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Nancy Grace

Sergeant Peterson Blames Missing Wife for Media Circus

Aired November 15, 2007 - 20:00   ET


MIKE BROOKS, GUEST HOST: Tonight: After weeks of hiding out and lashing out at the media, it seems Drew Peterson just can`t stop talking. The veteran police sergeant continues his media blitz, still denying he had anything to do with his third wife`s mysterious death or his fourth wife`s disappearance. He says 23-year-old Stacy Peterson left on her own, and now says he`s angry with her for creating this media circus.
And with the a second autopsy under way of wife number three, more witnesses reportedly called before a grand jury.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The husband of missing woman Stacy Peterson making his case on national TV yesterday, denying he had anything to do with her disappearance more than two weeks ago. Well, now Sergeant Drew Peterson says he still believes Stacy left him for another man. Meantime, a man who knew Peterson`s previous wife says a grand jury has been talking to witnesses about her death. Kathleen Savio was found dead in her bathroom in 2004. It was ruled an accidental drowning at the time, but her body was exhumed earlier this week after suspicion that her death may not have been an accident.


BROOKS: Good evening. I`m Mike Brooks, in for Nancy Grace. Tonight, Drew Peterson speaks out yet again.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Still more questions than answers (INAUDIBLE) mysterious death of Drew Peterson`s third wife, previously camera-shy Peterson talking to the media yet again, some shocked at what Peterson has to say, this as witnesses reportedly called to testify before a grand jury.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was actually on my way home that evening from work. Drew pulled up next to me in the police car. It so happened that we were on the same street, and he asked me to go to the house within the next 10 to 15 minutes. He said he was trying to drop off the kids for, like, the last day-and-a-half, and she wasn`t answering the door. And that wasn`t like Kathy not to do. If he was a couple of minutes late, she would, you know, be right on the phone with the police department.

He came -- after her best friend came into the bathroom, I yelled out her name a couple times. She started screaming, and that`s when Drew came running up the stairs right into the bathroom. I`m looking at her. You know, he did check her pulse, and then started screaming out, What am I going to tell my kids?


BROOKS: Good evening. I`m Mike Brooks, in for Nancy Grace. Thanks for joining us. Well, it seems that Drew Peterson just can`t stop talking to the media. His fourth wife, Stacy, still missing, wife number three -- her body was exhumed the other day and another autopsy done, and he says that she is the one creating this media circus.

And the person he spoke to most recently is with us here on set tonight. Joining me here in New York is Jon Leiberman, correspondent with "America`s Most Wanted." Jon, thanks for joining us.


BROOKS: So what did he have to say?

LEIBERMAN: Well, I got to tell you, I`ve been hammering away at Drew, saying I want to see him out searching for his wife, for his fourth wife...

BROOKS: Right.

LEIBERMAN: ... and I want him to call on her to -- you know, I want him to actively help in the search. So I called him today to ask him to do that, to tell him to come on "America`s Most Wanted" and let`s help bring Stacy home.

BROOKS: And what`d he say?

LEIBERMAN: In the course of our conversation, he says that he`s angry with Stacy because, I have this circus surrounding me and my family. So he`s angry with her for that. And I asked him the question, Do you want Stacy back? And he interpreted that to mean did I mean did he want her back to be his wife...

BROOKS: Right. Right.

LEIBERMAN: ... and live in the house. And he says, Whether I want her back anymore is questionable, he says. I hope she exposes herself to be alive and well. And I said, Drew, is she alive and well? And he says, I`m hoping she is.

BROOKS: I`m hoping she is. Now, how was his whole demeanor with you?

LEIBERMAN: It`s amazing, Mike. He is calm. He`s cool. He`s collected. He wasn`t rattled at all. He said he was frustrated by the fact that our host, John Walsh, had gone on some shows...

BROOKS: Right.

LEIBERMAN: ... and basically convicted him. He did say, you know, he`s innocent until proven guilty. He said that to me. And he reiterated that he had nothing to do with the disappearance of Stacy or the accidental death, what was ruled accidental, of Kathleen Savio, his third wife. But very calm, I mean, almost eerily so.

BROOKS: Well, you know, yesterday, he was on the "Today" show with Matt Lauer, and he -- again, out in front of the media he says is creating this whole circus. Let`s take a listen to what he had to say with Matt Lauer yesterday.


SGT. DREW PETERSON, SUSPECT IN DISAPPEARANCE OF STACY PETERSON: She never told me she was seeing another man. She -- well, maybe she did. But I believe she`s with somebody else right now.

MATT LAUER, "TODAY": Let me just go back to did she or did she not say to you, I`m seeing someone else, Drew?

PETERSON: It wasn`t put like that. She found somebody else, that was her exact words.

LAUER: And you believe that she is now not dead, that she has actually run off with another man.

