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Nancy Grace
Man Runs Over Ex-Wife`s Dog; Colorado Running Out of Pot; Search For Heather Elvis Continues
Aired January 07, 2014 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Off to the top, we go to Hawthorne, and the eye of the storm, the middle of a nasty, acrimonious divorce. So what does Hubby do, consult lawyers, cry on the shoulders of friends and relatives, try to get her back with promises, roses, tears, gifts? Oh, no!
Bombshell tonight. Caught on tape, hubby driving his Nissan Maxima into an alley to his wife`s pet Chihuahua, Cow Cow (ph), pointing the car at the dog, then zooming over Cow Cow as if he were a speed bump, never looking back, the dog caught on video writhing, crying, yelping in pain, in agony until the little dog dies in the alley. Tonight, love American style sinks to an all-time low!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The video is awful to watch.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I feel sad.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That was totally wrong.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police say Michael Parker drove to the alley, took the dog out and then purposely hit the cute little pet Chihuahua. A friend says this cruel act stems from a bitter divorce the driver is going through. The cute little dog is left alone, dying in the alley.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, in the last hours, the state of Colorado runs out of pot. Yes. I don`t mean pots and pans. I mean marijuana, weed, maryjane, hash, rope, spliff, loud (ph). Why? Because Colorado legalizes pot!
Hey, you want your baby-sitter high on pot? I don`t. You want your cab or your school bus driver high on pot? I don`t. How about your yard guy back there in the back of the yard burning your leaves? Want him high on pot? How about those workers in your children`s school cafeteria burning things on an open flame? You want them high on pot?
Well, get ready for a marijuana crime wave, Colorado, because here it comes!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Weed has gone mainstream.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`ve been dreaming about this since I started smoking.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For the first day you where can buy recreational pot, marijuana, the lines have been long, sales brisk.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They`ve sold about 20 pounds of marijuana every day.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They were all like kids in a candy store.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, live to Myrtle Beach and the desperate search for a 20-year-old restaurant hostess who disappears after a dinner at a Mexican restaurant. Her Dodge Intrepid turns up nearby abandoned. Tonight, where is Heather?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Twenty-year-old Heather Elvis vanished.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She texted me a picture. She had a smile on her face, just normal. I mean, she was having a good time.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The boyfriend or the guy she went on a date with said he saw her car parked at the apartment.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her car was found in a rural area a few days later.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Please help us find our daughter.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. Off to the top, we go the Hawthorne, the eye of the storm, the middle of an acrimonious, nasty divorce. So what does Hubby do? Call the lawyers, cry on the shoulders of friends and relatives, try to get her back with promises, roses, tears, presents? No!
Caught on tape, hubby drives his Nissan Maxima into an alley to the wife`s pet Chihuahua named Cow Cow, points the car at the dog, then speeds over the dog, Cow Cow, like he`s a speed bump.
I want to warn you this video is graphic and disturbing, the little dog caught on video writhing, screaming in pain, in agony until he dies alone in the alley. Check it out. Look. Hold that video! Look at that? He pulls back. The dog is just standing there. He was all wagging his little tail, until he drives directly over the dog.
Tonight, love American style sinks to an all-time low! Now, we`re going to show you the video in full, but I want to warn you it`s very, very upsetting.
We are taking your calls. To Larry Altman, reporter with "The Daily Breeze" who broke the story. You know what? I don`t think three years is appropriate. That`s the maximum he could get for this. I think that`s too good for him, Larry.
Tell me what happened. I understand they`re in the middle of a divorce. It`s extremely nasty. They`re splitting. And friends and family have reported -- and I don`t know if know this or not or if you can confirm it - - that he wanted her to -- oh, there`s a good shot. Hey, let`s see the selfie he took of himself without a shirt. There you go! Is he going to drink that whole thing? Oh, yes, that`s my fave. Let`s hold on that. You know, Kim Kardashian could take some pointers from this guy when it comes to bedroom selfies. OK.
It`s my understanding, Larry Altman, that he wanted her to sign some documents that would give him the house and he was angry when she refused?
LARRY ALTMAN, "THE DAILY BREEZE" (via telephone): Yes. And I was told by a friend of hers that he then made threats against her and her family. The dogs were living in that house.
