Return to Transcripts main page
Nancy Grace
The Fetus Snatcher; Female Teacher Accused of Molesting Three Boys. Aired 8-9:00p ET.
Aired March 31, 2015 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight, live, Longmont. A 34-year-old mother of two accused of luring a 7-months-pregnant 26-year-old mom to be
to her home with a baby clothing ad, then attacking Mommy, slashing open her tummy, cutting out the fetus. We dig deep tonight to learn the alleged
perp, 34-year-old Dynel`s Lane`s, own baby boy, just 19 months old, drowns in a back yard pond. Was she willing to do anything to replace her drowned
son, even commit murder?
Bombshell tonight. No murder charges. That`s right. In the state of Colorado, you can hunt down a pregnant mom, slit her stomach open, steal
her fetus, the baby dies, and that`s not murder. Outrage!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The 26-year-old woman lies beaten, stabbed and bleeding.
911 OPERATOR: What did she cut you with?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A knife. I`m pregnant. She cut me in my stomach.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: According to the arrest warrant, Lane`s boyfriend says he heard the baby gasp when he saw it in the bathtub at
their home.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And a prim and proper English teacher, a married Taysville (ph) teacher and mother of two, to stand three separate trials, one for
each boy student she allegedly molests.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An English teacher faces charges for allegedly having sex with three high school students. Police say a 16-year-old said
he had several sexual encounters with the teacher.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And live, suburban Abington and a local Target store, where a 32-year-old man executes a James Bond-level peeping Tom operation in the
ladies` changing room at Target. And he allegedly did it with this. It looks like a writing pen, right? Guess again. It`s a camera.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police in Pennsylvania say a man used a camera pen to film women changing in a Target dressing room on multiple occasions.
Police were called after a Target shopper who was changing suddenly noticed a small pen protruding under the wall.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell tonight. A 34-year-old mother of two accused of luring a 7- months-pregnant 26-year-old mom to be to her home with a baby clothing ad, then attacking her, slashing Mommy`s tummy, cutting out her fetus.
We dig deep tonight to learn the alleged perp, 34-year-old Dynel Lane`s, own baby boy, just 19 months old, drowns in a back yard pond. Was
she willing to do anything to replace her drowned son, even commit murder?
Bombshell tonight. No murder charges. That`s right, in the state of Colorado, you can hunt down a pregnant mom, slit her stomach open, steal
her fetus and the baby dies, and that`s not murder? Outrage!
Straight out to Randy Corporon, talk show host at KLZ. I`m shocked! So you can hunt down a pregnant mom, lure her with an ad for baby clothes,
get her to your home -- you`re looking at the pregnant mom right there, Michelle Wilkins, 7 months pregnant -- get her to your home, then slice her
stomach open, leave her for dead on the basement floor, bleeding out, the baby dies, and that`s not murder?
Randy, what part of that scenario did I miss? Why are there no murder charges?
RANDY CORPORON, TALK SHOW HOST, KLZ (via telephone): Well, Nancy, it is stunning. And the state legislature is promising they`re going to
address this issue, but Colorado...
GRACE: Oh, blah, blah, blah, blah! You know what? The state legislature in Colorado has tried to make this a crime three times in a
row. So what does it take, the death of this little baby for them to wake up and smell the coffee?
Everybody, you are seeing shots of a young mom to be, her tummy sliced open, the fetus wrenched out. The baby dies, of course, Mommy left to
bleed out on the basement floor. But the law is that`s not murder.
You know what? Maybe I`m missing something here, but don`t we all remember -- let me think -- Scott Peterson? Remember when Laci was
murdered and her body washed ashore, and then the body of her unborn baby boy, Conner, washed ashore. Scott Peterson was put on trial for not one
but two murders. Here`s Laci, OK?
[20:05:17]And I`m not talking about a woman`s right to choose. I`m not talking about abortion, all right? That`s not what we`re talking
about. We`re talking about a third party individual, like this woman, Dynel Lane, or Scott Peterson, who cuts a lady`s stomach open to steal the
fetus. The baby dies, and that`s not murder.
