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Nancy Grace
Convicted Murderer of Chandra Levy Released; Pilot of Deadly Hot Air Balloon Had Previous DWI; Kindergaren Teacher Gunned Down at Home. Aired 8- 9p ET
Aired August 01, 2016 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HLN HOST: Breaking news tonight. Speculation reignites in a sensational murder, where gorgeous young intern Chandra Levy brutally
murdered in a park near her apartment, her dead body found after evidence of her sex affair with powerful congressman Gary Condit.
Bombshell tonight. The man convicted of murdering Chandra Levy has just been released, all charges dropped. Why?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The 24-year-old intern disappeared in 2001.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chandra Levy had had an affair with then congressman Gary Condit.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you know anything about where Chandra Levy is?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s repeatedly denied involvement.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her remains found a year later in Rock Creek Park.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Police ruled out Condit as a suspect years ago.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now, in a stunning move, prosecutors have dropped all charges against Ingmar Guandique...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... the man accused of killing the Washington intern.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: The pilot in a deadly Texas hot air balloon crash killing all 16 aboard had been arrested for driving intoxicated, was the subject of Better
Business Bureau warnings. Also tonight, was he on probation for drugs? All passengers, including newlyweds, dead after their hot air balloon
ignites like a fireball in the sky.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The hot air balloon hit power lines before it crashed in Texas.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: First I heard a whoosh, you know, like a whooshing sound.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Killed the 16 people believed to be on board.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s just a big ball of fire up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Kindergarten teacher, mom of two little boys, gunned down dead in her kitchen floor at their upscale home. Tonight, cops hone in on none
other than her own mother-in-law! Breaking right now, in the last hours, Police reveal the mother-in-law researching on line, quote, "people who
kill their family."
Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell tonight. Peculation reignites in a sensational murder where gorgeous young intern Chandra Levy brutally killed in park near her
apartment, Chandra`s dead body found after evidence of her sex affair with a very powerful congressman, Gary Condit. The man convicted of murdering
Chandra,just released, all charges against him dropped. Why? I don`t understand it!
Straight out to Dan Simon, CNN correspondent joining me. Dan, I don`t understand. We all covered this trial and the investigation blow by blow.
Do you remember when it all came out that a powerful congressperson, Gary Condit, had been having an affair with not only Chandra Levy but woman
after woman after woman while his wife held down the fort with his children back home while he`s in D.C.?
Then there was this twist and that turn where she had gone to Baskin and Robbins just before she was killed. And was there the cup of her ice cream
sitting? Could they find it and get DNA? I mean, it went on and on.
Now the guy finally convicted at a jury trial walks free, Dan Simon?
DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Boy, you really just have to feel for Chandra Levy`s family, Nancy. Here you have this guy -- you know, what`s
his name, Ingmar Guandique -- he`s the guy who was found guilty of killing Chandra Levy. And you know, he had allegedly assaulted other people in
that park.
You had no forensic evidence. You had no eyewitness, people who came forward. And so the case that prosecutors had against Guandique came from
a jailhouse snitch, Nancy. And the credibility of that snitch came into question.
He had a conversation with a woman in a hotel room, basically, that was recorded. And he said, You know what? I did share a cell with this guy,
Guandique, but the fact that I had said that he had told me that he killed Chandra Levy -- I know this is complicated -- well, apparently, that was
all a lie. So prosecutors really had no choice but to release Guandique. It`s crazy.
GRACE: OK, let me understand this, Dan Simon, because if you go back, Dan, which I know you have, and you look at the original arrest warrants,
prosecutors say at that time that Guandique bragged or confessed that he killed Chandra Levy to four different people, four -- one, two, three, four
-- not just a cellmate, that the day after Chandra Levy was murdered, he didn`t show up at work. And when he was spotted again, his face was
covered in scratches that he couldn`t explain.
[20:05:24]And Dan Simon, remember, there were two other women, that we know of, maybe more, that identified him as attacking them in the same Rock Park
(sic) where Chandra Levy was murdered in the same fashion. Remember all that, Dan Simon?
