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Quest Means Business
Icahn's $150 Million Push for Corporate Tax Reform; Starbucks, Fiat Ordered to Repay European Taxes; Tuition Protests Erupt in South Africa; Ferrari Races Ahead in Market Debut; The Business End of Business Trips; Carnival Launches Cruise Brand in China; Fans Celebrate Back to the Future Day. Aired 4-5p ET.
Aired October 21, 2015 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[15:59:55] (NEW YORK STOCK EXCHANGE CLOSING BELL)
POPPY HARLOW, HOST: Stocks are heading for a negative finish on Wall Street. It is Wednesday, October the 21st.
Tonight, Mr. Icahn goes to Washington. The billionaire investors pledges millions of his own money in a push for major corporate tax reform
in America. He will join me next live on the program.
And goodnight, sweetheart. The EU cracks down on alleged cozy corporate tax deals.
And Ferrari shares go from naught to nearly $60 a piece on the day of its initial public offering.
I'm Poppy Harlow, and this is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
Tonight, on a historic day in the race for the White House, one of the world's most powerful investors is vowing to spend millions of dollars of
his own money to bring home trillions of dollars in profits from US companies. All that money is sitting overseas.
Carl Icahn wants to see an overhaul of US corporate taxes, and he wants a temporary tax holiday to persuade major companies, like Apple and
others, to bring home that overseas money.
He penned a letter to Congress, and he is starting his own Super PAC designed to put pressure on Congress and try to force lawmakers into
action. He will commit $150 million of his own money to the fund. He plans to raise much more from wealthy investors on Wall Street.
He's taken on the boards of some of the world's biggest companies and won, from Apple to eBay to Time Warner, the parent company of this network.
Carl Icahn joins me now on the phone. Thank you, sir, for being with me.
CARL ICAHN, BUSINESS MAGNATE AND ACTIVIST SHAREHOLDER (via telephone): Thank you for having me, Poppy.
HARLOW: Well, let's begin with the news in the Rose Garden today. Joe Biden, the vice president, said he will not seek the nomination for
president. What's your reaction?
ICAHN: You're asking me on the reaction of Biden?
HARLOW: I'm asking you your reaction to the vice president.
(CROSSTALK)
ICAHN: Yes, well, I'm not an expert on Democratic Party politics but, you know, I sort of expected that. I think he waited an awful long time if
he was going to throw his hat into the ring. So I think -- I'm sure Hillary is pretty happy about it.
HARLOW: All right. So let's talk about what you've done. You sent this letter to Congress. I read it. A lot of people have read it by now.
You put $150 million of your own money into what will be a Super PAC. And you want Congress to mainly focus on inversions, basically to have
companies come back to the United States and not be, as you call it, double taxed for the money that they bring back to this country.
How much money have you calculated will put into the coffers of American government if we were to see that change?
ICAHN: I think $200 billion to $250 billion will just come in. And the figures are sort of a no-brainer. When you make an investment,
sometimes you find those. You can't really understand why anybody is against doing this in the government.
And everyone I've spoken to -- that I've spoken to, everybody in Washington I've spoken to, say, yes, it's a good idea but they don't do
anything.
And interestingly -- you're the first to know this -- I just got a call about five minutes ago from Harry Reid, who said to me -- and I've
know him for years, not well but I know him.
And he said, hey, Carl, we're 100 percent for this. I can deliver over 40 Democrats for this. We don't want these inversions. It's -- and,
as we both said, it's terrible for the country. And it is very scary for the country, actually, Poppy, because it's almost insane not to do this,
because, perversely, you're getting the opposite of what you want here.
You're getting the 1 percent, the rich 1 percent make money on these inversions, some of them, because some of these big hedge funds, not all of
them, but the short-term is spent people don't like, are pressuring companies to do this, because they get a fast premium.
So they make a lot of money. And the foreign country makes a lot of money and again, you have the American people left holding the bag. And
why nothing is done about it is beyond my knowledge or understanding.
But everyone says do it and yet it's not done. So I believe it's time to say who is to blame for not getting this legislation, simple
legislation. We're not going into a complicated tax deal. We're just saying, hey, look, bring the money back. We argue with these companies,
say, you know, you pay 8 percent or something like that.
And honestly, the companies are right. They shouldn't be paying anything, because in any other country in the world, if you're making
widgets in another country and producing them there, you don't have to pay a double tax on it. And yet we keep saying that these companies should pay
a double tax. And yet I think they will pay that $200 billion.
[16:04:59] HARLOW: So to be clear here, you want the companies to basically have what would be called a tax holiday. So when they bring this
money back, you're proposing 8 percent is what they'd pay, et cetera, but not 35 percent.
