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Quest Means Business

U.S. Stocks Rally On Hopes For Coronavirus Treatment; U.S. Lawmakers At Impasse As Small Business Loans Run Out; China's Economy Shrinks After Decades Of Growth. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired April 17, 2020 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:42]

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS ANCHOR: An hour to go on Wall Street. Final hour of trading. Sixty minutes, and it looks like we are going to end the

week on a higher note, and not just for the day, but for the week.

Take a look at where the Dow is standing at the moment. Throughout the course of the day, it gave a bit back towards lunchtime, but otherwise

moving one and three quarter percent.

Those are markets and let's look and see some of the reasons why.

Gilead, the pharmaceutical company, their shares are up sharply on news that they might have found a vaccine for coronavirus that could help.

U.S. lawmakers are stuck trying to agree to new money for small businesses. Meanwhile, in the Small Business Administration, the money has run out.

And Emmanuel Macron of France says the future of Europe is at stake unless the E.U. manages to get its act together.

We are live in New York. It is Friday. It's April the 17th. I'm Richard Quest. Good to be with you. And of course, in the living room today, I

still mean business.

Now, it is the hope for a vaccine, or at least treatment for coronavirus that is absolutely lifting the markets today. All the major indices are

higher and the prospect that a treatment will be found that will allow the economy to open in all its glory is what's encouraged to investors because

investors hope the new treatment will reduce the need for longer stay-at- home orders.

Gilead is up the best, up sharply. The video report showing doctors leading clinical trials. It's remdesivir. Remdesivir and it's in Chicago and the

doctors are saying many patients are recovering quickly; as a result, Gilead is up some 6.5 percent.

The health experts are warning caution. Of course, whenever we get these sort of tests, the first thing we always say, caution, it's a partial test

and it doesn't necessarily have all the controls in before a final adjudication.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. LEILA HOJAT, PRINCIPAL INVESTIGATOR ON REMDESIVIR TREATMENT: So we've had a lot of our patients improving and going home and I think that we're

all really pleased to see that. It's hard to know at this point if that's related to the study drug or not, but we're expecting results, as you said,

a little bit later this month, at least on the first several hundred patients that were studied.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: So it's called remdesivir and it's made by Gilead, which has particular specialty in antiviral medications. They're very big in the HIV

medication field and there are trials of this going on all over the place - - dozens of them.

Gilead expects results by the end of April, of course, cautions against drawing conclusions. There's no control group in this particular test so

far, which means we don't know if it's the drug that's causing the improvements.

The trial excluded patients with underlying conditions or on ventilators. What we do know is this drug is not effective against Ebola and the studies

in animals showed success against SARS and MERS. They have similarities of course to COVID.

Dr. Celine Gounder is me. The Infectious Disease specialist and the host of "The Epidemic Podcast." Doctor, very good to have you. Now, let me put all

those caveats and cautions on the table. Now tell me, should we be excited by what this is doing?

DR. CELINE GOUNDER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: Well, Richard, here is one way I would think about it, as a counter-example, let's say you had, I don't

know, a hundred people who had the flu and I said I'm going to have half of those people take or eat carrots for five days and half of those people eat

carrots for ten days. And

And everybody had the flu and some of them got better and we were pretty happy about that. I mean, that's basic the level of evidence that you're

getting from this Chicago study. It is literally some of the patients got five days of remdesivir, some got 10 days. These were not the sickest

patients, the ones on ventilators. And these were not patients with underlying medical conditions.

[15:05:19]

GOUNDER: So one, we did not have a control group to really prove that this was the drug having an effect, and secondly, the very group we most need

treatments for, the sickest people who are least likely to survive were excluded from the study.

So I'm really waiting to see the placebo controlled, randomized controlled trials.

QUEST: But you can understand, Doctor, can't you, why there is this grasping for hope that this is it. Look, I can't remember too many cases,

maybe HIV in the early days before it became clear at how difficult it was to find treatment, or even Ebola, but it's natural that we will grasp onto

it, particularly the market will grasp onto what they perceive is a likely winner.

