Return to Transcripts main page
Nancy Grace
Female Jogger`s Body Found in New York Marsh; Three Walmart Employees Apprehend a Suspected Shoplifter; FSU Law Professor Gunned Down
Aired August 04, 2016 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. A gorgeous young 30-year-old vanishes while jogging not far from her own home. And in a shocking twist,
her retired firefighter dad out searching with police, desperately looking for his daughter, finds her body in a swampy marsh near the jogging path,
with evidence she was both sex assaulted and strangled in broad daylight. This as tonight, eerie new journal entries seem to predict her own murder.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re investigating the homicide of a 30-year-old female named Karina Vetrano. She`s an active jogger.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Missing (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Father had walked us through this path to help us with where she normally ran.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her father made the gruesome discovery.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We found her face down in the ground. There`s evidence of strangulation, asphyxiation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Three Walmart employees go berserk when they apprehend a suspected shoplifter, leaving the elderly Walmart shopper dead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He died in the parking lot of the store.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He died of -- with 15 broken ribs.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He doesn`t have a pulse now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re doing their job. I mean, what, are they just supposed to let this thief leave Walmart?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: A young, up and coming FSU law professor gunned down in the family`s upscale neighborhood right in the driveway to their two-story
family home. Was the execution-style killing actually part of a murder- for-hire plot set in motion after a bitter divorce? Tonight, in the last hours, the law professor`s wife denies involvement in this sickening
murder-for-hire plot.
Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell tonight. A gorgeous young 30-year-old vanishes while jogging not far from her own home. In a shocking twist, her retired firefighter dad
out searching with the police, looking desperately for his daughter, actually finds her body in a marsh near the jogging path.
There`s evidence she was both sex assaulted and strangled in broad daylight. This as tonight, eerie new journal entries come to light where
she seems to actually predict her own murder. What happened to this gorgeous young woman, Karina?
Straight out to Sarah Ganim, CNN investigations correspondent. Sarah, thank you for being with us. Let`s start with cause of death. What do we
know, Sarah?
SARAH GANIM, CNN INVESTIGATIONS CORRESPONDENT: The medical examiner`s office told us today the cause of death was strangulation. They are
labeling this a homicide. We are also learning that the NYPD is taking a look at a condom and condom wrapper that were found nearby.
As you mentioned, absolutely terrifying story. She went out for a jog at 5:00 o`clock -- this was still broad daylight -- and was found face down in
this marshy area.
GRACE: Oh! Terrible! Chris Spargo joining me, in addition with Sarah, Chris Spargo, reporter, Dailymail.com. Chris, thank you for being with us.
I want to understand this area. As a matter of fact, there it is right there. Thank you, Justin. This is not a busy freeway. It`s out along a
beach, Howard Beach. It`s marshy. There are dunes. There are marshes there. How long had she been gone from her home, Chris Spargo? She lives
there with her mother and father. How long had she been gone when the father got concerned?
CHRIS SPARGO, DAILYMAIL.COM (via telephone): Well, she left a little before 5:00 PM. And she`d done this run so many times. It has only been
about two hours when she wasn`t answering her cellphone that her father started to really become concerned that she wasn`t back because it was so
unlike her. And then four hours later is when they went to search and found her.
GRACE: Wow. Four hours into it. Now, Chris Spargo, wasn`t this her usual run? I mean, she was an avid runner. And it`s my understanding that her
mom is actually battling cancer. And so she is in the home with her father, The retired firefighter, and her mom, I`m sure helping to take care
of her mom.
Here are exclusive photos from Dailymail.com on line. She`s there in the home trying to take care of her mom, along with her father, now retired.
And I`m wondering if this was part of her escape, that she would go running practically every day, Chris. I don`t think she ever missed a day.
SPARGO: That`s really exactly what it was. It was for her and her father. It was a routine that every single night, they would spend this hour. They
would go for a jog together. And then this one night, because he was hurt, she went out alone and this happened.
