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Nancy Grace
Bobbi Kristina Brown Dies; Lawsuit Against Nick Gordon; Amber Alert: Search for 21-Month-Old Lonzie Barton; The Mysterious Death of Sandra Bland. Aired 8-9p ET
Aired July 27, 2015 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HLN HOST: Breaking news tonight. We go live. American songbird superstar Whitney Houston`s only child, Bobbi Kristina, first
found face down in a bathtub at her mother Whitney Houston`s exclusive condo, then after surviving months in a coma, reportedly getting better.
Bombshell tonight. Whitney Houston`s only child, Bobbi Kristina Brown, dead. This as local district attorney`s office confirms they are
investigating. What really happened the night Bobbi Kristina found face down in her mother`s tub?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The daughter of the late Whitney Houston.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She has something to say.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Bobbi Kristina Brown has died.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Whitney Houston died in a similar scene in a bathtub full of water at the Beverly Hilton Hotel.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A 21-year-old female in the bathtub, face down.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Bobbi Kristina`s boyfriend, Nick Gordon, and a friend found her unresponsive in the tub. The criminal investigation is still
open.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, Jacksonville, Florida, Amber Alert for a 21-month-old little boy, Lonzy Barton (ph). Tonight, where is Lonzy? Please join the
search.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With a helicopter overhead, dozens of police officers looked for toddler Lonzy Barton.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have bloodhounds from our corrections (ph) division, state of Florida (INAUDIBLE) partnered up with us to search for this child.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police found that car abandoned and running about eight blocks away. The toddler wasn`t there.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I am really worried for him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And the mysterious death of 28-year-old Sandra Bland, found dead in a Texas jail cell after a controversial arrest. Breaking tonight. After
we dig up jail booking documents and Sandra Bland`s voicemail from behind jailhouse walls, tonight, supporters insisting Bland was murdered, and
what`s more, convinced her mug shot was taken after she`s dead. Claims of a cover-up?
We go live tonight,. American songbird superstar Whitney Houston`s only child, Bobbi Kristina, first found face down in a bathtub of her mother
Whitney Houston`s exclusive condo, then after surviving for months in a coma, reportedly getting better, according to her father, tonight, Whitney
Houston`s only child, Bobbi Kristina Brown, is dead. This as the local district attorney`s office confirms they are investigating.
What really happened the night Bobbi Kristina is found face down in her mother`s tub? Straight out to Alan Duke joining us, editor-in-chief at
Leadstories.com. Alan, what do we know at this hour?
ALAN DUKE, LEADSTORIES.COM: Now next is the autopsy. Yes, six months later, maybe they`ll be able to find something they couldn`t find during
medical testing while she was in the coma and in the hospital.
GRACE: OK, at this hour, Nick Gordon has not been named a suspect or a person of interest.
I want to go straight out to the Fulton County medical examiner`s office. Standing by is Mike Duffy. Mike Duffy, what`s happening?
MIKE DUFFY, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Now, Nancy, the death of Bobbi Kristina is called non-natural by the Fulton County medical examiner because of the
events leading up to her death. Those events happened at her home in Roswell, Georgia. And by law, she would be required to be brought here to
the Fulton County medical examiner`s office.
Despite the time interval between her being found unresponsive and her ultimate death. an autopsy is still going to need to be performed. We`re
standing by to see if that is happening right now, or if it`s going to happen shortly.
GRACE: OK, well, Mike Duffy, you know, when you`re great, great grandmother dies in her sleep, there`s no autopsy demanded. So why an
autopsy, Mike Duffy?
DUFFY: Nancy, this autopsy will help us answer what were some causes of death and contributing factors. The Fulton County medical examiner`s
office is telling us that it`s going to be difficult to re-establish those initial events that led up to Bobbi Kristina`s unresponsiveness, and they
say that this autopsy will help them answer many of those questions.
GRACE: OK, Mike Duffy, I understand she`s there at the medical examiner`s office. I`ve been there many, many times. But when do you think we`re
going to have the results from the autopsy?
