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Quest Means Business
Two Hostages, Gunman Killed in Sydney Siege; Lindt Promises Support for Victims; Update From Sydney; Former Australian PM Rudd Praises Siege Police; Sydney Siege Cafe in Business District; Uber Sydney Fares Surged During Siege, Provoked Outrage; Pro-Muslim #IllRideWithYou Trends During Siege; Australian PM Speaks After Hostage Crisis
Aired December 15, 2014 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(NEW YORK STOCK EXCHANGE CLOSING BELL)
RICHARD QUEST, HOST: The market is down the best part of 100 points as trading comes to a close, the start of a new week. It's not been as
much as economics, rather geopolitical issues.
(GAVEL POUNDS)
QUEST: He beat the bejeebees out of the gavel when it closed. The day's trading is over, it's on Monday, it's December the 15th.
Tonight, that siege in Sydney is over. Three people are dead after the police stormed the building.
Surge pricing. Uber's accused of price gouging during the Sydney crisis.
And it's a double-digit despair for the Russian ruble. The currency crashes to a new record low.
I'm Richard Quest. We have an hour together, and I mean business.
Good evening. Tonight, three people, including the gunman, are dead after a 16-hour siege of a Lindt cafe in Sydney's central business
district. The siege which ended in explosions and gunfire.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(GUNFIRE)
(EXPLOSION)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: The Australian special forces and police stormed the site. It was in the middle of the night just after 2:00 AM local time. New video
just emerging shows the intense scene through the windows of the cafe as the final moments of the crisis unfolded. Look at that.
A short time ago, we heard from the police commissioner of New South Wales and the regional premier.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MIKE BAIRD, PREMIER OF NEW SOUTH WALES: And I say to everyone in New South Wales, today we must come together like never before. We are
stronger together. We will get through this. We will get through this.
ANDREW P. SCIPIONE, COMMISSIONER, NEW SOUTH WALES POLICE: This was an isolated incident. It is an isolated incident. Do not let this sort of
incident bring about any loss of confidence about working or visiting in our city. It was the act of an individual.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: That individual was Man Horan Monis, a 50-year-old Iranian man who appears to have been a follower of the Sunni branch of Islam. On his
website, he pledged allegiance to ISIS. He was outspoken and well-known to the Australian law enforcement for writing harassing letters to the parents
of dead Australian soldiers. He called such soldiers "Hitler's soldiers."
Monis claimed to be a healer, and he was recently arrested and charged with a number of sexual assaults. He was reportedly on bail after being
charged as an accessory in the murder of his ex-wife. He was a self- proclaimed sheikh. He went by the name Sheikh Horan and described himself as a Muslim cleric. Here you see him lecturing in Sydney in 2009.
We'll be in Sydney in just a moment for the latest update, but let's put this into full perspective. Ali Soufan is a Lebanese-American, former
FBI agent. He's worked on anti-terrorism cases, both in the US and around the world. He joins me along with our own Fareed Zakaria. Good to see
both of you gentlemen. Let's start with you, Ali. This -- this is your classic lone wolf, isn't it?
ALI H. SOUFAN, FORMER FBI SPECIAL AGENT: Sure. He was.
QUEST: And because of that, how does it play into a wider issue?
SOUFAN: Well, the problem is, after 9/11, we did not have as part of our strategy a tactic to -- or a part of our strategy to attack the
narrative. We let the narrative go. Social media, the advances in telecommunications, fed into changing the nature of terrorism from being
operational terrorism to being motivational terrorism. And that's what we're seeing today.
QUEST: But when we see somebody basically going into a chocolate shop, saying they've got a bomb and holding people hostage for 30-odd hours
-- 16 hours or however long it was, this is a very different form of terrorism in some ways to the one that the police are aiming at, and the
authorities aiming at.
FAREED ZAKARIA, CNN HOST, "FAREED ZAKARIA GPS": Well, in a sense, though, this is the new form of terrorism that we should get used to.
We've been waiting for another 9/11. We've been watching -- and yes, partly we haven't gotten it because we've been very good at tracking the
money, tracking the people.
But instead, what we are getting are these lone wolves. And clearly, the whole strategy of society should be figuring out local intelligence
from the communities, special ops, the kind the Australians did superbly, and then, most importantly, resilience.
Notice, Richard, the one thing you didn't see happen, stock markets didn't collapse anywhere. Because at this point, people have realized, you
know what? This is an isolated event, you bounce back. Notice what the premier of New South Wales said, "We will bounce back." Everyone wants to
deprive the terrorist of that weapon by saying, we're going to get back to business as usual.
QUEST: But it's impossible. Look at -- let me read again. He was well-known to Australian law enforcement, he'd written harassing letters to
the Australian parents, he was recently charged with a number of sexual assaults. What's the old line? If it walks like a duck, quacks like a
duck? And yet, these things still happen.
SOUFAN: Well, unfortunately, people can pull the freedom of speech on you in these kind of things. This guy is a criminal. This guy has been
putting a lot of pro-ISIS things on his website. And in these kinds of things, in the lone-wolf situation, the problem is, you go --
(CROSSTALK)
QUEST: But we --
SOUFAN: -- overnight.
QUEST: -- can't do anything about that?
SOUFAN: Well, you go overnight from the radicalization to the mobilization, and that's what you're seeing today. And we have to do
something about it. We have to start targeting the narrative. If we don't target the narrative, these things are going to happen again and again.
