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Nancy Grace
Elmo Accusers` Cases Dismissed; Body in Suitcase ID`d as Missing 5- Year-Old; Self-Defense or Murder?; Mother`s Milk Battle with TSA; Gwyneth Paltrow Fears Stalker
Aired April 24, 2014 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Big Bird, Cookie Monster, Oscar the Grouch, Bert and Ernie, Elmo -- millions of children growing up with the hit TV show "Sesame Street." It all comes to a screeching halt after allegations the voice of Elmo accused of sex assault on multiple teen boys.
Bombshell tonight. In the last hours, a torpedo stuns Elmo`s sex accusers. Will Elmo walk free?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s known as the voice of Elmo.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was excited about "Sesame Street."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s not just about doing the voice of a character. It`s actually, you know, creating the character and bringing it to life.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) Elmo ticklish.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Facing multiple sex abuse claims.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We had a sexual relationship.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And to Little Falls, broad daylight, a 65-year-old sitting in his easy chair hears a break-in. He grabs two guns and starts shooting, gunning down two all-American neighborhood teens that break into the home. The case takes a bizarre turn when home owner Byron Smith says he kills both teens with, quote, "a good clean shot" to the head. In the last hours, as we go to air, stunning new evidence uncovered. Tonight, self- defense or murder?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Prosecutors allege Smith was lying in wait in his basement, armed and planning to kill the teens.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Audio recordings taken inside of Byron Smith`s home on the day of the shootings.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You could hear Smith talking to himself after the shootings. Smith says, "I`m safe now. Cute. I`m sure she thought she was a real pro."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That`s from ABC`s "GMA."
And tonight, a young mom of two held indefinitely by TSA so-called officials at the Phoenix airport after she refuses to have her breast milk X-rayed. Breast milk X-rayed? Really?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Agents detained her in a glass enclosure after she went through security screening (INAUDIBLE) breast milk.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My only options were to put it through the X-ray or to throw it in the trash. I was sobbing, crying, and thinking desperately for another solution.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And live, Fitchburg, a 1st-grader tells her teacher her baby brother hasn`t been home in weeks, but he`s never reported missing. After repeated calls to child safety, did they drop the ball? Tonight, a positive ID on a tiny body stuffed in a suitcase, thrown alongside a busy interstate, that tiny body 5-year-old Jeremiah Oliver. Tonight, I join Jeremiah`s father in demanding CPS, child protective service workers, not only lose their jobs but go to jail right along with the monsters that murder him!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They found a little boy fitting the description of my son.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The body was found. It was in a wrapped condition.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: His sister told employees at her school she and her siblings were being abused, and Jeremiah was gone.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How could somebody hurt this little boy?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My heart is very heavy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, Hollywood superstar Gwyneth Paltrow in the headlines for her, quote, "conscious uncoupling" -- i.e., divorce -- and her expensive advice doled out on Paltrow`s Web site, Goose.com (ph). But tonight, the star and mother of two living in deadly fear. Why?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Academy Award winner Gwyneth Paltrow is living in fear. The star allegedly is being stalked on two continents. Nick Gavillas (ph) has allegedly traveled from Texas to Paltrow`s homes in Los Angeles and London. Paltrow`s security says the man shows up claiming to have an appointment with the star.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell tonight. Big Bird, Cookie Monster, Oscar the Grouch, Bert and Ernie, Elmo -- millions of children growing up with the hit TV show "Sesame Street," including my children. After allegations the voice of Elmo accused of sex assault on multiple teen boys, bombshell tonight. In the last hours, a torpedo stuns Elmo`s sex accusers. Will Elmo walk free? Incredible story.
Frank Morano joining us. Also Alexis Tereszcuk, senior reporter, Radaronline.com. Alexis, Elmo set to walk free?
ALEXIS TERESZCUK, RADARONLINE.COM: You are exactly right. The appeals court has dropped three of the cases against him. These are three men, two of them have been identified, the other wants to remain anonymous, who claimed that he sexually assaulted them when they were just teenagers. They were under 18. And the court has said the statute of limitations has expired, therefore they have no cases. And in fact, they were very specific...
