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Nancy Grace
Twelve-Year-Old Girls Stab Friend 19 Times
Aired June 03, 2014 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight, live Wisconsin. An innocent sleepover with three 12-year-old girls turns deadly when two of the girls, obsessed with on-line sci-fi stories, fantasy characters found on a bizarre Web site, lure their 12-year-old little friend to play hide and seek, then hold her down, stabbing the child 19 times, all in a freaky bid to please a magical fantasy creature, Slenderman, then after the horrific stabbing of their 12-year-old little friend, stating, Part of me felt remorse, part of me didn`t.
Well, since they`re going to be tried as adults, the two 12-year-old girls will have plenty of time to sort all that out behind bars!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) a 12-year-old female. She appears to be stabbed.
911 OPERATOR: She appears to be what?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stabbed.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The two middle school-aged suspects said they believed in a fictional evil character called Slenderman and essentially wanted to be one of his disciples.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: After the three woke up Saturday morning from a sleepover at Weier`s house, the two acted out the horrific plan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, to the country music capital, Nashville. A gorgeous young mom mysteriously disappears, leaving behind purse, cell phone, dog, and her little son. And to Spartanburg, a 28-year-old mom of twins disappears. But then her family gets disturbing e-mails and texts that don`t sound like her at all.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There is still no sign of Nichole Burgess.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She would never leave her child. She would never leave her dogs, for that matter.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police are searching for a missing mom of three and suspect foul play may be involved, 28-year-old Nicole Goodlet (ph)...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Greatly saddened for her disappearance, and we strongly believe that she was taken by force.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, Vermont. ER docs call CPS when they spot major bruises on a tiny baby. Child services drags out to the house, see the baby sleeping, and then leave! Minutes later, 911 called, the baby is dead. CPS gives the family an A-plus after looking at a comatose baby in a crib? They leave the baby to die!
And now outrage in Vermont boils over with public hearings after two toddlers, little Peighton (ph) and 2-year-old Deseret (ph), given back to mothers, and then the children end up dead. Then, on the other tip (ph) of the country, a female CPS worker investigated by CPS when her home found soaked in urine, fleas, roaches, marijuana, counterfeit money, open pill bottles and a gun!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Fatal injuries occurred just hours before a DCF worker arrived at the home, observed bruises on the child`s neck, admitted not knowing whether the child was actually alive at the time of the visit.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s six kids reportedly living in a home filled with drugs and filth. Denoa (ph) worked for DCF. Three previous times, the children were forced to sleep and eat amid cockroaches and human waste.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And suburban Warrensberg (ph), a young mother suspected of drowning her newborn baby boy in a Walmart restroom toilet, then dumping his tiny body in a cave?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Authorities say a newborn baby was born in a toilet at Walmart. They claim his mother leaves him in the toilet to die.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They say she wrapped the child in paper towels and put him in her locker.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And after vicious beatings at the hands of their so-called lovers, women fight back, posting the reality of domestic abuse.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Victims of domestic violence go public with brutal photos of their horrifying injuries.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Stabbing me with that knife, just kept coming (ph) at my face.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One punch. After that, I couldn`t see what was going on.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It took 32 stabs for him to stop.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My face was completely covered in blood, and my hair felt soaking wet, like I just got out of the shower.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That is from CBS News "48 Hours."
Good evening, everybody. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell tonight, live, Wisconsin. An innocent sleepover with three 12-year-old girls turns deadly when two of the girls, obsessed with on-line sci-fi stories, fantasy characters that they found on some bizarre Web site -- they lure their 12-year-old little friend to play hide and seek. And then they hold the little girl down, stabbing her 19 times, all in a bid to please some mythical creature called Slenderman, then after the horrific stabbing of the little girl, stating, Part of me feels remorse, but part of me doesn`t.
Well, since they are going to be tried as adults, these two, the two 12-year-old girls will have plenty of time to sort out their conflicting feelings behind bars!
Straight out to Miguel Marquez, CNN national correspondent. It`s almost too much for me to take in. At 12 years old, they should be in 4H or Girl Scouts or something like that. They should be worried about what camp they may go to over summer vacation.
