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Nancy Grace

Paypal Refunds Donations to Hot Car Death Fund

Aired July 14, 2014 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JEAN CASAREZ, GUEST HOST: And we begin tonight with breaking news in the tragic death of 22-month-old Cooper Harris. The toddler is left alone

for hours in a hot car by his father. But was Cooper actually murdered? Justin Ross Harris -- he loses his job, and now comes another stunning

announcement. A second police department is looking into Harris`s activities. Could he face even more charges?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It smelled like -- it was a foul odor.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would it have been a painful death?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Upset, erratic, yelling and screaming, no tears.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It looked like he was trying to hyperventilate himself.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Every time I turn to my right, there`s the carseat. When I look into my rearview mirror, there`s the carseat.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would you be surprised to know that Ross is completely deaf in the right ear?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I did not know that.

NANCY GRACE, HOST: He may be deaf in one ear, but what about the other ear?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CASAREZ: And we got to Avon Lake, Ohio, a husband found dead in his own home. He is attacked with a taser and then suffocated with industrial-

strength plastic food wrap. Police are now saying it was reportedly being staged to look like a suicide. By whom, you might ask? Well, according to

police, his own wife.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He has -- we has plastic wrap, it looks like, on his head, and there`s a roll laying on the floor. And he left a one-line

note.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police didn`t buy her suggestion of suicide. Police say she had shocked him with a stun gun, zapped more than 20 times,

then wrapped his head in plastic wrap.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CASAREZ: And the mystery surrounding the disappearance of a young pregnant Marine wife. Erin Corwin (ph) leaves the military base in her

Toyota Corolla, heading for Joshua Tree National Park, but she is never seen again. Tonight, we search for clues.

And good evening. I`m Jean Casarez, in for Nancy Grace. Thank you so much for joining us.

We begin tonight with the tragic death of Cooper Harris, the toddler who literally died as the heat took over his entire body in his father`s

car.

Out to Ninette Sosa tonight, reporter with Newsradio 106.7. What is all this about a second police department investigating the father, Justin

Ross Harris?

NINETTE SOSA, NEWSRADIO 106.7: Jean, in addition to the sexting allegations that are going on, it appears that he may have met up with one

of the women that he was sexting with in an area that`s Woodstock. And they met up at a park. They rendezvoused there. That`s what`s being

investigated right now.

CASAREZ: Now, I understand this is about 10 miles away from where he lives. But here`s my question. Is this one of the six women that he was

sexting on that day while Cooper was in the car?

SOSA: My understanding is that, yes, it is. There is still that possibility. You know, the case needs to unfold, but my understanding is

yes, this is one of the six women that he had been sexting during work at Home Depot on that fateful day of June 18th.

CASAREZ: Right. And this changes everything around a little bit because this is not on a computer. This is in a park. This is face to

face. This is alleged human contact. Do we know at all if this was the minor?

SOSA: No, I don`t believe it was the minor. I -- for -- this Woodstock County visit was yet another person that he was sexting of the

six. The minor I remember was the one who had exposed her breasts to him. He exchanged a photo with her. And she -- the minor was the one who had

asked him via text, Do you have a conscience? He replied, No.

CASAREZ: Out to Michael Christian. What do we know about these women? Obviously, they`re being talked to by police now and investigators.

But what do we know about them?

MICHAEL CHRISTIAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER (via telephone): You know, we don`t know much, Jean. And that is so frustrating. We know from the

probable cause hearing that he was sexting six women. We know that the police said that they had identified, at that point, two of them and had

talked to them. One was this underaged girl who had been 16, apparently, when this on-line relationship started, now 17.

And then a second woman that they kept referring to as the older woman, although we have no idea what age she is. She`s just older in

relation to the 16 or 17-year-old. But at that point, that is all that the police had identified, and so that`s all we know about them.

CASAREZ: Now, back to you, Ninette. We have been able to confirm at this point that the man you`re looking at right there, charged with murder,

has been terminated, fired from Home Depot, right?

SOSA: Yes, he has been terminated. That happened on Friday, late Friday evening. At least, that`s when we got word of it to the newsroom.

