Return to Transcripts main page
One World with Zain Asher
World Leaders Address U.N. Amid Steep Global Challenges; Biden Addresses UNGA For The Last Time As President; IDF Says It Launched "Targeted Strike" In Southern Beirut; New CNN Poll: No Clear Leader Between Harris And Trump; Former Hostage Speaks To CNN About Her Ordeal; Herzog: We Have The Right To Defend Ourselves; Aired 12:00-1:00p ET
Aired September 24, 2024 - 12:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[12:00:27]
BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN HOST: Hello, everyone. Live from New York, I'm Bianna Golodryga.
ZAIN ASHER, CNN HOST: And I'm Zain Asher. This is ONE WORLD.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is CNN Breaking News.
ASHER: All right. We want to start with a brand-new CNN poll in the U.S. presidential race. We've known the race is, of course, very close for quite
some time, but this new poll shows just how close.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. Kamala Harris and Donald Trump are in a virtual tie, 48 percent to 47 percent.
Election day is in exactly six weeks, but voters are already casting ballots in a number of states. We're going to break down the results of
this new CNN poll with our political director, David Chalian, in a few minutes, including a shift we're seeing in voters' attitudes towards the
race.
But first, I have hope, and I know there is a way forward. That's the message from U.S. President Joe Biden and his final address to the U.N.
General Assembly as president.
ASHER: Speech began with a look back at the key events over his 50 years in public service. He then turned to the current conflicts in both Ukraine and
the Middle East. President Biden touted his efforts to end the Israel-Gaza war, but says it's time for all those involved to lay down their weapons.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I put forward with Qatar and Egypt to cease fire and hostage deal. It's been endorsed by the U.N.
Security Council. Now is the time for the parties to finalize its terms, bring the hostages home, and secure security for Israel and Gaza free of
Hamas' grip. Ease the suffering in Gaza and end this war.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: President Biden then looked toward the future. His message of peace to the gathered leaders came with a reminder, it's the people that
matter most, and we're here to serve them, not the other way around. He also ended with a note of optimism.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: I know many look at the world today and see difficulties and react with despair, but I do not. I won't. As leaders, we don't have the luxury.
I recognize the challenges from Ukraine to Gaza, to Sudan, and beyond, but maybe because all I've seen and all we have done together over the decades,
I have hope. I know there is a way forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ASHER: All right. We are covering all the angles of this story and of everything that's going on at the U.N. General Assembly right now. Kevin
Liptak is at the White House for us.
But first, let's begin with Richard Roth at the U.N. So because of what is happening in the Middle East, everybody was keen to hear what the U.S.
president says about the crisis in Lebanon.
He essentially said that, look, a full-scale war is not in anybody's interest. And, of course, his priority was trying to figure out a
diplomatic solution. Richard, take us through it.
RICHARD ROTH, CNN U.N. CORRESPONDENT: Well, we're kind of at that full- scale war almost with thousands of rockets and thousands of casualties. Even two U.N. refugee agency workers killed today in the latest strikes.
President Biden told the General Assembly, you know, we need a deal, get a deal. But Israel has long ago ignored the U.N. and Hamas is a terror
organization. So these are not parties that are going to listen to the diplomats here.
For the president of the United States, he was, as we heard, hopeful on the future. He also stressed the need for unity, such as working with a group
such as NATO. He said, we're stronger united with everyone on board, perhaps a note to the isolationist theme of former President Donald Trump,
who may be here next year again.
GOLODRYGA: And, Kevin Liptak, I want to turn to you, because aside from the war there in Gaza and concerns about rising tensions between Hezbollah and
Israel, there's also a war we know in Sudan that the president talked about, and then Ukraine, which was a primary focus of last year's U.N.
General Assembly and the president's speech.
He continues to focus on it throughout these remaining few months of his presidency, and a really important meeting that he is gearing up for with
President Zelenskyy who will be presenting him his victory plan.
And perhaps, we will see some policy changes, specifically as it relates to long-range missile use by Ukrainians inside of Russia. Talk to us more
about how the president is preparing for this meeting.
[12:05:59]
KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes. Perhaps we'll see that, although the president did just say, I think it was yesterday, that he
hasn't made up his mind about whether to grant Ukraine permission to fire those long-range missiles deeper into Russian territory.
But that's certainly something that Zelenskyy wants. A lot of other world leaders are pressuring the United States to come to this decision. And it
will all kind of come to a head in that meeting on Thursday.
And certainly we will also hear from Zelenskyy when he addresses the U.N. himself, talking about his need for greater capabilities, if he is to win
the war against Russia.
