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Nancy Grace
Medical Records Sought in Hot Car Toddler Death
Aired July 07, 2014 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. The tragic death of 22 month-old toddler boy Cooper, seemingly left alone for hours in a baking
hot car by Daddy. But tonight, was the tot murdered? Damning details emerge as Daddy sits unemotional until evidence comes out he`s sexting six
different women, including sending pictures of his erect penis as his toddler boy bakes dead in the car. Evidence indicates the baby`s
scratching his own little face, crying out loud, abrasions on the back of his head as he rocks, banging back and forth, calling out for Daddy.
Bombshell tonight. In the last hours, we obtain detailed information behind newly executed search warrants, and the prosecution`s plan to seek
the death penalty.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The child appeared wide awake and happy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What he was doing during that day while his child was out in the car.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was having up to six different conversations with different women, sexting.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No tears, no, you know, real emotion coming out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The photos being sent back and forth between these women and the defendant during this day while the child`s out in the car.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, there were photos of his exposed penis, erect penis being sent.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, the 16-year-old girl, OK -- did she send him a picture that day?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She did.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Of what?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She sent a picture of her exposed breasts.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And did he send any pictures to her?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He did. He sent a picture of his exposed erect penis.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He also did a search on how to survive prison.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) was called child-free. And child-free is a -- people who advocate living child-free.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He wanted to live a child-free life or there`s evidence to suggest that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell tonight. The tragic death of 22 month-old toddler boy Cooper, seemingly left alone for hours in a baking-hot car by Daddy. But
was the tot actually murdered?
Damning details emerge as Daddy sits unemotional until evidence comes out he`s sexting six different women, sending pictures of his erect penis,
while his toddler boy, Cooper, bakes dead in the car. Evidence indicating the baby`s scratching his face, crying out, abrasions on the back of his
head as he bangs back and forth, trying to escape.
In the last hours, we obtain detailed information behind newly executed search warrants and the prosecution`s plan to seek the death
penalty.
We are taking your calls. As you all know by now, the father, Ross Harris, has been bound over from the lower court to a felony court. Now we
are waiting on a grand jury presentation. Now, what that means is this. The Cobb County elected district attorney, Vic Reynolds, will convene a
grand jury. This is the July/August term. That means there`s a new grand jury coming in, unaccustomed to hearing cases.
We are predicting he will wait several weeks while he amasses more information and breaks in the grand jury. In a couple of weeks, we predict
this case will go to a secret grand jury for indictment. At that time, we predict the district attorney will seek the death penalty on this father,
Ross Harris.
There you see him in court. There you see his wife on the front row, snapping gum and looking bored. But tonight, that`s not a good look for a
woman that many people believe is being honed in on by police. Now, at this time, the wife, Leanna Harris, the mother of little Cooper, has not
been charged. She has not been named a person of interest or a suspect.
Straight out to Ninette Sosa, reporter with Newsradio 106.7. Ninette, all eyes now not on just Daddy but Mommy, as well. What can you tell us
about these newly obtained search warrants?
NINETTE SOSA, NEWSRADIO 106.7 (via telephone): Well, one of the questions is, is she a co-conspirator? So that might be one avenue that
investigators are looking, you know, at her. About these new search warrants -- they`re aimed (ph) involving Kaiser medical records for Justin
Ross Harris and...
GRACE: Hey, hold on. Hold on, Ninette. Let`s see the tears (ph) from the search warrant, a search warrant for Kaiser Permanente medical
records. Very interesting that in a possible premeditated case, they are exercising a warrant for Kaiser Permanente records. Explain, Ninette.
SOSA: They`re looking at what type of medication Mr. Ross -- or Ross Harris may have been on, if any, also about Cooper. Was he progressing the
way he should be progressing? Were the check-ups on schedule, details like that. In addition to the medical records, they also seized thumb drives,
hard drives, a DVD recorder, and curious...