SIMON: Yes, but if you -- if all you have is forensic evidence and you have -- or no forensic evidence and you have no eyewitnesses and the heart
of the case comes down to a jailhouse informant, and the credibility of that person comes into question, then what do prosecutors do? They really
had no choice in the matter, Nancy. I mean...
GRACE: Well, Dan, I tell you what...
SIMON: ... if the one person that they relied on -- yes?
GRACE: I tell you what. I side with Chandra Levy`s mother, Dan Simon, because if you believe in your case in the first time and you believe this
is the guy that murdered Chandra Levy, hogtied her and murdered her with her own workout tights, you know what? Let a jury let him go. I would not
have this on my head that I let this guy go.
Listen to what Chandra`s mother says.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SUSAN LEVY, CHANDRA`S MOTHER: It`s a technical issue, and I am (INAUDIBLE) shocky (ph) right now. Physically and emotionally not doing very well.
Just kind of, like, puts you back to the level of grief that you originally have. I always want justice. But even if I get justice, doesn`t bring
calm back to a family that`s been fractured by a horrendous crime like this.
I`m the voice of my daughter right now. And she`s not here, and just like many million other women who don`t have their children, either boys or
girls, due to shooting or due to any other major trauma. It has to stop. And I hope that we find the right person who -- who will not or -- that if
it was Guandique, that he doesn`t go on and do anything else to other people. One day, I`ll be with her.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Yes, that`s the big question that Chandra Levy`s mother, who according to sources, is absolutely devastated, that the guy who was
convicted by a jury of murdering her daughter, Chandra Levy, now walks free. An illegal immigrant in this country, Guandique, had attacked two
other women in the very same park where Chandra Levy found dead.
And here`s is my next big question. Let me throw this to you, Keith Alexander joining me, courts and crime reporter with "The Washington Post,"
@Keithla -- Keithlalexander. Hey, Keith, what about this? If Guandique didn`t do it, then who did?
KEITH ALEXANDER, "WASHINGTON POST": Well, Nancy, that`s the million-dollar question, isn`t it. You know, like you said earlier, when prosecutors went
after this case, they said they had multiple -- multiple witnesses who say that Ingmar Guandique admitted to them that he killed Chandra Levy.
Yet during the 2010 trial, they only called one of those witnesses. So let`s say that witness, Mirando -- Armando Morales -- there were some
credibility issues. Why aren`t the prosecutors calling the other witnesses? Why not just dismiss Morales in the retrial? And that`s...
GRACE: I hear you.
ALEXANDER: ... what we`re trying to figure out.
GRACE: OK. Keith Alexander, that`s what I`m screaming. Dan Simon, CNN correspondent, I know you heard what Keith Alexander said because in the
original arrest warrants, there were -- it said he had bragged to four different people and talked about the murder of Chandra Levy.
And not only that, remember this, Dan Simon, that when they came to confront him about Chandra Levy, didn`t he have pictures or a picture of
her cut out of a magazine that he was keeping? Why would he have that? I don`t have a cut-out picture of Chandra Levy on me right now, so why did
he?
SIMON: I don`t know, Nancy. I mean, the question is whether or not prosecutors are going to reopen this case again after all this time. I
mean, it was 2001 when Chandra Levy was killed. I mean, the question I guess will come down to, A, are there any more suspects, and B, what does
the family want? Do they want to keep looking for this killer, or is the family convinced -- we don`t know -- if -- if they felt that -- if, in
fact, it was Guandique.
GRACE: Well, here`s another issue.
SIMON: That`s (INAUDIBLE)
[20:10:00]GRACE: Here`s another issue, Dan Simon. What about Condit? Now, everybody is saying Condit is not a suspect and that he was cleared. But
you have to revisit motive. He was a married man having an affair with a young intern, for Pete`s sake. She was interning I believe with Pardons
and Paroles or probation department in D.C. Now, here he is with all of these children and the wife back home holding down the fort, and turns out
he`s got a list of lovers. You`d have to have a flowchart for it.
So how did he end up with an airtight alibi? What was his alibi, Congressman Gary Condit? How did he get cleared?