And you heard President Biden in his speech trying to take credit for his efforts to rally the world behind Ukraine amid this aggression from Russia.
It's something that he is, you know, proud of. It's something that he wants to take a victory lap in some ways.
But at the end of the day, the war is still going on, and the president didn't necessarily describe how the war might come to an end.
And if you were listening to this speech, looking for any sort of new capabilities, new strategies, you were walking away still waiting to hear
that from the president. I think in a lot of ways, this was a valedictory speech. You know, this was the capstone of a very long career in foreign
policy for the president.
And you heard him kind of tick through all of the various foreign crises that he's engaged with throughout his 50-year career, starting with the
Cold War in Vietnam and apartheid in South Africa, ending with the conflicts that he is still dealing with today.
This was always going to be a tough speech in some ways for the president. It's a tough moment. The world is still very much on fire in a lot of ways
in the Middle East, in Ukraine, in Sudan.
It wasn't a speech that he was going to be able to come out and say, I've brought peace to the world. Instead, he talked about the ways in which he
is trying to bring these parties together and said that the U.S. and the world are at an inflection point.
And I think you can interpret that to mean we're at an inflection point in the Middle East or Ukraine, but you could also interpret it to mean we're
at an inflection point in the United States, on the cusp of a very critical election that will determine the future of American foreign policy.
And you hear the president warning that a return to the isolationism of President Trump wouldn't necessarily resolve all of these conflicts.
And so the president had a lot that he wanted to give, but at the end of the day, this was the shortest U.N. speech that he's ever given. The last
three years were a little bit longer than this. And I think it tells you that the president didn't necessarily come to this speech with a lot of new
strategies, but certainly wanting to talk about what he has done so far to bring the world to where it is right now.
ASHER: Richard, let me bring you back in because, obviously, three major wars brewing around the world. You talk about Ukraine, Sudan. Of course,
you've got what's happening in Gaza and now Lebanon as well.
When you look at the U.N. as a body, this is the 79th U.N. General Assembly, is the U.N., as a body, really equipped to provide any kind of
meaningful, diplomatic, long-term solution to the various crises we're seeing break out across the world?
ROTH: Well, I haven't been here for all 79. The members of the United Nations heard Antonio Guterres, the U.N. Secretary General, in his most
dire speech yet. The rhetoric keeps escalating as the years go by.
But he warned of a powder keg ready to explode. He said that leaders of these conflicts thinks they have a get-out-of-jail free card in their
pocket. And he warned of a cataclysm ahead. He knows these issues very well.
I asked him at a press conference last week when I overheard him saying to hostage families of Israel, I have no power. He said, I have no money. I
have no troops, aggressive troops, but he has his voice.
Well, he keeps using his voice. And as you mentioned, we have three major conflicts going on besides the other side wars that are happening.
It doesn't appear, I've said it before, that the U.N. can handle all of these now with the balance in leadership of these strongmen. And even the -
- that President Biden said, when he explained his decision to step down and let Kamala Harris become the presidential candidate of the Democratic
Party, he said that, you know, you've got to do more for your country, not for yourself. That got probably the biggest applause of his entire speech.
ASHER: All right. Richard Roth, live for us there. Kevin Liptak, thank you both so much.
All right. As world leaders discuss the spiraling Middle East crisis at the U.N., a situation is escalating very quickly with Israel vowing to
accelerate attacks in Lebanon.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. For the second straight day, the IDF launched what it's calling targeted airstrikes in Beirut, claiming a senior Hezbollah
commander was killed.
The Lebanese Ministry of Health, meanwhile, says at least six people were killed and 15 others wounded in the strike on a residential building in the
southern suburbs.
ASHER: It comes hours after Israel and Hezbollah traded more cross-border fire, and one day after the deadliest day of Israeli airstrikes in Lebanon
in nearly 20 years.
[12:10:09]
The health ministry says 558 people were killed and nearly 2,000 injured. And the U.N. warns that many children remain missing under the rubble as
well.
GOLODRYGA: Our Nic Robertson joins us now live in Tel Aviv.
Nic, we're looking at these numbers. The Israeli military says that 215 rockets were fired from Lebanon today. We already mentioned the targeted
strike. The IDF says that it had in Beirut there targeting a Hezbollah official in charge of missile development.
And, Netanyahu, the prime minister of Israel, addressing the Lebanese people themselves today, telling them that they need to free themselves
from Hezbollah's grip. What more did he have to say?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL EDITOR: Yes. He's repeating the message that he put out to the people of Lebanon yesterday in many ways. He's
saying, we are not your enemy. Israel is not the enemy of the people of Lebanon. It's Hezbollah is our enemy.
