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Nancy Grace

Jodi Arias Retrial Begins

Aired October 21, 2014 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JUAN MARTINEZ, PROSECUTOR: This is not a case that...

JENNIFER WILLMOTT, ATTORNEY FOR JODI ARIAS: The million-dollar question is what would have forced her to do it.

JODI ARIAS, CONVICTED MURDERER: The evidence is very compelling.

KIRK NURMI, ATTORNEY FOR JODI ARIAS: Did you kill Travis Alexander?

ARIAS: Yes, I did.

He body slammed me.

MARTINEZ: You`re standing there in your den, right?

ARIAS: Yes. I didn`t mean to shoot him or anything.

He said, "(EXPLETIVE DELETED) kill you, bitch."

I just couldn`t believe what had happened.

He went like that, and he turned his head aside.

MARTINEZ: Were you crying when you were shooting him?

ARIAS: I don`t remember.

MARTINEZ: Were you crying when you were stabbing him?

ARIAS: I don`t remember.

MARTINEZ: How about when you cut his throat, were you crying then?

ARIAS: I don`t know.

MARTINEZ: She knew. She was going to kill him.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NANCY GRACE, HOST: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. Welcome to HLN. I want to thank you for being with us.

We are live camped, outside the Phoenix courthouse as the death penalty retrial of Jodi Arias commences. This has been an extraordinary day in the

courtroom that started with opening statements.

Straight out to Valerie Paraso, KFYI.

Valerie, what a day in the courtroom. Juan Martinez was at his best. I watched him from the beginning, and at the get-go, at the very beginning,

the jurors were lined up looking at him. One juror, a female juror on the end already nodding her head "yes." On the other hand, several jurors

staring and meeting the gaze of Jodi Arias. She had a laser-lock on several of the male jurors in the jury box. What did you observe?

VALERIE PARASO, KFYI: Well, we saw the first thing Juan Martinez did when he started opening statements, he laid out a picture of Travis Alexander

with his throat cut and said, "This is how much Jodi Arias loved Travis Alexander."

GRACE: You know, and he was doing that, Valerie, following up on what Nurmi, the lead defense attorney, said. Now remember, we`ve been all

around with the defense team here, because a couple of weeks ago, Jodi Arias fired her defense team. Well, she rehired them. That`s like putting

the band back together again.

The entire defense team is back with Jodi Arias there. She`s even got her chair screwed down lower than everybody else`s like she had last time so

she will look petite and frail and pitiful there on the end of the row. She`s doing a good job at it.

He was saying that in response to the defense opening statement. Matt Zarrell, I noticed as Kirk Nurmi was giving his defense opening, he kept

referring to the beloved Alexander, beloved Travis Alexander. He said it over and over and over, emphasizing how much she loved Travis Alexander.

MATT ZARRELL: Yes, exactly, Nancy. He went over it ad nauseam. He said this is a tale of infinite sadness. He also said the relationship was one

of lust, spirituality, passion, forbidden sex, abuse, and violence, and it came to a crashing end.

GRACE: You know, the way he kept referring to the beloved Travis Alexander -- this is the defense. And I wanted to just tap him on the shoulder and

go, "Sir, sir, you refer to him as the beloved Travis Alexander. Your client murdered him."

You know, the whole courtroom was riveted when we then saw crime-scene photos.

For those of you just joining us, we are live here at the Phoenix courthouse as the Jodi Arias death penalty retrial commences. In the last

hours right behind me, Martinez takes certain stage in that courtroom as he delivers a riveting opening statement following Kirk Nurmi.

Unleash the lawyers. Joining me Jeff Gold, also in the courtroom with me today. Sue Moss, family law attorney, victims` rights advocate, joining me

out of New York. And Parag (ph) Shaw, defense attorney and author of "The Code."

OK, Sue Moss, in the courtroom Martinez was riveting, and it was amazing to me that the defense kept referring to Travis Alexander as "the beloved."

SUE MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: Absolutely. Her excuse is just too obtuse when you look at facts of this case. This is one of the most bloody,

disgusting crimes we have seen in a long while. We`re talking 27 stab wounds to his body, cutting his throat, then killing him, also shooting him

with a gun. The amount of blood that was at the scene is crazy, and when these jurors see each and every part of that -- that room, that master

bedroom, and how bloody it is, they`re going to come back with the death penalty.

GRACE: Everybody, we are live here at the courthouse and taking your calls. I`ll kick it off with Stephanie. Hi, Stephanie. What`s your

question?

