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Nancy Grace
More Body Parts Found in Seattle; Arlington Couple Missing. Aired 8- 9p ET
Aired April 18, 2016 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. A mom of three dips her toe back into the dating scene. It all ends in tragedy. She goes on an on-
line date to a Mariners game with a 37-year-old dream man. She`s found dead in a local recycling bin, her remains wrapped in plastic, quote,
"still fresh," bits of human flesh found in the mom`s own bathtub drain. What madman masquerades as normal on dating Web sites, then commits murder?
Tonight, did cops get the wrong guy? Claims there`s no forensic link between the on-line date and the mom, that he made no attempt to run. Just
going on a date does not a murder make. This as cops dismantling the dead mom`s bathroom plumbing.
Bombshell tonight. As we go to air, more remains, body parts of this missing mom just recovered by garbage guys -- not the police, not cadets,
not cadaver dogs, the garbage guys! Mom`s body parts in another residential dumpster near Mommy`s workplace. Is this an elaborate setup?
But by who?
At this hour, police combing through hundreds of hours of bus and light rail video to capture what could be the last images of the mom alive and
possibly with her killer. Tonight, we do the same.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:15:48]UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Another gruesome discovery.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sanitation workers found a receptacle that contained, by all accounts, is human remains.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Officers searching through this quiet neighborhood, looking for any evidence that could be tied to Lyne`s murder.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Investigators believe there are still more remains to find.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: A gorgeous young Arlington couple seemingly vanish off the face of the earth, leaving no trace behind, sheriffs begging for help. But
tonight, we learn a squatter near their ranch reportedly harassing the wife. Are they connected? Cops now fearing foul play after both their
SUVs found in a remote woodlands.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Based on evidence collected from the missing couple`s vehicles, detectives believe Patrick and Monique were murdered.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Inside their vehicles and their home, the sheriff says, deputies found evidence of murder.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: A "Baywatch" star, ABC`s "Dancing With the Stars" fan favorite, worth millions and still raking it in, now demands an end to his alimony
payments.
Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell tonight. A mom of three dips her toe back into the dating scene. It ends in tragedy. She goes on an on-line date to a Mariners game with a
37-year-old dream man. She is found dead in a local recycling bin, her remains wrapped in plastic, quote, "still fresh," bits of human flesh found
in Mommy`s own bathtub drain. Who would masquerade as normal on a dating Web site, then commit murder?
Now there are claims there is no forensic link between the on-line date and the mom, that this guy made no attempt to run, and that just because he
goes on a date does not make him a murderer. Cops right now dismantling the dead mom`s bathroom plumbing.
Bombshell tonight. Just as we go to air, more remains, body parts of the missing mom just recovered by garbage guys -- not the police, not cadaver
dogs, not police cadets, the garbage guys! Mom`s body parts in another residential dumpster near Mommy`s workplace.
What does this mean? There`s only two very bad alternatives. For those of you just joining us, as we go to air, more of mom`s body parts have just
been found not far from her workplace.
This means that either police failed to find the body parts the last time they searched -- how can you miss that, body parts, human body parts --
either they failed to find them, or since the last search, the body parts were deposited. That would mean the wrong guy might be behind bars. That
doesn`t make sense, either.
[20:05:00]Candace Trunzo joining me, senior news editor, Dailymail.com, it doesn`t make sense why they`re just finding more of the mom`s body parts.
Either A, police did a bad job or didn`t look the first time, or these body parts were dumped after the last police search.
So what`s the worst alternative, Pat -- I mean, Candace?
CANDACE TRUNZO, DAILYMAIL.COM (via telephone): Well, the worst alternative is that they don`t have the guy that actually dismembered, killed this
wonderful nurse with three young daughters. But police are pretty confident that they do have the right guy.
GRACE: Hold on, Candace. Hold on, Candace. We`re going straight to a police presser.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At approximately 9:45 this morning, sanitation workers, while collecting the receptacles, found a receptacle that contained what
appeared to be, and by all accounts is, human remains.