As far as why he was fired, one can only suspect that it was because of sexting, not so much because of the charges of murder. That`s -- there`s

been no definitive answer on that. But sexting while at work, I would think, violates some type of a policy.

CASAREZ: Well, let`s go out to Darryl Cohen, defense attorney. You practice right there in Georgia. You know, when I first heard -- I`m not

going to say it was the second thing I thought of, but the first thing I thought of when I heard that he had been terminated, being the objective

person that I am, I said, He`s innocent until proven guilty. He`s been charged with a crime. Normally, you are suspended, even without pay,

normally. But he was fired. What`s your law there in Georgia?

DARRYL COHEN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Jean, I suspect he was probably fired because he was using the computer for his own purposes while he was

at work. Now, what`s the real reason? He`s charged with a crime. He may be guilty of the crime. It`s bad publicity for Home Depot.

And the law is they can pretty much -- he`s an employee at will, and he can do as he pleases -- or Home Depot can do as they please. But I

think they`re really trying to minimize the amount of bad publicity. And this is not a good for anybody. He`s in bad shape. Home Depot doesn`t

want to be associated with him.

CASAREZ: And that`s right, Kelly Saindon, family law lawyer. The second thing I thought of was, he was sexting during the course of that

day. He admitted that. And the fact is, he was there at Home Depot working. So that gives them cause -- it doesn`t even have go be at will

that they terminated him.

KELLY SAINDON, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: You`re right. They can absolutely get rid of him for that, for wasting company time, for stealing

resources. It is bad publicity. And they can go as far as saying he can`t come to work. He`s on the schedule next week. He didn`t show up. Sorry,

you can`t keep your job. No call, no show. They don`t have to hold the position for him.

So you know, he did open the can of worms. Obviously, he`s charged with a lot bigger things than sexting at this time, but Home Depot

definitely wants to dissociate from him, and you can`t blame them.

CASAREZ: But you know, this sexting part of this case is intertwined, and it is going to be a part of all of this. Back to Darryl Cohen. I`ve

got to ask you, as a defense attorney -- I heard last week a defense attorney say they don`t want any of this sexting to come in. What do you

say?

COHEN: Well, I -- well, Jean, I wouldn`t want the sexting to come in.

CASAREZ: Yes!

COHEN: But why would they? It`s stupid. On the part of the prosecutor -- and I know the DA`s office in Cobb fairly well -- very well,

actually -- and you`ve got a case of murder against him, and that`s probably going to be the focus of what they want to do. And anything else

will make it -- they`ll take the attention of the jurors off of it.

And I as a defense lawyer would like them to bring in everything because we can show that this was not a murder. This was stupid, poor

conduct, bad -- bad things that he did by stupidity. But I would want to show that he did not have the intent of killing his child.

CASAREZ: Well, Kelly Saindon, the texting can -- can be the defense from heaven for -- for them because they can show that he was so

intertwined with six different women on the day that he did forget his son. But if the prosecution doesn`t bring it in, and they might not, how does

the defense get it in? He takes the stand?

SAINDON: Well, really quickly, I was a former prosecutor. I know you brought up family law. And I was a former prosecutor. And I would want

this in as a prosecutor. I would show that he`s a calculating, manipulative liar that wanted to be single.

As for the defense bringing it in, as you just said, as their, this was someone who was distracted, they would say this guy didn`t have a care

in the world. He`s, you know, living this other life. He`s happy as clam. He`s got his family life here, and on the other side, he has his sex

buddies that he`s either meeting in person or he`s sexting. So he was distracted, and it`s more likely than not from the defense perspective that

you can take him at face value that he had other things on his mind that day.

So from the prosecution perspective, I would say this was carefully crafted strategy and that he was distracting himself because he wanted the

fantasy single life.

CASAREZ: Kirby Clements out of Georgia, Kelly is right. This gives a motive, a motive to want to be a free man without a child because you`ve

got so many woman in your life. Do you want it in as a defense lawyer?

KIRBY CLEMENTS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Given the facts of this case, I absolutely would want it in because my contention would be he was in such a

rush to start sexting these women that he forgot his child. You`ve got to explain how that baby got left in the car, which is why we`re here, and the

answer has got to be he was so focused on trying to get to these women and sexting them that he forgot. And that`s really what it goes down to, and

that negates the elements that the prosecution has to prove. He`s a bad guy.