PETERSON: I believe that, yes.


BROOKS: That was video of Drew Peterson yesterday on the "Today" show, a stoic Peterson tells his version of what he believes happened to his missing wife, Stacy.

I want to go right out to her -- from Los Angeles, to Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst and author of "Deal Breakers." Bethany, you`ve seen this. You`ve have heard what Jon had to say about his whole demeanor, and you`ve seen, you know, other news clips of him. What do you think of his body language and his behavior?

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: I have so many thoughts. The way he`s sitting back and his legs are planted in front of him, it`s as if he`s arrogant, he`s indifferent. I thought about all the research about sociopathy, which is sociopaths have very low levels of anxiety and that`s why their conscience doesn`t form (ph) because they`re not afraid of getting into trouble. So they tend to go in front of the camera, even if they`ve committed homicide, because they don`t really think they`ve done anything wrong.

During the interview, he expresses no concern for his children, other than when Matt Lauer says, What will happen to the children if you go to jail? Then he gets a little emotional when it`s all about him. For someone who has, like, a stalker-type mentality, who is literally on top of his wife all the time, he presents not one theory about who she went away with, not one cell phone record, not one story about who it might be.

And at the very end, when Matt Lauer says to him, Do you want to say anything to her, he kind of turns into the camera and laughs. And I don`t know the exact quote, but something like, you know, Come home. But it`s as if he doesn`t really know she`s there. I think that the overall picture is of indifference and as if she really doesn`t -- he doesn`t really think she`s around.

BROOKS: You know, and he says that she took of with somebody else. And you know, we talked yesterday with one of Kathleen Savio -- wife number three -- with one of her relatives, who said that he was extremely violent towards Kathleen Savio. And yesterday also on the "Today" show, he says -- Matt Lauer said, Did you ever hit her? Peterson said, "Never, never hit her, never raised a hand to her. And then he goes on to say, I don`t believe our relationship was ever violent. There were a few incidents where Stacy and I would have verbal confrontations, and I`d be in her face and she hated being cornered. And one time she hit me in the head with a frozen steak."

What do you think of that, Bethany?

MARSHALL: Well, what I really think is -- I thought about the pattern of spousal abuse, where the man kind of stalks, belittles, blames. He`s on top of the woman all the time. And then when she reacts, he says, Oh, kind of out of control, aren`t you, little missy? And that was kind of the reaction he had with Matt Lauer on the "Today" show. It`s as if the women were unstable, hormonal, they were getting their periods and then they would, you know, threaten to leave him.

He said at one point that he had tossed her into the pool at a party and she came out swinging. But he had very little insight as to why she actually might be angry with him. So it was really the lack of insight seemed to fit the profile of an abuser, and the externalization of blame and blaming the victim.

BROOKS: Well, Bethany, as you were just saying, he was trying to blame it on everything but himself, all these other outside things. And he went on to say yesterday, "I`m not trying to be funny here. Stacy would ask for a divorce after her sister died on a regular basis. I`m not trying to be funny. And it was based on her menstrual cycle. It was like any moment she had when she was unhappy with something, she would want a divorce."

I want to go out to Pat Brown, criminal profiler and author. What do you get by this guy`s behavior, as a professional profiler, Pat?

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Well, one of the reasons he is starting to blame the menstrual cycle of this woman is because when he got her at 17, she was controllable. That`s why he wanted a younger girl. And then she had two kids, she became a mother and she became more of a woman, and she said, Wait a minute. I don`t think I like the way I`m being treated. So she started fighting back.

And you know, he has a badge. He can use that on the job, but you can`t use it at home. So he`s frustrated because in his work, he gets a lot of -- you know, he gets his power and he gets his control. But at home, apparently, after a little while, he loses it.

BROOKS: Do you agree with that, Bethany?

MARSHALL: I completely agree with that. But I also think that it shows a lack of insight into why she was angry with him. If she`s continually threatening to leave, it`s because she really doesn`t want to be with him. And in the interview, he failed to ever link that to his own behavior.

BROOKS: Let`s go out to the phones. Mary from Washington, D.C., my home town. Good to be with you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you. My question was, have they ever explored the possibility that he may have paid someone to knock these wives off, or you know, to do that? That`s the reason why he`s able to act so relaxed, because technically, he didn`t do it himself?

BROOKS: Jon Leiberman, has that ever come up?

LEIBERMAN: Yes. That`s an excellent question that the caller had. We have sources inside the investigation theorizing that maybe he did have help. And that`s one thing they`re looking at right now as they piece together the timeline of this case. Who did he have contact with in the days leading up to Stacy`s disappearance? And then who was unaccounted for in that period of time?