GRACE: So a legal loophole, the statute of limitations? Joining me, in addition to Alexis and Frank, a special guest tonight who claims he was abused by Elmo, the voice of Elmo, Kevin Clash. Kevin Kiadii joins us. Kevin, thank you for being with us.
KEVIN KIADII, CLAIMS ABUSE BY Clash: Thank you for having me, Nancy.
GRACE: Kevin, you state that you were 16 at the time that you first got involved with Elmo, the voice of Elmo, Kevin Clash. Now...
KIADII: Yes, I was.
GRACE: ... it`s my understanding that you were born September 30 of 1987 and that the incident occurred in the summer of `87. So that would put you, what, one month shy of your 17th birthday?
KIADII: Not one month, about two or three months.
GRACE: Well, which one is it?
GRACE: Well, it would be, like, three months because it was at the beginning of the summer, ending of the spring.
GRACE: OK. Now, it`s -- I`m completely absorbed in how this whole thing went down because it`s not just you. There are other then teens that claim Elmo abused them. How did you meet Kevin Clash, the voice of Elmo? How did you guys meet to start with?
KIADII: I met him on a gay phone chat line.
GRACE: And which chat line was that? What`s the name of it?
KIADII: It was the Power (ph) Chat.
GRACE: The Power Chat?
KIADII: Yes.
GRACE: And what is the Power Chat? What is that?
KIADII: Well, the Power Chat -- heterosexuals and homosexuals can actually go on it, but they have private rooms for them to sign into.
GRACE: Now, when you go on -- when you went on the Power Chat -- and you`re saying this was in the summer of 2004.
KIADII: Yes.
GRACE: You were on the cusp of 17. You go in the Power Chat for what reason?
KIADII: Well, at the time, it was, you know, where you and your cool friends can go and talk and meet new people and you can actually conversate with people that you can possibly end up dating or getting to know on a intimate level.
GRACE: So you go on there to meet guys to date, right?
KIADII: Well, that it wasn`t necessarily a place to date. That wasn`t what I was there for, but...
GRACE: But that`s what you just said...
KIADII: No, I said that...
GRACE: ... that you meet friends, you go in chat rooms with your friends.
KIADII: I said that`s what it`s for. That`s not what actually I was doing.
GRACE: OK, I thought you just said intimate. Didn`t I hear -- I think it heard that.
KIADII: I said people can go there to meet people, friends. They can hook up intimately, if they wanted to.
GRACE: Now, with me, everyone, is Kevin Kiadii, who says he was sexually abused by Kevin Clash, the voice of Elmo. Kevin, when did you -- so that night, you go on to Power Chat. You start talking to Kevin Clash. Did you know at the time that he`s Elmo?
KIADII: No, I did not know at the time.
GRACE: So nothing in his voice gave it away, right?
KIADII: No, it didn`t.
GRACE: When did you guys meet?
KIADII: Well, we talked for a couple hours. He was a really nice guy. That I can admit. But he offered -- once he got to know me a little better, he offered to send a limo service to come and pick me up from my home.
GRACE: OK. And that night, it was around 3:00 or 4:00 o`clock in the morning, right?
KIADII: Yes.
GRACE: What did you think was going to happen at this man`s house?
KIADII: Well, at the time, I really didn`t have a clue. He just -- he asked me what are some things I like to do. I told him I was into music. I like movies. I like games. And he really basically told me that he can do all of that for me. He can help me with my music, and take me to studios and introduce me to song writers, all of that in that nature.
GRACE: When you got to his home that night, did you have sex that night?
KIADII: No, we didn`t have sex that night.
GRACE: Now, when did you finally become intimate with the voice of Elmo?
KIADII: Our second encounter.
GRACE: And when was that?
KIADII: That was all in the same month of -- we met. I can`t really give you exactly the dates that we met. It was really a long time ago. But it was all in the same month. I was (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: Can I ask you this? If you`re unclear on dates, then how do you know you were still underage?
KIADII: Well, because I definitely can remember I was 16 years old because I did tell him that.
GRACE: OK. You told him?
KIADII: Yes.
