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Nancy Grace
No Death Penalty for Hot Car Dad; Arrest Warrant Issued for Hannah Graham Suspect
Aired September 24, 2014 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Grainy surveillance video emerging after a teen co-ed vanishes into thin air. Tonight, after combing
through hours of tape, a mystery man spotted following along with co-ed Hannah. He refuses to speak with police, and still no sign of the missing
co-ed. Cops swoop in for a second search warrant.
Bombshell tonight. In the late night hours, police issue an arrest warrant for the mystery man -- charges, kidnap with intent to defile.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It has been 11 days since University of Virginia sophomore Hannah Graham was last seen.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We obtained an arrest warrant for Jesse Leroy Matthew, Jr., charging him with a class two felony of abduction with the
intent to defile.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The only question is, where is Jesse Matthew?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, from throwing punches to throwing helmets, NASCAR superstar Tony Stewart has a reputation for rage -- threats to run
competitors off the track, claims he shoves drivers in anger, even throwing his helmet at a car. Well, it all blows wide open when Stewart kills
fellow driver Kevin Ward, Jr., on the racetrack in front of thousands, all caught on YouTube.
A secret grand jury meets on whether the NASCAR champ will be indicted with homicide. As we go to air, we learn the secret grand jury clears the
NASCAR champ of all charges.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tragedy on the racetrack (INAUDIBLE) race car driver Kevin Ward, Jr., killed after he steps out of his car and onto the
track, hit by one of the sport`s greatest drivers, Tony Stewart, three-time NASCAR champion.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And to Orlando. Mommy rushes baby to the hospital, a visit in a long string of hospital trips. But little did Mommy know the Florida
Children`s Hospital outfitted with monitoring equipment in the room. It catches Mommy making moves to suffocate baby. In the last hours, Mommy
busted, caught on tape confessing to smothering baby so she, Mommy, could get attention. We have the video.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An 18-year-old mother has been arrested for attempting to kill her 3-month-old baby.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Appeared to be a happy baby with a doting teenage mother.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It may be Munchausen by proxy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) baby.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It may be postpartum depression.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening, I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you to being with us.
Bombshell tonight. Grainy surveillance video emerges of a teen co-ed who vanishes into thin air. After combing through thousands of hours of
tape, a mystery man spotted with co-ed Hannah, who refuses to speak to police. Cops swoop in on a second search warrant, and in the late night
hours, police issue a warrant for the mystery man`s arrest -- charges, kidnap with intent to defile.
But first, let`s go straight out to Michael Christian and Ninette Sosa. We learned that Daddy will not face the death penalty after claims
he murders his child, his baby boy, Cooper, baking in a hot car while he sexts six different women, including sending photos of his erect penis, all
the while, his baby clawing at his face in the car, banging his head back and forth to escape the baking oven that is Cooper`s daddy`s car.
Straight out to Ninette Sosa, News Radio 106.7. The breaking news is that the dad, Justin Ross Harris, will not face the death penalty. Why?
NINETTE SOSA, NEWS RADIO 106.7 (via telephone): He`s not. And the district attorney, Vic Reynolds, says he will not elaborate about that at
this point in the case. And one more thing, that they are going to be scheduling this arraignment for October 17th -- they`re saying a little bit
of conflict with the defense attorney. Again, Vic Reynolds has decided not to seek the death penalty against Justin Ross Harris, which he says he will
not elaborate about the why.
GRACE: Breaking news tonight, everyone. After the elected district attorney charges the father, Justin Ross Harris, with intentionally leaving
the child in the car to bake dead, temperatures soaring over 100 degrees -- the baby`s face covered in scratches where he scratched himself in agony,
abrasions on the back of his head where he bangs back and forth to escape the seatbelt, all the while, Daddy inside sexting six different women,
including someone reportedly underage, even sending photos of his erect penis as his child dies in the car.
Now, this is what I don`t understand, Michael Christian. If you believe enough, if you believe it enough to indict it and give it to a
grand jury, that the father, who had gone on Internet searches about living a single life, living a life without children and how long it takes for a
child to die in a hot car -- if you believe that to the point that you will have a grand jury indict it on charges of murder one, there`s a disconnect.
If you think somebody would do that to a baby, why not the death penalty? I mean, why do we even have the death penalty?