GOUNDER: Oh, I agree completely with that, Richard. I spent -- and still do see HIV infected patients, you know, so I'm very familiar with all of

the antiretroviral that Gilead has helped to develop and use those in my own prescribing every day.

I was an Ebola aide worker. I saw first-hand how desperate the situation was. Yes, I am desperate to have something to give my patients. You know,

but I approach this as a scientist and we've seen situations like this before where we were hopeful remdesivir and other drugs would be working

for Ebola and they didn't.

QUEST: So I ask you what I've asked many, because we need hope rather -- even in the absence of expectation. Is this a case where a vaccine is going

to be found, it is just a question of when and by whom, and but by this time next year, there could be several?

GOUNDER: Well, I do think, whether it's remdesivir or other drugs, as well as vaccines, I do think we have a lot of reason to hope, there are many

different candidate drugs, as well as vaccines in the clinical trials right now.

I think the key is to figure out which ones work and which ones don't and to scale up those that do. I think that there is a hundred percent reason

to hope. This is not a virus like HIV, which is a far more complicated one to really conquer.

QUEST: Doctor, when there is more to report, we hope you'll come back and help us analyze and sift the myths from the realities and keep our feet

firmly on the ground when it comes to these vaccines. Thank you, Doctor. Have a good weekend. Thank you.

The money was supposed to last months. It lasted barely two weeks. This is the cash that was put forward by the Small Business Administration in the

United States that was to go as grants and possibly loans to small businesses. First come, first serve. There was over $350 billion. Now, it's

all gone and the bickering is under way about putting some more in.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LARRY KUDLOW, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: I don't know why the Congress isn't getting going and just replenishing this $250 billion.

SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D-NY): We're having discussions, Speaker Pelosi's staff, my staff, with Secretary of Treasury Mnuchin. We've had constructive

talks. They're going to continue through the weekend, and I don't see any reason why we can't come to an agreement soon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: Loretta Mester is with me. She is the President of the Federal Reserve Bank of Cleveland. Good to have you with me, Madam President, so

let's just get this out of the way. Do you believe that there should be more money put into the SBA, the PPP plan, the Payroll Protection Plan

eventually?

LORETTA MESTER, PRESIDENT, FEDERAL RESERVE BANK OF CLEVELAND: There's a lot of pain out there. There's a lot of firms that need extra funding to

get them through this period of shutdown. So obviously that's a Federal government program, not a Federal Reserve program. But it certainly is true

that we need more relief to the businesses.

I see that in the Fourth District and all of the people across the country report in that they're seeing that as well. So I think there is going to be

-- this is a very, very deep shock, economic shock.

Basically for the purposes of the public health of the country, we've shut down the economy because the scientists tell us and the doctors say that's

the best approach to control the virus, and that means that there's a lot of pain out there for both households and small businesses, and medium and

large businesses as well.

So yes, more needs to be done.

QUEST: Now, you're on record already as saying that the Fed will probably have to do more. When I look at the range of Fed programs that are now in

place of different stripes and colors, right the way down to the latest of corporate bonds, do you -- I mean, what more do you believe the Fed can and

should do, bearing in mind essentially the range of stuff you're already buying?

[15:10:33]

MESTER: Well, so some of our programs are announced, but they're not up and running yet. So we're continuing to work on bringing out the mainstream

lending programs, both the new loan and the extended loan program.

But one of the things that I am doing and my colleagues are doing at the Cleveland Fed, of course, is looking for areas where there may be gaps.

We're trying to make sure that the economy and households and businesses and the market functioning gets us through this pandemic shutdown period,

so that when we get to the end of that, we can have a decent chance of a recovery.

And so what we're doing is we are looking at areas that may need more help. We all have heard of that mortgage servicing, and maybe that's an area

where there's some market dysfunction.

So we continue to look for gaps, and the real thing is that we want to make sure that we can get through this period, mitigating the impact on the

economy so that when we do, whenever the scientist say it's time to reopen, the recovery can be supported as best it can be.

QUEST: This idea of strains, the Fed has done a splendid job of anticipating and acting ahead of strains. We've had nothing like the sort

of strains in the system of 2008 because of that. But they do still exist, don't they, in credit markets, and particularly in the mortgage market? Do

you expect to have to give more support there?