GRACE: You`re saying you told the voice of Elmo you were 16.
Everyone, I want to reiterate, in the last hours, a court has thrown out the claims made by Kevin Kiadii based on statute of limitations, that he waited too long to bring the claim. Also, the voice of Elmo denies the claims.
Kevin, question. Now, this is the hard question.
KIADII: OK.
GRACE: Why did you wait eight years before you said anything? Was it because you found out this was Elmo and you knew the guy was rich? Because this is not a criminal complaint where you seek justice and you try to put somebody in jail to save other victims. This was a money lawsuit.
KIADII: Well, I came out because when I found out he was Elmo was much years after -- at least six or seven years after I found out he was Elmo. And the first thing that dawned onto me was -- well, I dealt with this guy at the age of 16. So how many -- how younger did he go? Or how many other 16-year-olds did he deal with?
I also came out, too, because a lot of people gone through similar situations that I`ve gone through, and they end up committing suicide or trying to take their life, or just not becoming a successful person that they`re -- that they can be. And I want people to know that, you know, there is life after trauma, and you can still survive and you can still be all that you can be in life.
GRACE: I admire what you just said. I think I may admire it more if you had filed a criminal complaint and if you believe firmly in this, to try to put your perpetrator behind bars. What is disturbing to many people is that when you realized that this was Elmo, Kevin Clash, then you filed a civil lawsuit. Kevin, this is not saying that what you`re claiming is not true. I`m not saying that.
KIADII: I understand.
GRACE: I`m trying to figure out why it took eight years -- hold on, Kevin.
Joining me is Jeff Herman, who represents Kevin Clash`s, Elmo`s, accusers - - Jeff, excellent reputation as a lawyer, joining me out of Miami. Jeff, thank you for being with us. When you first -- how many plaintiffs are you representing, Jeff?
JEFF HERMAN, ATTORNEY FOR ACCUSERS: Four.
GRACE: So there are four people. Now, did one of those recant or no?
HERMAN: No. No. The four I`m talking about are the three that were just affirmed on the appeal, and there`s still one pending out of Pennsylvania.
GRACE: OK. Question. How much money were you guys seeking against Elmo?
KIADII: In the complaint, we don`t ask for a specific amount. So we don`t really do that until closings in a trial. To me, any time a child`s abused, you`re into the millions of dollars. It`s significant damages. And so I would have -- I would expect, if we get to trial in the other case, we`ll be seeking that kind of money.
GRACE: Let me ask you this, Jeff. Were you surprised at the court`s ruling, which essentially ends several of the complains for good -- I mean, unless you go up to the U.S. Supreme Court, but...
HERMAN: Right.
GRACE: ... on the fact that they waited almost 10 years until some of them realized it was Elmo, with a lot of money, before they filed a lawsuit?
HERMAN: Well, yes, I mean, you know, it -- the ruling`s disappointing. But it just reflects sort of, I think, the old guard view of sex abuse, in that, you know, when a child turns 18, they know immediately they`re supposed to file their sex abuse claims. And that`s not -- that`s not real life. We know that most victims are abused by somebody they know, and so they`re what we call compliant victims, meaning that they participate in the sexual activity. Obviously, they can`t consent because they`re kids.
But because they`re compliant and they`ve been groomed and they feel like they`ve participated, they don`t really see themselves as victims. And that`s what happened here. It usually takes many years, sometimes decades, for victims to sort of put the pieces together to realize that they`re victims.
GRACE: To Frank Morano, talk show host on "The Answer." Frank, what`s going to happen next?
FRANK MORANO, TALK SHOW HOST, "THE ANSWER" (via telephone): Well, he still -- Kevin Clash isn`t out of the woods just yet. He still has one more legal case pending in Pennsylvania (INAUDIBLE) it`s alleged that he threw a crystal meth-infused sex party before engaging one of these boys in sex. So he`s still facing that Pennsylvania charge.
GRACE: Everyone, just in tonight, Elmo set to walk free, the voice of Elmo, who denies all these allegations. An appellate court has just thrown out claims. And joining us tonight, Kevin Kiadii, who spoke out and really helped lead the lawsuits against Kevin Clash.