MICHAEL CHRISTIAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER (via telephone): Nancy, all I can tell you is that in the press release announcing this decision, Vic
Reynolds says that it was made after reviewing Georgia`s death penalty statute and considering other factors. Those factors are not elaborated.
That means if Justin Ross Harris is convicted of malice murder, he would face life in prison, but obviously not the death penalty.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Joining me, Monica Lindstrom out of Phoenix, Peter Odom out of Atlanta.
Peter, we`ve all worked on death penalty cases. And in this particular case, where baby Cooper died, baked to death in a hot car, the
case was indicted with special circumstances or aggravating circumstances, which would lead a legal eagle to believe that the death penalty would be
sought.
But tonight, the district attorney, Vic Reynolds, does a 180, changes course, decides it`s not worth the death penalty. What is your thinking,
Peter?
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, it`s not a 180. He was keeping his options open by indicting it with special circumstances so that he
could sit back and make the decision in a more deliberate way.
Now, I believe that the decision not to seek the death penalty was probably arrived at after consultation with the victim`s family. I mean,
you know, the death penalty, Nancy, as much as some people demand it in certain cases, it takes so many years to get the case to trial, there would
probably be a change of venue, it would drag on...
GRACE: Put him up!
ODOM: ... for 12 to...
GRACE: Put him up!
ODOM: It would drag on for 12 to 15 years...
GRACE: Put him up!
ODOM: ... and that`s not necessarily a satisfying result for families.
GRACE: So you basically say ixnay on the death penalty because it just takes too long, right?
ODOM: Nancy, I didn`t ixnay the death penalty. I`m telling you what I think...
GRACE: I`m telling you -- well, you just said that!
ODOM: I`m telling you what I think the district attorney`s decision was, what went into the decision.
GRACE: Too expensive, takes too long. All right, Monica Lindstrom, I see you shaking your head yes. Weigh in.
MONICA LINDSTROM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I think Peter got it right. The prosecutor was looking at all the evidence and the investigation, which
should be now complete. When the indictment came down, maybe there was information there that wasn`t complete yet. So now that he`s got the whole
story, he looked at the statute, he did what he was supposed to do, and he made the call not to go after the death penalty. I`m not the prosecutor in
charge and have to prove this case beyond a reasonable doubt. So he made an informed decision.
GRACE: OK, Michael Christian, let me get you to look up all the aggravating factors in that jurisdiction that could be used. Of course,
there is if you shoot a police officer, if you commit mass murder, if there`s a particularly heinous mode of death, like a torture death. There
are several aggravating circumstances in this jurisdiction under which you seek the death penalty.
And my contention is that if you believe in a case so much that you believe in aggravating circumstances, you believe that the father did this
to the child -- I would never take a case to a jury, ever, not even once that I didn`t believe in, that I did not believe that I was right, that the
police were right, I had the right person, and what I told the jury was what I believed happened, nor did I present something to a grand jury that
I didn`t believe in.
So if you want to put it up to a grand jury that this is what happened and then you back off of that, I don`t get that. To Ninette Sosa. Do you
recall what the aggravating circumstance was in the original indictment?
SOSA: In the original indictment for aggravating, it was involving -- I went back to the teen or the sexting allegations because, overall, there
were eight charges. I know that much. But I think there was more than just child neglect, et cetera. And at that time, the DA also backed down
on a first-degree to a second-degree count way at the beginning. So this is, like, the second time that he`s backed off a little bit.
GRACE: So what was the aggravating circumstance?
SOSA: Say that again?
GRACE: What was the aggravating circumstance that was used in the original indictment? Michael Christian, do you have that?
CHRISTIAN: Nancy, I believe it was that the murder was especially heinous, atrocious, cruel or depraved or involves torture.
GRACE: OK. So that was what was presented by the elected district attorney, Vic Reynolds, to the grand jury. He believed it enough to tell
it to a grand jury and to convince a grand jury that this was especially depraved. But when it gets time to try the case and take it to a jury, in
the last hours, we learn the district attorney is backing off, will not seek the death penalty on Cooper`s father, Justin Ross Harris. That`s the
latest.
Now, switching gears, in a late night announcement, we learn formal charges have come down in the case of the missing co-ed, Hannah Graham.
Straight out to Jean Casarez. Jean, what can you tell me?
JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it`s a felony. It`s a second degree felony. It is abduction with intent to defile. What is that?
