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Quest Means Business
Greek Minister of State Says Parliament Will Back Deal; French Minister of Economy on Greek Deal; European Stocks Climb on News of Greek Deal; Signs Greece's New Rescue Plan Flawed; Confederate Flag Debate Sweeps US South; Walmart Stops Selling Confederate Flag; NASDAQ Breaks All-Time Record; BlackBerry Shares Down After Q1 Results But Reports Signs of Turnaround; Gmail Adds "Undo Send" Button; Facebook Stocks Up on Interactive Ads; Make Create Innovate: Scientists Create Self-Healing Plastic
Aired June 23, 2015 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:00] (NEW YORK STOCK EXCHANGE CLOSING BELL)
PAULA NEWTON, HOST: Another day ends on Wall Street. Kind of flat- ish, I would say, but not a bad day. It's Tuesday, the 23rd of June.
Greece comes closer to a deal, and the prime minister faces a tricky balancing act with his own party.
US businesses are throwing out the Confederate flag. Walmart's CEO tells CNN why it took so long to get rid of it.
And you may not know his name, but gosh, you do know his music. We remember the composer behind some of the world's top-grossing films.
I'm Paula Newton, and this is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
Tonight, Greece's state minister says the Greek parliament will back a deal with the country's creditors.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NIKOS PAPPAS, GREEK MINISTER OF STATE (through translator): It is clear that any agreement will require the majority which was formed by the
elections. I assure you that the deal will be such that it will win the backing of the government majority and of the Greek people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NEWTON: The prime minister, Alexis Tsipras, has returned to Athens and now faces a very tough balancing act. Some from within his own party
accuse him of crossing so-called red lines.
Now, that frustration is shared, of course, by pensioners, who have already shouldered so much of the pain here, and they've seen their incomes
cut. Now, they took to the streets to demand that the Greek government stick to its pledge to protect those pensions.
This is all puncturing the optimism swirling through Europe that a deal can be done. In fact, the markets have already priced in the fact
that it will be done.
An EU source tells CNN that the heads of the eurogroup, the European Commission, the IMF, and the ECB will meet in Brussels on Wednesday. Mr.
Tsipras will join them in the discussion later on.
Now, the French economy minister says the IMF is right to push the Greeks toward reform, Emmanuel Macron told our senior international
correspondent Jim Bittermann in Paris.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
EMMANUEL MACRON, FRENCH MINISTER OF ECONOMY, FINANCE, AND INDUSTRY: I think it's normal that Christine Lagarde and the IMF is basically so
demanding, vis-a-vis the Greeks --
(CROSSTALK)
JIM BITTERMANN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Too demanding? Have they been too demanding, the IMF?
MACRON: I think that the Greek volatility over the past weeks didn't help basically to align all the creditors. So now, the IMF is perfectly in
its role to be extremely demanding, especially on the debt and reform side, because they have a strong role in the program.
I think our role is to push the Greek to converge and come with all the parties, and now, everything seems to be much more aligned. So, that's
why I'm much more confident.
BITTERMANN: Convergence is something you're a big believer in. Among the eurozone countries, one of the problems has been that there's not a
similar tax strategy, there's not similar budgetary strategy. How do you avoid this kind of thing in the future?
MACRON: We need tax convergence, we need social convergence, and we need more power at the eurozone level to have what we propose is a euro
commissioner. I mean, somebody in charge of such a convergence program. And you need more accountability and democratic accountability at the
eurozone level.
BITTERMANN: But are you saying that France and other countries in the eurozone are going to be willing to give up their sovereignty over their
budgetary process, accede to somebody in Brussels who's going to make the decision?
MACRON: There is no -- moderate option, or middle of the road option. I think either we decide to stay alone, and it will basically create a sort
of progressive dismantling of the eurozone, or we decide to go further and to integrate more of the eurozone.
It will not -- it's not for tomorrow, but that's a step-by-step approach. We need more solidarity and more investments at the eurozone
level. And what we need is to articulate the reform program at the domestic level and the investment program at the eurozone level, and more
solidarity at the eurozone level precisely to deliver.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NEWTON: Mr. Macron will be back later in the show. He's defending a controversial new law that he says is key to growing the French economy.
Clearly, that French economy going through structural reforms of its own.
Now, stocks across Europe traded higher on the news that a deal with Greece may well be in sight. London, Frankfurt, and Paris saw modest
gains. But remember, especially in Paris and in Frankfurt, those were on top of very large gains yesterday.
Now, Athens, of course, was the biggest winner, really continuing that winning streak, up almost 10 percent yesterday, adding 6 more percent
today.
Investors, will be happy with any sign of a deal. Anything, of course, is better than default. But is there really cause for optimism in
all of this? Is this a good plan for Greece?
[16:05:01] With his back against the wall, clearly Prime Minister Tsipras has agreed to make those significant budget savings. But some are
questioning if they are the right kind of savings. Years of austerity have already helped push the Greek economy into recession, and this could risk
prolonging it.
Also, there's no debt relief, something the Greeks had insisted on throughout these negotiations. Hampered with the second-highest debt
mountain in the world based on the size of its economy, it's unlikely Greece will grow fast enough to service all of that debt.