SIMON: Well, we know that the cops and prosecutors looked at Gary Condit for a very long time. He was the prime suspect. And nothing could stick
on him. So prosecutors were forced, along with the police, to look for other suspects. This dragged on for 15 years. Well, now it`s dragging on
for 15 years. So the question now is, you know, since so much time has passed, can they re-look at Gary Condit? I`m not sure they can, Nancy.
GRACE: Well, I`m not saying that Condit is the perp. In fact, he was cleared. What I am saying is, if the prosecutors say, OK, we`re cutting
this guy loose, Guandique, do they really think he didn`t do it? Because if they think he didn`t, they should retry it and lose it before just
cutting him loose and letting him leave the country.
Is he an illegal alien, Dan? Is he an illegal?
SIMON: He is an illegal alien. He`s an undocumented immigrant, and they are going to send him, the authorities, back to El Salvador. But the
question comes down to, for prosecutors, if they really don`t feel, Nancy, that they can prove the case beyond a reasonable doubt, don`t they have the
obligation to drop all the charges?
GRACE: (INAUDIBLE) to seek the truth, Dan. That`s what I believe in. If they thought Guandique killed Chandra Levy way back when, and all the heat
came off Gary Condit and now everybody says he`s not a suspect, he had nothing to do with this, he`s cleared, then why are they letting this guy
walk? Why not re-prosecute him with what they`ve got, or dig up more evidence?
What, because it happened several years ago, does that mean it`s all over, we`re just going to forget about it? What, we -- the justice system has
the attention span of a fruit fly? What, because it happened then, we should just let it go? I disagree with that!
Listen to her mother.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEVY: It`s a lifetime of a broken heart, leaving memories of good times that I did share with my daughter. Give me a little time to find out a new
normal because this is very difficult. I am a trauma (ph) person.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:16:48]UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An attractive and ambitious young woman who came to D.C. from California for an internship with the federal Bureau of
Prisons. Just days after that internship ended, she vanished.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The badly decomposed body of Chandra Levy was found more than a year after she disappeared.
LEVY: No matter how many trials you have, you`ll never have your daughter back.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: The man who was convicted by a jury in the murder of gorgeous young intern Chandra Levy is walking free. Why? Now, at the time Chandra Levy
was murdered in Rock Park, near where she lived, near her apartment, even near where she worked, all suspicion turned on powerful congressperson Gary
Condit. And it was shown that he was having an affair with her and many, many other women.
Now, that weekend, as I recall, Keith Alexander joining me from "The Washington Post," his wife was coming into town, as I recall it. And the
pressure was on. All focus turned on him. He was later cleared.
So my question is, if Guandique, the man convicted, didn`t do it, then who did?
ALEXANDER: You know, I talked to prosecutors just on Friday trying to ask that very same question. They tell me that this case is still ongoing. It
is still active. And they, as always, won`t comment on an open case. So that`s correct.
What is the next move? Who else are they going to bring into this case? Just because they dismissed the charges now does not mean they cannot bring
charges at another time.
GRACE: He`s going to be -- he`s going to be out of the country, though, Dan Simon -- Dan Simon joining me, CNN correspondent. They let this guy go
now, he`s going to be in another country.
So what is the point? Are they moving forward or are they just going to let the case go and never have justice?
SIMON: That`s a great question, Nancy. If they let him go to El Salvador, you can basically kiss him good-bye. You`re not going to see or hear from
him again. Whether or not cops decide to keep going with this case, whether or not they have any other suspects they can look at, that is
really the open question. I mean, so much time has passed since this happened in 2001, it really makes you wonder what else cops can do.
GRACE: Well, this is what I don`t understand. Unleash the lawyers. Joining me is Bernie Grimm, defense attorney who attended the trial,
joining us out of D.C. Also with me, Kenya Johnson, defense attorney, out of Atlanta.
Bernie Grimm, I mean, if they were convinced that this guy is Chandra`s killer, why would they let him go? Why not at least try and reprise the
case, give it to a jury and let a jury decide?
