susan, very much.

Once again, a verdict has been reached in the Bernard Ebbers WorldCom trial. We'll report on that verdict as soon as we get it.

Now more on a story we reported at the top of this broadcast, the federal operation against a purported racket dealing in Russian-style military hardware. Standing by live with the story in New York, CNN's Mary Snow. A dramatic announcement earlier today from the U.S. attorney in New York.

Mary, update our viewers. What happened?

MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, U.S. attorney David Kelley announced that 18 people have been charged with attempting to smuggle weapons into the United States. This is the result of a yearlong investigation, mostly done through wiretaps.

Now, what you're going to see here are pictures of weapons, shoulder-fired surface-to-air missiles, rocket-propelled grenades. The U.S. attorney stresses that these were only in the discussion stages, that these weapons did not make it into the U.S.

These pictures were taken from a Web site, a Russian Web site. The password was given to a confidential informant working on this case. However, he did say that eight machineguns did enter the United States.

Now, U.S. Attorney David Kelley says that he believes the potential pipeline was disruptive. A potential pipeline coming out of eastern Europe. However, it is unclear, although he says it is suspected that these weapons could have wound up in the hands of terrorists, the end user is unclear.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID KELLEY, U.S. ATTORNEY: It appears that the defendants were planning to obtain that weaponry through contacts they had developed in eastern European military circles. We're now working with our counterparts overseas to secure the weapons and to bring to justice conspirators who may be abroad.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SNOW: Now, the suspects were from various nationalities. The alleged ring leader is Armenian, we're told. Some of the other suspects from Georgia and Russia. The FBI, though, stating that there was no clear ties to any organized group.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDY ARENA, FBI: These defendants may not have been terrorists themselves, but they've shown a transparent willingness to do anything with anybody so long as it generates income for their organization.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SNOW: Now, the suspects are due to be arraigned this afternoon. The two alleged ringleaders, the penalty for the charges that have been brought against them are up to 30 years in prison -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Mary, the U.S. attorney, David Kelley, also used words that were very ominous. When I heard him talk about enriched uranium and the New York subway system, my ears, of course, perked up. I'm sure yours and our viewers' did, as well. But he then elaborated on what was going on, on that front.

SNOW: Yes. And he was very careful to stress, Wolf, that in the yearlong investigation, at one point in the discussions between one of the suspects and the confidential informant, that there had been a reference to enriched uranium, and potentially, use on a subway.

He said, though, in the conversations the rest of the year, which included 15,000 conversations, there was never another reference made again, and that this claim was made by one individual, and according to his knowledge was not discussed with the other suspects. And he really stressed that this was pinpointed to this one suspect that was mentioned once in a conversation.

BLITZER: All right. And Mary's going to have a lot more on this story coming up 5:00 p.m. Eastern on "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS." Mary Snow reporting from New York. Thanks very much.

Let's move on to a Hazmat scare involving the Department of Defense right here in Washington. One day later, nearly 300 workers are awaiting the results of definitive tests for potential exposure to anthrax. The initial tests came back negative.

But working the story for us, our Pentagon correspondent, Barbara Starr.

It's a confusing, complicated, potentially very significant story, Barbara. What do we know exactly?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Not much definitively at this point, Wolf. What we can tell you is the Department of Homeland Security is now taking the lead in this entire matter. If and when they do get those final laboratory results back, it may well be the Department of Homeland Security, not the Pentagon, that has a news conference here in Washington to announce the final disposition of this matter.

Let's review where it stands now.

Several facilities, several federal postal mail facilities are now closed across Washington. One of them is a remote delivery facility right here next to the Pentagon. That is where irradiated mail comes in, is screened before it comes in to the building.

It was last Thursday that an air sample from this building tested positive for the possibility of anthrax. What we now know is there have been 60 additional tests, according to Pentagon officials. None of them have come back positive. But they are still awaiting final word.

Across Washington, other facilities closed down as a precaution, include three buildings here in northern Virginia, a few miles from the Pentagon, that also handle federal mail, as well as a postal facility in downtown Washington. The mayor of Washington spoke about the caution being taken and why that facility was shut down. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think the level of concern now is just that we're trying to find out more about this situation. We don't know the extent of where this anthrax may have come from. But the extent the district could have been involved, we think this is the proper first steps.