MESTER: Well, it's certainly something I'm watching. We have people on our Boards of Directors at the Cleveland Fed who are participants in those

markets, and of course bond markets, those corporate bonds are one of the things that we are -- or commercial real estate bonds, we're looking at

those to see how that market is functioning. They're hard to renegotiate.

So there are certainly pockets of areas that we have our eye on. It's hard to know now whether we'll go in and try to do something to shore those up.

But it's something that we have an eye on, especially in Cleveland.

QUEST: If we take from the fact that the starting point from which we began this crisis -- I mean, the U.S. economy was, by far, the best -- in

the best position in that respect, how much lasting damage do you believe we will see? And I know this depends on the direction of the health crisis

and the reopening and how all that goes.

But if you look out into early next year, what is your gut telling you about lasting damage to the economy?

MESTER: Well, I think that's kind of what we're trying to do with these programs, and I know the Federal government program also has that goal,

right, it is to try to make sure that we can get through this period without having as much damage as we would if we didn't offer these kinds of

supports, both to households and businesses of all sizes, and also to make sure that the markets can continue to function.

Because of course, functioning markets are very important in order to get the help to the areas of the economy. So that whole goal is to try to make

sure that we don't have damage to the fundamentals underlying the economy so that it is in a position to take off and recover after this period.

But it's going to take some time, I think, for that to happen. You're going to see some numbers that come out over the next couple of months that are

very, very negative. And when the economy does start opening up, and I think it will be staged -- I don't think the whole U.S. will open up at the

same time. Because as you say, it depends on how the virus plays out and we know that there are regional differences there.

We'll see a gradual reopening, I don't think it would be a turn-the-light switch reopening, and then we'll see some of the numbers improve, but that

-- you know, if we are back to where we were, it is going to take some time for people to feel comfortable going back out into stores and going back

out to restaurants. There will be social distancing and other efforts to make sure that we don't have a recurrence of the bad state we were in

earlier this year.

So I think it will take some time.

QUEST: Thank you. Thank you for joining us. I appreciate it. Have a good weekend. Try and get some -- get a bit of a break, a bit of fresh air if

you can. Thank you very much for joining us.

MESTER: All right, thanks, Richard. Be well.

[15:20:18]

QUEST: I appreciate that. Thank you. Now, China is reporting its worst economic quarter on record. And yet, the I.M.F. still says that China will

have positive growth for the year. We need to understand that a bit more. It is a Friday. It's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, a very good evening to you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: Welcome back. China has reported a contraction in the economy for the first time in some 40 years. If you look at the quarter, it was down

6.8 percent in Q1. However, that was the time of course, before the lockdown. However, the I.M.F. is still predicting a 1.2 percent growth rate

for the year. David culver is in Shanghai.

David, before we look at the underlying numbers here, how much of the Chinese economy is effectively still locked down? How much of it or how

much of it is performing pretty much as normal?

DAVID CULVER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Richard, it's difficult to give a percentage number to this, but let me just give it to you anecdotally.

Because we know you walk down a street here for example, in Shanghai and shops are back open and life seems to be coming back online and some

normality is restored.

However, when you go to Wuhan, for example, it is still, even though it's no longer on lockdown, people are still restricted in many cases inside

their homes and their complexes, so they're not getting out. Shops aren't opening in all numbers. Folks are still, in many cases, unable to kind of

restore their normal operations.

And even if you have, for example, a factory that's back open, the numbers came out suggesting that they were close to a hundred percent, back up and

running, but in many cases they weren't producing 100 percent productivity because they didn't have the workforce in place -- Richard.

QUEST: Yet is there a definite feeling -- whatever the numbers are saying -- that the worst is over and that China is well ahead? Because one of the

things we keep looking at with China and Italy, but particularly with China, are those cases where they've had to re-impose a lockdown because of

a second or third wave.

[15:20:05]

CULVER: Right. And I think in places like Shanghai, there is a sentiment amongst people that things have passed, the worst has passed and they feel

that they can breathe somewhat easy and start to return to their lives.

