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Nancy Grace
Haleigh`s Father Speaks from Jail
Aired January 25, 2010 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight, Satsuma, Florida. A 5- year-old girl tucked into bed, five hours later, she`s gone. Daddy comes home from the night shift to find not a trace of little Haleigh. The last person to see her alive, new stepmother, 18-year-old Misty Croslin, who takes to the airwaves to claim she`s innocent. But even in one brief interview, Croslin can`t keep her stories straight, including a 180 on a failed lie detector, claiming she passed, then admitting on TV she failed.
Bombshell tonight. After Haleigh`s father, Ronald Cummings, and baby- sitter-turned-stepmother Misty Croslin both handcuffed, arrested and booked, Haleigh`s dad breaks his silence tonight from behind bars. What, if anything, do these felony arrests mean in the search for 5-year-old Haleigh?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do you do for a living, ma`am?
MISTY CROSLIN, HALEIGH`S BABY-SITTER: Nothing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m sorry?
CROSLIN: Nothing.
RONALD CUMMINGS, HALEIGH`S FATHER: Somebody stole my child from me!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How do you support yourself?
CROSLIN: My mom and my dad.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: New details emerge in the case of missing 5-year- old Florida girl Haleigh Cummings. In a jailhouse interview, Haleigh`s father allegedly claims, after he was arrested on drug charges, police told him their main focus is not putting him in jail, it was finding Haleigh.
CUMMINGS: (INAUDIBLE) lawyer.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Cummings is charged with three counts of drug trafficking. Misty Croslin, his former wife, is charged with six counts of drug trafficking.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When you have people who are on drugs, they really don`t pay attention. They are negligent.
CROSLIN: Some black guy just jumped in my car and stole my whole (ph) purse and threw me out the car, and he said he had a gun and said he was going to shoot me!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is one of the most dangerous drugs of our time!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This little girl didn`t stand a chance.
CROSLIN: I didn`t do anything to that little girl. I would never hurt her.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cummings reported told "The Florida Times Union" that he`s unsure if Croslin is holding something back, allegedly admitting it is hard to think Croslin does not know more.
GRACE: What did you make of those letters that emerged, detailing a party that night that the writer claims little Haleigh was at?
CUMMINGS: Miss Nancy, I didn`t make anything of them lawyers.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Children sometimes think that that`s candy. And we see sometimes accidental death.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Haleigh didn`t like medicine. And Oxycontin -- I`ve had to take it. I think it`s a very nasty taste and I can`t imagine Haleigh taking it.
CROSLIN: Everybody knows that I love Haleigh and Ronald and Junior. (INAUDIBLE) family, just like Haleigh wanted.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, breaking news. Amber Alert in America`s heartland. Seven-year-old Aja vanishes into thin air after Mommy`s found murdered inside the family RV, Geronimo, Oklahoma. But where is 7-year-old Aja Johnson?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There`s a desperate search going on in Oklahoma for a 7-year-old who may have been abducted after her mother was killed.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m the father of Aja Johnson, and I`m here to make a plea to everyone who`s listening and every parent who`s out there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Breaking news, Amber Alert, police on the lookout for 7-year-old Aja Johnson. The Oklahoma girl vanishes with her mother`s estranged husband, Lester Hobbs.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Please, Lester, if you`re listening or anyone out there who knows where she is, please return her!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Aja`s mom found dead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The body of 37-year-old Tonya Leeann (ph) Hobbs was found inside a camper. Ms. Hobbs was the estranged wife of a man named Lester William Hobbs.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police concerned Aja is with Hobbs because he`s a convicted felon and considered extremely armed and dangerous.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He does have a pretty extensive criminal history.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hobbs is not Aja`s biological father.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Aja also has a serious medical condition that requires regular medication, yet another reason why local, county, state law enforcement on the hunt to bring Aja home safely.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Authorities say he is driving a 1992 white Toyota Paseo with the Oklahoma license plate of 577 BPW.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I need my little girl back! She`s missing. I love her dearly. And she needs her medication!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. After Haleigh`s father, Ronald Cummings, and baby-sitter-turned-stepmother Misty Croslin both handcuffed, arrested, booked, Haleigh`s father breaks his silence from behind bars tonight. What, if anything, do these felony arrests mean in the search for 5-year- old Haleigh?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ms. Cummings, you`ve been charged with four counts of trafficking in hydrocodone out of Putnam County...
CUMMINGS: She put Haleigh to bed, done some laundry and went to bed, and woke up to the door propped open.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A total of five counts of trafficking hydrocodone out of Putnam County and one count (INAUDIBLE) St. Johns County.