I don`t get it, Randy Corporon!
CORPORON: Well, the district attorney has cited the statute the way it exists right now. Under Colorado law, without proof of a live birth, he
says he cannot charge first degree murder.
GRACE: OK, let`s talk about the proof of a live birth. Rita Cosby, investigative journalist, WABC host -- Rita, all right, so this woman has
been pretending to her husband that she`s pregnant, the lady that the son drowned. And I`m talking about Dynel Lane, the defendant, 34-year-old mom
of two.
So she convinces her husband -- here she is -- she`s pregnant again. And then he comes home and she says, I miscarried. The baby`s in the
bathtub. He goes up. Rita, he tells police -- and this is his wife. He tells police he finds the baby gasping for air, all right, number one.
Number two, the hospital personnel, Rita, say the baby`s viable, all right? They say the baby`s viable. And number three, what about the fact
that so often, children are born and they don`t know how to breathe in yet, so the doctor spanks them on their booty to make them cry and scream to
take that first breath? Those children haven`t breathed yet, either, but they`re alive!
RITA COSBY, WABC: Nancy, it is incredible. And I think what you pointed out, especially the boyfriend, the fact that the boyfriend...
GRACE: Right!
COSBY: ... said he saw the baby -- in fact, she made up this wild story that, I was pregnant. There doesn`t seem to be any proof she was
pregnant, of course. And then when the boyfriend comes, the baby is taking, quote, "its last breath." And the baby had a name, by the way.
The baby was supposed to be baby Aurora (ph).
GRACE: You know, which coincidentally is after Sleeping Beauty, baby Aurora. Just -- you know, let me just go through this one more time. So
this is not in his girlfriend`s best interests for him to say the baby was breathing, all right? That hurts her because it shows the baby was alive.
But that`s what he told police.
Only later, Matt Zarrell, isn`t it true that when he realized what`s going on, when he`s questioned again, he goes, Oh, yes, I misspoke. The
baby wasn`t breathing.
MATT ZARRELL, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER (via telephone): Well, what the district attorney said -- now, we know it`s in the initial report that he
claims he saw the baby take a gasping breath. The DA is saying that upon further examination with the witness by the police, that the witness
clarified that Aurora was still and her mouth was open, but she was not breathing...
GRACE: Oh, OK.
ZARRELL: Yes. And the DA said that`s consistent with medical evidence from the autopsy.
GRACE: OK, what I`m talking about right now is what the defendant`s husband, or boyfriend or live-in or whatever he is, told the police on the
scene. And the first thing he told police is that the baby was gasping for breath.
I want you to listen to the 911 call, keeping in mind she leaves Mommy with her uterus cut open to bleed out, left for dead. Mommy manages to
call 911. The baby dies, but it`s not murder. Listen.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
911 OPERATOR: 911. Address of your emergency? OK, tell me what happened.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She cut me.
911 OPERATOR: Who cut you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Downstairs -- I don`t know.
911 OPERATOR: OK. Hold on.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
911 OPERATOR: Hang on. Hold on.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Please. I`m downstairs.
911 OPERATOR: OK. Who cut you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was a girl. (INAUDIBLE)
911 OPERATOR: What did she cut you with?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A knife. I`m pregnant. She cut me in my stomach. I`m afraid...
911 OPERATOR: She cut you in your stomach?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Uh-huh. I`m pregnant (INAUDIBLE)
911 OPERATOR: What is the suspect`s name?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t remember.
Please, I`m bleeding out.
911 OPERATOR: I know. You need to stay on the phone with me, OK? I`m getting everybody to you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m bleeding out.
911 OPERATOR: I know. You stay with me, OK? I got everybody coming to help you. You stay on the phone. Don`t hang up. Can you grab a towel
or anything you can get in your hands and put it on your wound and press? How far along are you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Seven months.
[20:10:03]911 OPERATOR: Seven months? OK. Are you alone in the house?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t know.