Well, as you just said, Nancy, in the beginning of the show, it`s kidnapping. And they believe that Jesse Matthew abducted Hannah Graham
with the intent to defile. What is that? Well, that is an intent to commit immoral acts. And the statute in Virginia goes into many, many
different things, but it is a sex crime with the intent to do immoral things with her.
GRACE: Everyone, in a late night announcement, we find out that formal charges have come down, and the hunt for the mystery man last seen
with the missing co-ed is on. Take a listen to what police say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This afternoon, we reached that point where the commonwealth felt we had sufficient probable cause to seek an arrest
warrant. So we appeared before a magistrate -- Detective Sergeant Mooney (ph) did -- late this afternoon, very late this afternoon, and obtained an
arrest warrant for Jesse Leroy Matthew, Jr., of Charlottesville, charging him with a class two felony of abduction with the intent to defile.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re here tonight to announce that because of the collaborative efforts of the Federal Bureau of Investigation and state and
local law enforcement across this nation, Jesse Matthew is in custody in Galveston, Texas. Now, we won`t go into the circumstances that led to that
custody taking place. But by the grace of God and the good work of the Galveston sheriff`s office, it took place.
And so the extradition process is currently under way. And once that comes to a completion, we`ll have some additional information to share with
you. So we don`t at present have any information as to what might have prompted Mr. Matthew to head to that part of the country. Certainly,
that`s something that we`ll consider as we go through our investigative process. That might take several days.
But much like last night, because we`re not at liberty to say but only so much, we don`t -- we`re not going to be taking your questions tonight,
but we wanted to share the information.
I know many of you had heard this almost instantaneously. It started to hit Twitter and other media sources, and we certainly got your questions
over the last hour. Apologize for not being prompt in answering them. We wanted to -- to have some information back and forth shared between us and
the FBI and certainly to give Adam (ph) (INAUDIBLE) the opportunity to let you hear this from us.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: New charges have been announced against the man police say was the last person seen with her.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Abduction with intent to defile, a class two felony.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The commonwealth felt we had sufficient probable cause to seek an arrest warrant.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The mission to find Hannah is never lost.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We absolutely are continuing our search for Hannah, even as we speak.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight back out to Jean Casarez, CNN correspondent. In a late night announcement, police state that they have formally charged the
so-called mystery man last seen with the vanished co-ed, Hannah Graham.
OK, Jean Casarez, bring us up to date.
CASAREZ: Well, that charge just came about last night. It is a felony, and the police chief has said that now there are even more local,
state and federal authorities that are trying to find this man. We don`t know where he is. We don`t know that -- he has not been booked into the
jail, as far as we know, so the manhunt is still on to find him.
But here`s brand-new, just got an attorney. At least, his attorney has come forward. I just spoke with him minutes ago. His name is James
Camblos (ph), and he is the attorney for Jesse Matthew. He became the attorney on Saturday when Jesse walked into the jail.
He would have no other comment about the case. So I asked him, Well, how long have you been practicing law? Well, 1976 is when he started.
Nancy, he was the elected district attorney of this jurisdiction, the commonwealth.
GRACE: Everyone, with me, Jean Casarez. We are taking your calls. We learn that formal charges have come down against a so-called mystery
man. Let`s see the video surveillance tape that actually snagged the guy on camera. Now, take a look. You`re going to see -- there he goes. His
name, Jesse "LJ" Matthews, Jr., age 32. He is a nursing assistant in the OR, the operating room. He wheels people in. While you`re on a gurney, he
wheels you into the operating room. He`s the last face you see before you go under -- - Jesse "LJ" Matthews, Jr., 6-2, 270 pounds, black hair, brown
eyes, last person known to be with the missing co-ed.
Jean Casarez, why did the charge come down now? Police kept saying -- Police Chief Longo kept telling me that they want to talk to him, talk to
him, talk to him. They get a second search warrant on the home, his home, his apartment. Boom, indictment comes down. The charges come down. Does
it have something to do with what they found, something forensic?
CASAREZ: Well, let me tell you from my own reporting, because we went to the forensics lab yesterday in Richmond and we actually spoke with the
head of this operation -- he would not comment on this case, but he did say that they are continuing to test the items that the police department has
given to them. And it did not appear that they had given any results yet to the police department.