GRACE: I want to get back to medical records. Hold on just a moment. I don`t want to just gloss over that. With me, Ninette Sosa from 106.7.
Kaiser Permanente medical records -- now, let`s talk about the significant if that. Possibly, was the child malnourished? Was it mistreated? Had it
come in with bruises, unusual bruising in the past? They`re going to look at if the child had failure to thrive. Was he eating properly? Was he
growing appropriately? What other issues had this child had?
Also, the medical records of the father. What, if anything, had he been treated for? Now, what does this have to do with the investigation?
That is one of the questions tonight.
Hold on. I am just being joined right now by Mr. Madden. We all became familiar with him at the bind-over hearing. He actually saw the
tot, baby Cooper, pulled from the car dead. Mr. Madden, thank you for joining us.
MR. MADDEN, WITNESS (via telephone): No problem, Ms. Grace.
GRACE: Mr. Madden, I understand that you were there and you were with a colleague, and she was very upset. And you stepped over to see why she
was upset. When you saw what was happening, what was the first thing you observed?
MADDEN: The first thing after noticing that the body that was laying on the hot pavement was, in fact, a 2-year-old toddler. I was about four
or five feet away from him. Of course, that being Cooper. And then Mr. Ross. I was about three feet away from him. And he was hysterical. He
was crying out. He was screaming. He was hollering, My son, oh, my God, my son is dead, oh, my God. It just seemed very real, very organic.
GRACE: Yes, I noticed that was the phraseology you used on the stand. I want to get back to the child. You say that you were four or five feet
away from baby Cooper. What did you observe about him?
MADDEN: Well, honestly, Nancy, he looked very -- he looked clean. I saw no bruises. I saw no abrasions. His hair wasn`t pulled back. It
wasn`t wet...
GRACE: Well, was he laying on his back or on his stomach?
MADDEN: He was laying on his back.
GRACE: OK, because the abrasions mostly are on the back of the head, where we believe he was banging up against his carseat, trying to get out.
MADDEN: Oh.
GRACE: So was he pale?
MADDEN: No, he looked normal. He just was lifeless.
GRACE: Now, were the child`s eyes and mouth open at the time? Because we learned during the hearing that the child`s eyes were open, the
mouth was open and the tongue was protruding and the lips had turned bluish. That was the testimony by the police. What, if anything, did you
observe?
MADDEN: I saw none of that. And again, I was about four or five feet away from him.
GRACE: Right.
MADDEN: He looked normal. I saw no discoloration. His eyes were definitely closed. His mouth was definitely closed.
GRACE: Interesting. And what were police -- when did they move the father to the back of the police car? Did you hear him yell out at the
cops, "F you"?
MADDEN: Well, this was after one of the police officers had spoken very abrasively to him. And of course, he didn`t have his ball bearings
together, so he did yell "F you" to her, and then they approached him...
GRACE: Well, wait a minute. Wa-wait. When you say the cop spoke abrasively to him, what did she say?
MADDEN: Well, she wanted him to step back and she said, Get back. But of course, he wanted to, you know, see after his son and see what they
were doing and...
GRACE: Oh, really? Because was he performing CPR? Because we were told the minute other people got there, he quit administering aid and stood
back and got on the cell phone. Was that not correct?
MADDEN: Well, when I was approaching, that is accurate. When I was approaching, other people had came in and perhaps they told him that they
worked in the medical field or they had some history with giving or administering CPR.
GRACE: Well, do you know that they said that, or are you just guessing that they said that? Did you hear someone say, Step back, say I`m
a nurse or I`m a doctor?
MADDEN: I wouldn`t want to speculate, Nancy.
GRACE: Yes.
MADDEN: However, in a situation like that, I`m sure in the event I had history, I would want to tell the father that I did have history, as
opposed to being a novice and operating or just checking on someone`s child.
GRACE: So if you did not observe it, what you did observe is the father four or five feet away from the child and other people were giving
the child CPR. Were the other people EMTs?