In other places, though, there's a hesitation. For example, Beijing, I'll tell you that's become a fortress in many ways and the travel in and out is

heavily restricted, and if for example, if I were to go there, yes, I would be in quarantine for 14 days even coming from Shanghai. So domestically

there's a lot of restrictions still in place.

Overall, though, I would say that the state media is portraying that things are coming back online and springing back to life. Is that necessarily the

case everywhere? Not as we're seeing it play out.

QUEST: And as the debate goes over the number of people who died, I saw overnight the way in which China has revised upwards the Wuhan number by

some 50 percent. But does anybody have a view of what they think the really number is?

CULVER: Well, we can tell you that we were questioning the numbers going back to January, and you know this from our early reporting. I mean, CNN

has talked to many of the folks who were on the ground there and the people who were losing loved ones, Richard, who were telling us, well, the doctors

couldn't test them, we couldn't even get tested. Everybody is showing the symptoms, and yet they're not being counted towards the total death toll

here.

And some doctors were even pulling aside patient's family members and saying, look, it is that pneumonia, we just can't confirm it. So

anecdotally, again, we were getting the support to say, it is not adding up. To get a real number is going to be very difficult because you would

then expect the government to release a spreadsheet of sorts that would give every name to number and we don't anticipate that to come foreward.

So to get the actual number is highly unlikely -- Richard.

QUEST: David, thank you. David Culver who is in Shanghai. Have a good weekend if that you are able.

CULVER: You, too.

QUEST: Of course, the economic pain is continuing to be felt far and wide in so many different ways. Take for example in Bangladesh, which one of the

world's largest garment manufacturers. The problem now of course is that shops are closed, retail is just about ground to a halt. Nobody is buying

any clothes.

CNN's Ivan Watson reports on how this is now hitting the hardest and the poorest.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Shopping malls and main streets deserted around the world as workers and shoppers

stay home during coronavirus lockdowns and global demand for clothing collapses.

The impact is devastating for fashion brands and their staff. But nowhere is this pain being felt as sharply as in Bangladesh, which relies on

clothing as its main export and economic backbone.

Garment orders worth more than $3 billion are being cancelled or suspended, threatening millions of jobs in this impoverished South Asian nation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

AMBIKA BEGUM, GARMENT WORKER (through translator): We are facing a lot of problems, as we need to pay rent and buy food. How can we support our

families?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): I am poor and I have a baby and a husband who are both dependent on me. I don't know how I will survive.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATSON (voice-over): Anger is rising among factory workers who are mostly women supporting entire families. They protest in the capital, demanding

unpaid wages.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARUNA KASHYAP, SENIOR RESEARCHER, HUMAN RIGHTS WATCH: These workers have really worked. They worked in the supply chains and in the operations of

these brands for months and years, and at this moment of crisis, it's really important for brands and retailers to live up to their human rights

responsibilities.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATSON (voice-over): Bangladesh is the world's second biggest garment manufacturer after China, providing cheap skilled labor to meet the world's

demand for fast fashion for international brands such as Gap, Primark and Nike.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUBANA HUQ, PRESIDENT, BANGLADESH GARMENT MANUFACTURERS AND EXPORTERS ASSOCIATION: And it is a plea of humanity. And I don't want any grant, I

don't want any kind of charity. I just want the bear minimum justice for our workers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATSON (voice-over): Several brands have now committed to paying for the products they've already ordered, but activists say some companies,

including Gap, have so far failed to do that.

In a statement to CNN about this issue, Gap said, "We are acting quickly and prudently to responsibly reduce expenses. We're making decisions based

on the best interest of our employees, customers and partners, as well as the long-term health of our business. We're committed to working closely

with our long-standing suppliers to best assess how we can work together through this crisis."

The Bangladesh government is also calling for international brands to support their suppliers. Prime Minister Sheikh Hasina has announced a

stimulus package of around $8 billion, including soft loans to help factories pay their staff.

[15:25:10]

WATSON (voice-over): Some factories are also now producing personal protective equipment, including medical gowns for domestic use and export.

