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China Enacts Strict Lockdown On 400,000 People Near Beijing; E.U. Finalizing International Travel Restrictions; Mexico City Reopening, But It's Too Late For Some Business; Bookshops Being New Chapter With Increased Safety Measures. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired June 29, 2020 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:11]

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS ANCHOR, QUEST MEANS BUSINESS: Brooke Baldwin, thank you. We are 60 minutes from the close of business on Wall Street, and

it is a strong rally on the stock market. If you take a look, you show up nearly two percent. We're just about, in fact, we might be at the best of

the day, a gain of over 468 points and there are many reasons for today.

These are some of them. The team behind the Facebook boycott says they are still not satisfied. More and more companies are pulling ads.

The BOEING 737 MAX is flying again, officially. At least the test flights have taken off from the F.A.A. and Boeing shares are up 10 percent.

And Europe's list of countries allowed to visit the E.U. will not include the United States, as expected.

Live from New York, it is Monday. It's June 29th. I'm Richard Quest, and yes, I mean business.

Good evening. Tonight, as more top brands pull their advertising from Facebook, the group behind the boycott says that Facebook still hasn't done

enough to actually warrant them withdrawing. The Stop Hate For Profit campaign says that the social network hasn't gone far enough in its

reforms, and indeed, has come up with its own list of things that need to be done.

Facebook is now promising to label controversial content and ban ads that scapegoat minority groups as a threat. However, more changes concerning

accountability, decency, and support is what the group behind it says.

Brian Stelter, our CNN media correspondent is with me. What is it that these people want? They've managed to get to the point where there is a

large number of very reputable companies, big chip companies, blue chips, who are now boycotting.

BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: Yes. About 180 companies, according to this activist group, that's leading the boycott. A hundred

eighty companies, some of them huge names like Coca-Cola; earlier today, Denny's, the restaurant chain joined the list.

Let me be clear, Richard. Most Facebook advertisers are not changing a thing. They are not halting their ads, but this is enough of a problem for

Facebook that the company is responding, is trying to calm things down and convince advertisers to stay on board.

The boycott doesn't officially begin until July 1st, so these activists want more companies to get on board and they have ten demands that they've

identified in a memo today.

For example, they want Facebook to commit to giving refunds if their ads show up next to hateful content. They also want Facebook to figure out some

of the problems with groups.

Facebook has been moving toward a private group format where reporters and advertisers don't really know what's going on inside these groups, where

you can be sending around memes and misinformation and lies and hate speech, and none of it is visible to the outside world.

So, those are some of the concerns of the activist groups. Right now, I think they are winning. Facebook is losing. But like I said, most

advertisers are not pulling the plug, and the company's stock is back up today after taking a pretty significant loss on Friday.

QUEST: Because the -- on that point, the reality is, and I think I read it in the "Reliable Sources" newsletter, which is always reliable as a good

source, heard actually most of Facebook's money doesn't come from these big companies. Oh, sure, a fair dose does, but it actually comes from small and

medium-sized businesses.

STELTER: Right. It's a lot from mom and pop kind of that stereotype company that just needs to get customers in the door, especially in the

midst of a pandemic when they're focusing on online ordering and things like that.

Facebook and Google are incredibly successful because the ad model works so well. But even though this is only around the edges of Facebook's business,

it is still serious to the bottom line.

We have not seen a boycott effort like this have such an impact on Facebook before. And I think it's because it is such a simple message from these

campaigners. Stop hate for profit. Everyone can agree, hate speech is wrong and it shouldn't be on Facebook. Of course, Facebook agrees, too.

They say they have zero tolerance for hate speech. Here's what the spokesman for the company, Nick Clegg told me over the weekend.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NICK CLEGG, VICE PRESIDENT FOR GLOBAL AFFAIRS AND COMMUNICATION, FACEBOOK: Facebook, we have absolutely no incentive to tolerate hate speech. We don't

like it. Our users don't like it. Advertisers understandably don't like it. We don't benefit from hate speech. Of course not. We benefit from positive

human connection, not hate.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STELTER: Well, a cynic would say Facebook benefits from anything that keeps you on Facebook longer, any engagement with Facebook is a good thing.

That's what a cynic would say.

[15:05:07]

STELTER: But the point that Clegg was making is zero tolerance for hate speech does not mean zero occurrences of hate speech. He admits Facebook

has a problem. They have to work on making their algorithms better, making their technology better to stop hateful content from spreading on the site.