DUFFY: Nancy, I have been asking officials how long this entire process will take. And while they won`t say much, they will say that lab results
could take up to several weeks. Now, this autopsy could be ready at any time.
[20:05:04]GRACE: Mike Duffy, what else can you tell me? What`s happening there at the scene?
DUFFY: Nancy, we`ve seen a fair amount of activity outside the Fulton County medical examiner`s office this morning. As you can see just behind
me, there are several news crews from different media organizations. And we saw some people coming and going earlier, wearing all black. Their
heads were down. They seemed to be somber. We`re standing by to see what else is happening here.
GRACE: I want to go to Candace Trunzo, senior news editor, Dailymail.com. You know, Candace, for weeks now, the hospice where Bobbi Kristina was
housed has said that the tent outside and the hearse backed up to the door was just SOP. But I have been over there many, many times, and that has
just happened in the last few weeks. This clearly was for Bobbi Kristina.
So my point is, they`ve been waiting for this to happen for weeks now. Had she been taken off life support, off food and water? I mean, what do we
know?
CANDACE TRUNZO, DAILYMAIL.COM: Well, we believe she had been taken off life support, and we believe it was just a matter of time until she passed
away. And you could see what was happening last week. Tyler Perry went to visit her, her father, of course, her aunt Pat, so many relatives, so many
friends. They just knew it was a matter of time. And we were talking days, you know, not months, not anything longer than that before she
passed.
GRACE: For those of you just joining us, the only child of Whitney Houston, America`s songbird, has died.
Now, according to the medical examiner`s office, they are conducting a full-on autopsy. Joining me right now, Dr. William Morrone, renowned
forensic pathologist, medical examiner and toxicologist.
Dr. Morrone, they have had months in which to perform all sorts of tests, fluid taken from her body. They could do MRIs. They could do X-rays on
Bobbi Kristina. She`s been lying there in a coma.
What more can they get at autopsy that they don`t already have? Why are they doing an autopsy, Dr. Morrone?
DR. WILLIAM MORRONE, FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST/MEDICAL EXAMINER: Here`s the main thing. There was reported trauma to the face. They never had access
to the tissues and the bones directly of the face. In the autopsy, they will be able to actually view the bones of the face, and the skin is going
to have samples which will demonstrate healing, scar tissue and bruises from the past.
And if those bruises are also evidence on the bone, that will be an indication of how severe the trauma was to the face, which at the point
that somebody is on a ventilator in the hospital, you can`t assess that.
GRACE: Dr. Morrone, I understand. I`m just a JD, and you`re the MD. But when you have a bruise, it goes away over a period of time. I`m not
talking about damage to the facial bones. I`m talking about to the skin.
So what more do they need? What can they learn from her skin? I heard you say something about her skin. The bruises will be long gone by now.
MORRONE: Well, superficially. But under the skin is connective tissue and muscle. And when that heals, it heals with scar tissues. And the more
scar tissue there is to the underliement (ph) and the more damage there is to the bone, the closer you get to homicide and the further away you get
from accident or natural.
GRACE: OK, so Dr. Morrone, you`re telling me that every time I got a bruise that it never really goes away?
MORRONE: If it`s a really bad bruise, scar tissue takes months to heal.
GRACE: OK, did not know that. So they`ve had a chance to do toxicology on her by simply taking her blood in the hospital where she was at Emory for
so long, now in hospice. They could take fluid. They could do MRIs. They could do X-rays for broken bones.
So you`re telling me the reason that they would have an autopsy is what?
MORRONE: Well, one is to check the trauma, but the other thing is to take tissue samples and hair samples. The one thing that they would have no
access to, because in the hospital it`s not clinical test, hair testing can test for toxins and drugs, and you don`t test hair on live people. You
test it in toxicology in autopsy. It`s part of the autopsy report for toxicology.