CASAREZ: Back to Ninette Sosa, reporter with Newsradio 106.7. Something else that has just come out is that Paypal is going to actually

refund all of the donations that have been given?

SOSA: Yes, they are. Paypal has agreed to that. And there is another one that`s called Wepay.com (ph). They have yet to confirm or deny

that they will or will not give refunds. But Paypal will be giving money back. There`s also another account that`s through an Alabama bank that was

opened by Mrs. Harris, Leanna, and the status of that is still being determined.

CASAREZ: Now, Michael Christian, let me ask you, Paypal is just giving back the money that was donated. Do we know if people want their

donations back? There is a little boy that is deceased, the grieving, grieving mother -- and I put it that in quotes because many people believe

she`s not grieving -- has lost her child. What if people don`t want their money refunded?

CHRISTIAN: Well, Jean, when this was set up, I think most people assumed it was to help pay funeral expenses and also to pay for defense for

Justin Ross Harris. Well, the funeral ended up being paid by Home Depot. So that`s not really an expense.

And once things started coming out, negative things, negative allegations against this defendant, basically, this fund was just taken

down. I mean, once people started thinking, Hey, this isn`t as black and white as we originally thought it was, they didn`t contribute anymore.

Now, it`s very impressive in that in the short time it was up, it did raise over $22,000. But Paypal at least isn`t even asking people, Do you

want your money back? My understanding is that they will just be giving it back.

CASAREZ: All right, I want to go to Dr. William Morrone very quickly, medical examiner joining us, beck we`ve got to back to why we are here. We

are here because of Cooper Harris, this little boy.

I want to know -- and it is so hard to listen to, but we need to understand what he went through. For first 30 minutes he was in the car

that day, Doctor, what was it like for him as the temperature kept getting hotter?

DR. WILLIAM MORRONE, MEDICAL EXAMINER/FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Well, the first 30 minutes were his last 30 minutes. There`s no way somebody that

small and that fragile can live past that. The brain can`t live without six minutes of oxygen. It was a tight car, and it`s about 40 to 50 degrees

hotter inside the car than outside. And the average temperature for that place in Georgia this time of year is about 90 degrees. So that car got up

to 150, 160 degrees.

He started sweating, and he lost blood pressure, valuable fluids and probably went into a coma within the first 6 to 12 minutes. And he may

have gone into convulsions in the next 6 to 12 minutes. And the blood pressure coming down would have made him pass out. Therefore, he would

have had the coma.

And then a very famous medical examiner, Vincent DiMaio, said he cooked. That poor, innocent child cooked. And that`s irreversible damage,

pain, pain from the heat, pain from suffering and pain from fear. He didn`t live past 30 minutes. It`s a good thing he probably passed out in

the first 10 to 20 minutes. It was terrible.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CASAREZ: I`m Jean Casarez, in for Nancy Grace.

We have learned that Paypal is refunding all donations that were made to the Cooper Harris fund, no questions asked. You get your money back.

And that brings us to a point to talk about the mother in all of this, the mother of that little boy, the grieving mother of that little boy. I

want to go straight out to Ninette Sosa, reporter, on this. What do we know as far as her reactions, her grief, what she is going through at the

loss of her son?

SOSA: When she did receive the news about his death, she was very stoic, and actually, according to police documents told day care workers

that when she (sic) went to pick his son up, well, he -- Ross must have left him in the car. That was her reaction, just very stoic. Even through

the court proceedings, chewing gum, just looking straight ahead. Everybody does deal with stress in a different way, but she`s been very stoic through

the whole thing. And I believe she`s now back in Alabama with her mother.

CASAREZ: Michael Christian, we know that she has an attorney at this point. And the question everybody`s asking, Michael, is why hasn`t she

been charged? Is she going to be charged? What`s the latest we know on that?

CHRISTIAN: You know, the police have said that this is an ongoing and active investigation, Jean. Clearly, they are looking at everything. They

will not say whether or not she is a focus of the investigation, but certainly, she is part of this investigation.

They`re really not under any time pressure here. They can take their time. I would think they would certainly want to have all the Ts crossed

and the I`s dotted. So there may be charges against her at some point, but there`s really -- there`s really no rush. I think the investigation just

continues at this point.