GRACE: Whoa, whoa, wait, wait, wait, Larry! I don`t know if you can see the monitor, but check out this house. I see why they`re fighting over it. That`s some little crib they`ve got going on right there. That`s beautiful. Look at that landscaping. I wonder how many years of effort they put in getting that house in that state with that beautiful landscaping around it. Then they split.
Now, you just kind of glossed over something. Did you say threats on the family?
ALTMAN: Yes. I was told by a friend of hers, from the wife, that he had made threats against her and her family when she refused to sign the papers that day, December 28th, to sign the house over to him. And he was very angry about it. And the next thing...
GRACE: Why should she turn the house over to him, Larry Altman? Everybody, Larry Altman joining me from Torrance (ph). He`s the reporter with "The Daily Breeze" that broke the story.
A couple of ideas just right off the top. Where did this video come from, Larry?
ALTMAN: Well, in various parts much southern California, people have video now everywhere pointing at alleys and businesses and everything. And somebody there had surveillance video for protection on both ends of that alley. So you can see this dog killing from both ends of that alley front and back.
GRACE: Look at this little dog. You know what he reminds me of, Larry Altman, my Aunt Rose`s dog, Pudding. Of course, Pudding would eat nothing but candy corn for the last six years of his life, but -- OK, how can -- hold on, Larry. I`ve got with me right now. Lieutenant Scott Swain (ph). He`s the public information officer for the Hawthorne PD. Police are quoted as saying you never expect to see a little animal like that run over and left there to die, that it is shocking.
Was this all payback because of the split?
LT. SCOTT SWAIN, HAWTHORNE POLICE DEPARTMENT (via telephone): Well, Nancy, we don`t have any indication. The witnesses that we`ve talked to so far haven`t indicated that. But we have learned from some of the witnesses or people from -- that Larry Altman has come in to contact that that may -- that may have been a motive. So we are planning on speaking with those individuals within the next few days.
GRACE: You know, with me is Justin Freiman, our producer, but also Jane Velez-Mitchell, host of "JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL." Take a look at this, Jane. I know how you feel about animals. But when the guy drives up -- and this is a grown man, Michael David Parker. He drives up, the little dog starts wagging its little tail and he`s excited.
JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST, "JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL": Trust.
GRACE: The -- his Mommy and Daddy have gone through a split. So a neutral -- a neutral party is keeping the dog. And he comes up, he sees -- he gets out of the car, he sees the dog. The dog is wagging its tail, it`s happy, it`s walking around. The dog stops in front of the car and is just looking up at its daddy, and he points that car directly at the dog, runs over it, kills it, and leaves it laying there, crying!
VELEZ-MITCHELL: This is the ultimate act of cowardice and betrayal, Nancy. I have my family. We have three Chihuahua rescues. They look like this. This breaks my heart. It`s nauseating. And this animal shows unconditional love, as all animals do, and loyalty and trust of his human companion. And what he gets is death and betrayal. It`s sickening. He should go to jail for a long time!
GRACE: Yes. And what`s concerning me is he`s only up for three years, but to me, there`s more to it than that. Back to Larry Altman with "The Daily Breeze." Larry, if what friends and family are saying is true, that he has made threats on the family, as well, you know at times like this, according to statistics, crime only escalates. Now, we know this dog -- and he`s caught on video running down his dog in the middle of a split with his wife -- but the other dog is missing, isn`t that true?
ALTMAN: That`s right. They have a dog named Lucky that was living with Cow Cow in the house in San Pedro. And that dog -- nobody knows where that dog is.
GRACE: Everybody, you`re seeing video of this little puppy. This is Lucky, the other dog. But Cow Cow in the middle of a divorce -- the owner allegedly as payback goes to the alley. There you see. He`s pulling the car back. He`s going to aim it directly at the little dog and run over him.
The dog, when you zoom in on the video, is just laying there convulsing and crying and writhing in pain.
Unleash the lawyers. Joining me, Parag Shah, defense attorney and author of "The Code." And also joining me from the Atlanta jurisdiction, Renee Rockwell, veteran trial lawyer.
All right, Renee. You say you`ll take any case but what, child molestation?
(CROSSTALK)
RENEE ROCKWELL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: ... animal cruelty.