When we come back, a positive ID on a tiny body, stuffed in a suitcase thrown alongside a busy interstate. That body, 5-year-old Jeremiah Oliver. And tonight, I join Jeremiah`s father demanding child protective service workers on this case not only lose their jobs, but go to jail.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The little boy`s body was wrapped in a blanket, concealed in a dufflebag.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was only 5 years old. I mean, he didn`t get to enjoy his life.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: And now to Fitchburg. A 1st-grader tells her teacher her baby brother hasn`t been home in weeks, but he`s never reported missing. After repeat calls to child safety, did they drop the ball? Tonight, a positive ID on a tiny body stuffed in a suitcase found on a busy interstate, that body 5-year-old Jeremiah Oliver.
Tonight, I join his father demanding child protective service workers not only lose their job but go to jail, along with the monsters that murder him!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Five-year-old Jeremiah Oliver went missing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s only 5 years old. I mean, he didn`t get to enjoy his life.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The little boy`s body was wrapped in a blanket, concealed in a dufflebag.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Three workers at the Department of Children and Families have been fired for negligence. Jeremiah`s mother and her boyfriend are in jail.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight out to Pat Lalama with Investigation Discovery. What is so disturbing, in addition to this child`s body being found in a suitcase tossed alongside a busy interstate, Pat, is that he had been gone for months. And the little sister happened to mention it at school.
PAT LALAMA, INVESTIGATION DISCOVERY CORRESPONDENT: Well, can you imagine, Nancy? I mean, this poor child has been failed on every possible level. He`s gone since September. In December, this little 7-year-old girl goes to the teachers and says, I haven`t seen my little brother. And by the way, my sibling, my other sibling and I have been abused. So this has all been happening -- no one -- no one bothered to say, Where is Jeremiah?
GRACE: With me right now is Jeremiah`s father, Jose Oliver. Mr. Oliver, thank you for being with us. What`s so stunning to me is that his mother was part of all of this. When did you realize, because you were not living with him in the home -- when did you realize Jeremiah was gone?
JOSE OLIVER, FATHER (via telephone): I realized Jeremiah was gone when the detectives came from Worcester, Mass, I believe it was, like, a week after September 14th.
GRACE: Mr. Oliver, what do you think should happen to the child protective service workers who were called to that home over and over and over to check on Jeremiah? They drop the ball! Now the boy`s dead!
OLIVER: Yes, I mean, I can`t believe that -- that they would not go to the house, especially when a few people have called DCFS worker. Even Alberto Sierra`s brother called DCF and complain about -- about Elsa Oliver, and they never went.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Months pass before this boy`s even reported missing by his mother. Pat Lalama, how many times was DFACS, child protective services, called to the home? And they did nothing! Now the boy`s body has been found in a suitcase.
LALAMA: Well, the fact of the matter is that that agency had been following this family for quite some time. They missed repeated scheduled visits. They cry case overload, that they`re handling 30 a month, and they`re only supposed to be handling 12. But because of this and because of so many other factors, people just not asking the right questions, this child is gone. And so far, no one`s even been charged with his murder!
GRACE: I mean, this little baby was -- look at her. Look at her! I want to see his mother, please. This baby was beaten. It was starved, mistreated its entire life. Child protective services was called over and over and over. They didn`t show up. They knocked on the door, nobody came, so they left. They did nothing! And now this child`s body has been found in a suitcase!
Tonight, I join the father, who is with me tonight, Mr. Jose Oliver. Child protective services -- every worker on this case needs to go to jail. And they can sit in their jail cell and think about how this 5-year-old little boy died! They can go straight to jail, along with his mother!
Everyone, I will continue to keep you updated on what happens with the Jeremiah Oliver case.
When we come back, a 65-year-old man sits back in his easy chair, middle of the day, hears a break-in. He grabs two guns and starts shooting, gunning down two teens, neighborhood teens that broke into his home. In the last hours, stunning new evidence uncovered. Tonight, self-defense or murder?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re dying, Smith tells her, amid more shots, then simply utters, Bitch.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: And now to Little Falls, broad daylight, a 65-year-old sitting in his easy chair hears a break-in. He grabs two guns and starts shooting. Gunning down two neighborhood teens that break into his home. The case then takes a bizarre turn when the homeowner Byron Smith says he kills both teens with, quote, "a good clean shot to the head."