CASAREZ: You know, Michael, I think one of the things that caught people off guard were some of the words that she said at her little boy`s

funeral. And I believe that we have a video recreation so everybody can hear exactly what she had to stay at that tragic, tragic event. Listen to

this.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "I am happy a list of things my son will skip, his first heartbreak. I won`t have to see that. Junior high and high

school -- I didn`t like it. Who to sit with at lunch in those awkward middle school years. He will not have to suffer through the death of his

Mimi (ph) and granddad, the death of me and Ross."

(END AUDIO CLIP)

CASAREZ: ... clinical psychologist joining us from Los Angeles. Everyone just can`t understand those words. I mean, you understand to a

point that they`re in a better place, but this descriptive things of life`s experiences, some that are joyous, that the little boy will miss -- how do

you explain that?

SETH MEYERS, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, her comments, I think, show just how emotionally detached she is from this baby. It`s almost like the

baby was just an object, not an actual person. For her to be able to be so intellectualized about it at the funeral really speaks to something very

negative on her part.

CASAREZ: But Kirby Clements, from what we know -- and we don`t know lot because they have executed search warrants at the home. They are

combing through different devices. But from what we know, how could they charge her at this point?

CLEMENTS: From what we know, there`s not a whole lot to go on for them to charge her. Obviously, the statements that she made at the time

that she was at -- she went and visited her husband when he got arrested, that could be used to suggest that she had some foreknowledge. But at this

juncture -- and she could be charge as a party to the crime or maybe some sort of conspiracy. But that`s the best that they could hope for. And if

that were the case, at this point, it`s be a horribly weak case at that.

CASAREZ: And Daryl Cohen, when you look at conspiracy and you have to have a communication, you have to have that instrumental step that`s taken,

that could be difficult, also.

COHEN: Of course, Jean, it`s difficult. They`d have to connect the dots. But I think that she made a very good move in hiring or retaining an

attorney, but a very bad move in letting the world know she had an attorney because she needs to step back.

And referring to her detachment -- she could easily have been in shock. Shock takes many forms, and people react and cope in many different

ways. So I don`t think I would put too much into the fact that she had no emotion. I would put -- just take it and put it together. But at this

point, I would agree with Kirby. The state would have a very weak case, based on the knowledge and facts as know them. Now, that could change.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: The dichotomy of the public Justin Ross Harris and the private Justin Ross Harris -- we dig deep.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Search and seizure of Cooper`s medical records, as well as a DVD-R and external hard drive from the boy`s father.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Up to six different conversations with different women.

GRACE: Even sending photos of his erect penis as baby Cooper bakes dead in Daddy`s car!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Charged with murder and second degree child cruelty.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CASAREZ: I`m Jean Casarez, in for Nancy Grace.

Now, I know you`re waiting for this. Last week, Nancy showed you a picture. It`s a selfie that the father in this case, Justin, took next to

the urinal, right? Do you remember that photograph? I think we can show it to everybody.

Well, guess what? It`s in a restaurant that it was taken, and the restaurant recognized their bathroom. And the restaurant is -- well,

Michael Christian, I`ll let you finish it off. Where`s the restaurant that that photograph was taken?

CHRISTIAN: It`s in Buckhead, Jean, which is the northern part of the city of Atlanta. This is fascinating because the restaurant, which we

don`t identify in this photo -- some people from the restaurant saw this selfie, this urinal selfie, we call it, on the NANCY GRACE show and all of

a sudden realized, Oh, my God, that`s our restaurant.

Now, they`ve asked not to be identified. That`s certainly fine. But they checked their reservations, and there is only one time that Justin

Ross Harris had a reservation there, and that was on Saturday, February 15th. The reservation was for two people. But the server who handled that

table that night has said that he or she just can`t remember any specifics about either diner at all. So we don`t know if it was him and Leanna. We

don`t know if it was him and another woman, him and a man. We have no idea.

CASAREZ: All right, Ninette Sosa, reporter, you are right there in the heart of Atlanta. Let`s talk about this for a second because February

15th was Saturday night. Valentine`s was Friday. But for a lot of working people, they celebrated it Saturday night.