911 OPERATOR: You stay with me. Don`t go to sleep. You stay with me. You`re downstairs in the basement?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Uh-huh.
911 OPERATOR: And are you alone?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. I locked the door.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
911 OPERATOR: Tell me what happened.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She cut me.
911 OPERATOR: Who cut you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Downstairs, I don`t know.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This mother-to-be beaten, stabbed and bleeding, her baby had been cut out of her.
911 OPERATOR: Did she cut you in your stomach?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Uh-huh. I`m pregnant.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: According to the police report, Lane told her husband she miscarried a baby, and he saw the baby gasping for breath.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Apparently, in Colorado, you can hunt down a pregnant mom, trick her into your home with an ad for baby clothes, attack her viciously,
slit open her stomach, steal her fetus, leave Mommy to die bleeding. The baby dies, and you`re not charged with murder.
[20:15:15]OK, hold that thought one moment. Straight out to Dr. William Morrone, forensic pathologist. Dr. Morrone, question to you. Now,
remember, I`m a JD, I`m not an MD, so try to get down to my level.
So many times when children are born, apparently, they won`t take that first breath, and doctors smack them on the booty. Not my children. They
were not smacked. Absolutely not. But some children are smacked on the booties to make them try to breathe in.
So those children are alive, even though they haven`t taken a breath yet. So what`s the difference?
DR. MORRONE, MEDICAL EXAMINER/FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Here`s where the flaw is. They`re going after paperwork. They talked about the autopsy.
There`s not a lot of pathologists and people who do autopsies that are very familiar over and over repeatedly with live births.
And on the death certificate, you have homicide, you have suicide, you have accident, and you have natural as the manner of death.
So what did they use? When you use anything other than homicide -- and this baby was produced by a violent act, I don`t see how that fits.
Now, for what you said, the baby is in amniotic fluid. So there`s fluid in the lungs.
And then there`s this stuff that kind of looks like ricotta cheese or mayonnaise that`s all over the baby as lubricant. It`s called vernix (ph).
So you have two physical barriers that present this baby as a lubricated object, but they`re difficult to breathe through.
So then you clear the lungs. And the baby cries and it takes its first breath. And then cardiovascularly, inside the chest, there is a
valve in the chest called the foraminal (ph) valley (ph) that switches over...
GRACE: OK, beware (ph) because you`re starting to lose me.
MORRONE: Oh, I`m sorry! OK.
GRACE: I got the pat on the back...
MORRONE: Let`s go back to...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: ... clears the chest and the baby can breathe, right?
MORRONE: Let`s -- let`s...
GRACE: Yes, go back to that.
MORRONE: The mayonnaise and the ricotta cheese -- this baby is covered with a lube. And then its lungs are full of fluid. If an
untrained person delivers this baby and doesn`t take the necessary precautions to do it clean and then stimulate the baby -- they stimulate
the baby to get it to start breathing. All those fluid and creamy barriers and stimulation aren`t done, so maybe they`re saying, Well, that -- that`s
the reason why you didn`t have a live birth.
It doesn`t make sense. They are going off of paperwork and bad legislation. This doesn`t make any sense.
GRACE: OK, so let me ask you this -- for those of you just joining us, this woman plots out this crime. She posts -- and let`s see her
picture, Liz. I am talking about Dynel Catrece Lane, a 34-year-old mother of two.
She puts up a baby registry from Target, as I recall, where she puts all of the items she wants people to buy her at Target. She has a couple
of baby registries. She goes on different baby blogs and asks questions. She leads her boyfriend/husband to believe she`s pregnant. She keeps
changing the delivery date.
Long story short, stalks a mother by posting an ad for baby clothes. The mom-to-be comes. She ends up being attacked, her tummy slit open.
She`s left for dead in the basement, bleeding out. And the baby dies.
Dr. Morrone, what I don`t understand is, is there a test that you can do to see if the baby actually did take a breath? Is that what they`re
relying on?
MORRONE: What they`re relying on is the condition of the lungs and the position of the valve. But if this baby presents to a non-trained
medical professional and they`re not taking that as a priori circumstances...