And of course, it won't last long. The cash will be just enough to meet some upcoming loan deadlines. Another rescue -- I think I'm counting
three here -- is likely to be needed, and that would be just around the corner.
The EU Economic Affairs Commissioner, Pierre Moscovici, says these reforms are a major step forward. Still, there is work to be done to get a
deal in the coming days, he says.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PIERRE MOSCOVICI, EUROPEAN COMMISSIONER FOR ECONOMIC AFFAIRS: We are now agreeing on fiscal targets, on the primary surplus that Greek needs to
create in order to have a financed economy, a sustainable economy, and sustainable public finances. There was a gap there, and there is no gap.
So, that's a very positive sign.
Then, the proposed reforms on VAT and pensions. We're not yet there. But one thing I want to be very clear on is that we are not advocating for
austerity. The Commission and the institutions are not pro-austerity. We don't want poor people in Greece to pay a higher price for goods and
services that they use every day.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NEWTON: Joining me now is Bill Rhodes, he's the president and CEO of William Rhodes Global Advisors. He's also a senior advisor to CitiGroup
and the author of "Banker to the World: Leadership Lessons from the Front Lines of Global Finance."
You just heard Mr. Moscovici, there. He doesn't want austerity. They don't want austerity in the EU, they want Greece to obviously grow. You've
been one of those advocating that look, debt relief has got to happen in Greece for there to be that kind of growth. Do you see anything in this
deal that gives us that back door to allowing that debt relief?
BILL RHODES, CEO, WILLIAM R. RHODES GLOBAL: Well, Paula, first of all, it's good to be with you on the program. I haven't seen the deal,
that these details leak out. But there's no doubt for a program to be sustainable over time, you've got to get some debt relief.
Remember, this is a country five years in depression. Youth unemployment over 50 percent, and total unemployment in the area of 27
percent. So, growth is the key. And I think they do need the pension fund reforms, they do need the labor reforms. All of that, I think, is very
necessary.
The other thing is a banking system. I said with Richard six weeks ago when he asked me about it, what was the key here? And I said was,
keeping the banks solvent. Because without a solvent banking system, the whole thing collapses.
And fortunately, Mario Draghi's been able to convince his board to keep pushing money in there to take care of the massive amounts of money
that have been taken out to buy time to get a deal done.
But really, at the end of the day, we have to see that banking system be able to operate on its own. So, that's something that we really need to
watch very carefully going forward.
NEWTON: You've described the cash going into those Greek banks, that basically the ECB is shoveling it in there. If they're able to stem that,
if they don't have to prop up those banks daily, do you think things can calm down in the next few weeks in Greece?
RHODES: Well, that's why I say it's very, very important. I did a piece three months ago in "The Wall Street Journal" saying the banking
system was the Achilles Hell of Greece, and that's what it's turned out to be. As I said, fortunately, Mario Draghi has been able to convince his
board to keep putting money in there until a deal could be done.
But let's see what this deal is going to be like. We'll know definitely by, I think, Thursday, because that's when the heads of state
get together. And then, we'll see what the impact is going to be on the banking system.
Because a safe and sound banking system that can be the transmission point for growth is the key here. And that's what you got to watch very
carefully. That and debt relief. Because as you pointed out earlier, when you have 180 percent of debt to GDP, how are you going to pay that off over
time and get growth and solve your youth unemployment problem and your overall unemployment problem?
NEWTON: And those basic economics, no one has to explain that to the people in Greece living it right now. I want to ask you -- we've had so
many commentators over so many months about Greece and growth. What can they do?
Many in Europe say that, look, they're just -- going to wait to take off, here, on a cyclical recovery in the rest of Europe. Will Greece get a
piece of that action if they can rebuild some confidence here with the banks and with investors?
[16:09:54] RHODES: I think they could, because I think the quantitative easing is doing a couple of things that Mario Draghi has put
in. First of all, you have a weaker euro rate, not as weak as some people would like to see, but still, it's helped on the export side big time. And
then, the extra liquidity has also made a big difference.
And then, of course, you had the drop in the price of oil and gas, which has also helped. So, this is why you're seeing the recovery in some
of these countries in the eurozone that we had not seen before, particularly in Southern Europe.
But one of the things you've got to watch out for is the political fallout. We've seen this on the left and the right. Syriza in Greece,
Podemos and its allies in Spain on the left. Then we've seen in France Marine Le Pen and her party.
And so -- and recently, just two days ago, we saw this on this immigration battle in Denmark, where a far-right party got the largest
single portion of the vote.
So, all of these economic problems are starting to have serious economic fallout, and political fallout along the way.
(CROSSTALK)
NEWTON: Yes, and those --
RHODES: And if you get a government that really does not want to continue with some of these policies that the Troika -- they don't call it
the Troika anymore, but Brussels --
NEWTON: No.
RHODES: -- the IMF, and the ECB want to do, then you've got a real problem. So, you really have to get back to growth. Growth is the key to
bringing the eurozone back.
