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Piers Morgan Live

An All-Female Panel

Aired September 10, 2012 - 21:00   ET


DONNY DEUTSCH, HOST: I'm Donny Deutsch sitting in for Piers.

Tonight, what women really want. OK. Now that I've got your attention, I am no expert but my guests tonight are. Some of the smartest, strongest women in this country. U.S. Open champ, Serena Williams.


SERENA WILLIAMS, U.S. OPEN 2012 WOMEN'S SINGLES WINNER: If I could just hold that serve and if I can win that game, I have a fighting chance.


DEUTSCH: Money guru, Suze Orman.


SUZE ORMAN, HOST, "CNBC'S SUZE ORMAN SHOW": My mother always taught me that an Orman never gives up.


DEUTSCH: And TV talkers, Gayle King.


GAYLE KING, CO-ANCHOR, "CBS This Morning": There's a different way of doing the talk show.


DEUTSCH: And Lara Spencer.


LARA SPENCER, CO-ANCHOR, "GOOD MORNING AMERICA": Use your voice just like the boys do.


DEUTSCH: We're talking politics.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DEUTSCH: Year our first female president. What year?

KING: 2016. Don't you want to know who?


DEUTSCH: Your money --


ORMAN: Women put themselves on stand.


DEUTSCH: And the question I just have to ask.


DEUTSCH: Women like a very authoritative man in the bedroom. Let's deal with that.

WILLIAMS: Yes, I think it's just different strokes for different folks.



Good evening. I am not Piers Morgan. I'm Donny Deutsch, and Piers is on assignment in the UK and he brought me back to fill in for him. And as something I said, let's do something a little different tonight. So I am bringing in four incredible women I admire. They're accomplished and successful. And they are stars in their own fields.

They are, first off, the woman of the moment, U.S. Open champ, Serena.


DEUTSCH: Serena in primetime. Suze Orman, the most recognized personal finance expert in the world, and the one person I would go to for money advice, the one, the only Gayle King, newswoman, mom and a best friend of a woman you may have heard of, Oprah, and the legendary Lara Spencer. She is host of a morning show I cannot remember its name right now but we'll just call it --

KING: I can't either.

DEUTSCH: It's a morning show.


DEUTSCH: And we're going to play an interesting game of 20 question tonight. This is going to be something a little different. I want you all -- the ground rules here. Leave your pundit hats at home. You are as women. And this is a show about what women want and we're coming off the conventions, a lot has happened. So I want you talking as moms, as working women, as U.S. Open champs, first, 30 seconds on that. Wow.

WILLIAMS: Thank you.

DEUTSCH: I mean, I was just sitting at home, OK, this is over, so just quickly, you're down 3-5. You're down in the service. Just give me the thought that goes through your head that says I'm turning this around.

WILLIAMS: I thought, you know, if I can hold that serve and if I can win that game I have a fighting chance. My main goal was to win that game and take a break. Because after that we'd have a changeover and I would have time to take a little of breather. And I felt I could get myself together and I can pull myself into the match. And so it's what I did.

DEUTSCH: What's that squeal that was coming out of your opponent? What was --

WILLIAMS: That wasn't a squeal --

DEUTSCH: It t was a mating call. What was that?


KING: At one point, I thought, does she need a hotel room? It's very -- it had a very sensual thing.

DEUTSCH: It was a mating call --

ORMAN: Yes, but you're OK, it didn't bother you? It bothered every one of us.

WILLIAMS: They really didn't -- no.

DEUTSCH: It was annoying to us.


ORMAN: Didn't bother her.

WILLIAMS: I thought it was lower than normal to be honest. I've played her a few times in our career. And I just was so focused on the match, I didn't even hear it.

KING: That was lower?


KING: That says -- Donny, that says she was in the zone.

DEUTSCH: OK. We're going to get back to that later. OK, guys, first question, OK. Basically, I want to throw something out. Does it matter -- forget pro-choice, pro life. I'm going to put that aside. For working women, women today still make 77 cents on the dollar. Startling as that is. In the same part, through both administrations, Obama's ad W's before, it really hasn't moved. It's moved one cent in eight years. Does it make a difference for the working woman?

Suze, I want to start with you.


ORMAN: Yes, it makes a difference. And let me tell you why. In 2009 when President Obama signed the Lilly Ledbetter Act, forget about the 77 cents on the dollar, Donny. Here's what that act allowed women to do. You don't want us to be a pundit. I can't help but be --

DEUTSCH: Be a pundit. Pundit away.

ORMAN: Of course, I'm going to putt it right out of here for you.

DEUTSCH: No, this is pundit, not putt.

ORMAN: Yes, well, I'm going to put it out for you. But -- anyway, so it allowed women to have more time to actually oppose and come and say, you're not treating me fairly. It allowed women to be able to have lesser standards for the corporations to stand up to. So which means more women are winning so they can earn more. And that was a really important thing that happened.

So if you're opposing it and you want to get paid more money because you feel it hasn't been good, now you have more of a time to prove your case which wasn't true after 2009.

DEUTSCH: Well, does that tell us something? Because Ryan actually voted against that and Romney has not been clear yet on where he stands on that.

KING: Well, he would -- he would argue that he's been very clear about it. But I think what we also need to look at is whoever becomes president of the United States, the next president of the United States, we've got to make sure that they can work with Congress. Because it didn't -- really doesn't matter what your ideas are if you don't have a Congress that's working with you.

And you know while we're focusing on the two candidates, we also need to focus on Congress and the president of the United States working together. And so far we haven't had great luck with that.


