Return to Transcripts main page

Piers Morgan Live

Michael Skakel Granted New Trial; Math Teacher Murdered; Interview with Dick Cheney's Cardiologist

Aired October 23, 2013 - 21:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

PIERS MORGAN, CNN ANCHOR: This is PIERS MORGAN LIVE. Welcome to our viewers in the United States and around the world. Breaking news tonight on one of the most infamous, high-profile murder cases in modern history. Kennedy cousin Michael Skakel is granted a stunning new trial for the 1975 killing of 15-year-old Martha Moxley. The latest on this extraordinary turn of events. I'll interview exclusively the mother of Martha Moxley. Plus, did this boy killed a beloved math teacher?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JONATHAN BLODGETT, ESSEX COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY: The body of Colleen Ritzer, 24, (inaudible), was located in the woods near Danvers High School. It was apparent that she was a homicide victim.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MORGAN: Latest details on this shocking case outside Boston. I will talk to two of the victim's students.

Also saving Dick Cheney, the Vice President's cardiologist on what Cheney calls the miracle that keeps him alive.

And move over, Katy Perry. The children hospital's heartwarming take on "Roar," the young and inspiring stars of this moving viral video will join me here tonight.

On the judge's decision to try the murder conviction of Kennedy cousin Michael Skakel, the nephew of Robert and Ethel Kennedy was found guilty of beating to death, 15-year-old Martha Moxley in 1975.

Tonight, a judge in Connecticut is ordering a new trial. And Skakel could be a free man in just hours. With me now live in Stanford, your CNN's Ashleigh Banfield. Ashleigh, one of the most notorious cases of recent times and a stunning twist. No way to describe this. Why has this happened?

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Well, the judge in this case decided to go with what was effectively a Hail Mary path, because Michael Skakel has tried many times to overturn his guilty verdict. And each time he failed, today he didn't. And the judge decided was because of his defense lawyer ineffective assistance of counsel as to why he should throw out the verdict. But I got to stop you for a second because I talked to the prosecutor just a short time ago. I am not 100 percent sure, Piers, that there's going to be a new trial. One step at a time the prosecutor study hadn't even had a chance to read through the 135 pages of this opinion. But, the first is this, appeal what happened today. The prosecutor said undoubtedly, they are going forward with the robust appeal of what happened today. Maybe there'll be no need for a trial if he can reinstate the conviction today.

But then I asked what about a prosecution? Almost 40 years after a crime, if you fail to restate this conviction, can you go forward with a robust prosecution? The witness is dead, several are aged to the point where memories were fail. There's been a furious corrosion of evidence and memories. And the answer was that's a reasonable question.

The prosecutor did not say undoubtedly we would go ahead. So, you know, usually we hear absolutely not so much in this case, Piers.

MORGAN: Fascinating, the instance to what happened Ashleigh Banfield, thank you very much indeed. With me now exclusively on the phone is Martha Moxley's mother, Dorothy Moxley, this is the first time she's speaking out about the decision.

Mrs. Moxley, thank you so much for joining me. I know that you currently on some medication and you wanted us to make that clear. I want to just get your reactions to what has happened today with this news that they maybe a new trial?

DOROTHY MOXLEY, MARTHA MOXLEY'S MOTHER: Oh, my reaction. All right. First of all, I had back surgery this morning because I had a compression fracture in my back and it was a great deal of pain. And I still I'm in some pain but as much better that it was before. But you are under anesthetic and when I have this call earlier, I had no idea of how I was going to feel. And right now I'm fine.

MORGAN: I understand. Well, you sound crystal clear to me.

MOXLEY: How do I feel about this.

MORGAN: Yes, what is your reaction to this development?

MOXLEY: Well, first of all, there's not a way they can erase what was said during the first trial. Well, the status of first trial is still in evident, I'm sure. So, you know, I have not given up. And I do believe Michael Skakel killed my daughter. I don't believe there's any doubt in that. He can -- He convicted himself practically. And there has been absolutely no new evidence that means anything since the trial. So I am not concerned.

If there is a new trial I will be there.

MORGAN: Right. I just want to ask you do you feel angry that this judge has effectively reopens this whole case again, basically, because he doesn't think that the original case Michael Skakel have the right kind of defense. The defense wasn't good enough. Is that something that makes you angry?

MOXLEY: Well, if I think about it being angry, but you know, Mickey Sherman did a wonderful job at that trial. I was nervous the entire time. We had many people who were concern. So I do still think that no matter what they say, they had -- he had a very good representative there with Mickey Sherman.