They say they are committed to that. They know they can't get it down to zero occurrences, but they have zero tolerance for this stuff.

Then Richard, where it gets even more complicated is one man's hate speech might be another person's funny post. I mean, look, there are certainly

some legal definitions for these terms, but there is a whole lot of nastiness on social media that may not be called hate, but it is still

divisive, it's still ugly, it is still damaging to the discourse and I don't think Facebook wants to go too far down that path of just trying to

decide what is divisive or not.

QUEST: Brian Stelter. Brian, thank you. Now, some of the major companies who have pulled their ads from Facebook or at least redirecting.

Facebook declared more than $70 billion, nearly all from ad sales and a significant chunk comes from these big names. Their business is vital.

Small companies scaled back or closed because of the pandemic. So Lululemon and Patagonia was one of the earlier ones.

If you look at the really big spenders, Coca-Cola, $22 million; Diageo, $22.9 million; Starbucks, way up there, $94 million. Unilever -- you see

the numbers. The sort of really sizeable ones.

Bruce Turkel is the Chief Executive of Turkel Brands. He joins me now. Whenever we need to understand the corporate mindset as it relates to this,

we turn to you, Bruce. So, what do you make of this? You have a particular view of a timeline for how this goes.

BRUCE TURKEL, CHIEF EXECUTIVE, TURKEL BRANDS: Of course, because even though this is the first time we've seen this happen in this instance, this

happens all the time. We don't want, as advertisers, the place where we put our messaging to override the message. At that point, advertising, as you

and I have talked about, Richard, turns into badvertising.

And the big problem that Facebook has here is that once these big companies make these statements, other people are going to hear it, other people are

going to follow suit.

And then, the timeline starts to roll, and what first was a response, let's face it, it's only a July response right now, but at some point, that

response could grow, and when that happens, Facebook is going to be playing catch-up, it is going to be playing defense, and if they get to the point

where they have to prove that, in fact, marketing and advertising on their platform is not detrimental to your brand instead of advertising with them

will make you money, they're in a lot of trouble.

QUEST: right. But you're -- this -- this timeline, which we're now showing, advertising to badvertising, Facebook to faceplant, ban to bounty,

but it ends up with everybody being back on board, and as you put it, all is forgiven.

What has to happen for Facebook to get to that point?

TURKEL: Well, Facebook will do the right thing. First of all, you heard the guest who was on just before me say that Facebook says, we do not stand

for this, we do not like that -- but let's face it, their actions don't prove that.

However, as long as their statements continue to back that up and they fix their algorithms to where people stop seeing the speech that they dislike

next to their messaging, at some point, the advertisers need to spend that money. They need to speak to their consumers. And so, one of two things

happens.

QUEST: Right.

TURKEL: Either Facebook takes such a hit and let's face it, Instagram as well, takes such a hit that the advertisers go elsewhere longer term. I

don't see that happening. Instead, Facebook will do enough of the right things where all will be forgiven. They've been rather tone deaf up to this

point.

QUEST: All right, okay, but --

TURKEL: They haven't had to do anything. Now, they have to do something, and if they do it right --

QUEST: Hang on, Bruce. I saw in the statement issued by one of the Vice Presidents, EVPs at Facebook where she basically said, we don't give in

where revenue is being used as a cudgel to beat us. I think the exact words were, I hope you've realized by now that Facebook doesn't give in just

because somebody says it's going to be -- they're going to use money against us.

TURKEL: Yes, that's a great thing to say, unless the cudgel gets bigger and bigger and bigger. Remember the old racing slogan, don't race what you

can't replace. Facebook loses this revenue in July. That revenue never comes back. They never earn that again. It's okay.

But if they lose it again in August, and it gets bigger and they lose it again in September, and it gets bigger, now they're racing something they

can't replace.

Instead, what they're going to realize is, they can tweak here, they can twist there, and when they do that, those advertisers see the benefit and

they all come back.

[15:10:09]

TURKEL: Facebook knows the way this plays out. They can act tough now. But at some point, they're going to change what they're doing, because they

want to welcome back this market.

By the way, if they didn't, if they don't do this, it's not lost on them that before them, there was something called MySpace, and before MySpace,

there was something called Friendster, and these platforms continually change. Facebook has done a great job of staying relevant, but they have to

keep doing that every single day.

QUEST: Good to have you, sir. Bruce Turkel with me. Thank you very much.

