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Nancy Grace
Deputy Slams Schoolgirl to Floor/Woman Dead After Jennifer Aniston Wedding. Aired 8-8:30p ET
Aired October 27, 2015 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news now. Live, Spring Valley High, Columbia. Brutal video shows a school girl slammed to the floor, attacked
by the school resource officer. Bombshell now. The bully with the badge caught on video.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A student`s arrest in South Carolina has caught a lot of attention.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you going to come with me, or am I going to make you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Ben Fields is seen trying to remove a female student from class, and suddenly, he flips her over in her desk and drags
her to the front of the classroom.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And live, Jennifer Aniston`s star-studded honeymoon turns tragedy when a gorgeous young guest found dead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Vanished, her body found washed up on the beach. Assistant to famed Hollywood producer Joe Silver, Carmel was on vacation
with Silver and his family, who were among the celebrities invited to join Jennifer Aniston and Justin Theroux on their honeymoon.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That cellphone video posted to Facebook, Twitter and YouTube.
And live, Palmetto, a 1,300-pound prize show horse, a championship jumping horse with a shiny chestnut coat named (INAUDIBLE) stolen in the
night from his private stall and butchered, sources say slaughtered and butchered for his meat, only his head and neck left intact. In America! A
prize show horse worth tens of thousands of dollars butchered for horse meat?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A long, lonely path to a savage death, where a trusting horse was led from the safety of his warm stall, lured into the
cruelest kind of torture.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This was an outright murder!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And live, Portland. A trusted baby-sitter hired through the popular Care.com sitter site, all things baby, accused of child sex abuse?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Investigators say that Nelson (ph) registered himself on the Web site called Care.com.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When it was time to find a new baby-sitter, I had some requirements.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Court records show that Care.com identified Nelson as, quote, "a safe person who parents could be trust to care for their
children."
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Get access to background checks and more.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That was Care.com commercials from YouTube.
And live, roommates binge watching the Netflix hit series, AMC`s "The Walking Dead," when one becomes convinced the other`s a real-life zombie
and allegedly commits brutal murder.
Hello. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell right now. Live to Spring Valley High, Columbia. Brutal video shows a school girl slammed to the floor, attacked by the school
resource officer -- it`s law enforcement -- the bully with the badge caught on video.
Straight out to Gary David, morning show host, WVOC, joining us from Columbia. Gary, what happened?
GARY DAVID, WVOC (via telephone): Well, that`s a great question, Nancy. We`re all trying to figure out ourselves exactly what happened.
What we do know is yesterday morning (INAUDIBLE) vary from some say yesterday morning about 10:30, other accounts say it was yesterday
afternoon. But from what we can tell so far, is we had a student at Spring Valley High School who the teacher said was being disruptive in class. Two
stories there, one that the student...
GRACE: Oh! Whoa, whoa, whoa, wait, wait! Gary David, morning show host, WVOC -- you`re seeing cell video of the incident posted on Facebook
and Twitter -- hold on. Stop everything.
Liz, can you start this at the beginning, please? This is law enforcement. This is a cop. OK, hold on. Are we at the beginning? No,
we`re not. Hold on. We`re going to scroll...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (EXPLETIVE DELETED) Put your hands behind your back. Give me your hands.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: OK. That`s not the end of it. He continues dragging her. Look! What? Good Lord in heaven! This is a school girl, for Pete`s sake!
This is not a dope dealer off on the side of the street. This is not a 19- year-old brandishing a gun or a knife! What in the -- what -- oh, my -- oh, my stars! He slammed her!
[20:05:12]Everybody, you are seeing video from YouTube and Twitter, cell phone video posted -- oh! You know what? I would not have believed
it if somebody had not videotaped it.
Gary David, I`m sorry for interrupting, but just...
DAVID: It`s OK.