We`re going to continue on until, you know, we feel as comfortable, comfortable as we can that we`ve covered and exhausted as much of an area
as we can.
We`re going to be removing those vehicles to a secure location and doing an entire search of the contents of those vehicles.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Pat Lalama, managing editor, "Crime Watch Daily" -- Pat, not good. OK, I`m glad that we`re recovering more of the mom`s missing body parts.
We still haven`t ID`d exactly which body parts they are. But the two choices are police missed them the first time, or these body parts were
disposed of after the last search.
PAT LALAMA, "CRIME WATCH DAILY": Well, and when you look at how many days have transpired since the first discovery, which apparently was not that
far away, where they found the head, an arm and a foot -- and so now this location -- no one saw it before this. It makes you wonder if the killer
is playing some sort of crazy psychotic game, cat and mouse, with the cops.
GRACE: Question, Justin Freiman. How did cops actually find out about the remains? More of the mom`s body parts have been found.
JUSTIN FREIMAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Nancy, more human remains have just been found. They were located at a recycling center in Seattle. This is
the third time in the last 10 days that body parts have been found. And police are saying they do believe this is connected to the case.
GRACE: Justin, they`re in another residential dumpster? When I say dumpster, I mean like your hervy curvy (ph). You roll out in the mornings.
There`s, like, a recycling on, it may be green, and another one that may be blue. Those, that`s what they`re found in. The people -- the residents
roll them out to the street. Little do they know somebody`s going to come along and dump a woman`s dead body in it.
So how did cops find out about it this time?
FREIMAN: It was the sanitation workers. Once again, this is outside of somebody`s home. Garbage pickup is only about once a week. So sanitation
workers come around and they find this in the container and they notified the authorities.
GRACE: OK, this is bad. This is bad because either they didn`t find it the first time or they were just deposited there, which means the guy
behind bars could be the wrong guy.
But let`s follow that through because this guy was the last one with her, right, Candace Trunzo, that we know of? Candace Trunzo, Dailymail.com.
This guy takes her to a Mariners game. He says they go back to her house, or so he remembers. He claims he`s too drunk to remember anything. And
that`s really all we know right now, except he`s got a record in six states that she didn`t know about.
That`s all we know, right?
TRUNZO: That`s right. He was in jail for assault, aggravated robbery, felony theft. So unfortunately, you know, she didn`t do her homework when
she signed up to date on line. And this couple had been dating for about a month. After the game, he took her to a bar where his sister worked. And
then he said he got so drunk, he barely remembered if they had sex but...
GRACE: I wonder if the sister remembers them being there.
Unleash the lawyers, Kirby Clements, veteran trial lawyer, Atlanta, Robin Ficker, defense attorney out of Maryland.
Robin Ficker, I know that you two are going to jump all over this, but listen, I know you`re going to argue somebody else must have done it and
just dumped the second round of remains. I mean, what are we going to find tomorrow? So someone is dumping this mom`s remains in different trash
cans.
But I think it`s better to go with the route that the police missed it the first time because think it through, Ficker. That would be that this guy,
Charlton was with her all night, he leaves, and then within the space of about two hours, three hours, somebody gets in her house, kills her,
dismembers her, cleans the crime scene and begins dropping her body parts all over town.
[20:10:03]ROBIN FICKER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Forget this falsely accused baseball fan. I`ve been to chicken rendering, cattle rendering plants.
There`s lots of blood. There`s no blood tying him in to this crime at all. When you cut up a body, there`s lots of blood spatters. There`s blood all
over the place. Why haven`t the police zeroed in on that?
GRACE: You know what? You`re right about that, Ficker, the fact that this crime scene has got to be gruesome. And the crime scene at the mom`s house
is not gruesome. Why? Because people walked by her bathroom several times and did not even realize it was a crime scene until they looked into the
drain.
What would it take to dismember a human body? Look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When animals are commonly being butchered, the butcher, who`s a professional, knows precisely where to cut the bone. And they also
have the benefit of using a mechanical device, a mechanical saw in order to facilitate that.