GRACE: OK, there you go again. No Latin allowed on this show, all right? No Latin. I heard that.
MORRONE: OK.
GRACE: Is there a test where you can look at a baby`s lungs postmortem during autopsy and determine whether they`ve been exposed to air
or not? That`s a yes/no.
MORRONE: Yes. They`d be full of fluid. Somebody`d say it didn`t take its first breath.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:23:42]UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The 26-year-old woman lies beaten, stabbed and bleeding.
911 OPERATOR: What did she cut you with?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A knife. I`m pregnant. She cut me in my stomach.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: According to the arrest warrant, Lane`s boyfriend says he heard the baby gasp when he saw it in the bathtub at
their home.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: So her own boyfriend/husband says the baby was breathing, but then later recants that and says, Oh, no, the baby was not breathing.
To Marc Klaas, president and founder of Klaas Kids Foundation. Please weigh in, Marc.
MARC KLAAS, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: Well, listen, Nancy, the fact that -- that she murdered this baby and cannot even be charged with the murder
diminishes the life of the little girl. It`s just absolutely unbelievable.
She is not going to be punished for the crime that she committed. She`s diminished the life of a little girl. She`s really negated the fact
that this child was even a viable human being. And I just don`t understand how a legislature can do something like that. It`s just unconscionable.
GRACE: Well, also, Marc Klaas, based on what Dr. Morrone is saying, just because the child has fluid in its lungs may very well mean that those
lungs have not been cleared. And I mean, I know from personal experience - - this baby was over 7 months along. The hospital staff says the baby is viable. OK. What more does the district attorney need?
[20:25:10]KLAAS: You`re asking me? I have no idea what more the district attorney needs. It seems to me that this is a case where a
prosecutor does not have the internal fortitude to carry out the job that he was elected to do!
GRACE: Well, I`m telling you, I`m, like, upside down.
Let`s unleash the lawyers, Areva Martin, LA, Kush Arora out of D.C.
First to you, Kush Arora. Let`s hear your defense of this woman. She`s clearly not insane. This is well thought out plan. She`d been Lying
to her boyfriend/husband for months on end, changing her due date until she could finally find a mom she could attack and steal the baby.
KUSH ARORA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don`t think this is a time to be attacking the prosecutors. This really doesn`t have anything to do with
the prosecutor.
GRACE: That`s not what I asked you.
ARORA: Well, listen, the point is, I`m piggy backing on what somebody else said just now. This -- this prosecutor is only bound by the law is...
GRACE: OK...
ARORA: ... in the state that he`s representing. This woman is still facing potential decades of jail time...
GRACE: Let`s try to...
ARORA: ... for not only a first degree assault...
GRACE: ... steer it back into the middle of the road.
ARORA: ... but also for an attempted murder.
GRACE: Areva Martin, let`s hear your defense of her. That`s what we`re talking about.
AREVA MARTIN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Nancy, we haven`t gotten into this case. We know there`s going to be a psychiatric evaluation. This
woman clearly was not sane at the time. She`s not going to meet the legal definition of sanity. She`s going to be determined insane.
These acts are the reprehensible for sure, but this is a clear-cut case where the insanity defense is going to be pled by her defense team,
and I think we`re going to learn about this woman`s tragic background. Her own kid...
GRACE: Well, you know what`s interesting...
MARTIN: ... died in a pond. She was the subject of domestic violence, and there`s going to be a history here of mental issues that
caused this woman...
GRACE: OK, please stop...
MARTIN: ... to commit this reprehensible crime.
GRACE: ... because that`s not true. There is no history of mental illness.
MARTIN: It absolutely is, Nancy. It absolutely is. If you look at the background of this woman, you`re going to find that she had clear
(INAUDIBLE)...
GRACE: Please put her up.
MARTIN: ... that led her to this reprehensible act.
GRACE: I have a question.
MARTIN: That`s -- those are the facts, Nancy!
GRACE: No.
MARTIN: You can`t deny them!