[20:05:08]GRACE: You know, Chris, you and I have discussed that my father recently passed away. And that is something we always did together
whenever we could. You know, he was a heart patient. And so he would go on this very long walks, and he goes really fast, and I would jog to keep
up with him. And we would do it all the time, every time we were together.
I`m just imagining these two jogging together all the time. And he had had this little injury so he couldn`t go that day. And now she`s gone. I
mean, to me, it`s really heartbreaking for that father.
I want to go through the timeline, Chris. Let`s start at the beginning. Now, you`re saying that she went out around 5:00 o`clock. And at this time
of year, I mean, we`ve just passed the equinox. It`s still light outside, right?
Oh, here we go. Tell me about the timeline, Chris Spargo.
SPARGO: I mean, yes, she went out a little before 5:00 PM, and like you said, I mean, this is summertime so it`s incredibly light out. It`s going
to be light out for the next three hours until about 8:00, 8:30. So this entire time that she would have been out there would have been completely
light with other people around, presumably.
GRACE: We`re showing you a spot right now near where the body is found. So that is the terrain. I`m just saying, if she ran this route practically
every day -- she`d be gone between one and two hours, very physically fit. After four hours, the father gets worried and starts trying -- he`s trying
to call her and finally goes out looking.
And isn`t it true, Sarah, he finds his daughter`s body? I just can`t even imagine that!
GANIM: Yes, it`s heartbreaking. Police are saying that they actually brought in a special unit to try and track her phone. They pinged and
found her phone nearby, and were searching in that area when her father, who was with detectives, with some NYPD, was actually the one who first
spotted her.
GRACE: Let me understand something you just said, Sarah. So you`re saying that they could ping her, I guess, like find my iPhone, like, take your
iPad and look for it that way. Is that how they found her?
GANIM: They brought in their own technology to able to find her phone in that area. You can see from those pictures it`s a marshy area. You know,
imagine a cell phone on the ground in this area. So they had actually brought in some additional technology to help NYPD find the phone.
GRACE: So they can ping immediately. This vegetation can reach as high as 10 feet, lots of joggers, cyclists, dog walkers, often used by fishermen.
But who would see her in broad daylight and be so bold that they would sex attack her and kill her in broad daylight?
Hey, let`s listen. What can we learn from what police are telling us?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At about 1700 last night, thereabouts, sometimes afterwards, she went for an evening run, not with her father this time.
Usually, she runs with him. He had an injured back and he could not go.
At some point after that, her father began to get worried where she was. She didn`t return home normally. He called a member of the service, a
police chief who lives nearby, who then called 911.
We immediately began searching the area for where she was. We called our tactical response unit, who came up and went on her phone because she had
her phone when she runs. She listens to music. She also texts and calls friends, as well. So right now, we have cell phone investigation going on,
as well.
Finally, about 9:00 o`clock in the evening, they found a ping on her phone. It was somewhere in the brush off the path. The father had walked us
through this path to help us with what -- where she normally ran. The father then went into the woods and then found the body with our detectives
right after him. You can imagine his angst at that point.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: You know, I want to go through, Michael Christian, the number of sex offenders in this area. It is incredible! Justin, see if you can pull
up the map for me regarding the number of sex offenders.
Oh, dear Lord in heaven! Michael, how many sex offenders in that area?
MICHAEL CHRISTIAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: It`s over 1,500, Nancy. I think it`s 1,570. That`s within a 10-mile radius of where this body was found.
GRACE: Oh, no! Oh, no, 1,570 registered sex offenders. It is a beautiful area. Let me see the shot again of where she was found. It`s natural.
It`s beautiful. It`s near the beach, near the actual water.
I want to go back through what we can learn. Michael, what can you tell me about love interests?
CHRISTIAN: Nancy, we know that she had recently broken up with a boyfriend. But police have emphasized that he is not a suspect. They
spoke to him, and apparently, he had an ironclad alibi. it checked out. He`s not a suspect in any way.
[20:10:06]GRACE: Now, isn`t it true he lives, like, 40, 45 minutes away?
CHRISTIAN: You know, I`m not sure of that. I`m sorry. I don`t know that.