MORGAN: Robert F. Kennedy told Sanjay Gupta, my scene in colleague, earlier that he believes that Michael is innocent, has always been innocent and was 11 miles away at the time that your daughter was killed. What would you say to Robert F. Kennedy and indeed the wider Kennedy family who clearly share this view?

MOXLEY: You know, I don't believe that Robert Kennedy came to the trial very much. He wasn't very interested in it at that time evidently. Anyway, he can -- I think he can say whatever he wants to but you cannot erase what was set at the first trial. And you know another thing, I wonder, do you know how much money that State of Connecticut has spent on this appeals that Michael Skakel has made? Every appeal costs the state of Connecticut money. And I hate to think that I'm going to now have to be calling on appeals because I don't want to cost the state of Connecticut any money. They've done so much for me already. I feel very blessed.

MPRGAN: Did you, Mrs. Moxley, have never had a shred of doubts in your mind that Michael Skakel was the person who killed your daughter?

MOXLEY: Once we knew who it was. Once we had the proof, I have not has one bit of doubt no, absolutely not. It took us a long time, you know. It took us 27 years defined and convict him. So it wasn't that we rush the judgment on this. We, you know, he was pretty clever in the way he avoided being caught.

MORGAN: And finally Mrs. Moxley, it's obviously been as you say a very, very long time since your daughter was killed. But they say you never get over the death of the child if you're a parent. How have you coped over the years and how do you cope today?

MOXLEY: You know something, there are wonderful, wonderful people in this world. I had so many people that helped me and I didn't ask one person. They all came. In fact I called that my team of angels. And there's still more angels coming everyday of things like, and you know back then I can remember this green reporters that came to my house and I was just so glad to see them because it was the first time anybody showed any interest.

Nowadays, I don't seem to hear more see the green reporters who were just starting out. Those young people I mean they were -- they deserve to have a break and they should, you know, they should be out there too. (inaudible) a lot of sense but, you know, what I mean. The young one ...

MORGAN: Now what I was asking really Moxley, when was how you personally as Martha's mother have coped with her horrendous death over the last four decades? MOXLEY: You know because I've had such wonderful people who have helped me.

MORGAN: Right.

MOXLEY: This wonderful people have come and they have to just made me see how important it is to be positive and honest. I truly believe you have to be honest and this is all, you know, because of the help that people have given me. And I know that I'm honest with them and care about them, they will be the same to me.

MORGAN: Well Dorothy Moxley, I really appreciate you calling into the show tonight and I'm very sorry that you and your family will obviously have to go to at more scrutiny and press attention as results of all this. But hopefully in the end, it will get resolved finally once and for all. Thank you very much indeed for calling me..

MOXLEY: Well I'm sorry if I don't make a lot of senses, it could be the anesthesia is still trying to wear out. Thank you very much.

MORGAN: No, you made perfect sense don't worry about that. Mrs. Moxley, thank you very much.

MOXLEY: Thank you.

MORGAN: I want to get back quickly to Ashleigh Banfield. Ashleigh, you know a lot about this case. I mean talking there to Dorothy Moxley not misunderstanding and she said that the fact that she would obviously had a lot of medications today, but she did make a lot of sense in a sense that she was very clear that in her eyes, there is new evidence which would necessitate a new trial. And based on all of the evidence that she sat through and she was at that, original trial day in and day out. She believes without any doubt Michael Skakel is guilty.

BANFIELD: And she was very friendly with the defense attorney daily in fact they greeted each other daily and you just heard her few some praise for Mickey Sherman's work as well in that courtroom. I do want to tell you, Piers I spoke personally with Mickey Sherman just a short time ago. He's not doing any press interviews. There's of course disappointment whenever there's a ruling like this. But he did say this, he is happy that there's a chance that Michael Skakel could be released of course upon hearing he's probably going to start be launched at this week and he could be released next week.

He's also always believed in Michael's innocence and he says its natural when you lose a case that there is some disenchantment that's normal. But he didn't want to commentate further because clearly we could still be in litigation. There is a pending appeal, Piers.