CALLER: Hi, Nancy. I just have to say, I love you. And I just love you`re a great mother of your children.

I cannot understand how come she has so much control and power in the courtroom. I`m not too sure. Is this a normal thing for the defendants?

But it`s -- she`s been found guilty.

GRACE: You know, it`s amazing. She really is controlling the courtroom. All eyes are on Jodi Arias. I`ll tell you this is what I observed. She

has gotten a hair trim. Her hair is about to right here now. It`s down. She swings it around quite often.

In one of the breaks, she was doing stretches, and she turned back toward the audience. And I was standing there looking straight at her. Well,

that wiped the smile off her face. She quit stretching and turned around, and sat down.

But I have noticed her locking gaze with many of the jurors, Stephanie. And it`s amazing. For someone so petite, she really does have a magnetic

presence in that courtroom.

And I`ll tell you another thing, Stephanie, that really struck me. As I was watching Martinez go through evidence that would be admitted in trial,

there was one photo of Travis Alexander lying naked on the bed. This was just before he was murdered. He was lying there, and he looked so

innocent. He was asleep, Stephanie. He was asleep, and it struck me how much he must have trusted Arias to have actually fallen asleep. And this

was just moments before his throat was sliced.

Everybody, we are taking your calls. Unleash the lawyers. Once again, Sue Moss, Jeff Gold, Parag (ph) Shaw. All right, Jeff Gold, you were in the

courtroom with me. What did you observe?

JEFF GOLD, ATTORNEY: Well, first of all, I thought that Juan Martinez was not on his top game. I thought he was disjointed. I don`t think he was

telling a story to a jury that never heard any of this before. I think he was picking and choosing what he did, but he`s got to remember that these

jurors don`t know that whole story.

I thought Kirk Nurmi, on the other hand, fit and trim, was actually in a fighting game. He really made it somber. He tried to tone it down as if

Jodi was very sorrowful about this. And now let`s talk about what mitigates this, because after all, this is a case about should she die, not

whether or not she did it. I thought Nurmi did a good job.

GRACE: Well, you know, I don`t know where you`re coming from, because Parag (ph) Shaw, when you give an opening statement, you give the statement

that is most favorable to your client, i.e. the state. You don`t go through every single fact unless you`ve got a bothersome fact and you want

to explain it to the jury before the other side can pounce upon it. So bottom line, Martinez` opening was great.

You know what, Parag (ph)? You weren`t in the courtroom today. Take a listen to Nurmi. Let`s dip into the courtroom for opening statements.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARTINEZ: This is not a case of whodunit. The person whodunit. The person who "done it," the person who committed this killing, sits in court

today. The defendant, Jodi Ann Arias. And the person that she "done it" to was an individual by the name of Travis Victor Alexander. A former

boyfriend of hers, an individual that she was in love with. An individual that was a good man. An individual that was one of the greatest blessings

in her life.

And this love, well, she rewarded that love for Travis Victor Alexander by sticking a knife in his chest. And, you know, he was a good man, according

to her. And with regard to being a good man, well, she slit his throat as a reward for being a good man. And in terms of these blessings, well, she

knocked the blessings out of him by putting a bullet in his head.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Martinez at the top of his game as he gives an opening statement. For those of you just joining us, we are live here outside the Phoenix

courthouse as the Jodi Arias death penalty retrial commences and taking your calls. To Julie in Arizona.

Hi, Julie. What`s your question?

CALLER: Yes, I was just wondering how the jury is all reacting to this. I mean, know that they haven`t seen this before. I was there the day -- the

very first day, where the boyfriend testified; actually saw you, Nancy, by the way. Love you. Saw you walk into the courtroom, set down and walk

out. So I`m just kind of curious how the jury is reacting to all of this.

GRACE: Well, you know, it`s a very interesting jury. Right at the get-go this morning, we were almost derailed, Julie in Arizona, because one juror

kicked it all off by calling in sick, claiming she had some sort of family emergency. So for a moment there, I thought that we were going to be

delayed yet another day. The judge would have none of it. In this jurisdiction they strike about 17, 18 jurors in case we have long trial, in

case some of them fall out. So that`s exactly what she did. The judge pushed the case forward.

I can tell you everybody on that jury was watching very carefully. And I noticed while Martinez was talking, several of the women jurors were just

looking over. They`d look at Martinez, then look over at Arias and then look back at Martinez.