I think it's a prudent course of action. I don't think there's cause for alarm or panic or undue worry. But we are following the test results, and we're in close contact with people at the Department of Defense, Health and Human Services and the CDC, who are all involved in managing this response.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STARR: Wolf, let me correct one thing for our viewers who are so familiar with Washington, D.C. It was Mayor Tony Williams standing behind that official. That is the director of public health here in Washington, D.C.

So the testing goes on. They hope to have final results perhaps as soon as this afternoon. But all of these facilities shut down, all of the workers being tested, being offered the possibility of three days of antibiotics, being given public health information, officials say, in an abundance of caution. But so far they say they have no reason yet to believe there is a direct threat to public health.

BLITZER: Barbara Starr at the Pentagon. Thank you very much.

We'll take a quick break. Much more news right after this.

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BLITZER: We understand the verdict in the Bernard Ebbers trial has just been announced. Susan Lisovicz is in New York.

What did he -- what's the news, Susan?

LISOVICZ: The news is very bad for Bernie Ebbers, Wolf. Bernie Ebbers has been found guilty on all counts, nine counts against him. Guilty of conspiracy, guilty of securities fraud. And then seven counts, guilty of false filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission.

Bernie Ebbers was the former CEO of WorldCom, which collapsed and resulted in the largest bankruptcy in U.S. history. $30 billion in debt, the $11 billion accounting error is the largest accounting fraud in U.S. history.

So Bernie Ebbers has suffered, of course, a terrible fate. But so have millions of investors who invested in WorldCom. And as anyone knows, when you -- when a company goes through bankruptcy, the shareholders are the last in a long line of creditors.

Maximum sentencing guidelines found guilty on all counts, Bernie Ebbers could go to prison for 85 years. Sentencing guidelines, of course, could reduce that substantially -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Sixty-three years old right now, Bernard Ebbers. Let's review some of the facts involving WorldCom.

WorldCom's 2002 bankruptcy, Susan, as you know, was the largest ever in U.S. history. WorldCom's $11 billion so-called accounting error the largest accounting fraud in U.S. corporate history. WorldCom is now known as MCI. It's the second largest long distance and data services provider in the U.S.

The jury began its deliberations on March 4. The trial actually began on January 19. In the scheme of things, Susan, this went down pretty quickly.

LISOVICZ: It went down pretty quickly. And it was interesting, Wolf, because there was no hard evidence against Bernie Ebbers.

Bernie Ebbers portrayed himself as a phys-ed major, a guy who started off a very sort of modest life. He was born in Canada, worked as a milkman in 30 -- in minus 0 weather for a time after high school.

He ended up going to a southern Christian college in Mississippi and worked in a variety of jobs. And started this long distance company as part of the deregulation of AT&T in 1983 through a series of very aggressive acquisitions over the next two decades. Fifteen years, I'd say.

It became one of the big players in telecom. But it collapsed under a mountain of debt.

Bernie Ebbers said he really knew he had nothing to do with it. It was the CFO, the chief financial officer, Scott Sullivan, who said, no, he was in on it, and his personal wealth was tied to the stock, and that he, in fact, pressured him to cook the books. Scott Sullivan turned state witness, was the star witness against Bernie Ebbers. He is hoping for a reduced sentence.

The jury coming in against Bernie Ebbers, all nine counts -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Well, legally, if he's convicted on all nine counts, potentially faces what, 85 years in prison given the fact that he's been convicted on all counts? How much leeway is there in terms of how many years he'll actually wind up going into prison given federal prison sentencing guidelines?

LISOVICZ: Wolf, I really cannot speak on in terms of what the judge could give him on legal guidelines. What I can tell you is this, prior to this Bernie Ebbers had a spotless life. In fact, a lot of people in Clinton, Mississippi, say he is a good man.

He has spoken of his relationship with the lord, that during his college years, that while he was there on a basketball scholarship, he discovered Jesus Christ. And it was those, that part, his spiritual life, that really was a turning point for him. He's never been in trouble with the law. He was sort of a late bloomer, did a variety of jobs, as I mentioned. Everything from delivering milk in the pre-dawn hours, to working as a school teacher for a period of time, owned a number of Best Western hotels.