BERNIE GRIMM, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know, Nancy, you bring up an excellent point. But as a prosecutor, you have more guts than your
standard prosecutor. You weren`t afraid to lose. Prosecutors here are afraid to lose. But listen, you got somebody`s life in your hands (AUDIO
GAP) If this is your guy, take it, win, lose or draw.
But let me unpack this case. It`s very complicated. You said he was already convicted by a jury, but he was convicted based on perjured
testimony, for God`s sake.
[20:20:04]GRACE: Whoa! Wait a minute!
GRIMM: Perjured -- perjured testimony, yes.
GRACE: What about the other women, the similar transactions...
GRIMM: Good point. Good point.
GRACE: ... the two other women that said, He attacked me in Rock Park just a few feet away...
GRIMM: Right.
GRACE: ... from where Chandra was killed...
GRIMM: Right.
GRACE: ... in the days leading up to Chandra`s murder...
GRIMM: And I`ll tell you...
GRACE: ... with the same MO?
GRIMM: And I`ll tell you right now, I`ve put in -- I prepared for New York, New Jersey and Boston Marathons in Rock Creek Park. I wouldn`t let
my daughter run through there unless she was surrounded by the Secret Service -- well, that`s a bad example because they don`t do a very good
job. But I wouldn`t let her run in Rock Creek Park. It`s a dangerous place.
Now, you`re right. Keith Alexander, this warrant came out, the affidavit in support of the arrest warrant -- a lot of noise. We have a lot of
witnesses, this, that and the other thing. But as Dan raised, there`s no forensics. That`s what jurors want.
GRACE: You are avoiding the question, Grimm!
(CROSSTALK)
GRIMM: Ask the question. You want the guy to be guilty. He`s not guilty under our system.
GRACE: Cut his mike! Cut his mike.
GRIMM: We can try...
GRACE: I`m hearing him, and now I`m hearing her. Grimm, my question to you is this. You went to the trial. You`re saying the conviction was
based on nothing but perjured testimony because the snitch, the jailhouse rat that said, He bragged to me, was lying.
Isn`t it true two other independent women that did not know each other at all identified him in the courtroom and said, That is the man that attacked
me in Rock Park just yards away from where Chandra was murdered...
GRIMM: Yes.
GRACE: ... in the same MO as the way Chandra was killed? Isn`t that true, Grimm?
GRIMM: Yes, yes, yes. Ms. Prosecutor Grace, you are absolutely correct. In Rock Creek Park in generally the same area, not within feet, same MO...
GRACE: Yards!
GRIMM: More than -- - more than -- Rock Creek Park is about...
GRACE: I know. I`ve been there.
GRIMM: It`s about 15 square miles.
GRACE: I`m very familiar with it.
GRIMM: At any rate -- OK, at any rate, to cut to the chase, that came in, as we know as other crimes evidence, not substantive evidence. They
weren`t witnesses to this offense.
Don`t get me wrong. I listened to it. The guy was very compelling, very believable to a jury. I didn`t believe him for a minute.
GRACE: You`re back on him!
GRIMM: This is a guy that said, Well, you know, I connected with God. I don`t want anything out of this. I don`t want to get out of jail. Give me
a break! Here`s where the problem states. When you want to convict Satan, you`re going to have to go to hell to get him. So ask your...
GRACE: I believe that (AUDIO GAP) When you want to put the devil in jail, you got to go to hell to get your witnesses. You need to write that down.
To you, Kenya Johnson. Before he starts up on the lying snitch -- and I`ll agree, OK, the snitch lied. Fine. Let`s just put that out there.
To you, Kenya Johnson. How can you -- either of your explain that this guy, Guandique -- he misses the next day of work, the day after she`s
killed. He shows up, his face covered in scratches. And not only that, when he is approached by police, he has a picture cut out of a magazine of
Chandra Levy?
Do either you have a Chandra Levy picture stuffed down your shirt? Because I don`t. Why did he?
KENYA JOHNSON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: No, but obviously, this case is falling apart. Some 15 years later, the evidence...
GRACE: Respond to what I asked you.