You know, one thing that I noticed he spent a lot of time on was the key pad. The key pad. He showed a photo of Travis`s home to the jury and that

you get in through -- with a key pad, not a key. And then once you get in, there`s an alarm on the inside of the door. You`re got to know the code to

turn it off.

Out to Matt Zarrell. What is the significance -- that`s the exact photo Martinez just showed the jury, right there that we`re showing you. What is

the significance of the key pad, Matt?

ZARRELL: Well, that Arias went in there -- or she claims Travis knew she was coming. But the state says Travis had no idea she was coming, but she

had access to house and could get inside the house with him being aware that she was coming.

GRACE: Uh-huh. OK. He really was hammering that home.

Everybody, we are here for opening statements in the Jodi Arias death penalty sentencing trial. It has just commenced behind us. Let`s go back

in for more opening statements. Juan Martinez.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MARTINEZ: Victor started to not look so good, because inside the garage is this black Prius, this black Prius that`s Mr. Alexander`s. He`s not

answering the door, the dog is going crazy, and his Prius is in the garage, so they decide to walk in.

They walk in -- and this is a two-story house. They walk in, and to the right is the washing machine and the dryer. And then they take a left, and

to the left is bedroom. To the right is a study. And as they continue on to get to the stairs to go upstairs, Marie Call (ph) notices there is this

strong, pungent foul odor in the air. That Napoleon, he must have really been having real problems here, because this doesn`t smell very good at

all.

And so they walk up the stairs. And when they walk up the stairs, they come to the first door on the landing, on the left, which is Mr.

Alexander`s room. And I say "room" because Mr. Alexander wasn`t living alone. He actually had a number of roommates, and the bedrooms were on the

second floor, and there were other -- two other people that he was renting rooms to.

They opened the door, and when they opened the door, Marie Call (ph) stays behind and the two men go inside. But she`s able to see through the crack

all this blood that`s in the hallway.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: We`re going to take you right back into the courtroom, but another thing that happened in opening statements in the last hours, the defense

kicked it off in this jurisdiction of the death penalty phase. The defense has the first opening statement.

And defense attorney Kirk Nurmi told this jury they would hear from Jodi Arias, but he never committed to whether she would take the stand. Could

they be hearing this instead?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NURMI: Mr. Alexander talks about how he wants to zip tie you to a tree and (EXPLETIVE DELETED), right? Remember that?

ARIAS: Yes. That was a reference to a photo shoot that he wanted to do out in the Woods somewhere. He wanted me to dress up like Little Red

Riding Hood.

He wanted me to find a spot, because he was coming up to Yreka. There is a lot of forest up there, so -- there are trails and things near a park

called Greenhorn. It`s toward the southern end of town, and it goes into the Woods quite a ways. And I figured if we went early in the morning or

late at night, we could find a spot there and we wouldn`t have to worry about any hikers or anybody coming on us, because that would have been

mortifying.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MARTINEZ: I thought you said with the relationship with Mr. Alexander was very stressful.

ARIAS: Some of the sex wasn`t.

MARTINEZ: You say you had memory problems, but it depends on the circumstance right?

ARIAS: Usually when men like you are screaming at me or grilling me.

NURMI: It`s not about Snow White.

MARTINEZ: Anybody involved with this fantastical tale.

ALYCE LAVIOLETTE, DOMESTIC VIOLENCE EXPERT: I couldn`t speak to Snow White. Nor could I speak to the seven dwarves.

MARTINEZ: So you are a lie -- human lie detector, right?

LAVIOLETTE: Gosh, I didn`t think I was saying that.

DONAVAN BERING, FRIEND OF JODI ARIAS (via phone): She`ll call and she may say, "Hey, you know, I really -- I read this really cool post. I`d like to

tweet it."

JUDGE SHERRY STEPHENS, PRESIDED OVER ARIAS MURDER TRIAL: "A person suffers PTSD because of a bear attack while hiking. Would you throw out their PDS

test if they lied and said it was a tiger?"

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, those would be different events.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Attorneys for Jodi want Juror No. 5 out.

STEPHENS: The court has denied the motion for mistrial. Juror No. 5 has been excused.

MARTINEZ: Show me the linebacker pose. That`s what I`m asking for you to do.

ARIAS: He went like that.