CUMMINGS: I don`t think Misty holds any information that`s going to find Haleigh.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From behind bars, Haleigh`s father, Ronald Cummings, allegedly says officers told him their main focus is not putting him in jail, it was finding Cummings`s 5-year-old daughter.
CROSLIN: She`s gone, and that`s all I know!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have stated all along and I will continue to state that my grandchildren love Misty and that Misty loved my grandchildren.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Haleigh`s father refused to talk specifically about the drug charges, simply calling them a setback in his life.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Investigators say they will try to interview the people who were arrested while in custody about Haleigh`s disappearance.
CROSLIN: They go out and look for the right person, maybe they`d -- they would be -- would have the answers, but they`re trying to get all the answers from me.
CUMMINGS: How the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) can you let my daughter get stole, (EXPLETIVE DELETED)!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: More likely is she was passed out, did not remember what had happened because she was doing drugs for three or four days on a big party.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why did you say one thing one time and one time the other -- one thing the other?
CROSLIN: I don`t know.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But you know you did do that?
CROSLIN: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Apparently, when Haleigh was first reported missing, you said she would be -- she was wearing a pink shirt. And you have now said that, no, in fact, she was not wearing that pink shirt, and I believe that pink shirt was actually found at your home. Can you explain that discrepancy for me?
CROSLIN: I was in the house with the detectives. They were showing me -- had me go back in the house to show them some stuff. And I was looking by the dirty clothes for the clothes she was wearing earlier that day for school, and I found that shirt and I showed the detectives. If I was hiding something, why would I show the cops the shirt?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That was Misty Croslin on NBC`s "Today" show talking about the accusation that her story does not add up, which it does not. We are taking your calls live.
But first to Art Harris, investigative journalist at Artharris.com. Art, today, in the last hours, Ronald Cummings has broken his silence from behind bars. What did he say?
ART HARRIS, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALIST: Nancy, he said that the focus of the investigation was not on him but in finding Haleigh. That`s what the police told him when they threw him on the ground and cuffed him. And that he was also asked, did he believe Misty knew anything about it? He said he wasn`t sure but didn`t see how she could go that long and keep a secret.
GRACE: Well, I have to agree with him on that. But I mean, Art, we`ve shown one example of how nothing she says makes any sense. She can never explain why her story differs every time she tells it. And Art, let`s go back over what she said the child was wearing the night she disappeared and then her discovery of that very outfit there in the home.
HARRIS: Well, I believe it was a pink outfit, Nancy, and then, wasn`t that in the wash afterwards? But I know there were a lot of other contradictions from where she said Haleigh was sleeping. At first, it was on the bed with her. Then it was on the mattress on the floor. There was talk that they looked under the bed. But how can you look under a mattress? A lot of contradictions in what Misty was saying that night and it just didn`t make sense. And her brother, Tommy, says he shows up, bangs on the door, no one`s home. Misty says later she was asleep and didn`t hear him. Just a lot of -- a lot of suspicions, Nancy.
GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Is there finally a break in the search for 5-year-old Haleigh?
Straight to you, Marlaina Schiavo, our producer on the story. What else did Ronald Cummings have to say from behind bars?
MARLAINA SCHIAVO, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: He mentioned, Nancy, that Misty hasn`t told him anything new at this point that we haven`t already heard. And we`re still waiting to see if she`s going to say something. However, we know her lawyer has advised her not to say a word. Ronald also said that the police have not questioned him at all. He has spoken to his attorney one time. He visited him the other day in jail. And he is sort of waiting. The one thing he did say, Nancy, is that he really does think he`s going to go to prison.
GRACE: Out to the lines. Eleanor, Illinois. Hi, Eleanor.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. How are you?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. I have a question. Is there a law in Florida about statutory rape? And if so, could this be why Ronald married Misty at the time that he did, because she was under age? And if so, that might be why they`re divorced now, so he can`t -- they can`t charge him for anything now?
GRACE: Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining us tonight, Susan Moss, family law attorney out of New York, defense attorney Raymond Giudice out of Atlanta, and a special guest joining us tonight, Mark Nejame. He is joining us out of Orlando. He is also the attorney for Texas Equusearch founder Tim Miller.
Mark Nejame, what is the law in Florida regarding statutory rape? What is the age?
MARK NEJAME, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: It`s 16 or 17. It depends upon the difference of age between the alleged perpetrator and the alleged victim. But in this particular case, it would have required Misty to have cooperated and indicated that something, some sex, had occurred. I doubt, the way this was going, that could have ever been proven.