SPENCER: And we feel like, too, though, it starts at home. We have to be working with our little girls, advocating -- teaching them to advocate for themselves when they get a job to go in and ask for the raise. Use your voice just like the boys do.

DEUTSCH: I got to tell you --

(CROSSTALK) WILLIAMS: That's what we did in women's tennis.

DEUTSCH: Yes. Want to bring that up.

WILLIAMS: I mean we have a lot of opportunity. We women stood up for ourselves in the '70s, led by Billie Jean King who said, you know, we're going to pay, we're going to play for the same amount as men. And so just recently we were able to have equal pay. Because we're working just as hard and just as much as the men.

DEUTSCH: It's the only sport that -- I want to bring up -- go back to your point, Lara, and I'm curious, you guys in the work place, I've employed thousands of women over the years. And Mika Brzezinski has written a book where she talk about --

WILLIAMS: I was going to say that -- yes.

DEUTSCH: A great book about -- and what I found without exception, men would come in asking for raises, if I don't get a raise, I'm going to -- women apologize --


DEUTSCH: And I say to women, I have three daughters --

SPENCER: That's why I'm asking -- and I don't want to up set you.

DEUTSCH: I say to three daughters this is --

SPENCER: Celebrate yourself.

DEUTSCH: That's interestingly enough, and I think you hit the nerve. That's what's going to change. Not from the top up. Not the president but a new generation of women.

And, Suze, I'm curious, you saw in the marketplace, and to me I'll take a woman over a man any time in the market. I'll explain that.


KING: Isn't it obvious?

DEUTSCH: I'll tell you, if you give me equal man and woman, the difference is, if you watch a Saturday morning TV commercial, a woman -- a girl -- it's always four girls playing together, it's always one boy go, I won. And that's men and women in the workplace. Women, they want to be collaborative, they want to be fair, men it's a zero sum game. (INAUDIBLE) every single time.

But Suze, have you seen that women are much more reticent to ask for a raise than men?

ORMAN: Yes. I have -- you know, I have a thing that women put themselves on sale. They're like, I'm a sale rep. I'll work, you don't have to pay me, it's all right. I don't need a vacation. Pay raise we can go a few years without it so that you can be OK. Men, are you kidding?

KING: We're the fixers.

ORMAN: Yes. So remember, women's nature -- a woman's nature is to nurture. She has the ability to give birth. She has the ability to feed that which she's given birth to. So her job is to take care of everybody with her mind.



DEUTSCH: But we're going change that.

ORMAN: And so the reason women are in this situation, and I've said this for years now, is not because men are keeping us there. We're letting them keep us down. I get paid great money. I get paid top dollars. I'm a woman and it's because I won't put myself on sale and women just have to meet --

DEUTSCH: Before we move to the next question, there are still a 12-point difference in Obama actually in the CNN poll got a four-point bounce. Six points coming out of election, very, very substantial.

KING: Coming out of the convention.

DEUTSCH: Coming out of the convention. Sorry. Speaking of the election, though, I got in trouble the other day with my friend Star and Nancy on "The Professionals," which was opposite your fine --

SPENCER: I have no idea.

DEUTSCH: Of course you have no idea what I'm talking about. And I said --

KING: I don't know what you're talking about.

ORMAN: I do. I watch (INAUDIBLE).

DEUTSCH: And I said something interesting, it wasn't interesting that they smacked me around pretty good, that when we contrast the first women about their speeches, I said, does this country vote that way anymore? If I want a CEO of a corporation, I want them to give me shareholder value. I don't care who his wife is. Is that naive? Is that stupid? They're both great women. I got it. Is that going to decide elections? Is this dumb guy talking?

SPENCER: I don't think they decide it, but I think it can help them, it can enhance.

DEUTSCH: So what? They're both great women. They both have great marriages. Next. SPENCER: Because they're teaching us a little bit. They're giving us a glimpse at the men. And giving some information that we might not have otherwise gotten. And that's important to women. We want to know the whole story.

KING: And gives you information about how he thinks, what he believes, and he holds dear. And I think you're right when you said when you look at Michelle Obama, and we look at Ann Romney, they are both -- I just spent time with both of them, they are both top notch, high class women. Both of them. So nobody can argue about that. But it does give you, as Lara says, a look at -- a look at what their husband believes. And I think that that's important.

WILLIAMS: And I think it also gives a look into the wife and how they act, how they respond with their husband and how they're able to talk about them, how people can look at the president or the potential president and see what type of person they are, depending on who they choose to be their forever mate.

DEUTSCH: I still think people vote with their pocketbooks and if this guy is going to cost me more or less, that's it.


DEUTSCH: Lovely, lovely women, doesn't impact me.

ORMAN: I don't think people vote with their pocketbooks at all, Donny.


ORMAN: I think people vote with who they feel attracted to. A vote --

DEUTSCH: As a human being.

ORMAN: As a human being.

DEUTSCH: Well, statistics have always shown us that.

ORMAN: And come all the way down to their hair cut.

DEUTSCH: We connect as a human being. If your theory is right, clearly Obama wins.

One more question before the break, shifting gears for a second, OK, Katie Couric debuts today. We all love Katie. Kate's a good friend of all of us.

KING: Yes.

DEUTSCH: I have a theory and tell me yay or nay, that Katie aside, the one-host format that your dear friend, not just revolutionized, made, is not as relevant anymore. If you don't give people utility during the day, they don't want it. And I'm not saying Katie is not -- is going to be a failure, but is that an old format at this point? Was that kind of done and this has nothing to do with Katie. Let's go on record we all love Katie, Gayle.