Do you think you can get enough folks onboard in Congress on both sides? I know Harry Reid just called you, said he can get 40 Democrats.
Can you get the votes for this? Because this has been proposed by many before, but they don't want to -- you know, some folks say --
(CROSSTALK)
ICAHN: Well, I -- I've got to tell you --
HARLOW: -- the companies should pay more than 8 percent.
ICAHN: -- there's some people, you're right, for some reason or other, which I really, honestly, with all respect, don't think they
understand it, don't want it -- they may not want to do this because they don't want the government involved in anything.
And you know, today -- and we can go through this a long time and if anybody wants to watch it, they can go to carlicahn.comand see a video I
put out about two or three weeks ago, showing the problems we have in this country and showing the fact that conservative Republicans say we want
limited government.
They're getting the opposite of that because the Fed has to do so much and the Fed is so powerful, it's the most powerful organization in the
world. I am not against the Fed but the Federal Reserve is shouldering the whole burden of keeping economy from really sinking, and we don't know the
problems that are going to come from zero interest rates.
And I think the Fed would welcome some stimulus from the government. And you know, in a capitalistic system, you have to -- you have a very
cyclical economy and you have to have some stimulus from time to time. But this is not even that. I'm not even -- I'm digressing a little. This is
just a simple move and it's insane not to do it.
HARLOW: Let --
ICAHN: And I can't -- I really can't understand why it's not done without my having to do this.
HARLOW: You basically sent a message to Congress and you said, you do this or else. You're putting $150 million of your own money into this
Super PAC. Tell me specifically, Carl, how you're going to force Congress' hand. Is this about getting some of them out of office?
(CROSSTALK)
ICAHN: I don't think it's about --
HARLOW: -- and new people in? How do you do that?
ICAHN: I don't want to be presumptuous. I'm not a politician. I don't really get into politics much. I know a lot of the guys there;
they're always coming to me to give them some donations. Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't.
But I'll tell you this -- it's not what's in the hand, but I tell you what I've done successfully for 30, 40 years. You have a lot of companies
have the wrong CEOs or CEOs that are lazy or -- and I'm not telling people they're lazy -- but you know, what I've learned is, you told them
accountable.
You try to be real nice, and you say, look, I own stock in your company, just like I'm a voter, same idea. I own stock in your company.
And you ought to be doing this or this. Get off the golf course.
(CROSSTALK)
HARLOW: But you don't own these politicians --
ICAHN: Or just get --
HARLOW: -- that's the difference, right, Carl? That's the big difference here.
ICAHN: No, no. But let me tell you, let me finish for one second. I know maybe I'm talking a little too much here.
(LAUGHTER)
ICAHN: But you get me going. So, I'm saying that you tell them, I'm going to hold you accountable, and if you don't do this, sooner or later,
we're going to have a proxy fight. The voters will vote you without because you're doing a lousy job. OK?
And I plan to do the same thing in Washington, which isn't a threat. It's just saying, hey, I want to know who's to blame for not doing this.
I've gotten an outpouring already, a lot of congressman and senators, you know, both on the committee.
In other words, the legislation has to come from the committees, which is the Finance Committee in the Senate, House Ways and Means in the House.
And you say, OK, I want to know who on those committees don't want to do this?
And those are the people that I will blame. And I will blame them and hold them accountable and say you have a mandate to represent the people
who voted for you, and you're not really fulfilling it.
And when it comes time to elections, I have a PAC, and my PAC is different than the PACs that they've criticized. My PAC is wide open, they
know who's doing it. There's nobody going to give me money that we're not going to know who is doing it.
And we're going to just tell the voters we're independent. You know, we're going to be independent of anybody running against them. But we're
going to be spending money, telling people why they shouldn't vote for somebody that did something so ridiculous unless there's a good reason.
And that's how we're going to do this.
But I don't think it's going to come to that, Poppy, because I do think -- everyone I talked to said we should do it. I can't figure out who
doesn't want it.
And then when you say, well, why aren't they doing it? You don't know. It's just stupid, because this country has a major problem from
this.
And I'll tell you the problem, that a lot of these companies are planning as we speak -- and this is an area I know -- planning, as we
speak, and a number have done it already, moving out of the country.
HARLOW: Who? Which companies? --
(CROSSTALK)
ICAHN: And that is absurd, right?
HARLOW: Which companies? I mean, you're one of the biggest shareholders in Apple. Would Apple leave?
ICAHN: Apple won't leave, but I'll tell you -- I don't think Apple will leave. I mean, I don't run Apple. I know Tim Cook pretty well. I
don't think they would leave. They're too big. They are too big. They're one of the few --
(CROSSTALK)
HARLOW: So who would leave?