Now, Wall Street is higher if you look at the numbers. Wall Street has up - - it's the start of a shortened trading week because, of course, July 4th Holiday, which is taken early because of the weekend.

The Dow is up nearly two percent, well, 1.5 percent. There are new coronavirus outbreaks. So the reason the Dow is up so strongly is because

of a surge from Boeing, and you can see why just at about 9:30 when the test flight took off.

The F.A.A. test flight of Boeing 737 MAX is under way. That's put on nearly -- more than 12 percent to the price. The MAX has been grounded for more

than a year after two fatal crashes. There are still many issues to be solved before the MAX will fly again commercially.

The test flights began on Monday, and they were expected to last some three days. The F.A.A. will review data, give final clearance, new training, and

grounded planes will need maintenance updates before flying.

Pete Muntean is in Washington. He's our aviation correspondent. As I look at what's happening here, Pete Muntean, and the various steps that now have

to take place, it's a long way before this thing is going to, perhaps, fly again.

Look at all the number of reports they have to have. The EB validation report, the final F.S.B. report, the final documentation, the can and can't

have, and the rescind grounding order. It's going to be some time.

PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this is just one big milestone, at least, though in this really long saga that you just laid

out, Richard.

You know, I think what is so critical to underscore it to people at home is that you may not realize how unorthodox this whole thing really is. The

F.A.A. typically does not wade in the certification of an airplane like this to such a degree. Typically, the manufacturer certifies the airplane,

says that they have done the legwork, then the F.A.A. comes in and essentially gives an airplane its blessing.

In this case, this flight that is taking place right now, not only Boeing employees, Boeing pilots taking care of this flight right now, but also

F.A.A. pilots and F.A.A. engineers.

So far, the flights have been relatively benign. This flight took off around 10:00 a.m. Pacific Time at Boeing field just outside of Seattle and

then went to a place walled called Moses Lake, Washington, where the plane has been doing some takeoffs and landings, some relatively benign climbing

and turning, although we have learned from the F.A.A. that this only gets more aggressive from here on out.

Pilots will essentially be turning the airplane completely on its side to try and figure out where they can find those problematic corners, pushing

the envelope of the M-CAS system, the system that failed that ultimately led to those two landmark accidents. So, this is really just the start --

Richard.

QUEST: The problem, of course, as they try and test that envelope of M- CAS, you know, it's highly unlikely that it will be the same effect or anything even close of M-CAS kicking in because of slow speeds or whatever

that we saw in the other previous two cases. It's going to be something completely different.

And it's exploring the potential avenues for that in these certification flights that won't be easy. So, once they've done these flights over three

days, how long do you think it will be before they will rescind the grounding order?

MUNTEAN: Weeks, at least. We know that the F.A.A. Administrator, Steve Dickson, who is a pilot himself, will actually fly some of these flights,

some of these test flights, to sort of prove that the airplane is safe to fly again.

Typically, test flights like this, in any instance, are very methodical. These are particularly under a microscope where the pilots are really

trying to push the boundaries and as you put it so eloquently, really explore what the airplane is capable of.

We know that there's this software patch in the M-CAS system which was really the fatal flaw in this airplane. The M-CAS will now not overpower

the pilots when it pushes the nose over to try and prevent an aerodynamic stall of the airplane.

It also has an ability to essentially figure out if there is an issue with the probes -- the air sensor probes that caused these issues in these two

flights that proved fatal, so there's a lot of exploration that needs to take place, and typically, the certification of an airplane from the get-go

is long -- it is a long runway, and in this case, we're probably only at the halfway point is my guess -- Richard.

[15:15:21]

QUEST: Pete Muntean, our aviation correspondent. Pete, thank you. In just a moment, Siemens says it won't lose any jobs as a result of coronavirus,

but it's going to be a pretty torrid year for the company. Well, the CEO of Siemens is with us after the break.

It's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, start of a new week together. July the 4th.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: Angela Merkel is hosting Emmanuel Macron for meetings in Berlin. The German and the French leaders are both obviously discussing the

pandemic and how to get economic recovery well and truly under way.

Merkel has vowed to spear head the plan as Germany assumes the rotating E.U. presidency on Wednesday and there you see, of course, suitable social

distancing of the two leaders as they arrive to see each other.

The Siemens Chief Executive, Joe Kaeser is in berlin and joins me now. Joe, it is good to have you as always, sir. You know, I read about the

performance of the company and to some extent, I take the numbers that we're seeing now and in the second and the third quarter with a huge dose

of, well, it's to be expected.