But many are worried that these steps won't be enough to save the industry for the millions of workers who depend on it to feed their families.

Ivan Watson, CNN.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Now, economies are suffering and trade likely to consider to suffer. If you look at the latest numbers from the European Union, they

made disturbing reading.

Exports will likely drop 9.2 percent. At the same time, you're going to have imports falling 8.8 percent. $500 billion for the year and that may be

optimistic.

Frank Appel is the Chief Executive of Germany's mail and parcel carrier Deutsche Post. He joins me now. Frank, it is always good to talk to you.

Thank you, sir, for making time. What are you seeing? I understand, obviously, things are extremely difficult at the moment, but are you seeing

ways forward in which things can get moving again?

FRANK APPEL, CHIEF EXECUTIVE, DEUTSCHE POST (via telephone): Richard, hello. So definitely, we have seen a clear pattern which started in Asia

where we had significant drop in volumes and now, the volumes came back pretty rapidly after the shutdown was lifted.

We also see first time in Europe in the moment when some countries, as has happened this week, lift their shutdown to a certain extent. So we believe

that this is the same model. It might take a little bit longer in Europe and the U.S., but overall, I think we will follow the same pattern.

The challenge will remain that passenger airplanes will not travel for quite some time. That's the reason why the express carriers and the

shipping lines can carry more growth.

QUEST: I had to ship something to Morocco a couple of weeks ago. Actually, I am not being gratuitous when I say, I used your services and, first of

all, I was amazed that anybody is still moving fast freight and cargo around, but also the measures that you were taking, temperature being taken

before I was even let into the depot. The full social distancing.

So you're still a backbone of the economy, aren't you? And it can't be easy doing it, trying to get things to so many different places.

APPEL: No, it is a challenge. But we have a very clear purpose. We're connecting people and improving lives and I'm very proud to see how agile

and how committed our global workforce is.

And so having 550,000 people around the world, it is amazing to see how committed the people are. They follow the instructions. We protect them

first. That's the most important thing we have to do. Second, is we have to serve our customers and look for capacity, and so far our services hold up

quite well around the world.

QUEST: Frank, what is the biggest concern that you have if you look for -- not just three, four, five weeks or a month or two, but if you look forward

to when economies have started to reopen again and we're in Q4, possibly Q1 of next year, what's your biggest worry about how this goes?

APPEL: You know, I'm not too much worried. I believe the pattern we have seen in Asia should encourage us. As we got into that, in Europe we are now

in that challenge for six weeks and it feels like years, and we sometimes forget how little time has passed by.

We have nine months to go into the end of the year and it's a long time and I think we will see a recovery there.

As I said, the biggest challenge for the global economy might be that we have not enough belly space capacity because passenger airlines will not

fly again and we have to find new ways how we progress goods and therefore we need longer lead times because the shipping vessels will continue to

move.

QUEST: But I always say that companies -- I always say that companies like yours are the barometers. So are your customers, your big corporates, are

they saying to you, Frank, be prepared for us to ramp up to 60 percent of what we were, 70 percent, 80 percent? Or are they saying there's no

visibility on just how big it will be?

APPEL: I think the latest, I think none of us has visibility hat we can predict certain things.

[15:30:10]

The way it will be measured, because consumers will start spending again, we have to establish and I think just industry has to play an important

role in that moment, and we will, collectively, we will go help the business. That's our objective. And I think that my biggest worry is that

we don't find a proper way to restart the economy. I'm feeling encouraged now that governments have taken the actions they have taken in Europe.

I see that now U.S. is starting to move in that direction as well, despite that the U.S. is slightly behind Europe. But I feel encouraged that, you

know, governments are starting to think how we can restart that and we will find a way you know? We have seen so much adaptation or even small

retailers who are now shopping online, despite that their stores are closed. I think the humans are capable enough to adapt to the challenge and

I think we will jointly go through that, and successfully --

QUEST: Good to talk to you, Frank. We will talk more. Well, keep yourself well and your family, please. And we will talk more as it progresses. Thank

you, sir. Now, after the break, France's president Emmanuel Macron says that the pandemic has created an existential issue for the European Union

questioning whether or not it has been able to assist and help an all-for- one, in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: Hello. Welcome back. It is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS live from New York. It is a Friday, end of the week. But we have plenty more still to bring

you. Amazon's senior vice president tells us that testing for the virus is the only way to get economies up and running again. Emmanuel Macron says

it's an existential crisis for the European Union, that it's a moment of truth. This is CNN. And on this network, the facts always come first.