He really got his start, made a real impact in the telecom business in the '80s and '90s. But what brought him great success also, of course, brought him terrible, terrible failure. And now the likelihood of an extensive prison sentence -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Bernard Ebbers, 63 years old, found guilty all nine counts. Susan Lisovicz reporting for us that news. Thank you, Susan, very much.

We're also watching what's happening in Atlanta. Right now there's a memorial service under way. Take a look at this, a memorial service honoring Judge Rowland Barnes, court reporter Julie Ann Brandau, Fulton County Deputy Sergeant Hoyt Teasley, three of the four victims from that shooting spree on Friday.

This is a memorial service happening at the Fulton County Justice Center in downtown Atlanta. We'll watch that. We're watching other news, as well.

We'll take a quick break. We'll be right back.

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BLITZER: Sudan's humanitarian crisis may be a lot worse than first suspected. The United Nations' top emergency relief official now estimates more than 180,000 people have died in the Darfur region during the last year and a half. That's more than double earlier estimates.

And the figures only include deaths from hunger and disease. Countless others have been killed in a brutal campaign blamed on government-backed militias. An estimated two million people have been driven from their homes in the 2-year-old conflict.

Darfur is only one bleak spot on a continent rich in resources but plagued by serious problems from poverty to AIDS. Now a commission led by the British prime minister, Tony Blair, is calling for some legal change, beginning with the world's wealthiest nations.

Joining us now from London, a member of that commission, the musician, the activist, Sir Bob Geldof.

Sir Bob, thanks very much for joining us. Our viewers, of course, know you from the Band Aid, the Live Aid concerts, all the work that you've done. How did you get involved right now in trying to deal with this issue of poverty, death in Africa?

SIR BOB GELDOF, COMMISSION ON AFRICA: Really, I was there about a year and a half ago, Wolf, and just nothing seemed to be getting any better. All the solutions tended to be piecemeal. Some people were dealing with AIDS, some with poverty, some with the whole slew of catastrophes you've just outlined. And I just thought it wasn't going anywhere. It needed -- we needed to stand back and take a look at the totality of it.

And I asked Tony Blair to set up a commission. He will be president of the G-8 this year, at the same time, president of Europe, at the same time prime minister of Britain. And he did that. And we've come up with this report.

I mean, I have to say that, largely, we took a lead from the Americans with their millennium challenge ideas and took it forward from there. And the root of the problem, of course, is governance and corruption. And from that stems all the other faults that we see inheritance in the continent. And you must deal with that at its root -- root point.

BLITZER: You wrote a provocative piece this week in the British newspaper "The Independent," which I read, and you make the point that it was not all that long ago that we -- that we saw similar problems in Asia, in India, elsewhere in Asia.

GELDOF: Exactly.

BLITZER: Now that continent is doing relatively well. There's a dramatic economic improvement. But Africa is standing still, it's not going backwards. What's the basic difference?

GELDOF: Again you're right. In the last 20 years since Live Aid, Africa is the sole continent in decline. And you have to ask why. Indeed, in the 1960s, average African incomes were twice that of Asians.

And I think that you have far more coherent societies in Africa. The shocks of history were less stressful on Asia. But more to the point, you also had throughout India, for example, you had democracy very early on. And it's been hard to take root in a lot of African states. I mean, whether it was colonialism or the independent states that followed, it was very difficult to get a purchase, very difficult for people to have a say in their governments.

What you're seeing throughout Africa is that change beginning. This sort of great giant is becoming awake from its enforced slumber. And that is what's happening right now.

So Darfur, for example, that you just mentioned. I visited Darfur 20 years ago, and there was still a war going on. But the reason that you can't have peace there at the moment, or one of the reasons, is because China gets six percent of its oil out of Sudan, which is 60 percent of Sudanese production. And they don't want to do anything that upsets the apple cart there, upsets the government there.

Africa, as you again correctly state, is so rich in raw materials, and where you have wealthy countries, with raw materials, you have an awful lot of war.

BLITZER: What's the bigger problem in Africa? And there are so many problems plaguing that continent. Is it AIDS or is it the warfare, the genocide, if you will, that's unfolding not only in the Darfur region, but elsewhere in Africa, as well?