And I got to tell you, Mike, another scary thing, actually, and that`s why I think Drew is so insecure -- we have sources inside this investigation who say that he tapped the phones of each of his four wives repeatedly to monitor their conversations and to see who they were talking to.

BROOKS: And that goes back to the whole thing Bethany was talking about, and Pat, about the controlling -- about how controlling this guy was.

LEIBERMAN: Absolutely.

BROOKS: You know, now, there is a grand jury that is sitting right now, involved in this case, and there have been a number of witnesses back and forth, you know, from the courthouse to this grand jury. We hear, Jon, that Paul Peterson, Drew`s brother, and another Bolingbrook police officer have been in front of this grand jury. What do you know about that?

LEIBERMAN: One thing that it appears that the grand jury wants to explore, Mike, is who in the Bolingbrook Police Department had the inside on this whole investigation back when Kathleen Savio died in the bathtub?

BROOKS: Right.

LEIBERMAN: Because they were initially at the scene. Then state police were called in once they realized that this was a Bolingbrook cop`s wife who was dead.

BROOKS: Right.

LEIBERMAN: But there have been a lot of questions about, Did Bolingbrook try and sweep this under the rug? So one thing that they`re trying to paint in front of the grand jury is, What did these Bolingbrook cops know? What did Drew say at work about it? And of course, what did he say about Stacy and his other relationships.

You know, a lot of people told us that Drew had a lot of women on the side...

BROOKS: Interesting.

LEIBERMAN: ... all throughout his career at the Bolingbrook Police Department, and everybody around knew about it.

BROOKS: That`s very interesting, that he had women on the side, because we heard again from one of Kathleen Savio`s relatives yesterday that the confrontation between Kathleen and Stacy took place in the car while he was still married to Kathleen and Stacy was in the car. And he handcuffed her and then called police, where he probably should have been calling the police on himself.

Let`s go back out to the lines. Steve from Michigan, thanks for being with us.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, thanks for having me on. I was just wondering, why is he disguising his identity? Every time you see him being interviewed, he is looking down at the camera, like the footage you`re showing. Coming out of his garage, why does he have his face covered? It seems to me he`s got something to hide.

BROOKS: Pat Brown, what do you have to say about that?

BROWN: I think the reason he did that when he was being pursued by the media was that they were coming into his territory and they were -- it was on their terms, not his terms. And he didn`t appreciate that, so he was saying, Look, you`re not going to be able to take the pictures you want of me. I`m going to cover that up.

But when he can call the shots, when he got, you know, the request from the "Today" show to go on, he said, OK, I`ll do that. Now he thinks he`s in control, he can plan everything he wants to do and do the perfect interview. At least, he thought it was a perfect interview.

BROOKS: Let`s uncage the lawyers. With us here in New York is Richard Herman defense attorney, and out of Atlanta, Renee Rockwell. OK, Richard, he`s your client. This guy, all of our panelists for the last couple of weeks have been saying, Look, he should just stay at home, stay in his house and keep his mouth shut.

RICHARD HERMAN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You heard that devastating analysis by Dr. Bethany Marshall. That`s exactly why a defense attorney does not want their client talking to the press. Any move he makes is going to be criticized. There is nothing he can do to gain favor with the public or with anybody right now. He has to wire his jaw shut. He has to go on a vacation. He has to stay out of the public eye right now. Every move he makes is being criticized and it`s being evaluated the wrong way. He`s getting destroyed in the public`s view.

BROOKS: Do you think that he is any better off today and yesterday after doing that interview with Matt Lauer than he was the day before?

HERMAN: Mike, he`s absolutely worse off. If it goes to trial, this prosecutor is looking to make a name for himself. He`s got to get votes to win an election. He looks like he`s got tunnel vision here. It looks like he`s going to indict Peterson on something. And these tapes are going to be played to the jury. It`s really bad this guy`s talking. I cannot believe it! It`s incredible.

BROOKS: Well, you and I don`t agree very often, but Richard, I have to agree with you on that.

Now, Renee, he`s asking for an attorney. Get your airfare from the cheapest airline you can find and get on down there. Why would he be on TV, national TV, soliciting for an attorney?

RENEE ROCKWELL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: And you know what, Mike? Attorneys will stand up and line up for free to represent a case that`s going to have a lot of media attention. But think of what he`s doing when he`s giving these interviews, Mike. He`s actually committing himself to, I have never been violent with my wife. I have never done this, I have never done that. Those words will come back to haunt him, Mike, because this isn`t an interview that you can throw out and say, Hey, I wasn`t read my rights, I wasn`t this -- this has no police involvement. This is in front of the media, so it will come back. He needs to shut up and not say anything else.

BROOKS: Well, I think we have a consensus from the defense attorneys that, Oh, that`s what he needs to do is to shut his mouth, stay in his house and listen to his -- and listen to whoever`s been giving him legal assistance. I don`t know who it is, but they`re not giving him right assistance.

