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Quest Means Business
CNN Poll: Majority of U.K. Blacks Say Minorities Have Less Opportunity To Succeed Than Whites; Black-Owned U.S. Businesses Hit Especially Hard By Pandemic; CEO Of Drugmaker of "Breakthrough" Steroid Speaks To CNN; Danish Football Club Aarhus Fills Stands With Virtual Fans. Aired 3-4p ET
Aired June 22, 2020 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[15:00:10]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS ANCHOR, QUEST MEANS BUSINESS: Sixty minutes before the close of trading on Wall Street, an hour to go and an
interesting sort of day to start the week.
Look at the numbers and you'll see how a market that started lower, then had a bump up, and then a bump down, and now we're up 178. The best of the
day so far, which is somewhat interesting when you look at what was going on. Those are the markets and the reasons why.
Germany's R number spiked quite sharply. There was an outbreak at a meat factory, still relatively contained, but still of great concern.
Wirecard is reeling. First they couldn't find the money. Now, they're saying the money might not have existed all along. Billions are involved.
I'll speak to the journalist who uncovered the crisis.
And the W.H.O. says demand for that steroid that helps in the treatment of coronavirus is surging. We'll talk to the company that's making it.
Live from New York, it is Monday. It's June 22nd. I'm Richard Quest, and of course, I mean business.
Good evening. Tonight, coronavirus cases are surging and surpassing nine million worldwide after some countries saw a resurgence following the
reopening. As you look across the world, you see particular countries are showing extreme measures as a result of this.
Germany's infection rate has skyrocketed with major outbreaks at a meat plant. China is halting some Tyson Food imports because of outbreaks at a
U.S. Tyson plant. The virus has killed 120,000 people in the United States with 10 states now reporting almost record jumps in cases.
Let's start in Germany with the main outbreak, which turned out to be at a meat plant. CNN's Fred Pleitgen reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Germany has called in its army after more than 1,300 workers at Tonnies
meat processing plant in the City of Gutersloh tested positive for the novel coronavirus.
Local authorities ripped into management, saying, in many cases, the firm failed to provide the addresses of employees, even as health officials were
urgently trying to trace those who may have been in contact with the virus.
"I want to say clearly that the trust we have in the Tonnies company is zero," the crisis team leader says. "I have to say this clearly."
While the company says German data protection laws slowed the information sharing process, the owner says he is sorry the outbreak occurred in his
business.
"I can only offer my complete apologies and give my apology because we are the cause of this issue and carry full responsibility. Me, as a businessman
and the company as a whole," he said.
The outbreak in Gutersloh is one of the main reasons the reproduction number for the novel coronavirus in Germany has soared, the country's
Center for Disease Control said. But it also spotlights what many activists and politicians say are unacceptable working conditions in German abattoirs
with employees often laboring and living in very close quarters.
Germany has seen a series of outbreaks in its meat processing industry and the government says it will take action to improve conditions.
"The Federal government is determined not to be guided by the interests of lobbyists but by the interests of the public," Germany's Labor Minister
said. "At its core, this is a decision between public wellbeing or egoistic interests."
Meanwhile, in the town of Gutersloh, state authorities say they may have to put the entire region around the Tonnies plant under a blanket lockdown.
"The source of this outbreak can be found at this specific company so it is still the case that we are unable to rule out a wider lockdown," the state
governor said.
While Germany has often been praised for its strong reaction to the coronavirus pandemic, politicians acknowledge they need to do more to make
sure the meat industry here does not remain a source of heightened infections.
Fred Pleitgen, CNN, Berlin.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: Now, the United States has a new COVID epicenter. Record infection rates, a number of cases that have been confirmed in Florida. The state has
more than 100,000 cases. Miami has just mandated wearing masks in public, which begs the question, why, of course, that hadn't been done before.
Overall, in the United States, ten of them are reporting -- ten states have the highest seven-day average since the pandemic with new cases rising in
almost half of them.
[15:05:19]
QUEST: The White House is sending mixed messages. The economic advisers Larry Kudlow and Peter Navarro, they are not on the same page over the
possibility of a second wave in the U.S.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Are we preparing for a second wave in the fall?
PETER NAVARRO, DIRECTOR OF THE OFFICE OF TRADE AND MANUFACTURING POLICY: You prepare -- you prepare for what can possibly happen. I'm not saying
it's going to happen, but of course you prepare.
LARRY KUDLOW, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: We know how to deal with is this stuff now. It's come a long way since last winter, and there
is no second wave coming.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: CNN's senior medical correspondent, Elizabeth Cohen is with me. The number is rising, but as one expert has put it, it's almost as if the
United States has decided that a certain level of cases is acceptable on the opposite side of scale of closing down the economy. I guess, the issue
is, what is that level of acceptable number of cases?
ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Richard, I think you're missing a key ingredient here. It is not just about starting the
economy up again, but President Trump would like to be re-elected in November, and so he wants to make it seem like, hey, nothing happening
here. COVID? What's COVID? That's the impression he is trying to create so that people will vote for him again.
So, when you add that in there, I think a very high level of COVID would be acceptable to him, as long as he can trick enough Americans, as long as he
can lie and fool enough Americans to think that COVID is not a problem, which, of course, it is. As long as he can trick people, the sky is the
limit to him.
QUEST: Elizabeth, you've been covering this since before any of us had ever heard of the coronavirus, before it even had a name. Elizabeth, the
situation now in states like Florida, Texas, Arizona, how serious is this increase?
COHEN: It's very serious. In 11 out of 50 states in the United States, the rates are going up, more than 50 percent from last week -- from the week
before. So, in one week, the rates went up more than 50 percent. In 23 states, they went up to some degree or another.
So when you have that many states with increasing rates, that is a problem, or I'm going to be even more pointed about it, Richard. Hundreds of
Americans are dying every day from COVID-19. That is a crisis.
Can you imagine if this were happening during the Obama administration? That there was this runaway virus that was killing hundreds of Americans
every day? President Trump would have said, boy, oh my gosh, how could Obama not have fixed that? But when it's happening under his watch, he
likes to say it's no big deal.
QUEST: But Elizabeth, to put in place over a longer period of time the necessary restrictions that will drive the curve lower, is that acceptable
too?
COHEN: There have to be restrictions that are put in place for sure. There are ways to do it that will harm the economy less and ways to do it that
will harm the economy more. And so, what the United States needs to do, according to every expert that I have ever spoken with, is you need to
figure out what you can do that will harm the economy less, and there are ways of doing that.
For example, telling people that they have to wear masks. That doesn't hurt the economy, right? That may make some people angry. It may make people not
vote for you if you're a politician, but it's not going to hurt the economy for people to wear a mask, so, people ought to be wearing masks.
QUEST: Elizabeth Cohen, thank you very much.
Now, in a moment, we have a number now for Wirecard and the level of the accounting scandal. More than $2 billion. The only problem is, it's
starting to appear as if the money never existed, which is strange in itself.
The journalist who uncovered all of this will be with me after the break. It's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS live from New York.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:12:00]
QUEST: Wirecard has now put a price on what is one of the largest financial scandals in Europe, more than $2 billion, they say went missing.
Well, actually, to be more precise, it probably never existed at all.
According to the German services company, which is embroiled in the scandal, it put out an announcement saying that a series of over accounting
and miscreant behavior has obviously over counted by $2 billion. Dan McCrum is the investigative reporter who broke the story for "The Financial
Times." Dan joins me now from London.
So, this is rather extraordinary, isn't it? I mean, never mind false accounting. This is simply no accounting.
DAN MCCRUM, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER, FINANCIAL TIMES: Exactly. I mean, it's quite something when a company whose job it is to move money around the
world is suddenly saying that $2 billion, they just can't find it. It may have never existed after all.
QUEST: At what point, Dan, as you started the investigation into this, at what point did you think, I can't be believing this. This can't be true.
This is simply unbelievable.
MCCRUM: Well, I think what you have to understand is how Wirecard is seen in Germany. I mean, this is the next great sort of technology hope of a
country which has its incredible manufacturing base, but no real modern technology companies except S.A.P., the big corporate software company.
And so many people saw Wirecard as the next S.A.P. It was growing faster than everyone else. It was more profitable than everyone else, and when you
come up against a company like that, which seems to openly be such a success, there is an element which you can't really believe what you're
seeing, and what we were seeing in this case, what sort of started the whole thing to unravel and we published back in October, was that we were
provided documents by whistleblowers which gave us a little bit of an insight into inside the company.
And then when we started to check that some of these customers who, they were appearing in documents given to the auditors at EY and were supposedly
the source of significant profits, well, it turned out they didn't really exist and so, this raised quite a substantial question about a very large
portion of the company's profits.
QUEST: It also raises questions, of course, about financial regulation in Germany. The regulators consistently either ignored or dismissed or chose
to look the other way, it would seem. I don't think they did it deliberately, more by incompetence than malfeasance.
MCCRUM: I mean, there is a real question about Germany's regulatory response here. We started reporting on this company 18 months ago, and when
we started that reporting, the regulator seemed to treat what we were saying as if we were -- as if we were short sellers or market manipulators,
and on the basis of an entirely spurious complaint from the company itself, they investigated me and my colleague, Stefania Palma, who had been working
on this story as criminal market manipulators.