MADDEN: No, they weren`t. They were just...
GRACE: Really?
MADDEN: ... sensitive to the situation, you know, saddened by the situation. They were just trying to help out...
GRACE: And they were giving EMT -- was anybody giving EMT to the child?
MADDEN: EMT actually didn`t arrive until later.
GRACE: Well, was anybody giving CPR to the child? Let me rephrase that.
MADDEN: As I was approaching.
GRACE: They were?
MADDEN: Yes.
GRACE: OK, and those were just standers-by.
MADDEN: I wouldn`t be able to tell because, again I was approaching as they were doing it.
GRACE: OK. Now, I`m not quite sure why the father ended up in the back of the car, in the back of the police car. When he yelled out "F you"
to the police, I think that pretty much sealed it. What was he doing in the back of the police car?
MADDEN: Well, he was sitting there, and then there were detective -- homicide detective that came -- he was about 100 feet away in a squad car,
and they came and they began to speak with him. But he wasn`t acting out, wasn`t being violent in the back of the car.
GRACE: Well, he was handcuffed, right?
MADDEN: I`m sorry?
GRACE: Wasn`t he handcuffed?
MADDEN: He was handcuffed, yes.
GRACE: Well, OK. With me, everyone, is Mr. Madden, who we all remember testifying at the hearing with crucial evidence. He is also
taking your calls.
Back to Sarah Westwood, reporter with "The Marietta Daily Journal," also joining us, with Ninette Sosa. Sarah, these newly executed search
warrants are, in my mind, very, very critical. Number one, we know that they are looking at their medical records. Number two, why are they
searching -- why are police searching for lightbulbs?
SARAH WESTWOOD, "MARIETTA DAILY JOURNAL" (via telephone): Right. So one of the significant pieces of evidence that the defense presented for
Justin Ross Harris was that Justin Ross Harris was deaf in his right ear, which would have been the side of his face that was closest to the child.
So one reason they`re likely looking at Justin Ross Harris`s medical records is to corroborate the validity of that statement.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would you be surprised to know that Ross is completely deaf in his right ear? Did you know that?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I did not know that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you think that he intentionally kept that from you?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Welcome back, everyone. Again, in the last hours, we receive information behind the search warrants, the newly executed search warrants,
including a search for lightbulbs and medical records of the father that you see there, Ross Harris, and the little boy, tiny Cooper, a 22 month-old
boy that is baked dead in Daddy`s car. Tonight, was Mommy in on a murder plan? At this hour, the mother, Leanna Taylor Harris, has not been named a
suspect or a person of interest, as questions gather.
We are taking your calls. Deborah in Oregon. Hi, Deborah. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. Thanks for taking my call. I think that possibly maybe the two conspired together.
GRACE: And why do you say that?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, it sounds like she did the looking at home, and it was, like, he did the looking at work to maybe to throw people
off. So I`m thinking maybe they co-conspired it together. And you know, both of them -- she didn`t act so totally surprised that it happened.
GRACE: No, not at all, Deborah in Oregon, but because unless she is clairvoyant -- unleash the lawyers, Danny Cevallos and Areva Martin.
First to you, Cevallos. She goes to the day care to pick up the baby. They say he was never dropped off. The first thing she says is, Ross left
him in the car. Well, the day care worker goes, Well, it could be -- they could be at McDonald`s. They could be at the playground. He doesn`t have
to be in a hot car. She goes, No, he left him in the car.
Now, Either she knew or she`s clairvoyant. Which one do you pick?
DANNY CEVALLOS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: I pick option three because the reality is, everyone becomes or fashions themself as an
expert on the proper way to react to a crisis during times like this, when the reality is, everybody says something differently. What about the
chance option three, Nancy, that she maybe just made a correct guess and she was right? But now because that`s not the way everyone says I would
react to stress or I would react to pressure...