ZAKARIA: I think we have to recognize there are going to be people like this no matter what you do. I agree with Ali, of course we should be
out -- create a counter-narrative. And most importantly, very good to see moderate Muslims, Muslim clerics, denouncing what this man did.
But they're called "lone wolves" for a reason. They're lone. In many of these cases, these people are psychologically disturbed. Look at this
guy: sexual assaults, accessory to murder. The problem is, there are a bunch of people like this. You're never going to be able to arrest all of
them.
QUEST: No, that's certainly true. But it does lead to an environment of terror. That's the first thing. And secondly, you were saying to me
earlier, Fareed, on the question of business -- we never, ever, ever on this program put dollars before bodies and lives, never. But you say that
the terrorists are going for the business.
ZAKARIA: Well, clearly what they are left with, since they can't do 9/11s, they can't spectacular attacks against symbolic targets, they're
going for malls, they're going for shops, train stations, things like that.
And what we have to get good at is making those places resilient. Which means having good intelligence, which means probably having good
technology and communications.
But most of all, it means not letting it work. Bouncing back. Bouncing back in a way that shows -- if I were anywhere close to Sydney, I
would go in, and you'd shop. You'd want to show that this kind of thing doesn't work.
QUEST: Whenever we have these incidents, I always -- I'm old enough to remember, as I suspect maybe you are as well -- Margaret Thatcher,
Brighton bomb, the IRA, the famous quote, gentlemen, "We only have -- you have to be lucky every time, we only have to be lucky once." And that
always comes back when I see these things.
SOUFAN: Absolutely. And you know what? We have to give credit, at least in the United States, to the law enforcement and the intelligence
community. They have been disrupting a lot of these --
QUEST: Have they?
SOUFAN: -- lone wolf. Absolutely. Absolutely. And a lot of times, when a plot has been disrupted, they say, well, the FBI sent sources and
that's entrapment. But this is the only thing that we have.
We have to monitor what they are doing. We have to monitor what they are doing online, and we have to see their communication and we have to
interfere and disrupt when we have the opportunity to do so.
QUEST: Final question to you, Fareed. Does ISIS take this as a propaganda tool, these events here? The guy's got -- the hostage taker's
dead. It can hardly be regarded as a great success from that point of view. Do they -- what will ISIS make of this?
ZAKARIA: It will be seen as a success for them. Because remember, ISIS is really in a battle for mind share and market share. They wanted to
become the leading terrorist organization. That's why they did those gruesome, barbaric execution videos. They're trying to displace al Qaeda.
They're trying to say, we are the guys battling the Great Satan, the great crusader.
Frankly, by taking the bait, by jumping to it, we've given them some of that, so they love this stuff. Yes. This is free publicity. This is
what they want. The more we can treat them as the band of thugs that they are rather than some grand caliphate, the less well they do.
QUEST: Go out and buy some Lindt chocolates.
(LAUGHTER)
QUEST: Thank you very much, indeed, for joining us.
SOUFAN: Pleased to meet you.
QUEST: Now, talking of that, and I wasn't just being facetious when I said go out and buy some Lindt chocolate, it was a Lindt shop, of course,
and Lindt has released a statement following the end of the siege.
It says, "Our thoughts and feelings are with the victims and their families, who've been through an incredible ordeal, and we want to pay
tribute to their courage and their bravery." The company's chief execs also promise promise to provide support to victims, their families, and all
the Lindt staff affected by the event.
We need to update on the events actually in Sydney tonight. The SBS correspondent is Kathy Novak, joins me now with the latest. So, as morning
has arrived in Australia's largest city, there must still be a lockdown, there must still be a feeling of crisis. Tell me what's happening.
KATHY NOVAK, SBS CORRESPONDENT: There is. There are still police here in the area that I have been standing overnight. There is a cordons
around the city and parts of it still shut down, although there are people who have arrived in the city to return to work.
One of the messages from the authorities is that this man was a lone attacker, that he acted alone, does not represent a bigger group, and
should not affect the way that Australians go about their business and affect Australians' way of life.
So, we can see that already starting off this morning, some people starting already to come back to work. This is just the next day after
this very shocking incident happened.
But it must be said, there is this feeling of disbelief amongst the Australian community that something like this can happen right here at
home. The front page of the "Sydney Morning Herald": "Terror hits home."
Hits home, that is crucial to the way that people feel about this here, because it seems to be the sort of thing that Australians would
expect to see overseas and not something that you would expect to see right in the heart of Sydney.
QUEST: And that's interesting, because there's also -- Australians are no stranger to being the victims, unfortunately, of terror. I think
back to the Bali bomb. I think back to MH17, most recently. So, they -- this connection when it actually arrives on Australian soil is significant.
NOVAK: Indeed. There certainly have been links, large links for Australia's two terror attacks, as you have mentioned, in the past, and
Australians really did feel the pain of the Bali bombing specifically.
And there have been links drawn to Australia's commitment to wars overseas and its support for US-led coalitions against groups such as ISIS,
but it's not -- we haven't seen in the past incidents like this, where it is right here at home.
Just in September, also there was a threat against Martin Place. There was a giant police raid, hundreds of officers raiding properties
around the city because it was understood at the time that there had been - -
QUEST: Right.