GRACE: Let`s hear this. What`s your defense?
ROCKWELL: Nancy, the only defense this guy is going to have is some kind of mental defense. This is not the actions of somebody that`s sane!
GRACE: What mental defense would that be?
ROCKWELL: That he temporarily lost his mind. And don`t you know...
GRACE: Well, are you actually saying temporary insanity? Are you trying to form that thought?
ROCKWELL: Absolutely, Nancy. Does this look like the actions of somebody that knows what he`s doing? This is the kind of guy...
GRACE: Yes. It looks like he knows exactly what he`s doing.
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: ... show that video again. He gets there. He gets out of the car to see the dog. He gets the dog positioned in front of his car. The little guy`s standing there in the middle of the road, and he points it right at the dog. What, he didn`t feel that? Renee, are you telling me...
ROCKWELL: And kept going.
GRACE: He probably went straight to the bank or right back to his office.
ROCKWELL: And kept going, Nancy. And I`m surprised he didn`t back back over the car. (sic) But Nancy, you well know that these situations -- that sometimes Daddy gets out, kills all the kids, kills the wife and kills himself. So this is obviously something that we expect in these contentious divorces. Will he prevail? No.
GRACE: What you`re saying is that with a divorce, you can expect a murder. OK. No!
Let`s go the lines. Patty, Wisconsin. What`s your question, dear?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m just wondering about this Chihuahua, that someone actually ran that dog down, from what I`m understanding?
GRACE: Yes, and it`s caught on tape. It`s caught on tape. He does it in an alley, think nobody`s seeing him, I guess. But the whole thing is caught on tape -- he, his face, his car, the dog, everything.
He`s in the middle of an extremely acrimonious divorce with his wife, and according to friends and family, when she refuses to sign documents giving the house to him, this dog gets run over. Now, is it payback? That`s the question.
All right, Parag Shah. Let`s hear the defense. And don`t even start with temporary insanity.
PARAG SHAH, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Ms. Grace, I think the proper play here is damage control. We need to get him a psychological evaluation and get him some treatment because of the real...
GRACE: Did just tell you...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: ... don`t say temporary insanity?
SHAH: ... is the threat to the other people. But the real thing that we have to...
GRACE: Did I just tell you that?
SHAH: ... protect him from is the threat to other people. We don`t want other charges coming. We need to show the prosecutor...
GRACE: You said you need...
SHAH: ... that he is no threat.
GRACE: ... to protect him from a threat on other people. You know what?
SHAH: We need to show the prosecutor that there is no...
GRACE: You two -- you two...
SHAH: ... threat to other people.
GRACE: ... prove it to me, all right? When you don`t have a video, you say, It didn`t happen. It didn`t happen. Now you`ve got a video. So your fallback, insanity. This proves my point. This guy is going to jail. That`s my prediction.
Everybody, when we come back, the state of Colorado actually runs out of pot. And I don`t mean pots and pans, I mean marijuana, weed, maryjane, hash, roach, spliff, loud. Why? I guess they`re all high because the Colorado assembly has legalized pot! Well, get ready for a marijuana crime wave, Colorado, because here it comes!
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: In the last hours, the state of Colorado runs out of pot. And I don`t mean pots and pans, I mean marijuana, weed, maryjane, hash, roach, spliff, loud. Why? I guess they`re all high. The Colorado assembly legalizes pot.
Well, hold on! Do you want your baby-sitter high on pot? Your cab driver, your school bus driver? How about your yard guy back there burning leaves? You want him high on pot? How about the workers in your children`s school cafeteria there around open flames? Well, get ready for a marijuana crime wave, Colorado, because here it comes!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Out of cannabis closet and into a new era of legal recreational marijuana. The great Colorado smokeout is on. At Medicine Man, Denver, one of the state`s largest dispensaries, driving snow, wind or cold didn`t deter the faithful, the line in the hundreds all day long.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the first legal deal was done. Colorado residents aged 21 and over can purchase up to one ounce of marijuana.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: OK, I guess I should say congratulations, Colorado because you`re setting yourself up for one of the biggest crime waves you`ve ever seen! According to statistics -- oh, there`s some good video. According to statistics, marijuana involved in over 461,000 emergency department visits, 39 percent of all emergency department visits involving illicit drugs -- I didn`t make that up -- that`s according to the U.S. Department of Health -- because of marijuana.