GRACE: No, that`s not it at all.
CEVALLOS: ... that`s what they`re using to convict. Well, either way, you`re going to need more than an odd statement.
GRACE: Actually, that would be quite a coincidence, Areva Martin, and I do not believe there are coincidences in criminal law. Now...
CEVALLOS: They`re inconvenient.
GRACE: ... if I was arguing in your shoes, Areva or Danny Cevallos, I would say, Well, just the other day, they had talked about and looked up on
line what temperature, quote, "is needed" for a child to die in a hot car. So that was on her mind. That`s something I would argue if I were the
defense.
And for instance, another thing I would argue if I were the defense is, Yes, he had -- he`s a sex-aholic, and that`s what he was thinking about
when he got out of the car. Instead of fighting the sexting, the defense should embrace it and use it as a defense.
Think about it people! Why am I having to spoon feed you two? OK, Areva Martin, help me out here.
AREVA MARTIN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know what, Nancy? That`s probably going -- that`s probably going to happen. We`re probably going to
see the defense saying that this man was so preoccupied throughout the day, because he does have this compulsion with women and sending his erect penis
and getting pictures of them and their body parts, that he forgot about his child. And as it relates to that mother, we just haven`t heard nearly
enough...
GRACE: Hold on.
MARTIN: ... to suggest that she was involved.
GRACE: Let me get you back in the middle of the road here. OK, at the day care center, she`s the one that says he`s got -- He left him in the
car, I know he did, when nobody had ever even said anything about a hot car. My point is, are the police...
MARTIN: Nancy...
GRACE: ... now focusing on the mother, Leanna?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In court, the mother`s face mostly stoic.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Leanna Harris has not been officially charged or listed as a suspect.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`d both done Internet searches on child deaths in hot cars.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She states, Ross must have left him in the car.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And the first thing Mommy says when she goes into that police interrogation room to see her husband, whom she has chosen to see as
opposed to seeing her child, Cooper -- first thing is not, What happened? Whether she`s blaming him or not blaming him, she didn`t say, What happened
to Cooper? First question, one of the first questions is, Did you tell the police too much? Did you say too much? That`s one of the first things.
And correct me if I`m wrong, but Mike Duffy, when we were watching the testimony as it unfolded from the witness stand, her mother, Leanna
Harris`s mother, was on the phone and said, What`s wrong? Why aren`t you reacting? Your child is dead. What`s wrong with you?
And they asked the cop, Mike Duffy, How did you hear that? They were on the phone. And the cop -- you know, never ask the question you don`t
know the answer to because the cop said, The mother, the grandmother was screaming so loud, I could hear her. Just standing there, I could hear her
on the phone. So she`s been stoic without -- throughout.
Mike Duffy, I want to talk to you. We`ve already seen the drive. We followed in the footsteps of police from work to Uncle Maddio`s, where the
scene unfolded with the child on the asphalt. You have done another route. Tell me, where did you go, Mike Duffy? Let`s see it.
MIKE DUFFY, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER (via telephone): Yes, Nancy, it`s that clear frame of reference that most people don`t have. So what we did
was retrace the drive from the Chick-fil-A, where dad and son supposedly had breakfast that morning, to work. And what we found is that it takes
less than two minutes to get there. It`s less than half a mile. So in that time, the question is, Did Dad forget his son?
GRACE: OK, so you`re pulling out. You come back around the Chick- fil-A to get out on the highway. Take a look at this guy. That`s the left turn everybody is talking about. You turn back. There you go. This is
from Chick-fil-A to the Home Depot office, the treehouse, so to speak, where the father, Justin Ross Harris, works.
Now remember, this time -- here`s the red light we`ve been telling you about, complete with camera -- complete with camera. Red or no, that
camera is working. Now, remember, it`s just one minute and 20 seconds -- one minute and 20 seconds. He has only got that long to completely forget
about his son.