NOVAK: -- a threat linked to ISIS that people who supported ISIS were being encouraged to carry out lone wolf attacks, to kidnap a random member
of the public and to behead them in Martin Place. In that case, it didn't eventuate. But unfortunately, in this case, we did see the loss of life
after an incident like this.
QUEST: And finally, the police -- I listened to the police commissioner, and I listened to the press conference. This message that
they brought out today, Sydney is safe, go back into Sydney, go back shopping, go about your business. Is this something that Sydneysiders will
take?
NOVAK: From the few people that I have started to speak to here this morning, it seems like it. There is a bit of fear amongst the community,
because as we've been discussing, people aren't used to seeing this here, and they're still in disbelief that this could happen here.
But it seems that people are heeding these instructions to go about their business, come back to work. In the area that I'm coming to you
from, which is, as we know, very close to the site of this whole incident, people are walking around, getting their morning coffee, heading to work.
And I'm seeing people just going about their business.
We've also seen the bringing together of the community in support of the broader Muslim community. The message that this man was acting alone
and does not represent a larger group and certainly doesn't represent Australian Muslims. So, there have been messages of support, particularly
on social media, and warning against any backlash against the Islamic community here in Australia.
QUEST: SBS correspondent Kathy Novak. We're in Sydney, where it is the morning. Kathy, thank you for joining us on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
Think of it as the look of fear in a famously friendly city. Anyone who's been to Sydney knows the magnificent nature of it. Well now, a
former Australian prime minister talks about the end of innocence in Sydney.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Obviously, our top story tonight is the hostage tragedy in Australia, and the former Australian prime minister Kevin Rudd says the
authorities handled the siege with the utmost professionalism. Mr. Rudd was speaking to Christiane Amanpour, and he described the events as an
assault on the innocence of Sydney.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KEVIN RUDD, FORMER PRIME MINISTER OF AUSTRALIA: The important thing to remember is that Sydney is a very open and welcoming city. It is not
within our collective consciousness that when you rolled innocently into a cafe in Martin Place in the middle of Sydney, which I am intimately
familiar with, that you go there in fear of your life.
This is not something which is in the mainstream of our national life. So, you ask, how could this happen? Well, in any society, you're going to
have people who are very much at the fringes of the margins, and obviously, this individual was.
But I think all of our condolences should be extended to the deaths of -- to the families of those two people who have been killed, tragically, in
this appalling and violent attack.
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: On the fringes, and actually, pretty well-known to police and society. And I'll
get to that in a second.
But obviously, when we first heard about this, everybody leaps to the inevitable conclusion that this is terrorism, and particularly with that
ubiquitous flag that was being waved in the cafe that actually wasn't an ISIS flag, what does it say to you about how concerned one should be? Is
it a lone wolf? Is it a deranged individual? Or is it a vanguard of something potentially bigger and worse?
RUDD: Well, in this particular individual case, it's important we wait for the authorities in New South Wales to give us all the facts.
There'll be multiple interviews which need to occur.
But I think more broadly in Australia, it's an extraordinarily peaceful country. An extraordinarily multicultural country. We have half
a million Muslim Australians who are fine, upstanding members of the Australian community, and during the course of today, the Grand Mufti of
Australia stood up and condemned this action by the hostage-taker and by the gunman.
We had combined prayers at Sydney's largest mosque involving our Jewish leaders, our Muslim leaders, and our Catholic and Christian leaders
as well. So, the Australian society, we come from everywhere, and people have bound together at this important moment as well.
I think that speaks to the strength of my country, and I think it speaks also to what seems to me to be a very sensible way in which the
Australian government and the state authorities have handled this matter so far.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: That's the former Australian prime minister Kevin Rudd speaking to Christiane. Now, the Lindt cafe on Martin Place is in Sydney's
Central Business District, the CBD. It's the heart of the city, and it's still not clear whether that location held any significance for the gunman.
The area is home to the state's premier's office and also the Reserve Bank of Australia. The US consulate and the state parliament houses are
both located around the corner. Across the street is the national broadcaster the 7 News Network.
Christine Forster sits on Sydney's city council and is Prime Minister Tony Abbot's sister. She's been working to improve Martin Place. She
joins me now, live on the line from Sydney. This morning, as morning arrives -- now obviously, you're very familiar with the area, you're on the
council. So, tell me what you believe the mood and what you're feeling the mood is this morning
CHRISTINE FORSTER, SYDNEY CITY COUNCIL (via telephone): I think, Richard, probably people are still coming to terms with what's happened
overnight. Most people would've just been waking up and hearing the news, because it all -- the end came sort of in the middle of the night at 2:00
AM our time. So, most people were asleep.
I think, obviously, people are shocked, very upset about what's happened and the loss of these poor innocent hostages.
QUEST: Right.
FORSTER: So -- but I guess the city will start to try and get back to normal.
QUEST: You heard Kevin Rudd, perhaps, ma'am, you heard him just talking about the lost innocence of Sydney. Now, I -- whenever -- Sydney
is perhaps one of my favorite cities in the whole world. It's absolutely extraordinary, the number of times I've been there.
But I do wonder, does that innocence go? Does Sydney have to change? Does it have to recognize -- Australians have always known they stand to be
the victims of terrorism overseas. Do they now need to start having the scales fall from their eyes at home?