GRACE: ... looking at this video is -- you know what? You know what? This is why we have vigilante justice. This is why, because if I saw some
grown man pick up my child like this and throw my child to the floor and drag them out -- oh, yes, Mommy would be looking for vigilante justice, let
me tell you that, Gary, right now.
Now, at first, when I heard about it, Gary David, I thought, Well, you know what? If the student didn`t do what she was told, she deserves to be
taken out of the room and taken to the principal`s office. Gary, I didn`t know that involved slamming her to the floor.
Start at the beginning, Gary David. Go ahead.
DAVID: OK. Well, Nancy, as best as we can tell, there are two stories that came out of this. The first one was that the student had
taken a cellphone out. And this -- these accounts coming from students in the classroom now who videotaped the incident, one student saying she had
taken her cellphone out, the teacher asked her to put it, up and only had it out for a second or two, she says.
Another account of another student in the classroom -- matter of fact, an 18-year-old who was also arrested for disturbing the classroom yesterday
-- said that, basically, the young girl was not participating in class, and the teacher was writing her up.
GRACE: Wait, wait, wait, wait! All this is because somebody was not participating in class?
DAVID: (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: You`re kidding! My brother did not participate in class from K to 12. He only got interested in college, for Pete`s sake. He had more
Fs than anybody on the whole street. Nobody ever threw him on the floor like that. I mean, not participating in class? Are you kidding me?
DAVID: Well, that`s one of the accounts. But the account that seems to be the more accurate is that the cellphone was taken out. Now, how it
goes from there, we don`t know. We do know that from what we`re told, the teacher made some demands of the girl, was writing her up, and then asked
her to leave the classroom. She refused.
Again, what we`re told -- we don`t have all the details quite yet. Then a vice principal, administrator, was called into the classroom, had
the same requests of the student. Again, the student refused, we`re told.
And at that time, the school resource officer, Deputy Fields, was called in. And the video (INAUDIBLE) about at least three of them going
around right now, that you may have seen, all shot from different angles, but all basically pick up from the time that the officer walks over to the
desk. It`s hard to say what he is saying to her, but at that point in time, things seem to be fairly calm.
And then all of a sudden, what precipitates what you see now on the rest of the tape (INAUDIBLE) something was said, or what have you,
something snapped, and well, you`ve seen the result of it there.
GRACE: Good gravy! Rita Cosby, investigative journalist, WABC host, also joining us. You know, Rita, if one of my children refused to do what
the teacher told them and then refused to do what the principal told them, I would expect them if they had been to be lifted up by the armpits, OK,
I`m not angry yet -- not that they would ever do that, of course.
But this goes way, way past that. You do not throw a school girl face down on the ground like this by an adult male officer like that. N-O!
What happened, Rita? What do we know?
RITA COSBY, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALIST: It is incredible. And apparently, the officer is heard on tape, You`re coming with me, or I`ll
make you. And then when another student tried to intervene, Nancy, he said, Look, I`ll put you in jail, too.
And as you can see, he uses his forearm, apparently, around the student`s neck, then drags the student by both arms and a leg to the front
of class and then says...
GRACE: Wait a minute! Wait a minute!
COSBY: ... Put your hands your back like you`re a felon.
GRACE: Matthew Horrace, senior vice president, FJC Security, law enforcement expert -- Matthew, we just went through this. We just went
through this in New York. You do not do a chokehold around the neck even on a grown man, much less a school girl.
MATTHEW HORRACE, LAW ENFORCEMENT AND SECURITY EXPERT: Clearly...
GRACE: No!
HORRACE: Well, clearly, we don`t do a chokehold, Nancy. But there are a number of things that we don`t know about this case. The bottom line
is you`re absolutely right. Normally, you wouldn`t -- you wouldn`t expect someone to walk in and pick someone up out of the chair.
But remember, the teacher tried, the vice president tried, and now police were enacted (ph) to come in with police authority. He gave lawful
commands. She didn`t respond to those commands. He got her out of that chair and got her handcuffed within 60 seconds. And she was not injured,
as hard as it is for us to watch this.