GELDOF: The singular condition is poverty. We have AIDS in our countries, but we can put a halt to its rampage. It doesn't devastate our societies. And we can look after those people who've been afflicted by it. Our medicines are relatively cheap for our societies. And the means of delivering -- the infrastructure exists to look after people.

That is not true in Africa. It devastates the entire continent. It is really unbelievable. I mean, I'll give you a small -- I spent the last three months in Africa, making a television series. And I'll give you a small example.

Where they use pipes to irrigate the fields in some farms, they've stopped working, so the fields are now fallow. And they've stopped working, because the brass pipes that turn on and off the water have been stolen to make coffin handles for the dead. So even in a small little area, you can see how this impacts more horribly.

It is the active, the sexually active people, the young people who are the producers and they, of course, die first, so production stops in an economy. But that leaves very old people orphaned, in effect. And those old orphans now have to look after the young orphans, and there's a general collapse.

But those are only excrescences of poverty. Were they a normal functioning economies with normal government, you would usually be able to deal with a situation like that, which is why we must deal with the central issue of impoverishment.

And the only way out of that is for African countries to be able to trade their way out of poverty, to allow them to get to a base level, a base means, a base level of civilization. And they're not allowed to do that. They have trade rules imposed upon them by the rich part of the world. And there are tariffs and subsidies imposed upon them.

And their debt, which America is dealing with right now today. Secretary Snow has been holding a conference with regard to 100 percent debt relief, which again ties in totally with the Commission for Africa report. Things are beginning to move. But we need to do a lot more.

And again it's a place where nothing will happen without the leadership of the United States. And you have broad support across the Senate. Of course, the Democrats support the issue. But more importantly, the Senate majority leader, right across to Rick Santorum.

BLITZER: Sir Bob Geldof's been nominated for a Nobel Peace Prize three times. Maybe one of these days, Sir Bob, you'll win one. You're doing incredibly important work for people in Africa, around the world.

GELDOF: Wolf, appreciate it.

BLITZER: Unfortunately, we have to leave it there, because we're out of time. But this subject is not going to go away.

GELDOF: No problem.

BLITZER: We'll continue it down the road. Sir Bob Geldof joining us, member of the Commission on Africa...

GELDOF: Thank you.

BLITZER: ... set up by Tony Blair.

When we come back, he's accused of shooting and killing four people, including a judge and a federal agent. But Brian Nichols is still not charged with murder. I'll talk with a former U.S. attorney about the legal plan of attack against the killing spree suspect. That's coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back to NEWS FROM CNN. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington.

If you're just joining us, breaking news only a little while ago here on CNN. Bernard Ebbers, the former CEO of WorldCom, now known as MCI, convicted all nine counts, could face as much as 85 years in prison. Sentencing scheduled now for June 13.

Eight days of deliberations by the jury. The federal jury convicts him all nine counts of helping to mastermind an $11 billion accounting fraud at WorldCom.

We're also watching a memorial service in Atlanta, memorial service honoring three of the four victims of that killing spree down in Atlanta. Right now the service honoring Judge Rowland Barnes, court reporter Julie Ann Brandau, and Fulton County Deputy Sergeant Hoyt Teasley.

These are live pictures -- actually these are taped pictures of the memorial service. We're watching that.

But let's talk about that Atlanta killing spree. A court appearance by the suspect, Brian Nichols, and new details emerging suggesting the suspect's original motives went beyond escaping custody.

Joining us now from Atlanta, the former U.S. attorney in Georgia, Kent Alexander. He's a senior vice president and general counsel at Emery University.

What do you make of the legal proceedings that unfolded about 10 minutes -- we saw him inside a courtroom earlier today? Explain to our viewers what this means, Kent.

KENT ALEXANDER, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY: Sure. Basically, the Fulton County, Georgia, prosecutor, Paul Howard, needed to get Nichols back into state custody. He'd been held in the federal pen.

So this was just an initial appearance on the pending charge, the rape charges, to keep -- keep Nichols in custody. The next step is going to be for the district attorney to decide what kind of charges to file. Obviously, there will be murder charges here. The big decision is whether to seek the death penalty.

BLITZER: Will he stay inside that federal penitentiary in Georgia? Yesterday, he was there for security reasons. It's considered to be more secure than a state facility in Atlanta. What's your sense on that?