[15:15:14]
QUEST: Do you -- will somebody go to prison, I guess, is the -- is what it really comes down to. Whenever you get these cases of financial
malfeasance, you really want somebody to be locked up. Will it happen here?
MCCRUM: I would hope that even if it was 2 billion euros, I mean, the banks are on the hook for 2 billion euros themselves, never mind this 2
billion euros which may or may not have ever existed.
You would hope, with a fraud now, of this scale, that there would be criminal consequences to those who caused it.
QUEST: Good to see you, Dan.
MCCRUM: Having said that, we do know that there are a number of folks have been investigated (INAUDIBLE) which are still (INAUDIBLE) so, those things
take time and often have unsatisfactory endings.
QUEST: Dan McCrum, thank you for joining us. Sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you, I had a bit of trouble hearing you at the end there. I
apologize. Dan McCrum from "The Financial Times." It is a story we will watch more and more closely.
Goldman-Sachs now says that the retail traders are beating the professionals. The retail traders, that's you -- well, you, me, normal
people, apparently, they are doing better when it comes to trading over this period of coronavirus than those who are paid a great deal of money to
do it on a professional basis.
Whether it's beginner's luck or sheer brilliance, no one really knows, but it's paying off so far. Since the market hit the bottom, a portfolio of
popular retail trader stocks is up 61 percent. The hedge fund major holdings are only up 45 percent. The S&P is up 36 percent.
Many individual investors are using Robinhood, which is the popular free fee trading app. The top ten stocks chooses their own Clare Sebastian is
with me. This is very interesting, isn't it, Clare? When I heard this story this morning, I was tempted to say, I'm not surprised because retail
investors plowing in at the bottom of the market, it was pretty difficult not to make money.
CLARE SEBASTIAN, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Right, Richard, and I think we're seeing a couple of things here. Right now, in the market, there's a
tension between the optimism over reopening and the sort of continuing bleak nature of the fundamentals, and I think since retail investors tend
to skew younger, those who might be more open to, perhaps, going on planes and cruises earlier and those who are less exposed, less vulnerable to the
virus than the older population.
It stands to reason they would be more optimistic and perhaps have the gumption to pile into some of those value stocks, including, in some cases,
bankrupt stocks.
But Richard, there's a cultural element to this as well. There's a sense that people are getting into the excitement of the stock market, and some
are attributing that to one man. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DAVE PORTNOY, FOUNDER, BARSTOOL SPORTS: If I lose half a mil on [bleep] Spirit because they go bankrupt, so be it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SEBASTIAN (voice over): At the beginning of May, sports blogger and social media celebrity Dave Portnoy invested a million dollars in Spirit airlines.
He says at almost the exact same time as this news broke.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNN BUSINESS ANCHOR, FIRST MOVE: Taking flight. Warren Buffett reveals Berkshire Hathaway has sold its U.S. airline stocks.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SEBASTIAN (voice over): Warren Buffett's decision, we should note was based on his view that it would take years for air travel to recover.
Still, as Spirit stock doubled over the next month, Portnoy didn't hold back.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PORTNOY: I said Warren Buffett, that old man, he doesn't know what he is talking about. I'm better than he is. It's a fact.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SEBASTIAN (voice over): Before the pandemic, Dave Portnoy, founder of website, Barstool Sports, was better known for being thrown out of the
Super Bowl and harassing female journalists, including a years-long campaign against ESPN host, Samantha Ponder.
He dismisses this, saying his style is to make jokes online.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PORTNOY: Have a mil of chewy, ding-ding-ding-ding. I've always been an avid sports gambler and once corona hit and sports kind of stopped, I was
looking for something to do, something to create content with.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SEBASTIAN (voice over): In March, he put $3 million of his own money into an E-Trade account, and came up with a name for his new trading operation,
Davey Day Trader Global or DDTG and coined a simple mantra.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PORTNOY: Stocks always go up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SEBASTIAN (voice over): And for several months, the S&P 500 proved him right. As the market surged from its March lows, Portnoy both tapped into
and some believe helped fuel a flood of amateur investors into the stock market.
Commission-free trading platforms like Robinhood, E-Trade and TD Ameritrade reporting big increases in trading volume and account openings.