GRACE: To Sue Moss. I don`t know of many jurisdictions that place statutory rape, which is basically rape of a minor, at 17. It`s very often 16 or under. What do you know, Sue Moss?
SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: You`re absolutely right. It`s usually 16 or under. But honestly, when there is a huge difference in age, even 17 can hit the statutory rape mark.
GRACE: What about it, Ray?
RAYMOND GIUDICE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, in Georgia, we have a new law that, as was just pointed out, is based upon the age difference. So you can be over 16, but if there`s a disproportionate age limit, it`s a sexual assault case, not a rape case. But I will also address the caller`s question. Them getting married would not have stopped the prosecution from getting a statutory rape warrant, if there was evidence of it.
GRACE: And unique, Raymond Giudice, to Florida law is the fact that the husband/wife marital privilege...
GIUDICE: That`s right.
GRACE: ... does not apply to abuse on a child, whether it be Haleigh...
GIUDICE: That`s right.
GRACE: ... or whether Misty Croslin was under the law a child at the time they started their relationship. So under either circumstance, the marriage would not have precluded her testifying.
GIUDICE: Right. There was lots of speculation at the time of their marriage and it`s just irrelevant. It wouldn`t have applied. It wouldn`t have protected anybody.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CROSLIN: I wish that they would have took me instead of her, you know, because I could have fought. You know, she`s only 5. She can`t really do anything. And I just wish they would have took me instead of her!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have the money at this time to hire a lawyer?
CROSLIN: I have a lawyer.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Misty Cummings, her brother, Hank Croslin, Jr., and Ronald Cummings charged with drug trafficking.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her bond is set at $950,000.
GRACE: One hundred and eighty possible years if these counts run consecutive.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There should be no leniency!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Someone`s got to sit down across the table from her, look her in the eye and say, You`re not going anywhere for a long time anyway. You ought to tell us what you know.
CUMMINGS: She pretty much tells me the same thing each time she -- I ask her about it.
CROSLIN: I loved her like she`s my own, and I`ll do anything to get her back!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who was with her -- the last person with her? She was!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Meanwhile, Haleigh`s grandmother says she also believes Croslin is withholding information that could help the Haleigh case.
GRACE: Ms. Neves, I don`t mean to grill you, but it just doesn`t all fit together.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: To me, it`s a very dysfunctional family, and that`s the best way I can describe that.
CROSLIN: Anything for Haleigh, I`ll do.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She is still the most important witness in this case. She`s the last person to see the children. She was with them. She`s an important person to be spoken to, and law enforcement needs to go get her.
CROSLIN: I was home. I was home. I don`t know where anybody come with I wasn`t home. I was home.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Apparently, when Haleigh was first reported missing, you said she would be -- she was wearing a pink shirt. And you have now said that, no, in fact she was not wearing that pink shirt. And I believe that pink shirt was actually found at your home. Can you explain that discrepancy for me?
CROSLIN: I was in the house with the detectives. They were showing me -- had me go back in the house to show them some stuff. And I was looking by the dirty clothes for the clothes she was wearing earlier that day for school, and I found that shirt and I showed the detectives. If I was hiding something, why would I show the cops the shirt?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Maybe because they saw it lying there on the floor and you had to say something? That was Croslin again, speaking out on NBC`s "Today" show after accusations her story does not add up.
We are taking your calls live. What difference will these charges make -- to Marc Klaas? Marc, I`m sure you`re familiar with everything bio dad Ronald Cummings has said from behind bars, that when he was thrown down on the ground and arrested, the cops said, This isn`t about drugs, this is about Haleigh, that he was going to prison, it`s a setback in his life, that he is in isolation and he says that is because it`s a high-profile case, that it`s hard to think that Misty Croslin doesn`t know what happened, but it`s also hard to believe she could keep a secret this long.
MARC KLAAS, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: Well, we know that she can`t keep a secret. I mean, we know that Misty is not a criminal mastermind simply through the way that she exposed herself and got herself sucked up in this drug trafficking situation. I think that drugs...
GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa! Marc Klaas, hold on one moment, OK? You don`t get sucked into selling drugs, all right? Now, Marc Klaas, I very typically agree with you. You`re a crime victim, I`m a crime victim, and I really respect the way that you have been a crusader for the rest of your life since the murder of your little girl, Polly. But I disagree that she`s sucked into anything. When you were her age, going on 19, I doubt you were out trafficking in drugs, all right? So she`s not sucked in. This is her decision to live this way! Go ahead.