Instead -- let me see their pictures, please, Liz. Instead, these two girls, 12-year-old girls, everybody -- hold on, Miguel -- are obsessed with some sci-fi fantasy Web site -- I never even heard of it before -- where they start believing in some mythical sci-fi creature named Slenderman. Let`s see a picture of Slenderman as seen on line. There -- I now know there are a lot of them.
Miguel Marquez, let me try you again. To CNN national correspondent Miguel Marquez, standing by on the scene there in Waukesha. Miguel, what happened?
MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, this all happened -- it started a few blocks down the way here at a park, where they initially tried to kill this young woman. These two girls, Ms. Geyser and Ms. Weier, they got it into their heads that this Slenderman character was somehow real, and to prove that he was real and to prove their loyalty to him and - - that they would kill their friend, and then they could move up the ranks and that they would -- he would accept them into their lives. So the plot was, so say police, was to kill their friend, and then go to the fictitious mansion up in the north woods of Wisconsin, where Slenderman lived.
GRACE: Miguel...
MARQUEZ: This was the trail of almost -- yes?
GRACE: ... do you hear yourself? Go to the fictitious mansion where Slenderman lives.
MARQUEZ: Hey...
GRACE: Hold on just a moment. These are 12-year-olds. Now, my question, Miguel, is how many hours and hours did they spend -- what`s the name of this Web site? It`s some crazy Web site.
MARQUEZ: It`s...
GRACE: What is it?
MARQUEZ: The Web site where they found this initially was Creepypasta.wikia.com...
GRACE: That`s it.
MARQUEZ: ... but look Slenderman is ubiquitous...
GRACE: Creepypasta wiki.
MARQUEZ: ... he`s all -- he`s all over the Web. He`s all over the Web site. There are films. There are Web site. Kids dress up as them (ph). These are -- these are very popular characters for kids.
GRACE: Liz, please pull up the picture...
MARQUEZ: These two just got...
GRACE: ... the actual picture of Slenderman, Liz. There`s one where a little girl is walking along with this really tall, creepy-looking guy. And that is Slenderman. I don`t want to see any pictures. I want to see what these girls were -- it`s a picture, Liz. It`s like it`s out of a magazine. Oh, that`s it! Yes. That -- hold that. Hold that for me, Charles. That`s Slenderman.
Now, what I don`t understand, Miguel Marquez, is how many hundreds of hours these two 12-year-old little girls, just in the 5th grade, were allowed to pore over on-line fantasy and sci-fi to where they believe Slenderman is real. And there`s a triangle. I don`t know if you know about the triangle, Miguel Marquez, but there is Slenderman at the top, then there`s a proxy, then there`s a murder victim. And to become a proxy...
MARQUEZ: And there`s a killer.
GRACE: ... you have to kill somebody.
MARQUEZ: Slenderman, the killer and then the proxy. Yes.
GRACE: Yes.
MARQUEZ: These girls wanted to be proxies. And they felt by killing their friend, they could become proxies of Slenderman. Police now saying that they are now looking at the computer hard drives and trying to recreate everything these young women were looking at and doing up until this thing happened. The big thing will be that computer hard drive, police telling us they suspect it`ll be more than just Creepypasta they were looking at, that there was lots and lots of stuff. If you read the criminal complaint...
GRACE: Where is Mommy...
MARQUEZ: ... it looks like a tiff between...
GRACE: ... and Daddy...
MARQUEZ: ... two 12-year-olds -- crazy.
GRACE: ... while they`re spending hundreds of hours on Creepypasta wiki, believing in Slenderman?
MARQUEZ: This is the other thing that police say. If you push your kid in a room with the Internet and you close the door, it`s the same thing as letting a stranger, a grown man into your 12-year-old`s room with them. Why would parents do that? They are warning parents not just about Creepypasta, not just about Slenderman, but about hundreds, thousands of characters and Web sites out there that kids can get into, very impressionable kids.
GRACE: OK, Miguel...
MARQUEZ: And for whatever reason, this took off with them.
GRACE: Miguel, let`s get back in the middle of the road. Tell me what happened. They lure -- they`ve been planning this for a year, 12- year-olds...
MARQUEZ: Well, they`ve been planning it...