[15:20:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JJ KINAHAN, CHIEF MARKET STRATEGIST, TD AMERITRADE: What Dave Portnoy has done is he has made investing fun. Now, just because it's fun, doesn't
necessarily mean you should take it lightly. It's money. You should take it very, very seriously. It's not gambling.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SEBASTIAN (voice over): These investors have taken risks, including piling into bankrupt stocks like Hertz. And yet, some experts say the amateurs,
especially younger ones, were quicker to call the bottom.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KINAHAN: Way back in March, when this first started, the cruise lines, we saw our millennial clients start to buy Carnival Cruise. The rest of our
population, you know, the more traditional, if you will, population, didn't really start to buy it until mid-April.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SEBASTIAN (voice over): One of those millennials was Sean Cassity, a 29- year-old employee at a defense contractor, also in the past, a sports gambler. In early April, he took his tax refund and government stimulus
check and put it all into his E-Trade account.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEAN CASSITY, AMATEUR TRADER: A lot of travel stocks, definitely a lot of what Dave Portnoy has talked about, you know, the cruise stocks, the
airline stocks, life is going to get back to normal, like he said. You've got to just hold your half of that and when that happens, people are going
to fly again and people are going to go on cruises again.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SEBASTIAN (voice over): So far, he is seeing a 50 percent return on his $6,000.00 investment. He follows Dave Portnoy, but says he takes a lot of
his advice with a grain of salt.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PORTNOY: You just take a couple of letters, you mush them together, press, buy, buy, buy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SEBASTIAN (voice over): And even Portnoy himself admits his winning streak may not last.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PORTNOY: If you told me I had a guarantee of the stocks are just going to go up every single day like it does for the next decade, well then, I'd
quit my job and just do this because there's nothing more profitable, but I don't think that's the case. I think eventually it will stop. I just don't
know when.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SEBASTIAN: So, obviously, Richard, if you're trying to day trade in a market this volatile, you do have to be careful but there's another side to
this and this is that we know since the great recession, the level of stock ownership among Americans really has never recovered.
A lot of people are looking at this and actually saying this is a good thing, more people are getting access to the stock market, TD Ameritrade
told me that their educational resources have gone up. Demand has gone up 300 percent, so it's not just people piling in without any sort of second
look.
People are also trying to learn about the stock markets, and they think that's a positive.
QUEST: But Clare, back to the point I made at the beginning, you know, all right, we didn't know March 18th would prove to be the bottom of the
market. But when a stock like Boeing is down at $92.00, you don't need to be a genius to -- I mean, you might lose it down to $70.00, but it's
eventually, in a fairly probably short order, by the nature of the pendulum, going to come back up again.
Isn't that what they're doing? Surely the difficulty for these traders is how to trade now when it's not just momentum but the company's performance.
SEBASTIAN: Yes, Richard, I think Mohamed El-Erian actually put it best. He described the phenomenon we're seeing among retail traders as people who --
long distance runners who start with a sprint. You have to have another burst of energy to keep going, and he wonders whether this will, A, be more
money deployed in the market, is there more retail money out there that could be put in or are we going to look to new policies, the Fed, the
Treasury, the support that the economy has seen despite these bleak fundamentals.
QUEST: That's Clare Sebastian. Clare, thank you.
Now, forbearance does not mean forgiveness. It's a phrase we're hearing again and again and again.
In the U.S., mortgage delinquencies have surged to the highest level in nine years. 4.3 million borrowers are delinquent by 30 days as of May.
Forbearances are being introduced around the world by mortgage lenders, banks, institutions, all sorts of lenders.
In the U.S., a third of states have eviction freezes which are about to expire or set to expire after three months. In the U.K., evictions are
banned until August. Spain and Australia is giving renters six months. However, the problem is tenants have to make up those payments.
Remember what I said? Forbearance does not mean forgiveness. And that's why we've got Bob Broeksmit, he is the President and CEO of the Mortgage
Bankers Association joining me now.
It's -- I understand the principle. You've still got to pay back the money and the interest and probably the interest on the interest, but it just
seems like -- so, really, all you're doing is telling people they don't have to make a payment when they may be a bit cash poor.
BOB BROEKSMIT, PRESIDENT AND CEO, MORTGAGE BANKERS ASSOCIATION: Richard, thank you for having me on. And actually, no, there's not interest on the
interest. There's a very simple way for borrowers to get out of forbearance when their hardship has been resolved.
So, in other words, if you -- let's say you are laid off from your job temporarily and three months later, you're called back to work. The way
forbearance works is that you didn't have to make those three months of payments when you didn't have any income, but when the income resumes, your
payment resumes, but those three months of payments are set aside without interest, and the borrower then pays them back when the loan is paid off.
[15:25:10]
BROEKSMIT: So, it really does match the period of distress with relief very nicely.