Now, you`re seeing the street just as he saw that day. We`ve shown you the route home, where he goes through seven different stop signs, seven
different red lights. This is from Chick-fil-A to the office, one minute, 20 seconds. That`s how long, according to him, it took for him to forget
his child.
And here you see it. He`s pulling in at work.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The child appeared wide awake and happy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What he was doing during that day while his child was out in the car.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was having up to six different conversations with different women, sexting.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No tears, no, you know, real emotion coming out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The photos being sent back and forth between these women and the defendant during this day while the child`s out in the car.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, there were photos of his exposed penis, erect penis being sent.
* No tears, no real emotion coming out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There were photos being sent back and forth between these women and the defendant during this day while the child is
out in the car?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, there were photos of his exposed penis, erect penis being sent.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, the 16-year-old girl, did she send him a picture that day?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She did.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Of what?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She sent a picture of her exposed breasts.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And did he send any pictures to her?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He did. He sent a picture of his exposed, erect penis.
He also did a search how to survive prison.
(inaudible) called child free, and child free is people who advocate living child-free.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He wanted to live a child-free life or there is evidence to suggest that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Welcome back. For those of you just joining us, as you know by now, a judge, Judge Fox, binds over the father of tot, 22 month-old
Cooper Harris, for grand jury indictment. Now it is in the hands of the elected district attorney, Victor Reynolds. This, as we learn that search
warrants go down. We obtain those search warrants. And the reasoning behind the search warrants, over the weekend, for medical records of the
father. Was he really deaf in one ear claiming he couldn`t hear the baby? As he claimed in court. As his lawyer claimed. Had he had medical
problems we don`t know about? Did the boy have problems like abuse or malnutrition, failure to thrive?
We also know a search warrant goes down to search the home for light bulbs. He claims that he has to go with his friends from work at lunchtime
to Home Depot. He is the only one that does any purchasing. He goes in and buys three light bulbs, comes back, leaves the friends, back to the
car. There in the car, he carefully -- is not driving -- throws the light bulbs into the car, slams the door and leaves. Was it for real or was it a
ruse to have witnesses state he did not notice the child? There you were seeing their rented condo.
We also learned that HR, human resources records have been subpoenaed. Had there been some problem at work? To Ben Levitan, telecommunications
expert joining me now, Ben, right now the case is in the hands of the district attorney, but to get all of the sexting, the sex text messages,
the e-mails, the computer searches, the phone records, how long will that take? Give me a ballpark, Ben Levitan?
LEVITAN: Well, Nancy, by law the phone companies and -- that has to be turned over in 30 days from the day you get a subpoena. But I work with
these guys every day, and they`re very cooperative. It is likely within a week all this stuff will be turned over, especially because it is so high
profile. They have to be more careful. Believe me, these companies comply with the law 100 percent. They have departments that do nothing but this
all day. This is going to create an incredible digital diary of this guy`s activity for the past months. We`re going to know what he was doing every
minute, because we got work computers, we got home computers, we got cell phones.
GRACE: You know, another thing I think we better be looking for, Bill Levitan, is this. We learned at the hearing there was no texting between
husband and wife the day the baby dies. For me, that is unnatural for people that have multiple cell phones, multiple laptops, hard drives,
Google Chromes, the works. They`re techies. He is in I.T. and doesn`t text his wife all day? I think it is very important, Ben Levitan, that
they search back and see their texting and emailing history, because if they typically text 30, 40 times a day, and then suddenly that day they go
radio silent, that is probative. It looks like they were trying to prove they had no communications that day, and there was never a chance for mommy
to say hey, did you drop off Cooper? I find that very, very probative. Hold on, Bill Levitan, you are saying a couple of weeks to get all of those
records. Michael Christian, think through this with me, are you with me?
CHRISTIAN: Yes, ma`am.