KING: What do you -- when you say utility, what do you mean?

DEUTSCH: Utility shows like "The Doctors," should take home, shows like what Suze does where people could take something away. The day of here's the host and we're going to introduce celebrities and we're going to do interesting subject matter --

SPENCER: I don't think she's going to do that, though.

DEUTSCH: Is that a relevant subject matter anymore?

KING: I think there's always room for something good. But I -- you're right. I think --

DEUTSCH: You know where I'm going with this?

KING: No, I know exactly --

DEUTSCH: Don't be politically correct.

KING: No, I know exactly where you're going, but I also think, you know, I look at these shows that are coming on and everybody always says, I'm going to be different. I'm not going to do what Oprah did. And my thing would be, I want to do what Oprah did.



KING: That worked really well. But everybody say, I'm not going to do what she did. I don't want to do that. But I do think that the time has come that maybe there's a different way of doing the talk show. But I do still think that it's relevant. I still think people like good conversation, I still think people they love celebrities. We are celebrity obsessed culture. And I do think people like looking at things that are relatable to them.

Is it still the talk show format? I'm not so sure about that. But when you're good, people find you. There's always room, Donny, for something good.

DEUTSCH: Like a show with one guy --

KING: Always.

DEUTSCH: One guy and four women, something like that?

KING: Yes.

ORMAN: But I think it's now more than just one-on-one, I think it's like "The View." I think it's --

DEUTSCH: But that's my -- you see, I believe this generation, which has grown up, that everybody can blog and everybody has their devices, and everybody gets a voice. KING: Yes.

DEUTSCH: The day of one voice speaking at you.

SPENCER: You definitely have to be (INAUDIBLE) digital. You have to.

WILLIAMS: Well, maybe -- and maybe it's a compilation of all of that. It's a compilation of doing something digitally where you can interact with your fans and then have the one person speaking. I personally love the format of Oprah. That was a great show. And I think there's a void on the air now for that and I think there is still space for what is trying to find the right way to create it.

KING: And the right person to do it.

WILLIAMS: Exactly.

DEUTSCH: Very quickly, Katie, going to be a homerun, single, double or strike out?

SPENCER: I think she could be a huge -- look at what she did?

DEUTSCH: You're an ABC person.

SPENCER: OK. No, I honestly -- I've been a fan of her for a long time.

DEUTSCH: I'm kidding, I'm kidding.

SPENCER: Smart -- so smart. And I think that she's going to pave her own way. She's Katie. There is no other Oprah. And so if she just stays authentic to herself and gives really great information, I think she's going to be solid.

ORMAN: But here's the question. Do we as women want Katie to succeed? Because sometimes women --


ORMAN: And we do --

DEUTSCH: Interesting.

ORMAN: But sometimes women, not on television, but it can be a competitive thing, we don't want somebody --

SPENCER: We've got to stop that --


DEUTSCH: I think they need some Hillary first time around. With a lot of women.

ORMAN: So our natural instinct is yes, Katie, you go out there and knock it out. DEUTSCH: OK, guys, guys, we're going to come back to that. Here's a tease for you. Listen to this. When we come back, security, sex and success all in one blog.


DEUTSCH: I'm Donny Deutsch, and I'm sitting in for Piers, and I'm surrounded by some of the smartest, most beautiful women around. U.S. Open champ, Serena Williams, Suze Orman, who is the woman America trusts with our money, Gayle King from CBS "This Morning," and Lara Spencer from "Good Morning America."

Let's pick up our 20 questions. All right, guys. Security. Obviously we watched the Navy SEAL last night. Talking about killing Osama bin Laden. We certainly feel safer today for a lot of reasons. So as individuals, as women, as moms, if you had your choice today, and you didn't have to take off your shoes anymore, would you say enough? Have we now gone too far and we can ease up? You're going to the airport today, I say you don't have to take off your shoes, you go (INAUDIBLE)?

SPENCER: I'm happy to take them off. I'm happy for you to go through whatever you need to do to make sure that me and my family and everybody on that plane is safe. It's not too much for me.

DEUTSCH: Gayle, what's interesting --

KING: It's not too much, but there are times when I see some people that are being asked to remove their shoes, little kids or older people, I go, really? Do you really have to do that? So I'm with you, Lara, you know, whatever you need to do to keep us safe. But there is another part of me that wonders -- the other day I had to throw out contact lens solution that had never been opened, the seal hasn't been broken, just because it was over the -- you know, the three ounces. But I'm for whatever you need to do to keep us safe.

ORMAN: I don't know. I just came back from a tour in Australia, went through airport after airport, never once had to remove my shoes, including coming back on the plane to the United States of America where something could have happened. Can't we somehow --


KING: Figure it out.

SPENCER: It's always a pleasure to not to have to do it. But I -- don't you understand? I mean --

ORMAN: I get why, but I don't get why after 11 years they have not figured out a more secure system, a system that makes sense. I mean they're not -- are we really that much safer? I'm not sure.

DEUTSCH: I'm with Lara. I would -- whatever it takes. But obviously, Serena, you travel around.

WILLIAMS: Yes, I definitely do. Whatever it takes because I mean after what happened at September 11th, and being the anniversary so soon, it's just something that as a nation we just can't forget. And you know I always like to think once you put your guard down that's when people attack.


WILLIAMS: And that's when things happen. And it's so important for us to, you know, just always stay awake.