GRACE: ... planning a murder for a year!
MARQUEZ: They`ve been planning it -- they`ve been planning it for a few months, actually. They came out (ph) of (ph) Slenderman and Creepypasta back in October. In January or December, they said, Let`s kill our friends that we can become proxies. And then in February, they said, On my birthday slumber party, that`s the night that we are going to do this.
They took her first to the park. They were going to -- they were going to kill her in her sleep. They were going to duct tape her mouth and then stab her in her neck and then cover her so that she would die without them having to see her eyes. Then they were going to kill here in the...
GRACE: Wait, wait! Go back...
MARQUEZ: ... bathroom in the park...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Miguel, Miguel, Miguel! Where did you get the detail? I learned all of that from reading the warrant that I`ve got in my hand right here that outlines what the two 12-year-olds said about the murder. You know, October to June, what is that, 10 months? You call it a few months. I call it a year.
But Miguel, I didn`t know that they actually said they did not want her looking them in the eyes when they murdered her? I didn`t hear that.
MARQUEZ: That was the initial -- that was the initial thing they were going to do. And then they decided, No, we`re going to kill her in the bathroom at a park just a few blocks away from here so that her blood could drain into the drain in the park bathroom. And then they fought in the bathroom over who was going to stab her. They got freaked out. And then they went to play hide and seek in the woods. These are the woods here, very...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Wait, wait, wait!
MARQUEZ: ... woods in this area here in Waukesha.
GRACE: They lured the 12-year-old girl into the woods, claiming they were going to play hide and seek. Everybody, look behind Miguel Marquez. What you are seeing is a rural area...
MARQUEZ: These are the woods.
GRACE: ... there near Waukesha. So they lure her into the woods to play hide and seek. Then what happened, Miguel?
MARQUEZ: Then they finally get up the gumption. They basically egg each other on. One of them sits on her. She starts yelling and screaming. They worry that it`s going to attract people from the neighborhood around here. So they get off of her. And then they tell -- then one of them tells the other one, Go ballistic, go crazy. And then Geyser says that that`s when she said, Don`t worry about it, I`m a kitty cat, and began stabbing her friend. They stabbed her 19 times, her stomach, her pancreas...
GRACE: I didn`t hear what you said about...
MARQUEZ: ... her liver, her heart...
GRACE: ... a kitty cat. What did you say about a kitty cat?
MARQUEZ: She said before she stabbed her -- the line that she used was, Don`t worry, I`m a kitty cat, and then began stabbing her friend. The kitty cat was a reference to the fact that one of them had cats. But it is fairly sick stuff...
GRACE: Miguel? Miguel...
MARQUEZ: ... that these two kids got themselves into.
GRACE: I`m looking at this...
MARQUEZ: Nancy?
GRACE: ... this little 12-year-old girl. My twins are almost 7. And all can I think about is Lucy, my little girl. And she wants to have a sleepover -- you`ll see, Miguel. She want to have a sleepover so much.
This little girl was struck in the heart, the liver, the pancreas, the stomach, 19 stab wounds, these two here, this Morgan Geyser and Anissa Weier -- 19 stab wounds. Doctors say she was 1 millimeter from death.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
911 OPERATOR: Hi, sir. So are you with this 12-year-old female?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. She says she`s having trouble breathing. She said she was stabbed multiple times.
911 OPERATOR: Stabbed multiple times?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
911 OPERATOR: OK, sir, are you with her right now?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
911 OPERATOR: Is she awake?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s awake.
911 OPERATOR: Is she breathing?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, she`s breathing. She said she can take shallow breaths. She`s alert.
911 OPERATOR: OK. Stay with her. We`re sending the police department. Don`t hang up, OK? Hold on just a minute. Don`t hang up.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.
911 OPERATOR: OK. Hold on just a minute, sir. We`re sending officers. Is there any assailant around?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I didn`t even look. I don`t see anybody.
911 OPERATOR: OK. Stay right with her, sir.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
GRACE: We are live tonight in Waukesha, Wisconsin. A community is rocked after a 12-year-old little girl gets invited to a sleepover with two of her little friends, both 12. It`s all a plot to lure the little girl and stab her to death. They stabbed this child 19 times in the heart, the pancreas, the liver.