GRACE: I`m asking you a question. Have you seen any...
MARTIN: I answered your question about her background.
GRACE: OK, please cut her mike.
To Randy Corporon, talk show host, KLZ. Is there any history of treated mental illness on behalf of this mom, the perpetrator?
CORPORON: No history of treated mental illness for this mom, Nancy.
GRACE: None whatsoever.
OK, could you please put Areva Martin back up? So Ms. Martin, before you attempt...
MARTIN: Nancy...
GRACE: ... to lie on air about what I`m going to know...
MARTIN: Nancy...
GRACE: ... what I know about...
(CROSSTALK)
MARTIN: First of all, no lies have been told...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Repeat, could you cut her mike? Repeat. You just said to look into the facts and that I would see a mental history, OK? Well,
there`s not one.
To -- let`s go to a mental expert, Dr. Patricia Saunders. Patricia, please weigh in on this.
PATRICIA SAUNDERS, PSYCHOLOGIST: OK, there`s no history of mental illness. All we know is that for 13 years, this woman has been lying about
baby registries, to her husband about being pregnant, miscarriages, mystery (ph). She wanted to replace her baby boy. She found the opportunity after
three years. This is not mental illness.
GRACE: OK, I want to add something else, Dr. Saunders that Matt Zarrell just reminded me of.
Rita Cosby, isn`t it true that when she gets to the hospital, she claims the baby is hers?
COSBY: Yes.
GRACE: As a matter of fact, she`s there with her miscarried baby while the real mother is being rushed into the emergency room to try to
save her life. They`re in the same hospital! And she refuses a pelvic exam because she knows that they`re going to find out this is not her baby!
COSBY: Yes. At first, she says she miscarried. Then she later admits -- and by the way, Nancy, at that time, the mother is laying
bleeding in her basement and about to call 911 after being stabbed repeatedly by this woman.
GRACE: And the other thing you were talking about, Marc Klaas, this is not the first time this sort of attack has occurred. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Brutal attempts to steal another woman`s child right from the womb are all too common -- Shannon Torres (ph) accused of
slashing a mom`s neck and kidnapping her baby, Lisa Montgomery, charged with killing Bobby Jo Stinnick (ph) while cutting out the infant with a
knife from her womb. Peggy Joe Conner (ph) was convicted after she clubbed a pregnant neighbor over the head with a baseball bat, drove her to the
woods and cut her stomach.
Effie Goodston (ph) convinced her husband she was pregnant before allegedly kidnapping a pregnant acquaintance and cutting the fetus from her
womb. And this woman allegedly shot a pregnant neighbor and abducted her baby. The suspect killed herself as police came to her home to question
her.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:30:00]
and abducted her baby. The suspect killed herself as police came to her home to question her.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:34:14]
GRACE: A prim and proper English teacher, a married mother of two, to stand trial for three separate trials, one for each boy student she
allegedly molests.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police and prosecutors say Altais (ph) essentially groomed three former male students.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Authorities say they locate two more alleged victims. 14 separate counts. Including rape and sodomy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight out to talk show host with KTKK Jim Kirkwood. All right. So there is three boy students that she allegedly sexually molests.
It`s my understanding that one of the boy students said he thought they were dating. So where does the husband and the two children fit into that
scenario?
JIM KIRKWOOD, KTKK: The husband has stayed loyal, at least till recently. I don`t know what his latest position is. But she is the mother
of two of his children. And what`s interesting, the No. 1 boy, so to speak, was an employee of a friend of mine. And he`s 18 now. And he
claims the other two are lying, that he was the only one, and that they are a couple.
GRACE: OK, so hold on. So now the sex molest victims are arguing about who is the real boyfriend?
KIRKWOOD: Yes. Boys amongst themselves, of course.
GRACE: Michael Christian, what exactly are the charges, specific charges against her?
CHRISTIAN: Five counts of first degree felony rape. Two counts of first degree felony forcible sodomy. Three counts of second degree felony
forcible sexual abuse. Three counts of unlawful sexual activity with a minor, Nancy, and one count of dealing harmful material to a minor.