In the last hours, as we go to air, stunning new evidence uncovered. Tonight self-defense or murder?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: You`re dying Smith Kelter, amid more shots, then simply utters, bitch.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A chilling audio recording on the day of the murders, from inside Byron Smith`s home.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Prosecutors say he didn`t stop there.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Just hours after Haley Kifer and Nick Brady were shot, quote, "I was doing my civic duty, I had to do it."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: In the last hours, we learn the homeowner, this 65-year-old man, Byron Davis Smith, actually calls the teens vermin. All of this is caught on tape. Smith has a home security system. And not only does it catch what he`s doing visually, you hear the audio, too. You hear the senior citizen shoot the boy, Nick. First of all, he shoots him. Then he puts his body on a plastic tarp and he drags the body across the floor and you see it, and you hear it, and you hear Byron Smith -- breathing. So the boy would not bleed on his carpet.
Then you hear the girl coming down and you hear her say, Nick, Nick? She`s looking for her cousin. The guy shoots her. She`s shot, she`s down, he says, you`re dying, bitch. He puts her on a tarp, drags her over, so she doesn`t bleed on his carpet. And as she`s laying there, and he says, you`re dying, bitch, he takes the gun and shoots her in the head at about six inches range.
Now is that self-defense? That`s the question. In addition to that, afterwards you hear him referring to the two dead bodies as vermin.
OK. In this jurisdiction, the big question is, was he still in danger when he pumped bullets into their heads as they lay on the ground dying?
To Jack Tomczack, host of " Up and At `Em" at KTLK. Jack, what just happened in court?
JACK TOMCZACK, HOST, UP AND AT `EM WITH KTLK: Well, it appears to me that the people heard new audio today from Byron Smith that he had recorded in his house. And still trying to figure out that exact question that you pose, was he in still in danger or not?
GRACE: OK. So we have him calling the teens vermin on tape. There`s 29 minutes of tape. This jury is going to hear. Now the letter of the law is you have a right to defend your castle. But does that include pumping a bullet into the brains of two teens that break into your home? Was he in fear or no?
Unleash the lawyers, joining me tonight, Jason Lamm out of Phoenix, Danny Cevallos out of New York.
First to you, Lamm. Self-defense? No.
JASON LAMM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I`m sorry. What? Self-defense? No. Let me tell you something, Nancy. In your normal prosecutorial blindness, today you`re calling these teens victims. Yesterday they would have been criminals and you like every other prosecutor is going to try and make --
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: You can stop right there.
LAMM: -- south ear.
GRACE: You can stop right there.
LAMM: Why?
GRACE: Because you`ve gotten carried away and you haven`t been listening to anything we`ve been saying. I`m on the fence --
LAMM: I`ve heard everything.
GRACE: As I was just saying, I`m on the fence here, because I don`t know the truth in this case.
Danny Cevallos, contrary to what Jason Lamm is saying, I`m saying that in this jurisdiction you have a right to defend your castle. That`s called the Castle Law. Remember, these teens are in his home. They have broken in on his home.
And not only that, Danny Cevallos, we`ve got the extra layer that this senior citizen who is a war veteran has been broken into numerous times. And people have even stolen his war medal. His war hero medals, like his Vietnam medals. So he`s sitting there, he hears them breaking in. If I hear something, I try to call 911, but that`s just me. In this case, self- defense or murder, Cevallos?
DANNY CEVALLOS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know, it`s fascinating in this case, that the very surveillance he installed arguably to protect himself may ultimately be the only thing convicting him because believe me, if there was no evidence of this execution-style killing, they probably -- prosecutors would probably not even charge this guy.
The real question under Minnesota law is, what they call the reasonable belief. Did he reasonably believe that he needed to use that deadly force? And the real question here for prosecutors is going to have to be whether or not the danger had passed and whether now he was --
GRACE: Right.