Now, what you`re looking -- the girl you`re looking at is one of the two alleged assailants. We are not releasing the victim`s name or picture. This little girl right there is one of the two accused of stabbing their little friend 19 times!
With me right now, hopefully, to shed light on this, in addition to Miguel Marquez, Meg McKenzie, also with me is Emily Edwards, neighbor and former baby-sitter of one of the girls accused in the stabbing.
Emily Edwards, thank you for being with us tonight. I need some help understanding this whole thing. You were a neighbor to one of the girls for years. Did you ever notice any unusual behavior at all?
EMILY EDWARDS, FORMER BABY-SITTER (via telephone): No, I didn`t notice any unusual behavior with Morgan. She was very normal. You know, she liked to do normal 12-year-old things, like riding a bike or playing with sidewalk chalk.
GRACE: You know, that sounds like all the girl children that I know. They like to play with chalk. They like to try to ride their bikes. They all have American girls, or a facsimile of an American girl. I don`t -- I can`t get my head around this, Emily. Did you know that they were obsessed with Slenderman, some sci-fi he creature they found on Creepypasta wiki?
EDWARDS: No, I didn`t know. I actually had no idea.
GRACE: So they never mentioned Slenderman to you?
EDWARDS: What?
GRACE: She never -- Morgan never mentioned Slenderman?
EDWARDS: No, she didn`t.
GRACE: Was there anything in her behavior that would have even suggested this stabbing could ever occur?
EDWARDS: No.
GRACE: Everyone, with me, Emily Edwards, neighbor and baby-sitter, says Morgan Geyser, of one of the two 12-year-old alleged stabbers, was just like any other little girl.
Out to the lines. Susan in California. Hi, Susan. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: I think I`ve got Susan in California. Hey, Susan, turn off your TV. What`s your question, dear?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: OK. I don`t have Susan. Let me get to my next caller, Liz. Tell me when you`ve got her ready. Joining me now, Meg McKenzie, news anchor, WISN. Meg, what can you tell us?
MEG MCKENZIE, WISN (via telephone): Nancy, what I can tell you is after the girls were in court yesterday, we`re getting little bits and pieces of information coming out. Now, they are being tried, as you said, as adults. However, at least one of the girls` attorneys is making a bid to get this kicked back to juvenile court.
Now, what that would mean is several things. One, juvenile court proceedings, as you`re well aware, are in secret, so we would not get as much information if they do get kicked back to juvenile court. Two, these girls would be out no later than the age of 25. Charged as an adult and tried as an adult, as you know, they would possibly facing up to 60, maybe 65 years in prison.
GRACE: Sixty-five years, Meg McKenzie. Meg, you brought up an excellent point.
Unleashing the lawyers. Joining me tonight out of Atlanta, Randy Kessler. Out of Miami, Marla Chicotsky. First to you, Kessler. You know what the seven deadlies are when juveniles almost automatically go to adult court. There is a designated felony hearing for a juvie judge to go, Yes, this is a designated felony. You`re going to adult court. And attempted murder falls in that category.
Can you give me one -- one -- good reason why they should not be tried as adults, Kessler?
RANDY KESSLER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Because juvenile court is for juveniles. It`s for judges that handle cases for kids. Kids are different than adults. There are different issues. There are different mentalities. What as their mental age?
GRACE: OK...
KESSLER: What was their state of mind...
GRACE: Let me ask you this, Kessler. So you`re saying the reason they should be tried as juveniles is because juvie court`s for juvie. OK, then what is the bind-over proceeding for? What is designated felony statute for? Juvies, correct?
KESSLER: You`re going to convict them before -- you`re going to convict them before the trial.
GRACE: No, I`m asking you. Your argument is bass-ackwards. Let`s see if Chicotsky can come back on that. Just to say juvenile court is for juveniles -- of course it is, for nonviolent juveniles, possibly juveniles that have a drug problem. Maybe they stole a car and went joyriding. You know, maybe they took all their mom`s jewelry and sold it to somebody and bought an iPad. I don`t know. That`s what`s for juvenile, not stabbing a little 12-year-old girl 19 times. That is not for juvenile, Marla!