GRACE: Okay, Michael, this is what we know. In Cobb County, the grand jury meets once a week on Thursday. That means the grand jury,
typically made up from 15 to 50 individuals, voters, get together. This is a new grand jury. They last two months. That is their term, July, August.
A brand-new grand jury is just coming in, Michael Christian.
Now, I presented to the grand jury hundreds and hundreds of times. A presentment takes two minutes to two hours. They need one witness. That
would be the lead detective, probably the same way we saw the hearing. We`re going to see that detective in front of the grand jury. He will give
a brief presentation, give the main facts and open it up to grand jury questions.
Here is my prediction, Michael. They`re going to wait several weeks. They want to break in the new grand jury. Let them cut their teeth on
shopliftings, you know, carjackings, dope cases, before they get this case. So I`m thinking sometime in August, late July, they`re going to get all of
their materials, Ben Levitan is talking about phone records and so forth, and take this to a grand jury.
One more thing, Michael Christian. They`re missing something. Toxicology reports. How do you think that will play into the
investigation, if at all? Toxicology on baby Cooper?
CHRISTIAN: That could be extremely important, Nancy, because certainly if this baby was doped up, if there was any sort of chemical
introduced into this baby`s system, that is something that the grand jury and the prosecutor would certainly want to know. Toxicology takes two,
maybe three weeks to come back. So we will be expecting in a couple of weeks for the medical examiner`s office to release a final autopsy report.
GRACE: Okay, hold on. I have got another thing. I got another thing. Unleash the lawyers, Danny Cevallos, Areva Martin, also joining me,
Dr. Michelle Dupre, medical examiner.
Areva Martin, this is what the state doesn`t want. They don`t want to indict prematurely and then get slapped with a speedy trial demand. That
is a constitutional right you have that says, okay, you have indicted me. Now you have got one to two terms to try me or you cut me loose. If you
don`t try that person in front of a jury within three to six months, they are acquitted. The charges are dropped.
My point is, Areva, they have to get their ducks in a row, have everything ready. All their proof, toxicology, phone records, e-mails, the
works, then indict. Because watch, they`re going to put a speedy on the state, and the state is going to have to move immediately to trial, Areva.
MARTIN: You know, I think the state is moving cautiously because there is so much information, as you said, Nancy, to be gained here, these
records. And this is a case that most people believe, as you will recall, that this guy just made a mistake. When these kids, 40 or so, that are
lost or killed in cars, people think it is a mistake, not murder.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From the U-turn, how far is it to get from the Chick-fil-a from this U-turn?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seconds.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Harris would have had to make a right turn out of the parking lot, then a U turn, just in front of the Home Depot.
Police said Harris sent lewd text messages while his son sat strapped in the car seat in the broiling Atlanta heat.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This whole second life that he`s living with alternative personalities and alternate personas.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And this hour, the case in the hands of the district attorney, Vic Reynolds. So far Reynolds has a stellar record as an elected
prosecutor. He trained in the office where I was a prosecutor in inner city of Atlanta, and actually trained under me, as well as with a lot of
other senior prosecutors. Never afraid to try a case, would take a case to a jury in a heartbeat. Right now many court watchers believing Reynolds
will seek the death penalty in this case.
On the other side, you got this guy. Maddux Kilgore, he is certainly no slouch either. Kilgore was a prosecutor in the state`s attorney
general`s office. I recall also working with him, not against him. Kilgore at that time I believe was working on a habeas corpus and an appeal
on a murder case I had tried, a very difficult murder case. And I recall at the time being very impressed with his skills.
So, okay, that was his assistant. There is Kilgore right there. Both fantastic trial lawyers.
We are taking your calls. Straight out to Lisa, hi, Lisa, what is your question?
LISA: Hi, Nancy, I want to say first of all you have so much strength for doing these shows every night. And my question to the panel of
possible pleas, I`d just like to know, if people don`t love, honor and cherish their child, then why do they have them?