JOHNSON: Well, there`s several different reasons why he may have been there. There may have been -- the evidence that came out 15 years ago,
obviously does not stand up today. Prosecutors know that you cannot convict on the testimony of one person. (AUDIO GAP) corroborating
evidence. And so they don`t have that now, don`t want to take the chance in trying the case. They`d rather let him go.
Fifteen years later, there`s new technologies. Let`s reanalyze everything and develop a new suspect.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:27:42]UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Ingmar Guandique was found guilty in 2010 and sentenced to 60 years in prison. Last year, he was granted a retrial.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But now, citing new evidence, the charges were dropped.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Still holding onto hope that somehow, investigators find the person responsible for murdering her daughter.
LEVY: I always want justice. But even if I get justice doesn`t bring calm back a family that`s been fractured by a horrendous crime like this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: To Dan Simon, CNN correspondent. When I see Chandra Levy`s mother and I think about what she and the father have been through all these years
-- remember, Dan Simon, Chandra Levy already had all of her items, her clothes, her furniture packed to go back home to California. Her
internship, and hopefully, the affair with a married congressman, Gary Condit, was coming to an end. She was ready to go home. It was a matter
of days before she went back home and started her life.
She never made it. She was murdered in the midst of her affair with Gary Condit. Now, police say Condit was cleared. But now years later, the man
convicted of killing Chandra walks free. Do you remember -- and I`m not saying Condit wasn`t cleared, but Dan Simon, do you remember all those
women that came forward and they were talking about how Condit liked bondage and all of his crazy sex fantasies way back then -- do you remember
that?
SIMON: I do. And you know, let`s face it, this is not good for Gary Condit because once again, it raises suspicions. We`re talking about his
past behavior with other women. He is very upset that prosecutors are dropping all the charges. I will say, though, that his lawyer put out a
comment once again saying that Gary Condit is completely innocent, that despite the fact that prosecutors are letting Guandique, it doesn`t change
that fact, Nancy.
GRACE: Yes, you`re right about that. They cleared Gary Condit, and now these years later, the man that gets convicted of Chandra Levy`s murder
walks free, and nobody can really explain to me why this guy is leaving and he`s headed for San Salvador!
[20:30:02] They`re not even going to try and prosecute him. They`re not even cutting a deal, Keith Alexander. They`re not saying, OK, you plead to
10 years, more and we won`t retry you and you won`t have a life sentence. They`re letting him walk. They`re practically giving him a set of Louis
Vuitton luggage and saying get the hay out of country man while you can. I don`t like it. It stinks. Something`s wrong.
ALEXANDER: You know Nancy, here in D.C., and Bernie Grimm talks about this, prosecutors do not want to risk double jeopardy. They don`t want to try
Guandique and lose this case. So remember, they really don`t have much evidence.
GRACE: Then take a plea. Plead him to something.
ALEXANDER: So, I think -- I think what they are concerned about is this double jeopardy. What they`re going to do is investigate further and get
more...
GRACE: Double jeopardy does not affect a plea. A plea does not invoke double jeopardy, that you can get tried thrice with the same crime.
ALEXANDER: But what the defense attorney -- what the defense attorney is going to encourage their client to plead guilty to something when the
defense already knows, the prosecution has nothing.
GRACE: Well, you know what, maybe not right now they don`t but if they worked the case up again, they will -- I just don`t want to see anything
unjust. Not anything unjust for Gary Condit, not anything unjust for Chandra Levy. Look, if Condit was cleared, he was cleared. I`m not fighting
about that. I`m saying this whole thing doesn`t add up. So Stacey Newman, is this it? Is this all she wrote? Keep walking. We`ll never see him again?
STACEY NEWMAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well, as Keith said, they are still investigating this case but another wrinkle to the story Nancy, you have to
remember, Guandique did pass an FBI polygraph. He said he had nothing to do with her murder.