[15:35:05]

The British government's reviewing its guidance on face masks, currently following the WHO recommendation that only medical workers need to wear

masks, policy to protect the U.K. supply. Officials said they are looking at the evidence and changes are possible.

President Trump's approval rating is slipping as the pandemic continues to batter the U.S. economy. A new CNN poll of polls showed 45 percent of

Americans, nationwide, approve of how he's handling his job, sound from 46 percent last week.

High winds are fanning a wildfire near Chernobyl, days after it was nearly extinguished by rain. Ukraine state media says while the air quality near

Kiev's hazardous, radiation levels are normal. People in Kiev have been told to shut their windows and stay indoors.

The French President Emmanuel Macron is warning that the European Union is facing a moment of truth. He's referring, of course, to the way in which

that countries will coordinate and help each other throughout this crisis. He says that the bloc could split for good if it fails to support those

member countries most in need.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

EMMANUEL MACRON, PRESIDENT OF FRANCE (via translator): So, we are at the moment of truth. It consists in knowing if the E.U. is a political project

or a market project. Solely, I think it's a political project. When it is political, what comes first, there are notions of solidarity at stake. The

economy depends on it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: Alexander De Croo is the Belgium finance minister and Deputy Prime Minister. He joins me now from Brakel, Belgium. Minister, look, I know

what's been agreed and the half a trillion of this and a half a trillion of that. And I understand all that's been done. But it's not been enough. And

there's a feeling that the union has not spoken as one. Otherwise, the French President wouldn't be warning about this. How concerned are you?

ALEXANDER DE CROO, FINANCE MINISTER OF BELGIUM: I agree. I think if Europe is not united, we will turn out to be much weaker. And I think that the

differences in opinion, are still quite visible, despite the fact that the -- my colleague, ministers and myself have agreed on quite a big package.

You mean, this is support for workers. This is support for businesses. This is support for sovereigns as well. I think more is going to be needed.

And if we want to make sure that all the progress that has been made over the last years, and you know, countries like Spain and Portugal, they have

done tremendous effort in cutting down government spending and making labor markets more flexible. If we don't intervene now, everything will be down

the drain. And this is the last thing that we can -- that we could accept in Europe today.

QUEST: But hasn't this forced the issue that was avoided during the sovereign debt crisis, which is the mutualization of debt, or put it more

bluntly, a federal States of Europe. All for one, and one for all. This has shown that is not the case. And they've left to certain countries will

never be the case.

DE CROO: Well, look, I think that the sovereign debt crisis was obviously, there was an element of moral hazards. Some countries have made a mistake,

had not done the rise reforms and there was hesitation to intervene because you would, kind of, help someone who made a mistake. Here, the situation is

completely different. Those countries who are most affected today, you cannot say that they have made economic mistakes often quite the contrary.

So, we should not be in this logic that too often is throughout Europe, where countries are still thinking about their own interests first, because

today, our own interest is not purely the national interest. Would you imagine there's a European Union, would continue with like econ -- big

economies like Italy or Spain being in very difficult circumstances. That would be a dramatically destabilize Europe. And I agree with Mr. Macron. We

are at the -- at the start an economic project. But today, if you want this economic project to succeed, you will also need to have a political

project.

QUEST: Right. But I guess where I come -- where my questioning is coming from is what the president of the commission said, Ursula von der Leyen.

[15:40:04]

You know, when you get the Commission President apologizing because of a failure to support a major country in its most dire need, it begs the

question, what's the point of that whole thing?

DE CROO: Well, let's not be too negative on this. I think that the response that we have agreed on last week, to answer the immediate needs, this is

what is necessary for the immediate needs. But the real question is, what is going to be the path forward? I mean, how are we going to relaunch this

European economy? How are we going to take leadership again, throughout Europe?