MORGAN: Ashleigh Banfield, thank you very much indeed. And I want to bring in CNN's Senior Legal Analyst Jeffrey Toobin, Atty. Star Jones, Spokesperson of National Association Professional Women and Senior Legal Analyst and Criminal Defense Atty. Mark O'Mara. Welcome to all three of you. Jeffrey, let me start with you. You had a pretty fiery encounter earlier with Robert F. Kennedy. I mean, what is the reality here? Do you think about the legality of what has happened?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well, you know, one of the most common things that defendants raise after the trial is my lawyer did a bad job. I had a bad lawyer, please overturn my conviction. It almost never works and the fact that it worked here was frankly astonishing to me because I saw Mickey Sherman in that trial. Sure, perhaps he could have done many other things, but it was not a terrible performance I thought.

And what Robert Kennedy was particularly upset about was the reason that the judge overturn the conviction is that Mickey Sherman failed to point the finger at Michael Skakel's brother, Tommy Skakel who the judge said, "There was a lot evidence pointing to him as the real killer." And so that I think is a mixed blessing for the Kennedy family.

MORGAN: Mark O'Mara, what do you make of this case? Obviously, a pretty sensational twist to something that everyone in America will remember. It was a huge case at the time. And given the proximity of time that is four decades after the death of this poor girl, can real justice still be attained after such a long period of time?

MARK O'MARA, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: It's going to be very difficult if they have to retrial the case because now there's been yet another 10 years have gone and this has passed away. And it's going to make it much more difficult to get it done.

What I'm interested in though is the meat of the 136 pages that this judge wrote because you don't get a new trial unless you truly have it in confident council. And that in confidence doesn't come from strategic decisions, it really has to be a deficiency. I'm very interested in reading through the whole opinion to see what this judge found 136 pages of deficiencies that really caused a problem.

MORGAN: Star, when you listen to the poor mother, Dorothy Moxley there and honestly a very long time has elapsed since and -- but she seems absolutely certain in her mind having attended the trial everyday. This man is guilty of killing her daughter. What do you feel about regurgitating all this so long after you've been in relation to her and her family?

STAR JONES, ATTORNEY: I have to tell you. Listening to her just reminds me of the victim impact statements that I have heard over the years in my careers and when you hear a mother talk about having to sit through a trial. There is nothing like a family having to sit through hearing the gory details of the death -- the killing of a loved one. And this is mostly obviously she comes from a different emotional place and everyone else who was talking about. This is -- was her child and the thought that she has to go through it again is probably the thing that would give her the most distress.

I'm curious along with my colleagues here who are talking about just a reversal based on and in fact of assistance and I know Mark knows this from his experience how rare you would have a lawyer of Mickey Sherman stature, someone who is being paid for a case to come down like this when you have so many people across this country who are represented by lawyers who don't do half the things that Mickey Sherman did in that particular case.

MORGAN: Right. Jeffrey Toobin, let me just play you again a little clip from your exchange with Robert Kennedy. Has he gone pretty far? Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERT KENNEDY, JR.: Is this Jeffrey Toobin?

TOOBIN: Yes. Your article on the Atlantis just like ...

KENNEDY, JR.: And Jeffrey, you should, you know, you should disclose that from the beginning. You have absolutely been talking long before Michael was convicted that Michael was guilty and now as you're bias from the beginning ...

TOOBIN: No. My bias ...

KENNEDY, JR.: ... and that was every news report that you did on that ...

TOOBIN: My bias ...

KENNEDY, JR.: ... Jeffrey was ...

TOOBIN: My bias was watching the trial and watching the evidence and I like the jury thought he was guilty.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MORGAN: I mean, Jeffrey, I guess that, you know, you can understand why the Kennedys feel the way they do. This is one of their family and many families in that situation despite overwhelming evidence will want to believe the innocence of the family member. How do you see this all playing out now? I mean, I actually touched from the fact that there's an appeal by the prosecutors which if they were unsuccessful, it could be possible that there is no retrial at all and the guy just walks free.

TOOBIN: I think that's right. And I think it's certainly possible and I think just in the short term, I think it's very likely that he will get out on bail very soon because he's now been granted a new trial and the two questions the judge always looks at about bail is is he a risk of flight, is he a danger to the community. And I think the answer to both of those is going to be no. So I think he's going to get out on bail.