And the warning for them to separate themselves out, as the IDF has been saying, get away from where Hezbollah is operating, get away from where it
is storing weapons systems. This is a very, very clear message.
Is it, in reality, going to have any traction in Lebanon? People are fleeing for their lives. They're afraid. Hundreds of people have lost their
lives already. Tens of thousands of people have taken to flight from the south of Lebanon, further north, and others also have been seen crossing
from Lebanon into Syria to try to get away from the possibility of Israeli airstrikes.
So it's not really clear that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's message is going to have traction. It is certainly, one, if he gets to the General
Assembly this week, and it still seems to be a little bit up in the air, if he'll make his time slot on Friday for his expected speech, if this would
be part of his narrative there.
But certainly, it's an important message for Israel to try to signal to Lebanese civilians that they're not the target. But also what is being
signaled is that this operation is not letting up, Northern Arrows. That's the name of the military operation underway.
The Army Chief of Staff, General Hertzi Halevi, has said that it will -- that there should be no reprieve at the moment for Hezbollah, that its
operation should continue full force, that they're going to speed the operation up. And it needs to be continued on all fronts vigorously.
So the signals coming from the IDF are very clear. Their military operation is continuing. It's going to continue to target Hezbollah. But I think
Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's message to the civilians is not one that's going to bring them solace, and the idea that they have really safe
sanctuary.
GOLODRYGA: Nic Robertson live for us from Tel Aviv, thank you so much.
ASHER: All right. Stop me if you've heard this one before, but the race for U.S. president in this country is incredibly close.
GOLODRYGA: I'm shocked. I'm shocked. Shocked.
A brand-new CNN poll released just minutes ago finds Kamala Harris with the smallest of leads over Donald Trump, 48 to 47. Voters prefer Harris'
personal qualities, while Trump scores strong ratings on the economy.
Just two percent of voters say that they are undecided, and another 12 percent say there is a chance that they could change their mind.
ASHER: All right. Let's get inside the numbers now in terms of this new CNN poll. We've got CNN political director, David Chalian, joining us live now.
So, David, we know that this is a --
DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Hi, guys.
ASHER: -- 50-50 nation. Hi. And we know that people's choices, when it comes to who they want for president, is pretty much baked in at this
point, obviously, aside from independents and in various swing states.
But are people right now voting based on who they admire in terms of the personal qualities of a candidate? Or are they voting based on policy?
CHALIAN: Yes. Well, certain voters are doing certain things and certain voters, that's why it's tied. There's two --
ASHER: We can't -- we can't generalize with 400 million people, right? Yes. OK. Point taken.
CHALIAN: But, you know, you can't even -- you can't even call this a small lead for Harris. I mean, this is -- it doesn't get closer than this. This
is a within margin of error, no clear leader in this race, 48 percent to 47 percent among likely voters. We're now 42 days away from election day, six
weeks out.
And so we're looking at the universe of voters who are likeliest to participate in the election. And it's worth that question that you asked.
Because we see on certain qualities like temperament overwhelmingly advantage category for Kamala Harris versus Donald Trump. Even on empathy
understanding the problems of people like you we ask. That's an advantage Harris category.
[12:15:07]
But when it comes to issue number one, and if you look here in our new poll, that is the economy for likely voters here. Forty-one percent of
likely voters say the economy is their top issue. The next issue, protecting democracy, is 20 percentage points lower. Twenty-one percent
offer that up. And then 12 percent say immigration. Eleven percent say abortion or reproductive rights. Clearly, those are the top four issues.
Those are the issues we hear the most about on the campaign trail.
And who do these voters prefer on the economy, issue number one? Well, right now, it's a clear Trump advantage category. Fifty percent of likely
voters trust Donald Trump to handle the economy compared to 39 percent of likely voters who trust Kamala Harris to handle the economy. That is a gap
that Harris is looking to narrow in these next 42 days.
GOLODRYGA: And just to remind our viewers again, this is a national poll, right? This is not a poll --
CHALIAN: Correct.
GOLODRYGA: -- taken in the seven battleground states.
CHALIAN: That is correct.
GOLODRYGA: OK.
CHALIAN: So this is a national snapshot of the nation overall, where we look six weeks out. Now, to your point, we know the way that the presidency
has decided, is this battle for 270 electoral votes, and it will be these seven mostly contested states, you know, three up in the rust belt and four
down in what we call the Sun Belt From west to east in the more southern tier of the United States that will determine the outcome here, Bianna.