QUEST: Many people are fooled into thinking, though, I mean, despite -- I'm not suggesting for a moment the lenders haven't been clear about this.
I was talking to colleagues in the U.K. and they've been very clear about this, that you should try to make some payments to keep it lower, but
people do believe that there may be a holiday or it may be actually forgiven rather than just a holiday.
BROEKSMIT: Well, Richard, we're not seeing that in the United States. In fact, what we're seeing is that people understand that this special program
tailored by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and then made into law by the Congress is specifically tailored to this event.
So that it isn't -- it's a time-out, in effect, because your income stops, or you have some sort of hardship related to the pandemic, and then when it
comes back, the payments come back at the same rate and any amount that you missed is put on at the end.
So I don't think there's any confusion in the U.S. about forgiveness as opposed to forbearance as it relates to their mortgages.
QUEST: Bob, I know this is going to sound almost socialist in idea, or even Robinhood, but you know, people, when they've lost their jobs and they
may not get a job for four, five months, and the absolute calamity of the potential of losing their home, and yet we know that within a year, the
banks are going to be making once again profits in the billions and the tens of billions overall. And you think, couldn't you just forgive a bit of
it?
BROEKSMIT: Well, I guess I'll just say, again, Richard, that I think it makes sense for the relief offered by lenders to match the hardship of the
borrower, and can keep in mind, the forbearance in the U.S. is for up to 12 months, so even in the case where recovery is slow, let's say, the borrower
is working in an industry that's especially hard hit. For up to a full year, that borrower does not have to make a payment.
So all we're saying, across America, as it relates to mortgages, is that when you're back on your feet, resume making the payments and then when the
loan is paid off, you'll owe that amount that you missed, but without one nickel of interest on it. So, we think that's quite a fair solution.
QUEST: Bob, thank you. Always good to have such frank discussions on these difficult issues, and I'm grateful that you came on to talk about it today.
Thank you, sir.
BROEKSMIT: Thanks for having me on, Richard.
QUEST: When we come back in just a moment -- thank you. In a moment, the U.K.'s race divide. Results from an exclusive new CNN poll, disturbing, and
we'll talk about it after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. There's more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for you in just a moment.
We'll be talking to the head of Aspen Pharmaceutical. It's the company that makes the steroid that is widely now accredited as helping in the fight
against coronavirus.
And the Danish football club that is getting creative filling the empty stadium. Well, it's not actually filling it, it's doing something very
similar. We'll talk about that after the break.
All of that comes ahead. This is CNN, and on this network, the facts on the news always come first.
NASCAR is rallying around the African-American driver Bubba Wallace, a crew member found a noose hanging in Wallace's garage a day before the 500. As
the race began minutes ago, drivers gathered around Wallace's car pushing him to the front of the pack. Racers also joined him during the singing of
the National Anthem.
President Trump is said to be furious over the disappointing turnout at his campaign rally on Saturday in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Fewer than 6,200 people
showed up after campaign officials said more than a million people registered for the event.
Disneyland Paris says it will begin a phase reopening starting on July 15th. That's the same week plan for the company's theme parks in the U.S.
state of Florida. The park will increase cleaning frequency, limit attendance and require physical distancing.
Exclusive new poll details by CNN and Savanta ComRes. It shows profoundly different views between black and white people on a variety of subjects
when particularly when it comes to racism in the United Kingdom.
69 percent of black respondents say black and minority ethnic people have less opportunity to succeed than white people. And only 29 percent of white
respondents said that.
Andrew Pearce is the managing director of Accenture. He's also the U.K. Chair of the Executive Leadership Council. He joins me via Skype from
Lincolnshire in England.
I mean, on one level, sir, I'm not surprised by this finding, because it sort of tells us what I think we all perhaps feared but we now have numbers
and evidence to prove. Would you agree, would you back that up?
ANDREW PEARCE, MANAGING DIRECTOR, ACCENTURE (via Skype): Most certainly, Richard. I think what has happened is that as with anything else,
particularly in business, you look for data. And the data is very clear now and shows the experience around the black community and black population in
business that wasn't fully apparent previously. And that is something that's important to business, it's also important to society.
So it is no surprise to me. But I think what is more apparent is that it's becoming much more visible to our leadership and to the wider community in
general.
QUEST: And what's also interesting from this is that the black employees are more disadvantaged over a longer period than other minorities, which
sort of rub salt into the wound and of the whole -- of the whole issue to begin with.
PEARCE: Yes, most definitely. And I think in the past, what's happened is that we tend to actually have the firm phrase bane, and it actually lumps
all ethnicities together. And that's incredibly unhelpful, right?