GRACE: But the issue is, regardless of where he lived, he`s got an ironclad alibi. You`re telling me that?
CHRISTIAN: Correct. Yes, that`s what police have said.
GRACE: OK, because that`s where all investigations start. To Joe Scott Morgan, certified death investigation, professor of forensics, Jacksonville
State University. So I`m curious about the injuries to the body.
Was she actually assaulted, or was this staged to make it look like she was assaulted? Because her pants were only partially pulled down. Her sports
bra was still on, but in disarray. Now, there is a sign of vaginal and anal trauma. I`m trying to figure out, was this staged. Also, we`ve got
broken teeth. To me, that`s the giveaway that she really was assaulted and this was not staged.
JOSEPH SCOTT MORGAN, CERTIFIED DEATH INVESTIGATOR: Yes, the nature of these very interpersonal crimes, Nancy, very intimate, up close and
personal -- I worked a number of sexual assault-related homicides over the course of my career. I`ve had any number of perpetrators that after they
have sexually assaulted someone, they will literally go back and attempt to what`s called "re-dress" the body. And sometimes, it`s a signature. I
think that this is very troubling.
Another point here is that if she was running the same route every single day, this opens up the door that she was possibly targeted after somebody
had watched her over and over and over again. And they knew this underpopulated area where they could take her off and perpetrate this
horrible, horrible crime.
GRACE: You know, Chris Spargo, reporter, Dailymail.com, the idea that`s just been conjured up by Joseph Scott Morgan of re-dressing a body that has
been assaulted and murdered -- obviously, this is somebody that didn`t think they were going to get caught. I wonder if her body -- if the event
took place further into the marsh. I`m just trying to understand the psychology behind someone that would re-dress a dead body, Chris Spargo.
SPARGO: Well, it`s unclear they would really have the time to do that, though, because don`t forget, she`d only left four hours earlier, and she
was found about 15 feet from this bike path. But again, police are not really saying anything on the record yet. All we really know now are
things that sources are claiming. So we don`t have a 100 percent full picture yet.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:16:12]UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her and her father would go running here often.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her father was not running with her last night.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Inside the heavily wooded and weeded area, an area he told his daughter never to run alone.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her father began to get worried where she didn`t return home normally.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police suited up, scouring the area.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The father went into the woods and then found the body with our detectives right after him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: What happened to this girl? She lives at home with her mom and dad. Her mom is battling cancer. She is there trying to help take care of
the mom, the dad a retired firefighter.
And tonight, her family wants answers. She goes jogging in broad daylight. She is attacked and murdered. Her father, out desperately looking for his
child with police, finds her body.
With me is CNN investigations correspondent Sarah Ganim. Sarah, again, thank you for being with us. Question. Eerie writings in her journal are
almost clairvoyant. What did she write in her journal?
GANIM: You know, she was quite the -- she had quite a bit of following on social media, not just her journal but also on Instagram, 9,000 followers.
She talked about how much she loved to travel, how much she loved her father. And also, a near-death experience. She was in Nice, France,
around the time of the attacks, the terror attacks there several weeks ago. And when she came back, she wrote about how she was happy to be home.
GRACE: You know, Michael Christian, the eerie writings that seem to be almost clairvoyant have really captured my attention. What did she write?
CHRISTIAN: Yes, they`ve become poignant, Nancy. There`s one where she wrote, you know, "Have you ever really found solace in the thought of
dying? Sometimes when I`m feeling really sad and lonely and misunderstood, I wonder if right now, at this age and this time of my life, if by freak
accident I died, what would happen?"
There`s another one. "It helps me realize that all these stupid little events that happen and that I think are so catastrophic and meaningful
aren`t so at all." And then, "In the big picture of life, it`s only the good stuff that will be accounted for."
She says on one, "I think of my family only for a few seconds because of the pain that this brings me. It brings me no solace. I play out what my
eulogy would sound like and how only my best friend would know exactly what to say."
GRACE: Wow.
CHRISTIAN: And the last one I saw was about how we`re all here for a very limited time.
GRACE: You know, Michael, that is so profound that she`s writing this in her journal, and within days, she goes jogging and she never comes home.