But I would just note, we have seen in the past that because of the Electoral College, and because a national poll includes big democratic
strongholds like New York and California, that usually a Democrat needs to be ahead in that national --
GOLODRYGA: Right.
CHALIAN: -- popular vote in order to win the Electoral College, not sort of in a tied race, which this looks to be.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. And this poll comes just days after "The New York Times" released a new poll in those battleground states where it looks like Donald
Trump has seen a slight surge in at least three of those seven states, Arizona, Georgia, and North Carolina.
Again, as we note, just six weeks left until election day. And some states are already seeing early voting.
CNN political director, David Chalian, this is -- this is your Super Bowl season. It's here, my friend. We're not split --
CHALIAN: Thank you.
GOLODRYGA: -- in terms of how we feel about you.
Thank you. I appreciate it.
ASHER: I like that. That's a good one. Thank you, David. Appreciate it.
GOLODRYGA: Well, coming up for us, as we approach one year since the Hamas attack on Israel, we will look at what is being done to bring the remaining
101 Israeli hostages home. A conversation with a woman who was once a hostage herself, when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[12:20:22]
GOLODRYGA: Well, in just under two weeks, it will be one year since the horrifying October 7th Hamas attacks.
ASHER: Yes. Amid the fighting in Gaza and now in Lebanon, it can be easy to forget that there are still 101 Israeli civilians being held hostage by
Hamas.
GOLODRYGA: Tens of thousands of Israelis took to the streets of Tel Aviv over the weekend, demanding the government do more to bring the hostages
home and calling for the resignation of Prime Minister Netanyahu.
Our next guest was one of those hostages.
ASHER: Maya Regev was taken from the Nova Music Festival and held in Gaza. She was later released last November during a brief ceasefire. One of her
close friends is still in Gaza, still being held by Hamas.
GOLODRYGA: And Maya Regev joins us now. Maya, it is so good to see you in New York. I spoke to you and your brother for a documentary CNN did on the
six-month anniversary of the October 7th attacks.
It is just stunning to believe we're coming upon a year now. But it is wonderful to see that you are recovering, you are walking. Your leg was
badly injured from a gunshot wound.
And you are in town also talking about and promoting a film, a documentary, about your experience with your brother. You both were taken hostage along
with your friend, Omer Shem-Tov, on October 7th from the Nova Music Festival.
This documentary is called "Brother and Sister in Captivity." And I have to say, Maya, it is really -- it's stunning and it's chilling to see in the
moment, real time, in the days after October 7th, when you and your brother and Omer were still in Gaza, your family was being documented for this.
And you saw the hell that they went through as they were so worried about the both of you and whether or not you would make it on that list to be
released in November.
Can you talk to us about what it's like for you when you first watched this documentary to see how your family was experiencing this horror?
MAYA REGEV, FORMER HOSTAGE, ABDUCTED FROM NOVA MUSIC FESTIVAL: Well, for me, it was crazy to see it, because all the time that I've been there, I
always thought about them and what they know and what they don't know and how they feel.
And to see everything that they've been through and what they did for us, it's crazy. And they are my parents. And I know that they would do anything
for me and my brother.
It was really hard to watch it because those are my parents and I loved them like crazy. And it was really hard for me to see how heartbroken they
were. But I'm so happy that we are here, and we got the family back together again.
ASHER: Maya, as you know, 101 Israeli hostages are still trapped in Gaza. Just reading about your description about your 50 days there. I mean, it
really does sound like the stuff of nightmares. Talking about doctors in Gaza pouring acid and vinegar on your gunshot wounds. Talking about having
your clothes ripped off. And day in, day out, people telling you that they were going to kill you, essentially.
Just explain to us your fears about what these 101 hostages are actually going through on a day by day basis. I can't even believe I'm saying that
you're one of the lucky ones. Not only did you escape, but you were there for about 50 days.
These 101 Israeli hostages have been there for close to a year, close to a year. What are your fears about what they're going through right now?
REGEV: Well, because that I've been there and also my brother and I know what they're going through with -- they are all starving, they are scared,
they are tired. They don't know if they will make it home.
And just like they said to me, I'm sure that they are -- Hamas telling them that they will kill them. And they know that every second can be their last
time on earth.
And it's really scary because you are ready to die every second. You don't know if you will die because the terrorist, Hamas terrorist will be upset
or just because he can't keep you anymore because he don't feel like it.