[20:10:08]GRACE: OK. You know, here`s my feeling about that, Matthew Horrace. I hear you. What you say here makes perfect sense.
But this is what I know. If it doesn`t feel right, it`s not right. If you cringe when you watch it, it shouldn`t be happening. If you feel
anger and distress watching it, then it`s wrong. And I don`t care what the handbook says. Don`t care. This is wrong, all right?
Unleash the lawyers, Danny Cevallos, defense attorney and CNN legal analyst, Troy Slaten, defense attorney out of LA.
First to you, Slaten.
TROY SLATEN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, the video looks bad, but the officer was absolutely within his rights. You know, when you`re dealing
with somebody and they don`t respond, whether they`re a student or an adult, the officer is allowed to use force to make the person comply. And
that`s exactly what the officer did here.
Nobody was injured. She failed to respond to his lawful command, and that girl, unfortunately, got what was coming to her at that moment.
GRACE: You know what, Troy Slaten? Were you ever spanked in school?
SLATEN: No, I wasn`t spanked in school.
GRACE: Oh, OK.
SLATEN: But I also listened.
GRACE: But...
SLATEN: When a principal...
GRACE: But it`s OK for her...
SLATEN: ... or a police officer or anyone said to do something...
GRACE: ... to get her...
(CROSSTALK)
SLATEN: ... I would do it.
GRACE: Look, you know what, Cevallos? You guys are putting me in the very bad position that I don`t like of arguing about what the cops are
doing. But both of you can sit there and preach at me for the whole hour, and I still know that video was wrong, OK?
Let`s hear your defense, Cevallos.
DANNY CEVALLOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, Nancy, you know, you were a prosecutor. You surely did a rotation in the juvenile unit. You have to
know that -- why are we all shocked? Juveniles get arrested all of the time.
GRACE: Those were criminals!
CEVALLOS: And most of the time...
GRACE: Uh-uh. No!
CEVALLOS: ... they get arrested in schools.
GRACE: Uh-uh-uh-uh-uh-uh! These -- those were criminals.
CEVALLOS: Ah, good point. Let me...
GRACE: Put him up, please.
CEVALLOS: ... respond to that. Let me respond to that. We...
GRACE: Those were -- no, I`m not through. Hold on.
CEVALLOS: OK.
GRACE: Criminals, for instance, that had guns, knives, brass knuckles, heroin, cocaine, crack -- at school...
CEVALLOS: I know. Good point.
GRACE: ... selling it, murderers. That was who was in juvenile hall...
CEVALLOS: So then...
GRACE: ... in Center City, Atlanta. This girl was not participating in class.
CEVALLOS: Quite the opposite, Nancy. She has been charged with a misdemeanor. And you agree...
GRACE: And that misdemeanor is what?
CEVALLOS: ... that a misdemeanor warrants -- disrupting class -- disrupting the classroom is a misdemeanor under South Carolina law.
GRACE: It wasn`t disrupted until she got smashed on the ground, Cevallos.
CEVALLOS: Nancy, are you saying...
GRACE: All that she originally did...
CEVALLOS: ... that she did no disrupting until the officer came?
GRACE: You know what? Let`s find out. Let`s find out. Gary David joining me, morning show host with WVOC, what was her initial charge?
DAVID: It is a disruption of the classroom. Both she and another female student were removed, were cuffed, were charged (INAUDIBLE) that,
disrupting the classroom.
GRACE: Now, hold on. Wait a minute, Gary David, WVOC. Rita Cosby, he`s right. They both have now been charged. The two girls have now been
charged. But the disruption came after this incident. It all started when the one girl would not participate and got a beatdown from a cop, and the
other girl was trying to take up for her. That`s my understanding of the facts.
Did I miss something, Rita?
COSBY: No, that is the case. And also, according to some students -- and again, we have to couch this. Some students are saying when the
administrator came before the cop came in, the student said, I`m so sorry, I was only on the phone for a little bit of time. I apologize.