And this while she`s trying to take care of her mother battling cancer, worried about her mother`s death, thinking about death as her mom battles
this illness, and it`s her that death takes and not her mother.
At this hour, we are asking for tips, 1-800-577-TIPS. To Chris Spargo, what is the working theory right now that police are following?
SPARGO: So what we`re hearing now is that police do believe it was a stranger that took this attack, which is why they are trying to interview
people in the area, like you mentioned, sex offenders, homeless people. They are starting to think -- some sources are saying it was possibly a
sexual assault. That`s looking more and more like a likely possibility.
And they`re still trying to piece this together because they still have a lot of work to do. The father is actually still out there collecting
evidence with the police every day to try to solve this.
GRACE: You`re seeing exclusive photos from Dailymail.com.
Here`s my problem with what you just said, Chris Spargo, Dailymail.com. All the facts you presented are true. The only problem I have with this
being stranger on stranger is that I can`t even think of a stranger on stranger case that I either tried or covered where the stranger took the
time to re-dress an assaulted body, that they actually took the time to do that.
[20:20:20]Now, on the other hand -- to Dr. Charles Sophy, psychiatrist joining us, author of "Side by Side" -- Dr. Sophy, I also find it difficult
to believe that anybody that knew her, even somebody that she used to date or had a relationship with, would have broken her teeth out and sexually
assaulted her.
If this were revenge or anger, I think they would have just killed her. So there are pros and cons to each theory, stranger or intimate, right?
DR. CHARLES SOPHY, PSYCHIATRIST: Absolutely. Yes. And I think that if it was -- it`s more looking like it`s a stranger because at this point, if it
was somebody mentally ill or somebody who wasn`t capable of really pulling it off, that`s maybe why she wasn`t even undressed. You know, we`re
assuming she got re-dressed, but maybe she wasn`t undressed. And it doesn`t make sense that she`s so sad and angry and depressed and she ends
up dead. That doesn`t connect, either.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:25:22]UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The mysterious death of 30-year-old Karina Vetrano.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We finally -- at about 9:00 o`clock in the evening, they found a pinging on her phone. It was somewhere in the brush off the
path. But there`s a lot of forensic evidence, as well as digital evidence in the area. We`re investigating the homicide.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For any clue that can help lead them to a suspect.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: What happened to her? Straight to the police presser.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We found her face down in the ground. We immediately called EMS, who came to the scene and pronounced her body. Right now,
there`s evidence of strangulation, asphyxiation. There`s some petechiae hemorrhaging that we`re looking at right now. The autopsy is done at about
11:00 o`clock this morning (INAUDIBLE) between 11:00 and 11:30.
She entered the park at 164 and 83rd Street. It`s a normal part of her run. There are other joggers, as well, who use that, as well, there`s also
people -- there`s some beer cans back there, so (INAUDIBLE) some kids hanging out back there, as well. Right now, we`re investigating anybody
who uses this park.
There is a lot of evidence, digital evidence and home video cameras that look at the street. Right now, we`re collecting that, as well. We have
here at one point about 5:46 running by one of the homes there.
The phone is going to help us out. We have other evidence at the scene. When we go further, there`s a lot of forensic evidence, as well as digital
evidence in the area. But we have -- again, we`re in the middle of this homicide scene. We`ll go forward as we get more information.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: If she was sexually assaulted, there should be DNA. Now, Michael, isn`t it true that a condom and a condom wrapper were found not far away?
CHRISTIAN: That`s right, Nancy. The other thing, however, you have to remember is this an area that`s very hidden because the vegetation is so
tall. So people go there sometimes to have sex or to drink or to do drugs. So it could be that that condom and that wrapper doesn`t have anything to
do with this case. We just don`t know.
GRACE: You know, what can you tell me about her? Where did she work? What did she do? What do we know about her?
CHRISTIAN: She had recently gotten a master`s degree from St. Johns University. She worked as a caterer for a huge catering hall in Howard
Beach. She was also a speech therapist.