NURMI: It`s not even about whether or not you like Jodi Arias. Nine days out of ten, I don`t like Jodi Arias.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: Welcome back to HLN. We are here at the Phoenix courthouse, bringing you the latest live in the Jodi Arias death penalty sentencing

retrial. Opening statements have just kicked off inside the courtroom as Arias sat locking gazes with the jurors.

Straight back to Jen Wood, reporter of "The Trial Diaries," also in court with me today. What did you observe, Jen?

JEN WOOD, REPORTER, "THE TRIAL DIARIES": I observed that the jurors were really engaged with both the prosecution and the defense. There was one

taking notes that was really feverishly writing. Jodi Arias seemed to really stare at each and every one of them as they walked in, just like she

did the first time around. And she would whisper with Willmott as each one would take their seat.

GRACE: Out to the lines. Kimberly in Arizona. Hi, Kimberly, what`s your question?

CALLER: Hi, yes. Really quickly, thank you and welcome back. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) weather. My question is now whether or not it even is an

option -- are they able to go ahead, if they`re not able to reach another verdict, are they able to even retry her again or are they just going to

give her life?

GRACE: Yes. Interesting question. I`ve been asked that a lot. Matt Zarrell, the answer is it`s my understanding she will get life.

ZARRELL: Correct, Nancy. The judge will determine if she gets life with or without parole.

GRACE: So bottom line, if there`s a second mistrial, Kimberly in Arizona, the death penalty is off the table. The only question left is will Arias

get life with parole or life without parole.

We are taking your calls. Straight out to Nancy in Kansas. Hi, Nancy. What`s your question?

CALLER: Hi, Nancy. It`s not really a question. It`s more of a statement. I was abused.

GRACE: OK.

CALLER: And an abused woman does not drive to see someone that abuses her. They stay away as far as they can. It wasn`t like she was living with him

and couldn`t get away. You know, I think that that`s...

GRACE: I was just talking about that just before we took air, Nancy in Kansas. You know, for ten years I was a volunteer at the battered women`s

center in Atlanta. And I talked to so many women that felt they could not get out of an abusive relationship. They had children. They were

financially dependent on the husband. A lot of them didn`t have a car, couldn`t drive. Sometimes the lover would even unhook the phones before he

left during the day, watching her every move. That was not the case in this scenario.

Out to Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst and author of "Deal Breakers," she does not fit into the battered women`s scenario at all.

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: No, Nancy. Clearly she doesn`t, but I think what the defense is trying to say is that she had some early trauma

at the hands of her family and that, because of this, she had this internal simmering rage. The rage got split off into another part of her

personality. She went towards the current abuser, Travis Alexander. They`re claiming he abused her. And that she was in some dissociative fog

when she stabbed him 29 times, shot him in the face, and slit him ear to ear.

But I think what`s most likely is that she was a natural born killer in that she`s a sociopath, a female sociopath. Quite rare. And because of

that, there`s a combination of genetics, biological, constitutional factors. And that because of that, when he tried to break up with her, she

went after him for revenge.

GRACE: Court is raging on, as we heard opening statements. And in opening statements, the defense attorney, Kirk Nurmi, promised the jury they would

hear from Jodi Arias. And I noticed his wording. It wasn`t "Jodi Arias will take the stand and explain to you what happened." It was "You will

hear from Jodi Arias." Will they be hearing this?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARIAS: He wanted me to put Pop Rocks in my mouth while he -- while I gave him oral sex.

NURMI: And did you do that?

ARIAS: Yes.

NURMI: And the Tootsie Pops, what did they turn out to be needed for?

ARIAS: He wanted to put the Tootsie Pop inside of me. I mean, just spend time down there doing that, I guess you could say.

NURMI: What do you mean inside of you?

ARIAS: Inside my vagina.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARIAS: You should have at least done your makeup, Jodi, gosh.

(singing): And I can`t breathe until you`re resting here with me.

It might change my memory. (LAUGHTER)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Is that the Jodi Arias that this jury will see?

We are live camped outside the Phoenix courthouse. The death penalty retrial of Jodi Arias commences with opening statement and the beginning

witnesses for the state.

Kirk Nurmi goes first for the defense. In this jurisdiction that`s SOP in a death penalty sentencing phase. Then Martinez takes the center stage in

the courtroom as Arias looks on just feet away. All of the parties are back -- Kirk Nurmi, Wilmott, Arias herself of course, and of course, Juan

Martinez and his supporting staff. Travis Alexander`s family once again seated on the first two rows; I watched them as crime scene photos were put

up and they looked down, still unable to look at these crime-scene photos.