But here`s what I know. The police department has been asking anyone that saw them in the Tempo restaurant to come forward, or walking out of
the restaurant. And you know what abduction is. Abduction is by force or intimidation or by false promises to someone. And so witnesses possibly
have been coming forward in regard to the demeanor or conversations they overheard.
GRACE: Clark Goldband?
CLARK GOLDBAND, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Nancy, we`ve asked that same question this afternoon to law enforcement. They`ve told us that forensic
results, in addition to everything else relating to the investigation, contributed to this arrest warrant. So Nancy, I can tell you that
according to police in Charlottesville, forensic results played a part of this warrant.
GRACE: With me, Jean Casarez, CNN correspondent, Talya Cunningham, WCHV. Let`s figure it out, ladies. We know that as of yesterday, Police
Chief Longo was telling us, We just want to talk to him, we want to find out what happened. Boom, all of a sudden, formal charges of kidnap with
intent to defile.
Jean, you and I both know they`ll tell us it will take three days, three weeks, so long to get DNA results back. But they come back out of
that apartment and out of that car, and charges go down. What do you believe they found in the car, possibly something that belongs to Hannah?
CASAREZ: I can tell you exactly what they`re looking for. They are looking for Hannah`s DNA. The testing that they do at the lab for the
state of Virginia is the forensic DNA testing. They look to see if there`s a stain. They do then a biological test on it to try to determine the DNA,
just as we talked about before. And then they try to make a match. And I also can confirm that Hannah`s parents gave that lab her DNA.
GRACE: You know, that`s very interesting. Talya Cunningham, WCHV, Jean`s confirming that Hannah`s parents did give her DNA to the lab. OK,
number one, that graphic, the car impounded -- that`s the car that he was driving the night he met Hannah Graham. The other car, the blue Nissan,
that is his sister`s car. We think he`s in it.
Talya Cunningham, what do you know? What do you think led to these charges? Did they find her DNA in the car or his apartment? Did they find
her clothing? Did they find an object that belongs to her, her driver`s license, her pocketbook, something like that?
TALYA CUNNINGHAM, WCHV (via telephone): Well, Nancy, the charges came so quickly after police were being extremely tight-lipped at this point
because they`re preparing for a trial. So getting information specifically has been very difficult here in Charlottesville with the police.
Now, what I can tell you, in my opinion, is that they did find some kind of her DNA in the vehicle or in his home. They already had probable
cause to search his residency and his possessions. So in my opinion, I think they have found something connecting Hannah directly to Matthew.
GRACE: You know what, Talya Cunningham? I think you`re right.
Jean Casarez, maybe -- as my judge who was 84 years old on the bench used to tell the jury, let`s make all witnesses speak the truth. Maybe the
crime lab is telling us the truth, they don`t have results yet. Maybe Talya`s informant is telling the truth, they found something connecting
Hannah in the car or the apartment. Maybe it`s not DNA. Maybe it`s her driver`s license.
Look at her in the video. She`s not carrying a pocketbook, but somewhere in those pants or that top, she probably had a cell phone. She
probably had a driver`s license. Recall she was turned away from one place because she`s just a teen and couldn`t get in. Somewhere on her person is
something to identify her, a credit card, a driver`s license, her cell phone. Maybe that`s what was found, Jean, not necessarily DNA but
something connecting her to that car, that apartment.
CASAREZ: Right. Remember, though, this is a sex crime, abduction with the intent to defile, the intent to do an immoral sexual act with her.
And so you can couple forensics with also witness testimony.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: A late night announcement that charges have come down on the so-called mystery man, the nursing assistant, 32 years old, 6-2, 270-pound
nursing assistant last seen slipping his arm around the missing co-ed, Hannah Graham.
Straight out to Marc Klaas, president and founder, Klaas Kids Foundation. Marc, weigh in.
MARC KLAAS, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: Well, there`s a couple of things, Nancy. First of all, this warrant is a game-changer. It raises the stakes
considerably and it also changes the priorities. Instead of needing to look for Hannah, they now have to look for Hannah and they have to find the
individual who has been accused of committing this crime against her. I think the way to do that is to give the federal authorities -- put the
federal authorities, the U.S. marshals and the FBI in charge of the investigation to find her, and the Charlottesville police should continue
doing the very good job that they have been doing with the Blue Ridge mountain search and rescue to organize and continue searching for Hannah.