And so, if this conviction is not reinstated by the appeals court, I don't really see any way how the state of Connecticut can start a trial in 2014, 2015 about events that took place in 1975. It was hard enough in 2002 but in 2013, '14, '15, I just don't see this possible at all. MORGAN: Well, Jeffrey and Mark, thank you both very much you're leaving me now. Star, you're going to stay. Stick around till later on the show and come back and talk to me about other big issues. Coming next, a teacher murdered, a14-year-old under arrest two of the victim's students join me live.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UMNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He is alleged on 10/23/13, Mr. Philip Chism did fault in the Colleen Ritzer the content to murder such person and by such assault and beating did kill and murder such person.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MORGAN: Did that boy murder a teacher? It's our other big crimes toward a 14-year-old suspect in the killing of Colleen Ritzer. Her body found in the woods in the Massachusetts High School where she taught. CNN's Don Lemon is live at (inaudible). Don, an awful case this is, a 14-year-old boy arraigned there today suspected of effectively beating to death this very beloved teacher at his school, one of his own teachers.

What do we know about this case?

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Well, we know now the prosecutors are going to try him as an adult and that's going to be up to the grand jury to come back to decide whether or not they try him as an adult. We know Piers that he is being held at the Essex County House of Corrections which is in Middleton Massachusetts is not a juvenile facility, it's an adult facility, but they have made room for him there and we know that there is going to be a probable cause hearing on November 22nd.

But still no motive and the only relationship that we know that they had was that he was indeed a student in her math class, Piers.

MORGAN: And the only clue at the moment was blood found in an upstairs room and that led them to find her body is that right?

LEMON: Yeah. The police got a call from the parents because she doesn't show up. She was still living with her parents and she was attending her graduate school.

And so, when she didn't show up and when she wouldn't answer her phone the police went looking for her and when they searched the school they found blood in the bathroom and then we were told during an interview the suspect allegedly incriminated himself and that's when police went looking in the woods and found her body. And when they found her body they said it was obvious that a homicide had occurred.

MORGAN: It's very, very tragic story. Don Lemon, thank you very much indeed. Brianna Wallis, Paige Strauch were students of Colleen Ritzer, they join me now live.

Thank you both for joining me. You're both 15 years old and both sophomore students of Colleen Ritzer.

What was your reaction? Let me start with Joanna. What was your reaction to the news when you heard what had happened?

BRIANNA WALLIS, STUDENT: When I had found out that Ms. Ritzer was murdered in the school it was devastating. It was surreal. There was nothing that I could understand. I didn't know how someone could kill someone that was so innocent.

MORGAN: And Paige she was your geometry teacher I believe since last September. What kind of woman was ...

PAIGE STRAUCH, STUDENT: Yeah.

MORGAN: ... Ms. Ritzer?

STRAUCH: Oh, she was so kind. She wouldn't hurt a soul. She's one of the nicest person I ever -- I have ever met. And she was like a role model.

MORGAN: And Brianna what do we know about Philip Chism he was 14 years old, he was at your school did you -- did either of you know him particularly well?

WALLIS: I didn't know him on a personal level but I had seem him around the hall and I knew that he was like really goof soccer player and people really liked him. He didn't seem like the kind of person that would end up doing this to someone.

MORGAN: Paige, is anybody aware of any problems between him and Ms. Ritzer or any problems that he have with the school in general?

STRAUCH: No, I didn't know anything of their relationship. I didn't -- I thought he was a good student. He seemed like a good kid, would never do anything like this.

MORGAN: And Brianna you just come back from the vigil I believe at the high school. How are the students were dealing with this? Because it's an appalling thing to happen to see this beautiful young teacher that everyone seemed to have loved be killed in such a horrific manner. How are the students all dealing with it?

WALLIS: Yeah. The students at the vigil were distraught. There is no words that could describe how upset and heart broken everyone was from the loss of Ms. Ritzer.

MORGAN: Well, I'm so sorry for what you both been through and for all the students there it's obviously a hell of shock and it will be difficult for you to get back to normal, but I wish you every success in doing that and hopefully we'll get to the bottom of what happened very quickly. So, Brianna and Paige thank you both very much.

STRAUCH: Thank you.

WALLIS: Thank you.

MORGAN: Coming next the fate of Kathleen Sebelius will the ObamaCare disaster cost her her job. Jake Tapper joins me next.

And later the man who helped give Dick Cheney a new heart. I'll talk with the cardiologist of the former vice president.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAY LENO: And the very disturbing story you may have heard about this. 25-year-old man and New York arrested for trying to join Al- Qaeda. Well, this is the amazing part? He said he was still eager to join Al-Qaeda using their website and he was to sign up for ObamaCare it's just -- that's not (inaudible) and he was in, he was in like 2 minutes ...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MORGAN: Jay Leno telling the ObamaCare rollout fiasco into a punch line, the joke is funny but no one's laughing in the White House tonight. And tonight the Obama Administration says it will not change the March 31st deadline of the individual mandate despite speculation to contrast, I'll bring in Jake Tapper anchor of "The Lead with Jake Tapper" and author of "The Outpost An Untold Story of American Valor" now out in paperback.