NEWTON: And that's a point -- important to point out that for a very short period of time, they had a little bit of growth in Greece late last
year, and that is now gone. Mr. Rhodes, we thank you and hope to see you again as we continue to speak about Greece on this program.
Some of the biggest retailers in the world are throwing out that Confederate flag. What the head of the largest retailer on the planet
things about the tragedy in South Carolina and corporate responsibility. CNN's interview with Walmart's CEO is up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
NEWTON: To many, the Confederate flag is a reminder of racism, segregation, and the institution of slavery. South Caroline lawmakers are
debating its place. Civil rights activists and black elected officials are seizing the moment, and people are protesting.
Tragedy has sparked this resurgence of activism over the hugely controversial Confederate flag. Nine African-Americans were murdered in
their historic Charleston church last week by an avowed white supremacist, Dylann Roof. He had previously posted pictures online holding that rebel
banner you see there. Activists are also calling for a closer look at the state flags of some other US Southern states.
Some of the largest retailers, meantime, in the United States are getting rid of all of their confederate flag merchandise from their stores,
and there was a lot of it. Amazon confirms no Confederate flag items will be sold on its site.
Sears Holdings, which operates Sears and K Mart, says it would remove flag merchandise sold by third-party vendors online, and it tells CNN it
does not currently sell Confederate flags at its stores. EBay, meantime, says it's banning the sale of the rebel flag and its image on its auction
site. And Walmart's chief tells us, quote, "let's don't sell it."
[16:15:04] CNN's Cristina Alesci sat down with Walmart CEO Douglas McMillon to discuss corporate responsibility and taking a stand.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CRISTINA ALESCI, CNN MONEY DIGITAL CORRESPONDENT: So, Walmart is no longer selling Confederate flag merchandise. Walk us through that
decision.
DOUGLAS MCMILLON, CEO, WALMART: Yesterday we looked to make sure that we knew what we were selling, and through e-commerce and marketplace, we've
expanded our assortment to over 7 million items.
And to my surprise, we found some and decided to discontinue to sell that product because we just don't want to sell products that makes anyone
feel uncomfortable, and we felt like that was the case. This was the right thing to do.
ALESCI: The Confederate flag has been a long-standing symbol of racism. Why do you think it took so long to make this decision? Why do
you think it took Walmart so long to make this decision?
MCMILLON: Well, this is one of those that hadn't been teed up for a while. So, obviously, in this environment, awareness changes. It's hard
to manage all of these items, and from time to time, we're going to find things that we need to discontinue.
Our assortment continues to grow. Customers want a broad assortment, especially with e-commerce, and we're becoming more of an e-commerce
company.
So, if you want to pull up your mobile app and look for something at Walmart, we want you to be able to find it. So, there's pressure from a
business point of view to increase the number of items we sell, which opens us up to third-party sellers on our marketplace, which means that the
assortment isn't always curated or edited.
One of the things as a company that we will have to learn to cope with and use our best judgment as time goes along. We get the opportunity
because we employ 1.3 million people in the United States and 2.2 million people around the world to try and influence things in a positive way.
ALESCI: Were you shocked to see that kind of merchandise on Walmart's platforms?
MCMILLON: I was surprised, yes.
ALESCI: What was your reaction?
MCMILLON: Let's don't sell it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NEWTON: Stocks in the US were mostly flat on Tuesday. NASDAQ, though, closed up 0.1 of a percent, and that was enough to break its all-
time high. Other US stocks saw just modest gains, as you can see there, the Dow up about 24 points.
BlackBerry shares closed down more than 4 percent, reversing an early surge. The company reported a larger loss and worse overall sales in the
first quarter than analysts had expected. It's not all doom and gloom, though, for BlackBerry. The company that long ago seemed destined to
disappear is staging a quiet comeback, and here's why. It reported that its cash flow grew in the previous quarter.
BlackBerry is also trying to reinvent itself with a focus on software. Sales from licensing more than doubled compared to last year. BlackBerry
has also struck a patent-sharing deal with Cisco, which will pay licensing fees to BlackBerry.
Despite all of that, the road to recovery, of course, remains long. Paul La Monica joins us now from New York. It's nice to see you there,
Paul.
PAUL LA MONICA, CNN MONEY DIGITAL CORRESPONDENT: Thank you.
NEWTON: And BlackBerry looked so optimistic this morning. They saw that glimmer of hope in the software sales, didn't quite hold in terms of
having a rally in the stock. But this is clearly, really, in terms of when you look at what the company used to be, it has clearly still fallen
off a cliff.
LA MONICA: Oh, without question. BlackBerry is a shell of its former self. It is a company that was too late to get into the smartphone
business that is now dominated by the likes of Apple and everyone that has an Android phone, companies like Samsung.
So, this is something that BlackBerry is not going to be able to reverse. There's no way that they're going to suddenly have a hot new
smartphone that's going to supplant the ones that you and I and everyone else now own.
But what is the hopeful sign for BlackBerry is that they realize that the hardware business is slow growth, it's -- not even slow growth.
They're losing market share. And it's low margin as well, so they're shifting to higher-profit margin software.