GRACE: OK. Dr. Morrone...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Dr. Morrone, everyone is saying that this was accidental or natural cause of death. You know, what I`m saying is when your great grandma dies
in her sleep, an autopsy is typically not ordered.
[20:10:07]When do you order an autopsy, Dr. Morrone?
MORRONE: That is an excellent point. Autopsies and medical examiners make their decisions based on whether or not the incident was witnessed, the
death was witnessed, or if a young, healthy person who is completely unexpected to die ends up in a situation that is fatal. And that`s what
you have here, an unexpectedly healthy young person. That`s how this goes.
GRACE: And again, we have the specter -- Justin, if you could pull up that 911 call that occurred during the life of Bobbi Kristina -- the specter of
drug use. Drug and alcohol use has been -- has reared its ugly head. Listen to this. We have not played it before now, but I want you to hear
what was said prior to Bobbi Kristina`s death. Listen.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Could you do me a favor and send (INAUDIBLE) somebody for a noise complaint for me?
911 OPERATOR: At what address?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: 5201 Beaver Creek Road. It`s Bobbi Kristina`s (INAUDIBLE).
911 OPERATOR: (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes (INAUDIBLE) her unit (INAUDIBLE) I was doing myself (INAUDIBLE) and cleaning my guns right now, and I heard a lot (INAUDIBLE)
911 OPERATOR: OK (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) they`re probably over there smoking dope. (INAUDIBLE) people over there. They`re always -- they`re always high,
so...
(END AUDIO CLIP)
GRACE: Joining me right now, special guest Al Dixon, the former chief assistant there at the Fulton County district attorney`s office. Al, thank
you for being with us.
Right now, I have confirmed from within the DA`s office that an investigation is ongoing. Now, here`s one question for you, Al. Number
one, why would they wait for a death to occur? I mean, prior to Bobbi Kristina`s death, there could have been an indictment on, for instance,
aggravated assault, and that did not happen. So why do you think the delay?
AL DIXON, FMR. FULTON COUNTY DEPUTY DA (via telephone): Well, that`s true, but I would suspect that there`s just no evidence to support the arrest
warrant at this point. There`s no obvious blunt force trauma, signs of a struggle...
GRACE: We don`t know that. We don`t know that.
DIXON: That`s the point. And we don`t know that, and so if they haven`t made an arrest, you can only assume that there`s no evidence to support an
arrest at this point.
GRACE: Well, what about the theory...
DIXON: And that`s why they`re investigating.
GRACE: What about the theory that you espoused earlier that they were hoping for a turnaround? I mean, even Bobby Brown himself said she`s
getting better. He did say that. And in the hopes that there would be a turnaround, we believe the DA`s office was hoping to actually speak to her
to ask her what happened, but that never occurred.
DIXON: Well, I`m sure that -- that would have helped the investigation if they would have been able to do that, to interview the victim to see what
happened. But there was no -- as the doctor indicated, no witnesses to this case, no witnesses to how this crime, or if it was a crime, occurred,
or how this death occurred.
GRACE: This posted on Twitter of Bobbi Kristina singing. Whitney Houston, "I Will Always Love You," Arista Records.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:18:24]UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: As the adorable daughter of pop icon Whitney Houston...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Bobbi Kristina Brown has died.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Questions continue to swirl. How and why did Bobbi Kristina Brown end up face down and unresponsive in a bathtub?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Police treating her case as a criminal investigation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: For those of you just joining us, the only child of American songbird Whitney Houston is dead. Bobbi Kristina Brown passed away while
in hospice care, and tonight questions swirling as to the cause of death.
To Alan Duke, editor-in-chief, Leadstories.com. Alan, we know she`s been in a coma for some time now after being found face down in a tub in her
mom`s exclusive condo. But what was the actual cause of death?
DUKE: Well, she suffered this -- this fatal brain injury. Her brain just wasn`t going to -- she was never going to regain consciousness, and her
brain wasn`t doing what it needed to do to keep her alive.
You know, we -- there`s so much that we know now that we didn`t know six months ago about how that came (ph). And it`s just remarkable what this
girl has gone through.