[20:35:00] (COMMERCIAL BRAK)
GRACE: The pilot in a deadly Texas hot air balloon crash kills all 16 aboard. He had been arrested for driving intoxicated, was the subject of a
Better Business Bureau warning. Also tonight, was he on probation for drugs? All the passengers, including newlyweds, dead, after the hot air
balloon ignites like a fire ball in the sky.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The deadliest hot air balloon crash in U.S. history.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They`re gone.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The hot air balloon reportedly carrying 16 people crashed in central Texas killing everyone on board.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Eight miles into flight, the balloon went down after striking high voltage power lines.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We look at the human, the machine and the environment.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Devastation. The worst hot air balloon accident in U.S. history and joining me there in Texas, Polo Sandoval, CNN national correspondent. Polo,
thank you so much for being with us. You know, I understand that we really don`t know exactly what happened. That the hot air balloon may have gotten
caught in power lines, not really sure that maybe there was a malfunction when he hit the -- basically it looks like fire that makes the balloon go
up in the air and when you reduce it, the balloon goes back down.
But now we`re hearing, Polo Sandoval, that he had been driving while intoxicated. There was a drug charge. In fact, there were several DUI
offenses. I mean, I didn`t know you could even get a license for a hot air balloon where you take tourist up in the air if you`ve had a DUI. I didn`t
think that was possible.
POLO SANDOVAL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hey Nancy, there are still a lot of questions about this balloon pilot`s history especially as you mentioned
some of that questionable criminal history and some of his convictions as well. I can tell you that investigators here on the ground have no not
addressed it. What they are focusing on is his license, the current status of his commercial pilot`s license.
We are told it was rated for hot air balloon only. That means that this guy could not actually fly a plane, could not fly a helicopter but he was at
least certified to fly these hot air balloons. Now, despite that though, officials here on the ground, they`re focusing on all the evidence that was
recovered just not long from -- not far from where we`re standing here, because as you mentioned, still, there`s a lot of questions to be asked.
But the predominant theory here according this NTSB investigator that I spoke to, is what we continue to hear that this hot air balloon did
essentially made contact with these high tension, high voltage power lines. But until that investigation wraps up, that is just a theory, Nancy.
GRACE: You know, Matt Zarrell, I want know the truth about our investigation into his record. The guy having 16 people, now, all dead --
up in a hot air balloon. Who was this guy?
[20:40:00] MATT ZARRELL, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well, records show the pilot was arrested and pled guilty in Missouri to driving while intoxicated four
different times including in 2007, 2000, 1999 and 1989, and we had a 1999 conviction for distribution, delivery or manufacturing other controlled
substance. Now, regarding the Better Business Bureau, Nancy, they have had multiple contact with this guy.
Apparently in 2009, the Better Business Bureau warned customers about doing business with a balloon touring company this pilot used to operate in
Missouri. Apparently, this is the third time since 2000 they had warned him. He has not responded to complaints. There were complaints about
flights getting rescheduled and cancelled. He was not responding and not giving refunds.
GRACE: You know, I want to go to special guest joining us, Jeff Chatterton, spokesperson for the Balloon Federation of America. Jeff, thanks for being
with us. This is something I don`t understand and I`m going to put it right on the doorsteps of the FAA because back in 2014, the NTSB begged the FAA
to help regulate hot air ballooning.
And the FAA basically said, nah, and now this. They did nothing. That`s the sole purpose they`re there Jeff, is to protect us. To protect people like
these 16 victims.
JEFF CHATTERTON, BALLOON FEDERATION OF AMERICA SPOKESPERSON: All I can tell you Nancy is that we have pledged our full and complete cooperation with
both the NTSB and the FAA. And for that matter, any other regulatory authority out there that wants to take a look at this incident. I can`t
comment as to the incident itself. Obviously I`m not going to interfere with an NTSB investigation. The job of the NTSB is to make recommendations.
The role of the FAA is to decide whether or not to implement those recommendations.
GRACE: Let me ask you this then, what are the main safety concerns for balloonists? I mean, are balloons maneuvered differently than airplanes?
When you see a power line, is there a way to maneuver up and over it? It`s all about the wind and the weather, isn`t it?
CHATTERTON: Yeah, and the balloons do go where the wind takes them. The job of any hot air balloon pilot is to understand the conditions that he`s
operating in, and if there are obstructions and whether that`s power lines, buildings, antennas or anything else. Obviously, the job of a hot air
balloon pilot is to make sure that his balloon and his aircraft goes over and goes...