Again, she didn`t respond when the cop came. But she was saying, Look, I`m really sorry, at first.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:18:19]GRACE: Jennifer Aniston`s star-studded wedding turns tragedy when a gorgeous young guest found dead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Carmel reportedly was swimming alone in the ocean when she vanished, her body found washed up on the beach hours later. The
family of Carmel Musgrove believes her death was foul play.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight out to Alan Duke, editor-in-chief of Leadstories.com. I mean, we`ve been waiting on this wedding and this honeymoon for what, how
many years has it been, Jennifer Aniston finally marries after the whole Brad Pitt-Angelina Jolie debacle?
And then this, a guest after the wedding? Everybody takes off to Bora Bora for the honeymoon. It`s kind of like a group party. And a guest is
found dead now? Her family is insisting on an autopsy, an investigation, claiming they think there`s foul play?
Alan, what happened?
ALAN DUKE, LEADSTORIES.COM: Well, this young lady was having dinner one evening in Bora Bora, this incredible place, the Four Seasons Hotel,
having dinner with friends. And then she wasn`t feeling so well. She says she was going back to her bungalow. And then had a few more drinks with
friends. And then at about midnight is the last time she was seen by room service.
Now, keep in mind, these bungalows are above the water in the lagoon. It was the next day they couldn`t find her, and they started to search.
They found her naked body in the lagoon several hours later.
GRACE: Uh-uh. Uh-uh. No. I agree with the family. Something is not right.
[20:20:00]For those of you just joining us, you know, the public has been waiting for years for the star-studded wedding of Jennifer Aniston.
She finally gets past the whole Brad Pitt debacle and marries her love, Justin Theroux. And now it all turns to tragedy when a young woman is
found dead, floating naked, I think, in the ocean.
This is what doesn`t make sense to me, Alan Duke. So the young lady, Carmel Musgrove, is there at the festivities following the Aniston wedding.
She goes to dinner, has a couple of drinks, goes back to her room. She has room service around midnight.
Now, it doesn`t sound right to me that a woman suddenly says, You know what? It`s about 1:00 AM, I`m going to strip down naked and go swimming in
the ocean all by myself.
I`d like to find this out, Alan Duke. Did she order room service for one or for two? Was anyone else in the room when room service was
delivered? Where were her clothes? Were they there on the beach? Did they wash up, as well?
What happened? Were there any marks on her body? Were there any bruises, ligature marks, any blood, any cuts, any abrasions? I mean, what
can you tell me about the condition of her body, Alan?
DUKE: Well, the autopsy that was done a few days later found no signs of any violence or injury. Of course, we don`t know that that means
anything definitive other than that there were no signs when her body was checked. Toxicology reports...
GRACE: You know what? Hold on, Alan.
DUKE: Yes?
GRACE: I`m going to go to Joseph Scott Morgan, certified death investigator, professor of forensics joining us. Joe Scott, thank you for
being with us, out of Jacksonville State University.
Joe Scott, question. If a person is drowned on purpose, it`s murder, there would be no way for the medical examiner to determine, did they drown
by accident or did they drown by murder. Is that right? Or do you have an idea -- unless there is bruising around the neck or the body to suggest
they were held down.
I recall in the Andrea Yates case, where she killed all of her children, that there were bruise marks on them where she held them under
water when they struggled to live. I guess that would be one indication. Any others?
JOSEPH SCOTT MORGAN, CERTIFIED DEATH INVESTIGATOR: Yes. Thanks for having me, Nancy. I think in this case, what is going to be significant
is, what are the findings at the initial autopsy relative to points of restraint, where the individual would have been held beneath the surface of
the water?
She would have been fighting if she were, in fact -- if this was a homicidal event, you would have bruising in order to try to control her,
keep her. You know, nobody is going to go of their own volition and allow somebody to drown them. That`s going to be key.