GRACE: Another interesting point about this, Jim Kirkwood, you are seeing a shot of a Kaysville English teacher, believed to be prim and
proper. While the judge has just ordered severance, that means three separate trials, to be conducted. So the jury won`t hear -- may not hear
about similar transactions. In other words, each of the three juries will believe she`s only charged with molesting one boy. Jim Kirkwood, talk show
host, KTKK, isn`t it true that one boy has now filed a civil lawsuit against the school district, claiming that they were on notice that she had
been in compromising positions before with a student?
KIRKWOOD: This is -- this whole thing is so sordid, Nancy. In my opinion. The boys are arguing who the real boyfriend is. The one now as I
said is 18. And what`s interesting is when they locked her up now because every time she has a chance, she gets together with him. That is what he
reports to a close friend of mine.
GRACE: When you say get together with him, you mean have sex with an underaged boy, correct?
KIRKWOOD: Correct.
GRACE: Okay. Well, that is certainly euphemistic. Michael Christian, so is it correct -- is my understanding correct that after she`s
arrested or charged in one rape of a boy student, she hooks up or has sex with another boy student after she`s already been arrested?
CHRISTIAN: That`s right, Nancy. I think at that point she had been arrested for having sex with two of them. And she had sex with a third
after that point.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Areva Martin, LA, Kush Arora, out of DC. OK, Kush, give me your best defense on this.
ARORA: Best defense in this situation to me is that there is some mental health issue. There is also some credibility I see with the three
boys here.
GRACE: Do you have any other playbook besides mental illness?
(CROSSTALK)
ARORA: It certainly is not. But I think there are also some credibility issues here with the three boys. They are obviously telling
different stories to each other. They are telling different stories to the police. That is --
GRACE: What is the different story, Kush?
ARORA: I think that there is a different story. One of these individuals is saying that the other two boys are lying. I think that this
is primarily one of the reasons that the judge has decided to sever these cases. Not only is it very prejudicial to any finder of fact --
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Take a breath. Hold on. Stop.
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: I have a question about what you said. You said that the boys are lying to each other. To put it more accurately, isn`t it true that the
boys are arguing about who is the real boyfriend? None of these boy students are claiming they didn`t have sex with a teacher.
ARORA: I think one of the boys is claiming that the other two boys are lying. There are some credibility issues here. We don`t know how
these stories actually began or how they actually were found out by the public or by any authorities at the school. I`ve often seen cases where
sometimes people are making allegations and other people jump on the bandwagon for fame, for any number of reasons. And that would be a big
concern here for any finder of fact in this case.
GRACE: Let`s talk about that. So Jim Kirkwood, KTKK, does he have a leg to stand on? How do we know, what is the proof these incidents took
place? Where did they take place? When? How can we corroborate them?
KIRKWOOD: I think that is the problem. We just have the boys` word from my understanding. As I say, I have a source very close to the boy.
And this source indicates the boy claims he is the only true boyfriend.
[20:40:02]
And they get together metaphorically whenever she has a chance. That is why the judge locked her up, is to keep them apart.
GRACE: Michael Christian, where did the different assaults take place on the three boy students? What if anything corroborates? Texts, e-mail,
Facebook, photos? Didn`t she send photos of her bare breasts to one of the students?
CHRISTIAN: Yes, that is one of the allegations, Nancy. Also prosecutors say when investigators were talking to her, that she confessed
that she engaged in sex with a 16-year-old boy on at least two occasions. However, her defense attorney says that confession was coerced and it is
not genuine.
GRACE: OK. Unleash the lawyers. Areva Martin, Kush Arora. You are saying it was all made up. What about the teacher`s confession, Areva?