ROCKWELL: No, he does not have a lawyer, I promise you, because no lawyer would let him do what he`s doing.

BROOKS: But he probably thinks he`s smart enough so he can handle it.

Let`s go out to the phones. Sandy from Arkansas, thanks for being with us.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you. My question is -- I love your show, first of all.

BROOKS: Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And this is for the defense attorneys. But I`d like to know if there`s any way -- first of all, I don`t agree with the defense attorneys. But I`d like to know if the pathologist, maybe Dr. Michael Baden or whoever, can get some DNA from her hair, even though it was still full of blood, if there`s still any way they can pull DNA from her hair?

BROOKS: Well, you know, it`s very interesting you bring that up. The NANCY GRACE show has been able to confirm with Kathleen Savio`s family that an independent autopsy will be conducted by the Savio family, independent of the other autopsy by Dr. Blum (ph) that is being conducted as we speak. And this one is going to be conducted by noted forensic pathologist Michael Baden. So that`s a very good question.

But I`m going to throw that question out to Dr. Marty Makary, physician and professor of public health at Johns Hopkins in Washington, D.C. What do you think they can glean from this?

DR. MARTY MAKARY, PHYSICIAN, PROF. OF PUBLIC HEALTH, JOHNS HOPKINS: Well, there`s probably realistically very little that he`s going to be able to glean from this. I mean, it`s been years. And common things being common, autopsy aside -- and there`s no such thing as an independent autopsy, just like there`s no such thing as an independent counsel. Common things being common, a middle-aged person that dies in the bathtub -- I mean, what do you think?

BROOKS: I tell you what. We`re going to -- we`ll get right back to that.

But tonight`s "Case Alert." Several investigations under way in the death of a 40-year-old man tasered at the Vancouver airport, and it`s all caught on video. Robert Dziekanski appears to confused and lost at the arrivals area. According to reports, he was unable to find his mother for hours. Video shows him throwing a computer and breaking a glass table and a window before officers arrive. Then, unable to communicate with police because he speaks Polish, he walks away. Then officers taser and subdue him. Moments later, Dziekanski goes unconscious.

And tonight, check out all the new messages about Nancy and the babies and the twins, plus photos and video. It`s all on Click on Nancy`s baby blog.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I also think that every woman in America should be appalled that that was his direction (ph), that while she had PMS issue that she wanted a divorce. I think he should be ashamed of himself. I think he should be looking to find Stacy.


BROOKS: I`m Mike Brooks, in for Nancy Grace. Well, Drew Peterson back in the spotlight again. He says he doesn`t want the attention and he blames it all on his missing fourth wife, Stacy, for creating what he called "this media circus."

Well, part of this media circus today was "America`s Most Wanted" correspondent Jon Leiberman, who`s joining me here on set. Jon, as we talk about this more and more, how is her family -- how is her family reacting to him being on TV all the time?

LEIBERMAN: Oh, they`re so distraught over it. I mean, think about it. And all the searchers too. I mean, every time that Drew goes on television or talks to us and says, You know what? Stacy walked away. She doesn`t want to be found. She`s with some guy -- it just throws -- it`s just -- it throws salt in the wound to this family who`s missing a loved one and to the dozens and dozens of searchers out there who are looking for Stacy day in and day out and praying and hoping that they find her.

BROOKS: Let`s talk about this cell phone. She was last seen when?

LEIBERMAN: She was last seen earlier in the day on Sunday, that Sunday.

BROOKS: And then he spoke to her about 9:00 o`clock?

LEIBERMAN: He claims that she called at 9:00 PM, and at that point, she relayed the fact that she was leaving him.

BROOKS: Now, we talk a lot about cell phone technology. Now, he says that she called him on her cell phone. We know that they`ve done two search warrants of the house. They took out computer records, cell phone records, everything else. And they probably have subpoenaed -- I know as a former investigator, I would have subpoenaed the cell phone records already.


BROOKS: Won`t they be able to tell through this technology, you know, that it wasn`t just, you know, her going, Hey -- dialing her phone up, Hey, how`re you doing? And then, you know, dialing -- getting on his phone...


LEIBERMAN: It would ping in the exact same area.

BROOKS: Exactly.

LEIBERMAN: As you know. But was he under duress somehow? Was he -- we don`t know. Maybe he made a mistake, and maybe that`s the mistake that will bring him down. We don`t know. But we do know that police clearly have evidence. They have chinks in his timeline. They have contradicting testimony, enough to come out and call him the suspect in her disappearance.

BROOKS: Yes, I mean, he -- we went from nothing to then, during the press conference, they called him -- he`s going from now a -- you know, a - - you know, to a suspect, you know?

LEIBERMAN: And you notice, Mike...