Obviously the components are different. They`re both high priorities, but we can`t lose sight of the fact that this girl is still missing and
needs to be brought home.
GRACE: Marc Klaas, very well put. Joining me in addition to Marc Klaas, Jean Casarez, Talya Cunningham, John Garaffulo (ph), director of law
enforcement training at ESVIA. John, thank you for being with us. How do we catch him? I earlier said indictment. These are police charges. John,
how do we catch him?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, he`s going to get caught in my opinion in the next few days either with a credit card or he`s distinctive looking, so
I believe someone will spot him. Obviously it`s all over the press. I believe her DNA was found in his apartment or car, possibly a hair sample.
She has long hair. So the parents, I`m assuming, gave them a sample of hair and other DNA samples. That`s what I believe led to the arrest
warrant. He`s got to make one mistake. As soon as he makes one mistake, we`ll catch him, Nancy.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Tonight from throwing punches to throwing helmets. Nascar superstar Tony Stewart has a reputation for rage. Threats to run
competitors off the track. Well, it all blows wide open when Stewart kills fellow driver, Kevin Ward Jr., on the racetrack in front of thousands.
Tonight we learn the secret grand jury meeting to determine whether to charge him with homicide clears the NASCAR champ, Tony Stewart, of all
charges.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Famed NASCAR driver Tony Stewart was competing in a dirt track race with fellow driver Kevin Ward Jr., who got cut off by
Stewart, forcing him into the wall and spun out. It was then that Stewart`s car struck and killed Ward Jr.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: You are seeing video from Youtube. Everyone, the entire incident was caught on video, published on Youtube. There you see what was
happening. It all started when Kevin Ward Jr.`s car went to the side. You saw it there. He gets out of the track, he comes out. You can look at
him. He`s angry. He`s pointing at Tony Stewart, he`s calling him out for what happened. Boom, he approaches Tony Stewart`s car on a racetrack in
the middle of a dirt race. Kevin Ward Jr. dies when he gets hit by Stewart`s race car. Straight out to Brad Gillie, host of Sirius XM NASCAR
radio. Brad, the grand jury has completely cleared NASCAR champ Tony Stewart. Why?
BRAD GILLIE: Well, you know, the district attorney took all of the evidence, took all of the witnesses, submitted all of that to the grand
jury, and of course they got to have witnesses and got to see all of the evidence, but ultimately what Michael Tantillo said was they had two
enhanced videos, two videos they had enhanced. The one that we`ve all seen on Youtube, and apparently the second video was the racetrack`s video.
According to him, in that video, Tony Stewart`s car didn`t demonstrate anything unusual with the direction it was going. It didn`t change
direction until the unfortunate contact with Kevin Ward Jr., so they took that and the toxicology into account as well in which Kevin Ward supposedly
had marijuana in his system.
GRACE: What?
GILLIE: And it could impair his judgment.
GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I didn`t hear anybody enjoyed a doobie before they got out there and went on a high-speed racetrack. With
me, Brad Gillie, host on Sirius XM NASCAR radio. For those of you just joining us, the whole thing was caught on video and then posted on Youtube.
Here`s the video from Youtube. Now there you see Kevin Ward Jr., age 20, sprint car driver, off the track. He runs into the side. He`s calling out
Stewart. He`s going after him. He`s mad. Who wouldn`t be -- why is he on the racetrack on foot? Bam. Stewart runs him down, he hits him.
Now we are hearing from Brad Gillie, Sirius XM NASCAR radio, that enhanced video shows a different angle and shows more. So, Brad Gillie,
what do you think the enhanced video showed then? The grand jury, everyone, has just cleared the NASCAR champ, Tony Stewart.
GILLIE: Again, the video that we see -- what we don`t see in that video is what Tony`s car is doing leading up to the impact. And if they
have got a second video that shows exactly what his car was doing, the direction his car was going, more importantly. And like the district
attorney said, Tony`s car didn`t deviate from that direction before the impact. It`s not like he saw Kevin Ward Jr. running down the racetrack and
then he pointed his car toward him. According to the district attorney, that did not happen. So if they have more video of Tony`s car leading up
to the accident, obviously that played into the evidence, and the district attorney also talked about the fact how Ward got out of his car, ran two-
thirds of the way down the racetrack on a hot racetrack, and, you know, so many other unfortunate and preventable factors involved in just this
horrible accident.