And it's really scary because you feel like you're going to die every second. So I think about them all the time and what they're going through
and if they have food, if they're sleeping, if they're scared, if they got used to the situation, although you can't get used to it.
[12:25:04]
So it's really, really hard and this is why I try to do anything that I can to make them come home as soon as possible, because it's really hard to
stay alive there.
GOLODRYGA: And, horrifically, we now know those hostages followed -- those terrorists, followed through on their threats to hostages that are being
held. It was just a few weeks ago when six hostages were brutally murdered by their captives.
And for you, I know you think of all of them, but especially it's your friend Omer Shem-Tov, who was also kidnapped with you and your brother
Itay. And I spent quite a bit of time with Itay. And he talked about the strength that Omer gave him went for weeks. They were together, shared one
room, very little food, tied up.
They spent Shabbats together. And your brother said that it was because of Omer's strength that he was able to make it through. And I know he carries
a lot of that guilt.
But, Maya, I spent time with Omer's parents, Shelly and Malki, and you and your brother give them hope and you give them life.
Tell our viewers about Omer who you continue to think about every single day.
REGEV: Of course. I think about Omer every single day, every single minute that I'm here. I know that Omer is strong. And he believes that he will
make it and he is very calm. And I know he's not problematic or anything and I trust him. I trust him that he can stay alive. And I just hope that
he knows that we're doing anything that we can to bring him home again.
And, of course, Omer families were keeping in a really close touch with them, telling them about everything that Itay and Omer been through in all
those 54 days they were together. And all the time that I was with Omer and we are giving each other strength, and trying to do as much as we can.
Just hope that Omer is still strong, and he knows that we're doing anything that we can to bring him home again.
ASHER: Maya, after October 7th, the plight of the hostages in Gaza dominated the airwaves around the world for a good, I would say, two to
three months.
But as you know, the news cycle moves very, very quickly. And right now in the United States, of course, we have an election coming up in about six
weeks, and that is the main focus.
In addition to that, you've also got the war brewing in Lebanon, which is tangentially linked to, of course, what is happening in Gaza, but also at
the same time separate.
Given the distraction, what is your message to world leaders to keep their attention on this issue and to try to ensure that these hostages come home
sooner rather than later, Maya?
REGEV: Well, I think that everyone that has power to do anything needs to know that this time, it was us, the next time, it will be in Europe or in
the United States or anything -- anywhere else in the world.
And also, there are still American civilians there and other civilians that are not only Israelis. And I think everyone should do anything that they
can to, first of all, study about the situation, because not everyone knows and -- what's really happening.
And I think that they need to do, again, as much as they can to release the hostages back home and finish the war. And we are trying to do as much as
we can.
But with the help of other people around the world, with power, we can do, I'm sure, more and finish it as much -- as fast as we can.
GOLODRYGA: Well, Maya, the hostages, Omer, they are not forgotten here on the show. We continue to cover their plight and put pressure on the world
to make sure that they also get to come home and be reunited with your -- with their families the way you were with yours.
REGEV: Yes.
GOLODRYGA: Please give your brother our best and thank you so much.
REGEV: I will.
GOLODRYGA: It's great to see you, Maya.
ASHER: Thank you, Maya.
REGEV: Thank you. Thank you so much.
ASHER: We'll be right back with more.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[12:30:45]
ASHER: All right. Welcome back to ONE WORLD. I'm Zain Asher.
GOLODRYGA: And I'm Bianna Golodryga.
U.S. President Joe Biden says the time for a Gaza ceasefire and hostage deal is right now, even as the situation in Lebanon escalates dramatically.
ASHER: Israel embroiled in a two-front war is vowing to speed up operations against Hezbollah targets in Lebanon. For a second straight day, the IDF
carried out what it calls a targeted strike, this time, hitting the capital, Beirut.
Israel says Tuesday's airstrikes on an apartment building killed the commander of a Hezbollah missile unit. Lebanon's health ministry says at
least six people were killed.
GOLODRYGA: Now, this comes a day after Israel pounded Southern Lebanon in its deadliest onslaught in nearly two decades. The Lebanese health ministry
says 558 people were killed Monday. We should note Hezbollah began launching rockets, unprovoked, into Israel on October 8th.
ASHER: All this as Israel keeps up its strikes on Hamas targets in Gaza. And the death toll in the Palestinian enclave has reached 41,000, so far.
Listen to the anguish of one displaced Palestinian in Gaza.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): We heard an explosion and ran and found a room on fire and started screaming, and people came and entered the
room, and we felt something horrific.