Straight out to Jennifer Morgan, co-host of 600 KCOL radio. Jennifer, thanks for being with us. What the hay? What happened?
JENNIFER MORGAN, KCOL RADIO (via telephone): Well, they legalized it, and everybody wants it. And lines have been crazy out the door. People are shutting down their shops because so many people want it, and they need to just kind of slow things down a bit.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... Colorado, it is legal to sell recreational marijuana.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s like going to the deli.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`ll help who`s next.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Instead of half a pound of ham, it`s an eighth of an ounce of pot.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What does it today feel like?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Freedom.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For new recreational retailers, the biggest concern is demand exceeding supply and the possibility of shortages and higher prices.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Shortages, higher prices, long lines? It sounds like an oil shortage. But no, it`s Colorado marijuana shortages. The legislature, the assembly there in Colorado legalizes pot. And guess what? In about 24 hours, the state has nearly run out of pot.
Back to Jennifer Morgan with KCOL. Jennifer, what possessed the -- what is it, the Colorado legislature or assembly to legalize pot?
MORGAN: I suspect it`s the tax revenue they get from it. There`s a 15 percent excise tax, and up to -- actually, the total can be up to 40 percent tax total, depending on the city, and the state is getting all that money to put back into regulations and for the schools.
GRACE: OK, so for all the schools, but the kids are going to be high on pot. I mean, we just had a case about 72 hours ago in Colorado, where a little girl picks up a pot cookie laying outside, eats it and has to be rushed to the hospital.
With me right now is special guest Brad Lamm. He is an addiction specialist. He was an addict himself. He`s the founder of Breathe Life Healing Centers. Brad, thank you for being with us. You know, I`ve gotten a lot of heat, Brad, a lot of heat since I said yesterday...
BRAD LAMM, INTERVENTIONIST: I know.
GRACE: ... that pot makes you fat and lazy. Now, that`s street talk for lethargic -- pot makes you lethargic and pot makes many, many people, the majority of people, want to eat. Now, there is the...
LAMM: (INAUDIBLE) makes you want to eat.
GRACE: ... rare, rare person that doesn`t gain weight. Maybe Snoop would be a possibility, that stays thing. But that`s what statistics and studies show.
LAMM: But here`s the question, Nancy. First, I was curious, have you ever smoked pot?
GRACE: I`m sorry? What?
LAMM: Have you ever smoked pot? Because it`s so...
GRACE: Absolutely not!
LAMM: ... mainstream now. OK, OK.
GRACE: No, I have not.
LAMM: Here`s my point of view. I am against -- I think pot really harms a lot of people. But it`s become so normalized that I`m not sure that prohibition is the answer, either. There`s a great Harvard study -- and I love that you talk statistics, Nancy, because great Harvard study linking adolescent use of pot to schizophrenia later in the life. And it`s not -- it`s not a no problem problem. I think for many families that grew up smoking pot...
GRACE: Well, you really -- no offense, Brad Lamm...
LAMM: ... -and so they`re telling families...
GRACE: ... but you`re really rubbing me the wrong way because...
LAMM: Really?
GRACE: ... it sounds like you`re saying everybody`s doing it, so let`s just go with the flow. I don`t think that`s right.
LAMM: I`m not! I`m not!
GRACE: Because, I mean, there`s one statistic...
LAMM: I think alcohol...
GRACE: ... Brad...
LAMM: No!
LAMM: This one statistic...
LAMM: No, I think alcohol...
GRACE: ... pot involved in...
LAMM: I think alcohol...
GRACE: ... nearly a half a million emergency calls nationwide.
LAMM: No! And...
GRACE: In fact, 39 percent...
LAMM: ... I agree, Nancy...
GRACE: ... of all EMT calls about drugs is because of pot?
LAMM: No, and I -- don`t -- don`t get me wrong. I think it`s -- it`s -- it`s very, very sad what happens with alcohol and pot, how so many lives are ruined and people do get addicted. I don`t care if people say -- did you -- I mean, you may have seen the headlines yesterday, Nancy, that there were no victims to pot. Lots of people have terrible lives as the result of their addiction to pot.