GRACE: Right.
MORGAN: And that`s what Dr. Baden`s going to be looking for in this second autopsy.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:26:58]UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... vanished, her body found washed up on the beach. Assistant to famed Hollywood producer Joe Silver, Carmel on
vacation with Silver and his family, who were among the celebrities invited to join Jennifer Aniston and Justin Theroux on their honeymoon.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: After Jennifer Aniston marries her long-time love, Justin Theroux, it turns tragic when a young guest is found dead. Now we learn
her family has brought in a superstar medical examiner. We all know Dr. Michael Baden. Michael Baden has been the medical examiner called in on a
string of high-profile cases -- Michael Brown, for the defense of O.J. Simpson, the defense of Phil Spector, President Kennedy, Martin Luther
King, Belushi, Kathleen Savio in the Peterson case -- the list goes on and on.
And now the family of this young girl has been called in to determine whether her death was an accident or was it foul play? All of this on the
heels of Jennifer Aniston`s wedding and honeymoon.
Alan Duke, what more can you tell us? Why has the family called in Dr. Michael Baden? When you see a gunslinger like him coming in, you know
there`s a problem.
DUKE: Well, really, I think that they want to get their own opinion, because this is Bora Bora. Now, it is part of the French government, and
so it is not exactly third world. But they want to have the assurance. It reminds me so much of when Dr. Baden was called in to investigate the death
of David Carradine five years ago in Bangkok.
GRACE: That`s right.
DUKE: They wanted answers, and they didn`t want to depend on a foreign government.
GRACE: Well, that was certainly unusual circumstance of death, as I recall, David Carradine.
So this is what we believe to be the scene. The festivities were at the Four Seasons. We believe she was staying there -- waiting to confirm
that. But she is found not in this room, not out on her luxury patio, not there at the Four Seasons, but out naked in the water, last seen around
midnight ordering room service in her own room.
So how does she end up naked in the water past midnight, Rita Cosby?
COSBY: By the way, Nancy, I`ve been to that Four Seasons there in Bora Bora, and those bungalows are really close to each other. We don`t
know now if anybody heard anything, heard any noises. And also, just to give you some context of who this woman was -- she was an intern for Joel
Silver, Joel Silver from "Matrix" fame, "Lethal Weapon," huge films...
GRACE: Right.
COSBY: ... and then became an assistant, very beloved, apparently very smart, very sharp -- totally out of character.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:34:00]
GRACE: Live, Palmetto, where a 1,300 pound prize show horse, a championship jumping horse with a shiny chestnut coat, absolutely
beautiful, named Phedras de Blondel, stolen in the night from his private stall and butchered. This is here in America. Sources say this show horse
slaughtered and butchered for his meat. Only his head and neck left intact. Here in America. In Florida. A prize horse worth tens of
thousands of dollars for horse meat?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Blood lines, the area after getting stabbed in the ribs, he had just arrived at Centennial farms.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One of these criminals would turn in the other for that kind of money.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Okay, I am sick about this story. Take a look. This is a prize-winning jumping horse. A champion.
[20:35:00]
This is from Youtube. Video of the horse. A beloved show horse. A champion. Phedras de Blondel. Not that his life is worth anymore than
another pet`s life. But look at the beauty of this animal! Look at it! Working so closely with a human. Taking that human to a giant trophy, a
money prize, fame and fortune. This beautiful show horse was stolen, stolen out of his private stall and butchered. Since I first started
studying this story, I have learned that horses are often butchered alive. I did not know that. And to look at this gorgeous creature and know
someone snuck onto the grounds of this exclusive horse farm, goes into his private stall and takes the horse. Matt Zarrell, what happened?
ZARRELL: So just before 7:00 a.m., the horse owner arrived to the horse barn to check on paperwork and prepare for the day`s lessons when
they noticed that the barn had been tampered with, and that the horse in question was nowhere to be found. So they search around for about a half
hour and they discover the body found lying partly against the fence and ground. The head and neck were intact, but the legs from gone from the
shoulders, and the cuts in the torso were smooth and deliberate. They believe this was carried out by an expert butcher specifically for the
meat.