FORSTER: Well, look. I hope not. Let's hope that this is a one-off incident. It's -- nothing like this has every happened before, and let's
hope nothing like this ever happens again. And that Sydney will remain -- as always has been and always will be the beautiful city that it is, the
beautifully welcoming, inclusive, multicultural city that it always has been, Richard.
And I think that's been a message that everybody, from the prime minister to the premier to the police authorities that they've been trying
to convey --
QUEST: Right.
FORSTER: -- to the people of Sydney is that we have to get back into our normal, everyday lives, to not be bowed by this horrible event. Just
go about the business of living our lives as usual.
QUEST: But it is this -- obviously, as a member of the Sydney City Council, it is this balancing act, isn't it, between -- you don't want to
create a fortress city? If you think of London, now, for example, or Paris, or even here in New York, these cities where you dare not -- the
police presence can be bordering on oppressive, but necessary. That's not what you want in Sydney.
FORSTER: Absolutely not. We've never made it that here, and it would be awful if we had to have it here. But I mean, of course, everybody --
the authorities have been on alert for the last -- on high alert for the last couple of months, and so, there has been a slightly more visible
police presence and security presence around the city.
But certainly no feeling that we're in any kind of fortress or under any kind of lockdown or anything like that.
QUEST: Right.
FORSTER: The -- Sydney is -- has remained its beautiful, free self.
QUEST: And there we shall leave it. Christine Forster, thank you so much, from Sydney's city council. We appreciate you giving us time on what
I know --
FORSTER: My pleasure.
QUEST: -- must be a very busy morning for you. And we are waiting to hear from the prime minister, Tony Abbott. There you see the flags, the
podium. The prime minister spoke yesterday, of course, when this incident first happened. We're waiting to hear his comments now that the siege is
over. This is CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: As the siege was unfolding in Sydney's Central Business District on Monday morning, extraordinarily, the cab company Uber once
again seems to be in trouble because Uber raised its prices in that area. It was quickly picked up by media, it provoked a backlash.
The company clearly mishandled this in an extraordinary way. Samuel Burke is here. What did they do, and how did they do it?
SAMUEL BURKE, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Anybody who's a regular user of Uber knows they have low prices until it start raining in New York
City. Everybody wants a car, and then you see this on there. And this is exactly what people saw in the Central Business District yesterday in -- on
Uber, Richard.
QUEST: Right, but --
(CROSSTALK)
BURKE: They saw --
QUEST: Hang on, hang on, hang on. Let's go back here.
BURKE: Go back?
QUEST: So, it says, demand is off the charts, fares have increased to get more Ubers on the road. And that's the key number, it's gone up by
four.
BURKE: Four -- it's gone up four times. Now, normally, the fare would be about 25 --
QUEST: Australian.
BURKE: -- Australian dollars. Here, you see $100 Australian for a minimum fare to get out of the Central Business District. That's about $82
US.
QUEST: So, here we have a case -- let's take this bit by bit. Here we have a case of Uber's normal pricing algorithm kicking in.
BURKE: When you sign up for Uber, this is what you agree to. You get the low fares sometimes, and then --
QUEST: But this is automatic?
BURKE: This is an algorithm.
QUEST: Right.
BURKE: This is automatic, a computer doing this. But in the United States, Richard, Uber has agreed during emergency situations after Sandy
here in New York when this similar situation happened, they said, no more, not during emergency situations. But in the midst of all this happening,
this incredible hostage situation, Richard --
QUEST: So, we can't really blame them for this. I'm trying to be fair, here.
BURKE: Yes, and you're right. You're making a good point.
QUEST: You can't really blame them for the fact that the computer kicks in and does this.
BURKE: No human being is involved in that.
QUEST: Fine. But --
BURKE: But a human being was involved in this tweet, Richard. Uber Sydney sends out this tweet: "We are all concerned with events in the
Central Business District in Sydney. Fares have increased to encourage more drivers to come online and pick up passengers in the area." This is
where --
QUEST: So --
BURKE: -- people were upset, Richard.
QUEST: So, now they know what's happened.
BURKE: Clearly.
QUEST: The prices have gone up, they know what's happened, and they are prepared to ride this wave.
BURKE: And the riders are prepared to be upset, Richard. Right away, people replying to this tweet, Tyson Armstrong saying, "What a shameful
disgrace." He wasn't the only person. Another user here saying, "Your business model is vile."
Now, this was picked up on social media, and immediately then, after all the reaction, Uber says, not only are we going to have free rides for
anybody trying to leave the Central Business District in Sydney, we're going to refund all the people who had to pay that surge.
So, yes. Computers were at the controls doing it, but as soon as Uber saw what was going on, they should have said no more. Put the cap on the
surge, just as they would do in the United States, and that's where they mad their mistake.
QUEST: Samuel, when we look at his, Uber has clearly managed to get this spectacularly wrong.
BURKE: Absolutely.
QUEST: What do they do now?
BURKE: Well, they give the free rides, they refund. But I think they have to have people -- this is where you can't replace human beings with
computers. You have to have people in every office in the world of Uber looking at this and deciding that they're going to have a human there to
flip the switch. Now, this is the bad side of social media, Richard.
QUEST: Right.