So I`m -- I`m -- I`m right on board with you. I think people often do get fat and lazy when they just become chronic pot smokers. But I`m not sure that prohibition is the answer, either.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hundreds of people waited in the snow to select their preferred strain of pot.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, this is going to be a cross of oji cush, vanilla cush, and sweet tooth.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the first legal deal was done.
Colorado residents aged 21 and over can purchase up to one ounce of marijuana. Out-of-staters can buy a quarter of an ounce.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m excited. I`ve been dreaming about this since I started smoking.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GRACE: In the last hours, Colorado runs out of pot. Runs out of marijuana. Why? Because the legislature there legalized pot.
Let me give you a few cases that we have covered. Daniel Gray leaves a three-month-old son in a hot car to die as he smokes pot. The baby`s core temperature was 107 degrees. Justin and Britney Aleston, sentenced to 60 years. They starved their baby to death while they preferred smoking pot with friends to taking care of the baby. Catalina Clouser, she drives away in a car with her five-week-old son in the car seat on the roof. He falls off in the middle of an intersection. When asked what happened, mommy high on pot.
Colorado, Kayla Erin Barnett. A four-year-old boy drowns in the pool. Mommy too busy smoking pot. She pled guilty to child abuse. New Jersey, Chevon Thomas, mom beheads son, sticks the tot`s head in the freezer. Toxicology shows pot in mommy`s system. Idaho, Tony and Medina Green, parents charged after 4-year-old child ate a Rice Krispie laced with pot. And the little four-year-ld had to go to the hospital.
With that in mind, let`s go out to Norm Kent. He is the president of the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws. Norm, thank you for being with us. Norm, why should marijuana be legalized?
NORM KENT, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL ORGANIZATION FOR THE REFORM OF MARIJUANA LAWS: Because individual citizens in a free society ought to be able to engage adult choices and make responsible decisions about what they want to consume and put into their bodies. And we ought not to restrict that.
GRACE: Does that extend to crack cocaine and heroin and methamphetamines?
KENT: You know, there are people that are going to engaging different products, recklessly and negligently. Whether it`s housewives using valium years ago --
GRACE: If you could just give me a yes or no.
KENT: The answer is -
GRACE: Does your theory extend to crack, heroin and meth?
KENT: The answer is there`s a big difference -- there`s a big difference and distinction between a cancer patient fighting off the effects of chemotherapy --
GRACE: I`m not talking about medicinal marijuana.
KENT: But I am.
GRACE: But I`m not. That`s not the question posed to you, and you`re not answering because you can`t answer!
KENT: No, I can not only answer --
GRACE: I`m not arguing with medicinal marijuana.
KENT: Yes you are. Because patients like Kathy Jordan outside of Orlando -
GRACE: You can`t answer, can you?
KENT: -- are faced with a choice of going jail if they don`t use marijuana medicinally, and they ought to be able to use it legally. They ought not to have criminal prosecution to take medicine that saves their lives.
GRACE: Uh, sir, I take it Mr. Kent, that you cannot answer. I am not talking about medicinal marijuana.
(CROSSTALK)
KENT: You`re the one who is being irresponsible by saying marijuana leads to a crime wave. Marijuana in Colorado is one of the few places in the nation where it`s now regulated, controlled and taxed, where the product is supervised, and the individuals getting the marijuana are getting it in the healthy and responsible way.
GRACE: OK. Let`s go back to the question that you dodged. I am not referring to medicinal marijuana. I`m not arguing about that. I`m asking you why should recreational use of marijuana be legalized? That is my question.
KENT: And I gave you the answer that we come together as a society not to restrict the rights of any, but to secure the rights of all.
GRACE: Okay.
KENT: And free individuals --
GRACE: That is a quote --
KENT: -- in society should be able to make decisions on their own.
GRACE: And my next question --
KENT: Without you`re telling them how to act.
GRACE: And Mr. Kent, my next question was, under your theory, one should be allowed to smoke crack, heroin, methamphetamine in their home too. Is that okay with you?
KENT: I`m saying that responsible adults ought to make their own choices about what they need to do with their own body.
GRACE: So, is that a yes?
KENT: What`s hard to understand about that?
GRACE: Is that a yes?