GRACE: You`re seeing inside the hospice facility. Let`s show those shots one more time. This is where Bobbi Kristina`s family, relatives,
bodyguard, friends, have been coming to the hospice facility. It`s highly exclusive, really well run. And for weeks, they have had a tent and a
hearse outside, although they would never confirm it was related to Bobbi Kristina.
[20:20:10]To Dr. Morrone, when they say they`ve taken her off all drugs, does that mean, as well -- when they say life support, does that mean
they`re not feeding her or giving her water? I mean, what -- why do you actually die? I know your heart stops beating. But what would be the
cause of death?
MORRONE: OK, the whole purpose of hospice is to create a situation where we no longer aggressively try to cure anything, and you let the body`s
natural processes -- so when somebody says, We have a DNR, a "do not resuscitate order," and we`re going to follow that order, it means we take
them off of life support, if that was the wish. We stop hydration and we do not force feed and...
GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa! That sound like a fancy way of starving somebody to death. She`s lying there in a coma, and they quit
giving her intravenous food and water, and that`s -- she dies because she starves?
MORRONE: It`s a strict interpretation of how we look at "do not resuscitate." You`re not going to aggressively treat. Now, there are
variations and...
GRACE: Well, wait! Wa-wa-wa-wait! "Treat" is a lot different from "feed," OK? I understand no more medicine. Fine. But the person actually
doesn`t get water or food?
MORRONE: It depends exactly on the family`s wishes. And if somebody declines, feeding them is actually going to make things worse as they get
into a state of active dying.
It`s a totally different science. It`s nothing like regular medicine. Hospice is there to prepare the families for a terminal event.
GRACE: Whitney Houston`s "Greatest Love of All," Arista Records.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:26:38]UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Brown`s chaotic, short life was chronicled by her mother`s spotlight and ultimately consumed by tragedy following
Houston`s sudden death.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is Trini (ph) from Beverly Hilton.
911 OPERATOR: Hi. What`s going on?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I need paramedics. (INAUDIBLE) got a 46-year-old female found in the bathroom. She fell, or she was in the bathroom with
the water.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That video posted on Twitter of Bobbi Kristina singing. Tonight, Bobbi Kristina`s body at the Fulton County medical examiner`s office as
they announce from the Fulton DA`s office an investigation is ongoing.
But where in the world is fiance Nick Gordon? Here he is on "Dr. Phil."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NICK GORDON, BOBBI KRISTINA`S FIANCE: I`m going to seem so weak in front of the world!
DR. PHIL, HOST: Nick, you don`t seem weak. You seem caring.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
GORDON: I want them (ph) back! There are so many things! I want them back! That`s the only thing! I can`t believe I`m crying in front of the
world!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I know.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That from CBS Television distribution. And Dr. Phil -- the last time I saw a photo of him, he was in a hot tub with a blond lady. I don`t
know where he is tonight.
Unleash the lawyers, Troy Slaten, defense lawyer, LA, Robert Schalk, defense attorney, New York. And with us, Al Dixon, former chief assistant
within the Fulton County district attorney`s office.
Al, of course, nobody is a suspect right now. But in addition to her being found face down in the tub, in water, I`m sure the medical examiner is
looking, as Dr. Morrone, said, for bruises, broken bones, which could suggest a beating.
But you know, there`s another line of inquiry, I would think, Al Dixon, such as if she was high on dope at the time she died, cocaine, heroin,
whatever it may or may not have been, who supplied her that dope? Who supplied her with the fatal dose of drugs that may have killed her?
Wouldn`t that be a line of prosecution, Al Dixon?
DIXON: Sure. That`s something they`re going to be looking at very closely in Paul Howard`s offices. If it was a drug overdose, who gave her those
drugs? And that certainly could be the cause of death.
GRACE: Now, let me ask you this, Al Dixon. Would that be -- if the actual doper, the supplier that gave her whatever drug it was -- could they be
charged with her murder?