I was looking through my notes from today. I noticed that Martinez kept talking about -- when police get there, they see that Arias has poured

water over Travis Alexander`s bloody body. Why? The jury was transfixed as he described that she had tried to clean up this horrifically bloody

crime scene with a cup of water.

He went on to show the jury shots of the washing machine full of bloody cloths where she had tried to wash them. There were bloodstains on the top

of the washer -- state marker`s number 1b and 1a -- Travis` blood diluted with wash water covering the top of the washing machine. And there

practically on top of the bloody clothes, a towel practically red was the digital camera. The camera Jodi Arias used to take photos of their wild

sex all afternoon just before she slits his throat. Martinez then goes on to lay out the diagram of the bedroom where Travis Alexander had sex with

her and the adjoining bathroom where he died.

We are here and taking your calls. Straight out to Cheryl, Pennsylvania. Hi Cheryl -- what`s your question? I think I have Cheryl in Pennsylvania.

Cheryl are you there, dear?

CHERYL, PENNSYLVANIA (via telephone): Hi.

GRACE: Ok. Hi, what`s your question?

CHERYL: Hold on, honey. I was trying to watch your show. I`m in another room. By anyway --

GRACE: Ok.

CHERYL: I love you, Nancy. And I love the kids.

GRACE: Your question is.

CHERYL: Anyway, I wanted to talk about that sick girl, if you want to call her that.

GRACE: Yes.

CHERYL: Number one, I think she saw --

GRACE: And your question?

CHERYL: My question -- I just wanted, it`s a comment.

GRACE: Ok.

CHERYL: I just wanted to say that I think that the state of Arizona has spent far too much money on this woman. I think that she doesn`t deserve

the death penalty because they should keep her in jail and spend the rest of her life there so that she can watch the world live while she`s locked

up like an animal. I think that`s --

GRACE: You know, that`s an interesting perspective. And I`ve heard a lot of people say that, Cheryl. Now the problem with that is that -- and it

may not be a problem -- is that she can get life with parole, which means she could walk.

Out to Parag Shah (ph) a veteran defense attorney joining me out of Atlanta. Parag Shah j-- you have heard the opening statements over a

monitor. I want to get your assessment. How are they going to do it differently this time?

PARAG SHAH, ATTORNEY: Well, I think the focus is that the defense is trying to show that this is more of passion. If someone is acting with

passion, you don`t want to put that person to death. The people that are meant for the death penalty are those that have a depraved heart, who just

kill to kill, and that`s not Jodi Arias. There`s abuse. There`s psychological issues.

GRACE: Parag, that`s not their defense. They`re not really -- ok, you`re mixing apples and oranges. You`re mixing defenses because you`re saying it

was an act of passion --

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: Hold on -- which will bring it down to voluntary manslaughter. But their defense isn`t act of passion. Their defense is post-traumatic stress

syndrome. That`s the defense that they`re --

SHAH: But the passion that she had for him, and that`s all tied together. The way she reacted because she loved him and she hated him and because of

the abuse -- there`s so many emotions.

GRACE: Put him back up -- put him back up.

SHAH: They`re trying to tap in to the jury`s emotion.

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: Do you know what he actually said today? I want to remind you of what Nurmi`s words were. Try this on for size. Nurmi, the defense lawyer,

says Jodi was the secret woman. She`s the one that would get down and dirty behind closed doors win the bedroom but she`s not the one he took on

proper dates and she just couldn`t take it anymore. That`s his argument.

Now is that supposed to engender some type of sympathy from the jury?

SHAH: No, it`s supposed to invoke an emotion --

GRACE: I mean if she didn`t want to be the other woman, why not just leave?

SHAH: You know, it`s just not that easy.

GRACE: An emotion -- it evoked an emotion with me.

SHAH: It`s just not that cut and dry, and that`s the point. Because it`s not just that kind of depraved heart type of murderer, she should not

receive the death penalty. And life in prison without parole is a severe sentence.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARIAS: How far back were those?

MARTINEZ: We`re talking about your memory problem, right?

ARIAS: I don`t know that I`d really call it a problem.

Not that I remember. I don`t remember that part.

MARTINEZ: What was the name of this woman?

ARIAS: I don`t remember.

I don`t remember if there were calls that morning.

MARTINEZ: Can`t tell us anything.

ARIAS: I just don`t remember what specific subject matter.

I don`t remember.

It could be because I don`t remember.