KENT: I don`t have to answer yes or no to that. Any product -- look, you know --
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: Okay. Okay. You can refuse to answer. It`s okay. I`m just asking. I`m trying to understand your fury.
KENT: No. No. You just used an example of a four-year-old going to an emergency room. Well, you know what? There might have been a housewife that let Clorox sit next to a washing machine, and the child consumed that. But the mother should be --
GRACE: That`s not what happened.
KENT: Should be prosecuted for negligence either way.
GRACE: This is what responsible people high on pot do. See this little boy? He`s smoking pot. At home. With people that are believed to be fully responsible, those people being his parents.
KENT: If parents act negligently, Nancy, they get prosecuted --
GRACE: You didn`t answer my question. Let`s go back to -- let me go to Yvette Williams, co-owner of Timberline Herbal Clinic. joining me from Denver, Colorado. Miss Williams, thank you for being with us.
YVETTE WILLIAMS, CO-OWNER, TIMERBLINE HERBAL CLINIC: Thank you.
GRACE: Miss Williams, how has business been since pot became legal?
WILLIAMS: Very busy.
GRACE: Like how busy?
WILLIAMS: Probably quadrupled.
GRACE: Do you think it`s all medicinal?
WILLIAMS: The medicinal patients have medicinal cards so this is purely recreational. Some people who chose not to get a medicinal card because they don`t want to be on a list or known by the government have waited for this moment to be able to get their medicine legally. GRACE: Miss Williams - everyone, Yvette Williams with me, the co-owner of Timberline Herbal Clinic. Miss Williams, why do you believe pot should be legalized other than you`re going to have a lot more customers?
WILLIAMS: I believe it`s a safer choice. I feel that our society pushes people in directions that are unsafe. I grew up in an industry where alcohol was the only place where you could go and recreate with other people and that is not a safer choice. I feel like with marijuana, you`re at home. You`re in the privacy your own home --
GRACE: Well, hold on. Let me ask you a question, Ms. Williams. From your argument, you`re saying my only two choices to recreate are to smoke pot or drink booze. Isn`t there an alternative like hanging out with your children and having a great time, going out your boyfriend or girlfriend or your husband, having fun, going to a party, exercising, going to a movie? Why are the only two choices you`re giving me is either get drunk or get high?
WILLIAMS: Those were just two examples, because society thinks alcohol is very acceptable and marijuana is not.
GRACE: OK, I`m asking you -- I`m not asking you about alcohol. I`m asking you about marijuana. Why should marijuana be legalized other than you`re going make a lot of money off of it?
WILLIAMS: I really believe it`s a safer choice. I was a nurse`s aide for many years. I took care of many medical patients. And some had access, some did not have access.
GRACE: I`m not talking about medicinal marijuana!
OK, you know what? You know what, I`m going to go back. Very quickly to Brad Lamm addiction specialist. He`s the founder of Breathe. It`s a life clinic. It`s a healing center.
Brad, every time I ask a pothead why should pot be legalized, they talk in circles. It doesn`t make any sense to me. They start talking about alcohol. They start talking about medicinal marijuana. I`m not arguing with medicinal marijuana -
BRAD LAMM, ADDICTION SPECIALIST: Well, they want it to be legal so they don`t go to jail.
GRACE: I don`t understand this.
LAMM: Some of the sickest patients that we deal with -- and I`ve been helping people for over a decade now -- are people that get sick from pot. And so like me, I can`t drink because I can`t do it safely. I can`t smoke pot safely. So, I think if you`re a person prone to addiction and you get hooked on pot --
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Is pot addictive? Is pot addictive?
LAMM: Yes.
GRACE: I struggle with so many people when I was prosecuting trying to help them, people that had lost their homes, they lost their job, they were losing their family because of an addiction to pot or alcohol. They`ve driven, they`ve crashed into other people, they`ve killed other people in a car because of pot or alcohol. And it`s so hard for them to quit; they can`t quit. And to me, that is dangerous.
With me right now is Chris Dessy, founder of Silver Back, social media expert. Chris, thanks for being with us. What`s happening online with this?
CHRIS DESSY, FOUNDER, SILVER BACK: You know, Nancy, this is obviously a polarizing topic, and the world is watching. They are waiting to see what`s happening in Colorado. And part of that and per all the different details people are posting on Facebook and Twitter, this is the manner in which we aggregate and disseminate information. And people are sharing information. We have some of those details for us today.