ALEXANDER: That will be something worked out between probably the U.S. attorney, Dave Nahmias, and the district attorney, Paul Howard. Generally, if you're being prosecuted on state charges, though, you're held in a state facility. So I would not be surprised to see Nichols brought back to a state facility.

And the bottom line, as long as you keep somebody shackled and under heavy guard and not in a situation that resulted in this tragedy, you can keep somebody -- you can keep everyone safe.

BLITZER: Remind our viewers why, in this brief court appearance today, he was shackled, he was clearly bound up, yet last Friday when he was in that court -- courthouse, he was not shackled.

ALEXANDER: Well, today was just an appearance in front of the judge to hold him, to detain him. The trial was in front of a jury. So the thought was not to have him shackled so the jury wouldn't be prejudiced.

Right now I think this case has gone well beyond prejudice. People are too concerned about safety. So this particular hearing didn't matter a whole lot. He could be shackled. It was just a judge.

But even in front of a jury, when there is a jury trial, I would not be surprised to see him shackled. The shackles might be hidden under a desk or something or table, but it's just a changed situation now, obviously.

BLITZER: And the theory being that if he's there in front of the jury, and he's shackled, it could be prejudicial to his case, because he looks like a criminal if he's shackled. That's the theory behind going in before a jury, at least not being seen as being shackled. Is that right?

ALEXANDER: Yes. That's the theory. And sometimes what they'll do, when this rolls around to trial they could keep somebody's legs shackled, keep his legs, but hidden from the view of the jury. Have the jury leave, and then handcuff him and bring him out.

But whatever situation this man is in, in the future, he will be under heavy guard, and what happened last week will certainly never happen again with him. BLITZER: There's reports in Atlanta today that the -- someone in that courtroom on Friday, in Judge Barnes' courtroom, maybe Judge Barnes himself, did trigger a silent alarm, but for 10 minutes, no one seemed to pay attention to that as the situation unfolded. Is there a silent alarm system that's normal inside those courtrooms?

ALEXANDER: I don't know about the Fulton County Courthouse. But in courtrooms, generally, there is a silent alarm. But, I think that what's going to happen here is there will be a head-to-toe review and revamping of security, not just in that courthouse, but I think that's going to be going on around the country. And it's probably overdue.

And it's just a shame -- it's more than a shame, it's an absolute tragedy this happened.

BLITZER: And I'm being updated now. He has been transferred, Nichols, to the Fulton County Jailhouse from that federal penitentiary in Atlanta. That's where he's going to be staying, at least for the time being.

Kent Alexander, former U.S. attorney in Georgia, thanks very much for joining us. We'll continue to discuss the legal ramifications of this case.

Here's a disturbing statistic: more than one-third of American children born in 2000 will develop diabetes in their lifetime. And there's a direct link between obesity and diabetes. Coming up, I'll speak with a leading authority about the crisis and possible solutions. Francine Kaufman will join us when THE NEWS FROM CNN continues.

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BLITZER: Diabetes is clearly on the rise in the United States. And doctors say our sedentary lifestyles and high sugar diets are contributing to this growing epidemic.

Take a look at this statistic. Nearly nine out of 10 people with Type II diabetes are overweight. Type II diabetes is the most common form of the disease.

My next guest explores the link between obesity and diabetes in her powerful new book, "Diabesity." Dr. Francine Kaufman is a former president of the American Diabetes Association and now leads the Center for Diabetes, Endocrinology and Metabolism at Children's Hospital in Los Angeles.

Francine, thanks very much for joining us.

FRANCINE KAUFMAN, AUTHOR, "DIABESITY": Thank you, Wolf.

BLITZER: Congratulations on this important new book. Why is it so important that people right now understand this plague of diabetes?

KAUFMAN: Well, it's important because we can alter your course; you can alter your course if you take action about your lifestyle. And the point of my book is to talk about what the individual can do and then what we have to do collectively.

We have to change communities. We have to change schools. We have to change the workplace and make those places where we can get good food options, good activity options, and improve our health.

BLITZER: How does someone know if they're -- if they're at risk for diabetes?

KAUFMAN: Well, if you've got a family member who had diabetes, you are likely at risk. If you're overweight, you are at risk for diabetes. If you're over 45, you're probably at risk for diabetes. And if you're particularly a member of one of our ethnic racial minorities, African-American, Latino, Native American, Asian-American, then your risk is even higher.