So Ninette, either he was with his wife and went into the bathroom and took a picture like this to send to someone else, or he wasn`t with his

wife the day after Valentine`s. Do we know anything else?

SOSA: We don`t know anything else. And the Buckhead restaurant is absolutely mortified that this has even come out or that it`s their

restaurant that this did happen. But the gall, the day after Valentine`s Day, to do this -- and I believe, if I recall, some of the other pictures

that were shown had a snippet of another woman standing next to him on some other selfies that he had taken. So that might be worth reviewing again

and see, does that really look like Leanna next to him or maybe not.

CASAREZ: You know, Seth Meyers, you are a psychologist, so you`re the one I have to ask this to. Who would take a picture like that next to a

urinal?

MEYERS: Yes, it just speaks again to more of his bad judgment. You know, this guy seems like he -- my guess is, actually, about his romantic

relationship, that the wife is actually more of the shot caller, that she`s a little more mentally organized. This guy really seems like judgment

after judgment is bad.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CASAREZ: We go to Avon Lake, Ohio. Was a husband attacked first with a taser and then suffocated with plastic food wrap by his own wife over

money?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An industrial size roll of plastic wrap.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Looks like it came out of the kitchen.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Wrapped around a man`s head, cutting off his air supply and killing him.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I touched his leg, it feels cold. It looks like there is blood coming out of his mouth or something.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police concluded it was Jeane Harrington who pulled the plastic over Michael Gabel`s head.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CASAREZ: To Phil Trexler, reporter with the Acron Beacon Journal. Let me ask you this, OK? The wife is saying this was a suicide. My

husband committed suicide. How was the husband, Michael Gabel, found?

TREXLER: He was found laying on a couch inside the house. He had multiple wounds, apparently from a stun gun. He had bruising all over his

body. But most tellingly he had this plastic wrap around his head, and the wife is saying this was a suicide and the cops are saying not so fast.

CASAREZ: So do we know how many times the plastic wrap was wrapped around his head? And where the box of plastic wrap was found?

TREXLER: The box was next to him. It was wrapped continuously around the head. It was difficult for the police to take off and this is another

reason they just think this suicide story just appears to be concocted by the wife.

CASAREZ: The fact is, Clark Goldband, they originally believed that it was a suicide. That`s how it was reported. That`s how it was thought.

They continued to investigate. What more do we know about the injuries to his face and body?

GOLDBAND: Jean, first, let`s go to square one. We`re talking about industrial strength plastic wrap. I have got some of it right here, and

you can see this stuff is pretty thick. There is a huge roll of it we were able to obtain. Similar to this. We`re talking about this plastic wrap.

This was found wrapped all around the head of the victim. And we`re not just talking about a little bit. Authorities say it was the mouth and the

nose as well. Now, authorities also say, Jean, he was apparently stunned at least 20 times by a stun gun. Authorities revealing in a press

conference that perhaps he was stunned first and then wrapped second.

CASAREZ: Clark, how many times was he stunned by the stun gun?

GOLDBAND: Law enforcement says, Jean, at least 20 times. Two zero.

CASAREZ: 20 times? 20 times. Dr. William Morrone, medical examiner, first of all, how common is suicide by plastic wrap?

MORRONE: This is very uncommon. Almost unheard of. Anybody involved in asphyxiation usually uses bags. Pullover bags. It is easier. And how

do you wrap yourself? The hands don`t work that way. Somebody had do this. That is why they were suspicious.

CASAREZ: Well, you know, I can visualize, you know, having someone wrap themselves in plastic wrap. But here is the 911 call. A lot of

people say that his wife, who`s now charged with murder, is very convincing when she says in this 911 call that it is a suicide. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And -- how close did you get to him just now? I mean, does it look like he`s done something to himself?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He has plastic wrap it looks like on his head, and there is a roll laying on the floor.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s rolling on the floor?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, there`s a roll of it on the floor. I`m sorry.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It looks like it came out of the kitchen. And he left a one-line note.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Okay.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So I -- I.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you touched him or anything like that? Does he feel --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I touched his leg. He feels cold.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cold to the touch. OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It looks like there is blood coming out of his mouth or something. He`s facing the back of the sofa so I can`t tell.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When was the last time you saw him alive?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, I was watching TV, and I think he got up to go to the bathroom. Maybe 2:00.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: 2:00 in the morning?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: 2:00 in the morning, yes.