In this particular case, we`re talking about a pruning saw or limb saw that`s used for the express purpose of trimming limbs. The thing about
this is that limbs are not near as dense as bone is. When you get into the matrix of the bone, particularly right here in the shaft, it`s very, very
difficult to cut.
Just as an example, we`re going to draw the saw across the shaft of the bone. And even under these controlled conditions, it`s very, very
difficult to do.
One of the other things that comes about is that you will have what are referred to as stop-starts. The individual doesn`t get started in quite
the particular angle, so they will readjust the bone or readjust the saw relative to the bone and begin to draw it across in multiple places.
For the police and for the forensic scientists, this is a great, great point to make because you`re going to have multiple evidences of tool marks
that`ll match up with the blade.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Another gruesome discovery.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Detectives believe it`s linked to the murder of Renton mother Ingrid Lyne.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A garbage collector found human remains on his route.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: By all accounts, it`s human remains.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Some of Lyne`s remains were found in a recycling bin. Investigators believe there are still more remains to find.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Is someone playing a horrible game with police? As we go air, we discover more of the missing mom of three`s remains have been found in
another trash can -- found by garbage guys, not by cadaver dogs, not by police cadets walking shoulder to shoulder, by the garbage guys!
Straight out to Candace Trunzo, senior news editor, Dailymail.com. Hey, Liz, show me the map, please. Show me the map of where this guy has been
because now -- look -- California, Idaho, Washington, Montana, Utah and Florida, with a very long swathe across the country. How did he get to
Florida? Did he leave a trail between Utah and Florida?
Candace, all the women that have gone missing, we have sifted through their photos. Look at these, who look similar. There are dozens and dozens of
unsolved homicides and missing women, unsolved until tonight, Candace Trunzo. Look how similar many of them are to Ingrid Lyne. You think
that`s just a coincidence, Candace?
TRUNZO: Well, it`s very hard to say. He did have another girlfriend, and she talked about him being a really mean drunk. I mean, he had some
problems with drinking, with crack cocaine. But she says he never assaulted her. So that was very, very interesting.
GRACE: OK, you know what? Take a look at the pictures we`re showing you, the search now expanding regarding unsolved homicides and missing women in
multiple jurisdictions. This as police combing through light rail and bus stop video.
Justin, explain why this is so incredible. We are doing the same tonight because we believe that there`s a very good chance the killer, the real
killer, could be caught on rapid transit video with the mom of three, Ingrid Lyne. Explain, Justin.
FREIMAN: That`s right, Nancy. Charlton`s not just -- he`s not just charged with her murder. He`s also charged for allegedly stealing her SUV,
which was found in an area of Seattle with a lot of public transportation. So there`s a good chance that whoever ditches her SUV has to get onto
public transportation. A lot of those hubs have a lot of cameras.
GRACE: You know, we also have a map -- there you go. Somewhere between the baseball stadium and her home, also where her car was dumped.
Interesting her car is dumped downtown, and this last deposit of her body parts is near where she works. Question -- is this some attempt at a
frame-up? What about it, Pat Lalama, "Crime Watch Daily"?
LALAMA: Well, because we have to -- you`re absolutely right. We have to look at -- try to figure out some sort of a timeline. How would this
person be able to cut up the body, take her car, get it downtown, get body parts in two different locations. It`s stunning, but it takes some
calculation if it`s one person doing the job.
GRACE: Unless the person is still at large, leaving the woman`s remains in different parts of the city.
Joining me right now, Harry Oakes out of Longview, owner of the International K-9 Search and Rescue. Harry, thank you for being with us.
What`s so disturbing K-9, cadaver dogs, didn`t find this. Why?
HARRY OAKES, INTERNATIONAL K-9 SEARCH AND RESCUE (via telephone): Yes, from what I read in the newspaper and seen on the news, I`m not sure that
they even used cadaver dogs.
GRACE: Why do you say that, Harry?