GRACE: Right. You know, with me now, in addition to Jeff Chatterton and Polo Sandoval, joining me is Josh Rowan. His brother, Matt, lost his life,
killed in the crash. Josh, thank you for being with us.
JOSH ROWAN, CRASH VICTIM`S BROTHER: Hi Nancy, thanks for having me on and appreciate the opportunity to tell the wonderful story of Matt and Sunday
and what amazing people they were so, thank you for your time.
GRACE: You know what, I was going to ask you about why -- what you think of the FAA refusing to regulate hot air ballooning, but you know what, you`re
right. I want to hear about your brother. Tell me.
ROWAN: Yeah, I guess what we want people to know is Matt and Sunday were amazing people and they lived an amazing life and they touched so many
people. You know, Sunday was a mother. She had a young son not too much different than the age of my oldest son. Matt was a visiting professor and
lecturer at universities in San Antonio.
He was a researcher and recently the chief of a burn and clinical trials unit at the Army Surgical Institute at Brooks Army Medical Hospital. And
he, you know, he was a brilliant guy and he had the opportunity to work in a variety of different places and he chose to work there. He was passionate
about burn research and things and what that kind of information and knowledge could do for soldiers and servicemen and air members who were
injured.
And you know, having been in the army, having been overseas in Iraq, I think he felt a certain connection to that and he`s going to be sorely
missed, and she`s going to be sorely missed.
[20:45:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: A kindergarten teacher, a mother of two little boys gunned down dead in the kitchen floor of her upscale home. Tonight, police are honing in on
none other than her own mother-in-law. And breaking now, in the last hours, police reveal the mother-in-law, online, researching quote, "people who
kill their families."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Shot and killed by her own mother-in-law. Elizabeth Betsy Wall.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s really shocking and stunning.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: More questions surrounding the murder of a 35-year-old Cobb County teacher.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Mike Duffy on the scene. Mike, what can you tell me?
MIKE DUFFY, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Nancy, Jenna and Jerrod Wall were allegedly in the midst of a contentious divorce. Elizabeth Wall, Jerrod`s
mother, came to this home here on Powder Springs, Georgia where Jenna was living. According to a police warrant, Elizabeth went inside and retrieved
Jenna and Jerrod`s two young boys, ages 7 and 8 and brought them outside to a waiting vehicle.
Elizabeth returned inside the home where Jenna was and shortly thereafter the boys reported hearing gunshots fired. When authorities arrived at the
scene they found Jenna deceased of an alleged gunshot wound.
GRACE: You know, she is shot down in the kitchen of her own home. Her two little boys outside waiting in the car. We are learning tonight more. We`re
learning she was shot four times. Was there another weapon found in the home? Back out to Mike Duffy at the scene. What more do we know, Mike?
[20:50:00] DUFFY: Jerrod Wall received a call from his mother Elizabeth saying that he needed to come to the home you see behind me. She abruptly
hung up. And when he tried to call her back, she didn`t answer. As he was on his way, he called his son who happened to be sitting in the vehicle
parked just outside this home.
He asked the boy what happened and the boy said that his mother and grandmother were inside and that he heard gunshots fired. When he arrived
at the home, he found his mother sitting in the living room holding a black revolver to her head and his wife dead in the kitchen.
GRACE: So he finds his mother-in-law of what, Scott Kimbler, joining me from 106.7 -- what Scott holding herself hostage?
SCOTT KIMBLER, NEWSRADIO 106.7 REPORTER: Well, from what we understand from the detectives and what we heard earlier in the story, she is sitting in
the living room with a gun in her mouth and doesn`t actually want to be bothered. From what we understand, she actually told the detectives that
she just wanted to be left alone and just wanted to die.
GRACE: Well, you know, that`s interesting because what happened is she kills her daughter-in-law and not herself. Take a listen to what the lead
detective on the case tells us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She made a few statements. She said, "Just let me die. Leave me alone and let me die. I want a lawyer, he`ll let me die." In her
web searches on the cell phone on April 19th, she had researched several articles regarding someone killing their family and themselves.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: To Ben Levatan, telecommunications expert, Ben, have you taken a look at the searches this mother-in-law did? What do they reveal?