GRACE: You`re taking a look at Karina Vetrano, just 30 years old. Tonight, who killed this girl in broad daylight? There is a reward, 1-800-
577-TIPS, 1-800-577-8477. Her parents begging for your help.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
**
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Do three Walmart employees go overboard when they apprehend a suspected shoplifter, leaving the elderly Walmart shopper dead?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Somebody was stealing from the store and we chased him down and we had him on the ground.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Someone dying over some items, some material things, it`s horrible.
GRACE: What happened? What is -- the irony to this is that nothing was actually stolen from the Walmart store. Apparently, Ray Caputo joining me
from WDBO, what happened is I see a guy with dozens, I believe, of DVDs and he is making his way to the door.
He`s an elderly Walmart shopper and as he gets to the door, the alarm goes off that there is one of those tags on there that hasn`t been scanned and
he is rushed, what happens then, Ray?
RAY CAPUTO, REPORTER, NEWS 96.5 WDBO: Well, Kenneth Wisham, 64-year-old Kenneth Wisham starts running out of the store and into the parking line
and several employees give a chase and when Wisham is running, his pants are sagging he eventually falls down, the three employees jumped on him for
about 10 minutes. Now, he is saying that he can`t breathe, he even stops moving. And then he make another call to 911 saying this person that they
have on the ground is not breathing anymore, so he eventually died.
GRACE: I want you to hear this, Ray Caputo. Listen.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You have somebody on the way, right?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. But tell me exactly what happened.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Somebody was stealing from the store and we chased him down and we had him on the ground and we were putting like too much force
on him but he doesn`t have a pulse now.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. And are you with the patient now?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. And how old is he approximately?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How old do you think he is? He has some gray hair.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. But if you were to guess his age, what would you say?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fifties.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Fifties. OK, and is he awake?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He has his eyes closed?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is he breathing?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s not breathing either.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are you right by him now?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Lay him flat on his back on the floor ground and remove any pillows.
GRACE: He died. You know, unleash (ph) the lawyers, Eric Johnson, defence attorney out of Atlanta, Kisha Hebbon, defence attorney out of New York.
First to you Eric Johnson, I distinctly recall the very first jury trial I ever had was a shoplifting from a Kmart. It was foisted upon me, I had no
choice, try it or else. Well, the guy didn`t take anything.
He wandered around at Kmart for, you know, they were all watching him through the mirrors, the security was. He left the DVD player in the Kmart
and left. They ran out, attacked him and dragged him across the asphalt and brought him in. I had to try that. I tried the case and told the jury,
look, the grand jury got it wrong. This is not a shoplifting. This is an attempt to shoplifting, OK?
So, was for sure, the guy didn`t even take anything. He ran out without the merchandise. What`s your defence of these Walmart employees?
ERIC JOHNSON, DEFENCE ATTORNEY: Well, attempted shoplifting is still in -- still in of itself is a crime and the Walmart employees in this case, they
had the authority to go out and stop him and try to detain him for the authorities. Under Florida law, their actions would be justified.
Now, the amount of force that may have been used may have resulted in his death but as long as they were acting reasonably and had reasonable belief
that he was and in fact is possibly trying to steal something, their actions would be justified and possibly upheld and defensive (ph).
GRACE: OK. You know, who is joining me right now, special guest out of Tampa, the lawyer for one of the Walmart employees, Nathan Higgins, Rusty
Franklin. OK, Rusty, thank you for being with us.
RUSTY FRANKLIN, DEFENCE ATTORNEY OF WALMART EMPLOYEE, NATHAN HIGGINS: My pleasure.
GRACE: Give me your defence because hi, I`m a huge Walmart fan, OK? So, I don`t want to think that they would do anything wrong, but when you`re
sitting on top of the guy and he`s saying I can`t breathe and he is dead, I don`t think that that is what Walmart management has in mind. Give me your
best shot, Rusty.
FRANKLIN: Nancy, it`s a nightmare of epidemic proportions for Mr. Higgins. He is 35 years old. He has three children, worked at Walmart for seven
years. When the incident occurred he was on his break, in his truck, not participating in the apprehension of the shoplifter. So, he had no
intention or no involvement in the apprehension or the pursuit of Mr. Higgins.