DIXON: Well, it would certainly depend on, you know, if they gave her some sort of drug that was laced with something or was more stronger than it
should have been or was not the correct dose. Certainly, they could (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: Well, you know what? Al, I take issue with that. I don`t know what the correct dosage of cocaine is.
DIXON: Well, I mean if it`s cocaine that`s cut with something that could lead to a fatality.
GRACE: Unleash the other lawyers, Troy Slaten, Robert Schalk. Also with me, Al Dixon.
OK, Troy Slaten, nobody has been named a suspect at this juncture. But wouldn`t you agree the fact that she is found face down in a tub of water,
reported injuries to her body -- now there`s an autopsy ordered. The district attorney says that they are conducting an investigation.
TROY SLATEN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know, it`s suspicious.
GRACE: Let`s take a look at a civil lawsuit filed against Nick Gordon.
Now, again, Gordon has not been named as a criminal suspect. Gordon torturous conduct caused among other things bodily harm to Brown.
Defendant began to commit domestic violence on Brown, Bobbi Brown, punching in the face, knocking out a front tooth, dragging her upstairs by her hair,
even after hospitalization. While she was in a coma, they claim Gordon accessed her accounts and stole $11,000 plus from Bobbi Brown.
Just prior to the tub incident, Brown confided that Gordon was not the man she thought he was. Brown, however, never made it to a meeting to discuss
that. Instead, the morning of January 31, Bobbi Brown embroiled in an argument with Gordon at her townhome (ph) and ended with Brown later found
unresponsive, unconscious, face down in a bathtub, mouth swollen and another tooth knocked out. This is according to a civil lawsuit.
The misrepresentation that Gordon was her husband was used to control her, limit her interaction. He answered her cellphone, would not allow her to
make appointments without his approval, manipulated her bank relationships so he could access her money.
And in fact, defendant acted on the scheme by routinely transferring a large portion of Bobbi Brown`s funds into his account. Based on
defendant`s knowing willful and intentional, malicious conduct, Brown is entitled to an award of punitive damages and $10 million.
OK. That`s a civil lawsuit, Robert. Schalk, weigh in.
ROBERT SCHALK, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yeah. I mean obviously it`s going to be one sided at this point in time. You have Bobbi Brown`s family making
these allegations. But again, criminally, he hasn`t been charged. He has an attorney and his attorney will fight that civil lawsuit the appropriate
way. You`re going to hear his version through his lawyer and the papers it does to the respond.
So, these are one-sided allegations from a family who doesn`t like Nick Gordon. No one is hiding that fact.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Whitney Houston`s "Where Do Broken Hearts Go," Arista Records.
WHITNEY HOUSTON: So here I am, and can you please tell me, where do broken hearts go?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Live. Jacksonville Florida, Amber Alert for a 21-month-old little boy Lonzie Barton tonight, where is Lonzie? Please join the search.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With a helicopter overhead, dozens of police officers looked for toddler Lonzie Barton.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And we stopped what he was doing. Went back downstairs and noticed that the car was not there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They searched the backyard and shed some bloodhounds to try to pick up his scent or any clues about where he may be. Investigators
took up brown bag as potential evidence from the dumpster and looked at surveillance video.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have peace, be strong, just hold on. And drop your knees and pray hard.
GRACE: Straight out to Christy Turner, WKOZ. Christy, thank you for being with us. Everyone -- I want you take a look at this little boy, Lonzie.
He is missing. There is an Amber Alert out of Jacksonville, Florida. There is a reward tip line 866-845-TIPS, 866-645-8477. There is a $3,000
reward. Please help us. This little boy last seen, still wearing his diaper.
Look at Lonzie. Amber Alert. Christy Turner, how did he go missing, Christy?
CHRISTY TURNER, REPORTER, WKOZ: Well, right now there are still more questions than answers. But here`s the timeline of Lonzie`s abduction. It
was first reported to the Jacksonville Sheriff`s office Friday around 2:20 A.M. as a car theft with a child inside, officers responded within a minute
and a half of the call and it took them about 10 minutes to find the car abandoned with no toddler inside about a half mile from the apartment
complex where he was kidnapped.