We have begun to wish death.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ASHER: All right. Time now for The Exchange. The president of Israel, Isaac Herzog, joins us live now from Jerusalem.
Mr. President, thank you so much for being with us. Israel has said, time and time again, that it does not want a wider war. But if you play out the
events of last week, two back-to-back major attacks on Hezbollah's communication unit, so much so that thousands of fighters were seriously
injured, obviously a lot of people, including children, killed. And then you had that targeted strike that killed a Hezbollah commander as well at
the end of last week.
If you look at that and you sort of play out that game of chess, there is really no way that Hezbollah is not going to retaliate, not going to
respond. How can Israel say that it does not want a wider war, given the pace of the attacks that we saw last week, Mr. President?
[12:35:01]
ISAAC HERZOG, ISRAELI PRESIDENT: Thank you, Bianna. We are insistent on the fact that we do not want war. And I repeat, we did not want this war.
This war was waged against us through a terror attack of the worst kind on October 7th. And the day after later Hezbollah started attacking us day in
day out endlessly for the last almost one year, 352 days of attacks by Hezbollah.
And we are, at the end, there's a limit to how much a nation can absorb when 100,000 of its citizens are totally deprived of their homes. Their
homes are being destroyed. The whole region has been desolate. This is impossible. We have the full right to defend ourselves.
So I remind everybody, we've gone through hell in the last year. We are fed up. We want to change the equation. And we want to see a new horizon, which
by the way, the Palestinians and the Arabs deserve as well.
But they've been hijacked by a terrible empire of evil. Iran and its proxies were armed up to their neck with armaments of huge countries to
fight us.
GOLODRYGA: Mr. President, it's Bianna Golodryga. That was Zain Asher my colleague who asked you that first question. It's the two of us. I know you
can't see us.
I want to ask you --
HERZOG: Sorry.
GOLODRYGA: -- about what we heard from President Biden today speaking before the U.N. General Assembly where he noted that the world has the
responsibility to ensure that an October 7th style attack never happens on Israel again.
And he noted that on October 8th, Hezbollah began this conflict by launching those missile strikes on Israel. But then he went on to say that
a full-scale war is in no one's interest and that he believes a diplomatic resolution is the only path to ending the Mideast conflict. So your goals
are aligned, especially the return of tens of thousands of Israelis to the north.
My question to you is, are you and the United States on diverging pathways as to how to ensure that goal? The president's still saying that diplomacy
is possible. It appears Israel's saying that's not the case now.
HERZOG: I don't think so. I actually think that we are almost on the same page with the president. Perhaps some nuances, but we are indeed. We see
eye to eye with the president. We've been trying endlessly to get to an arrangement in our northern border.
The president has put special efforts. He sent a very talented envoy and diplomat, Amos Hochstein, time and again. But it turns out Hezbollah
doesn't want to stop. And they say Nasrallah, their leader, says I'm linking it to Gaza.
And in Gaza, we have 101 hostages there in the dungeons going through hell. You just showed it in your program. And the leader of Hamas out there,
Yahya Sinwar, does not want to move, doesn't want to move an iota. That's the truth. That's the crux of the matter. It's been said time and again by
American leaders from Secretary of State Blinken downwards.
So this is the equation. So if Nasrallah wants to fight for Sinwar, and Sinwar says no, we can't go on this way. We have the full right as every
decent nation to defend ourselves. That's the point. So we are fighting. We are trying to clean, as we say, to take off capabilities of Hamas.
We are attacking their capabilities of huge missiles and specific missile and launchers who are aimed at our families, at our homes, at our cities,
at our villages, in order to enable us at the end to get to calm in the north, bring our people back and work as much as we can to get a hostage
deal.
This should be the most important priority of all the world leaders are meeting right now at the U.N. General Assembly.
ASHER: Mr. President, you talk about the importance of getting a hostage deal, and you mentioned that 101 Israeli hostages still trapped in Gaza, in
your words, trapped in dungeons in Gaza. And I'm sure you heard our interview with Maya Regev just before you, detailing the horrors of what
she experienced when she was trapped in Gaza for 50 days.
Are you concerned, though, that escalating this war in Lebanon between the IDF and Hezbollah will make trying to get the hostages out of Gaza that
much more complicated, that trying to get the hostages out, getting some kind of hostage deal, is going to be that much more difficult if Israel
does engage in a full-scale war with Hezbollah?
HERZOG: So I will explain the mentality of our enemies. It's a jihadist culture, which has been worked out and choreographed in Tehran, with
proxies all over the place, full of armaments, simply wanting to kind of weaken us endlessly and constantly by hemorrhaging and by pain and by
attacks.