GRACE: Yes.
FRANKLIN: A manager tells him there is a freakiest something going on. He goes over to the scene, observes two Walmart employees and the gentlemen
who ultimately died, he is kicking and flailing his legs. Mr. Higgins, then Nathan, grabs his legs not with the intention to injure or apprehend, but
to be a Good Samaritan to his co-employees. When he hears someone yell let go, let go he lets go.
He recognizes that the person is not breathing. So, again, Mr. Higgins is nothing more than a Good Samaritan trying to protect his fellow employees.
And what he is trying to do is he was told by his supervisor, go over there and assist. So, it`s just a horrific nightmare for this gentleman.
GRACE: You know, the way you phrase that, Rusty, it almost makes me feel sorry for your client who is out there on his break and somebody says get
over there and stop that guy, so he runs over and grabs the guy`s legs.
FRANKLIN: Right and Nancy...
GRACE: I just don`t see how grabbing his legs had anything to do with the guy dying, but did that facilitate somebody else sitting on him -- on his
chest?
FRANKLIN: Well, from what we`ve understand to know that the deceased was on his stomach and two of the security people were in his upper torso in that
area. Mr. Higgins, again though, never is in his chest, his upper body area, all of his contact with him is in his legs.
How long he was holding him and what was going on? You know, that`s -- those are facts to be determined in the case. But again, Mr. Higgins, by
holding this man`s legs did nothing to contribute to his death. And, you know, the state`s theory I guess is that, you know, he was assisting those
people in their actions.
GRACE: They were sitting on his chest. OK, let`s hear it, Kisha Hebbon. You know Rusty Franklin, very well respected lawyer in that jurisdiction and
what`s going to be the problem for his client is that if he is perceived to have helped the other two who were basically sitting on the guy`s chest
from the way I hear it, so what`s your defence?
KISHA HEBBON, DEFENCE ATTORNEY OUT OF NEW YORK: Well, Nancy first of all, I think there was -- the employees were justified in pursuing this guy. He
attempted to shoplift when...
GRACE: ...right there -- right there little lady, hold on. Even cops can`t shoot at or use deadly force to apprehend unless it is a fleeing felon.
HEBBON: But Nancy, we don`t know...
GRACE: OK? Attempted shoplifting is not -- under $1,000 is not going to rise to a felony.
HEBBON: Right, but they have every right to apprehend him. That`s the part of their job and we don`t know if he resisted arrest...
GRACE: OK. Right.
HEBBON: ...or he had some pre-existing medical condition that caused his death, we don`t know that.
GRACE: All right, you want me to what focus on his gallbladder as opposed to my sitting on his chest and he is saying I can`t breathe. OK, Kisha, I
can`t breathe. Mike Duffy, help me out. What do we know? Start at the beginning.
MIKE DUFFY, NANCY GRACE REPORTER: Well, Nancy we know that this gentleman when he fled the store was already having some difficulty running on his
own. He was then held down by several employees, three to be exact. And witnesses report that they say punching and kicking going on.
GRACE: Punching and kicking, I didn`t know about punching and kicking Mike Duffy.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He died in the parking lot of the store.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He died of -- with 15 broken ribs.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But he doesn`t have a pulse now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re doing their job. And what are they supposed to let this thief leave Walmart?
GRACE: Well, the thing is, he didn`t actually get anything out of Wal Mart. He left the DVDs behind. They had their stuff, so why 15 broken ribs? The
guy is saying I can`t breathe. Listen to this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, we need an officer at the Walmart, North Lakeland, North 98.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tell us what`s going on there?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re holding somebody down. We need somebody right now.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. What did they do?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What did they do? Stole a bunch of DVDs and other things.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Female or male?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m sorry.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Male or female?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Male.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: White, black or Hispanic?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We need somebody right now.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m getting in the car right over. White, black, or Hispanic?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: White.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. And you`re holding him down?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sorry?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You`re holding him down?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did he have any weapons?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m sorry, he`s like yelling.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did he have any weapons?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t think so.