BURKE: This is the bad side of technology. There's also a good side. All across the world today, we saw this hash tag: #IllRideWithYou. And it
really had to do all with one woman who was on a train and she saw a woman, a Muslim woman, who was afraid to be Muslim in Australia today. And we'll
show you what happened.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BURKE (voice-over): The hash tag is called "I'll Ride With You." It's intended to show solidarity with Sydney's Muslims. Now,
#IllRideWithYou has gone global amid fears of anti-Muslim sentiment.
This Twitter map shows #IllRideWithYou is trending across the world. Thousands of messages of support of the campaign.
It all began with a social media post from a woman in Sydney who saw a fellow passenger take off her hijab in the train to hide her religion
during the hostage siege. The tweet reads, "I ran after her at the train station. I said, 'Put it back on, I'll walk with you.' She started to cry
and hugged me for about a minute, then walked off."
TV producer Tessa Kum saw the tweet and sent her own response via Twitter. "If you take the 373 bus, wear religious attire, and don't feel
safe alone, I'll ride with you." And then, Tessa writes, "Maybe start a hash tag. What's in hash tag? #IllRideWithYou." Tessa Kum talked to the
BBC earlier by phone.
TESSA KUM, TV PRODUCER (via telephone): I saw one tweet that was just a very small act of kindness to a frightened Muslim woman on public
transport, and that pretty much broke my heart. And it just seemed like something that there should be more of in the world. I can't say that I
planned this at all. It has been amazing to watch it take off.
BURKE: The response to her hash tag has been overwhelming. One picture posted on Twitter says, "Thanks for protecting my sisters." And
this tweet, "Being Muslim in the wake of a terrorist attack can be horrifying. Thank you to Australia for #IllRideWithYou."
And finally, this tweet from Jacob: "#IllRideWithYou is everything that's right with the world. I just cried reading people's posts.
Darkness always brings out the light."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: And now, we go to the prime minister of Australia.
TONY ABBOTT, PRIME MINISTER OF AUSTRALIA: Early this morning, the Martin Place siege ended with the death of the lone gunman and, tragically,
the loss of two hostages, innocent Australians caught up in the horror of yesterday.
Five other people, four hostages and a New South Wales police officer, have been injured. State and Commonwealth agencies are investigating.
Understandably, there is a lot of speculation, but it will take time to clarify exactly what happened in Martin Place and why.
What we do know is that the perpetrator was well known to State and Commonwealth authorities. He had a long history of violent crime,
infatuation with extremism, and mental instability. We know that he sent offensive letters to the families of Australian soldiers in Afghanistan and
was found guilty of offenses related to this. We also know that he posted graphic extremist material online.
As the siege unfolded yesterday, he sought to cloak his actions with the symbolism of the ISIL death cult. Tragically, there are people in our
community ready to engage in politically-motivated violence. The events in Martin Place also show that we are ready to deal with these people
professionally and with the full force of law. I want to thank the New South Wales police and all the other agencies involved for their
professionalism and courage. Yesterday Premier Baird showed great steadfastness and Sydneysiders can be proud of their calm during what was a
very difficult and testing day.
Australians should be reassured by the way our law enforcement and security agencies responded to this brush with terrorism. There is nothing
more Australian than dropping in at the local cafe for a morning coffee, and it's tragic beyond words that people going about their everyday
business should have been caught up in such a horrific incident. Our hearts go out to all of those caught up in this appalling incident and
their loved ones. On behalf of all Australians, I extend my sympathy to the families of the two hostages who died overnight.
These events do demonstrate that even a country as free, as open, as generous and as safe as ours is vulnerable to acts of politically-motivated
violence. But they also remind us that Australia and Australians are resilient and we are ready to respond. Now, I do intend to go to Sydney
early in the afternoon to be further briefed by New South Wales police and other security agencies. I also intend to say thank you as best I can in
person to New South Wales police officers and others involved in this appalling incident. I'll do more media there and I'll take questions at
that time when we do have a better idea of exactly what has happened. Plainly, there are lessons to be learned and we will thoroughly examine
this incident to decide what lessons can be learned. But I do want now in the hours immediately after the conclusion of the siege, to offer these
words of comfort to those caught up in it and reassurance to the Australian people.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR AND REPORTER HOST OF "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" SHOW: The Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott. It is
morning in Australia, so obviously his statement timed for the morning newses and for the day ahead in Australia. Let me just very briefly tell
you - remind you what he just said there. He did say he thanked the Australian forces, saying it proved that they were ready to deal
professionally with the full force of law against those people ready to engage in political violence. He said Australians should be reassured by
the measures that they were taken. But he described the siege as "tragic beyond words." He said it demonstrated that even a country like Australia
that is free, open and generous, such a country remains vulnerable to politically-motivated violence.
The Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott also confirming that he will visit Sydney. He'll leave Cambria and visit Sydney in the Australian
afternoon. We'll have more details on the events of the day. This is CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. More "Quest Means Business" in just a moment. This is CNN and on this network the news will always comes
first. The 16-hour hostage siege at a cafe in Sydney, Australia has ended. The police stormed the cafe shortly after 2 a.m. and after exchange of
gunfire, officials have accounted for 17 hostages and confirmed two were killed. The Prime Minister of Australia Tony Abbott spoke a short time
ago.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
ABBOTT: As the siege unfolded yesterday, he sought to cloak his actions with the symbolism of the ISIL death cult. Tragically, there are
people in our community ready to engage in politically-motivated violence. The events in Martin Place also show that we are ready to deal with these
people professionally and with the full force of law.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
QUEST: The police have identified the hostage-taker as Man Haron Monis, as self-described Muslim cleric with a long-known criminal
background was killed when the police stormed the cafe and they say he acted alone and don't believe he was part of a broader terror plot. On his
website, Monis pledged allegiance to ISIS.