CEVALLOS: He was initiating deadly force. But believe me, if there were not these recordings, this would be not only a run-of-the-mill self-defense case, a run-of-the-mill reasonable belief case, but an easy one for the defense.
GRACE: To John Lott, Jr., president of Crime Prevention Research Center, author of "More Guns, Less Crime." What do you make of it, John Lott?
JOHN LOTT, PRESIDENT, CRIME PREVENTION RESEARCH CENTER: Well, I couldn`t agree more with what was just said. You have to have a reasonable person standard there. Just looking -- listening to the conversation, the audio that you`re talking about, still doesn`t tell us everything. It doesn`t tell us whether they were still moving, doesn`t tell us whether there was still some possibility of a threat.
But surely in terms of the way you described it verbally, it seems like they were incapacitated at that point and there wouldn`t be a threat. In that case, there`s real question about whether he acted properly or not. Because you just can`t go and shoot somebody if there`s no threat posed to you.
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: On the other hand -- I agree with you.
LOTT: And you have to respond proportionately to the threat that you face.
GRACE: I agree with you, John Lott, Jr.
With me now physician Dr. Nina Radcliff, joining me out of New York.
Dr. Radcliff, I keep thinking about what the teens went through as they were lying there, especially the girl who was shot so many times. She`s laying there on this tarp, she looks up at the homeowner, and he says, you`re dead, bitch. And then -- no, he says, you`re dying, bitch. And then he shoots her again. Was she aware of what was going on, Dr. Radcliff?
DR. NINA RADCLIFF, PHYSICIAN: Yes, I`m very sad to say that unfortunately she was aware of this. And this must have been such a fearful time for her. Her heart must have been pounding. Her blood pressure must have been -- she literally had the fear of God in her at that moment.
GRACE: To Ladd Everett, director of communications, Coalition to Stop Gun Violence, joining me out of D.C.
Ladd Everett, here`s the thing, you remember in the horror movies, you see the villain, they`re dead. You think it`s all over, all of a sudden, they jump back up again, that would have to be the scenario in his mind here because he`s definitely shot them. He just said, you`re dying, bitch. He`s already shot her once, he shoots her again. How is this going to play out, Ladd?
LADD EVERETT, DIRECTOR OF COMMUNICATIONS, COALITION TO STOP GUN VIOLENCE: Well, I -- Nancy, I think you`re exactly right. I mean, I think with both these kids, you know, he shot them at the top of his basement stairs. Both these kids fell down the stairs. You know, there`s a ritualism about this that`s truly disturbing, you`re right, it does sound like a horror movie.
GRACE: On the other hand, you have him parking his vehicle three blocks away, to trick people into thinking he`s not home. Kind of inviting burglars in. But here`s the great equalizer, Bethany Marshall.
Imagine this, everybody, what if it`s your senior citizen parents? What if it`s your parents? And they`re sitting in their home, they hear a break- in, and they shoot the burglar? You know what, if it happened to my parents, I would say that they were justified. Of course, my parents wouldn`t come out guns blazing.
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": Nancy, I can tell you -- I can tell you what my parents and what my Baptist minister father would do. He would take a look around the neighborhood, try to get a sense of where the break-ins were coming from, and he would call the parents of the teen. He wouldn`t hide his car down the block, sit in a darkened house with tons of guns.
GRACE: You know what, before everybody says that this guy is going out for murder, I want you to all go sit in your easy chair and see how you`d react when two burglars come in on you, OK? That`s what I`m putting out there.
We`ll keep you abreast of the trial as it goes on. We expect the prosecution to rest. Pretty soon this is going to a jury.
When we come back, a young mother of two held indefinitely by TSA so-called officials at the Phoenix Airport after she refuses to have her breast milk x-rayed. Breast milk x-rayed? Really?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: A mom detained at the airport after she refuses to have her breast milk x-rayed? Those words should not even be in the same sentence together. Breast milk x-rayed? This on the heels of a full body pat-down search of a 2-year-old.
What is happening with the TSA officials?
Pat Lalama, what happened?