And then apologies are not what we need. What we need now is leadership. And being able to think of -- these are solutions which are maybe outside

of the ordinary solutions, but which rule people throughout Europe can say, OK, I understand this is the path you want to go forward. And let's all

unite one another.

QUEST: Right. Minister, a final question to, sir. What worries me is, after the great financial crisis. Yes, unemployment did come down in the E.U.,

but by no means to the same levels that say, in the U.K. or the U.S. Now, I'm really worried that the levels will go back up again, obviously, but

that the damage is so great, that again, your will not get its unemployment down to reach a potential, because of how bad the situation will be. Are

you worried about that?

DE CROO: Well, I am worried about the fact that those economies might be in a lockdown situation for too long, because in the end, the best measure we

can take is a controlled restart of our economy and obviously there are some health condition that need to be covered to do that. But the faster we

can, in a controlled way, and testing and masks and so on, will be -- will be a part of that. The faster that we can get that going, the easier it

will be to get back to our (INAUDIBLE) economic potential.

Look, this is a difficult situation, but it's not like we are after a war. It's not that the infrastructure is crippled. It's not that the high level

of education of our people would be wiped away. Everything we had six months ago, is still there today. The real question is going to be, which

kind of boost of confidence and boost of financing are we going to give to this European economy to kick start it back over again. And this is

definitely the role that the European Commission needs to play.

QUEST: Good to see you, Minister. Thank you. Thank you for giving us time tonight. Busy week for all and I'm grateful that you spoke to us. When we

come back and just a moment, Amazon has got its own lab, or is working on its own lab for testing its employees. After the break, a senior vice

president that (INAUDIBLE) explains the rationale and how far it is prepared to go, as the best way to start the economy. In a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:45:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: A top Amazon executive says that the way forward to open up the economy is to increase the amount of testing. And to that end, Amazon

itself is moving forward with its own testing, which it believes will help the company. The senior vice president, Jay Carney, was speaking to Julia

Chatterley.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JAY CARNEY, SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT, AMAZON: These are extraordinary times. And I think Amazon like a lot of companies and private -- other private, as

well as public sector institutions are having to do things they've never done before. Now, we think and I know that we're not alone and thinking

this that the need for plentiful, scalable testing around the country in the world, is a key to our ability to return to normal, so to speak,

especially before there's a vaccine available.

And because there has been a shortage of testing, we are assembling our own first lab. I mean, it's early days, hopefully, we'll be able to start

testing some of our frontline employees soon. But how far are we get in this process? How much scaling we're able to do? Remains to be seen. We're

very humble about this, not our area of expertise. But we really need and everyone needs to, I think focus on this challenge.

JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNN BUSINESS ANCHOR, "FIRST MOVE": But you're sending a message here, perhaps to the leaders of this nation that in the absence of

mass testing on a broader scale, companies will go it alone because in the end, you have to protect and give confidence to your workforce. Is that the

message?

CARNEY: Well, we're not alone. And I think many business leaders and leaders from the health industry and across industries have noted that the

easiest way, the best way, perhaps the only way for us to get the economies of the world going again, is to have a system where testing is readily

available so that those who are diagnosed positive can be taken care of and isolated from the population of workers, and others who can -- if they test

negative, can go back to work and do so without fear.

I think, you know, this is not a novel idea that we have. We are because we have the capacity to at least try it. We are trying to build some of our

own coronavirus testing capacity. But obviously, none of this works at a scale that the United States or Europe or the rest of the world needs

unless it's done by many, many institutions, governments and private and public sector.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Julia Chatterley talking to Jay Carney. When we come back, the voice of the crisis. The rental car company that's allowing health workers to

rent cars for free, because nobody else is renting them. In a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:50:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: Tonight's voice of the crisis, and it's a digital car rental company that suddenly found nobody else was renting their cars. So, they decided to

let health workers and those working in the health industry, use their cars to get where they need to be. It's called Virtuo. It's a digital car rental

with hubs in U.K., France and Spain. Now, the business is obviously down dramatically because of the pandemic.