MARLA CHICOTSKY, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: No, Nancy. You`re absolutely correct. I mean, juvenile is rehabilitative. Adult court is punitive. So attempted murder is definitely a punitive thing. The state attorney`s objecting in this case. They`re going to have a very difficult time getting this case transferred to juvenile because of the type of charges.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: A 12-year-old little girl goes to a sleepover. Her two 12- year-old friends -- there they are -- it`s all their plot to lure her into a stabbing, the child stabbed 19 times.
With me in the field, CNN national correspondent Miguel Marquez. Miguel, what do the parents of these two suspects have to say?
MARQUEZ: Well, they`re not saying anything at the moment. These are parents who are in complete shock, according to their friends and neighbors that we`ve been able to talk to, to go over what`s happened. It doesn`t make any sense to them.
You know, people we talked ion this neighborhood say they know these characters. They know the kids dress up as these characters at Halloween. These parents have no way to account for what has happened and what`s transpired in these very woods right out back of their house, shocking.
GRACE: And you know, another thing, Miguel -- and I want to get back to where you`re standing and what you know of the location. You know, we say, when you put your child in a room with the Internet, you don`t know what they`re doing. But I don`t know that that`s what happened. How do I know the child didn`t get on the Internet at school, at the library? I don`t know if this was happening in the home.
But Miguel, I want to get back to the actual incident, with them luring the 12-year-old girl into the woods behind you, then stabbing her 19 times. It`s a miracle she`s alive. How was she found, Miguel?
MARQUEZ: She was found because she was able to crawl, literally -- the stabbings happened in the woods here, several blocks from the park where they initially tried to kill her, and then they made their way around here. And this young woman made her way across this street here, this closed-off street, down this trail, somewhere down into this area, in this grassy area here.
The person that you hear on the 911 call is a bicyclist. They used this trail coming along this closed-off road, and this is where they found her, and then everything took off. People in the neighborhood said all day Saturday and Sunday during the weekend, they thought these two other little girls may have been injured, as well. It was a full-on SWAT, helicopters, everybody, looking for these two girls because they thought they were injured. Turns out they were on their way...
GRACE: Where were...
MARQUEZ: ... to what they believed...
GRACE: ... the two girls...
MARQUEZ: ... was the mansion of Slenderman.
GRACE: Miguel, where were the two girls, the alleged perpetrators, found? Where were they when their little friend was -- they thought was bleeding to death in the woods, where did they go?
MARQUEZ: Amazingly enough, they had a backpack packed with food and water. They had gone to the -- and they had kept the knife in their mother`s purse that they had with them. They went to one of the local roads here and were on their way north. They were going to walk to this national park, Nicolette (ph) National Park, up in northern Wisconsin.
GRACE: So what, they were going to have a picnic...
MARQUEZ: ... so they could go to this mansion.
GRACE: ... while their little friend bled to death?
MARQUEZ: No, they were going to -- they were going to Slenderman`s mansion, which is also fictitious, in this park that actually exists.
GRACE: Will you please...
MARQUEZ: That`s why they believe that it exists.
GRACE: ... quit talking about Slenderman`s mansion? There is not a Slenderman`s mansion, Miguel.
MARQUEZ: There is not. But I`m afraid in these girls` minds, they believed that there was and they were going to prove to the world that this existed. And this is exactly why they did this. As nonsensical and crazy as it sounds, that`s what happened, at least according to police.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: And now, to Vermont. ER doctors call CPS when they see major bruises on a tiny baby. Child services finally drags out to the house to see the baby sleeping. And they leave. Minutes later, 911 call. The baby is dead. CPS gives that family an a plus after looking at what many believe is a comatose baby, lying in the crib. CPS leaves a baby to die, again. And now, outrage in Vermont boils over with public hearings after two toddlers, that baby, little Payton, and a 2-year-old girl, Deseret, given back to moms, and they both end up dead. Then on the other tip of the country, a female CPS worker investigated by CPS. Her home found soaked in urine, fleas, roaches, marijuana, counterfeit money, open pill bottles, even a gun.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: 15-month-old Payton Gerard (ph) dead. Court papers reveal he was born opium addicted. CPS had taken custody of him at least once after LaForce (ph) violating parole and fleed the state.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The judge took emergency action and stripped Randy and Kaisa Denawa (ph) of their six kids.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is an individual who is hired to protect children.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A home filled with drugs and filth.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have anything to say about the condition of your home and your children?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, sir, not at this time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight out to Brett Larson. Investigative reporter. I want to start off with Payton, the little boy, Payton, and Deseret, the little girl. I can hardly even stand to look at them. I don`t know if you can see this.