GRACE: You know, Greg Cason, psychologist, I don`t think any of us lawyers are qualified for that. I mean, I know what to do if somebody is
charged with murder, but I don`t know the answer to that. Why do you go through so much to have a child? I know I did. And then start looking up
living a child-free life? And not only that, Greg, I was just really disgusted. I remember the first time I wrote a non-fiction, "Objection."
And I had to look up how people made blood money, money off murder cases. And the websites I looked at, by the time I finished writing that book, I
wanted to throw away my computer. I was so just put off by all the -- the dark, dark leanings in our society.
But Greg, this guy is looking up watching people die on video. Where is Greg Cason? He is watching them in the throes of death. And he is
looking at websites, how to live a child-free life. And how long does it take a child to die in a hot car? And if you could, show the video of the
veterinarian that we spoke with at length who created the video about animals dying in hot cars. Can you answer at least those questions, Greg?
CASON: It is absolutely disgusting, Nancy, and I think for those of us who bond with our children and feel a great deal of need to have
children and raise children and see them as the future of our society have trouble seeing that some people are just that depraved. And it may be that
he wanted a child in the beginning, but then started to see the real stresses of having a child as you go through life and wanted to escape from
that. And he chose one of the most heinous and possible actions a parent can take, if indeed he did.
GRACE: At the get-go, I want to go back to Ninette Sosa, News Radio. At the beginning, I kept thinking, depending on the time of the search of
dead animals in hot cars, if it were after the death of Cooper, I still thought maybe he could be innocent, but the more we hear, the worse it
gets. What can you tell us about the stunning news over the weekend that the father, Ross Harris Cooper, excuse me, Justin Ross Harris, actually
directs his family how to get the life insurance proceeds from behind bars.
SOSA: The $27,000, exactly, there is two of those. And it was Friday evening, and he is telling his family how to cash out these policies for
his child. That is quite grim, from behind bars, on a Friday. And he -- in a twist, it is the mom, though, I keep going back to Leanna. The eulogy
on Saturday for her son, and she says toward the end of the eulogy to her husband who was listening via speaker phone from jail to this funeral, that
she was doing it for him. And I was thinking, doing what for him, exactly. It left me more questions on her bizarre eulogy that she gave for her son.
Yet it is about him, the husband.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers, Areva Martin, L.A., Danny Cevallos, New York. First of all to you, Danny, OK, he is behind bars, his child is dead
of a gruesome death, a tortuous death, a cruel death, and you know the word cruel and tortuous plays into the language you use to get the death
penalty, and he has the wherewithal to tell his family how to cash in on a life insurance policy. Hello? Home Depot already paid for the funeral, I
think. So while his mind, I would think, would be reeling about the death of his baby, he is worried about the life insurance policy. Let me hear
your spin on that, Cevallos.
CEVALLOS: Yes, good, everyone keep focusing on life insurance policies and Internet searches. Focus on them all you like. They are not
beginning to rise to the level of specific intent, malice murder, and even you have to concede, Nancy, even you have to concede, the prosecution is
going to have to come up with something better than asking about a life insurance policy, which is something that you buy and cash in on--
GRACE: I don`t even know what you`re saying.
CEVALLOS: You don`t?
GRACE: I don`t even know what you`re talking about.
CEVALLOS: You`re familiar with a life insurance policy, right?
GRACE: Have you actually tried a circumstantial murder case?
CEVALLOS: Of course I have, Nancy. Are we doing resumes now?
GRACE: How did that turn out?
CEVALLOS: Which one, Nancy? Listen, we both tried murder cases.
GRACE: Because I don`t even know what you`re saying. This is actually how a circumstantial case is made.
CEVALLOS: Well, beware everyone who cashes in on their life insurance policies, beware, buy them at your own risk.
GRACE: No. You can go ahead and cut his mike.
CEVALLOS: OK, I`m done anyway.