Pro from Nicole Showaller Smit. "I am a pot smoker. I would rather have a sitter smoking pot than drunk on alcohol or depressed on antidepressants." --
GRACE: Well, can I ask, why can`t you have a sitter that is cold stone sober?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Weed has gone mainstream.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`ve been dreaming about this since I started smoking.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: First day where you can recreational pot. Marijuana. The lines have been long, sales brisk --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They`ve sold about 20 pounds of marijuana everyday.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They were all like kids in a candy store.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are few complaints here.
LINDA ANDREWS, OWNER, WELLNESS CENTER: I expected to have some business, but I didn`t expect to it be that big.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But because of that, (INAUDIBLE) Wellness Center owner Linda Andrews says there are new complications.
ANDREWS: We are still limiting our purchases.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Customers can only buy an eight of an ounce here, even though state law allows you to purchase a full ounce. Andrew says it`s necessary so they don`t sell out.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GRACE: Well, Colorado has run out of pot, there`s been such a high demand. I guess they Colorado legislature, they are all high. They got to be high on pot because they`ve legalized marijuana in the state of Colorado, and in about 28 hours, they ran out of pot.
We are taking your calls. But first, I want to go back to Norm Kent, the President of the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws. And also with me, Brad Lamm, addiction specialist.
Let`s see both gentlemen at once, Liz. Brad Lamm is the founder of Breathe Life Healing Center and an author of multiple books.
All right. Mr. Kent, I`m going to ask you a different question this time, see what I can get out of you. What do you make of the fact that marijuana is extremely addictive?
KENT: That is absolute nonsense. I can`t believe your disseminating such a lie to the American people. You know, Nancy, you`re such an ardent advocate for victims` rights. Why not speak up for all those people who for the past four decades, hundreds of thousands, millions of Americans that have been wrongly arrested, unjustly prosecuted, illegally jailed, denied scholarships, all because they chose to smoke a joint or use cannibis responsibly? What a shame -
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Actually - actually, I just asked you what you make of marijuana being addictive. That was the only question.
KENT: It`s not. I`m sorry, Mister. I`m sorry the other guest has a problem. But marijuana is not --
GRACE: Ooh, I think I hear something still in my hear. Ooh. Brad Lamm. Brad, let`s hear your response.
KENT: Here`s the thing. This fellow has all this crafted outrage to your question, Nancy. I want to know what is he getting from this? What is your salary? Are you a lobbyist? Are you a pot addict? What really is --
GRACE: Are you a lobbyist?
(CROSSTALK)
KENT: I`m a responsible cannabis consumer, and I do not apologize for it.
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Norm. Norm, are you a lobbyist.
KENT: No, I am not! No, I am not! I am an activist who was a cancer survivor that used cannabis to fight the effects of chemotherapy, and like many of my friends and clients have used it responsibly for decades.
GRACE: OK, whoa, whoa, whoa! Uh oh! The cow is out of the barn. Let`s go back to Brad Lamm. Brad, just like I mentioned earlier, whenever I ask a pothead why --
KENT: Don`t use the word pothead.
GRACE: They start talking -- I was not referring to you. They start talking about medicinal marijuana. But that`s not what we`re talking about. It is addictive, Brad.
LAMM: I think it`s heartbreaking that we`re sitting here having a conversation about passionate people fighting for the right to help people stay sick. I`m all for medicinal marijuana and I actually am against a lot of the prohibition that`s putting people in jail instead of helping them get treatment.
But pot is addictive. A lot of people`s lives are ruined because of it, and to say it`s not is just a lie.
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Here`s another question.
Norm, we`re moving on. We`re moving on to another question. Here`s my question, Norm. According to the Department of Health, 39 percent -- that`s nearly 40 percent of drug related emergency calls -- have to do with pot.
KENT: You know, Nancy, that`s not true. I don`t know where you got that statistic from. I would love to see --
GRACE: That`s not true, either. Um, the U.S. Department of Health.
KENT: Yes. I would like to see that. I would like to know whether or not those people - you know, there are people that go to thing in room.
GRACE: Are high on pot?