ICAHN: -- I think are too big to leave. What? But let me tell you what Apple or anybody like them will do. They're not saying they're going
to do it. They'll take that $2.2 trillion -- well, there's -- they have about $200 billion there -- and they're going to invest it over there.
So instead of bringing it into this country, instead of investing here, they're going to invest in foreign companies where they get a much
lower tax rate.
[16:10:04] So even if they don't leave, we're going to lose all that money and all the jobs that that money could bring in. And we're going to
give it up, and they're going to do it soon. I mean, I'm not telling you they're telling me that. But I know these guys, I know them all. And why
shouldn't they do it?
HARLOW: Let me ask --
ICAHN: Look, if you're a good CEO, that's what you will do.
HARLOW: Let me ask you this. Look, those that criticize the Citizens United decision that allow Super PACs to run, or those that criticize super
PACs, say folks like you, Carl Icahn, who are billionaires, have a louder voice in Washington than the average American.
Is -- and Joe Biden talked about that today, when he said he's not running for president.
(CROSSTALK)
ICAHN: Poppy --
HARLOW: Is this an example -- Carl Icahn, is this an example of you having more power in politics in Washington because of your wallet than the
average American?
ICAHN: No, I don't think that applies. I don't Biden was speaking about that. The criticism of Citizens United was it was sort of a secret
kind of organization where nobody knew what they were doing, nobody knew what was happening.
But I don't think anybody is against somebody like myself, who's made a lot of money and feels I've got a responsibility to voice what I believe
should be done. And if you don't think that, speak out against me.
But I want to have a voice because it's so crazy what you're doing. And by the way, I think very few disagree that the Senate and Congress is
in a gridlock, doing nothing, and it's terrible for this country, what's going on. They can't get anything done.
But this is a quick essential example of it. And I think more people like me should be coming out and saying, hey, here's a problem. And here's
how we're going to try to fix it.
And I am the opposite of Citizens United, because the criticism of Citizens United in this Supreme Court vote that gets that criticism was,
hey, this is like a self-organization, nobody knows what they're doing --
HARLOW: Right.
ICAHN: -- it's all done in secret. And we don't know why they're doing it. With me, you know what I'm doing. You know what I'm saying.
HARLOW: And you have pledged to tell us, all the people, that put money into this fund, so that will be interesting to hear who else --
(CROSSTALK)
ICAHN: Well, wait. Hold on, hold on. I'm putting in $150 million. I'm committing $150 million. I'm not telling you -- I'm not even asking
people to do it at this point. And if they do it, they're going to have their name in there. They're not going to do it quietly.
HARLOW: Right.
ICAHN: They're going to do it and put their name in. And if they don't do it, so what? Hey, look, I love this country. I came up from the
streets of Queens. I couldn't have done it anywhere else, and it sounds corny. I don't need their money. So I can do it, and that's what I'm
doing.
HARLOW: All right, Carl.
ICAHN: So --
HARLOW: Carl Icahn, we'll be watching, and who knows? If Donald Trump does make it to the general election and is nominated and becomes the
next president, you might be our next secretary, we know -- Treasury Secretary.
(CROSSTALK)
ICAHN: No, no, no --
(LAUGHTER)
ICAHN: I'm not going to Washington.
HARLOW: We know he wants you for the job.
ICAHN: That you can count on, that's 100 percent. But I will tell you that we do need somebody like Donald Trump from the outside here,
because look at the problems that you're having now in Washington. You have these two sides dug in. They don't know how to compromise.
And you know what? They think I'm a good negotiator. You know, it's very simple to be a good negotiator. No one can make a deal, know when to
compromise and stop this intransigence. And the irony of it all is, that they say, economists say, oh, our principles are more important.
But you know what? I really mean it. I mean this with all respect, the principles, it's ironic that the principles they say that they want to
back, it's the opposite happening. The Federal Reserve has so damn much power, the government has just put $4 trillion in through the Federal
Reserve, and the Federal Reserve doesn't even want the power.
And to their credit, they're saying, hey, bring us some fiscal stimulus. I mean, the whole thing is really an absurdity. It's something
out of "Alice in Wonderland."
HARLOW: Carl, I --
ICAHN: And I think we can stop it, hopefully.
HARLOW: Carl Icahn, I have to leave it there. Sir, thank you so much for calling into the program. Always a very interesting conversation.
Thank you.
Well, economic -- ignoring economic realities is not just dangerous for business. The European Commission says it is also illegal. It is
ordering Starbucks and Fiat to pay tens of millions of euros in back taxes. Those companies pushing back hard, appealing that decision. More on that
when QUEST MEANS BUSINESS returns.