LARSON: Oh I can.
GRACE: That`s Deseret.
LARSON: It`s heart-breaking.
GRACE: That is Deseret, right there. Can I tell you something, Brett. They take -- CPS takes little Deseret and Payton away from the mother. Then in their wisdom, they give the mother the babies back. And of course, the babies are dead. Now, catch this. I`m pretty sure this is -- was deseret. When they gave her back -- she already had a broken leg.
LARSON: Yes.
GRACE: She had two broken legs at the hands -- this little girl. Look at her. They had already broken her legs. Twice. She was covered in bruises. They give her back. She`s dead. I spoke to the family, Brett, I spoke to the family. The sisters. They had all begged CPS, don`t give the baby back to the mother. She will die. They give her back. She`s dead. Now, Payton, tell me about Payton.
LARSON: Nancy, this is like a double whammy for pour little Payton. Look at this adorable kid. Gets taken to the hospital. The hospital workers do what they are supposed to do. This is in their oath. They try to do their best to protect this kid. They called child protective services. They tell them this child is clearly being abused. Child protective services goes to the home. They see the bruises on his neck. But he`s asleep so they figure it`s all right. The child`s asleep, we`re just going to go. Not hang out and make sure he is still awake and alive.
GRACE: Joining me now is a special guest. Chief medical officer there at Fletcher Alan (ph) health care. Dr. Steve Leffler joining us. His team, when this child, Payton, first came to the hospital, they are the ones that spotted all these bruises and they knew something was -- I can hardly stand to look at him. My son has those exact same pajamas. They knew something was horribly wrong with the bruising. And they tried to stop it. But even this doctor, very well respected, and a team of doctors, couldn`t stop CPS from putting the baby back in the home. Doctor Leffler, thank you for being with us. What is your SOP? Your standard operating procedure when you see a child with suspicious bruises?
LEFFLER: Nancy, what we do in these type of cases is we call DCF, we consult with them. Together we collaborate to make a decision how to manage this case.
GRACE: And that`s exactly what was done, Dr. Leffler, with little Payton. And I`m sure that your people, when they saw him covered in bruises, had no idea he would go right back to the home. Dr. Leffler, how many cases have you seen like this, when children come in with suspicious bruises?
LEFFLER: Nancy, our emergency department sees about 60,000 cases a year. We probably see 12 to 15 cases a year where we consult DCF to help make a decision to try and protect the child from potential abuse.
GRACE: And then, Brett Larson, not only does Payton die, Deseret dies. Now they are having public hearings because child services is not doing their jobs. What can you tell me about this other woman, a CPS worker investigated by CPS?
LARSON: Yes. If you can believe that, Nancy. This woman is a Child Protective Services worker. They go to her home for a warrant for a drug warrant, drug-related charges. What do they find when they get in there? Almost two dozen marijuana plants, they find a baggy of marijuana, a handgun, pills. But that`s just scraping the iceberg and scrape being the word to be used. Look at this place. It`s disgusting. It is filthy, covered in cockroaches and bugs and soaked in urine. And this is a woman who is supposed to be out on the streets protecting children from these very environments.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Now, to the country music capital, Nashville. A gorgeous young mother mysteriously disappears leaving behind purse, cell phone, dogs and little son. And to Spartanburg, a 28-year-old mother of twins disappears. But her family then gets disturbing e-mails and texts that don`t sound like her at all.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Burgess simply disappears, leaving her dogs, purse and car at home. 10-year-old son.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are worried we will never see her again.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Foul play suspected in the disappearance of a South Carolina mother of three who vanished without a trace.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We feel like there are some wrongdoings in this case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Not a day goes by without her son praying to god to bring her -- bring his mother back home safely.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: To Brian Joyce, host of "Live and Local," thank you for being with us. What can you tell me, has there been anything in Nicole Burgess? She leaves behind her purse, cell phone, two dogs and her son.