[12:40:06]
We have to change the equation. And I have an advice to world leaders in this sense. I believe that this crisis that we are in, as we want to
prevent war, we can escalate it, may God forbid escalate into a much bigger war.
But if we want to prevent war, we have to work real hard on getting out of this crisis in an arrangement that enables the release of the hostages,
that enables the day after in Gaza, that enables a calm and defensible border with Lebanon, meaning, adhering to international resolutions that
Hezbollah never adhered to and enable peace and calm and security to go back.
You know how many Muslim citizens were attacked today by Hezbollah? You know that Muslim-Israelis, Arab-Israelis were attacked by Hezbollah
missiles? You know that Christian-Israelis and Jews-Israelis -- and Jewish- Israelis, the beautiful tapestry of our Galilee is being attacked and we won't accept it.
GOLODRYGA: You mentioned resolution that had been signed. That was Resolution 1701, and that would call for Hezbollah fighters to remain north
of the Litani River, where they certainly are not now.
You also referenced Tehran, Mr. President. And I want to ask you to respond to two things that we heard recently from the new president, Pezeshkian.
Our Fareed Zakaria asked him about what many had anticipated to be an imminent response of Ismail Haniyeh earlier this summer.
This is what he said to Fareed. Let's play the sound.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MASOUD PEZESHKIAN, IRANIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): If international organizations cannot make this individual sit down and stand down, and they
keep allowing someone who unfortunately has the means to commit such atrocities, then naturally, we will give the appropriate response.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: So that's one thing that he said. But while here in New York, before the U.N. General Assembly to reporters, he also suggested that he
does not war -- that Iran does not want war with Israel.
How do you interpret these comments? Is Israel anticipating any type of response militarily from Iran in the coming days and weeks?
HERZOG: Well, it's very clear, the onus is on him. And mostly, the onus is on his regime. Because the one who calls the shots in Iran is the supreme
leader and because the revolutionary guards don't ask the president a word and they don't adhere to his authority, and they spread terror cells all
over the world, and they finance and beef up and supply armaments to all these terrible terrorist organizations who are shattering the Middle East,
in Lebanon, in Gaza, in Iraq, in Yemen.
So he can't play double standard. If he wants to be serious about it, if he wants to change the course in the region, he's got to get these guys, these
proxies, these terror organizations out of the way and enable a real dialogue with the state of Lebanon, a real day after in Gaza that would
enable Palestinians to live in dignity as we want them to.
And enable real calm and tranquility, rather than calling Israel. This week, his supreme leader, just a few days ago, called Israel a tumor that
must be removed.
GOLODRYGA: Quickly, Mr. President, there had been conflicting reports about the whereabouts, the state, the health of Yahya Sinwar, the head of Hamas,
in Gaza. The United States, Israel saying the onus, as of now, is on him in terms of a ceasefire and hostage deal.
What intelligence, if any, can you share with us about his whereabouts and his health?
HERZOG: Look, we are all trying to locate and hunt him down. We don't -- we can't confirm either or. It's all under deep surveillance.
But right now, he -- he's the one, he's the leader of Hamas. He has to say yes. There's an American proposal and a mediator's proposal. It's all very
clear that we can get to a hostage deal.
But I must say, and I say it out loud and clearly, he -- throughout the last year, he has been saying no. He has been literally saying no. And our
hostages are in huge pain and suffering. And I mean it's mind-boggling. And I can't think more pain than what they're going through in the dungeons of
-- and tunnels of Gaza.
[12:45:00]
ASHER: Yes. And there are those who also criticize Benjamin Netanyahu for moving the goalposts when it comes to the Philadelphi Corridor as well, so
the international community look at the hostage deal and feel that though both sides do bear some responsibility, and the fact that there has been no
deal as of yet.
Israeli President Isaac Herzog, live for us there.
HERZOG: So I will -- I will reply to that.
ASHER: Go ahead.
HERZOG: I must say -- I would just say on the merits. I know that there are, of course, claims on the Israeli position, but the underlying position
of Sinwar and Hamas has been adamantly no to all the proposals.
And there are positions that were taken by the Israeli government which have to do with Israel's security and have been discussed in public and
also in closed rooms. As far as I know, Israel is trying its best to get to a deal.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. As you know, though, many in your own government, the defense establishment had voiced their frustration over the past few weeks
as to the state of where Prime Minister Netanyahu is in terms of these hostage and ceasefire talks.