If you really want to make a difference, you've got to look at those and split them out into something that's meaningful. And when you do that, you
do see the huge impact among the black society, among black business and in black communities. And it's actually having those conversations that then
allows us to take those actions to change that.
[15:35:06]
QUEST: In a moment, I'll hear reports from entrepreneurs but if we talk about the corporate environment. Look, every company of any size has a raft
of policies designed to prevent this. So I'll say you don't need to, those policies clearly are working. But really what it is, it's about hitting
middle management, so a pipeline's created.
PEARCE: Oh, yes, without a doubt. I mean, there was a great report actually by the Black Business Awards called the -- you know, the Middle Report, and
it actually looked at that very fact.
The -- you know, the issue is in the past, what's tend to happen is that companies have gone on a tick box approach, it might be an unconscious bias
training, it might be -- well, we've got policies. But what has not happened is that people have not really understood what the experience is
for those employees.
So to become an advocate, you've got to understand what it feels like in terms of racism. And if people are just saying, well, I'm not racist,
therefore, it's not an issue, that's not enough. You've got to be anti- racist and take action.
So what companies need now to do is enough to have the policies, that's important, but take specific action. Because otherwise in six months, a
year, two years, we'll be having exactly the same conversation. So the policies on their own are not enough. We need those advocates to drive
change.
QUEST: You know, I do wonder, though, you -- no disrespect, you've been around the block once or twice like myself. We've both been through these
moments before, where -- you know, somebody's told us this is -- this is the moment (INAUDIBLE). In the U.K. from Toxteth riots, Brixton riots, you
know, Birmingham. Why is it different, if it is?
PEARCE: Well, I mean, you raise a very good point, is it different? We have been here before, over many, many periods. And we've also had these things
will change this time.
My hope would be -- and the catalyst, obviously, the tragic events in the U.S., and we've seen coming together of people against racism and public
acknowledgement by corporations and society that racism exists.
My hope is that no, this moment becomes a continuous dialogue and we do see change. It would be incredibly disappointing for our communities if we do
not see that change embedded and taken forward.
But I take your point, and people are tired of the constant rights and the constant -- you know, fear that of discussing it. So we do need that
lasting, sustainable change momentum going forward.
QUEST: Andrew, you're talking about a constant dialogue, Sir. May I invite you to have a constant dialogue with us here on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS as
this continues? We'd love to have you back and talk about this as we see policies, and be brutal about in terms of what's working and what's not.
PEARCE: I'd be delighted to, Richard. You know, this is an extremely important but for business, but what's -- it's not only the right thing for
business, it's the right thing for society. So yes, I'd be delighted to have those dialogues and discuss how things are going and what we can do
better. It's been a pleasure to have a conversation with you tonight, Richard. Thank you.
QUEST: Andrew Pearce joining me. Thank you.
Now, in the United States, the pandemic hit minority owned businesses, especially hard. As if things weren't bad enough. CNN's Phil Mattingly
reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's the sound the Jones sisters weren't sure they'd hear much longer, a customer buying their ice
cream. For the owners of the Southwest Soda Pop Shop, the coming summer months were the heart of this business.
BRITTANY JONES, SOUTHWEST SODA POP SHOP: We house -- you know, sodas, but you know, floats, milkshakes, ice creams, things like that.
MATTINGLY: Until the pandemic brought them on the brink of failure.
BRIANNA JONES, SOUTHWEST SODA POP SHOP: Instead of the 30 customers or 50 customers that we usually have on a regular week day, it went from maybe
one or two, three or four because people were scared.
MATTINGLY: But it wasn't a piece of the trillions in federal government assistance that kept them alive.
BRITTANY JONES: We just didn't qualify initially for those programs that were out there.
MATTINGLY: They were shut out of the largest small business rescue program in U.S. history. The Paycheck Protection Program running headlong into the
structural issues that have hindered black owned small businesses for decades, and only been exacerbated by the pandemic. 41 percent of black
owned small businesses shuttered between February and April, their white counterparts less than 20 percent.
ASHLEY HARRINGTON, FEDERAL ADVOCACY DIRECTOR, CENTER FOR RESPONSIBLE LENDING: This is just laying bare all of the cracks and issues that were
already there in this foundation and that people of color have been experiencing every single day.
MATTINGLY: The PPP was structured in a way to quickly kick hundreds of billions of dollars out the door. That same structure unintentionally
entrenched those pervasive disadvantages, from lack of bank relationships and disincentives for banks to prioritize smaller loans to the fact that
more than 95 percent of black owned small businesses are sole proprietorships which limited the funds they could access.