GRACE: You can actually hear the guy in the background, Rusty Franklin, attorney for Nathan Higgins, one of the three Walmart employees saying, I
can`t breathe. You can hear him moaning in the background. That`s not going to help at trial. I`m just warning you right now.
FRANKLIN: Well, Nancy, just a couple of very brief points on the law.
GRACE: OK.
FRANKLIN: First of all, Florida has no attempted theft. Theft occurs either with the attempt or the actual completion of the act. Second, theft is a
felony in the State of Florida if the value of the property is greater than $300. Third, Florida has a strong public policy recognizing and immunizing
merchants for the apprehension of shoplifters.
GRACE: Put them up.
FRANKLIN: But with all those things aside, Nancy, Mr. Higgins, Nathan, his actions were motivated not to -- not to apprehend or assist. He had no
knowledge about what are going on in the store. He was over there to help his co-workers.
GRACE: I hear you.
FRANKLIN: But again...
GRACE: I hear you.
FRANKLIN: ...when he heard, I can`t breathe...
GRACE: So, you`re telling me that in Florida there is no such thing as an attempted crime like attempted robbery?
FRANKLIN: There are certainly attempts but Florida statute on theft, which is 8112.014...
GRACE: And shoplifting is merged in with theft there, there`s not a...
FRANKLIN: Correct.
GRACE: ...specific charge on -- hold on -- hold on, Joseph Scott Morgan is back with me, just got 15 broken ribs over some DVDs that never made it out
the door?
JOSEPH SCOTT MORGAN, CERTIFIED DEATH: Well, yes. Yes, this is -- this is profound, Nancy. You got an older gentleman. He might have kind of a brutal
bone structure at this point in time. And this...
GRACE: I don`t know about that.
MORGAN: ...well, yes. They could come about any number of ways. We heard about this idea that he`s been kicked.
GRACE: Right.
MORGAN: They could have splintered the ribs this way. But also we have to understand that they`re talking about compression or mechanical --
mechanical asphyxia. That means that this guy...
GRACE: Right.
MORGAN: ...is being compressed downward and held down.
GRACE: Well, we`ll find out more when we can see the complete...
MORGAN: Yes, yes. We will.
GRACE: ...medical examiner`s report.
Everybody, this weekend Summer Olympics begin, Rio de Janeiro celebration of sport.
This week CNN hero understands how inspirational that can be. Scotsman Davie Duke, homeless when soccer or as he calls football motivated him to
transform his life and now he is doing that for thousands of others.
SCOTSMAN DAVIE DUKE, CNN HERO: When you`re homeless, you lose more than just the roof of your head. You lose your dignity, your self-esteem, so you
isolate yourself. Football gives you a place where you belong, confidence, fitness, friendships. It got me my life back.
GRACE: To see how he uses soccer to give thousands their lives back go to cnnheroes.com and nominate someone you think should be a 2016 hero.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: A young up and coming law professor at FSU gunned down in the family`s upscale neighborhood in their own driveway. Was the execution
style of killing actually part of a murder for hire plot set in a motion by a bitter divorce?
In the last hours, the law professor`s wife denies involvement in this sickening murder.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A terrible tragedy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For FSU law professor, Dan Markel...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He shot at his Tallahassee home.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gunned down in his own home.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gunshot wound to the head.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, watch as Markel leaves the gym. He gets back into his car and drives off. But look closer what seems to be that same car
follows him out of the lot?
GRACE: To Roger Schulman, News Director at "The Answer WGUL", Roger, thank you for being with us. So, what I understand is that two people so far have
been charged in the murder of this young FSU professor. Their divorce better...
ROGER SCHULMAN, NEWS DIRECTOR, THE ANSWER WGUL: That is correct. Sigfredo Garcia and Luis Rivera, one of them was a high-level gang member from South
Florida, Miami area.