KENT: No. They go the emergency room because they were in car accident, but we didn`t ban the thought of having vehicles in our society even though 50,000 people are killed a year --
GRACE: OK, you`re not even making any sense. You`re talk out of your head now.
KENT: No, I`m talking logically and intelligently.
GRACE: Brad?
LAMM: The trouble with pot if it`s no big deal for you, it`s no big deal. And then what about for the hundreds of thousands of people whose lives are terribly upset or completely ruined, are completely thrown off track because of their relationship with pot, Norm? So, for you to stand and advocate -
(CROSSTALK)
KENT: Brad, people like you make bad choices all the time. That doesn`t mean everybody else should have their freedoms restricted.
LAMM: No, but I will tell you -
GRACE: Ok, guys, Brad Lamm, I always become very -- I get very suspicious when people refuse to answer a question outright. Questions that are very, very simple. And duck and dodge and jump on another bandwagon like medicinal marijuana, like alcohol, like why don`t we outlaw cars instead of answering the question. That`s very, very suspicious to me.
Switching gears, when we come back, the desperate search for a 20-year-old restaurant hostess. She disappears after a Mexican dinner. Tonight, where is Heather?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A team of volunteers has set up an around-the-clock effort looking for tips in her disappearance.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Purse and cell phone are missing along with her.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The last communication around 3:41 when she called her roommate to say I had a great date.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Tonight we join the parents of Heather Elvis in the desperate search for the 20-year-old girl. First here, Lt. Robert Keggler with the Horry County Police Department. What is the latest in the search for Heather, Lieutenant?
LT. ROBERT KEGGLER, HORRY COUNTY POLICE DEPT (on the phone): Our task force we have developed continues to receive and follow up on leads or tips that are coming into us. We have been working all day on it and will continue to work with the Elvis family, with the (INAUDIBLE) center and we will be following up on any leads as they come in.
GRACE: To Seth Meyers, clinical psychologist, what words of advice do you have for Heather`s parents who are joining us tonight?
SETH MEYERS, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: One of the things that are most common when families deal with this kind of tragedy is they often end up take responsibility unnecessarily for what happened. They ask themselves, what should I have done differently, they feel terribly guilty and anxious.
So really, what they need to remind themselves that this is not their fault. They need to try to find as much faith as they can and try to hold on to it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was seemingly just another day for a 20-year-old makeup artist and House of Blues hostess. She dropped by her parents` home to pick up mail, went out on a date later that night. But since about 3 a.m., she is never heard from again.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s hard. It`s very hard. So if you know anything, help us put this nightmare to bed.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And now, straight to Terry Elvis. This is Heather`s father. Terry, what can you tell us? what are the updates on the search for heather?
TERRY ELVIS, HEATHER ELVIS` FATHER (on the phone): We are in contact with the chief of police earlier this afternoon. And she gave me confirmation that a lot of the tips that were coming in last night and today, they were very, very helpful. They did quite a few puzzle pieces that were filled in because of the tips that came from this show.
GRACE: With me is Terry Elvis. Also with him, Debbie Elvis, Heather`s parents. She goes missing. She`s a hostess at a popular restaurant, the House of Blues. Her car found not too far away from that, abandoned.
With me now, Dr. Michelle Dupree, forensic pathologist out of Columbia. Dr. Dupree, thanks for being with us. I am choosing to believe Heather is alive. But if she is no longer alive, what condition would she be in, and what if any clues can we get from the car? Let`s start with the car first.
DR. MICHELLE DUPREE, FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Thanks, Nancy. Yes, there might be a lot of clues actually left in the car. What police and investigators will be looking for are any signs of where she may have been last, who may have been with her, any type of trace evidence, things like hairs fibers, fingerprints of someone else, anything like that that may be able to give us a hint as to what happened right before she disappeared.
GRACE: You are taking a look at Heather Elvis, everyone. Let me give you the tip line. 843-915-TIPS. There is a $25,000 reward.
Let`s stop and remember American hero Army sergeant Andrew Looney, 22, Owaso, Oklahoma. Purple Heart, Army commendation, loved history and military movies. Parents Martha and Cleo, sister Joanna, brother Steven. Andrew Looney, American hero.
Drew up next. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp, Eastern. And until then, goodnight, friend.
END