GRACE: Well, what you just said, Brad Gillie, I`m a NASCAR fan but what you just said -- let me go to Jeff Bodine, former NASCAR driver,
Daytona 500 champion. Jeff, again, thank you for being with us.
Although we`re all fans of NASCAR, we don`t know the ins and outs like you and Gillie do. What I understand he`s just saying is this enhanced
video shows that Stewart was going round and round and round and he did not deviate from his path. When Kevin Ward Jr., age 20, comes out there,
Stewart was on his regular path. The enhanced video shown to a grand jury does not show him veering off, intentionally trying to hit Ward. That
makes sense to me. What do you know, Jeff?
JEFF BODINE, FORMER NASCAR CHAMPION: Well, Nancy, that`s what we`ve been saying, I`ve been saying all along. Tony`s car from that first video
didn`t appear to swerve at Kevin or anything such like that. He was going around the track, he didn`t know what Tony was looking at, at the time
Kevin ran down the track. We did see Kevin run down towards the car. You know, was that because he was mad or because he had some -- something in
his body to make him more angry?
I`ve never done any drugs or smoked any marijuana, so I don`t know what it does to you, but obviously it wasn`t the right thing for him to do.
You know, all the evidence, we`re very confident all the evidence is going to come out. We were hoping to have another video that showed that Tony`s
car didn`t swerve towards Kevin. And we were hoping that there were eyewitnesses, other drivers behind on the track with Tony and track workers
that were right there would also say, you know, testify that Tony`s car didn`t swerve. So we`re very sad with the results, of course, of what
happened, but we`re very happy that Tony now will hopefully be able to live with what`s happened and enjoy the rest of his life and racing career and
we can go on and continue that with no problem.
GRACE: With me is Jeff Bodine, former NASCAR driver, Daytona 500 champion. Also with me Brad Gillie, host on Sirius XM NASCAR radio.
Gentlemen, when I first saw the Youtube video, it didn`t look good to me. I thought Tony Stewart was going to be indicted. When I had you guys
on and you`re trying to explain it to me, I still couldn`t get past that video, because to me it looks like he runs him down on purpose. But what
the grand jury saw is something entirely different, from a different angle. And I think a couple of enhancement videos that shows, as Gillie and Bodine
are explaining, Stewart never veered off his track, his course around the racetrack.
Caryn Stark, I get what Bodine and Gillie are telling me, and it makes sense and I understand. If they`re right, I agree with the grand jury not
indicting. I`ll tell you somebody who doesn`t agree, and that is Ward Jr.`s family. They are still upset about the history, the reputation for
violence they claim Stewart has. I just don`t know if they will ever be able to accept this decision, Caryn.
STARK: I doubt it, Nancy, because it`s a natural inclination when someone dies to look for blame. And in this case, it`s not a death that
was natural. It came because he was walking on the track. And so they are going to look to blame someone.
GRACE: I think that`s natural, Caryn. I think you`re right. And you put it so much better than me. But I think they`re going to have a tough
time dealing with this grand jury decision, even though many of us believe it is right. Gillie and Bodine convinced me about it.
Everyone, on a different note, all of you legal eagles out there, you court watchers, can you guess who this is? Here`s a hint. Once a
flamboyant music legend, now serving time for murder. Answer, on Twitter at the end of the show. Check it out, people, who`s that?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: And now to Orlando. Mommy rushes baby to the hospital, one in a long string of hospital visits. But little does mommy know the Florida
Children`s Hospital is outfitted with monitoring equipment in the room. It catches mommy making moves to suffocate baby. In the last hours, mommy
busted, caught on tape, talking about attempts to smother baby to get attention.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You were holding the baby --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was holding her too closely.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The baby can`t breeze with her nose up against your body, right? Not against your breast, against your body.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight out to Meredith Incillo (ph), investigative reporter in Florida. Meredith, how did it come about that mommy is busted on tape,
making moves to suffocate baby?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, what happens is, the baby, when -- in that hospital room where she was being monitored, her, she went into distress.
And that distress signal set off the video monitoring equipment. Not once, but twice. And after that happened, staff said, something`s just not right
here. So they went back and reviewed the tape, and that`s when they found what appeared to be the mother with her hands on the baby, in the crib.