Reuters is reporting that the Israeli Prime Minister and the U.S. Secretary of State met for three hours in Rome. Benjamin Netanyahu made it
clear before Monday's meeting that Israel will not agree to set a date of withdrawal from land the Palestinian claim as theirs. It's unclear if a
U.S. man who entered North Korea illegally will be released. In a press conference from Pyongyang, Arturo Pierre Martinez accused the U.S.
government of acting like the mafia. Martinez's mother says her son has a history of mental illness.
The Turkish president has told the European Union to mind its own business. President Erdogan made the remarks after the E.U. criticized
police raids on media outlets in Turkey. A number of journalists have been arrested. They're said to be supporters of a U.S.-based cleric who's a
former ally of the president.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN, TURKISH PRESIDENT, VIA INTERPRETER: Those who try to get involved in dirty business and dirty relations with the hope of
returning Turkey to its old days, should realize that they will not be successful and give up as soon as possible. Turkey's economy continues to
grow and democracy is further strengthening.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
QUEST: So as you heard, the Australian prime minister said the Sydney hostage-taker was reportedly wanting an ISIS flag and held a flag up into
the window. Hostages were seen standing in the cafe's window unveiling this black flag. It read, "There is no God but God and Muhammad is the
prophet and messenger of God." That is called the Shahada or Declaration of Islamic faith. It is found on many flags throughout the Islamic world.
Extremist groups also use the Shahada but the flag we've commonly seen of course is the ISIS in the ISIS videos is different. It also uses the
phrase "There is no God but God," but there's a white circle with three words - "God, Messenger, Muhammad." As we said earlier, police have
id4entified the hostage-taker as Man Haron Monis describing himself as a Muslim cleric and had pledge allegiance to ISIS on his website. Nick Paton
Walsh joins me now from the CNN Center whether the militant group actually played a role. We were talking - good to see you, Nick. Thank you for
joining us. We were talking to Fareed earlier - Fareed Zakaria - who makes the point - it's a good point - that regardless of the outcome - and let's
face it, the hostage-taker's dead - ISIS will regard this as a success. It gives - it feeds - the oxygen of publicity.
NICK PATON WALSH, SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT FOR CNN INTERNATIONAL BASED IN BEIRUT: Well, yes but you also have to bear in mind
they may have not no real role in this at all. I mean, we're seeing of course you mentioned the flag yourself - either a drastic lack of planning
on behalf of the gunman here or the fact that perhaps he chose not to take with him one of the key essences of ISIS branding. That flag is really the
only recognizable symbol they have. You can't really recall publicly what their leaders look like - many of them live in secrecy. That flag is
basically their symbol. And he clearly went to this operation - this terrible crime - with the wrong flag in his hand -
QUEST: Right.
WALSH: -- so this may point to mental instability or it may simply point to the fact that maybe he was hoping somebody else would endorse him
and later on in this terrible incident, found actually maybe ISIS were the ones he chose to try and seek support from.
QUEST: Nick, I need you, sir, to pull the strands together of this story and help us make sense of it tonight. What does it tell us and where
does it take us?
WALSH: It tells us that you are probably unfortunately going to see more instances like this. Individuals like this man who you just heard the
Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott there say had a history of mental instability or who espoused extremist ideology are going to, in the name of
ISIS, against the coalition campaign in Syria and Iraq perhaps commit acts like this. It's going to be very hard to stop them because, frankly, if
you're not part of a network. If you're not like ten years ago traveling to Afghanistan for bomb-making classes, then it's very hard to quite work
out who are the targets here.
This man was known to the Australian authorities so it must be to many some surprise that he got to this particular stage. But you're going to
see as the war against ISIS continues - perhaps as ISIS get increasingly desperate and want to see more you might say in this shocking the publicity
successes that they are willing or perhaps more willing to endorse activities like this when they find themselves less successful in the
Syrian or Iraqi battlefield in the months ahead. This is the worry chapter now that's opening in what we used to call the global war on terror.
QUEST: Beautifully done, sir, thank you very much indeed. Nick Paton Walsh at the CNN Center putting it all into perspective for us tonight.
Thank you. Now coming up, U.S. stocks had a positive start to the week. It was extremely short-lived. Stocks turned negative and ended the day in
the red - a hundred points. Well, a smidgen just off.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Let us return to our daily agenda of business and economics - our nightly conversation. There was absolutely no rebound for Wall Street
after last week's sell off - you thought there might be. The Dow closed down more than half a percent. You get a bit of a bump at the beginning,
and then down and up again, but this is the low point of the day. It goes down a bit further and then we close off. Not often you see that. Look at
that - down 99.99 at 17,180. The catalyst once again was that falling price in oil. Brent fell by $1.41. It's now just hovering around $60 a
barrel. At that price, it is the lowest - the lowest in some five years. Very good for oil-consuming nations, less so for oil producing nations.
One of those of course is Russia.
If you want to see how this affected, join me at the other Super Screen, and you'll see what happened to the Russia RTS index. This is how
the index has traded since the beginning of the year from January. And as you come here, this is - this is - basically the fall in the price of oil.