BRIAN JOYCE: Right. Thank you again, Nancy, for having me on and thank you so much for covering this story. Right now those are the details that we know. She was last seen on a Friday. She went missing on a Sunday. And that`s about it. Her friends and family just don`t flow what happened to her.
GRACE: Everybody, take a look at this picture. This is Nichole, Nicky, Burgess. Mother of a 10-year-old son. I want to go now to Sheriff Chuck Wright with the Spartanburg County Sheriff`s Office. Sheriff Wright, I want to thank you so much for being with us. Your people did everything right in the search for Nichole. This is a 28-year-old mother of three. Including twins. Let`s see a shot of Nichole Goodlett (ph). Sheriff, what happened, what have you observed, what have you found out, Sheriff Wright?
WRIGHT: Thank you for letting me be on your show to get exposure for this family. We had a 28-year-old mother of three, and she was reported missing on March the 12th by her parents who flew in from Texas. During the investigation, we went to serve a search warrant at the boyfriend`s home. While we were doing the search warrant, we notified him of what we were doing when we came there. He runs into the house and shuts the door. We gain entry into the house and make an arrest on him for interfering with our search warrant. While we were searching him to make sure he didn`t have anything on him that might hurt us, such as weapons or whatever, we find Nichole Goodlett`s cell phone on him. And the mother comes down and during her report, she said, I started texting my daughter, it didn`t sound like the way she talked back to me, her mother. I know her better than anybody. She starts texting in German. Well, when Nichole, the person texting her back in German, and didn`t really understand what German was, she knew that that wasn`t Nichole.
GRACE: With me, Sheriff Chuck Wright. Chuck, Sheriff Chuck Wright, I think that you`re definitely on to something. Sheriff Wright, please don`t move a hair. Daniel Goodlett is with us. The brother of Nichole. Daniel, your sister speaks German as well?
DANIEL GOODLETT: Yes, Nancy. Thanks on behalf of the Goodlett family (inaudible). That is correct. Nichole does speak German, and she would speak German with my mother quite often.
GRACE: When her mother tried to write her, as Sheriff Chuck Wright was telling us, in German, the response was just gobbledygook, it didn`t make any sense, right?
GOODLETT: Right. From what I understand, it looked like it would be a broken translation from something off the Internet. It was not the same text that Nichole would have used, the same format she would have used to speak in that language.
GRACE: Daniel Goodlett, how are her children doing? She has twins and then one other child. How are they?
GOODLETT: They are doing very well. Her son is safe with my parents. And he is doing very well. He is very sad with the situation. Does not understand. It is very senseless to him.
GRACE: I`m sure, Daniel. Sheriff Chuck Wright with us. Sheriff, when I have to work late, my twins cry when I come in. They`re upset. I can only imagine the three children, mommy`s just gone. What should I tell the viewers tonight? Sheriff Wright? What should I tell them, other than the tip line, which is 615-742-7463, on Burgess and 1-888-crime-South Carolina. Help me out, Sheriff Wright.
WRIGHT: I would first say be in prayer that we would find the right clue, be in prayer for the Goodlett family. And I`m hoping that we will find Nichole somewhere, alive and well. But, the gentleman, her boyfriend is Gerald Germane Howard. And we have talked to him. And if anybody who listens to this show can sit and imagine your sister, your mother, your best friend, your person you pray with and work with never shows up home again and you know something, please call 888-274-6372. 888-crime sc.
GRACE: Dr. Leslie Austin, psychotherapist, Dr. Austin, this guy is not a suspect, not a person of interest. He`s the boyfriend. But I tell you, if police were at my house, I wouldn`t run in and slam the door in their face.
AUSTIN: Neither would I. The fact he had her cell phone in his possession and there were odd texts, that concerns me. You need to look for patterns and anomalies. What is atypical? This woman would never have left in the way she did if there wasn`t some kind of foul play somewhere. So let`s all hope someone will give something to the police that will find her.