OAKES: Well, I`ve never -- you know, in the news, they`ve covered -- they had a lot of news coverage on this incident, as well as the missing couple
up there in Snohomish County. And -- but not once I have seen a report or any report of any kind of them using cadaver dogs in this search.
[20:20:15]GRACE: To Justin Freiman. How far away is this round of Mom`s remains from the last round discovered?
FREIMAN: Nancy, it`s just about two blocks away and about three blocks from where she worked.
GRACE: So the person would have to go from the scene at her home, then deposit the remains near her office, then the second set of remains. To
Harry Oakes with K-9 Search and Rescue there in Longview. Harry, would a cadaver dog be able to pick up a scent two blocks away?
OAKES: If the winds were coming from the direction of where the victim`s remains were, yes.
GRACE: Another issue, though, Harry. I mean, let`s follow through the logic. If the perp drops remains in one trash receptacle, then goes from
there to the next trash receptacle two blocks away, couldn`t the cadaver dogs follow that scent?
OAKES: I depends on how they were transported, and if they were sealed up tight in plastic bags, or if they were just put into cardboard boxes
openly. It just depends on...
GRACE: Wow. You know, if you think back on Scott Peterson, those dogs managed to follow Laci Peterson from her home in Modesto all the way to the
San Francisco Bay, OK?
OAKES: That`s correct.
GRACE: All the way. Now, if they could do that and she was in a vehicle, the dogs couldn`t have found this two blocks away near her office? Why?
Were they not already there? Have they been deposited since cops arrested Charlton?
To Joe Scott Morgan, certified death investigator, professor of forensics, Jacksonville State University. Joe Scott, can we date the remains? This
is critical, Joe Scott, because if these remains, this second round of remains were deposited after Charlton was arrested, we`re in a lot of
trouble. You know that, right?
JOE SCOTT MORGAN, CERTIFIED DEATH INVESTIGATOR: Yes. But we can date the remains, Nancy, relative to lack of preservation. What we do know
scientifically is that human remains decompose at a specific rate dependent on the environmental conditions. And this is rather easy for us to
measure. So we can get -- we can timeframe this pretty well.
I find it pretty interesting that the second round of remains were found only 18 -- roughly 1,800 feet away from where the first rounds were
deposited. My suspicion is, is that it was not done -- the search was not done in a very thorough manner.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:27:00]UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Ingrid Lyne was the mother of three young girls. Some of Lyne`s remains were found in a recycling bin.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Almost a week after another gruesome discovery.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sanitation workers found a receptacle that contained what appeared to be, and by all accounts is, human remains.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Garbage guys find more of the missing mom`s remains.
Liz, can I see the graphic of the missing mom? I know that part of her leg, a foot have been found, the head, of course. This is what we know of.
Now more body parts found outside another home near mom`s office. Why not dump them all at once? Why this bizarre game of dropping off the mom`s
remains in different places?
Nicole Partin, funeral director and embalmer joining me out of Marco Island. Nicole, how can you possibly have a funeral with a dismembered
body like this?
NICOLE PARTIN, FUNERAL DIRECTOR AND EMBALMER (via telephone): The medical examiner`s office will release what they have of the body in a body bag.
And then depending on the family`s wishes, that bag and the contents will either be cremated or placed in a casket for burial.
The issue is closure for the family. Most families get to see their loved one in a casket, be able to say good-bye. But unfortunately, Ingrid`s
family will never get that opportunity.
GRACE: Well, and there`s the other issue. If we keep finding, like, bombs, more body parts hidden all over town, why would the family have the
funeral now if there are more body parts that we`re going to discover in the days to come?
Joining me, Dr. Daniel Bober, forensic psychiatrist out of Ft. Lauderdale. Also with me, Joe Scott Morgan from Jacksonville State University.
You know, Dr. Bober, this guy says he can`t remember exactly what happened because he was so stinking drunk. We also have Joe Scott Morgan, who says
the opposite. What about it, Dr. Bober?