MARTIN: What we do know, Nancy, is that 10 police officers apparently arrived at this woman`s house. There are some issues about whether her
Miranda rights were read to her. And there have been arguments about suppressing this statement because her lawyers are claiming it was a forced
confession and that in fact she has not committed any crimes with respect to these young boys.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:45:21]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: An English teacher faces charges for allegedly having sex with three high school students. Police say a 16-year-old said he had several
sexual encounters with the teacher.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: The judge in this case, and I can`t say the judge is wrong. This is a discretionary move. But the judge has given her a huge advantage
by severing or splitting apart all of the charges. This prim and proper English teacher from Kaysville, a mother of two, a married mother of two,
now accused of sex assaulting three boy students. Sodomy charges, rape charges. The defense attorney is arguing that the boys are all lying.
Three of them. All right. Let me ask you this, Michael Christian. Isn`t it true, Michael, that she confessed to police. She confirmed the sex
relationship with one of the boys, and that one of the boys could accurately describe the layout of her home, including her bedroom, and the
tattoos all over her body.
CHRISTIAN: Nancy, that is what prosecutors are saying that investigators found out. However again, the defense is saying that her
quote/unquote confession was coerced.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers again. Kush Arora, DC, Areva Martin, LA. You know, this is as serious as a male teacher allegedly molesting a girl
student. But for some reason, when the perpetrator is a female, it is not taken as seriously. So as these boys grow up and go through life, their
story of school, oh yes, my teacher molested me. Yes, that is what happened when I was in school.
Now, could you explain to me, Areva Martin, you are claiming her confession was forced. But how would that boy student know about the
tattoos all over her body and describe them? How could that be?
MARTIN: Nancy, we don`t know the credibility of that young man`s statement. We don`t know if that`s something he heard, something he`s
making up. A fabricated story. These boys --
(CROSSTALK)
MARTIN: Boys are often trying to get credibility for talking about their teachers --
(CROSSTALK)
MARTIN: And until their credibility is tested by vigorous cross- examination, we don`t know if these stories are true. There is no evidence just because someone makes a statement, Nancy. You know that may not be
(inaudible). She`s denying these allegations.
GRACE: Let me go to Michael Christian. So Michael Christian, we`ve got one boy student giving police the layout of her home, including her
bedroom. They can describe the tattoos all over her body which are hidden. If you can see a full body shot of her when she was walking along, you
can`t see the tattoos. So I can only guess where they are. But the boy students sure know where they are. Yep, I don`t see a tattoo. Do you see
a tattoo, Areva Martin? Do you see a tattoo, Kush Arora? Just keep your eyes on the monitor. Michael Christian, how did the claims come to light
to start with?
CHRISTIAN: Nancy, we know about two of these guys, how it came. One the mother, his mother, found some strange text messages on his phone, so
she contacted police.
GRACE: What do you mean my strange? Sexual?
CHRISTIAN: I would guess sexual. I can`t confirm that. Strange is the word I see here. The second relationship was discovered apparently
because of a girl who was in the student`s class complained to her grandmother that the student was calling her names. And when the
grandmother asked the girl why didn`t she just report it to the teacher, the teacher apparently -- excuse me, the girl said it was because the
student was having sex with the teacher, and he had told her and another student about it, and that way she couldn`t go to the teacher.
GRACE: Dr. Patricia Saunders, clinical psychologist out of Manhattan. Please help me. I mean, she`s already been arrested on two counts of
raping boy students. When she, according to police, has sex or sodomizes another boy student, one in the church parking lot.
SAUNDERS: Well, our stereotype of pedophiles that they are only males. There are female pedophiles. This is one of them. The reasons are
many.
[20:50:00]
Sometimes they just can`t or are afraid of adult men, or, for the most part, they are true pedophiles, attracted to young boys.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Live to suburban Abbington and a local Target store, where a 32-year-old man executes a James Bond level peeping tom operation in the
ladies` changing room in Target. And he allegedly did it with this. Looks like a writing pen, right? Well, guess what, ladies, it`s a camera.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police in Pennsylvania say a man used a camera pen to film women changing in a Target dressing room on multiple occasions.
[20:55:00]
Police were called after a Target shopper who was changing suddenly noticed a small pen protruding under the wall.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Rita Cosby, investigative journalist, WABC, what happened? I`m almost afraid to ask.