It's an area where they do have some interesting technology. Internet of things is one area they're focusing on. Entertainment systems for cars.
They have a deal with Ford, now. So, that's something that I think John Chen, the CEO there, is trying to push, but it's going to be a bumpy
transition.
NEWTON: Yes, absolutely. The technology space very, very difficult to track right now, and it is difficult to try and go into that space at
this point with anything original and make some money on it. Many people said BlackBerry had that, though, had that competitive advantage. We'll
see if they can turn it around in the revenue.
Paul, I want to talk to you as well, also, about there's this concept that Google has running that perhaps will help us all with -- how shall we
say? -- our e-mail idiocy?
LA MONICA: Yes. The "unsend" button could be a savior. But there are a couple of caveats here. First, of course, you have to be a Gmail
user. Even if you are a Gmail user, you have to set up in the settings that you want to use this "unsend email" function, which would allow you to
have a period of up from five to thirty seconds to take back an email that you may have sent in haste.
[16:20:00] Now, how many people are really going to do all that? I'm not so sure. But I guess it's nice to know that if you accidentally hit
reply-all when you just wanted to send it to the one person that actually sent it to you, you do have that option of maybe fixing it. But I don't
think this is going to be a solution for all of the dumb things that sometimes we do on email.
(LAUGHTER)
NEWTON: We have to get a hold of ourselves, and sometimes that doesn't happen until somebody replies. Paul, I want to ask you as well,
Facebook, this is the stock that cannot be stopped. They're up today on interactive ads. What does that mean?
LA MONICA: Facebook is unveiling video ads -- mobile video ads that you'll be able to actually play around with and touch and interact with the
ad content. So, that is something that presumably a lot of advertisers will like.
I think investors are enthusiastic about this as well. They see this as maybe differentiation from Google's YouTube, so maybe Facebook can get a
leg up there. So, that's definitely something interesting. I think that's why the stock rose to an all-time high today, and now its market value is
more than Walmart, which we just talked about.
NEWTON: Yes, that is incredible, really, when you think about it. And it's that mobile ad buy that everybody's after, and I guess people
think that Facebook can really get a piece of it with this. Paul, thanks so much. As always, appreciate it.
LA MONICA: Thank you.
NEWTON: Now, when you drop your phone -- and I do it a lot -- it stays broken, apparently. That could change soon. We'll show you plastic
that heals itself. That's up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
NEWTON: Three hundred million tons. That's how much plastic -- things like this -- that the world produces each year. As we can all see
from the household items we have -- you ever step on this? This hurts -- plastics have increased twenty-fold over the last 60 years.
And when it breaks -- and it breaks often, let me tell you -- the vast majority ends up in landfills. Why? Because it can't be fixed. Now, it
can also end up in oceans, and there, it can take up to a thousand years to break down.
Scientists are hoping to change all of that -- and this is incredibly fascinating -- they're creating a plastic that can heal itself. Nick Glass
travels to Paris in this week's Make, Create, Innovate.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NICK GLASS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The moment you drop your mobile phone. We all do it. We all pay the price. But what
if the pieces could be put back together just as they were, as if nothing had ever happened?
GLASS (on camera): I'm here in Paris to meet a scientist who's discovered a new and revolutionary family of plastics, ones with a
molecular makeup that gives them astonishing properties.
LUDWIK LEIBLER, INVENTOR, VITRIMERS: We invented a new kind of plastics, which can repair themselves and are recyclable.
GLASS (voice-over): Professor Ludwik Leibler is a material scientist. He was entranced by plastics early on, encouraged by a classic movie from
his youth.
LEIBLER: You remember this movie "The Graduate"?
WALTER BROOKE AS MR. MCGUIRE, "THE GRADUATE": One word.
DUSTIN HOFFMAN AS BEN BRADDOCK, "THE GRADUATE": Yes, sir?
BROOK AS MCGUIRE: Are you listening?
HOFFMAN AS BRADDOCK: Yes, sir, I am.
BROOKE AS MCGUIRE: Plastics.
[16:24:57] LEIBLER: In the 60s, when the film was made, plastics were almost confidential. Now, they are 2 or 300 million tons which are
produced.
GLASS: Invented some 60 years before Dustin Hoffman became a film star, plastic is now a vital part of our everyday lives. But a single
crack can leave it unusable, destined for landfill.
LEIBLER: With Vitrimers, you can reuse it, reshape it, and recycle it, which should be a big advantage.
GLASS: After a lifetime of work, Leibler finally made his breakthrough in this lab in 2011, experimenting with ingredients much like
a chef. First, a white power epoxy resin as a base. Then the addition of a special catalyst, a sprinkling of zinc, and a generous helping of a fatty
acid the color of molasses. Stir well, add to a mold, and heat under high pressure.
LEIBLER: So, here it is. The epoxy Vitrimers.
GLASS: And now, the magical part. Leibler cuts the thin sheet into pieces to make a jigsaw of sorts, and then heats it all under pressure
again. An hour later, and the Vitrimers has reformed.
LEIBLER: It's just to show sometimes the motivation can come from Hollywood.