It wasn`t until though after 6:00 A.M. that Florida issued an Amber Alert. He knows the time the toddler went missing. He was being watched by the
mother`s boyfriend. 32-year-old William Ebron.
He originally told police he was bringing the toddler and his 5-year-old sister to pick up their mother from work, but had to go back into the
apartment to grab something. The little girl ran inside to tell him she was scared and that`s when he says he looked outside and saw the car
driving out of the apartment complex.
The investigation went on. The boyfriend actually admitted to police, he left the children in the car to do cocaine and since then police have found
a lot of holes in his story. The same night Lonzie went missing, Ebron was arrested and charged with two counts of felony and child neglect. Right
now, police no longer believe Lonzie was abducted by a stranger.
GRACE: With me as Christy Turner from WKOV there on the scene, in Jacksonville, also joining me Meredyth Censullo, Investigative Reporter.
So, let me understand this, Meredyth, the father admits he leaves the little boy and the 5-year old sister out in the car so he goes in and does
a hit of coke?
MEREDYTH CENSULLO, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: So, this is actually the mother`s boyfriend who was watching the children. The mom is separated
from her husband, the biological father. So, the boyfriend was watching the children. She needed to be picked up at work just after 2:00 in the
morning. So that`s when he says he put the children in the car, went back inside, later admitted he was inside doing coke.
GRACE: Oh, coke.
CENSULLO: Yeah.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With a helicopter overhead, dozens of police officers looked for a toddler Lonzie Barton.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have bloodhound`s marker X the division State of Florida is in partnered up with us to search for this child.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police found that car abandoned and running about eight blocks away. The toddler wasn`t there.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m really worried for him.
GRACE: Where is toddler boy Lonzie? Straight back out to Meredyth Censullo, Investigative Reporter, and Christy Turner WKOV on the scene also
with me, Marc Klaas, President and Founder of KlaasKids Foundation.
Meredyth Censullo, let me understand this. So the father says he leaves the 5-year-old girl and the toddler boy, Lonzie, out in the car. He comes
in to do a hit of cocaine. He says he goes back out and I don`t know how you can miss this car. It`s an orange Honda Civic with a black line at the
middle, stripe at the middle. He says the car is gone. He calls 911. They arrive about a minute and a half later and where do they find the car
or do they find the car?
CENSULLO: So it was actually the woman`s boyfriend who was watching the children not their dad it was the boyfriend.
GRACE: Thank you.
CENSULLO: They did locate the car just about eight blocks away. They found the car literally 15 minutes after they arrived on scene.
GRACE: And how quickly, Christy Turner, WKOV after the 911 call, after the boyfriend calls, how quickly did the police get there?
TURNER: It took them about a minute and a half to get to the scene.
GRACE: OK. So, Christy Turner, that would mean they get there in a minute and a half and they find the car just a few blocks away, correct, and the
baby is gone?
TURNER: That`s correct when they got there the child was no longer inside of the vehicle.
GRACE: OK. Marc Klaas is joining me right now, President and Founder of KlaasKids Foundation. What the police need to be doing right now, Marc
Klaas?
MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER OF KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: Well, the police are doing everything they should. The Amber Alert is active
everybody in the State of Florida and probably in the country knows about this right now. And they are focusing their attention where it needs to be
focused, on this boyfriend who has been caught lying multiple times. He is the key to this.
You know, Nancy, you should never plan a crime when you`re high on cocaine. If you`re going to hide a car, hide the car. You don`t put on some place
where law enforcement is going to be able to find it immediately.
GRACE: Did Dr. Charles Sophy, psychiatrist with the L.A. County Department of Children and Family Services, author of "Side by Side". Dr. Sophy, does
leaving the children alone in the car itself is a reason for an arrest. Is that right, Dr. Sophy?