It is the recession, it is the higher interest rate as a result and into that factor of course there is also the effect of the sanctions over
Ukraine.
So that's the - that's the - equity side - the accelerating recent months of selling is now down 50 percent since the beginning of the year.
As for the ruble, traders say it is a mood - the total mood - of pessimism. The mood is - there we have you down 10.7 percent at 64.45 as the long
price of oil keeps falling. And oil is of course Russia's most important. You saw how it's fallen but now just look at put this into perspective -
the ruble versus the dollar. And again, we need to get right over to this side of the equation. And there you actually see that sharp fall.
European stocks have wiped out -- $700 billion in just six days. These are significant falls. You don't often see 2.3, 2.5, 2.7 on a major
market like the Xetra DAX. London's FTSE off the best part of 2 percent. Traders are continuing to sell, London is now at its lowest in nearly 18
months. Frankfurt, Zurich and Paris also down as well. We need to make sense of it all. How serious is it all? Luckily for us, Diane Swonk is
with me to do just that. Well I hope you're going to, Dan, joining us from Mesirow Financial. All right. It looks like the wheels are coming off the
wagon. Is it?
DIANE SWONK, CHIEF ECONOMIST, MESIROW FINANCIAL: You know, I don't think so. I guess I'm a little shocked by how much markets are selling
off. We sort of forget the fact that we're an oil-consuming nation and many of the countries although the economies in Europe are hurt by the
sanctions with Russia, they're actually helped by lower oil prices as much as we are, so is China helped by lower oil prices, so is Japan. So, for
much of the world that we've been worried the most about, we are seeing - going to be see a lift from this crisis' (ph) losers - Brazil, many of the
oil-producing nations. You've already mentioned Russia is really being pushed into a corner and I think the geopolitical uncertainty comes out of
this as well because it's hard to come out of this in any way that Russia's not -
QUEST: Right.
SWONK: -- a train wreck. So that clearly is an issue. But that said, you know, lower oil prices although they don't have the same effect
they once did, it's a tax cut.
QUEST: Right.
SWONK: And we've already seen it in consumer spending.
QUEST: And this is what I'm finding truly puzzling at the moment because, look, you probably can't see but in my studio, we've got the Dow
here which is down nearly a 7/800 points from where it was at its high points. You're seeing these -
SWONK: Not that long ago I might add. (LAUGHTER).
QUEST: -- Right - not that long ago - absolutely.
SWONK: About two weeks ago maybe?
QUEST: Absolutely. And you've got the European market. They should - now, how much of the European market's being down is because of a fear
over another Euro crisis?
SWONK: I think that's a real issue too. I mean, we've seen, you know, there's sort of the - they call it quantitative speaking now out of
Mario Draghi -- he's been able to talk but not walk the walk. He's not backed it up with credible, you know, quantitative easing and there's a lot
of questions about how we can actually execute that in any way like the Federal Reserve or other central banks around the world have done. There
is limits to it. And so, you know, the market's saying well we'll give him to March now. We saw this tantrum in October as well, and I think there is
a lot of sense of, you know, the Eurozone is sort of put together with sort of rubber bands and chewing gum at the moment, and you know, every once in
a while the market seems to get rattled by that.
QUEST: Right.
SWONK: Ironically it's good news for Europe to see a stronger dollar, a weaker euro, and it's good news for them to have lower oil prices.
QUEST: Well you say it's good to have a stronger dollar, weaker euro, but that's the old competitiveness argument, isn't it? Export your way
out. But if you're not actually making yourself more competitive, if you're not taking the opportunity for that structural reform, all you've
really done is a 'beggar thy neighbor' policy.
SWONK: Well, and that is exactly - hit the nail on the head, you know what I mean. Europe -- I actually remember when the crisis first broke, my
European friends that were economists said it's going to go to parity with the dollar. And I said not it's not - you've got Germany in the mix. And
the reality is that we've not seen the structural reforms you need in places like Italy. Spain has gotten a little further, there's still
problems in the periphery, there's still problems across - you know - Greece is still a mess -
QUEST: Right.
SWONK: -- so, you know, we're still seeing that inability to really make the structural reforms. And although we've seen some election changes
in Japan and we hope that means more structural reform there, we're still seeing darts shot at a board rather than actual arrow shot in terms of
structural reform and fundamental reforms that you need to increase competitive both in Japan and in Europe. And I think that is the real
conundrum here. And the strong dollar - although we welcome lower oil prices, the strong dollar does not help us in (ph) profits in the United
States. Remember -
QUEST: Right.
SWONK: -- a large percentage of non-financials - about 40 percent - comes from abroad. We may not export it all, but we sell in Europe. We
sell in these economies now, we build in these economies, and when -- we don't do all inversions. We bring those tax dollars home, and if they're
not coming home and they're coming home with a stronger dollar and weak growth abroad, that's going to hurt -
QUEST: Right.
SWONK: -- profits in the U.S. I think that's part of the market reaction as well.
QUEST: We've got lots to talk about in the weeks and months ahead. Thank you. Good to see you.
SWONK: Good to see you.