BROOKS: A person of interest to a suspect.

LEIBERMAN: And you notice it happened after he spoke to the grand jury and they spoke -- the police spoke to the two older children of Drew. There are problems with his timeline and his story.

BROOKS: We`re going to talking about that.

But tonight "Case Alert." Verdict in the case covered on the debut of the NANCY GRACE show. Just moments ago, a jury finds former high school football coach David Temple guilty of murdering his wife, Belinda, Temple found shot to death in her bedroom closet. For years, David Temple remained calm, claiming that it was an intruder, but police eventually found enough evidence for charges. Temple now faces life in prison.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In a network interview, Drew Peterson says he has nothing to do with the disappearance of his wife, Stacy Peterson, or the death of his third wife, Kathleen Savio. Peterson has never searched for Stacy. The former police sergeant claims he was never violent with the 23- year-old missing mother of two.


BROOKS: I`m Mike Brooks, in for Nancy Grace. Well, he claims he was never violent with wife number four, but we know different with wife number three.

I want to go right off to the phones, to Lorraine in New Jersey. Thanks for calling in, Lorraine.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. I have a question. How come they -- my question is, how come they`ve never done a lie detector test on him, if he`s so -- says he`s -- he didn`t do anything? How come they`re avoiding that?

BROOKS: Well, you know, I can -- let me answer that for you. I can tell you, Lorraine, that`s one of the first things I was talking about, you know, one of the things that investigators -- it`s a fantastic investigative tool. He was cooperative with the police early on, but then he says -- he said he lawyered up. But apparently, he`s not being cooperative with police anymore, and I would -- you know, right now, he has -- I`d say if you have nothing to hide, take a polygraph.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He swears he`s telling the truth, but is Drew Peterson hiding secrets about two of his wives? The mystery begins on October 28. That`s when Peterson, a veteran police sergeant, reported his fourth wife, Stacy, missing. The search for the 23-year-old began almost immediately, but while family members, volunteers and police looked for Stacy, her husband did not.

But authorities think Peterson knows exactly where Stacy is. They say he may have killed her. The case, however, do not end with Stacy. There are also questions about this woman, Kathleen Savio. She was Peterson`s third wife. She died under mysterious circumstances. Three years ago, the body of the 40-year-old was found in her bathtub. At the time, she and Peterson were getting divorced. Her death was ruled an accidental drowning. Police unearthed Kathy Savio`s casket, exhuming her body for an autopsy, hoping it`ll answer the questions her family continues to have.


MIKE BROOKS, GUEST HOST: I`m Mike Brooks, in for Nancy Grace. Thanks for being with us. Well, as Drew Peterson continues to put his face in front of the media, his fourth wife, Stacy, is still missing, and third wife, Kathleen Savio, has -- right now, her body exhumed the other day, and is undergoing another autopsy. As we come to air, the NANCY GRACE show has been able to confirm that the Savio family`s request to have an independent autopsy done by another medical examiner, aside from the one right now who`s doing this, Dr. Blum -- this one is going to be conducted by noted pathologist Michael Baden.

Now, I want to go to the first autopsy. And Jon, I want to talk to you about that. The first autopsy took place -- I had some real problems with it as an investigator. Number one, the Illinois state police investigator who testified at this coroner`s inquest -- he was not even there at the scene. He didn`t observe the scene. He wasn`t present for the autopsy. You know, I`ve been involved in cases like this. I`m going to go to the scene and I`m going to be there for the autopsy. That`s one of the problems I have. There`s some other problems.

Kind of take us back and set the scene at that -- at that now could-be crime scene, where before it was an accidental drowning.

JON LEIBERMAN, "AMERICA`S MOST WANTED": It`s a laundry list of potential problems, Mike. Number one, the autopsy didn`t show any water in Kathleen`s lungs, which clearly, you would have to have for a drowning. Her tongue was clenched between her -- her mouth. And generally, in a drowning, you go unconscious. The muscles relax and your tongue is not clenched in your mouth.

Another problem in the same -- the same state police...

BROOKS: Right.

LEIBERMAN: ... investigator you referred to took Drew Peterson`s alibi hook, line and sinker. He said, I was with my family over the weekend, the few days prior. And he didn`t do any digging, this state police -- he just kind of signed off on it and said, OK, he was with his family, so it must be accidental.

So many other problems. There was no water analysis done between the water in Kathleen`s sinuses...

BROOKS: Right.

LEIBERMAN: ... to see if that`s the same water that came out -- that was in the bathtub, as well.

BROOKS: Right.

LEIBERMAN: I mean, so -- the drain was closed, yet they say the water somehow had to have dripped out. It just doesn`t make any sense.

BROOKS: You know, a lot of other things, too. Number one, she was -- it was an empty tub. Her hair was still wet. She had a laceration on the back of her head. And the autopsy -- autopsy number one said that there were contusions over other parts of her body.