DEUTSCH: You know, going back to the --

KING: I'm kind of with you, too, Suze. I'm for whatever it takes, too, but isn't there another way?


KING: Wasn't it great traveling through Australia not to take off -- not to do --

ORMAN: Yes. And I don't feel unsafe.

DEUTSCH: Guys, let me give it another way.


DEUTSCH: I want to talk about the profile that you touched on. To your point, is there anything wrong if we say, OK, there are certain suspects that are terrorists to not stop little 5-year-old Scandinavian girls? Or is that -- is the line -- there is no such thing as --

SPENCER: That's what I was thinking when you said that, Gayle. I think you have to be -- you have to be -- you can't just say --

DEUTSCH: But to my point that's not --


DEUTSCH: They're policing technically. It really, really is.

ORMAN: What if somebody is using that 5-year-old girl so --

WILLIAMS: Exactly. Exactly.


ORMAN: It's all or nothing.


DEUTSCH: OK. Speaking of --

KING: And right now it's all.

ORMAN: Yes. DEUTSCH: And we'll keep it that way. OK. Speaking of all the rage, "Fifty Shades of Grey" has been talked about a lot. To me that shows -- the success of that, this dumb guy talking. The success of that book showed two things to me. Number one, there must be a lot of very under-sexed women in America if they're getting so excited, and that two, most women want to be dominated in some form because that was the core of -- she's looking at me -- that was the core of that book. So as you're both staring me, when I say just in that sexual thing, most women reacted to that very positive -- and that was the essence of the book. So let's --


SPENCER: On "Good Morning America" we --

ORMAN: So here's the real question, how many women on this panel read that book?

SPENCER: I actual did for research.

DEUTSCH: OK. Yes. Of course.

KING: You did? You do read it?

SPENCER: Of course I did.

WILLIAMS: No, I didn't read it. It's not my kind of read. I'm really -- I'm an old-fashioned kind of person. And I just -- I'm not into it.


SPENCER: When I saw my mother --


KING: But Serena, do you know what it's about?

WILLIAMS: I know what it's about. And --


DEUTSCH: He was a very dominant character --

ORMAN: Did you read it?

DEUTSCH: I know the basic premise. Is that -- does that show that that's a nerve that hits --


SPENCER: I can only tell you from my very own unscientific sampling of girlfriends who were -- thought it was so naughty and funny, and all of them are married. You know, I just think it enabled them to talk about something that, before this book, and for whatever reason it's touched a nerve with all due respect, it just enabled them to talk about -- you know, and maybe expand their sex life after 10 or 15 years when they might have wanted to push the envelope a little bit. And so I don't know necessarily about being dominated I just think it's about --

DEUTSCH: But that the women I talked to, they get so excited -- I mean it was learning for me, to be honest. I only dominated in a negative (INAUDIBLE).

KING: Donny -- are you a spanker?

DEUTSCH: No, absolutely not.


DEUTSCH: But I've learned that women do like very strong men. I have yet to see a woman --


KING: I don't want spanking of any kind.


KING: I don't want gentle spanking, I don't want hard spanking. I like soft caressing, so are you spanker? They say women like to be tied up and spanked.

DEUTSCH: No. What I have found --


DEUTSCH: No, I have found that women like the men to take control. Serena? That's what I found. It's not about spanking. It's not about -- I'm going to tell you something, women like a very authoritative man in the bedroom. Let's live with that.

WILLIAMS: Yes, I think it's just different strokes for different folks because --

DEUTSCH: Come on.

WILLIAMS: I'm just being honest. Not everyone likes the same thing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think a lot of --


KING: Serena, are you a spanker?


DEUTSCH: Your honor, I would like you to answer that question.

WILLIAMS: That is inappropriate. No.

KING: Go ahead, Serena.


ORMAN: Both ears. Go ahead.

WILLIAMS: No. I think, you know, just -- it just brought out a lot of maybe different feelings among different women that do like more things that are dominant, and they like to be --

DEUTSCH: So you're a physically -- you're a beautiful woman, very physically strong. Is that intimidating to a lot of men?

WILLIAMS: I think it is.

DEUTSCH: I might be -- I'm being honest with you.

WILLIAMS: Yes. Are you intimidated by me, Donny?

DEUTSCH: If you and I --

ORMAN: You should be.

DEUTSCH: I would be -- you're gorgeous, but yes, I would be a little intimidated.

SPENCER: If I was a man, I would be all over that.

DEUTSCH: You're gorgeous, so I'm curious, do you run into that?

WILLIAMS: Yes, I do. I run into the intimidation factor. But I think it's important to find that balance and find someone that can balance you both mentally, spiritually and everything else.


ORMAN: I would be intimidated by you.

KING: It's not the guy for you.

WILLIAMS: Exactly.

DEUTSCH: Of course. I'm sorry.

WILLIAMS: If it's not the guy for you, not the guy in your life --

DEUTSCH: I changed my mind. I wouldn't be intimated.

WILLIAMS: You can just kind of be friends.

ORMAN: That's right. Yes.

WILLIAMS: Yes. Thank you, Donny.


DEUTSCH: See, I'm not the guy doing tonight. I'm staying like this.

Ladies, when we come back, we're here to talk about living happily ever after in Hollywood. Don't go anywhere.


DEUTSCH: I'm back with four incredible women. Lara Spencer, Gayle King, Suze Orman, Serena Williams. Well, I consider that as wow.

Let's pick up the questions. A lot of Hollywood wedding news. We have a divorce over the weekend. We have Will Arnett and Amy Poehler, sad after a number of years, two great people. We've got a new engagement, Ryan Reynolds and Blake Lively.