But Jake Sullivan, as of today, said that it is, in his view, and the U.S. view, that it is Sinwar who is currently preventing a deal.
Israeli President Isaac Herzog, thank you so much for taking the time.
ASHER: Thank you, Mr. President.
HERZOG: Thank you very much.
ASHER: We'll be right back with more after this short break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GOLODRYGA: World leaders at the U.N. General Assembly are focused on the situation in Lebanon. It has been a week of strikes by Israel against the
organization. Tens of thousands of Lebanese are fleeing their homes trying to get out of their way.
ASHER: Saleh El Machnouk is a non-resident fellow at the Middle East Institute, and he joins us live now from Beirut. Saleh, thank you so much
for being with us.
So, the Israelis have said that, essentially, they really wanted to get out of the sort of tit-for-tat cycle that we've seen on the northern Israeli
border, the back of forth between Hezbollah and Israel that's been going on pretty much since the day after October 7th.
And that -- from that perspective, the only way to get out of it would be to escalate the situation so much so that Hezbollah ends up backing down.
What do you make of that rationale?
SALEH EL MACHNOUK, NON-RESIDENT FELLOW, MIDDLE EAST INSTITUTE: I think what's most important here is that there's an immense sense of
powerlessness and frustration in Beirut because this is a country that for the past five years, has undergone tremendous suffering on all levels by
being ruled by a mafia, militia nexus. And now they're stuck in a war that is not of their own choosing and over which they have very limited, if any,
control at all.
And therefore, this is one of those instances in repeated history where the Lebanese are stuck once again in a proxy war between the Iranian regime and
Israel. One that has been exacerbated by the terrible carnage that has happened in Gaza.
[12:50:01]
And it is a reflection, first and foremost, of the failure of the international community both to contain the aggressive posturing of Iran in
the Levant over the past many years, but also to resolve the Palestinian- Israeli question in a way that is fair to the Palestinians.
GOLODRYGA: Saleh, we see in the banner there, underneath you that Israel is claiming to have killed another Hezbollah commander this after a week of
strikes. And though Israel has not taken credit for that covert campaign that we saw last week, where thousands of pagers blew up and then walkie-
talkies the next day, injuring thousands of Hezbollah operatives.
Given all of that, given the strikes that we've seen, the defense minister of Israel even saying that they were able to destroy tens of thousands of
rockets and their launchers, how degraded is Hamas? I mean, I'm sorry, is Hezbollah right now?
MACHNOUK: Hezbollah's military capabilities have suffered tremendous blows over the past week. The real issue here is that Hezbollah has been acting
as an organization that is a hostage to both its ideology and Iran's grand project in the region and has very little regard for both its diminished
capabilities on the one hand and the suffering of the Lebanese people on the other.
What is most frustrating today is not simply the level of death and destruction and hundreds of thousands of Lebanese people having to leave
their homes, but also the fact that the end game, so to speak, of this war should be well known to everybody involved in this process. And this is the
agreement that was put in place in 2006 with U.N. Security Council Resolution 1701 and a return of both countries to the armistice agreement.
The issue being that over the past few months, the diplomatic effort has been mostly ceremonial and premised on the idea that this conflict can, in
fact, be contained disregarding the fundamental linkage that Iran has put in place in the region between the so-called Unity of Fronts.
So now what's important, first and foremost, is for the international community to step in with all the tools at its disposal with the largest
alliance possible, learning the lessons from the failures of international policy towards Lebanon, especially with the so-called quintet that's been
operational for the past years and to put once and for all an end to this madness.
It's really important that the centerpiece of any negotiations be that this should be the last war between Lebanese armed groups and Hezbollah. The
Lebanese people have suffered enough for the past 50 plus years being used in proxy wars for regional ideological projects.
GOLODRYGA: All right, Saleh El Machnouk, thank you so much for joining us.
MACHNOUK: OK.
ASHER: Thank you. We'll be right back with more.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[12:55:38]
GOLODRYGA: All right. In Munich, hundreds of Bavarians in traditional attire packed the streets for Oktoberfest.
ASHER: Yes. The annual costume parade is held on the second day of the world's largest beer festival. It began back in 1835 as a royal wedding
anniversary celebration and features brass bands and horse-drawn carriages. Now the parade highlights Bavaria's cultural heritage.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. Perfect weather, too.
ASHER: Yes.
GOLODRYGA: Well, that does it for this hour of ONE WORLD. I'm Bianna Golodryga.
ASHER: I'm Zain Asher. Appreciate you watching. "AMANPOUR" is up next. You're watching CNN.
END