DR. DANIEL BOBER, FORENSIC PSYCHIATRIST: Well, you know, Nancy, a lot of people are confused about what an alcoholic blackout actually is.
Alcoholic blackouts are not passing out. They`re actually periods of time where people can lose their memory or fragments of their memory and results
of not only drinking a large amount of alcohol...
GRACE: Fragments.
BOBER: ... but a large amount of alcohol in a very short period of time. So it would be possible...
GRACE: Whoa! Whoa! Whoa-whoa! Bober! Bober! Bober! Bober, you said fragments. If he`s responsible for the -- didn`t you just see Morgan
sawing the bone? How could you forget that?
BOBER: Nancy, you can have a complete loss of memory for events when you`ve consumed a large quantity of alcohol. There have been people that
have driven across multiple states and have done very purposeful acts and have no memory of it whatsoever and may appear totally normal to the people
around them.
GRACE: OK, what about it, Joe Scott Morgan?
MORGAN: Hey, look, this is -- this involves a high cognitive level. You`re talking about sawing through very, very dense bone and then having
the presence of mind to deposit it in a variety of different receptacles over a period of time.
[20:30:10] This is a planned event. And then not to mention he cleaned up afterwards. You know, the only thing that I can think of is maybe this
guy`s had a lot of practice at doing this and something he can fall back onto. But this is a high level of skill that this guy is engaged to.
NANCY GRACE, NANCY GRACE SHOW HOST: But I can`t believe you`re saying that he can`t remember it. You`re siding with him. I`m just -- I`m just shocked.
SCOTT: I`m horribly sorry. I know -- I know for a fact that this guy.
GRACE: I`m talking about Bober.
DANIEL BOBER, FORENSIC PSYCHIATRIST: Nancy, all I`m saying is -- is that it is physiologically possible to engage in a purposeful act and have no
memory of it. It doesn`t mean at the time he wasn`t aware of what he was doing, but he may have no recall of that event.
GRACE: Put it in this place -- So Dr. Bober, are you telling me and Joseph Scott Morgan and everybody listening tonight, that this guy could go out
with a woman, kill her, dismember her, he had to clean the scene with something because nobody could even tell the bathroom was a crime scene and
you can`t just do that with bleach.
He must have used something like black -- something like muriatic acid, something like that. Do all that deposit remains, we think, in two
different locations make up a lie, take rapid transit, dump the car and get out? I mean how that he doesn`t remember it? Is that your theory, Dr.
Bober?
BOBER: There`s a difference Nancy between what`s probable and what`s possible. But it is possible to -- for him to lose recall of that event
even at that time -- even at that time he may have appeared to be purposefully.
SCOTT: Let`s keep in mind -- Nancy, let`s keep in mind this guy is going to be covered with blood as well. He had to have the presence of mind to
actually clean himself -- change his clothing, clean himself up. This is not a clean event.
This guy will literally be covered with her blood. And that`s -- that`s the key here to as far as his cognitive abilities.
[20:35:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: A gorgeous, young Arlington couple seemingly vanished off the face of the earth, leaving no trace behind. Sheriffs are begging for help, but
tonight, a squatter near their ranch reportedly harassing the wife. Are the two connected? Cops saying they fear foul play after both the couple`s
SUV`s have been found in remote woodland.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The couple`s vehicles, a Land Rover and Jeep, were found in a wooded area near Oso several miles from the couple`s rural
Arlington home days after they were last seen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Let`s go straight into a police presser.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A major crimes detectives have established probable cause for the arrest of two men suspected of murdering Patrick Shunn and
his wife Monique Patenaude. Detectives are asking for the public`s help in locating 53-year-old John Blaine Reed and his brother, 49-year-old Tony
Clyde Reed.
Both men are convicted felons, are believed to be armed and dangerous, and their current location is unknown. They are armed and dangerous and the
public should absolutely be worried.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Joining me, host from KGMI, Dillon Honcoop. Dillon, thank you for being with us. Let`s talk about the discovery of the couple`s car. We were
talking about Pat Shunn and his wife Monique Patenaude. Dillon, how were the vehicles discovered? Can you take that in full? I want to see the cars,
please.