[16:14:27] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW: Two major multinationals are vowing to appeal after being ordered to repay millions in euros in taxes. The European Commission says
Fiat and Starbucks benefited from illegal "sweetheart" deals from the governments of Luxembourg and the Netherlands respectively. Speaking to
CNN, Fiat's CEO today calling those charges "outlandish."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SERGIO MARCHIONNE, CEO, FIAT CHRYSLER AUTOMOBILES: I read the press release, I saw the little drawing that they had. I think it's an
outlandish claim, with all due respect that I have for the European Commission. I would actually be embarrassed if somebody issued a document
like that to re-characterize the operations of this business that we have in Luxembourg.
Luxembourg is the issuer of bonds that are used to finance FCA. To characterize it as a bank is the most nonsensical assertion I've ever seen
in my life.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: Sergio Marchionne there. The Commission says Luxembourg and the Netherlands allowed the companies to use artificial and complex methods
to avoid paying some taxes.
Here's how the Commission said that it worked in the case of Starbucks. For Starbucks, manufacturing that is based in the Netherlands,
it buys green coffee beans from another part of the Starbucks group based in Switzerland. And according to the Commission, it pays an inflated
amount for those beans.
Starbucks manufacturing also, it says, paid inflated royalties to another arm of the company based in the UK, and the Commission says no
other parts of Starbucks pays similar royalties. Well, the result, the Commission says, is that by shifting profits outside of the Netherlands,
Starbucks has lowered its tax bill by tens of millions of euros.
Starbucks is appealing the decision and responded to this allegation saying in a statement, quote, "We comply with all relevant rules, laws, and
OECD guidelines, pay a global tax rate of 34 percent, and continue to cooperate with the Commission's state and investigation in the
Netherlands."
I spoke with the competition commissioner, Margrethe Vestager. She insists that her case is strong.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MARGRETHE VESTAGER, COMPETITION COMMISSIONER, EUROPEAN COMMISSION: I realize, of course, that there are limits as to what state aid tools can
do. But I think there is obviously selectivity here, because these tax rulings are available for companies that can do intragroup trading.
It's not available for a stand-alone company because the prices are not related anymore to market prices. And therefore, we have selectivity,
and that amounts also to state aid when there's given that kind of benefits.
HARLOW: I wonder how much of a warning this is to others, and if you think this is, indeed, the tip of the iceberg.
VESTAGER: Well, I think this is reassuring for the thousands and thousands and thousands of businesses who just pay their taxes. Who pay
their fair share. And who feel that it's no need for new taxes or higher taxes, but just for every company to contribute fairly and squarely.
And I think that's the message today. I hope that we can work with the European Parliament, with member states, with OECD international
partner, with the business community, to get fair tax competition in Europe. To get a much more transparent system.
[16:20:02] And for tax authorities to work together, not to have more taxes or new, fancy taxes. But just for every company to pay their fair
share. And by that also to compete on equal terms.
HARLOW: So, the European Commission is really taking the lead here in terms of leading the fight against tax avoidance, that's clear. But when
you look at these tax breaks, these alleged tax breaks for Fiat in Luxembourg, they come at the same time as Jean-Claude Juncker was the prime
minister of Luxembourg.
So, even though he denies being at all involved in them, my question to you is, can the rest of the world take the European Commission seriously
given that?
VESTAGER: Well, I can do my part. And I do that independently from the president of the Commission. It is fact based. It is an --
interpretation of the evidence that we find. And eventually, it may have to stand up in court. So, yes, we can do the job.
HARLOW: Commissioner, is there one structural change that you believe would help across the board to level the playing field more, to make sure,
quote-unquote "state aid" is similar or the same from country to country within the continent? What structurally needs to change?
VESTAGER: Well, I think the most important thing would be to have a common corporate tax base in Europe. Because it would make it easier for
just the company who is active in maybe two member states, they would know exactly what to deal with, they could save money on tax advisors.
And for those who do tax evasion or tax avoidance, well, it would close loopholes and it would make it much more difficult to play on the
differences between the taxing systems of the member states. So, if we could have a common corporate tax base, I think that would be a great
thing.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARLOW: Up next, teargas and scuffles along with protests. How rising anger over increased tuition fees disrupted the finance minister's
budget speech in Cape Town. He will join me next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW: South African students protesting annual tuition hikes have been clashing with police near parliament in Cape Town. Scores of students
broke through the exterior gates of South Africa's parliament compound. They stormed the grounds.
[16:25:03] And scuffles broke out even inside the chamber when members of a South African socialist political party refused to stop
protesting, and they were expelled. Students also marched in Pretoria, Johannesburg, and other cities across the country. David McKenzie has more
on what is behind these clashes that have escalated in Cape Town.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: In scenes eerily reminiscent of Apartheid, hundreds of students stormed South Africa's
parliament on Wednesday, trapping the politicians inside. The police were brought in, and dramatic scenes unfolded as they shot teargas and stun
grenades --
(AUDIO GAP)
MCKENZIE: -- the students are. More than a dozen universities in South Africa are now shut down by these protests. On the face of it, they
are about fee increases that are proposed for next year. Many students say it would make tertiary education here unaffordable.