[15:40:07]
QUBILAH HUDDLESTON, D.C. FISCAL POLICY INSTITUTE: I mean a lot of it has to do with who has a seat at the table and who we think about in terms of who
are the business owners that -- you know, are at risk of closing doors.
MATTINGLY: The Small Business Administration's Inspector General finding that contrary to law, there was no initial prioritization for these
underserved communities. And that no demographic data was collected making it impossible to quote, determine the loan volume to the intended
prioritize markets.
Federal officials have recognized the shortcomings and have scrambled to address them but that push would have been too late for the Southwest Soda
Pop Shop where it not for their own inventive effort.
BRIANNA JONES: The GoFundMe was originally my dad's idea. So you can imagine four young, independent black women, we're like dad, a GoFundMe
that's kind of like begging. It took a lot of pride to the side for us to even send out the GoFundMe.
MATTINGLY: And this viral tweet with more than $25,000 raised, the business is alive. Distanced, masked, but still delicious.
JONES: That's only the beginning for us.
MATTINGLY: But it's also a win though, into just how acute the long- standing hurdles faced by black owned businesses have become for a nation in crisis.
JONES: (INAUDIBLE) save Southwest Soda Pop Shop.
MATTINGLY: It wasn't -- it wasn't the government?
JONES: It was not the government.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: The demand for dexamethasone is surging. That is the steroids that is now set to greatly assist those in the most extreme cases of
coronavirus, reducing the fatalities by 35 percent. The CEO of the company that makes that dexamethasone we'll be with us after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Worldwide demand for the drug dexamethasone is surging. Researchers found that the steroid can make coronavirus in its worst cases considerably
less deadly. Preliminary results show dexamethasone lower deaths by up to 30 percent amongst patients on ventilators.
Now bear in mind, if you end up on a ventilator, you're not in very good shape to begin with. So this is a huge benefit.
2,100 people got small doses for up to 10 days. The drug is usually used to treat arthritis and asthma. Dexamethasone is made up -- made in South
Africa by Aspen Pharmacare. The CEO Stephen Saad and he joins me from Durban via Skype.
[15:45:06]
Stephen, what did you think when -- I mean, when they told you that they were trying dexamethasone for COVID to see if it improved, or did you go to
them and say, well hang on, have you thought about trying our stuff?
STEPHEN SAAD, CEO, ASPEN PHARMACARE: I actually find out when you found out, Richard. So, I was unaware until they announced those trial results
were announced. You must be reminded, there have been many products trial through this process. And we've been sort of at the forefront of many of
them, you know, having been in obviously very strong anesthetics and the lead player there. So, you know, there have been a lot -- there have been
many moving parts.
QUEST: The ability to produce sufficient of the drug for worldwide demand is impossible without partners.
SAAD: Agreed. We are fortunate to have very large capacities. And obviously, we've had a bit of time now to find out if we had all the
components like the sort of dexamethasone API. The real pressure -- of course, comes in both an injectable and a tablet. The real pressure on
volumes is on the tablets. And what we try to do is collate all those global demands together with all the aid agencies and WHO, et cetera, to
understand the type of volumes that would be required. And look, where we are now is that within this first three weeks, we expect to be able to
produce 10 million tablets, and we should be able to ramp it up from there. So, I think we're able to get a large amount -- larger volumes out there
relatively quickly.
QUEST: Stephen, I am -- I hate to be vulgar about this, but are you making a considerable amount of money as a result of this? Not you personally, I
mean, the company?
SAAD: No, it's -- the product, it's really inexpensive product. It's an old and inexpensive product, tried and tested. And you'd probably find, I mean,
just to put a price on it, the tablets are probably around about $0.10 a tablet. So, it's a -- it's a -- it's an inexpensive product. And it's thank
goodness for all of us, has given us all a little bit of hope that, you know, there's something that can actually provide some relief to the
patients around the world.
QUEST: Actually, I'm just delighted that the company didn't decide to raise the price when it realized that you probably could, without price gouging.
You know, it's only $0.10 a tablet. You turn it to $0.20 a tablet, you may -- you know, you're doing pretty well. But obviously, that would be highly
inappropriate in most cases.
SAAD: It would and, you know, we aren't the only producer globally of the product. So, I'm sure that there will be a sufficient supply for all the
patients at a very affordable rate.
QUEST: Yes. Good. So, where do you take the company now you got this? And this was sort of discovered by accident. Do you decided to do more R&D in
particular areas where this might be related to?