CASAREZ: Hmm, what do you think about that call? Let`s go out to Lisa in Canada. Hi, Lisa.

CALLER: Hi, Lisa. Can I please quickly ask, I know it is unthought of and inhumane to kill your spouse or anyone else let alone. Could it be

that this wife, Jeane, killed her husband Michael because she has life insurance and/or a boyfriend?

CASAREZ: Life insurance. Phil Trexler, what do we know about any life insurance policies?

TREXLER: It`s not exactly clear right now. The police aren`t talking about any possible life insurance policies. They do however paint a

picture of a very tormented marriage where a lot of financial problems, and in fact the suicide or homicide or whatever you want to call it was

committed the day before the house was to be sold to a foreclosure sale.

CASAREZ: Clark Goldband, this is why I see motive for suicide. Not as much motive for murder, possibly. Wasn`t the home supposed to be sold

the very next day in a foreclosure sale because of his gambling debts?

GOLDBAND: 24 hours, Jean. Now, important point you bring up, the gambling debts. According to reports, these two had alleged filed for

divorce back in 2005. One of the reasons cited in the divorce petition was that this gentleman apparently had a gambling debt. Now authorities say

they`re investigating, and based on everything they`ve found, Jean, they don`t see any evidence of a gambling debt.

CASAREZ: The thing is, she admitted many things. She admitted they had been in a fight the night before. An argument. And Clark, we have

some of that on the 911 call, too. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is he located?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s in the den in the back of the house.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Okay. Had he been ailing or?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No. He got a letter from the Internal Revenue Service the other day wanting $17,000. And then the following day he got a

letter from some collection company wanting $16,000. And tomorrow they are supposed to sell our home at sheriff`s auction. So I -- we had had an

argument yesterday.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Okay.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CASAREZ: Kelly Saindon, as a former prosecutor, what do you see as the motive for murder here? Or had she just had enough?

SAINDON: I think it`s both. She went around telling everyone she has disdain for this guy. She can`t stand him. They`re fighting. When you

tase someone 20 times, you are not wishing them well, you`re not hoping that they walk away from that. So the motive for murder would be probably

life insurance, if not the history that we talked about with the previous divorce. Some of her money went for a previous divorce filing, excuse me.

Went to help with previous debt. And if you are married to a spouse, you would be liable for the IRS debt. So killing him if there is an insurance

policy could potentially eradicate that if it was a suicide. That comes into play. Sometimes insurance companies don`t pay on suicide. So there

is a lot of information that has to be collected to actually answer that. She could have been fed up with him. It could be financial and it just

could have been the fight that`s escalated. So it could be a manslaughter versus a homicide.

CASAREZ: Kirby Clements, they have got to have something on her to charge her with murder. Because this investigation took time. This took

time. They said it was a suicide. It was actually undetermined officially. But is it forensically what they have on her or is it this

suicide note, which I understand was typed out. A one-liner of some kind.

CLEMENTS: I would point out to you that there are a lot of problems for the prosecution in this case. No. 1, it took approximately three years

before they arrested her. So whatever it is they found, it wasn`t obvious for three years. That is the first thing. Second he did have a motive for

committing suicide. What`s bad for her is the idea that there are 20 separate stun gun charges or wounds to his body. That`s very problematic.

But I would say in conjunction with the evidence they had, they didn`t arrest her promptly. So it must be something knew that developed. I`m

wondering whether there were fingerprints on the Saran wrap. It`s very hard, if you ever used that stuff, to avoid getting your hands all over it,

so I would suggest that if it had fingerprints, they would have had that at the time.

CASAREZ: And Kirby, it would have to be like third layer in, as you are wrapping around the head, because if it`s on the box or what was left

behind or even next to the air so that you could touch, those could be her fingerprints.