But many observers say that it's broader than that, there is dissatisfaction among South Africa's youth about the continuing income
inequality here more than 20 years after democracy.
The ruling ANC has called for calm. They say they will meet with the students. But as student leaders call for a nationwide shutdown, the
leaders of South Africa will certainly have to take notice.
David McKenzie, CNN, Johannesburg, South Africa.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARLOW: And earlier today, I spoke with South Africa's finance minister, Nhlanhla Nene, and he told me that his government is working to
try to fix that gap.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NHLANHLA NENE, SOUTH AFRICAN FINANCE MINISTER (via telephone): The message is clear that government has lived with the matter, and it has been
living with the matter for some time now of trying to address the funding for the post-school education and training.
There is a process, and if you look at the resources that have gone into this space, you would realize that over the past five years, this
allocation on the national student financial aid scheme alone has seen an increase of more than three times the allocation of more than five years
ago.
But that is not to say that there isn't a funding gap. It is for that reason, then, that there is a process in government to begin to look at the
long-term sustainable funding model for post-school education.
HARLOW: What do you say to those students protesting who argue that this will just widen inequality in your country, increasing tuition by this
much?
(CROSSTALK)
NENE: I think those students -- we all need to calm down. And the discussions on negotiations between the minister of higher education and
the institution have resulted in them realizing that it's either they tone down on the quantum of the increase or they postpone the increase until
such time that a long-lasting solution has been found.
So, it is two -- it is a two-pronged approach that says we first need to stabilize the situation at the moment, but going forward, we need to
find a longer-lasting and comprehensive solution to the challenge.
HARLOW: Not just protests outside of parliament for the past few days focused on this. Also scuffles in -- breaking out inside of parliament
with opposition members saying that the budget should be delayed. Are you confident -- are you confident, Minister Nene, that the whole country is
behind your government's economic plan?
NENE: Indeed, the whole country -- this country is made up of ordinary citizens. It's made up of the parents to these students that are
protesting. It is also made up of taxpayers who would want their taxes to be deployed efficiently in areas where they are going to get the best of
economic and social returns, including providing for the skills that the country needs in order for the economy to grow.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARLOW: South Africa's finance minister there. Coming up next on the program, they are pricey and exclusive. But it's not just Ferrari's cars.
Shares in the luxury automaker are now available for those who want a piece of the company, but perhaps not a whole car.
[16:29:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW (voice-over): Hello, I'm Poppy Harlow. There's more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS in a moment, when Carnival's chief executive tells me about
their launch in their joint venture in China.
Also, Great Scott! We have made it to the exact date that Marty McFly found himself in "Back to the Future Part II."
First, though, here are the headlines.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW (voice-over): U.S. Vice President Joe Biden has ended months of speculation about a possible run to be the next President of the United
States. His announcement puts Hillary Clinton in a stronger position to try to win the Democratic nomination.
Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu is facing widespread criticism for saying a Palestinian inspired the Holocaust. In a speech on
Tuesday he told the audience that Hitler, quote, "didn't want to exterminate the Jews at the time" and was urged to do so by the Grand Mufti
of Jerusalem.
Syria's president visited Moscow to thank his Russian counterpart for his support against what Assad calls "terrorists." The Kremlin says Bashar
al-Assad and Vladimir Putin discussed military coordination. As far as we know, this is the first time that Assad has left his country since the
civil war broke out there in 2011.
One of the most powerful investors in the world is vowing to spend millions to try to bring home trillions of dollars in U.S. companies, money
that is now sitting overseas. Carl Icahn wants to see an overhaul of the U.S. corporate tax code and a temporary tax holiday to try to persuade
major companies like Apple to bring home those profits from abroad.
CARL ICAHN, BUSINESS MAGNATE AND ACTIVIST SHAREHOLDER: . in any other country in the world, if you're making widgets in another country and
producing them there, you don't have to pay a double tax on it.
HARLOW (voice-over): Starbucks and Fiat have vowed to appeal the European Commission's order for them to repay millions in unpaid taxes.
The commission says those companies benefited from illegal quote-unquote, "sweetheart deals" from the governments of Luxembourg and the Netherlands.
Starbucks says it has complied with all laws.
Fiat's CEO told CNN those charges are outlandish.
SERGIO MARCHIONNE, CEO, FIAT: I read the press release. I saw the little drawing that they had. I think it's an outlandish claim.