SPENCER: No, married.

KING: They got married over the weekend.

DEUTSCH: Married.


DEUTSCH: They got married. So Gayle, I'm just --

KING: I love that they did it in secret, too, in South Carolina. We didn't know about it until it was done. I love that they pulled it off.

SPENCER: So it can be done.

KING: It can be done.

DEUTSCH: Can the Hollywood marriages last? We obviously went through, you know, Katie and Tom. And is it almost arithmetically impossible to have another Paul Newman, Joanne Woodward, you guys are on this world --

WILLIAMS: I don't think anything is impossible.

ORMAN: Me neither.

WILLIAMS: I mean I still believe in love and I still believe that you can find it if you find the right person. But you know a lot of times people look and they feel like, we do this -- I mean we do this in common or we have this together so we should be together or I can relate with you on that. And you just have to watch out for those emotions and really look for real love.

KING: I have been told, though, that I'm very naive on this, Serena, because I'm like you, I'm a hopeless romantic. I still believe in the idea of love. I love the concept of love, and I believe that when you meet the right person, you know, it's not just Hollywood marriages, it's just marriage in general.

But we're all living longer. You know back in the day when they were getting married, you didn't live -- you know, you're dying at 42, you're dying --


KING: In your 50s, but now you're living until 80, you're living until 90. And you're looking at your spouse saying, I don't know how I feel about you anymore.

DEUTSCH: Lara --

KING: But I still believe it's possible, Donny.

DEUTSCH: I always said, you know, the kids today, we can talk -- obviously, we've got parents around the table here, is there a trivialization in that we see -- it's a year, it's a year and a half, it's almost --

SPENCER: It's not disposable.

DEUTSCH: That's a better than -- that are we sending a message? We see these marriages and obviously with all of the gossip magazines we have, are we right -- raising a generation today where it's just much more disposable?


KING: I worry about that.

SPENCER: I worry about it, too. And I think you're right to worry. I just feel that if it's -- if things get tough, it doesn't mean that you move on. You know, you buckle down and you work hard. That's the way my mom and dad did it. That's just sort of the way -- and that doesn't mean it's always going to work. I'm a realist. I get it. But I do think that far too often now, it's like, you know what, it just got hard. And so --

KING: And so I'm out of here.


KING: I did an interview years ago with Drake, the rapper Drake. I'm nuts about him. He's a 20-something guy, his parents got divorced at a very early age. And I was asking about relationship and does he think he's capable. He said, you know, I saw my parents fight, but I didn't see them fight through. And I thought that was such a great thing for somebody who's 20-something.


KING: I'm not saying you stay in a bad marriage if you're being abused or you know there's -- you know serial infidelity. But I think so many times now people give up far too easily.

DEUTSCH: That's the line -- we were talking on the break. My dad had some surgery over the weekend. Watching my parents 83 together, loving each other.


DEUTSCH: That's 59 years the way they care for each other. I'm sure it wasn't perfect a lot of times. But it was so, so beautiful. And I just don't know how much --

ORMAN: But that's no longer the norm, Donny. Today the stats are one out of two people who get married end up in divorce. That's 50 percent and the number one reason, by the way, for divorce is argument over money.

DEUTSCH: Money and sex.

ORMAN: And what's interesting, I was just in the Philippines, they -- there is no such thing as divorce there. What does that mean? They say, no, you cannot get divorced in the Philippines.

KING: Well, I think, Suze, you need the option.

ORMAN: Right.


ORMAN: But so, one extreme to the other. But we don't have a role model anymore. Now your point that you made was great, Donny. Now our vows mean nothing.

DEUTSCH: Serena, look, you're all incredibly prominent and famous. How can that be normal? You guys are -- whatever you do is pulled apart, ripped apart. How do you live normal?

WILLIAMS: It's difficult but for me, I'm just normal individual. I'm really a normal person when I get out of my tennis world or out of my little, you know, social --


DEUTSCH: But the rest of the world doesn't let you be normal.

WILLIAMS: To a point I think you are how you want to be treated. I'll go to the grocery store, I'll go to the mall, I'll go anywhere in my normal clothes and be totally normal and act normal. And I think when people see you in that environment and they feel like you're touchable and relatable then you're -- it's easier to have a normal life.

DEUTSCH: OK. Speaking of not normal. The royals.


DEUTSCH: I'm going to say something and you guys are going to get angry with me because every time I say it, I get in trouble. Why do we care? Why do we care?

WILLIAMS: They're the royals.

DEUTSCH: I got that. But we are such an evolved society. These are -- we know what they are. Why -- and we -- like children --


KING: People still believe in fairy tales and the tradition of it. I was so smitten with Princess Diana. I never met her. I got up at 4:00 in the morning to watch the wedding. I got up unfortunately at 4:00 to watch the funeral. I so worried about her sons and would her sons be OK without their mother.


KING: Yes, we did. I still think that people are holding on to that. It's nice to see William. He seems to be happily married.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The Pippa thing can get a little out of control.

DEUTSCH: The Harry -- Suzanne, I want to ask you, that whole thing came out --

KING: Leave Harry alone.

DEUTSCH: My feeling was he's just a young guy. We have a generation today that accepts that. I think young people --

ORMAN: He's not just a young guy. I'm going to disagree with that. He is in a successor, possibly, of the throne. He has a responsibility to act in a certain way that is part of the tradition, that is part of his righteousness.