We`ve got more of this 911 call where she is describing -- remember, she`s just found her husband. She says he`s committed suicide. Listen to

what she says now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, officer, I just came home from the store and it looks like my husband is deceased.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is this at?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My address is--

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And your name?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My name is Jean Harrington. I have an 11-year- old child here. Should I take him somewhere?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`ll have somebody come over there right away. How old is your husband?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s 50. He was born in `56.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Okay.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CASAREZ: The mystery surrounding the disappearance of a young pregnant Marine wife Erin Corwin. She heads out to Joshua Tree park and is

never seen again. Now, it just doesn`t make any sense. Tonight, we search for clues.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The search is on for a pregnant wife of a Marine corporal.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Young pregnant Marine wife last seen heading out in her Toyota Corolla.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We know she`s out there. It`s just a matter of us trying to figure out exactly where.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It just doesn`t seem real. I`m cooking in her kitchen and she`s not there.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: As of tonight, still no sign of the pregnant mom. What has become of Erin?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CASAREZ: Everybody is hoping she`s walking around Joshua Tree national park at this very moment to be found. To Dave Mack, syndicated

talk show host. We`re talking about the wife of a U.S. military man. Erin Corwin`s husband is a corporal in the U.S. Marines. Now the San Bernardino

County Sheriff`s Department is putting one of their specialized units on this case, saying there are quote, suspicious circumstances. What do we

know at this point?

MACK: What we know is if she was headed to Joshua Tree, her car was found only two miles from her house, and yet eight miles away from the

entrance to Joshua Tree. Already there is suspicion right away as to how did she get there if her car was only 2 miles from her house.

CASAREZ: Justin Freiman, let`s go back to the beginning. Okay. She leaves her home on Saturday at 7:00 a.m. Bound for where?

FREIMAN: She`s actually bound for this huge national park about the size of Rhode Island. She says she`s going there to scope out some

photographing spots to go there maybe when her mom comes to down. But she`s actually never seen again. And we`re not even sure whether or not

she made it into the park.

CASAREZ: Right. So she leaves at 7 in the morning. She`s going to Joshua Tree national park. When you told me, Justin, that it`s the size of

Rhode Island, I was shocked. It`s huge. We know 29 Palms is where her husband is stationed. It`s east of Los Angeles, close to Palm Springs.

Temperatures are sweltering at this time of year. Dave Mack, it just doesn`t make sense. Why are they positioning the search in Joshua Tree

national park when her car was found close to base?

MACK: They`re actually apparently not releasing all the information they have. But from the interviews they have conducted, they believe

that`s where she went. Now you know there is surveillance footage of people going in and out of the general entryway into the Joshua Tree park.

I don`t know if you`ve ever been there, but they got surveillance cameras everywhere. They are not releasing everything. They`re putting everything

through the San Bernardino County Sheriff`s Department. So we don`t know what was seen, if she was seen going on or not. But you have to assume

they know something, because they are actually searching specific areas in Joshua Tree.

CASAREZ: And you are looking right here at the temperatures. Because this is desert. This is Palm Springs, California. Joshua Tree. 29 Palms.

This is the hottest time of the year in this desert area. No question about it. Justin Freiman, the concern is all these cameras from the base

to the park. We don`t know what the cameras showed at all? If she was by herself or if she was with someone else?

FREIMAN: Police are being very tight lipped about this, so we are not sure. But they must have seen something, Jean, because they are continuing

to search this park and have narrowed it down to about a 200 mile area. And that sounds huge, but again, this park is the size of Rhode Island, so

200 miles, not so big.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Erin Corwin heads to Joshua Tree national park to plan a family outing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police did find Erin`s car in 29 Palms. It`s a military base where her husband is stationed.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We were going to go to Sea World and the San Diego zoo. How excited she was about that trip.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We know that she is out there.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Temperatures are rising to over 100 degrees.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CASAREZ: This young wife of a corporal in the United States Marines is three months pregnant. Her birthday is tomorrow. And her mother was

coming up to celebrate right there in the area. They were going to go to San Diego, they were going to go to the zoo. Dr. William Morrone, forensic

pathologist joining us today. With temperatures that high, someone can sustain without food, I understand. But what about without water?

MORRONE: Water is really what kills you in the end. You can only last five or six days without water. And you need to support blood

pressure. You need to cool. You need water to perspire. And that is how you deal with the heat. Without the water she`s not going to make a week

in that park at those temperatures.