GLASS: In this case, "Terminator 2" from 1991. A metallic liquid cyborg comes menacingly back to life. With Vitrimers, it's more a tangle
of fibers. Inside, a network of molecules constantly link and unlink. Leibler likens it to a courtly dance.
LEIBLER: Imagine two couples which are dancing. And they come together for some moment, and they exchange partners. So the number of
bumps, number of links, it's still the same, right?
GLASS: The plastic can flow. Bonds can be replaced, cracks healed, making the potential applications something Leibler is irrepressibly
excited about. A future where planes, cars, smartphones, are all made of a plastic that can heal itself and be completely recycled.
LEIBLER: And they can open avenues for new applications in which the durability and recyclability is a big -- can be a big advantage.
GLASS: Leibler is based at a pioneering institute, the ESPCI in Paris. In these same buildings, Marie Curie discovered radio activity and
Paul Langevin invented sonar. Leibler hopes his work will stand the test of time as well.
LEIBLER: It's difficult for me to say that we are doing revolution, but certainly some people think so.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NEWTON: Desperate migrants and angry strikers, a mix that reached critical mass today at the connecting point between the UK and the rest of
Europe. We'll be in Calais after the break.
[16:28:09] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:30:24] PAULA NEWTON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT FILLING FOR RICHARD QUEST ON THE "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" SHOW: Hello, I'm Paula Newton
and there's more "Quest Means Business" in a moment when a port strike causes travel chaos between the U.K. and France. And the art of the
soundtrack - we look at the life and music of James Horner.
Kurdish forces in Syria have seized a town on the doorstep of Raqqa, the city ISIS claims as its capital. Now YPG fighters swept into Ain Issa
with the help of U.S.-led airstrikes.
Now the push comes after the capture of Tal Abyad from ISIS last week.
South Carolina's House of Representatives has voted to allow a debate on removing the Confederate flag at the Capital Building. Now lawmakers
gathered on the heels of a rally outside the Capital Building where protesters called for the controversial banner to be taken down in the
aftermath of the Charleston church massacre.
Now South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham called on lawmakers to vote yes.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
LINDSEY GRAHAM, U.S. SENATE REPUBLICAN: To anybody thinking about voting no, here's what it means. It means that we'll get boycotted, it
means that our state will suffer economically, it means that the children - black, white, and everything in between in South Carolina are going to be
haunted by this.
There is no way to explain this after nine people were murdered by a racist young man who embraced the flag. So for God's sakes, understand
this is about your political future, my political future, this about the future of the state.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
NEWTON: Thousands of Greeks meantime have rallied against their government's proposed budget savings as the country races to make a last-
minute deal to avert a default. Pensioners turned out in force after Greece's leaders offered to raise the country's retirement age to 67 and
increase sales tax.
Greece and its creditors say they are hopeful for a deal this week.
North Korea has handed down two very harsh sentences. Two South Korean men accused of spying have been sentenced to hard labor for life.
South Korea denies the charges against them.
Authorities believe they have a significant new break in the hunt for two escaped prisoners in New York State. Investigators say DNA belonged to
convicted killers Richard Matt and David Sweat was found inside a burglarized cabin not far from the prison they escaped from.
In the meantime, the husband of the prison seamstress charged with helping the men escape is speaking out. Joyce Mitchell's husband, Lyle
Mitchell, says the convicts threatened her in order to get her to comply. He says the men had plans to deal with him as well.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
LYLE MITCHELL, WIFE CHARGED WITH HELPING ESCAPEES: He told me that Matt wanted her to pick him up and she said well I never go nowhere without
Lyle, never. And he says well I'll give you some pills to give him to knock him out and then we'll - and you come pick us up.
She said I am not doing that, she said. I love my husband, I am not hurting him. She said, then I knew I was over my head. She said I can't
do this.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
NEWTON: Tonight the key link between the U.K. and continental Europe is trying to get back to normal. Now earlier hundreds of striking French
ferry workers set fire to tires, sat in the road and blocked the entrance to the Calais port and the channel tunnel, now before police eventually
removed them.
Now trucks have been backed up for miles. Desperate migrants meantime have been trying to use the disarray to board them and find a new life in
the United Kingdom.
Now thousands of people are believed to be living rough around Calais hoping for a chance to cross the channel. Erin McLaughlin shows us what
they go through.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
ERIN MCLAUGHLIN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT BASED IN LONDON: SA line of traffic snaking its way through France. Most places this is a
travel nightmare commuters try to avoid. But in Calais, France it's seen as an opportunity. Aerial footage shows migrants as they scramble to board
trucks to England.
Police try to control the situation. Scenes like this are all too familiar in the beleaguered court of Calais where an estimated 3,000
migrants live in tents waiting for a chance to cross the English Channel. Many say the problem is getting worse.
Female: It's a catastrophe. There is no other word for it. I mean, you can see around you, you know, there's trash everywhere, there's broken
fence, you know, there were burned buildings a couple of weeks ago. There's 3,000 people living in conditions like that and don't have - they
don't have - enough of anything.