Jake, good to see you. And there's -- we'll get to the book in a moment, we talked about it before and you said it's a fantastic, a powerful book. I only get to some of the impact that it's had in terms of some of the medals that have gone out to people. It says what's going on with ObamaCare. Lot's of people making jokes but its not funny if you're in the White House, is it? Can Kathleen Sebelius survive this if it continues to be a mess for weeks, months ahead?

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: I think the best thing she has going for her is the fact that Republicans are calling for her head because there's nothing that President Obama dislikes more than Republicans calling for the firing. They're calling for a personnel change. And the fact this it would be difficult to confirm a new health in Human Services Secretary in this current environment that said, I think it's clear that some action is going to have to be taken and you have a bunch of Senate Democrats now saying that the individual mandate, the penalty for individuals not signing up for health insurance should be delayed because of all the problems with the website, so I think they're probably ultimately somebody -- there's going to have to be some decisive action in terms of somebody's job.

MORGAN: I mean what struck me as extraordinary from that interview with Sanjay Gupta were two things. One there are clearly problems that they were aware of that were not made aware to the President. And secondly, that they didn't seem to have A team on this in the build up to the most important rollout of President Obama's entire presidency. I couldn't understand either of those things.

TAPPER: Well, if you're looking for me to explain them I don't know that I can help you. I think it's true that is a -- you would think especially with the campaign that was so text savvy and with the data mining that the Obama campaign was able to do, not to mention with the NSA is able to do. You would think that there would be a higher degree of sophistication when it came to building this website. The explanation I've heard from some insiders is that the Center for Medicare and Medicaid was put in charge of this and they're not use to that.

There also -- There's also some speculation that one of the problems was that political decisions were being made about the website and let me explain exactly what I mean by that. The idea is to enroll as many people as possible so that healthy people are enrolled in the system and thus, able to help pay for people who aren't as healthy.

If you were to log on immediately, see how expensive it would be before any sort of subsidy from the government if you qualified, that might cause some people to turn off and say, "To heck with it. I'm just going to pay the fine and I don't want to pay for this insurance." And I think that there's been a lot of speculation from smart people who know how governments work when it comes to trying to start a new program saying, "Maybe they made the decision to try to get people enroll before they gave them the final cost of this so as to not turn people off."

MORGAN: Right. Let's turn to your book, the "Outpost, An untold story of American Valor." Extraordinary that since we last spoke, actually, when the hardback was out two of the soldiers involved in this incident have been awarded the Medal of Honor. Quite extraordinary, really, would you look back at the impact the books had and how do you feel about it Jake because you were embedded with these guys, you have known them all well, you know, you're so closely aligned to you.

TAPPER: It's -- I mean, it's been remarkable to see Ty Carter and Clint Romesha, the two individuals you mentioned, former Staff Sergeant and the current Sergeant be honored with the Medal of Honor. When I started writing this book in 2010, the year after it happened, they felt the troops who served the Combat Outpost Keating felt that nobody knew who they were, nobody knew who the names of the 8 dead men -- the 8 men who were killed that day, who they were, and that the world couldn't have cared less.

And since that happened, obviously the book the came out but more importantly, these men and their families have started to get the recognition that they deserve for their incredible actions. There were a lot of medals given previous but the Medal of Honor, the highest honor, of course given to Clint Romesha and Ty Carter. It hasn't happened, Piers the two living individuals were awarded the Medal of Honor for the same battle. That hasn't happened since 1968, since the year before I was born.

So the idea that that would happen for Combat Outpost Keating is a remarkable testament to these men and it's great that the country is finally recognizing what they've done for this country.

MORGAN: Certainly isn't it. If you haven't read the book, the Outpost is a terrific, amazing detail and if you really want to get inside, what is like to be on the front line when you're fighting for your country? This is a book that people should read. So Jake, thanks very much for joining me tonight. I appreciate it.

TAPPER: Thanks Piers.