DILLON HONCOOP, KGMI HOST: Nancy, not long after we went to air with this story on Thursday night, our rescue helicopter there in Snohomish County
actually found those vehicles and they described them as having gone over an embankment. They were found in some woods really not far from where both
the suspects now in this case and the -- obviously the missing couple lived. And that`s where they found them and started to process the crime
scene as they believed it to be.
GRACE: Whoa, both over a ravine and Pat -- neither Pat nor Monique in their vehicles, big mystery. How did both vehicles get to that spot? Did the
perfs (sic) get the woman and then lure the husband to his wife? It`s one of thinking.
Both of their cell phones have been cut off, but now all possibility that these two may have just high tailed it to Mexico or decided to disappear,
no, not true. Cops admitting they believe there is foul play. Now Dillon Honcoop, joining me KGMI, when you and I talked last, I was pursuing the
avenue of investigation that whoever had been harassing the wife, sexually harassing her, according to the brother and or squatting on their land
should be looked at. Are these the same guys?
HONCOOP: Absolutely, and these are close neighbors to them. They had a relationship. They knew these people. In fact, they lived through a
disaster together just two years ago, that landslide that killed 43 people here in Washington State.
Their homes were literally feet away from the west edge of that massive landslide. They knew each other. In fact, I`m talking with one of the
friends today of this couple. He tells me that that was one of the first things they thought of as the landslide was happening. They said, "We need
to go check on John." John Reed.
GRACE: Oh, my god.
HONCOOP: The neighbor that`s now suspected of their murder.
GRACE: Everyone that leads me to the development as we go to air, police are in fear this couple has been murdered. Nobody has been found, but
apparently inside one of these guys` home, there`s evidence, we believe, of a serious and extreme altercation.
[20:40:00] To Marc Klaas, President and founder of Klaas Kids Foundation devotes his life to finding the missing. Marc, what do you think?
MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER OF KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: Well, Nancy, they also said they found -- the found evidence in the cars that led them
to believe that they were murdered as well. And that having them said, I imagine they found large amounts of blood from both of the missing
individuals.
GRACE: You know, Matt Zarrell, these two guys, is one of them the alleged squatter or is one of them the alleged sexually -- the person sexually
harassing the wife, Monique Patenaude?
MATT ZARRELL, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: It`s the same person, Nancy. It`s John Reed, the guy on the left there. He`s the squatter that the brother told us
had sexually harassed the wife and was given the couple a lot of problems. The brother confirms John Reed is the same guy he was talking about last
week.
GRACE: So let me ask you this, Dillon Honcoop of KGMI, how close is this to the Canadian border?
HONCOOP: About an hour away, give or take from the Canadian border. And of course, you mentioned that Monique Patenaude originally from B.C. So that
was her origin and a lot of wild country between here and there.
GRACE: Well, how do you think, Dillon? What is the theory the police are working with as to how these guys managed to lure Patrick Shunn to Monique
Patenaude? What happened?
HONCOOP: No idea at this point as far as a working theory other than what you`ve described already which is it`s kind of where people have gone that
I`ve talked to so far of how Monique Patenaude again last seen at about 1:00 Monday last week.
Her husband was at work clearly at that time. He went home and likely that`s what happened because she was last seen before he departed and
headed back home from his job about an hour to the south. You have to imagine that something was going on there to try to lure him. And his
background is that of an army ranger. This guy is not a fool. He knows about conflict. But something had to have gone on there to draw him into
this.