Dr. Marty Makary, physician and professor of public health at Johns Hopkins, OK, does this make any sense to you? The dry tub, the wet hair, the cut on the back of the head that they said was consistent with her falling in the tub and knocking her unconscious, other contusions on her body, the clenched tongue -- does any of this make any sense to you? And try to help us explain why this would -- her body would be in this condition.

DR. MARTY MAKARY, PHYSICIAN, PROF. OF PUBLIC HEALTH, JOHNS HOPKINS: I think the two of you just completed the autopsy and there`s probably no need to do one.


MAKARY: I mean, these made sense to anybody. I mean, what did she have, a sudden stroke or a heart attack at age 41, at the time when the bathtub was full of water? I mean, there`s no reason somebody should have a laceration or a tongue that`s not retracted in the back of their throat if it was a natural death.

BROOKS: Very interesting. So is this Dr. Blum, and now probably Dr. Baden -- are they going to go now, take a look at the body, see if there`s anything they can glean from this new autopsy after the body has been exhumed? And then what else are they going to be looking for, Doctor?

MAKARY: Essentially, this is going to be a documentation mission. It sounds like the first autopsy just did not well document the injuries and put them together with a reasonable conclusion. So what they`re going to do is get that down on the record and have the people that need to be there in the room.

BROOKS: Very interesting. I want to go back out the lines. Susan from Ohio, thanks for joining us.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you, sir. It`s such a great privilege to speak to you, Mike.

BROOKS: Good to have you on.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And I want to say congratulations to Nancy and to her new family that`s born, and I am thinking of her and praying for she and the newborns.

BROOKS: And I can tell you that she appreciates your thoughts and your prayers. She`s probably watching us right now.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you, sir. I`m retired from the medical field, and I find this case you`re discussing this evening very, very fascinating. And my question to you and to Nancy is this. What would be the motive for Drew Peterson killing one or both of these ladies? Was the motive -- if he did this crime or crimes, is it insurance money or is it other relationships, or was there another factor? Has his personal life been investigated to a greater degree to define whether or not there was some sort of motive for him doing this?

BROOKS: Pat Brown, criminal profiler, author of "Killing for Sport."

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Very simple. For a psychopath, people are either useful or they`re in the way. And if they`re no longer useful - - in other words, they`re not the good wife you want them to be, they`re not doing anything for you and you want to move on and get some other women, then they become in the way.

And most of us, when somebody becomes in the way, we divorce them. But then the problem is you have to deal with them the rest of your life, and you have to pay money, either child support or alimony. You certainly don`t get any insurance money. So for a psychopath, if they`re in the way, kill them. Then you don`t have to deal with them at all, and you get money and you can just be free forever. It really works well if you don`t get caught.

BROOKS: Bethany Marshall, I want you to weigh in on that question also.

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: Pat Brown`s brilliant, and I totally agree with her. And she`s really talking about splitting, too. When you`re with me, you`re good, and when you`re away from me, you`re bad. What also comes to mind is that 44.4 (ph) percent of all homicides occur over disputes around property and money. And I know that Kathleen Savio was -- he wasn`t wanting to pay the $2,000 in child support a month. And then also, if Stacy Peterson was on the brink of leaving the relationship, he might have had to divide the property and to support her in some way. And we also know that women are at the greatest risk of homicide as they`re about to leave a relationship.

BROOKS: You know, I want to go back out to the lawyers, Renee Rockwell in Atlanta and Richard Herman here in New York. These statements and everything we`re seeing on TV of him up there running his mouth, are these going to be admissible in court, should he be indicted?

RICHARD HERMAN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, he should not be indicted because there`s no case in either one of these. And as far as...

BROOKS: Oh, Richard! Come on! What do you mean, there`s no case in either one of these?

HERMAN: No case -- listen to me. There`s no case in either -- Mike, by the way, it`s primetime. I told you before. I bought you a tie. It`s an extra long tie for you. It goes great with that shirt. Come on, buddy.

BROOKS: I appreciate that. But sometimes the answers you give, I think your tie`s a little too tight, so you got to loosen up a little bit, boy.


HERMAN: They will be admissible in court, thought, and that`s why he shouldn`t be talking right now.

BROOKS: What do you think, Renee?

RENEE ROCKWELL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: The statements will come in because they`re not statements that were involuntarily given to law enforcement. But the best thing that could happen to him defense-wise is if he got indicted right now, the state wouldn`t be ready to present any kind of case. There`s no evidence. There`s no evidence that there`s even a homicide in wife number four or wife number three.

BROOKS: Well...

ROCKWELL: So the best thing would be an indictment because he could file speedy trial, and once you get tried once, Mike, that`s it. They`ve got one crack at you, and that`s it.