GRACE: I can hardly take it in. With me now out of Ft. Lauderdale, Don Anthony, communication director at Animal Rights Foundation of Florida.
Don, I don`t know where this is hitting me so hard. I hate animal cruelty. You know, my -- all my years prosecuting, I represented so many helpless
children and women. Who is even more helpless, animals. Explain to me the black market for horse meat. I had no idea this even existed, Don.
DON ANTHONY, ANIMALS RIGHTS FOUNDATION: Yes, unfortunately, it`s all too common. We`ve got a long list of horses found slaughtered all over
Dain, Broward, Palm Beach county in Florida. This happened in a small town just south of Tampa. It happens all over the state. It`s another
embarrassment that Florida has to deal with. Horse meat is sold on the black market, it`s used in exotic dishes, Caribbean, European dishes, by
people willing to pay top dollar. To eat the carcasses of these wonderful, majestic animals.
The stealing is done by thieves that are very good at breaking into a stable, removing docile animals that are used to being around humans, and
carving them up quickly before they can be discovered, sometimes right there at the scene. It is always brutal, it`s painful, it`s barbaric, and
it takes a long time for the animal to finally die. Horses are rarely killed quickly and usually are butchered while still alive. And that`s
what they think was the case here.
GRACE: Don Anthony, Communications director at Animal Rights Foundation of Florida, here`s another thought. This was at Imperial Farms,
a very exclusive horse farm. If you`re going to butcher a horse for their meat, does it seem a little beyond the pale to go into fancy, exclusive
stables like this to get that horse? It seems like it would be easier to break into a farm, and get a workhorse, not a show horse.
ANTHONY: It`s abhorrent to most people because this horse cost a lot of money, he`s an award winner, he`s a prize horse, he had a name, he`s
somebody`s pet. But all animals suffer the same way. They all feel the same, they all feel terror.
GRACE: Don, Don, I get it.
ANTHONY: They all feel the exact same way.
GRACE: I`m not saying this animal`s life was more or less important than another animal`s. I`m thinking how do I catch a criminal. That`s how
I`m programmed. That`s how I`m wired. So what I`m saying is, why would somebody sneak onto Imperial Farms, which is an exclusive horse stable,
where they teach lessons. Why get a show horse, for Pete`s sake? You`ve got a horse worth multimillions of dollars, that`s going to bring in money
over time. Why would you do that for the horse meat?
ANTHONY: They are thinking in this case, because this horse was such a big horse, and it could -- with one theft, they could get a lot of pounds
of meat and sell it on the black market.
GRACE: For what? Why not go to the grocery store and get ground round? Why do you have to kill a horse? A championship jumper? For what?
What`s -- what -- why do you want horse meat?
[20:40:00]
ANTHONY: Well, they do it the same way with a lot of other horses. Like I said, we`ve got a long list of horses that were found slaughtered
all over the state. There was a Miami Herald article that said the black market for horse meat has claimed another horse, with the tally now up to
22 horses that had been tortured and butchered in South Florida since March. That report came out in December of 2009. So within eight months,
22 horses had been butchered and tortured exactly that way, whether they were prize winners or they were just found -- just average stables.
GRACE: Don -- please help me. Who wants to eat horse meat in Florida? I mean, who? This is a pretty exclusive enclave? Who wants to
eat horse meat?
ANTHONY: Yes, I don`t know. I don`t eat any animals, because I know that it`s just as bad in legal slaughterhouses as it is in illegal
slaughterhouses for cows and pigs and chickens and other animals.
GRACE: Okay, hold on. Matt Zarrell is breaking in. Matt, what do you know? Why are horses on the black market? Horse meat? That`s not
even allowed in the U.S.