CHARLES SOPHY M.D, PSYCHIATRIST: 100 percent. It`s 100 percent right, never leave a child unattended in a car, absolutely.
GRACE: But he wants to go in and do a hit of crack, right? You would agree with that?
SOPHY: Yeah, 100 percent more, totally. This child was unattended to and there are no answers and you have to get these answers it`s a crime.
GRACE: You know, another thing I didn`t understand, Meredyth Censullo, Investigative Reporter, the little 5-year-old sister, the big sister, comes
in and tells the boyfriend I`m scared. What does he say she was afraid of?
CENSULLO: She -- he said she was afraid of being outside in the car at night. It was 2:00 in the morning.
GRACE: Good lord, 2:00 A.M., Meredyth Censullo? He leaves the children at 2:00 A.M. So he can go in -- unleash the lawyers, Troy Slaten and Robert
Schalk, first to you Slaten.
So boyfriend goes in to get high on cocaine, do a line of coke while the baby and a 5-year-old big sister is in the car?
SLATEN: You know, addictions are a terrible thing and when somebody is under the influence of drugs, they`re not in their right mind and they`re
not acting rationally.
But, you know, there needs to be better evidence that this is exactly what happened. I mean who isn`t that actually saw him go in and do these drugs
and although he will be in charge...
GRACE: But what are you trying to defend him from doing the drug? He`s already admitted to that.
SLATEN: He`s not. He has not been charged with any abduction.
GRACE: Well, are you trying to say that your concern is maybe he didn`t do drugs? I`m worried about finding the baby.
SLATEN: Obviously. But, you know...
GRACE: he can work out his addiction problems later, preferably behind bars.
SLATEN: We convict him of kidnapping and abduction, you know, we need to make sure that we`re concentrating on the right guy here.
GRACE: Robert Schalk, I`m trying to establish -- this guy leaves the children in the car at best, at best, Schalk, this guy leaves the children
in the car so he can go in -- I don`t know what Troy Slaten is talking out of his mind. This guy has already said he`s the one that told us he was
inside doing coke, all right. The police didn`t make that up. He said that.
So at the very best, he leaves the child in the car so he can do coke. Now, the child is gone and they can`t find him. Even if he had nothing to
do with the child`s disappearance, I think he should be charged with a felony and go to jail on a felony.
SCHALK: Well, I mean, with regards to what his sentence should be. I mean, he was rightfully charged with a felony it was neglect but as Troy
said he has a drug problem but we don`t know whether he a prior criminal history. We don`t know what to mend to his sentencing guidelines would be
for this charged. So there`s a lot we don`t know at this point in time but his rightfully charged, his lawyer is defending the case properly. This
could be a probation or (inaudible). We don`t know yet.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLAND: You`re about to break my wrist. Stop.
OFFICER: Stop moving.
BLAND: You are (inaudible).
OFFICER: Stop moving.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: The mysterious death of 28-year-old Sandra Bland. Bland found dead in a Texas jail cell after a controversial arrest, after we dig up jail
booking documents and Bland`s voicemail from behind jailhouse walls tonight. Supporters still insisting Bland was murdered hung to death. And
what`s more? They are convinced her mug shot was taken after she`s dead, claims of a coverup.
Straight out to Carmen Watkins, Host of Point of View, KJOZ, joining us there in Houston.
Carmen, thank you for being with us. Supporters insisting that she was murdered, she did not hang herself. And also, theories that this mug shot
was actually taken postmortem, after her death. But first Carmen, I want you to see in her controversial arrest.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OFFICER: Do you mind putting out your cigarette, please if you don`t mind?
BLAND: I`m in my car, why do I have to put out my cigarette.
OFFICER: Well, you can step on out now.
BLAND: I don`t have to step out of my car.
OFFICER: Step out of the car.
BLAND: Why am I?
OFFICER: Step out of the car.
BLAND: No. You don`t have the right.
OFFICER: Step out of the car.
BLAND: You don`t have the right to do that.