MORGAN: Also I've a book out it's called "Shooting Straight Guns, Gays, God and George Clooney" and as I have been all week, I'm giving away free signed copy to my favorite tweet that I receive in the next half an hour. Send your tweets to @piercemorgan, #pml and we'll give away a signed copy to say to anyone who can make me laugh or just enrage me, upset me, or whatever you feel like doing, really. So get cracking.

Coming up, Dick Cheney close to a miracle when Dr. Reiner joins me later. Katy Perry's "Roar" taken to new heights at the Children's Hospital viral video. These kids, you see there, join me live.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JONATHAN REINER, MD, CO-AUTHOR, "HEART: AN AMERICAN MEDICAL ODYSSEY": A normal heart would basically be about the size of two fist clamped together like this maybe in a little bit smaller.

DICK CHENEY, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF AMERICA: Right.

REINER: And you see, this is about half a foot wide.

CHENEY: Old heart, new heart. Old heart, new heart and it's one of those situation where bigger is not necessarily better.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MORGAN: Former Vice President Dick Cheney with Dr. Sanjay Gupta in "60 Minutes". Cheney speaking out about his new heart and the surgery to save his life. Cheney's doctor cardiologist Jonathan Reiner, the author of a new book "Heart: An American Medical Odyssey." And Dr. Reiner joins me now. Welcome to you Dr. Reiner.

REINER: Hi Piers. It's good to be with you.

MORGAN: Do you fear in your darkest moments that when you eventually live this mortal world of Oz that the headline maybe man who kept Dick Cheney alive in decades?

REINER: I'll wear it proudly. MORGAN: And tell me about the extraordinary, I guess evolutionary revolution that went on when you were treating Dick Cheney about a kind of advances in surgery that you're able to deploy as you went along which did and did keep him alive but will now be used to keep so many others alive.

REINER: Yeah, you know, I told the Vice President a couple of years ago that, you know, his life is sort of like, you know, very early in the morning when you drive down a road and without any traffic, and every time you get to a red light, it turns green, just in time it turns green, and if you look at his life, every time a health crisis was about to stop and every time he was about to hit a red light, you know, medicine had an answer and you can trace this remarkable history of really medical miracles through the life of this extraordinary patient who got very sick at a very young age but still managed to really live this incredibly, you know, vigorous life.

MORGAN: What's he seem like, Dick Cheney. I've never meet Dick Cheney but obviously he's got this very tough reputation, very hard politician in anyway, very divisive, what was he like when he's going through such quite regular life and death scenarios in his own private life?

REINER: Incredibly courageous. I hadn't really encountered a patient who was able to, first of all, you know, compartmentalize his medical issues, put them in a sort of a safe place and then go ahead and you know, live his life and do his job and really there's series of jobs of increasing responsibility. He managed to just sort of, you know, live with the disease.

My dad used to have a saying that, you know, it's one thing to have a disease but it's another thing entirely to let the disease have you and clearly heart disease never got Dick Cheney.

MORGAN: Tell me this, should somebody who is that sick or potentially could be fatally taken anytime, should they be vice president, were you concerned that actually he maybe old to stand out?

REINDER: No, I wasn't. You know, when I look at his history I take sort of the opposite view and I think he's a testament to the fact that folks with health problems can lead really extraordinary lives and not let their illnesses stop them.

Early on in the Administration I told the vice president that if I ever thought that he was, you know, physically incapable of doing a job that he wouldn't have to ask me, I would tell him. And I never needed to do that.

MORGAN: It's an amazing been the book, in 2007 he needed his heart defibrillate to replace and you ordered the wireless feature to be disable fearing a terrorist could assassinate the vice president an exact same plot line and then of course appeared in Homeland, did you watch that episode of Homeland? Did it bring back memories to you a precisely the kind of thing that you feared?

REINDER: You know, I actually didn't see it then I have seen it, but the night that it was broadcast Mrs. Cheney e-mailed me and said, "Oh my God did you see Homeland tonight they just killed the vice president by reprogramming his defibrillator." We were -- I was paranoid and, you know, caring for the vice president, you know, it creates a different set of challenges and when we replaced his device I thought a device that could be access wirelessly was a bad idea for the vice president of the United States. So, we have the manufacturer, Medtronic disable that for him.

MORGAN: I've also been watching this other show Hostages ago with the similar plot line with the terrorist get to the surgeon was about to operate and were you ever concern that people might try and get to you?

REINDER: No, not at all.

MORGAN: Well, it's a riveting book.

REINDER: They'd have to get to my wife first.