So, it took its unused fleet and rented to medical stuff for free. Karim Kaddoura is chief executive of Virtuo. He joins me from Paris via Skype. I

can only imagine you must have just seen, particularly in Italy and (INAUDIBLE) you must have just seen the whole thing, slowly, just stopped,

as nobody was traveling.

KARIM KADDOURA, CEO AND CO-FOUNDER, VIRTUO: That's correct. Hi, Richard. Thanks for having me. Honestly, this whole thing is so unexpected, and it

happened so, so fast, which is hard, because we had a tremendous start of the year. And of course, lockdown, you know, created a sharp decrease in

our new bookings.

Although, I think we're still in a better position than any other mobility or travel companies out there, and I think the reason being is that our

service is fully digital, as you said, contactless. And so, if you want to rent a car, there's no human interaction. And I think in the current

crisis, it's what's nice.

QUEST: Sure. Except because people shouldn't be traveling according to the -- now look, this idea to let medical staff, nursing stuff, rent the cars

to help get them to work, whose idea was it, was it yours?

KADDOURA: It was our team's, our marketing team. I think a collective effort from our team. We -- it started a month ago. So, right when

confinement, you know, measures were arriving in Europe. And so, the whole idea was to obviously help workers, those on our phone line, working long

hours, relieve a bit of their stress and providing them with, you know, better and a safer means to get (INAUDIBLE) with a lockdown meant huge

disruption in public transportation.

QUEST: So, if we -- if we look at how you will restart, as -- come -- as economy starts opening again, your overheads obviously are there, but

you're managing to manage that and you've got funding. Will you survive? Will it succeed?

KADDOURA: Well, we're optimistic, we're hopeful. And listen, we have three offices, three teams, across three countries, but our main office is in

France. And I think the French government is giving a tremendous support to its economy. And so, we're applying and benefiting from temporary

unemployment, but also from a huge public loans and government backed loans. So, that's obviously helping the business.

QUEST: Right. Well, congratulations. Thank you, sir, for the work you are doing in this respect. How long do you think you'll be able to keep it

going in terms of allowing them to have the cars, allowing the health workers to keep going with them?

KADDOURA: Well, listen, as long as (INAUDIBLE) again, we're here to help. So, if it's needed for a longer term, then we'll do that. we'll support.

[15:55:04]

QUEST: Good to talk to you, sir. Well, I promised just when everything else, and I can keep this promise. I promise you, when I'm back in Britain,

I will most certainly be renting one of your cars, and I'll even pay for it as well. There's a novel suggestion. So, we look forward to trying out your

digital thing. Thank you, sir, for taking the time in joining us and telling us about it.

Now, I'm going to leave you with the markets as to how they are looking at the moment. Well, there's been a bit of a rally as we go. It was a Gilliard

rally that started. But of course, it is essentially all predicated on the idea that if there's a solution or a vaccine, I won't say a cure, then this

will make it a lot easier for economies to reopen. And that's what suddenly boosted the market this afternoon.

Bearing in mind, we were down at 18,000 just a few weeks ago, when our 24,000 on the Dow, but we still got an earning season to get through.

Anyway, that's the way things are looking at the moment. And so, thank you for taking time to be with us. You hear the usual e-mail address,

Richard.quest@cnn.com. You and I can have our own discussion of what's been happening. Thank you for joining me today from the living room. That is

QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for today. This is what it looks like. I'm Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, oops, I hope

it's profitable. Even the bell won't work. See you next week.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper, in Washington. Right now, the number of confirmed coronavirus cases in the United States

is approaching 679,000. The death toll has more than doubled in the last week in the U.S., to more than 34,000 in part. That's because probable

coronavirus deaths are now included in some state totals. Across the globe, more than 2.2 million people have contracted the virus with nearly 151,000

dead.

Today, governors in a few states are announcing they are taking small steps towards beginning to reopen their societies and their economies. And we

have some brand-new models just into CNN that suggests some states might be able to relax some restrictions as soon as May 4th, though other states may

need to wait until June or July. We'll discuss that more with Dr. Sanjay Gupta, coming up.

END