DEUTSCH: Does that mean Serena, as a tennis star, does she have an obligation to young people to act a certain way?


DEUTSCH: It's the same math, though.

ORMAN: I don't think so. Not to me.

DEUTSCH: You say leave him alone.

KING: I say leave him alone. He's single. He's in a private room. He's not out in public behaving this way. He was betrayed by someone. I'm more upset with the person that betrayed him.

Does it come with responsibility? Absolutely yes. But at some point, you have to figure out a way to surround yourself with people who are going to protect you. He's entitled to have a good time.


DEUTSCH: Yeah, I actually believe today we have what I'll call the accepting digital generation, that understands they're going to be photographed. And I think are future presidents and I think our future Olympic stars and our future heads of state are all going to be visually in compromising situations. KING: Photographed in a private room? You think that you should expect that you're going to be photographed in a private room.

DEUTSCH: I think it's impossible for somebody to live -- right now, there's a president of the United States who is 22 years old. OK? There's no way this man or woman has gone through the past seven years or the next 30 years of his life completely in a bubble that somebody can't take out a camera phone and show them smoking a joint.

ORMAN: Michael Phelps. He was stupid

DEUTSCH: When we come back, our own royalty, Katie Holmes, very, very interesting. Her new post-Tom Cruise heroism, we'll talk about it. Don't go anywhere.


DEUTSCH: I'm Donny Deutsche. I'm sitting in for my good buddy Piers Morgan with four incredible women, Serena Williams, Suze Orman, Gayle King, Lara Spencer.

ORMAN: Does Piers know we're here?

DEUTSCH: No. Piers don't know I'm here.


DEUTSCH: Katie Holmes, it was interesting. A few years ago, she was an actress. Now she's seen by many, particularly women, as a hero because she divorced Tom Cruise.

KING: Hero, Donny? Is that the word you use?


DEUTSCH: I'll ask it another way. Not hero because she got divorced. But to a lot of people got under the control of Tom Cruise.

SPENCER: I heard that she escaped.


DEUTSCH: Not hero because of divorce, but better, Laura -- thank you -- escaped. So why are women seeing her that way, as opposed to just, Gayle, to your point, someone who got divorced? What is it?

KING: Divorce is very painful. I don't care who you are, if you wanted it.


KING: Even if you want a divorce, it's still a very painful thing.

DEUTSCH: You know there's something different going on here. Is it because he was a bigger movie star and she came out on top? Is it because of Scientology? Come on, let's talk about it here.

KING: It's because people really didn't understand -- a lot people didn't understand what it was. I saw the two of them together. I'm telling you, I believed when I saw the two of them together. I did. I believed that they were in love with each other.

No one knows exactly how they got together. You're hearing all of the stories about she was interviewed and she was recruited. I don't know what's true about that.

But when you saw the two of them together and interacting with each other, that was very believable to me.


KING: Now people don't know. Nobody knows what goes on between a man and women behind closed doors or what they really have.

SPENCER: Here's what I applaud. They did it quickly and did it keeping their daughter in the forefront the entire time. That's the priority. You know, I don't know the machinations of how that all happened so quickly, and we probably never will.

But their daughter was clearly the most important thing to them. Women appreciate --


SPENCER: You're rolling your eyes.

ORMAN: I don't care about her or Tom Cruise.


ORMAN: I don't know them. I'm glad they loved each other. Now that they're not together, Mazal Tov, go and live a good life. I don't personally care.

SPENCER: Suze, divorce is very, very tough on kids. We all know that. That's just the way it is. They've done a good job thus far, seemingly, keeping it out of the media, keeping it --


DEUTSCH: Serena, I want to go uplifting. Can you help me do uplifting, please? This is time to uplift, OK, because we're all very upset about that. Uplift. I was watching you last night, as we all were, and I was like, holy moly, like the way you just dug, turned it around. So I want to use that as a metaphor for this country, because there are people facing eminently more important things.

Please go with me on this. Whether they've just lost their job or their mortgage is in trouble. So give somebody a little pep talk, a little coach about what you find inside of you at that moment that might translate to somebody at home that needs to get off the mat, so to speak. WILLIAMS: For me, it's -- I live by the motto, never give up. I know you grow up hearing that. You grow up hearing never give up, never give up. But you really got to take that to heart. And you say, OK, I'm in the hospital right now or I'm -- like my sister, for instance, she's going through so much. She has the Sjogren's Disease. She's still competing and still playing. But she never gives up hope or belief in herself or in the fact that she or anyone can do what they have a dream of doing.

You know, I visit hospitals all of the time, children's hospital. These children have cancer. They're dealing with Leukemia. They're dealing with all kinds of diseases. But yet they smile.

That stuff really inspires me to realize, OK, you know what, I can be in the darkest of holes, in the darkest of positions, but I know that there's someone out there that I can help, I can change their life if I just never quit. That's just the mantra that I live by.

ORMAN: Did you ever doubt yourself yesterday?

WILLIAMS: I did, I did. I thought -- at one point, I was not playing well. I thought, gosh, I may as well think about what I am going to say. But it was a brief thought and then I snapped right back. And then I thought, now all I have to win is 12 points in a row. Then I thought, all have to do is break and hold, break and hold.

Then I thought -- there was so many different thoughts that went through my mind. One of them was negative. That's normal. I think in life, you do have that negative moment, that negative thought. But what's important is that you don't let it overcome you and let it take priority. You let it slide and you let the positive thoughts come --

DEUTSCH: Suze, you were waiting tables at one point. You had a tough time. What was the turning point for you?