BROOKS: Well, they`ve got one crack at you. Now, Richard, how long do you think this grand jury is going to continue?

HERMAN: Oh, this grand jury`s an investigative grand jury. This thing could go on for six months, renew it, maybe a year, who knows, Mike? I mean, this autopsy -- what`s going on now, this exhumation of the body, is an absolute disgrace. The forensic pathologist will tell you they`re not going to find anything now that they didn`t have before. None of those soft tissue injuries are going to show up. They`ve all been decomposed. There`s nothing except fractures that were found in the initial one. This is a disgrace. This is just done for the public, to win votes. That`s what`s being done now.

ROCKWELL: But Richard, can I jump in on this...

BROOKS: No, you know -- win votes? What are we talking about votes here, Jon?

LEIBERMAN: This is ridiculous. Yes, they may not even need to have any substantive differences...

BROOKS: Right.

LEIBERMAN: ... in the autopsies because now they`ve gone back, they`re looking at documents. They`re looking at restraining orders. They`re looking at a pattern of behavior leading up to Kathleen Savio`s death. So they may not even -- they`re now looking at all of what the autopsy will show through a different pair of glasses now.

BROOKS: Right. And Richard -- Richard and Renee, can you say timeline? Doesn`t add up here, folks.

ROCKWELL: Well, you know what? But he`s the one that`s making the timeline. That`s why defendants should never say anything because once you say it, you paint yourself into a corner. But regarding this exhumation, they might be doing this not only to see if he`s squirming a little bit, but to see if the -- what was presented and the authorities that were involved first time around didn`t cook something up and maybe not present a fair finding. And maybe somebody else was involved in the undetermined or accidental finding of a drowning.

BROOKS: But can you say Scott Peterson?





UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... mother of two, 23-year-old Stacy Peterson, southwest suburban Bolingbrook, gone, massive searches, suspicion finally cast the way of the husband, Bolingbrook police Sergeant Drew Peterson, who is now an official police suspect. He maintains his wife ran off with another man and hasn`t participated in any search efforts.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If this was my wife, I`d be out here, you know? I`d be doing all I could. This is just wrong.


BROOKS: I`m Mike Brooks, in for Nancy Grace. Well, looks like Drew Peterson is still making the rounds on the media outlets. Just yesterday, he had an interview on the "Today" show with Matt Lauer. Let`s take a look at that.


MATT LAUER, "TODAY": Can you look at me straight in the eye and tell me that you had nothing to do with the death of your third wife, Kathy, or the disappearance of your fourth wife, Stacy?

SERGEANT DREW PETERSON, SUSPECT IN STACY`S DISAPPEARANCE: I can look right in your eye and say I had nothing to do with either of those incidences.

LAUER: Do you have anything you can present to me that might prove your innocence?

PETERSON: No. I don`t know what to tell you. Just let the case unfold as it does.


BROOKS: That was video of Drew Peterson on the "Today" show. Peterson calmly denies having anything to do with his third wife`s death or his fourth wife`s disappearance.

I want to go back out to Jon Leiberman. Jon, the grand jury meets every Wednesday, you were telling me.

LEIBERMAN: Right. Right.

BROOKS: How many people have been before the grand jury so far?

LEIBERMAN: It appears four have been in front of the grand jury. So this is a slow process.

BROOKS: Right.

LEIBERMAN: And somebody mentioned earlier, they`re really in no rush to indict because they do need to build a case. We know they got a lot of physical evidence out of the house in the way of cell phones, computers, weapons. Drew had a lot...

BROOKS: What kind of weapons do they have?

LEIBERMAN: Drew had a number of rifles, apparently, in the house. They had -- this is also a guy, Mike, a lot of people don`t know -- he`s a martial artist, as well. Drew Peterson knows martial arts. I mean, he`s very skilled.

BROOKS: Very interesting. Now, he has resigned. He is no longer a Bolingbrook police sergeant. He just resigned. When did he resign?

LEIBERMAN: Earlier this week, Monday, he turned in his resignation.

BROOKS: He turned in his resignation. Now, he has 39 (SIC) years on the job, as we say. I had 26, he has 39. I know I get my pension every month. Now, he`s resigned now. Is he eligible for a pension still?

LEIBERMAN: Drew is entitled to $6,000 a month.

BROOKS: Whoa! I was with the wrong department.

LEIBERMAN: Yes, $6,000 a month, unless he`s convicted of a felony in connection with his employment as a police officer. So let`s say he`s convicted and let`s take...

BROOKS: Right.

LEIBERMAN: ... a few steps (INAUDIBLE) Let`s say he`s convicted of some felony in this case.


LEIBERMAN: He will probably argue that he deserves the pension because whatever the felony is wasn`t in direct connection with him being a cop.