GRACE: Everyone, the tip line 425-388-3845. For all the doubters out there thinking these two just high tailed it to a concert or a vacation
unplanned, that`s not the case. Both their vehicles have been found pushed down a ravine. Police are begging for your help tonight.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:45:00] GRACE: A Baywatch star, ABC`s Dancing with the Stars fan favorite worth millions and millions of dollars and still raking it in, now
demanding an end to alimony payments.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Global star David Hasselhoff claims spousal support is cutting into his retirement funds. Hasselhoff was married to Pamela Bach
for years and the couple had two daughters together. Hasselhoff has filed court papers to put an end to the 21,000 he pays each month in spousal
support to his ex, saying the payments are cutting into his retirement.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We all know David Hasselhoff. Let`s see that in full, please. There is Hasselhoff in his glory. Baywatch -- from Baywatch company. There you
go, who was that? Now I thought it was Heather Locklear just for a moment. But there you go. Hoff saves yet another person.
Do we have the shot of Hoff running along the beach with Pam Anderson? I mean, it could be glamorous as the man is worth, according to many sources,
$110 million. They still love this overseas. They can`t get enough of David Hasselhoff and Pam Anderson. He`s rolling in money, yet he wants to stop
his alimony payments, Clements?
KIRBY CLEMENTS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well he`s actually not rolling in money, I think he`s making.
GRACE: He`s rolling.
CLEMENTS: He`s making like 112,000, but here`s the issue -- I mean a month. But I want to point up, she can get a job.
GRACE: Whoa. Wait, $112,000.
CLEMENTS: Thousand dollars a month. But he`s dipping into his retirement fund. She can get a job. She just can`t sit around eating bonbons and not
working. Get a job
GRACE: But she has worked.
CLEMENTS: No, but she has -- and she needs to start working again.
GRACE: You know what, that`s why you should never ask a trial lawyer about how much money all these movie stars make. Allan Duke, Editor in Chief of
leadstories.com -- oh, there he is in Night Rider, Glen A. Larson, and productions in NBC. But you know what, I appreciate the car, Liz, but I
think what they`re paying to see overseas is not the car.
There you go. Now, some people think he`s attractive, not me. That`s Baywatch and Baywatch Company. Allan Duke, stop his wife`s alimony
payments? Didn`t -- weren`t they married for 20 years and she gave birth to two children?
ALLAN DUKE, EDITOR IN CHIEF, LEADSTORIES.COM: Yes, two now grown daughters, so they`re not getting any of this $21,000 a month. Yes, they were married
a long time. She pretty much gave up her acting career. And I can tell you, she does not live in luxury now on that $21,000 a month. She lives very
modestly, as best I can tell and people I know who know her.
GRACE: OK. Hold on, hold a moment. There he is. Isn`t he in a brand new - Allan, he`s in the next Sharknado, right?
DUKE: Yes, Sharknado 4. He had three days of -- well, just a very short amount of shooting in Baywatch, the film that`s coming out with The Rock,
Dwayne Johnson. But he didn`t make a lot of money on that. I`m thinking that he`s probably making his.
GRACE: What do you mean not making a lot of money?
DUKE: No. Sharknado 4.
GRACE: Yes and? It`s an adult classic.
DUKE: Sharknado 4 and Baywatch, three days of shooting. Yeah, it is. And he`s got his music. But he`s got residuals, that kind of thing.
[20:50:00] But the experience, his future isn`t that bright.
GRACE: Then he go from Sharknado from sci-fi -- OK, that was the old rocker and I don`t think he`s involved in this scenario. OK, but I want to go now
to -- here comes the guru.
Author of Divorce Protect Yourself, Kids and Future, Randy Kessler. Did you say -- oh, there`s Pam Anderson. Did you see Hasselhoff on Dancing with the
Stars? I mean, he`s the feisty fan favorite. So now he can`t pay? Oh, there you go. Go on, Kim Johnson. Really all he did was push his hair back. But
Kessler, why now, a guy who`s worth a reported $100 million, he can`t afford his alimony anymore?
RANDY KESSLER, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: Yes, but he`s getting old and as we get old, we don`t want to work the rest our lives just to pay our ex-wives and
that`s a legitimate request.
GRACE: So that`s why he shouldn`t have gotten along with her, Randy. That`s why they shouldn`t get along. They should have divorced. You look at the
statistics. You get a divorce, you dump into a lower socioeconomic level, the children have all sorts of problems.