ORMAN: Believe it or not, very much the same is that an Orman never -- my mother always taught me that an Orman nerve gives up. Remember, my mother was a secretary. She sold Avon to support the family. She always said, Suze, an Orman never gives up. I think the key thing here --

DEUTSCH: I'm so sorry about your mom, by the way.

ORMAN: Yes. For those who don't know, last week, on September 4th, mama went to be with God. That's all right. She was 97. She live a great life. But you don't -- there's -- see, the real question is, Donny, isn't what do we do? It's why do we do it? Why were you able to reach down inside and not give up? Why am I to, against all odds, go I'm going to do this and I don't care -- what makes me be that warrior? I don't quite know how to answer it. But all of us in our own way.

SPENCER: It's a fire in the belly.

ORMAN: It's that thing of we're going to do this. Where does this come from?

DEUTSCH: The common thing you both said it is came from your parents. So it's in us but it's also taught to us.

We're going to take a break here. When we come back, I'm going to ask each one of you what year will be our first female president?

ORMAN: That's easy.

KING: That's easy. I think that's easy too.


DEUTSCH: Back with our fabulous four, Serena Williams, Suze Orman, Gayle King, Lara Spencer.

OK. This is our lightning round. We're going to go real fats. Let's start with Gayle. I'm going to start with you. Year our first female president. What year?

KING: 2016. Don't you want to know who?

DEUTSCH: I'm assuming that's a Hillary? Is that a Hillary?

SPENCER: Yes. I would imagine that -- I think we are not going to get a big debate on that one.

DEUTSCH: Let's go through it.

ORMAN: 2016, please, Hillary.

WILLIAMS: I guess I'll go what with everyone else says.

DEUTSCH: I'm all in on the 2016 also, OK?

Next one, Madonna playing Yankee Stadium, 54, looking great. I'm going to get my Stones tickets. Mick is turning 70. At what age -- at what age does it just get so ridiculous, where we finally stop going? Lara?

SPENCER: I hope never.

KING: Listen, Bruce Springsteen is 63. He has more energy than anybody I've ever seen on the stage.

SPENCER: As long as you're still having fun.

KING: As long as your knees are good and you're having a good time, I say go for it.

ORMAN: I hope never. Age doesn't determine how old you really are.

DEUTSCH: I think the answer is never, because we're not -- because once we let them sit down, that means we have to sit down. It's all about us. Clint Eastwood, should he have stayed home or was there some little magic that went on there that we might have missed there? Lara?

SPENCER: I think he did what he set out to do. He doesn't need to stay home. He has an opinion. He shared it.

KING: He should not have stayed home. But I don't know if magic is the word I would use, what we saw.

DEUTSCH: One could argue that he hurt the party.

KING: It's never good when your appearance overshadows the nominee.


DEUTSCH: Mistake for the Republicans? Should he have stayed home?

ORMAN: I think for the party he should have stayed home, because I don't think it really helped in the long run. For him, I liked seeing him myself up there.

WILLIAMS: I love Clint Eastwood. But I don't know if it helps.

DEUTSCH: Do you guys think it damaged his brand at all?

KING: No, no.


KING: Donny, you heard him explain it. He said listen, he just got the ideas moments before he went out. He said, hey, can somebody get him a chair. The guy giving him the chair thought he was asking so he could sit down. He just thought of it on the cuff, on the fly. He's making no apologies for that. .

SPENCER: He's Clint. He can do whatever he wants.

DEUTSCH: I agree with you guys. I wish there was some disagreement. OK, let's show that picture of Obama getting picked up today, literally physically picked up. I think he was in a pizza place?

WILLIAMS: That's awesome.

DEUTSCH: Would that have happened with Mitt Romney? And what would he have done? Let's start with you, Serena?

WILLIAMS: No, I don't think so. That's what I love about the president. He's so down to Earth. You'll see him at a basketball game. I've never see that before. You'll just see him at regular outings and regular scenes. He's just a regular guy. I love him .

DEUTSCH: That's kind of choreographed, those regular things. WILLIAMS: Are they? Well, hey. He's with it.

ORMAN: Do you think that was staged?

DEUTSCH: No, I'm just saying, when you see him at baseball games -- no, no, of course that was not staged. The question was, what would Mitt have done in that situation?

ORMAN: God, I have no idea what he would do there or in any situation, for that matter. However, there's something about that picture that's wonderful. That's the picture that evoked the love people have for President Obama that they feel like, I love what you've done for me so much, here you go, big boy. Love that.

KING: And he was a republican. The pizza owner guy was a Republican who picked him up.

WILLIAMS: The fact that Obama even went and gave him a hug instead of a hand shake also shows a lot about his character.

KING: He said I'm voting for you, President Obama. But when you ask about Mitt Romney, Mitt Romney does have a sense of humor. He does have a sense of humor.

SPENCER: He should. I mean, that's the kind -- we want to feel that you're one of us.


DEUTSCH: If he has a sense of humor, why is it not possible that people can't see that? What is it about him? You said you spent time with him on camera and off camera.

KING: He does. He has a great sense of humor.

DEUTSCH: You know, his answer when his wife was describing his sense of humor, and then he said, oh, yes, I love "Laurel and Hardy." That's what he actually said, and some of the modern -- that doesn't sound like somebody with a sense of humor.

KING: He loves "Modern Family" and "Seinfeld." They told us that too. We have a thing in "O Magazine." They love "Modern Family" and "Seinfeld." He does have a sense of humor. Clearly it's been trouble translating it. I get that.