CASAREZ: Dave Mack, what about her purse, her personal belongings? What she had on when she was last seen?

MACK: Oddly enough, when her husband made the phone call at 8:30 the next morning when she didn`t come home, he told the sheriff`s department

about her not coming home and where she was headed. But he gave no description of what she was wearing. And again, we go back to the car, and

the police are being very tight lipped about what they`ve seen and what they`ve found. We only know limited details about who recovered the car,

who found it first, and the only reason he reported it -- he worked for a utility company -- was because it had been in the news a couple of days at

that point.

CASAREZ: Justin, everybody is asking this, so I have to ask you. Why haven`t we heard from her husband?

FREIMAN: He`s been told not to speak, but we are being told he`s being very cooperative with authorities. And again, Jean, no one`s been

charged or named as a suspect.

CASAREZ: Right. And this is a missing persons investigation, but Dr. Morrone, they have brought in the homicide squad. So this is a dual

investigation. Let`s not fool ourselves here. What would you be looking for as an investigator that would aid you in all of this? The car, her

abandoned car would have to be a plethora of forensic information for you. Hopefully.

MORRONE: What they are looking for are signs of violence, signs of trauma and signs of restriction and transfer evidence. Tapes, ropes,

frayed or torn clothes, things that would suggest she may not have cooperated in this and there are signs of foul play.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Officials are calling the disappearance suspicious and are searching the area where the car was found and Joshua

Tree park.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No sign of a pregnant mom. What has become of Erin?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is unbelievable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CASAREZ: Erin`s birthday is tomorrow. She will be 20 years old. She has been married only for a couple of years. Three months pregnant.

There, she and her husband. Her husband was stationed in Japan. She was with her family in Alabama, but they were reunited last fall at 29 Palms

because there is a huge U.S. military base there for the Marines.

Seth Meyers, as a clinical psychologist, she had everything to live for. She was going to have a baby, her mother was coming to visit her.

They were going to do fun things. In fact, the reason she went to Joshua Tree national park that morning was to seek out, according to family, must

be from her husband, I would think, places she and her mother could go.

MEYERS: Yes, absolutely. It`s really hard to imagine a situation more upsetting than this. This sounds like a young woman who had a decent

if not good relationship with her mother, was married to somebody who spent his life doing something very worthwhile. They have all the hope in the

world, looking forward to a new baby. I think the main takeaway is young women out there, be careful. And perhaps don`t go to parks that have large

deserted areas alone.

CASAREZ: Yes. Really, really good point. Darryl Cohen, what is your take on this?

COHEN: That it`s interesting, it`s scary and it`s mysterious. And I couldn`t agree more. Young women should never be out or women of any age

should never be out in places where they are not with at least one or two other people. It is just too dangerous in the days and times in which we

live.

CASAREZ: Kelly Saindon, law enforcement is not really showing their hand here. They know so much more than what they`re saying, because there

is surveillance video footage. They are not saying what`s on that. We don`t even know what she was wearing the last time she was seen. And

obviously they have looked at or searched clothing that is in her home and her husband could by deduction say what is not in the home. Is it valuable

to let the public know more at this point?

SAINDON: The problem is you have nailed it. They are keeping it very close to their chest for a reason. I suspect foul play is involved. And

that is why. They don`t want to taint any possible successful prosecution.

CASAREZ: All right. Tonight, we stop to remember American hero, Marine Lance Corporal Ivan Wilson, 22 years old, from Clear Lake,

California. He was awarded the National Defense Service Medal and the Combat Action Ribbon. He loved reading science fiction novels and dreamed

of being a warrior or even in the medical field. He leaves behind his parents, Christopher and Denise. His sister Jackie. Ivan Wilson, a true

American hero.

Now, before we go tonight, I want to show you. This is a brand new photo of Nancy`s twins, John David and Lucy. They are spending time with

their grandfather at the beach, and the twins find more hidden pirate treasure at the beach. Look at them. They`re growing up so quickly. For

more pictures, you can go to hlntv.com/nancy grace. And a special happy birthday to a friend of the Nancy Grace show, Kylie Barnes, happy birthday.

Dr. Drew is coming up next.

END