KESSLER: We have no idea what was going on in their marriage. And I`m sure the both sides wanted a divorce and needed a divorce. And do you pay the
rest of your life? It`s going to be up to a judgment. You don`t have to pay forever and ever and ever. You could probably help what you get being
married by now.
GRACE: OK. Can I ask you something, Randy Kessler?
KESSLER: She didn`t get remarried, they both kept living. So now he`s going at one alternative and that`s to go back to the judge.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers, Kirby Clements and Robin Ficker. That`s Baywatch from Baywatch Company. This Baywatch star estimated at $110
million and they`re still showing Baywatch overseas.
So Robin Ficker, Kirby Clements, Randy Kessler, Robin Ficker, you all three are very well versed in the laws of divorce, but what about the "`till
death do us part" portion of that? That`s what -- where alimony comes in. You`re in it until death. You got to keep writing that check, Ficker.
ROBIN FICKER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Usually not, unless there`s a handicap, unless there`s a complete inability to work and here this lovely woman
could be earning quite a bit as an actress if my eyes aren`t deceiving me.
GRACE: That`s Baywatch from Baywatch Company.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:55:00] (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How much alimony is too much? Baywatch superstar David Hasselhoff said he`s reached that point. He claims that $21,000 monthly
payments are too much.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: To Stacey Newman and Allan Duke, Allan Duke from Leadstories.com. So the wife stays married with him. You`re seeing Baywatch from Baywatch
Company right now. For 20 plus years, they have two children, she raises the children, they turn out fine. They`re grown now and he suddenly,
Stacey, wants to stop his alimony. What has something to do with the fact that he`s about to get a lump sum of half his retirement and he doesn`t
want her to get it?
STACEY NEWMAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Yes, based on our calculations, he`s already paid her $2.5 million. So she`s supposed to get half his retirement
fund. That`s the base of his legal argument. She is cutting into that money and he also has a big payday coming in the Baywatch.
GRACEY: Whoa, hold on. Stacey, Stacey, look at your monitor. Allan Duke, is that their home? It looks like an institute or a hotel.
DUKE: That may be the home they sold. That was the one they had to sell at that time -- about the time of the divorce. She lives in a very modest
place in Hollywood.
GRACE: Oh, they had to sell it. And what -- they`re living in a van down by the river? I don`t think so.
DUKE: Well, not quite but.
GRACE: Dr. Daniel Bober, forensic psychiatrist. What`s the thinking behind this? Whoa, here we go with Dancing with the Stars again from ABC. Bober,
what happened? Why now, he is worth all this money, he`s starring in two new movies, why dump on his ex-wife like this?
BOBER: You know what, Nancy, this is a very difficult one to touch. There`s such a gender specific reaction to these types of things. It really tends
to pit men against women. It`s very tough. But you know, some people would say that if his income is that high, why shouldn`t he continue to pay her?
She gave up the most productive earning years and had two kids. But some would say you know, that enough is enough already. So it one of those
things that really divides people.
GRACE: OK, we`re on it, David Hasselhoff insisting that Alimony payments end. Everyone, let`s stop and remember American hero Marine Lance Corporal
Jared Kremm, 24, Hauppage, New York, secretor, loved X-Box and Burger King. Mother Nancy, sister Jacqueline, widow Brooke. Jared Kremm, American hero.
And tonight, birthday memories of my father, Mac Grace, navy veteran of the World War, gave up a basketball scholarship to serve our country, a
railroad man for 40 plus years. He and my mom put us through college, put braces on our teeth, took us to Sunday school and taught me how to dance.
I want to personally thank all of you for all the cards, all the love, all the e-mails, after my father passed away. It has been a very sad day
missing my father, on his birthday, but also a day that we were thankful for all of our years together.
Thank you to our guests but especially to you for being with us. Nancy Grace signing off. I`ll see you tomorrow night at 8:00 sharp eastern and
until then, good night, friend.
[21:00:00]
END