I don`t remember.

I don`t know.

I don`t know. It was more -- I don`t remember specific subject matter.

I don`t remember making out with him before we went out for the evening.

MARTINEZ: Your memory issues -- we`re talking about those, right?

ARIAS: I don`t know.

MARTINEZ: And it was that call, I believe, correct?

ARIAS: I don`t remember.

MARTINEZ: How many minutes?

ARIAS: I don`t know. I wasn`t timing it.

I don`t remember anything.

MARTINEZ: Well, you think you don`t know -- right.

ARIAS: I don`t know.

I don`t know.

MARTINEZ: Isn`t it true that when you and Mr. (inaudible) engaged in (EXPLETIVE DELETED) you used baby oil -- right?

ARIAS: I don`t remember that far back what kind of lubricant we used.

MARTINEZ: Do you have a problem with your memory?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: It`s incredible.

Welcome back, everyone. This is HLN and we are live outside the Phoenix courthouse as the death penalty retrial of Jodi Arias commences. We`ve

been in opening statements for the last hours and see Martinez put up the first witnesses.

We are live and taking your calls. First, Irene in Colorado. Hi Irene -- what`s your question?

IRENE, COLORADO (via telephone): Hi, I`m not quite sure of the appeal process. If she gets life with parole, life without parole, the death

sentence, how does that work?

GRACE: Ok, with either of those, she`s going to appeal regardless of the outcome. She`s going to appeal. Death penalty appeals typically take

longer, but regardless she is going to appeal, so settle in for that. This is far from over.

Everyone, as soon as opening statements ended, Martinez started with a witness who could introduce crime scene photos. Straight out to Dr.

William Morrone.

Liz, let`s show the photos that were introduced in court. Dr. Morrone, medical examiner out of Madison -- Dr. Morrone, what do you learn from the

crime scene photos?

DR. WILLIAM MORRONE, MEDICAL EXAMINER: Well, when you look at the photos and they have the body, it shows how he was attacked. We know that he has

defensive wounds, has a lot of defensive wounds on his hands, and he has a lot of wounds on his back. He got the defensive wounds on his hands first,

and he had to have been unconscious or incapacitated to get the wounds on his back because they`re so concentrated in the angle that he was at.

So I think the order was, he defended himself -- he has ten or a dozen wounds on his hands. Then there were some wounds on the chest, then the

back. Then she cut his neck. And the neck was not cut low. It was cut high by the ears, which means his head had to go back. And he wouldn`t

have done that voluntarily.

And then the final gunshot wound came in on the right temporal and went across, but never exited. And the damning statement that takes away from

the defense that he was shot first is that there was a lack of hemorrhage in the brain, which means there was no blood pressure and there was no

blood supply, which means all the other trauma happened first and that`s what the autopsy shows.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARTINEZ: Did you have the knife in your hand when you shot him?

ARIAS: No, I did not.

MARTINEZ: Mr. Alexander is getting blasted, you go and get up -- he`s got the knife in his hand.

ARIAS: That was all in the same moment when he was lunging at me.

MARTINEZ: You get the gun. You go into the bathroom again. You turn around and point the gun. You shoot him. He goes down, still pawing at

you and saying (EXPLETIVE DELETED) kill you (EXPLETIVE DELETED) all in 62 seconds -- that`s what you`re telling?

ARIAS: He didn`t (EXPLETIVE DELETED) until after I got away.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Welcome back, everyone. This is HLN and we are live outside the Phoenix courthouse. The trial -- the retrial of Jodi Arias and this death

penalty phase has commenced. The courthouse right behind, we have just walked out of opening statements and we see Juan Martinez put up the very

first state witness going in detail through crime-scene photos.

With us is Dr. William Morrone who just pointed out a fatal flaw in their argument. It`s about a shell casing that`s found on top of blood. Let`s

see that crime-scene photo, Liz.

Matt Zarrell, what is so critical about this photo?

MATT ZARRELL, HLN PRODUCER: Yes, the state contends that the photograph of a shell casing that you`re seeing there is shows Travis Alexander was

already bleeding profusely before he was shot which contradicts the defense argument that the shot was first. The state says it was last.

GRACE: And why is that so critical to the defense, Matt?

ZARRELL: Because she killed him three times over and it shows the cruel and inhumane way that she disposed of somebody that she beloved.