KLAAS: Absolutely. And I couldn`t agree more. When I said that, Nancy, what I mean is that she was so easily taken in by the undercover cop who purchased the drugs from her over the course of a month. Drugs are a common theme from the beginning of this case, particularly prescription drugs, and I think what we have here is we have the truth laid out before us.
I believe that this young girl is a drug-addled addict that -- her parenting skills comes from what she knows. I believe that this problem probably goes back in her family at least one more generation. All you have to do is look at her 41-year-old mother, who looks 70 years old, to realize that there are some huge problems within this family.
And remember, last September, she said that there was -- she had a dream-like state of four people being in the house. Well, I suspect that`s absolutely what happened. And I suspect that she is so disengaged from consciousness that what she needs right now is a two or three-year detox, and maybe some of these -- some of these details will become clear finally.
GRACE: OK, a lot of pieces are starting to fit together. Listen to this 911 call that went down a couple of months ago.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
911 OPERATOR: 911. Do you have an emergency?
CROSLIN: I need someone -- what`s this place called?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t know.
CROSLIN: I just (EXPLETIVE DELETED) some -- some black...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
CROSLIN: Some black guy just jumped in my car and stole my whole (ph) purse and threw me out the car, and said he had a gun and said he was going to shoot me!
911 OPERATOR: OK, where are you at right now?
(END AUDIO CLIP)
GRACE: That`s right, blame the black man. Don`t say, I`m out selling dope and somebody stole it. What about it, Sheryl McCollum?
SHERYL MCCOLLUM, CRIME ANALYST: The most telling thing to me, Nancy, about this 911 tape -- her voice is high. It`s rapid. She is afraid. She`s giving as much detail as she possibly can in a short period of time. She did not do that the night Haleigh went missing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Was the bed made?
CROSLIN: No. I was sleeping in that bed. How would the bed be made if someone`s sleeping in the bed? I wasn`t the only one sleeping in it. But how would it -- me and his son, how would the bed be made if we were in the bed sleeping?
They`ve been on me for six months. They haven`t left me alone for six months. I`ve been the one, the main focus. They just need to move on and look for the right person.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So here`s the back door and here`s the lock. It sticks. So there you go. Now we open the back door, and here`s the back screen door, the one that was propped open with the cinderblock, OK? Now, like -- now, if you see, when it closes, it slams. It makes a loud noise. But if you leave this door, this slowly closes, as well.
911 OPERATOR: OK, sir, let me talk to your wife. Let me get some information from her.
CUMMINGS: (INAUDIBLE)
911 OPERATOR: Can I talk to her?
CUMMINGS: (INAUDIBLE)
911 OPERATOR: OK.
CUMMINGS: How the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) can you let my daughter get stole, (EXPLETIVE DELETED)!
(END AUDIO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Out to Toni in Tennessee. Hi, Toni.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. How are you?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Your twins are beautiful. And I have two questions.
GRACE: Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One is, what`s going to happen to the little boy that Ronald Cummings had? Who`s going to get custody? And will they willing to drop some of them drug charges just to get her to say where Haleigh Cummings is?
GRACE: Well, here`s my take on that, Toni. First of all, I`m going to go to Marlaina Schiavo and Art Harris on the update of custody. But she`s looking at a total of about 180 years if she gets 30 years on each traffic -- drug trafficking count run consecutively, which they can do, all right, 180 years. But unless they do a deal where they say, OK, if you killed Haleigh we`ll give you manslaughter, 20 years on manslaughter, we will not seek the death penalty, we will not prosecute you on murder one, they got to do a packaged deal on the drugs and the murder. That`s what they`ve got to do if they want this woman to talk.
And I kind of agree with Marc Klaas. I don`t know how much she knows about what happened because I think she was high as a kite. Her mind is fried. That little girl, that baby didn`t have a chance, Toni.
To you, Art Harris. What`s the status on custody?
HARRIS: I can tell you that the little boy, Junior, Haleigh`s brother, was turned over to mother Crystal Sheffield and that she took her...
GRACE: OK, Art, pause. Art, I have a question. I`m always suspicious of why doesn`t a mommy get custody to start with? You think, as much as I love my husband, that over my dead body would I let them get custody of the children? Oh, no, there will not be a divorce, Art Harris, much less a custody argument! So why did she lose custody to start with?
HARRIS: She was in court and she testified that she had done drugs when she and Ronald were together, and she did not get custody. Ronald had custody. And in this case, they actually drug tested her before they turned over Junior and did a home evaluation, which she passed, Nancy.
GRACE: You`re telling me she lost custody because she didn`t have a job? Did I just hear him say that?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Have e you asked her what happened? What does she tell you?