[16:35:16] MCLAUGHLIN: On Tuesday came an opportunity to escape the squalor. Disgruntled ferry employees protesting ship sales at the company
created a barricade of burning of tires and rubble outside the Euro tunnel, eventually shutting down the tunnel, Eurostar Rail and all ferry traffic
sparking travel chaos as far out as London.
Police used teargas and force. Protesters were pushed to the side of the road, the whole scene creating an 8-kilometer line of vehicle -- a
magnet for desperate migrants. Erin McLaughlin, CNN London.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
NEWTON: The video from that scene is just incredible. Now meantime, factories in France are humming again. The crucial purchasing manager's
index or PMI shows manufacturing expanded for the first time in more than a year.
Now the PMI in June was up more than a point to 50.5. Now anything above 50 indicates growth and that's encouraging since economic growth in
France had been sluggish.
One key measure designed to boost economic growth in France is the controversial Macron law. Now it's meant to cut the country's red tape.
For example, tight restrictions that they have on opening up and doing Sunday trade.
It's named after its author, the economy minister, Emmanuel Macron. He told our Jim Bittermann what he wants to achieve with the reforms.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
EMMANUEL MACRON, FRENCH ECONOMY MINISTER: We deliver and it will be voted by mid-July a series of reforms and products in good markets and
labor markets. I mean, what's the philosophy of these reforms? It's first enabling the outsiders. We have a series of sectors completely frozen,
blocked by a series of regulations. And this law progressively opens these regulations.
The second point and for me one of the key item of this law and this reform program is reducing the cost of (fater) in this country.
JIM BITTERMANN, CNN'S SENIOR EUROPEAN CORRESPONDENT BASED IN PARIS: But you have people within your own party who are opposed to this and the
government had to use an extraordinary procedure - parliamentary procedure - to get your law passed.
MACRON: That's also true that we have a lot of uncomforts (ph) on our own majority with this kind of measure because we didn't refresh
basically our own ideology and, I mean, our own software I would say. We need a need a new political software, and this software means that we have
to think about France in globalization. And being a leftist is not just to preserve status and to preserve the status quo. It's how basically to help
France to fix it (ph) in this globalization by preserving a social model.
BITTERMANN: You've got more reforms coming down the line.
MACRON: Exactly.
BITTERMANN: What kind -
MACRON: I think we want to push and promote more reform on the digital side. So then we will keep on reforming products and good markets,
services and labor markets.
BITTERMANN: You're going to have people in the streets.
MACRON: No, I don't think so. I think that French people are very much aware of the necessity of this reform and they want to succeed in
globalization. When you look at the current situation, you will realize there's a good dimension to political tensions in the national assembly and
the fact that we had to enforce this law.
But did you see a lot of people in the streets? No. Because people are aware of the situation. French people just want to succeed in
globalization and I think they are very far from image that a few people conveyed about France. France is back.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
NEWTON: We certainly hope so. For six months meantime the Greek finance minister has fascinated us with his statements, even his clothes
and his game theory. The course is on policies. We go inside the mind of the man who's been so instrumental in the Greek drama, right after the
break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:40:52] ALLKI (ph) ECONOMOU, EVENTS MANAGER: It's never going to be easy, so and unfortunately the people will have to bear with it and try
to save the country. The country will not be saved by getting out of the European Union.
MARGARITA ANTONONIOU (ph), CHEMICAL ENGINEER: they hope that this will be a good agreement and agreement will not postpone the main problem
present and the future.
ELIAS GRAMMATIKAKIS, REAL ESTATE BROKER: I think it's going to be completely disastrous for Greece to go back to the drachma, absolutely.
It's going to be at least 15-20 years for us to catch up and come back to these levels.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
NEWTON: Some diverse opinion there on the streets of Athens. Now in case you needed reminding as to why this has been so difficult, the people
of Greece elected their government in January on the promise that that government would end austerity and negotiate a better deal for Greece with
its international creditors.
Now six months on, and the Greeks have got themselves a new deal. They still had to concede though on austerity and they've really come to a
very similar deal than they had back in January. Now in that time, though, GDP has fallen and Greece is now in recession.
And I want you to see here that on October 2015 and January 2015 that they were up on GDP. And look what's happened in the meantime. Now, we
were talking earlier about how that Athens index had been up so much in the last few days. But look at the bottom that it had hit before then.
And I want you to see something else after this. Look at the Greek deposits. Now we were talking about that earlier and the fact that
basically the ECB is shoveling money into Greek banks and this is why. Look at that steady stream of those deposits, those euros, being taken out
of those Greek banks. And that doesn't even account for what's happened in May and the last few days here in June. I mean, apparently the ECB is
putting in that emergency cash at the behest of Greece because they are losing as much as 1.5 million euros a day in deposits.
Now earlier Greece's economy minister told CNN's Fred Pleitgen that the recent drop in those bank deposits would be reversed fairly quickly,
he's hopeful, once an agreement is finalized in Brussels.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
GIORGOS STATHAKIS, GREECE ECONOMY MINISTER: As soon as the agreement is signed then the stability in the banking sector will be immediate. ECB
obviously has a very strong role in the stability of our banking system.