BROOKS: So what you`re telling me -- and again, we don`t want to convict the guy.


BROOKS: But if he is found guilty of any crime, he will still get his pension! Oh!

LEIBERMAN: Unless -- unless it can be proven that it was a felony in connection with him being a Bolingbrook police sergeant.

BROOKS: A job-related felony. Unbelievable.

Tonight, CNN "Heroes."


FOREST WHITAKER, ACTOR: Unfortunately, right now, tumors of the brain are the biggest cause of death in children, really, over leukemia. And I don`t think people really understand that or know.

Hi. I`m Forest Whitaker, and my hero is Dr. Keith Black, who is a neurosurgeon and researcher who has saved many lives in his work.

DR. KEITH BLACK, CEDARS-SINAI, LOS ANGELES: There`s nothing more frightening than a brain tumor. It affects our ability to speak, to feel, to interact with the environment. We`re dedicated to finding effective treatments for that.

WHITAKER: My grandmother had a brain tumor. They told us that it was inoperable and that she wouldn`t live out the year. And my mother and my sister, they found Dr. Black. And he did conduct the surgery, and she lived about nine years from that time.

BLACK: You get to help people. You get to try to have an impact on the lives of people facing very difficult problems.

What you see here is probably a metastatic tumor. This should be a very good patient, actually, for the gamma knife.

One of the most important things I think that we can do is to reach back into the community, is to provide for the next generation who, hopefully, will do even better than we`ve done in making discoveries. So we`ve created a program called Brainworks, and we bring about 200 students in from low-income schools. They get to be a neurosurgeon for a day.

WHITAKER: They`re able to play around with neurological toys, looking through microscopes, doing surgery on different things and having discussions where their voice is being heard.

BLACK: Some of the students, they`re now getting ready to apply to medical school. They want to go into neurology, science, as a result of that exposure.

WHITAKER: It`s that seed that I think it gives to people, that seed of hope when people come and sit in this chair, that seed that those kids have when they hear that, Yes, I can do that, he did that. He`s allowed them to embrace their futures and believe in their dreams. He`s a hero.



BROOKS: Now over to Headline News. Glenn Beck, what`s up?


GLENN BECK, HOST, "GLENN BECK": Well, as politicians waste time by finger pointing and name calling, drug lords continue to wreak havoc along our southern borders and creep farther and further inside our states. Somehow, I`ve gotten pulled into the mix, but it`s just a dirty trick of misdirection, and I`ll have all the details and tell you what side I`m on in just a bit. I bet it`s the same side you`re on. Then Congressman Tom Tancredo is running a controversial new ad that pairs (ph) illegal immigration and national security. We`ll talk to him about the real dangers and the necessary solutions to keep you safe. And oh, O.J.`s back in the news! Next.


BROOKS: I`m Mike Brooks, in for Nancy Grace. First I just want to thank Richard Herman for this nice tie. It`s almost as nice as the clip-on ties he wears on the show every night. Richard, thank you very much. I do appreciate that. It`s not Brioni (ph), but it`s not bad. Thank you.

HERMAN: Proper gentleman.

BROOKS: Thank you, sir.

I want to go right back out to Jon Leiberman, correspondent for "America`s Most Wanted." Jon, we get a lot of calls asking, What about wife number one and number two?

LEIBERMAN: Yes, it`s a great question. Wife number one of Drew`s was a high school sweetheart. They met very young. Wife number two, they were married for about 10 years between the early `80s and early `90s. And he met wife number three while he was still with wife number two.

BROOKS: Out to Anna from Indiana. Anna, you got a question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. I`d like to know if her body, Kathleen`s body, was (INAUDIBLE) still in the bathtub when the police got there (INAUDIBLE) removed because if he was removed, he should have known better than that. He`s a cop hisself. And over the weekend, Geraldo interviewed the neighbor that said he found her in the bathtub first, and the way he described it, she was...

BROOKS: Yes. No, I can tell you, Anna, that the body was in the bathtub when police got there and when he found it.

Tonight, let`s stop to remember Army Private First Class Luigi Marciante, just 25, from Elizabeth, New Jersey, killed in Iraq, awarded the Bronze Star and Purple Heart. He dreamed of being a police officer after the military. The life of the party, he loved DJ and dancing. His favorite TV shows, "The Sopranos" and "King of Queens." He also loved the beach and summer trips with his family to Italy. He leaves behind parents Maria and Luigi, two brothers, a sister, and widow, Stephanie (ph), who just gave birth to baby boy Lorenzo (ph). Luigi Marciante, American hero.

Thank you to all of our guests, and thank you to you at home for being with us. Remember, check out Nancy`s new message about her baby blog at

See you tomorrow night, 8:00 PM sharp Eastern. Until then, stay safe.