But he absolutely has a sense of humor. What I want to know about that Obama clip is how did that fly with Secret Service.

DEUTSCH: How did that actually happen.

KING: Were they like, I got to get in, I got to get in? I marvel at that. When you look at the video, you don't see anybody running in to say, hey, hey, hey. You don't see anybody doing that. I'd like to know how that actually happened with Secret Service agents.

DEUTSCH: One would argue hen it was staged. I'm not saying it was, but it's almost inconceivable that they wouldn't jump.

KING: Even if he'd asked permission, you've seen those guys. They never smile. They're sitting there stone faced with their earpieces. If he asked permission -- the boss says he can give me a bear hug, he can give me a bear hug.

DEUTSCH: Do you think he actually -- this is an interesting question.


ORMAN: Can we go back to what you just said? They love watching "Modern Family." What do they love about watching "Modern Family?" Do they love the fact that that means that they're never going to let gay marriage happen, so it's like, ha, ha, ha, we love watching? Are you kidding me?

DEUTSCH: OK, more lightning round, Suze. I love it, babe. More when we come back.

WILLIAMS: It's well written and funny.

ORMAN: Think about the topic.


DEUTSCH: We are back with Serena Williams, Suze Orman, Gayle King, Lara Spencer. First of all, guys, what a pleasure to be with you guys tonight.


DEUTSCH: Really appreciate you guys coming. Interesting question to kind of wind it down with. Two women, Kim Kardashian, Kate Middleton. Kim Kardashian, like her or not, has made it on her own, sex tapes, all that other crazy stuff, versus Kate Middleton, who theoretically has married into her celebrity and her wealth.

So who's more of a -- and obviously royalty. So who's more role model for our daughters? Suze?

ORMAN: Well, if you didn't know -- just on the surface, because this is -- who knows them, really. I have to say it would be Kate Middleton because of how she conducts herself, in the same way I think she has the ability to be another Princess Di.

DEUTSCH: Let me challenge that for a second, in that not everyone's going to have the option of marrying a prince. So here's another woman who really doesn't have any apparent skills set and who has turned it into an empire. So --

KING: Well, you have to have some skill set, do you not, to turn it into an empire? Listen --

SPENCER: She has terrific work ethic. KING: We all know how she started. But when you fast forward to where she is today, you can say that she's become a success in business. And the thing about Kate Middleton when you say marry into royalty, I'm assuming that there was a their there. They were together for nine years. I don't see anything wrong with marrying into royalty if it's someone you really love.

DEUTSCH: I'm just saying a role model to point at for your daughter.

KING: You can take something from both of them. I'm going to take the sex tape out of it. I'm going to take the sex tape out of it. But when you look at the success that Kim has, you really can not argue with that. I see you, Suze, rolling your eyes, but you can't argue.

ORMAN: I don't think the goal of life is simply to be successful, coming from the lady. I don't think the goal of life is simply to accumulate massive amounts of wealth. The goal of life is to be intergrous, honest, be role models, whatever it may be.

But it's like I'm not sure, 72 days of marriage. I'm not sure you guys.

DEUTSCH: Serena?

WILLIAMS: I think each of the -- I'm going to give a politically correct answer, because I do know Kim and I think she's a great girl. I think a lot of kids do look up to her for what she has been able to do. So you looking at the girl who says, OK, my best chance of becoming successful is being like Kim Kardashian. Maybe I can't marry a Will or look at the other girl who has more of a chance to be like Kate, who obviously is beautiful and extremely classy, and extremely amazing. Of course she's a great role model. She has to be. She's royalty now.


SPENCER: My seven-year-old obsessed with Kate Middleton, just thinks she is --

DEUTSCH: I thought you were going to say the opposite.

It's interesting, Kim gets knocked as a role model, but no drugs, no drinking, hard working, very interesting. So they're both great women.


DEUTSCH: Before we go, Lara, "Flea Market Flip" on HTV, about to launch. Of course, author of "I Break for Yard Sales," great book.

SPENCER: Thank you.

DEUTSCH: My darling, thank you so much, CBS "THIS MORNING" rocking and rolling. KING: I'll be there tomorrow.

DEUTSCH: Not that I watch it, because I'm a big "Today Show" fan.

Suze Orman, of course, check her out on cNBC. You do such wonderful things for so many women. And Serena, check out, HSN, this Friday. What are you going to be selling.

WILLIAMS: A whole new Serena Statement collection.

DEUTSCH: One more final applause.


SPENCER: Do you mind if we take over for two seconds to say we've chosen a woman of the week. And it's unanimous. And it is the one and only --

ORMAN: Serena.

SPENCER: But it's also our Robin Roberts. And we're sending her so many prayers and love her. And today it begins. I want her to know that we've been talking about her the whole show.

ORMAN: Love you, robin. We love you.

WILLIAMS: My heart goes out.

KING: And we know she's coming back.

DEUTSCH: I asked her of camera, because I don't know her well, is she as great as she seems? And you guys said --

SPENCER: Better.

ORMAN: Greater.

DEUTSCH: We wish her the best. Fast recovery.

KING: Donny, can I just say, even though you're a fan of "The Today Show," you can still watch "CBS This Morning." Just saying.

DEUTSCH: I tape them all and watch them all.

Tomorrow Wolf Blitzer is here to mark the anniversary of 9/11 with Rudy Giuliani and Howard Lutnick,, who is of course the chairman and CEO of Cantor Fitzgerald.

That's it for tonight. Thanks again, guys. "AC 360" starts right now.