GRACE: But what`s interesting to you Matt Zarrell is the murder goes down in Tallahassee, these two are in Miami and aren`t they tracked by their
SunPass, their Miami, you know, fast pass that goes through tolls all the way 7 - 9 hour drive to Tallahassee? They don`t know Dan Markel. And they
follow -- listen to the video of them following him in and out of his workout place, a bus happens to capture them following him all around town.
They have no connection to him, so it`s not a crime of passion.
Joining us right now is the attorney from one of these gentlemen, Saam Zengeneh. Mr. Zengeneh, thank you for being with us. What would possibly be
in it for your client to go and gun down somebody, follow him around town all day long that he doesn`t even know?
SAAM ZENGENEH, ATTORNEY FOR ACCUSED KILLER SIGFREDO GARCIA: Well, that`s a million dollar question, isn`t it Nancy? I`ll tell you listen, a lot of
story that you`re telling the viewers, the story that`s been printed through the media and promulgated by the state attorney`s office is just
that. They have the story. They have very vague details. They, you know, they are really trying to formulate a fantasy reservation (ph) of like a
sexy novel here to be able to substantiate the fact that the evidence that they have in this case is pitiful. It`s...
GRACE: Hold on, I hear you and I appreciate what you`re doing for your client, but Roger Schulman, News Director WGUL, we have the two of these
guys renting a car in Miami and going all the way to Tallahassee, I guess seven to nine hours away there they are right there in the rental car.
Their SunPass tracks them all the way to Tallahassee. We see them from bus video following him around town. And, then there are the 2,000 texts and
phone calls that one of them makes to the wife`s brother`s friend and then the minute the murder goes down, no more connection. What about that,
Roger?
SCHULMAN: It`s kind of suspicious isn`t it? Why would the two men suddenly leave Miami, spend the day in Tallahassee supposedly to take a look at the
campus for further education, they`re both are in their mid-30s.
GRACE: You know, the family of the wife of Dan Markel are not suspect. And they vehemently deny any involvement in a murder-for-hire plot. Matt
Zarrell, tell me what do we know based on court documents about the acrimonious and bitter divorce, specifically, regarding custody of their
children.
MATT ZARRELL, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Regarding custody of the children, the judge had formally signed off on the divorce but they fought over
everything from money to the children. Apparently, Dan Markel did not want the parents-in-law, the wife`s parents to have supervised -- he wanted only
supervised visitation with the two children and apparently there was an upcoming court hearing about one of the grandparents were only going to get
supervised visits, but before they can have the court hearing, Dan Markel is murdered.
GRACE: You know, there were allegations to Dr. Charles Sophy, Psychiatrist in outside of LA, there were allegations made by the husband, Markel, the
FSU law professor that his mother-in-law would call him stupid and other claims like that. I mean that`s not the worst possible criticism but to his
children, and he petitions to court for only limited supervised visits with the grandparents, the grandparents-in-law. I mean this was a very bitter
divorce. And I don`t know if these claims are true or false. But what I`m saying is, lot of bad claims here and then suddenly he`s dead.
DR. CHARLES SOPHY, D.O., PSYCHIATRIST: Absolutely. Yes, a lot of bad claims, a lot of pushing him out of the way, disrespecting him in front of
his kids is going to make him angry and he`s going not want them around his children without supervision.
GRACE: You know, another thing very quickly Matt Zarrell, isn`t it true the wife wanted to move away, what to Miami, the Miami area?
ZARRELL: Yes.
GRACE: And, he as a law professor up in Tallahassee and the court would not let her move with the children, right?
ZARRELL: No, and her parents desperately wanted her to move with the children to South Florida. They wanted it as much as she did apparently.
GRACE: Again, the wife and her family deny any involvement in this murder or any suggestion that it`s a murder for hire plot and they are not
suspects.
Let`s remember American hero, Ray Fuhrmann II, 28, Nevada, California, Silver Star, Purple Heart, big friendly, loving, father Michael,
grandfather Ray, stepfather Eric, brother Tyler, sister Leila, widow Talia. Ray Fuhrmann, II, American Hero.
Thanks to our guests and especially to you for being with us. Nancy grace signing off, I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern and until
then, good night, friend.
END