RONALD CUMMINGS, FATHER OF MISSING 5-YR-OLD HALEIGH CUMMINGS: I ask her, but I don`t get any answers.
TERESA NEVES, GRANDMOTHER OF MISSING 5-YR-OLD, HALEIGH CUMMINGS: We have all encouraged her to speak with the police.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Bottom line, you don`t know where Haleigh is?
MISTY CROSLIN, RONALD CUMMING`S EX-WIFE, LAST SEEN HALEIGH: Bottom line.
CUMMINGS: She pretty much tells me the same thing each time she`s -- I ask her about it.
CROSLIN: I would have woke up if I heard any noise. I mean, I didn`t hear anything at all.
GRACE: You`ve been in the trailer just like we have been and somebody pounding on the front door as close as her bed was to the front door, you would hear it. It`s 10 feet away.
NEVES: I think the children would have been more likely to hear it.
CUMMINGS: I want to get to the bottom of what happened. One way or another I want my daughter to come home.
GRACE: Ronald Cummings, did it ever disturb you that Misty Croslin`s story actually changed?
CUMMINGS: Yes, ma`am, it did. I can`t really recall the exact changes. And they`re really small. It`s not like she -- she pretty much tells me the same thing each time she`s -- I ask her about it. So there might be a difference in the way that it`s worded.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: If he`s convinced Misty Croslin knows more or is even involved in the disappearance of his daughter, what is he doing out in the car with her selling dope, Art Harris?
ART HARRIS, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALIST, ARTHARRIS.COM, INTERVIEWED MISTY CROSLIN, HALEIGH`S NEW STEPMOM: I can tell you his family and Ronald tried to stay close to her and tried to psych her out, and I`m not unconvinced that the divorce wasn`t a way to rattle her cage.
Misty told a friend of hers that Ron`s mother -- we can ask her -- actually appeared over her one night when she woke up just staring at her. And so she felt the pressure from the family and Ronald may well have seen himself as a double agent in a weird way. He defended her in public.
GRACE: OK.
HARRIS: But went after her in private.
GRACE: Art, back to your last response. Why did the mother, Crystal Sheffield, lose custody of Haleigh and Junior to start with? Now she`s got Junior back.
HARRIS: Bottom line.
GRACE: Is that a good thing?
HARRIS: Well, it is in the eyes of court. At the time Ronald was the one who had the job. He was the more stable parent in the eyes of the judge and could provide for the children. He had health insurance. Crystal did not have anything. And.
GRACE: You know, Art, I`m really surprised with all the cases you`ve covered that you could even say that with a straight face. The mom loses custody because she doesn`t have health insurance? You know, I`m going to let you rethink that for a moment.
HARRIS: It`s a package, Nancy. He had the package, he had the job, he had the health insurance. And he did not, under oath, admit to taking drugs or doing drugs in court. She did.
GRACE: So you`re basically telling me he was less doped up than her?
HARRIS: Basically.
GRACE: OK. Out to Mark Nejame, a veteran defense attorney, excellent reputation. He represents a player in this case, Tim Miller.
Everyone, you know Tim Miller. He founded Texas EquuSearch. This is after the murder of his daughter. And he has gone on countless searches for missing children, missing people since that tragedy in his life.
Now, keep Nejame up. Let me go to Marlaina Schiavo. Who was Donna Broch? She was just arrested along with Misty Croslin and all of this dope selling, trafficking, no less than 28 grams or over. Where does Donna Broch fit in with Nejame`s client, Tim Miller?
MARLAINA SCHIAVO, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER, COVERING STORY: Donna was originally a volunteer for Texas EquuSearch. And in the beginning -- in the fall of 2009 she teamed up with Misty. Tim Miller decided that he was going to get to the bottom of what Misty was saying.
He sends Donna out there to sort of pal around with her, take her out to see if she can get the story. But as time went on, Nancy, as we know, and the road rage incident happened, Tim broke off from Donna. They completely parted ways and nothing -- Donna didn`t get anything from Misty.
GRACE: Please put Schiavo back up.
Marlaina, correct me if I`m wrong. But on Thursday night we discussed this and you said that Tim Miller had basically bankrolled Donna Broch, that he had paid for all sorts of gifts for supporting her, all sorts of things to get in with Misty Croslin. Did you not?
SCHIAVO: Well, yes and no. Nancy, let me just make it clear.
GRACE: OK.
SCHIAVO: He did give her some funding to take Misty out when she was in Orlando and they went out and they stayed in hotels. And yes, that`s what he did back then. But by October 30th they had parted ways.