And I think it could be rather optimistic that the return of the money in the banking sector will be quite impressive in the next two or three
months as soon as the fear of Grexit of or instability is remote.
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: But the big problem is, sir, that the fear of Grexit is something that is - has
been - over the past five years removed always until the time a payment is due.
It's something the U.S. has lamented. They say we've been kicking the can down the road, and you said yourself, the next thing that's important
is to initiate economic growth. How are you going to do that?
STATHAKIS: Well we all believe that the Greek economy nowadays has a very strong pro-cyclical growth element. Because the recession was huge -
25 percent - more than 25 percent of our GDP - has bottomed out more or less so there is indications and strong investment interest nowadays in the
Greek economy.
So we think that this one is the - we get the agreement and the economy stabilized, then the growth will come. We project - and this is in
agreement with the institutions that even 2015, this year, will give a small growth of 1 percent.
The performance will be much better in '16 and '17.
NEWTON: Certainly most people in Greece and Europe hope he's right. And you can see the full interview on "Amanpour" at the top of the hour.
Now with me now is Steve Keen, he is the head of the School of Economics, Politics and History at Kingston University in London. He is
also a friend of the Greek finance minister Yanis Varoufakis. And thank you so much for joining us.
[16:45:04] I want to know - he's been quite silent through the last few days. Have you spoken to him in the last little while?
STEVE KEEN, SCHOOL OF ECONOMICS AT KINSTON UNIVERSITY LONDON: Just recently and he's really describing the pressure they're under as being far
more political than it is economic. It's really - he's seeing it - he won't - you know I can't use these words on his behalf obviously - but it's
seeing it as him to break that party - to break them to the will of the European Union.
NEWTON: You have - he has - described this as kind of dealing with divorce lawyers, that they aren't people that are looking at what this will
do to the Greek economy or what will - what does he mean by that?
KEEN: Well it's my analogy that he's basically saying they are - they're simply refusing to consider what one would think finance ministers
would be required to consider and that's the economic impact of their programs. They're simply looking this and saying you signed a contract - a
bit like saying you got married and now you want to get out of it, well we're going to take you for everything you've got.
As if the contract of the European Union with the austerity program has actually fulfilled what they said it would do. but they're not even
looking at the economic consequences of that austerity program when they're insisting on a continue after it caused GDP to fall not by the 5 percent
they told the Greeks it would fall by, but by 25 percent.
NEWTON: And Europe says look at the other countries, especially countries like Ireland and they -
KEEN: And I say look at Spain because Spain is in exactly the same situation as Greece right now. It's been upward (inaudible) at the rate of
25 percent, it's under the European Union program, it's done everything right according to the European Union prior to the crisis beginning.
It paid its government debt down, it was running surpluses, etcetera, etcetera. The same medicine is having the same impact on two very
different countries. You can find some instances where the huge changes in Ireland as well where ultimately immigration has had a huge -
NEWTON: But you know that Europe is saying why does that mean that Greece gets a free ride on its debt when -- ?
KEEN: It doesn't - it's free - it's debt is - again, remember that the Greeks were told their GDP would be 20 percent higher than it is right
now if they followed the program. In fact, they'd probably be 20 percent higher than several years ago. It would be booning now. The actual - if
the European Union's program had worked, Greek's debt to GDP ratio wouldn't be 180 percent, it'd be more like 120 percent - still very close to
unsustainable but not at the breakdown levels it is now.
So it's the failure of that program to meet its own objectives which is largely led to this continuing crisis in Greece.
NEWTON: And Germany is saying Greece is to blame for that - the have not done the reforms that they need to do.
KEEN: They, if you look at the OECD you would know the OECD put out a table saying here are the countries that have done most to reform their
economies between 2007 and 2013. Which country came first? Greece.
NEWTON: Look, certainly if you look at something like the budget surplus, it's Herculean -- to use a term - what Greece did.
KEEN: Yes.
NEWTON: I want to know in terms of this being your friend and somebody who's under a lot of pressure right now, why do they believe that
fighting in this way and going through a lot of uncertainty for the last six months which is why - what - we pointed out just now - why's he think
this is what would be best for Greece? At the end of the day, where does he expect to be in four months?
KEEN: They've given two totally impossible situations - the classic devil and the deep blue sea. You know, the devil is telling you to do
things you know have already failed, already put you in a hades and the choice is do you jump out of hades and potentially drown in the ocean?
They're quite aware how weak the Greek economy is. If this is being done to Spain, Spain would already have left. OK. Spain has a big enough
economy -
NEWTON: No one in Greece wants to leave the Euro.
KEEN: Nobody wants to leave.
NEWTON: The majority - 80 percent say they don't want to leave.
KEEN: And Yanis himself said the same thing. It's a bit like Hotel California -
NEWTON: (LAUGHTER).
KEEN: -- once you sign in, you can't sign up. But he says the situation is so extreme that that choice has actually been contemplated by
some people now.