ZARRELL: No, it is not allowed in the U.S. It`s illegal to slaughter horses for meat in Florida or anywhere in the country. It is not monitored
by the FDA. But one thing I want to talk about is a couple of myths associated with horse meat, one, it`s an aphrodisiac.
GRACE: Slow down. Matt Zarrell, did you say horse meat is an aphrodisiac? Did I hear that come from your mouth?
ZARRELL: It`s a myth out there, yes.
GRACE: I don`t believe that horse meat is an aphrodisiac. The thought of it makes me sick. Tell me why it`s on the black market.
ZARRELL: The big reason is money. There are a lot of reports out there, including that the average size horse could yield $16,000 in horse
meat alone from one horse.
GRACE: Oh. Okay. 866-634-8477. 866-634-8477 is the tip line, there is a $30,000 reward.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:46:00]
GRACE: Live, portland. A trusted babysitter hired through the popular care.com sitter site. It`s all things baby. Accused of child sex
abuse.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Need someone to keep an eye on the kids?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nelson registered himself on the website called care.com. He was already in trouble with the law for having sexual contact
with two young boys he was reportedly babysitting. The web site says it does offer background checks for people who register on the website.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Search lots of profiles. Plus get access to background checks and more.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That video of care.com commercials from Youtube. Straight out to Craig Fronek, host of Sunrise with Craig, KCMX. Thanks for being with
us. Craig, let me just start this off by saying, we have already covered several cases related to care.com. First, we did Sara Gumm. The parents
blamed babysitter Sara Gumm and care.com for their 3-month-old`s death. Charged with murder after cops said she negligently slammed or struck the
baby, she is awaiting trial. Justin Jefferson, convicted of sex assault of a young boy he was babysitting, hired through care.com. California nanny,
mother of twins says nanny allegedly abuses her children and caught it on tape. Says family used care.com to hire the nanny and she appeared to have
a clean background check. You know, Craig Fronek, just the other day, somebody said, oh, we got our babysitter from care.com, I`m like, what
happened this time?
CRAIG FRONEK, HOST, SUNRISE WITH CRAIG: Well, Nancy, thanks for having me on. This is another case of this 27-year-old, no prior criminal
record, gets on to care.com, puts on his application, and some parents obviously employed him. I will tell you, I`ve been on the care.com
website. And at the very bottom of the website, there`s two little words called safety center. And when you click on safety center, it has all the
background checks, the safety guide, the safety resources. So bottom line is, parents are doing their due diligence, and this scumbag got through the
checkpoints, and he has admitted to the crime.
GRACE: Whoa! You know, I want to go to Dr. Charles Sophy, psychiatrist, with the L.A. County Department of Children and Family
Services. He`s an author of "Side by Side." Dr. Sophie, thanks for being with us. This is my concern about this whole scenario. A, I know he
doesn`t have a record, or I`ve been told he doesn`t have a record. I don`t know if that extends to his juvenile possible record or not. But it`s
interesting to me he goes so far not to just molest children, but to use care.com to get at children. That took a lot of thinking, right?
SOPHY: Absolutely. It is very premeditated by just the fact that he went on to that website. Very premeditated. This boy -- this guy is after
boys, he`s after children, he needs to be locked up.
GRACE: You know, you`re seeing a care.com commercial from Youtube. Liz, let me know when you can cue one up so we can hear it in its entirety.
So Craig Fronek, "Sunrise with Craig," KCMX, how did he get in the position of being able to molest the children?
FRONEK: Well, obviously got the duty of babysitting, and he was charged -- I mean, he started in June of 2014, baby-sat these 12-year-olds,
and finally when he did the third child, got busted with them in May of 2015.
[20:50:00]
That`s when all you know, everything came down. He was caught. Grand jury charged him with five counts of first degree sodomy, six counts of
first degree sexual abuse. It`s just crazy.