With all due respect to the European Commission, I would actually be embarrassed if somebody issued a document like that, to recharacterize the
operations of this business that we have in Luxembourg.
Luxembourg is the issuer of bonds that are used to finance (INAUDIBLE). To characterize it as a bank is the most nonsensical
assertion I've ever seen in my life.
HARLOW (voice-over): Chinese president Xi Jinping met with British prime minister David Cameron at 10 Downing Street earlier. During their
talks, major business deals worth tens of billions of dollars --
[16:35:00]
HARLOW (voice-over): -- were signed. Mr. Cameron has come under intense scrutiny for increasingly having that close relationship and
increasing how close the two countries are.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(MUSIC PLAYING)
HARLOW: If you want to buy a Ferrari, it will cost you about $300,000. If you want to buy one share of Ferrari, it will set you back a
much more reasonable $55.
The luxury carmaker made its debut on the New York Stock Exchange Wednesday. The ticker RACE, of course, and lived up to that name, racing
nearly 6 percent higher on the day.
However, like a Ferrari car, Ferrari stock was only available to a few. Clare Sebastian has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CLARE SEBASTIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It wasn't enough for Ferrari to list on Wall Street. It had to park there as well. The luxury
carmaker and its parent company Fiat Chrysler know how to draw the crowds with their products. This was about proving they could do the same with
their shares.
MARCHIONNE: It certainly was beyond my original expectations. I think we may have crossed 20 times in terms of (INAUDIBLE). It's a
phenomenal story in the making. We have got a long history behind us but I think the future is going to be more exciting than the one that we've had.
SEBASTIAN (voice-over): Staying close to its motor racing heritage, Ferrari listed under the ticker symbol RACE and it certainly got off to a
roaring start, jumping around 13 percent in early trading; 9 percent of Ferrari was up for grabs, priced at the top of its original range.
MARCHIONNE: We were selective in whom we gave it to. I think there are some people who committed to be long-term holders of this asset,
because of its unexpressed potential today in terms of growth.
SEBASTIAN (voice-over): Buying a share in Ferrari is a bit like buying a Ferrari itself. It's expensive, it's exclusive and, for many,
it's all about the prestige.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just to say you own shares in Ferrari, that's basically what it is right now. But I do see growth in it. The spinoff is
a win for Ferrari and a win for Fiat, too. Fiat, remember, walks away with billions of dollars on this spinoff.
SEBASTIAN (voice-over): The idea is the first step in spinning off Ferrari from Fiat Chrysler. The remaining shares will go to Fiat Chrysler
shareholders when the split is completed. And it's not the only way Fiat Chrysler's CEO hopes to strengthen his business.
MARCHIONNE: I've been quite vocal on the desire to achieve capital efficiencies by merging with somebody. I identified as part of the
discussion General Motors as the most likely, the most beneficial partner for FCA. But it doesn't exclude the rest.
SEBASTIAN (voice-over): This, though, was a moment for Wall Street to celebrate, the opportunity to own a piece of an iconic brand -- Clare
Sebastian, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARLOW: Shares of Ferrari's parent company, Fiat, closed today down more than 5 percent. That came after the European Commission accused the
automaker of dodging taxes in Luxembourg. The broader European indices finished mostly higher. Traders are trading cautiously ahead of the ECB's
meeting on Thursday.
Credit Suisse shares fell more than 3.5 percent. The bank reported a sharp decline in third quarter profit.
The CEO of Carnival Cruise Lines joins me live after his meeting with the Chinese president, Xi Jinping, in London. Stay with us.
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[16:40:00]
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HARLOW: China will be the country that spends the most on business travel by the end of next year. That is according to the Global Business
Travel Association and that could mean a huge opportunity for the companies who actually make those business trips happen.
Richard takes a closer look at the company that takes him around the world.
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RICHARD QUEST, CNN HOST (voice-over): Three letters come to mind when I have to book travel: BCD, the corporate travel service used by CNN to
send me and my colleagues across the globe.
BCD books everything, flights to hotels to rental cars. Travel management companies are known as TMCs and they send millions of people
around the world. And yet, because they're contracted by the company, they don't have an individual relationship with the person doing the travel.
JOHN SNYDER, CEO, BCD TRAVEL: Predominantly our relationship has been with the corporate customer. I think that is changing over the years. And
we're trying to develop more of a one-to-one relationship with the traveler, because, in today's environment, it's all about traveler
engagement.
QUEST (voice-over): I invited the chief execute of BCD Travel to the headquarters of CNN to see what more he could offer me. After all, I'm the
business traveler, not CNN.
SNYDER: I think the challenge of that, again, is getting the travelers engaged in the program and making sure that they're utilizing the
corporate's rates and not going rogue and booking travel on their own. I mean, at the end of the day, we have a responsibility to help the
corporation manage their travel investment.