And that was the first time that team had to respond to revive the baby and save its life.
GRACE: To Dr. Bill Manion, medical examiner and criminal pathologist. Dr. Manion, in order to suffocate a baby, it`s actually a very simple thing
to do. Explain.
MANION: Well, that`s correct. It doesn`t take much effort or force to suffocate a baby. And in fact, it may be very difficult to detect at
autopsy.
GRACE: Take a look. Mommy caught on camera. Take a listen to what she says.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So you need to tell me the truth. What happened? Be up front with me, because, listen, I don`t need to talk to
you. I don`t need to talk to you, honey. I don`t. I`m trying to give you your side of the story. Do you understand what I`m saying? I`m trying to
give you a chance to give your side of the story and tell me what`s going on. If you`ve got something going up here that`s not right, if you`ve got
something going on at home that`s not right, that`s making you do stuff, that you don`t have control over, be up-front with me right now. Because I
have other things that`s going on. Do you understand what I`m saying? I have everything showing me something different. And without your side of
the story, I don`t -- I`m just going off of my evidence. And I`m not going to get your side of the story. And I`m going to tell you, it doesn`t look
good, until you tell me what`s going on. Do you understand what I`m saying? So be honest with me. Talk to me, tell me the truth.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was just -- he starts to have --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I can`t hear you. You have your hand over your mouth.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was just really stressed out and I wasn`t thinking. I wasn`t trying to hurt her.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Okay.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I mean, because she was in the hospital she could get the care she need.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Okay. So you didn`t -- what did you do?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was just stressed out. I was trying to relieve the problem. But I knew that wasn`t going to work so I --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Okay. So you, relieve the problem. So you`re trying to relieve the stress from you? Okay. And what did you do?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I guess I was holding her too close. So I started to get -- but I couldn`t, so I held her too close, so she couldn`t
breathe.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Were you stressed out then? Were you trying to relieve your stress then?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I wasn`t -- I wasn`t taking my meds back then. I was -- I was only on my meds for a couple of weeks, so that`s why they
put me back on my meds, so I could control my stress.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you think it`s working now?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The nurses came in, you got a lot of attention that way, right?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Okay. So at what point -- let me see your nails, by the way. You don`t have any nails. Did you use a spoon to put down her
throat?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, I bit my nails for the past couple of weeks.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So it`s definitely your nails that caused -- now, let me ask you this, what caused --
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was just really stressed.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So you were pissed off about your life and the baby was the only one there to relieve your stress. The second time, the
baby had --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Monica Lindstrom, Peter Odom, also with me, Caryn Stark. Peter Odom, the only one there to relieve her stress was
the baby, and she says, yes?
ODOM: The defense here is clearly headed towards a mental defense. She`s talking about her medications, talking about being under stress.
She`s going to go with something like a Munchausen symptom by proxy. No question about it.
GRACE: Caryn Stark, Peter Odom basically just repeated my question to him. How can you blame the baby and basically say, she was the only one I
could take my stress out on, and say, yes. She says yes.
STARK: And Nancy, let`s be real. That makes no sense. She is not in her right mind. This is Munchausen by proxy. And the thing that`s so
disturbing about this particular diagnosis is that we never expect a mother to be this non-maternal, to try and kill their own child or to do the kinds
of things --
GRACE: You know what, Caryn, you are so right. And Peter Odom, you being a father of a boy and a girl, I`m stunned you would even say that.
But you know what, I know it`s your job.
ODOM: That it`s headed for a mental defense? That`s a fact.
GRACE: No, that she`s taking out her stress on an infant child.
ODOM: I didn`t say that, she said that. What I`m saying is where the defense is headed. I`m giving you what any lawyer would tell you, Nancy.
(CROSSTALK)
ODOM: Of course it`s not OK.
GRACE: Okay, you know what, you said tomato, I say tomato. We`ll see what happens.
Let`s just stop and remember American hero, Army Corporal, Conor Masterson. 21, Leedbury (ph), Minnesota. Loved music and a good joke.
Wanted a career in medicine. Parents Mark and Sandy, five brothers, one sister, widow, Lorena. Conor Masterson, American hero.
And tonight, special happy birthday to "Dancing with the Stars" brilliant costume designer, mastermind, Howard Sussman! Happy birthday,
Howard. Drew up next. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp, Eastern. Until then, good night, friend.
END