BEN LEVATAN, TELECOMMUNICATIONS EXPERT: Nancy, obviously, this is her phone. It`s in her possession and, you know, all the records indicate that
she was making these searches at a time before the murders took place, Nancy. This -- I don`t know how you get around this.
GRACE: What searches? What were they? Wrongful death lawsuits, people who kill their families. What other searches were made, Michael Christian?
MICHAEL CHRISTIAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: This woman, Elizabeth Wall was sending some derogatory comments on Facebook to the victims Facebook page
and one of those was read in court, and it said, "What God is saying and what you are hearing are two distinctively different things, which is
proven by what you are doing. God have mercy on your soul."
[20:55:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jenna Wall was a kindergarten teacher at Kemp Elementary. Police say she shot and killed her daughter-in-law, Jenna, at
this Powder Springs home just feet from Wall`s two grandsons.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`ve been able to get a good bit of information from them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: I know that animosity can run high during divorces but to shoot your daughter-in-law dead. To Dr. Michelle Dupre, forensic pathologist joining
me out of Columbia. Dr. Dupre, so great to have you on with us tonight. Thank you. How can we tell from the four bullet wounds whether she was
trying to defend herself? Is there way to tell that?
MICHELLE DUPRE, FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Nancy, we would look at the trajectory of all the bullet wounds and determine the angle at which they
entered the body, and from that we can draw some conclusions. We also look at how far away the gun was held toward the target to determine if it was
close range or distant or anything like that to see if maybe there was a struggle. So, we can tell a lot of things by actually looking at the wounds
themselves.
GRACE: You know you`re right. For instance, if the bullets are to the back of the head or to the back, then you`ll know that she, the mother-in-law,
was not under attack. You know, to Dr. Tiffany Sanders, joining me in addition to Dr. Michelle Dupre -- Tiffany Sanders, psychologist --this
takes the mother-in-law, the evil mother-in-law to a whole new level.
TIFFANY SANDERS, PSYCHOLOGIST: Right, Nancy. These are stories you just can`t make up. I am concerned that the mother-in-law forgot she was the
mother-in-law. It sounds like a sorted, twisted love affair and that she was hurt that her husband was -- her son was cheating on her. Again, it is
very disgusting and it`s a mess relationship.
Only people with unhealthy boundaries or unhealthy relationships or maybe mentally disturbed do these sorts of thing, and that`s why she was
hospitalized at least two weeks prior to the murder
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Bernie Grimm and Kenya Johnson -- OK, Bernie Grimm, there`s no evidence there was another weapon in that home. So, this
can`t possibly be self-defense just because the daughter may have slapped the mother-in-law. That doesn`t give her a right to shoot her four times. I
don`t even have evidence of a slap.
GRIMM: No, I mean thank God there`s no weapons this my mother-in-law`s home because I wouldn`t be around to do this wonderful show now and again. But,
yeah, it`s tragic. It`s sad. There are kids in the home...
GRACE: That`s all you got for me? It`s tragic and it`s sad. You`re the defense lawyer Grimm. You`re the defense lawyer. What about it Kenya?
GRIMM: I`m leading up to it. I`m trying to get the jury to hear me, but you got those fancy Loubou shoes. I can`t overcome that.
JOHNSON: Investigators are going to be looking to see whether there were prior difficulties between the parties`s whether there had been previous
threats. And her internet searches goes toward premeditation. We`ve got to look and see if there was some sort of threat that we can easily translate.
[21:00:00] GRACE: OK, Grimm, Johnson, Dupre, Sanders, Levatan and Kimbler, thank you. We remember American hero Army staff sergeant Christopher
Everet, just 23, Huntsville, Texas. Corrections officer, loved the outdoors. Parents Patrick and Lorraine, sister Dawn, brother, Kyle serving
the Marines -- be on safe. Christopher Everett, American hero. Thanks to our guests but especially to you for being with us. Nancy Grace signing
off. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp eastern, and until then, good night friend.
END