QUEST: You've just used a fascinating phrase, "going rogue."
SNYDER: Well, going rogue means that that traveler is not on the grid. We're not able to track them for safety and security reasons, we're
not able to provide services during the journey, which is important to corporations.
QUEST: In the old days, you picked up a phone and you called Travel; they told you the ticket, you bought it and you put it down and off you
went. Now, though, I am used to seeing online prices. I go to KAYAK, Expedia, wherever. I can see that I can get that flight cheaper than your
people are offering it to me.
SNYDER: Well, there's a lot of factors that come into play there.
Number one is, are you comparing apples to apples?
A lot of times when we do the research on the situations, they're not comparing apples to apples. They're looking at things that -- they've
asked us for one thing and then they go and search for another online.
QUEST: The problem of course is you end up being the bad guy.
SNYDER: Yes, without a doubt. Sometimes we're the bad guy because we're the one's enforcing that policy for the corporation. But we try to
manage that through communication with the travelers and help them understand why the corporation has those policies in place.
QUEST: So what are you doing for the individual traveler, me?
Never mind my company.
SNYDER: We absolutely care about what the individual travelers think. We do regular traveler surveys to gauge the opinion of the traveler.
Part of the blame we get is it's a lot harder to book corporate travel than it is to book my leisure travel. So what we're doing today is we're
bringing those leisure tools into the corporate environment and making it easier for our corporate travelers when they're booking and when they're on
the road.
QUEST (voice-over): This engagement would include new mobile technology for booking and communication platforms that model the like of
DIY sites we know so well. As long as they've got the corporate customer, they're not too worried about the rogue booker like me -- at least not just
yet.
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HARLOW: Carnival Cruise Lines has announced plans to launch a domestic Chinese cruise brand to meet the rising demand in the country.
Chinese President Xi Jinping was at the signing ceremony for that joint venture with Chinese partners on Wednesday.
Carnival CEO and president, Arnold Donald, joins me now from London.
Thank you for being with me, sir.
[16:45:00]
ARNOLD DONALD, CEO, CARNIVAL CORPORATION: Poppy, always a pleasure to be with you.
How are you?
HARLOW: I'm well. You have to bring me into your mindset here, because all we hear are headlines that China is slowing, China is slowing.
Will it be a hard landing?
And you're inking a big deal with China.
Why now?
DONALD: Well, first of all, we're just delighted to be here in the U.K., where we have two of our world-leading cruise lines, Cunard and P&O
Cruises that are based here. A furthering signing with our partners, CSSC and CIC from China.
Why are we doing it? Because there are ready today, Poppy, over 100 million outbound Chinese tourists today. And that number's only going to
grow. And today in cruising, fewer than 1 million of those Chinese outbound tourists are cruising today. So China will be, at some point in
time, the largest cruise market in the world.
We grew 43 percent there this year over last year. We have plans to grow 58 percent next year over this year. We're introducing two new brands
independent of this joint venture, either our German brand in Carnival, our namesake brand in the U.S. in 2017.
We have a purpose built ship, the first one; the Princess Cruise Lines will introduce in 2017 the Majestic Princess. So we see lots of growth
opportunity.
And although the economy may be slowing, it's still, as you know, Poppy, one of the fastest growing economies in the world.
HARLOW: It certainly is. I think we would all give a lot for 7 percent growth.
When you look, though, at corporate lessons learned, fascinating when Kraft brought the Oreo into China. They had a hard time at first, because
it was too sweet for the Chinese market. They had to adjust it. Now it's the best-selling cookie in the world; brings in hundreds of millions of
dollars in China alone.
What lessons have you been learning about the Chinese consumer and how to market to them differently than to us in America?
DONALD: Well, there is a learning process, no question about it. Some things are self-evident, once you pay attention to them, and others
are real discovery. For example, we know the Chinese gets their utilization of space and how they use public space is different than a
number of other cultures.
We have to have places on the ship for personal tai chi and communal tai chi.
The gaming is very different for the Chinese. In America and Australia, other places, slots are very popular. Here, it's just table
games and they like a little bit more privacy. So those are just some of the soft executions on the ships. Of course, there's always comfort food
but we know that for all the markets we go in the world, where people have different comfort foods.
Beyond that, though, is connecting the latent demand for cruising that exists and those outbound tourists. So the ships that are in China and
that's where we're working with the travel agent community here to effect that.
HARLOW: Is China, in your mind right now, Arnold, the only real place for broad tourism growth and that untapped -- so much untapped potential,
if you will, in new travelers, because you've already factored in the U.S., factored in the European market.
Is China where it's at?