GRACE: So after slashing him 29 times, slashing his throat ear to ear, she then shoots him. Everyone with me right now -- we are live and taking your

calls -- is a special guest. Tara Kelley, she was a former juror on this case. Tara, thank you for being with us. Now that the retrial has

commenced, you`re looking back. Do you have any regrets about what happened in that first trial?

TARA KELLEY, FORMER JUROR IN THE FIRST ARIAS TRIAL: Thanks for calling me Nancy. I don`t really have any regrets. Unfortunately, I was chosen as an

alternate at the very end, which was very hard to deal with.

GRACE: Right.

KELLEY: And it`s still hard to deal with. I don`t personally have any regrets. I put in a lot of time and attention into the trial. I asked a

lot of questions. The only regret I have is unfortunately that the jury couldn`t make the final right decision.

GRACE: And, Tara, what was your leaning during the trial?

KELLEY: Well, as far as the penalty phase, I obviously, based on the evidence and everything that was played out in court, I thought that Jodi

deserved the death penalty as well. That would have been my vote if I would have been on the sitting jury.

GRACE: Well, I`m interested. Why do you say that? And what do you think was the most damning evidence against Arias to lead you to that conclusion?

KELLEY: Well, I mean I think all the evidence that we saw was, you know, evident enough that that`s what she deserved. But then with her taking the

stand and just all the lies she was telling and all the times her story changed, it was hard to believe anything that she said, especially claiming

self-defense. It did not look like self-defense at all.

GRACE: With me is Tara Kelley. And we are taking your calls. Out to Nina in Pennsylvania. Hi, Nina -- what`s your question?

NINA, PENNSYLVANIA (via telephone): Hi, Nancy. I had a question and a comment.

GRACE: Ok.

NINA: I have post traumatic stress disorder myself. And I guess I`m kind of offended by this whole idea that this is an excuse and that she is such

a poor, introverted person. We have triggers. I know that I have triggers that will cause you to have the different behaviors because of post

traumatic stress. I`m wondering what the trigger for her was, by him taking a shower. And, personally --

GRACE: I`ve got to tell you something. Nina I`ve got to tell you what I just heard. Juan Martinez pointing out to the jury, practically standing

on his head, objecting and I know why. All right what he did -- and I thought this was brilliant, Nina. He takes the defense doctor`s own

written statement and I think it was Richard Samuel`s statement, his findings. He puts them up on a big screen and he talks about how Arias has

post traumatic stress syndrome. That`s the defense.

But, Nina, you said what causes it? According to the defense, what caused it were these people she says break in the house and killed Travis and she

barely escaped with her life. They`re basing the post traumatic stress syndrome on an event that never happened, Nina. Am I explaining it

clearly?

NINA: I think so. I have personal triggers where you go into this kind of introverted mode because of a trigger from a past traumatic experience.

And I guess my question is, what kind of traumatic thing did he do by taking a shower that is post traumatic stress disorder is her defense?

What could he possibly have done by taking a shower to trigger an abnormal behavior in her because of post traumatic stress disorder?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(ARIAS SINGING)

I know it`s obvious I was there.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No. It`s obvious that you committed a crime.

That you hurt Travis.

ARIAS: There`s no reason for --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No. I know that you did this. And you refuse to tell me why.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Justice delayed, justice denied. That`s the question here outside the Phoenix courthouse. We are live and taking your calls.

We have just come out of a round of opening statements like none other. The Jodi Arias death penalty sentencing trial commences.

We are taking your calls. Let`s go out to the next caller, Maureen in New York. Hi Maureen -- what`s your question?

MAUREEN, NEW YORK (via telephone): I have more of a comment tonight, Nancy.

GRACE: Ok.

MAUREEN: I think we`ve all suffered pain or heartache, rejection in a relationship. But to take another beautiful life and devastate a wonderful

family, I don`t know how this girl can live with herself or why she would even want to.

GRACE: You know, you`re right. Unleash the lawyers -- Parag Shaw, Jeff Gold, Sue Moss.

Sue, I`m here in the courthouse. I was looking at Jodi Arias, swishing her hair around in front of the jury and doing stretches during the break.

Where is all that love? I mean, they refer to him as "the beloved". I mean do you have to kill somebody because they don`t take you out on proper

dates? That`s the defense?

MOSS: Absolutely. I need a Corona for what`s going on in Arizona. The truth is, she killed this guy and even the friends, when they called the

police, they said she was stalking him. She was leaving voice mails, she was slashing her tires. This was no excuse of abuse.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

END