GRACE: Areva, I think you will agree with me, even as a defense attorney, that it is not just the life insurance policy. It is the unusual
death of the child, No. 1, which the medical examiner ruled as probable homicide. It is the statements that he made. It is the searching before
the child`s death. How long is it needed for a child to die in a hot car? It is his reaction with his wife. It is sexting the women. It is looking
up a child-free life. It is asking about the life insurance policy. That -- it is all of that together to -- you build a case.
MARTIN: No doubt, Nancy, cumulatively all of these things look really bad for the dad. And in most of these cases when these kids die in hot
cars, you have an overly emotional parent and you don`t have all of these issues. This case is quite unusual, and the dad has a lot of explaining to
do. No doubt.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Straight out to Dr. Michelle Dupre, medical examiner and forensic pathologist. Dr. Dupre, thank you for being with us. Could you
explain the marks on the back of Cooper`s head? We know he was on the lowest setting possible for that car seat, which means he was in very, very
tight.
DUPRE: Yes, Nancy. Thank you for having me on the show. It seems as though he probably went into a normal heat stroke reaction, which is he
becomes agitated, he`s trying to get loose. It`s a very scary situation and he`s scratching, he`s wiggling, he`s scratching, he may be even going
into seizures, all caused from this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Everyone, I want to tell you about a missing girl. It`s very important. Live to Washington state. This young girl disappears, and
tonight we join the search for Angie Dean. With me is her mother, Lynda Jorgensen. Thank you so much for being with us. How did your girl go
missing? Tell me.
LYNDA JORGENSEN, MOTHER: Thank you for having us. On Monday the 23rd she left the house and hasn`t returned, and we`ve heard nothing from her.
She left on the 23rd in the evening, about 9:30, and we have no idea where she is.
GRACE: Where was she going that night, Ms. Jorgensen?
JORGENSEN: We have no idea. We have no idea.
GRACE: Okay. She took only what she was wearing. She had on black running tights, like white razorback tank top, white Nike shows.
Authorities have discovered a cell phone Angie`s parents didn`t know she had. That is not unusual. The fact is, though, Ms. Jorgensen, did the
cops find that cell phone?
JORGENSEN: No, they haven`t found the cell phone but they know she was in possession of one.
GRACE: To Dave Mack, syndicated talk show host. Dave, I do not think this girl is a runaway. So often the cops throw that term out there. I`m
very concerned. What more do we know? Has she been spotted?
MACK: She hasn`t been spotted. But what we know is the afternoon she went missing, she was dropped off at her house by a man looking between the
ages of 25 and 30, driving an older Volvo and filled with a bunch of other people. Also, a couple of days prior to her leaving and disappearing, she
left an ominous message for her boyfriend, indicating that his life was in jeopardy, as well as that of her family. I don`t think she left on her own
either, Nancy.
GRACE: Everyone, please help us find Angie Dean, this beautiful young girl, the tip line is 360-397-2028. Repeat, 360-397-2028. Please help
bring Angie home.
Let`s stop, everyone, and remember, American hero Army Staff Sergeant Christopher Rogers. Just 29. Sturgess, Michigan. Army Commendation
Medal, Army Achievement Medal, National Defense Service Medal. Loved sports, food, fishing and golf. Parents Danny and Katherine, widow,
Selena, son, Caden. Christopher Rogers. American hero.
Tonight, everyone, I have new photos to share with you. Today Lucy and I went to an American girl birthday party for a little friend. I`ve
got more photos. There`s the American girl doll and dog. And Lucy`s dress (inaudible) the doll, and that stuff ain`t cheap, people. Go to
Nancygrace.com for more pictures.
Everybody, also tonight I want to wish a very happy birthday to Dan Grace. He graduated with honors. He`s a fantastic jazz player, and he`s
doing great in his new job. Happy birthday, Daniel Grace.
Dr. Drew up next. I`ll see you tomorrow night 8:00 sharp Eastern. Until then, good night, friend.
END