MORGAN: I don't know your wife, I should imagine she's a tough cookie because you are certainly yourself. It turns out another fascinating (inaudible) it's an amazing book anyone who's got any interest in hot issues or other family member has most of this do, I commend it all wholeheartedly, no pun intended and congratulations on the extraordinary work that you do.

REINDER: Thanks so much, I really appreciate it, Piers.

MORGAN: Coming up a big day of England's little Prince George we'll go to London for all the details.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MORGAN: A chubby cheeks Prince George today a period with parents Prince William and Catherine Duchess of Cambridge had his christening in London. It's the first big event for the royal baby and here with all the details, Katie Nicholls CNN's royal correspondent author of "Kate the Future Queen". Katie, what an exciting day, you must have been bursting with excitement?

KATIE NICHOLL, ROYAL COMMENTATOR: First thing, it was very exciting, I mean it was beautiful over here, the sun was shining and as you said, it was actually a really big day obviously for George but only the second time we've seen him since he emerged from the hospital up to his birth.

So there was a real excitement here and he is such a sweet little baby he's got those wonderfully, chubby cheeks, I mean this scene as we saw him everyone was saying, "It's just William. It's William when he was a little baby, he's got some strong little some eyebrows getting on."

MORGAN: Yeah, because I remember when William is born over 30 years ago now and he had chubby cheeks. (inaudible) it runs in the family. NICHOLL: It's a family gene, but I think you can just see how happy everyone was, I mean what the couple managed to do, yes today which I take my hats off to them, I think it's quite remarkable, they wanted a really small intimate family christening, he take well you remember, the royal family, you are not going to get that, well, they did, then with just, under 2000 people there yesterday. Very few family members, I mean whether knows is (inaudible) because Prince Andrew, Edward, Sophie of Wessex, the princess (inaudible) weren't there. I suspect they probably were, but I think what we're seeing is, is a streamlined monarchy.

MORGAN: But what I'm seeing actually is the first royal wave, there we are, there he is, look, actually you conduct (inaudible). That is amazing. I mean that is a brilliant gift.

NICHOLL: I know, he's been very well -- he's been very well prepared, well don't you remember, he gave a little wave when he came up to pass this all, that little hand.

MORGAN: I may not, that's a full running regal, what royal wave that is very impressive, well (inaudible) ...

NICHOLL: He's been professionally trained.

MORGAN: I would talk to you as we get more dramatic update from this (inaudible), like a very bright boy to me. "Kate, the Future Queen" terrific book by Katie Nicholl, I recommend you all go and buy it if you want to know all things royal.

She seems very well, isn't she Kate? I like it.

NICHOLL: She's doing remarkably well, I mean it's almost as if this girl was born to be royal, and of course she wasn't, she came from a very normal, the word commoner ...

MORGAN: Yeah.

NICHOLL: ... has always branded around which I think sounds terribly derogatory, I mean she came from the very well-to-do family. She went to a great private school, she have incredible education, and of course it was through the education that she ended up meeting Prince William, in fact one of the interesting nuggets in the book is that they were introduced when they were just 17 years old, they were at school. Well the girl who introduce them is called Emilia Delantia (ph) she is one of the godmothers rightly so because (inaudible) without Emilia, they wouldn't be William and Kate and then most certainly ...

MORGAN: All down to Emilia (ph). Well, good old Emilia (ph), and without that there wouldn't be a book by you either Kate Nicholl. So thank God for Emilia (ph).

NICHOLL: It's very true.

MORGAN: Thanks (inaudible) to you.

NICHOLL: You too. Thank you.

MORGAN: Now, we're rejoined by Star Jones. So Star before we get to that, I'm just going to reveal a winner of my signed copy of my book, "Shooting Straight" tonight, it's a good tweet. So I guy called Brett Forrest tweeted me and he says, "I hadn't made up my mind about where to stand from this gun control debate, maybe your book will help me" and that exactly the kind of attitude I'd like people to have when they read it.

I'm not professing of all the answers about gun safety in America. What I do know is just this week, there have been a series of further examples of why something has to be done. So yes, Brett Forrest you're going to get the signed copy of the book. Have a read and let me know what you think.

Star Jones, let me talk to you about -- we got two kids this week both involved in alleged murders. One involving a gun, one, we don't know quite what happened but it wasn't a gun. It was -- whatever it was. It just bring a question of parental responsibilities, the relationship between a school and students and parents, all that kind of thing. It just seems to me awful within the space of 48 hours. We've got the two young kids, 14, 13, committing apparent murder.