And the Christmas gifts that were bought for Misty`s niece and nephew were not funded by him. That came out of Donna`s pocket because at that point she had crossed over, had some unnatural -- emotional attachment to Misty and started helping her on her own.
GRACE: Well, you know, that is certainly putting the perfume on the pig, Marlaina Schiavo, because, Mark Nejame, when you start going along for dope runs, you`ve certainly crossed the line. Tim Miller must be stunned at all of these developments. What`s your response?
MARK NEJAME, DEFENSE ATTORNEY, ATTORNEY FOR TEXAS EQUUSEARCH FOUNDER, TIM MILLER: I think the summary that`s been given is appropriate. Stunned, saddened, and he`s accepted it. Not unlike a bad cop who infiltrates a police department, sometimes there`s bad eggs, bad apples.
When he identified it he completely terminated and suspended and eliminated her rights to Texas EquuSearch. The October 30th date was correct. And when he found out about it which is three months before this recent incident he got rid of her appropriately so.
He`s saddened. He`s sorry. He`s told the people of EquuSearch and around the country that he wishes it was otherwise. But when he found out about it he got rid of her.
GRACE: Let me ask you something, Nejame. Out of all that time and effort, money, too, that he pumped into Donna Broch, did she ever get any information from Misty Croslin?
NEJAME: Not that we know of. And if you told us -- you know, how can we believe anything at this point? You know?
GRACE: True.
NEJAME: If you`re willing to do was come out, whatever`s been said, how can you believe it?
GRACE: Out to Dr. Janet Taylor. She is a medical doctor and psychiatrist joining us out of New York.
Dr. Taylor, what have you -- what do you make of this symbiotic relationship between Ronald Cummings? His daughter`s been missing now for some time. Misty Croslin last one to be with her. Now they`re obviously fraternizing, traffic drugs charges against the two of them.
DR. JANET TAYLOR, PSYCHIATRIST: I mean it`s incredible. And both of them really should have been looking for clues to find Haleigh. They`re both doing drugs. I mean it shows a manipulativeness of both of them and how they really are not focused on finding her. It`s incredible.
GRACE: Back to you, Marc Klaas, president and founder of KlaasKids Foundation. Right now if you were in charge of this investigation how would you use these people behind bars to your advantage?
MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER, KLAASKIDS FOUNDATION: Well, I would keep Misty Croslin behind bars for as long as is humanly possible and basically throw the book at her in an attempt to do one of two things.
Number one, get her into that detox state so that her brain clears up and she can provide some useful information. Or number two, use it as leverage so she might provide something that she does know which I really doubt that she does know consciously.
GRACE: To Sheryl McCollum, crime analyst, director of the Cold Case Squad, Pinelake PD.
Sheryl McCollum, this case is quickly becoming a cold case. If I were running that prosecution I would take Misty Croslin to trial.
SHERYL MCCOLLUM, CRIME ANALYST, DIR. OF COLD CASE SQUAD AT PINE LAKE P.D.: Absolutely.
GRACE: I would get the maximum, if I could, on every single count and if they happened on different occasions run them consecutively.
MCCOLLUM: Absolutely.
GRACE: And if she sits there looking at 180 years behind bars I`d let her sit there for about a year, 18 months. Because the state`s not in a hurry. All right?
MCCOLLUM: No reason to be in a hurry.
GRACE: You know, let it breathe for a few moments. You know? Let it marinate. Let it develop, should we say, and then go to her when she`s been off the sauce for about 18 months. And offer a packaged deal on the drugs or a remodification, end with a manslaughter.
MCCOLLUM: That`s one way to do it. I`d tell you I`d go after her brother. During this 12-month period of time that Haleigh`s been missing, when he was arrested, he put himself at the crime scene. He said he was there, he knocked on the door, nobody answered. He`s also a real good witness. Make him the deal.
GRACE: Everyone, we are taking your calls live. As you can see, there`s the mugshot of girlfriend-turned-stepmother, the baby-sitter, Misty Croslin.
Very quickly, a special happy birthday to Georgia friend, Cathy Castrocone (ph). She delivered beautiful between twin girls, Isabella and Gabriella, and has brought them along with great love and devotion from an extremely premature birth to the healthy, happy girls you see right here.
She made time to cheer on not just me but other moms of twins that like us have faced huge physical obstacles. Isa and Gabby, you`re so lucky to have Cathy as your mommy.
Happy birthday, Cathy.