GRACE: Let`s see the care.com commercial. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right, Monkey, what kind of sitter? Someone fun?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Was that a big bubble?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How about this one?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All set.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What is this for?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Better get dressed.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Plan your next date night at care.com.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Okay, that video, care.com commercials, we got that off of Youtube. To Justin Freiman, what more do we know?
FREIMAN: In order to be on the care.com, what happens is people who want to use it, then people get background checks. These background checks
are different levels, and they`re paid for at different degrees. So he was able to slip through the system, because as he was saying, he didn`t have a
criminal record. So parents are letting this predator into their homes thinking it`s safe.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Danny Cevallos, New York, Troy Slaten, L.A. Okay, ultimately, I anticipate there will be a lawsuit against
care.com. He did not have a criminal record, Troy, so, how is is that going to shape up?
SLATEN: Well, this is a good lesson for parents to know that, you know, you really have to look at who`s going to be watching your kids, but
specifically, it`s the liability of care.com -- in order for the family to be successful in a lawsuit against them, they would have to show that
care.com was negligent, they fell below the standard of care. And here, they did everything that even a regular agency would do. They did a
background check. This person`s never been in trouble with the law before. So, it looks like care.com is probably going to be immune from any type of
lawsuit here.
GRACE: Agree or disagree, Danny?
CEVALLOS: If care.com didn`t do anything negligent, if they did everything reasonably within their power, it`s going to be difficult to
hold them liable. Look, companies like care.com are not absolute guarantors of all of our safety. They run a business and their obligation
is to do so reasonably, and if that business is to provide information, a court might look at it as a heightened standard, but still, if they did
everything reasonably within their power, then they may avoid liability.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:57:00]
GRACE: We go live. Roommates binge watching the Netflix hit series, "The Walking Dead," when one becomes convinced the other is a real-life
zombie, and allegedly commits a brutal murder.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Beat his victim with an electric guitar and a microwave, and stabbed him with a knife.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The suspect alleges his binge walking of "The Walking Dead" caused him to see his friend turn into a zombie.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That is video from "The Walking Dead" from AMC. A huge Netflix hit. To Eddie Aragon, talk show host, KIVA. Thank you for being
with us. I don`t understand so, so roommates are binge watching this. All right, "Walking Dead." And what happens? Why do they become convinced
each other are zombies?
ARAGON: Well, I`m not sure that they convinced each other, it was just one person was convinced he was a zombie. Not sure if they were
messing around or what happened. But here is what happened. Christopher Packens (ph), who is the deceased, started attacking Damon Perry, who is
the murderer, the alleged murderer now. Both are 23 years old. And Packins started attacking him by biting him. So then Perry decided to
respond, he starting beating him with his hands and feet, and he knocked him unconscious, and he used other items, that were named, a guitar,
microwave, kitchen knives.
GRACE: Oh, my stars. Eddie, hold on. Marena Martca is with us, who actually called 911. The suspect chased her with a knife. What happened?
MARENA MARTCA, CALLED 911: I was picking up my son, he was with his grandmother, and I, he came outside the building, and he started yelling,
don`t go in the building, something`s going on. And I told him, leave me alone, I`m going to my apartment. So I just ignored him, and he came to me
rushing towards me while I was carrying my son, and he had a knife or something in his hands, and he started chasing me up to my apartment. And
so, I pushed him, and he fell down the stairs, and I got into my apartment, and that`s when I called 911, and he was trying to get into my apartment.
GRACE: Okay, bottom line. He is behind bars now. Defendant Damon Perry. Zombie killing.
Let`s remember American hero, Army Private First Class Christopher Marion, 20. (inaudible), Missouri. Loved fishing. A memorial at his high
school in his honor. Parents Roy and Welma. Stepfather Walter. 15 siblings. Christopher Marion, American hero.
Drew up next with a special on race in America. Thanks to our guests, but especially you for being with us. Nancy Grace signing off for tonight.
I`ll see you tomorrow night. 8:00 sharp Eastern. Until then, good night.
END