JONES: You know, Piers, years ago, people used to throw around the old proverb, "It takes a village" and it really does take a village to raise children, to be responsible people and members of society.

The school has to be a part of the village. The parent have to be a part of the village. We have to all be diligent. And I think what we've seen in this past few days is young people really who don't have the ability to manage their emotions. They respond in a fashion that make them forget that life is precious, that life and death is a real situation. And this young man who is alleged to have killed this young teacher, we don't know the method of the homicide at this point. Is he looked like he had a vacant stare at his face because we have him ...

MORGAN: Yeah.

JONES: ... to look at as if there was just something not there. If we, in this country, don't deal with mental illness and mental instability for young people, we're going to see more and more of this. And then you should move.

MORGAN: And there have also, Star there have been a series of stories I've noticed this week. A 2-year-old, 3-year-old, a 5-year- old, now another 5-year-old, I think today. And in this case, all of them died accidentally from guns. The one today was particularly awful because of the 5-year-old, I think, picked up a gun left by his baby sitter.

JONES: Good Lord.

MORGAN: And you do just -- it begs the question. I mean, I've had four children. The idea that I would allow baby sitter come armed to our house to look after my child. It's just absolutely ridiculous. But there will be people who say, "No, she has her second amendment rights, this young baby sitter to come armed to look after a child," even if she leaves it on a couch and the kid then picks it up and kills himself.

JONES: Piers, I'm going to tell you. I know you and I agree a lot in this area but this one thing that I would like to state emphatically. With rights come responsibilities. And no one is saying that Americans do not have the right to bare arms. No one is trying to take your guns away. No one is going to rush into your house with the black helicopters and grab your precious guns, trust, and believe that what happening in the United States but every single right we have under the Constitution comes with some level of responsibility.

Our first amendment rights, have a level of responsibility. And so why wouldn't our second amendment right. I have to agree with the Responsible Gun Movement. When they say -- and it with a parent or a guardian or an adult has access to a firearm, the very minimum you should do is secure that firearm in the home and that's why you're seeing states who are putting laws in place that will hold parents responsible when something tragic happens.

MORGAN: Right. Well said Star. Good to talk to you again. Talk to you again soon.

JONES: You got it.

MORGAN: Coming up, Katy Perry's Roar mis -- reinterpreted, not misinterpreted. Meet the girls behind the inspiring viral heat lighting up the Internet as incredible movie. And I'm going to talk to some of them after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MORGAN: Parents and staff of the Children's Hospital at Darthmouth-Hitchcock in New Hampshire put their own twist on the Katy Perry hit, "Roar". The viral video is burning up the web. And joining me now, three of the star performers, patients Meghan Richardson and Maggie Philbrook, and child life specialist Holly Gasper. Welcome, ladies, to all three of you. What an amazing day. It must have been to you. The world has been watching this video. I watched it this morning and it's one of most moving and uplifting things in the long time.

Let me talk to you first, Meghan, you're 16. What was the idea behind this?

MEGHAN RICHARDSON, CYSTIC FIBROSIS PATIENT: It was to have, you know, everybody who has gone through rough times and hurdles that they have to jump over to come together and to, you know, just share our message that even though we might have things to jump over, you know, we roar. We really do.

MORGAN: Well, you certainly do roar. And Maggie, have you heard from Katy Perry at all? MAGGIIE PHILBROOK, CANCER PATIENT: No.

MORGAN: No? I can't believe it. Well, Katy, if you're watching, I know you love watching this show, get on the phone, tell these girls what an amazing job they're doing because it's one of the great videos I've seen in a very long time. Let me come to you, Holly. You must be very proud of all the children that took part in this?

HOLLY GASPER, CHILD LIFE SPECIALIST: We are. I mean every single day in the work that we do, whether you're nurse, child specialist, the doctor or resident, a physical therapist, you're proud of the kids that you work with. And this video just proves that.

MORGAN: Well, I want to get you on the show just to say on behalf of everyone in America and in fact everyone in the world has watched this. There's been with our friends in Britain called me about it. So many people have seen it. So many people feel so proud of you guys and uplifted by what you've done. We wish you all the very best, to all that are having treatment. And thank you for just putting a little bit of spring in us that -- and reminding us what's important in life. So thank you all very much for joining me.

RICHARDSON: Thank you so much.

PHILBROOK: Thank you.

MORGAN: Amazing people. That's all for us tonight. AC 360 starts right now.