NEWTON: In terms of what the prescription that Greece would want - short of having an incredible level of debt forgiveness that is not
acceptable throughout the -
KEEN: Germany got the same debt forgiveness in the - after - the second World War -- bigger. Germany's revival began with large-scale debt
forgiveness by the Western Allies. They're forgetting this now. And look at the German - Germany - didn't suffer because of the debt figure, nor did
the rest of the world.
NEWTON: We're going to have to leave it there, but there is so much more to speak about and we appreciate you coming in and giving us some
insights into how Greece really wants to play this and we'll keep our fingers crossed.
KEEN: Thank you.
NEWTON: Thank you. Now the name may not be (AUDIO GAP), the songs certainly do. Hollywood remembers the composer James Horner. That's
coming up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(MUSIC FROM FILM "TITANIC")
"I believe that the heart does go on. "
NEWTON: That of course was "My Heart Will Go On" - the famous theme of the movie "Titanic." Now the song is one of the best-selling singles in
history and it won its composer an Oscar. That man, James Horner, is feared to have died in a plane crash in California.
He composed music for numerous Hollywood blockbusters. Not just "Titanic" but "Apollo 13," "A Beautiful Mind," "Avatar," - I could go on
and on. Celebrities have been quick to react of course.
Singer Celine Dione who you just heard there tweeted, "Shaken by the tragic death of James Horner. We send our prayers and deepest condolences
to his family and friends."
The director of "Apollo 13" meantime, Ron Howard, tweeted, "Brilliant composer James Horner, friend and collaborator on seven movies, has
tragically died in a plane crash. My heart aches for his loved ones."
Actor Russell Crowe tweeted, "My sincere condolences to the family, loved ones and friends of James Horner. #ABeautifulMind - the movie in
which Crowe starred and Horner scored.
And I'm joined now by composer John Altman. I am so happy that you're here to join us and I know it's obviously a very sad evening for you. Our
condolences to you. You know, what was it about this man that when he did a score, composed something that he was so able to touch the emotion that
we were seeing onscreen?
JOHN ALTMAN, COMPOSER: Well this is the interesting thing about him. I think he has to be rated among the top composers of all time in film, not
just of our era. What he managed to do was combine a melodic sensibility of writing great themes to movies with an awareness of contemporary music.
So in other words, he had some of the old and a lot of the new. And he was able to put into the music whenever he scored a film enough of his
own personality to immediately make those films absolutely memorable. And the incredible thing of course is he worked across every genre of movie.
He did blockbusters, comedies, children's films, cartoons, adventure films, "Titanic," you know. It's an incredible career achievement.
NEWTON: Yes, the body of work. We want to listen to some of it right now and we'll hear a little bit more of James Horner.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
(MUSIC FROM FILM "APOLLO 13")
(MUSIC FROM FILM "BRAVEHEART")
(MUSIC FROM FILM "FIELD OF DREAMS")
(END VIDEOCLIP)
NEWTON: You know, John, when we look at that, we're made to finally feel something because, you know, we're looking at it at that point in time
and we're attuned to music. But when we're sitting in a theater or at home, it's a subtle thing.
In order to be able to tap into that - I mean, what do you think as a person in terms of his characteristics, what he was like, what gave him
that ability to give me goosebumps or make me cry?
ALTMAN: It's something you can't define, otherwise everybody would be coming up with it every time. And he just had that knack. Certainly when
I worked with him on "Titanic," it matched the scale of the film. And "Field of Dreams" equally matched the scale of the film.
[16:55:00] And there was something about how he wrote and the orchestration techniques he used that sort of grasped of the essence of
every single movie.
And a lot of composers are very sort of one-dimensional, you know, they're good at doing adventure films or they're good at comedy. He seemed
to transcend that and have a sort of overview of how a film should sound. And that's really what's done it. The whole fabric of the film is sort of
tied up in the way he wrote which is quite an achievement.
I mean, if you think of "Titanic," you know, it's a wonderful achievement to match the scale of that particular film with music.
NEWTON: Yes. And it is now inseparable - our memory of "Titanic" and our memory of the kind of music he scored for that.
ALTMAN: Yes, absolutely.
NEWTON: John, thank you so much. Really appreciate it.
ALTMAN: Thank you.
NEWTON: And we will be back with a final check of markets in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
NEWTON: Some breaking news in to CNN. Boeing has named a new CEO. Now the company just announced chief operating officer Dennis A. Mulienburg
will take over from James McNerney. Now that will happen on July 1st. McNerney has been in the job for ten years now and he will continue as
Boeing's chairman.
Now we want to take a quick look at how markets fared around the world on Tuesday. The NASDAQ as we said did break another record - -another all-
time high closing up about a tenth of a percentage. Didn't take much, did it? The Dow Jones Industrials meantime had some modest gains, closing up
25 points.
U.S. investors are waiting for more information on whether - you guessed it - Greece has a deal to avoid a default. And stocks across
Europe traded higher as we were saying. Stock market in Paris and of course in Germany up quite a bit about - about a (AUDIO GAP) percent today
up from 4 percent yesterday.
[17:00:06] That is "Quest Means Business." I'm Paula Newton here with CNN.
END