COSBY: Yes, it`s pretty scary. She goes, this woman, to the Target, she is changing. Suddenly she sees like a pen-like device and blue light
coming from under the door and going, what is that? Then she goes out and she reports it. Authorities say, there was another similar report of
something like this, and then the guy that they see on the surveillance video comes back again, and they find this James Bond-like device. It`s a
recording device put in a pen, and he`s apparently been doing it for a long time.
GRACE: To Joe Demark, owner of James Bond Spy Shop, okay, Mr. Demark, how does it work?
JOE DEMARK, OWNER, JAMES BOND SPY SHOP: How are you doing, Nancy?
GRACE: Well, not too happy right now because I go to Target all the time. Explain to me how this works.
DEMARK: Basically, you have a pen and there`s a hidden camera inside of it. And also, it has an ability to record itself to a micro SD card.
That is the same little card that you can find in your cell phones or little cameras and stuff. And what happens is you press the button on top
to activate it, and you pretty much only have an hour, an hour and a half, up to three hours to record. And they would have to get the device back to
plug it back into the computer and watch all of the information that is recorded.
GRACE: So, bottom line, Stacy Newman, he`s got three hours of ladies taking their clothing off at the Target`s fitting room?
NEWMAN: He sure does. And then he would go home and watch it at his computer, Nancy, for sexual gratification.
GRACE: Okay. Stacy, how do you know about the sexual gratification part?
NEWMAN: He actually told the police, and when they came to arrest him they said, hey, you know what we want to talk to you about? He said, let
me guess, it`s about that spying stuff?
GRACE: So bottom line is he`s doing this and then masturbating at home while watching it?
NEWMAN: Yes, you could say that.
GRACE: So let`s not put perfume on the pig. Joining me right now, special guest, detective sergeant Greg Urban, Abbington Police Department.
Detective, I imagine you, like me as a prosecutor, deal with so many felonies, so many crimes, but there`s always something extremely unusual
about a perv, a peeping tom. What happened here?
GREG URBAN, ABBINGTON PD: Well, he would go into the dressing room, I guess, and scope out a lady going to the dressing room, and then he would
follow in, and there was a dressing room designed where the men`s portion backed up to the women`s portion, and there was -- he would shove the pen
type camera underneath and take a picture or video.
GRACE: Okay. I`m trying to wrap my mind around this. So no one ever noticed at Target -- not that they should -- but that this guy kept coming
in all the time and going in the men`s dressing room, always the same room and then never buying anything?
URBAN: Well, he did buy things. I don`t know if he went into the same dressing room.
GRACE: Well, it had to be. Because that`s where he`s putting the pen device, right?
URBAN: Well, there`s a bank of changing rooms. It`s the same dressing room area, but there is a bank of dressing rooms. He would sit in
the aisle and observe the area first, and then he would walk in. So he wasn`t just hanging at the dressing rooms.
GRACE: Okay. So every -- when he would spot his victim, he would then go immediately into the men`s dressing room, and he`d have to go into
that one dressing room because it`s the one that is adjoining -- adjacent to the ladies` dressing room. All right. Just guessing, Detective, how
often do you think he`s done this?
URBAN: We don`t know that yet. We still are going to be sifting through the evidence that we collected. So we haven`t been able to
determine how many times that he has done that so far.
GRACE: Let`s take a look at this guy. We call him the pen perv. The alleged pen perv. He`s Nicolas Djukovic (ph). He`s age 32, he`s a Target
fan. I`m sure that the feeling is not mutual. Tip line, 267-536-1108. If you recognize this guy, please call that number.
Let`s stop and remember American hero Marine Sergeant Brock Babb, 40, Evansville, Indiana, Purple Heart. Loved coaching youth sports and
dancing. Remembered for fiery red hair. Parents Susan and Terrance. Sister Nicky, brother Jay, widow Barbara. Two sons, one daughter. Brock
Babb. American hero.
Drew up next. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. Until then, good night, friend.
END