LALAMA: Oh, my gosh, poor Stacey Armato. She flies constantly between L.A. and Phoenix. She says that the TSA on one occasion, I have breast milk, and you know, by law you cannot x-ray it, there are alternative measures. They hold her for 40 minutes, and then the next time they got to seek revenge on her and really humiliate, harass her and call the cops on her.
GRACE: So she stays there for hours and hours, detained at the airport, because she refuses to have her breast milk x-rayed.
And joining me exclusively tonight from Phoenix, Stacey Armato, the outraged mother detained by TSA.
Stacey, thank you so much for being with us. Number one it`s hard, as H-E- L-L, traveling with children, because it`s -- you know, it`s like you`re crossing the Sahara with camels, you`ve got so much to carry. And now this.
Here you see Stacey talking to a so-called official.
Stacey, what happened?
STACEY ARMATO, OUTRAGED MOM DETAINED BY TSA: That day I arrived with my pump breast milk. I arrived at security like I did every week. I announced my milk and asked for an alternate screening. I was told immediately that it would probably have to go through x-ray. I knew that I had printed out the rules, so I walked through the metal detector, tried to grab my rules and I was immediately ushered into the glass container and told to stay there.
GRACE: Now wait a minute. I think -- is that what you`ve got in your hands in the video? Take the video up, please. And let me see Stacey.
Stacey, is that your rules? You`ve got a little white piece of paper in your hand?
ARMATO: Yes. Yes. I was --
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Then what happened?
ARMATO: My hand was swatted away, I was told not to touch it, and I was forced to go into that glass enclosure area.
GRACE: OK, why do they want to x-ray your breast milk?
ARMATO: I think it`s habit and it`s easier. I takes about two minutes longer to do an alternate screening. So -- and maybe that frustration.
GRACE: What are the rules? What`s supposed to happen?
ARMATO: The rules are that breast milk is classified as a medical liquid, and you can be afforded an alternate screening as long as it`s announced before the x-ray machine.
GRACE: At what point did the exchange between you and TSA become heated?
ARMATO: It became heated as soon as they told me it was probably going to have to go through x-ray and they refused to read the rules. I was put in that glass container for about 30 minutes. And they made me sob. I couldn`t help myself. It was really degrading, humiliating experience. And I just couldn`t stop crying. So they sent over three police officers to threaten to arrest me for doing so.
GRACE: You were threatened with arrest?
ARMATO: Yes. Yes.
GRACE: Where --
ARMATO: I was told that I was crying too much.
GRACE: And so they were going to arrest you for crying?
ARMATO: Yes.
GRACE: OK. What do the police officers say when they got over there?
ARMATO: They told me that the TSA agents had remembered me from the week before, and they basically had it out for me, and I needed to play along with their horse and pony show in order to get home to my son, which I desperately wanted to do.
GRACE: Where was your son during all this?
ARMATO: My son was at home.
GRACE: And you were going to your son -- how old is your son?
ARMATO: My son right now is 4 and a half. At the time he was seven months old. And I was traveling weekly for work. So I pumped when I was in Phoenix and I would fly home with that milk back to Los Angeles.
GRACE: Now can I ask you something, Stacey? And I`ve been wondering about this. Now I`ve got you. You said the cops told you to play along with TSA because they had it out for you. Why did they have it out for you?
ARMATO: The week before I had travelled and I was held up for about 40 minutes. These particular TSA agents were there the week before and had no clue what the alternate screening rule was. They researched it, they tried to figure it out, they called supervisors and managers. And finally let me go after 40 minutes. Reluctantly.
I then filed a complaint the with TSA and was instructed to print out and carry the rules with me on my future travels.
GRACE: Do you believe these same TSA workers are there at the Phoenix airport?
ARMATO: I`m not sure about that. I haven`t seen them recently.
GRACE: Everyone, Stacey Armato, outraged mother detained by TSA.
Can I tell you, what about the incident made you breakdown in tears?