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Law enforcement needs your help in tracking down the Amber Alert issued for 7-year-old Aja Johnson.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just love her so much and I just want her back.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The Amber Alert issued after Aja`s mom, Tonya Hobbs, found dead inside the camper where she was staying with Aja.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One of the family members actually pried the door, the trailer open and they found the body of Tonya Hobbs inside the residence.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Police say Johnson was meeting with her estranged husband Lester Hobbs. The two allegedly separated, but trying to reconcile. Now, the estranged husband is gone, allegedly with Aja.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Hobbs is 46 years of age, 6`1" and 190 pounds.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Cops say Lester Hobbs should be considered armed and dangerous. Possibly driving Aja in a white 1992 Toyota Paseo with two doors, no hub caps, and plastic covering the rear passenger window.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What`s concerning us is Lester Hobbs is not present at this location nor is 7-year-old Aja.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Time of the essence. Aja has a serious medical condition that requires her to take medication.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She was going to go to a birthday party. All she had was a pair of clothing for that evening and that day and her medication for that evening and the next morning. Now she`s without all that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The family became concerned yesterday when they didn`t see Tonya or her small daughter. Once the family noticed that they hadn`t been around on Sunday afternoon they became concerned. One of the family members actually pried the door of the trailer open and found the body of Tonya Hobbs inside the residence.
What`s concerning us is Lester Hobbs is not present at this location nor is 7-year-old Aja Hobbs. There is no relationship between Lester Hobbs -- and I`m sorry, let me clarify that name. It`s Aja Johnson. There is no relationship between them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: OK. I need to clear something up. Out to you, Clark Goldband, our producer on the story.
Clark, there`s no blood relationship whatsoever between the suspect and the little girl, and it`s my understanding that there is a court order for the mother, the child`s mother, to keep the child away from him specifically.
What happened? Why was she there at his home in an RV with the little girl?
CLARK GOLDBAND, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER, COVERING STORY: You hit the nail on the head, Nancy. First of all, Aja Johnson not allowed to be with Lester Hobbs, no relation. For all intents and purposes they don`t know each other. Although technically her stepfather.
So let`s move that aside. The second part of your question, there was an emergency temporary order which I have right here from the court that specifically mentions -- let`s read from it.
It says this child shall not be left alone with Tonya Hobbs, the respondent, or Lester Hobbs at all. The court specifically saying this child never should have been with Hobbs in the first place.
Now mom -- excuse me, mom, Tonya Hobbs, found dead inside that RV trailer. Law enforcement arrives on the scene. The child nowhere to be found. Now they believe Hobbs is traveling with the child, Aja, in a 1995 white Toyota Paseo, and could be as far away as Oklahoma, Texas, or California.
GRACE: OK. Let me ask you this. You know, let me go to Dave Lanning with KOKC News Talk, joining us from Oklahoma City.
Dave, what -- in a nutshell, what was the mother doing back with this guy? Why was she visiting him?
DAVE LANNING, REPORTER, KOKC NEWS/TALK (via phone): Well, you know what, at one point in time we understood that he had called her asking to see the child and the child`s sister because he had an appointment with the court today and was kind of worried about it.
He was supposed to report to court this morning on some DUI charges from earlier last year. So we understand that the mother, Tonya Hobbs, may have a story to pass along to the dad, J.J. Johnson, that she was taking the girls to a party overnight when, in fact, was going to Geronimo to meet with Hobbs. And -- with the possibility of trying to reconcile.
GRACE: Oh, good Lord in heaven.
LANNING: At that point.
GRACE: This guy has a rap sheet as long as the interstate. She filed a TRO against him claiming that he threatened to hit the child in the head with a hammer and kill her if she tried to leave him. Then she goes back over there with the little girl in an RV. Suddenly mommy is dead. Baby is gone with this guy.
Take a look. This is the suspect in this case. Phone number 580-355- 1115. That is the suspect that you are seeing. 577-B, brother, P, Pennsylvania, W, Wyoming, is the tag plate. There is a chance to save this little girl.
To Jessica Brown, the PIO, public information officer, with the Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation, thank you for being with us.
Miss Brown, explain to me, have there been any legitimate sightings of the little girl since she went missing?
JESSICA BROWN, PUBLIC INFORMATION DIRECTOR, OKLAHOMA STATE BUREAU OF INVESTIGATION (via phone): I don`t know how legitimate they have been, but we have gotten several people who have called in claiming to have seen her across the state. We`re following those leads right now. We have nothing definite.
GRACE: What was the mode of the murder of Tonya Hobbs?
BROWN: We`re not releasing that at this point because we haven`t heard back from the medical examiner`s office. But I can tell you my investigators do say it`s obvious she was murdered.
GRACE: And to Dave Lanning with KOKC News/Talk there in Oklahoma City, the little girl apparently has some type of medical issue? Because I heard the relative is claiming she needs her medication. What medication for what?