DONALD: Well, look, China is a huge growth market. But the reality is, if you add up all the cabins in the world across all the cruise lines,
it represents less than 2 percent of the hotel rooms in the world. So the reality is we have growth versus land-based vacations because we are a
tremendous vacation value and we're an awesome vacation experience.
So we have growth potential everywhere in the world and we're experiencing growth everywhere in the world.
HARLOW: Arnold, thank you very much. I appreciate it. Good to have you on.
DONALD: Thank you. Thank you, Poppy.
HARLOW: A day to remember: "Back to the Future day is here. It is right now. A top futurist looks at what the movie got right and the
amazing, amazing things to come. First, though, a highlight from "Make, Create, Innovate."
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HARLOW: Social media and movie fans are celebrating Back to the Future Day, October 21st, 2015, today. That is the day that Marty McFly
and Doc Brown time-traveled to in the famous DeLorian, do you remember that, in the 1989 sequel, "Back to the Future II."
The film features some products and ideas that look far-fetched when they hit the movie theater 26 years ago.
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MICHAEL J. FOX, ACTOR, "MARTY MCFLY": Look, I need to borrow your hover board.
(END VIDEO CLIP) So just how well did the hit 1980s flick predict the technology of today?
You know what this is, right? This is the Gold Wing DeLorian.
I asked the host of "Sci Fi Science" on the Science Channel, Dr. Michio Kaku, and he not only talked about Back to the Future Day, he had
plenty to tell us about what is ahead. Wait until you hear what --
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MICHIO KAKU, PHYSICIST AND HOST OF "SCI FI SCIENCE": I'm a science fiction junkie. And "Back to the Future" is one of the top 10 best, I
think, science fiction movies of all time.
However, I'm also a physicist. And sometimes I cringe a little bit when I see reruns of the film, hits and misses. The biggest one, of
course, is time travel and hover boards. Every teenager wants a hover board but, hey, we don't have room temperature superconductors yet.
Supermagnets do not yet exist, unfortunately.
HARLOW: Let's talk about, Doctor, as you are a futurist, what is going to knock our socks off 10, 20 years from today?
KAKU: Well, one thing we're going to have in that period of time is the Internet in our contact lens. We'll simply blink and we'll have access
to the Library of Congress, all that knowledge right there in your contact lens.
And when someone speaks Chinese to you, your contact lens will translate Chinese into English, put subtitles underneath what they're
saying and you'll also see a biography, a biography of who you are talking to.
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HARLOW: Come on.
Is this reality?
KAKU: -- you'll always know who you're talking to.
Yes.
HARLOW: Is this really going to happen?
KAKU: We are working on prototypes today. We are working on prototypes today of that. The military already can put this kind of
information on an eyepiece that you put on your helmet. You simply flick it down and immediately you see a screen.
So the military wants to create an Internet of the battlefield for our soldiers. But eventually that eyepiece will be replaced by a contact lens.
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HARLOW: I cannot wait until my contacts do that.
On a more serious, very important note, today CNN is launching an exciting new initiative and we need your help. CNN's Freedom Project
shines the light on the dark reality of modern-day delivery. It is a problem that persists around the world. And now CNN is aiming to make
slavery history.
We cannot do it alone. Take a look at what you can do to help.
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BECKY ANDERSON, CNN HOST (voice-over): Slavery. You might think it's a thing of the past. It's not. It's all around us.
QUEST (voice-over): There are between 20 million and 36 million slaves in the --
[16:55:00]
QUEST (voice-over): -- world today; 5.5 million children globally are in forced labor. And half of all human trafficking victims are sexually
exploited.
ANDERSON (voice-over): Since 2011, the CNN Freedom Project has been highlighting modern day slavery, giving a choice to victims. Now we need
your help.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST (voice-over): Join CNN's Fly to Freedom campaign and help raise awareness on modern-day slavery.
KRISTIE LU STOUT, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Here is what we want you to do. Make a plane.
Make a pledge.
Show us your plane and pledge using the #FlyToFreedom and nominate two friends to do the same by tagging them.
COOPER (voice-over): You might think you can't make a difference but when we all unite as one, we can make a change, together. It takes just a
few minutes to participate. So please join us.
QUEST (voice-over): Share your videos and photos using the #FlyToFreedom. And be part of ending modern day slavery. Let's show the
world that it's time for slavery to stop.
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HARLOW (voice-over): U.S. markets closed lower on Wednesday. The Dow could not hold on to its early gains, closing down 48 points on the day.
HARLOW: Coca-Cola reported a 5 percent drop in revenue. Diet Coke is losing ground in the soda wars to its sister brand, Coke Zero. The number
of cases of Diet Coke sent to retailers in the quarter dropped 8 percent.
That will do it for QUEST MEANS BUSINESS today. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York. The news continues right here on CNN.
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