ARMATO: Just knowing that they had my milk and I was being forced to make a decision to throw away my milk or send it through the x-ray machine. It`s just a horrendous feeling as a mom, knowing that my milk will either go through the x-ray machine or this precious milk would be thrown in the trash. It`s just not -- it`s not logical and not a situation I wanted to be in at all. It was a very terrifying situation.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: With me, Stacey Armato, outraged mother detained by TSA, who threatened to x-ray her breast milk.
You know, Stacey, when I was in the hospital, all three of us were in the hospital for a really long time. It was very, very difficult to get breast milk to my children. People don`t understand how hard it is. Explain why you didn`t want, as you said, the precious milk to be thrown away.
ARMATO: It`s a labor of love. I would sit in bathrooms pumping away for 30 minutes to 45 minutes a couple times a day. I was a day-to-day pumper. Even taking supplements to try to increase my milk supply. It is -- it is hard work. It`s worth it, but when you`re forced to make that decision to make it go through the x-ray or in the trash, it`s heartbreaking.
GRACE: And very quickly, Stacey, what was your fear about putting the breast milk through the x-ray machine?
ARMATO: You know, I go out of my way to eat healthy, drink lots of water, take my prenatal vitamins. Stay in shape. And to then just send my milk to be exposed to radiation, it just flies in complete contradiction to every effort I make to make sure that I have the most nutritious milk for my child.
GRACE: Everyone, happy to report that as of tonight, Stacey has received a $75,000 offer for her to drop this whole thing and we`ll see what happens.
All you working moms, pay attention to what she has gone through.
Stacey, thank you for being with us tonight.
Everybody, when we come back, Hollywood superstar Gwyneth Paltrow in the headlines again. Paltrow living in fear, but why?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: She`s told security and police that Paltrow owes him money because he had written the blockbuster films "The Avenger" and "Iron Man," and gave the scripts to Paltrow 20 years ago. Claims that have not been proven.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Tonight, Hollywood superstar Gwyneth Paltrow living in fear. But why?
Alexis Tereszcuk, senior reporter, Radaronline.com. Gwyneth Paltrow living in fear. Stalkers. She`s actually had to take out a temporary restraining order. What happened?
ALEXIS TERESZCUK, REPORTER, RADAROLINE.COM: There is a man who is stalking her on two continents. This man is from Texas. He actually flew to London to her beautiful home in London and gained access into the home. He convinced her security guards that he had a business meeting with her. When they realized he didn`t, they booted him out immediately.
Then fast forward to just a few days ago, he was spotted outside the gym, the Tracy Anderson Gym, where she works out. This was terrifying for her so she went to the courts. She asked for a temporary restraining order. She wanted him to stay away from her and her children and her estranged husband. She has two little kids and she did not want this guy anywhere near any of them.
GRACE: I don`t blame her, Stacey Newman. What more do you know?
STACEY NEWMAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well -- Nancy, we actually spoke with this alleged stalker and he says I created "Iron Man." He actually says he created this multibillion dollar movie franchise and said all he was trying to do was get payment for work on the movie that he was owed from Gwyneth Paltrow.
GRACE: And you know, stalkers, you never know where they are. They`re following you when you travel. Gwyneth Paltrow living in fear tonight takes out a temporary restraining order. God help her.
Everyone, let`s stop, as we pay tribute to our American heroes tonight on a happy note, take a look at this video. I love it. I saw this online and flipped. Marines in a dance-off at the annual marine ball.
This is that Michael Jackson`s Billie Jean moonwalking split. Robot. The Marines are cheered on by the crowd. They work so hard to defend our country. See this guy`s moves. It`s incredible. And I`m so happy to see them having a good time.
Man, I can watch this all night. They keep on going and going and going. You know, power to the Marines. Semper fi, guys. Semper fi.
Tonight, a special good night from our friend, Kylie. Her father, Judge Roland Barnes, a victim of the Atlanta Holden County courthouse shooting gunned down on the bench, would have been 74 tomorrow.
God bless you, Kylie.
And happy birthday to Elizabeth (INAUDIBLE). She loves her beagle, Muffy, her flower garden, her violin, Strauss` " Tales from the Vienna Woods".
Happy birthday.
Drew up next, everybody. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern, and until then good night, friend.