SAAD: We are -- we've been very focused on getting anesthetics because some of our anesthetics were critical in muscle relaxants when particularly to
be used on ventilators. So, there was focus there. And then we moved to thrombosis. We're also strong players in anticoagulants. And what we are
building our capacities for now is hopefully to be able to assist with vaccines. So, with vaccines are fine to be able to -- there is going to be
a lot of production required. And you know, we could probably -- we could probably make up to half a million -- half a billion vaccines, globally.
And I think that's -- that is the ultimate solution. And we'd really like to be a part of that solution.
QUEST: Stephen, we'll talk when you do. As this vaccine comes along, we'll have -- I'll have you back please, and talk more about it. I'm very
grateful you've given me time tonight.
SAAD: Appreciate it. Thank you, Richard, thank you for your time. Thank you. Thank you. Bye-bye.
QUEST: Thank you. Thank you. Now, the pandemic makes it hard for football to function as usual. All right. You can play on a pitch in an empty
Stadium, but who wants to do that? You want to, yey, go. Well, now you can act digitally, after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:50:00]
QUEST: (INAUDIBLE) When you go to a football night these days, that's what you miss. Well, the stadium is there, and the players are playing it while
it being empty. Not though, for the Danish football club which is getting creative if it wants to fill and filling up the empty stands. The virtual
grandstand lets fans be a part of the games AGF Aarhus has been doing this since the league restarted in late May. Giant screens with thousands of
Zoom callers all singing along making noises. Aarhus CEO is Jacob Nielsen. He joins me from Denmark. This is brilliant, sir. This is brilliant. How's
your business doing in terms of responding? How do the players respond to these screens, where nobody's in sync and everybody's shrieking and
enjoying themselves?
JACOB NIELSEN, CEO, AGF AARHUS: It's been -- Hello, Richard. It's been quite amazing. We came up with this idea and we thought it was a brilliant
idea. But, you know, it's not every day that this technical side works. We had a great cooperation with Zoom. And the fan engagement has been
incredible. So, the business is doing quite well. Although, that core and the crisis also was a big part of the community in Aarhus.
QUEST: So, some of the screens show full size people and that show dozens and dozens of people on the screens. I mean, is it -- has it changed, for
the players, the emotion of playing versus an empty stadium?
NIELSEN: Well, in the beginning of the corona crisis in Denmark, we -- the last game before everything was shut down in the beginning of March --
we're in an away game, with empty stands all over and we lost this game. And one of the only games that the opponent won this season. So, we lack of
the fans; we need the atmosphere for the players, you know? We have big club in Denmark, and the players need the fans. Also, the away supporters
because it's a big part of our sports DNA. So, yes, the players love that there is some kind of atmosphere, and that these big screens is right down
into the -- into along the pitch. That's very important for this environment to the game.
QUEST: When they suggested this, first of all, did you think they were mad?
NIELSEN: No, we -- actually, we were only if -- I think we were five or six employees. We're still working but being home. So, we had this virtual
meeting when we came up with this idea. And there was a Danish T.V. program where they were singing still apart from each other. So, it was it -- was
how that came up.
[15:55:13]
QUEST: Brilliant idea. And finally, if I look at the company and if I look at how the club is doing, obviously, massive hits on revenue as a result of
fans and ticket sales and concessions and sponsorship, and all of those sorts of things. How long will it take before you think you've managed to
write the financial ship?
NIELSEN: Well, it's hard to say. These times, you never know. We just started testing in Denmark with more than 500 now into this event. You
know, we are actually only 300 spectators allowed but it's still a good start in Denmark. I think we are becoming more and more open from the whole
community of Denmark, and that's very important. And sports is a big part of it. So, I believe in a couple of months, everything will be back into
normal in Denmark.
QUEST: That's wonderful news. Good to hear you, sir. And thank you for joining us. Thank you. I appreciate it.
NIELSEN: Thank you.
QUEST: We will take a "PROFITABLE MOMENT" after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Tonight's "PROFITABLE MOMENT." It wasn't rocket science or didn't take a genius to make money, following the sharp fall in share prices
earlier this year. Oh, to be sure, if you're trying to time the bottom, then you're off to the, you know, you're a lunatic. That's almost
impossible to do. However, if all your goal was, was to buy stock when you install shares beaten up 60, 70, 80 percent, it was a fair bet they were
going to come back even if by 20 or 30, or 40 percent. And that's what many of the day traders have done, and have made good gains to be sure, as
indeed lots of people who added in to their 401(k)s and their pension funds. You didn't need to be a genius.
Now, it gets difficult, because now companies' share prices will not be on the back of momentum, but will be on the back of their trading positions.
This will sort the experts from the amateurs, those who really know what they're doing from those who are just foolish and sucking the wind. And
that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight, I'm Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable.
END
END