BLITZER: And yow do you definitively determine if you do have diabetes?

KAUFMAN: The diagnoses of diabetes is made by a blood test. It's your blood sugar. If you hit a number above 126 when you're fasting, or about 200 any other time, you likely have diabetes. If you don't have symptoms, though, blood tests need to be repeated. If they're still that high, you are diagnosed with diabetes.

BLITZER: I interviewed last week Governor Mike Huckabee of Arkansas.

KAUFMAN: Right.

BLITZER: He lost 100 pounds plus. He was at risk. In fact they had diagnosed him with pre-diabetes or actual diabetes. But when he lost all that weight, it all went away. Is that a normal circumstance for diabetes? Simply to go away if you loses weight?

KAUFMAN: It absolutely can happen. I'm here at an NIH study right now, looking at how we can treat children with Type II diabetes. At the very onset if we can get them a good, healthy lifestyle, they may be able to eventually, at some point, be treated with just one medication or no medications.

And the same is true for adults. So we have to really invigorate people to have a healthy lifestyle.

BLITZER: And so the most important thing is to exercise and lose the weight if you're overweight, is that right?

KAUFMAN: And the good news is, Wolf, you don't have to lose 100 pounds. It's great that the governor did, but not everybody has to lose it. It's about seven to 10 percent of your body weight. Walking 30 minutes a day, five times a week, looks like we can reduce people progressing to diabetes by 60 percent.

BLITZER: But there are some people who are not overweight and do work out, and they still come up -- come down with diabetes.

KAUFMAN: Well, you can get Type II diabetes, some people get it if they're not overweight. But then there's the other form of diabetes, Type I which most often does occur in children and in people of normal weight.

BLITZER: What about children specifically? What do parents need to know right now, the information they can get in your book "Diabesity"? What do parents need to know in dealing with this problem?

KAUFMAN: Well, we need to look at the bad habits, so drinking sweetened beverages, those should be diminished or eliminated if possible.

BLITZER: What if you drink diet?

KAUFMAN: Well, diet sodas have a lot of chemicals. They're probably not the best choice. A lot of them have caffeine. That's not good for children.

BLITZER: What should parents be giving their children to drink?

KAUFMAN: Water.

BLITZER: Really? What about juices?

KAUFMAN: Well, juice in moderation. Juice is filled with calories. We don't actually need to drink juice. It would be better to eat a piece of fruit. Water...

BLITZER: Everybody seems to think orange juice, for example, apple juice, grape juice, those juices are great for kids.

KAUFMAN: Well, they're not really great for kids. I mean, a glass a day perhaps, but they don't need more. We'd rather see them eat an orange or an apple that has the fiber and has all the micronutrients, rather than having this concentrated juice, which is mainly sugar.

BLITZER: So the old notion that you simply have too much sugar it's going to put you at risk for diabetes.

KAUFMAN: Too much sugar, too many calories, too much fat, too much saturated fat and not enough activity. I mean, it's really a balance, and we want to get people back in balance.

BLITZER: And even though you can treat diabetes, this is a potentially awful disease that can be deadly.

KAUFMAN: Like I illustrate that in my book. I tell the stories of the people I've met who have diabetes, the patients I've cared for, the people I've met through the American Diabetes Association and at meetings around the world, and their stories are devastating. They -- they lose a lot of their function, and they can lose their life as a result of this disease.

People used to talk about just a touch of the sugar. There is nothing farther from the truth. This is a devastating disease. We need to prevent it.

BLITZER: And people can learn a great deal by reading your book "Diabesity." Francine Kaufman, congratulations on the new book.

KAUFMAN: Thank you.

BLITZER: You're doing very important work. Thanks for joining us.

KAUFMAN: Thanks, Wolf.

BLITZER: I'll be back later today, every week day 5 p.m. Eastern for "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS." Weapons for sale: arrests this week in New York shedding some light on the problem of keeping arms out of the hands of suspected terrorists. I'll talk live with New York City Police Commissioner Ray Kelly about these arrests. That's coming up, 5 p.m. Eastern later today.

Until then, thanks very much for watching NEWS FROM CNN. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. LIVE FROM with Kyra Phillips and Tony Harris, that team standing by to pick up our coverage right at the top of the hour.

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