OFFICER: I do have the right. Now, step out or I will remove you.
BLAND: I refuse to talk to you other than to identify myself.
OFFICER: Step out or I will remove you.
BLAND: I am getting removed for a failure to signal?
OFFICER: Step out or I will remove you. I`m giving you a lawful order. Get out of the car now or I`m going to remove you.
BLAND: Then I`m calling my lawyer.
OFFICER: I`m going to yank you out of here.
BLAND: OK. You`re going to yank me out of my car? OK.
OFFICER: Get out.
BLAND: All right. Let`s do this.
OFFICER: Yeah. We`re going to.
BLAND: Yeah. Don`t touch me.
OFFICER: Get out of the car.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: You are seeing the arrest of Sandra Bland, later found dead in her jail cell. Carmen Watkins, Host of Point of View, KJOZ, many people insist
still that she did not commit suicide, weigh in.
CARMEN WATKINS, HOST, "POINT OF VIEW," KJOZ 880 AM: You know what? Does even in seeing the video and hearing it again, it`s still infuriating to
me, and people want to start with that cigarette thing but actually those that she fight before, where he asked, how was your day. She said, "You
know, I don`t understand why I`m being stopped when I just moved over to get out of your way," and he got unnerved right at that moment.
And this is one of those movements that just escalated very fast, even the Director of the Department of Public Safety is saying, he acted out of line
for an officer and he should have given the ticket and walked away. In fact, he wanted to give her a warning, and if he wanted to get angry, he
could have given her a ticket and been on his way.
GRACE: With me also, in addition to Carmen Watkins there in Houston is, Reverend Dr. James Miller, Senior Pastor at DuPage AME Church. He knew
Sandra for 18 years.
Reverend, thank you for being with us, are you convinced she did not commit suicide?
REV. DR. JAMES MILLER, KNOWS SANDRA BLAND FOR 18 YEARS: Well, Sandra I knew would not have committed suicide. And I don`t know whether she was
even in that cell. We have no video of her in the jail at all. It`s just so many questions and misbelieved and you showed the arrest but he also
filed a false report, there was no physical -- any part on her part.
The only -- the first physical was when that brutal arm twist and she screamed and then you have the activity that you heard. So that
happened...
GRACE: You know what, Dr. Miller? Reverend Miller with us, let`s take a look at that jailhouse video that he`s talking to. There you go. There it
is. Look at this, but as the Reverend is saying, do you ever actually see Sandra Bland? Now, an issue has been made Reverend Miller that she is
supposed to be checked on every 60 minutes, and that did not happen. But that aside, do you believe that she committed suicide?
MILLER: Well, here`s the question I have. If that arrest was illegal, is there any criminal liability that the officer might have because of her
death. She died in the custody of authority, and they had some responsibility.
GRACE: You know, Dr. William Marrone, Forensic Pathologist joining me out of Madison Heights. Dr. Marrone, you have reviewed the -- oh my goodness.
OK. Look, here is what we`re talking about, that trash bag is what she allegedly hung herself with. Now, when I was prosecuting, we would leave
nothing in the jail cell, Dr. Marrone, not even shoelaces that could be used to tie together and hang yourself or hang somebody else was the real
fear.
Dr. Marone, as far as the claims that her mug shot was taken after her death, could I see the mug shot please? How could you arrange someone`s
irises to look directly at the camera postmortem? I think that`s impossible.
MARRONE, I do think that that`s impossible also and I agree with you. There`s a lot of stuff here that needs to be investigated but that`s
probably number one.
GRACE: Everyone, the mystery goes on but let`s stop and remember, American hero Navy Petty Officer Gary Rovinski, Roseville, Illinois Purple Heart
Iraq campaign medal, Gulf War veteran, a man of service who found meaning in everything he did. Mother, Carmella, daughter Cecilia and Michaela,
widow Jennifer. Gary Rovinski, American hero.
I`ll see you tomorrow night in 8:00 sharp Eastern and until then, good night, friend.