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GRACE: A young mom suspected of drowning her newborn baby boy in a Wal-Mart restroom toilet, then dumping his tiny body in a cave. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: An autopsy revealed the little boy was born alive and even took a breath. Authorities now say Wilson delivered the child while at work in the bathroom.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Michelle Southern, Louisiana radio network, drowned the child in a Wal-Mart toilet, then hid the body in a cave? What alternate universe is this?
SOUTHERN: And that`s what authorities tell us, she went to the bathroom, had the baby in the toilet, and then made lots of effort to dispose of it, hide her tracks, stayed in the bathroom for just hours after the incident occurred, according to authorities.
GRACE: To Dr. Nina Radcliffe, physician joining me out of New York. Dr. Radcliffe, of course, the defense is either going to say I can go ahead and tell you their play book, insanity or that the child was stillborn, but isn`t it true, Dr. Radcliffe, that you can tell upon autopsy whether a child was alive at birth? I think I`ve got Dr. Radcliffe with me.
Liz, do we have Nina? Okay, I`m going to go ahead and answer my question.
To you, Lynn Stoppy, Johnson County, Missouri, prosecuting attorney, the lungs are tested. They are sometimes submerged in water and it`s determined if air had ever been breathed. And, you know, I guess you`re lining up for the defense right now. With me, Lynn Stoppy. Lynn, where was the cave where the body was found in connection with the Wal-Mart, Lynn Stoppy?
LYNN STOPPY: Well, actually the cave was on the other end of town. The cave belongs to the University of Central Missouri, and so in Wal-Mart, Warrensburg, actually, Wal-Mart is on the north end of town and the cave is more towards the south end of town. It`s kind of far.
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GRACE: A young mom accused of drowning her infant child in a toilet at Wal-Mart, then hiding the tiny body across town in a cave. With me, the Johnson County Missouri prosecuting attorney, Lynn Stoppy. Lynn Stoppy, it`s amazing to me that you can connect her to a cave across town. How did you do it?
STOPPY: Well, the way the story broke actually, there were some students doing research in the cave and they actually found the body at first. Once the baby was found and we were able to figure out that it was a boy, get some preliminary information, as with any kind of investigation in a smaller community, we asked the community for help. Law enforcement was very actively engaged in trying to find anyone around town who knew someone that may have been pregnant and all of a sudden there was no baby, because by the determination that we had, the baby was pretty close to full term. And so questions were asked and leads were gathered, and we were able --
GRACE: You know what, Lynn, this is what I don`t get, Lynn Stoppy, if you`re going to carry the baby nine months, and that`s your personal decision, if you want to have the child, you want to have an abortion, that`s your right in our country, but to carry the baby nine months, give birth to the baby, and then murder the baby, why not just give the baby up for adoption? I don`t understand that, Lynn, why murder the baby?
STOPPY: I suspect that`s the $64,000 question.
GRACE: Yes, yes, you`re right, you and me both want to know that. Dr. Radcliffe, I think I`ve got you back. How do you tell if the baby was born alive?
RADCLIFFE: Well, the key is that the baby`s lungs are inflated. While the baby`s in the mother`s body, the baby does not use its lungs, the mother is breathing for the baby and the lungs will remain collapsed. In the first few breaths after birth, the baby is expanding their lungs. What they need to see and determine is if the baby`s lungs are expanded, and that is key.
GRACE: Everyone, we are standing by to find out what becomes of this, but I don`t want this baby lost in the sauce. I`m sure Lynn Stoppy is not going to let that happen.
Everyone, let`s stop. I was recently honored to attend an event to honor U.S. Medal of Honor recipients, Donald Ballard, Harvey Barnum Jr., Gary Beikarch, Pat Grady, Bruce Crandall, Harold Fritz, Joe Jackson, Ron Rosser, Kenneth Stumpf and Woodrow Williams. Out of 3488 Medal of Honor recipients, there were 78 still alive, and I had the privilege of meeting ten of them at once. Their stories awed me, inspired me, brought everyone in the room to tears at their bravery. Tonight, thank you, American heroes. And tonight, a special good night from New York friend of the show Shannon Vemerchik (ph), she`s waving to her mom in Pennsylvania. Drew up next, everybody, I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
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