LANNING: Well, what we understand, as the official answer has not yet been released. But there have been reports that she suffers from attention deficit syndrome and insomnia, apparently very severe. And that`s what she`s taking medication for.
GRACE: What about it, to you, Clark Goldband, what do you how?
GOLDBAND: Well, Nancy, those are questions we`ve been asking law enforcement all day. We are not able to confirm. But what I can tell you is, law enforcement has said this at the very front that she is in desperate need of some form of pills or medication and they certainly wouldn`t put that out there unless.
GRACE: Your office says desperate need of her medication. I don`t think that would apply to ADD or insomnia. What is her medical condition?
I think I`ve got Jessica Brown with me.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: . at this point in time, Nancy.
GRACE: I want to go straight out to Dr. Gwenn O`Keefe, pediatrician, founder and CEO of Pediatricsnow.com.
Dr. O`Keefe, thank you for being with us. This little girl doesn`t even know this man. I mean there are no blood relation whatsoever and he`s on the run with her. What dangers, obviously, other than murder or assault is this child facing? And police are saying she`s in desperate need or medication. She`s 7 years old.
DR. GWENN O`KEEFE, M.D., PEDIATRICIAN, FOUNDER & CEO OF PEDIATRICSNOW.COM: Well, Nancy, I think there`s two big issues. One is her medical condition that sounds quite significant. And I agree, ADD is not a significant medical condition and the medicine she`d be on would not put her life at risk.
So we have to very concerned that she has a major medical problem where she needs a daily medication and she could withdraw from a medication if she`s taking something daily and doesn`t get it.
So there`s a real crisis here in her not being medicated daily. But being with a stranger is frightening to a child, especially a stranger who is violent. So this is a concerning and very high risk situation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She has a little problem with a sleeping disorder. And a little attention disorder. So she needs her medication to kind of help her sleep at night.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: An Amber Alert is issued for Aja Daniell Johnson who you see her. Comanche County Deputies found the body of her mother, 37-year-old Tonya Hobbs, last night in her RV parked in Geronimo. And police believe Aja is with her mother`s estranged husband.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight to the lines, Vick in Kentucky. Hi, Vicky.
VICKY, CALLER FROM KENTUCKY: Hi. How are you?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
VICKY: I love your show and I love your kids.
GRACE: Thank you.
VICKY: I was wondering what type of criminal history this man has.
GRACE: Go ahead, Clark.
GOLDBAND: He`s got a few convictions for DUI, Nancy, but perhaps most disturbing assault and battery, felony charges.
GRACE: And what do we know about those assault and battery charges, Dave Lanning with KOKC?
LANNING: Well, in fact, Hobbs was actually convicted of one in 2001 and served time for that. The most recent, though, that he was going to court for today was a DUI charge from 2009. Most of his history indicates a drinking problem and a pretty good temper which is obviously one of the reasons we should be very concerned that the child is with him.
GRACE: Marc Klaas, weigh in.
KLAAS: Yes, Nancy, this is another violent offender living his life sentence on the installment plan. Being regurgitated into society again and again until the life of an innocent child hangs in the balance.
This is a scenario that plays out oftentimes on your show and on society and costs many young children, including my daughter, their lives.
GRACE: Sheryl McCollum?
MCCOLLUM: Absolutely. Look at the past five months. August, mom gets a protective order. Hobbs is named. In November, dad wants a -- you know, an emergency protective order to get the child custody. Hobbs is named again. By January, mom is murdered, child is missing. Hobbs is named again.
GRACE: Everyone, the tip line in finding Hobbs, hopefully with the little girl alive. 580-355-1115. The Geronimo Police Department.
Let`s stop, everyone, and remember Army Sergeant Forrest Dane Cauthorn, 22, Charles City, Virginia, killed Iraq. Known by the middle name Dane, he loved Harleys, the state of Virginia, and pops, his father.
He is remembered for a zest for life. Cauthorn and his father had a very special bond and a level of respect for one another seldom seen. He leaves behind father Forrest Cauthorn, his father`s girlfriend, Debbie, uncles Lewis and Dave, aunts Maggie and Caroline. Great Uncle Bill, Great Aunt Fran.
Forrest Dane Cauthorn, American hero.
Thanks to our guests. Our biggest thank you, as usual, is to you for inviting all of us into your homes. And a special thank you tonight for Miss Joan Rivers who sent me this and some other beautiful necklaces from her QVC collection. I`m flattered that you would send these.
Everyone, see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. Mother, get well. Until tomorrow, good night, friend.
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