QUEST: Sony is fighting for its privacy. Coming up in a second, I'll tell you what the entertainment giant is warning the news media - and that
includes CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Damage control continues at Sony over its privacy breach. The film studio has asked the media organizations including CNN to stop
reporting the company's secret - there's been unleashed. Sony's been under intense pressure since the cyberattack. The shares were down another 3.6
percent in Tokyo on Monday. They're down more than 10 percent since the beginning of last week. Our senior media correspondent Brian Stelter.
It's an extraordinary story this, Brian.
BRIAN STELTER, SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: It is. And every day it gets worse. Now this new letter from a high-profile lawyer threatens news
organizations not to report what's in these documents.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
STETLER: While the Sony hackers promise a Christmas of yet another juicy and possibly worse data dump, Sony is asking news organizations to
ignore the leaked e-mails. The studio now hiring David Boies, a high- profile litigator, to demand that news organizations not reveal any further hacked material. In a letter that CNN received, Boies writes, "If you do
not comply with this request and the stolen information is used or disseminated by you in any manner, Sony will have no choice but to hold you
responsible." In the letter, Sony strongly suggests that they are being blackmailed not to release the upcoming movie "The Interview." Calling the
attack "an ongoing campaign explicitly seeking to prevent Sony from distributing the motion picture." It's the first time the company has said
publicly that comedy -
(BEGIN CLIP)
Female Actress: Take him out.
Male Actor: Coffee?
Male Actor 2: Dinner?
Male Actor: For Kim Chi (ph)?
Female Actress: No, take him out.
Male Actor: You want us to kill the leader of North Korea?
(END CLIP)
STETLER: -- that pokes fun at a plot to assassinate leader Kim Jung- Un appears to be the target of the hack.
(BEGIN CLIP)
Male Actor: 2: You want to go kill Kim Jung-Un?
Male Actor: Totally, I'd love to assassinate Kim Jung-Un.
(END CLIP)
STETLER: Sony has not accused any particular group of being behind the attack, but security experts now point the finger at North Korea.
ANDREW WALLENSTEIN, CO-EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, "VARIETY" MAGAZINE: Essentially we've done their bidding. We've maximized the exposure to this
content and I don't do that lightly. But on the other hand, it was going to get out there anyway. We have to be part of the conversation.
STETLER: This just weeks after hackers broke into the studio's computer systems and published millions of confidential and embarrassing e-
mails. According to "The Daily Beast," the latest batch of leaked e-mails are taking aim at Leonardo DiCaprio after he decided to pull out of the
Steve Jobs biopic. In an e-mail exchange, Sony co-chairman Amy Pascal and producer Mark Gordon reportedly called his decision "despicable" and
"horrible behavior." The future of Pascal's job now in question.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
STETLER: And every day new leaks, every day new information from this company.
QUEST: You and I need to talk about the Sony leaks in a wider sense on another occasion. This letter -
STETLER: Yes, yes.
QUEST: Talk about blame the messenger for the message.
STETLER: (LAUGHTER).
QUEST: Come on. What do you make of it? I mean, it doesn't it - what - do they look stupid sending this letter?
STETLER: Well, I don't want to call it desperate but I think that's what you're thinking and it's what other people are thinking. These leaks
have been going on for weeks now, and only now is Sony coming out and saying, 'If you have these files, delete them.'
QUEST: Right.
STETLER: (Inaudible).
QUEST: This is stolen material but it's out of the bag.
STETLER: You know, to me it feels like fair game because it is out of the bag. You know, journalists are not going in and hacking into Sony
getting these files. But once these files are dumped on the Internet, they are in the public domain. That's why this is so hard for Sony and that's
why this is not a lawsuit, this is just a legal document saying to these news organizations 'please stop doing this.'
QUEST: And are they going to?
STETLER: Well I haven't seen any today go ahead and stop covering this. I think there might be more discretion. I think there's a
legitimate argument about what's newsworthy and what's just gossip. You know, there's financial information that's actually quite interesting in
these documents. For example, the next "Bond" movie - way over budget. That's an interesting business news story.
QUEST: Oh, but I want tittle-tattle! Tittle-tattle.
STETLER: Yes, there's a lot of tantalizing details too, aren't there? Lots of gossipy revelations, you know. The Angelina Jolie spoiled brat
quote - stuff like that. But it's out of the bag now, Richard.
QUEST: It's out of the bag and it will probably stay that way. Thank you , sir.
STETLER: Thank you.
QUEST: "Profitable Moment" - that's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Tonight's "Profitable Moment." Uber raising the prices by a factor of 4 in the Sydney crisis - charging people much more than they
should have done to get home. Now Uber of course says that it was the algorithm that took this place and that actually no human intervention.
But that of course isn't the full story. What Uber did was they - they went on and said publicly that it was an attempt to get cars in. And only
later did the backtrack, claiming that they were actually going to now give free rides. The reality is what this is showing is a company under
pressure. Traditional companies like Johnson & Johnson, Procter & Gamble, the airlines, IBM - they're used to reputational crises and having to deal
with them fast. These new companies - the Spotify's, the Facebook's , the Uber's - these companies have grown so fast they simply don't have the
experience of reputational damage. And you're seeing it in full throttle when it comes to Uber. Uber is tripping over its own shoelaces left and
right simply because of a lack of experience, a lack of common sense and frankly a lack of knowing what to do next. And that's "Quest Means
Business" for tonight. I'm Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, (RINGS BELL) I hope it's profitable. Let's get
together tomorrow.
END