Where do you think you'll see improvement, a sort of bottom of recovery that you can build from?

JOE KAESER, PRESIDENT AND CEO , SIEMENS: Well, hi, Richard, first of all, thank you for having me today. You know, we had a very decent first

calendar quarter, which is our second fiscal quarter where we saw some resilience in the software business.

But you also said that in the current quarter, we do see a material decline on the numbers. By the same token, we said we would see -- we do believe we

will see the bottom in our fiscal Q3.

What we also said, though, that it's way too early, you know, how long that the bottom is going to last. So, that's where we are. There isn't really

much news on this one because we believe that the jury is still out on how long the pandemic is going to last and how long it takes to restore

confidence and trust in the kind of goods environment.

QUEST: You see, that's the core here, because the things that you sell are expensive. They are large-scale infrastructure in many cases, and it does

raise the issue, if budgets become tightened, if there's austerity following on from recovery efforts, do you fear that you could suffer?

[15:20:26]

KAESER: Well, look, I'm not getting paid for being fearful, I'm getting paid for showing people the way and look at the opportunities which we

have. There's tremendous opportunities.

First of all, we have quite a massive portion of software business so that means recurring revenues. Same is true for the service business like in

energy or in healthcare.

The other thing is, you know, we hear from our political leaders about trillions and billions of stimulus packages. I think what we need to go

look now is how can we structure, you know, those funds to make a meaningful contribution, and how can we take advantage of the global

stimulus packages which are around the world, in China, in the United States, in Europe, so actually, we are very confident that Siemens has got

all of the tools and all the power to be able to significantly contribute and build a better world by a better infrastructure, automation, and

digitalization.

There are some good comes that out of that pandemic, other than that people get to terms on how to work together and to collaborate, this is going to

be the acceleration of the digital industry going forward, and as you know, Siemens is the undisputed leader in the digital automation, so what we

believe is that digitalization in the industrial world is going to happen much faster as it used to be when we were before the crisis.

QUEST: Now, this is -- you're on to something here, because the way in which -- I mean, the mere fact, for example, that I am still broadcasting

from my living room and I'm likely to be doing so for the rest of the year, and the producers of this program are in their various homes, we have --

there has been an Industrial Revolution before our very eyes brought on by a pandemic and I wonder, from your point of view, how far this will go.

KAESER: Well, that makes, actually, two of us that we are wondering how far it is going to go, because it is not only about technology. It is also

about, you know, the lawmakers and the regulators on how we are going to accelerate digitalization.

How are we going to accelerate that people can work from home? How quickly can we come up with a meaningful set of rules that those people are being

supported? How can we make sure that data, which we are going to, you know, to exchange between the home office and the central server are going to be

safe?

But there is a lot also about protecting our data, about the free flow of data. It is a lot about 5G, which means real-time delivery of fast data

transactions. There's a lot of opportunity here, which we see in our engineers. They used to work at their labs, you know, to innovate the next

generation of products.

Today, they can do that from home if you have a fast connection, if you have a digital twin, which is the Industrial Revolution, so there is a lot

of opportunity, and the sense of urgency, which we were put into when the pandemic struck, it will help us to accelerate things much faster because a

lot of people said, well, we cannot do this, we cannot do that.

A lot of people said, we need to travel to see our Siemens people. Meeting Siemens people today, we do video conferencing. And it works. So it saves a

lot of money, it makes us much more effective and faster.

QUEST: Joe, if I had a dollar for every time I've had to think or say, this won't work, we can't do this, we've never done it this way before, but

we are now all doing it and the final question to you is, are you -- what more do you need to do at Siemens to position the company best to take

advantage? Or are you happy that the restructuring that's been done so far has gone sufficiently far?

KAESER: Well, what we have done in the last couple of years now is nothing but preparing the company for the strongest, the fastest, and the most

impressive transformation which we have seen in the industrial world and that's true for all three Siemens companies. Siemens Healthineers, Siemens

Energy, where we have the transformation from conventional to renewable, and then of course, Siemens Industrial, where we are going to accelerate

the digital twin, which we call Industry 4.0 or the Internet of Things.

[15:25:10]

KAESER: So, that actually is the beginning of a three-company approach where every company needs to be fast and accelerate the transformation,

first thing.

Second topic is that we actually now are going to go into a very decisive step. On July 9th, we are going to split the Siemens Company in Siemens

Energy and into Siemens Industrial. We have an extraordinary H.E.M. on July 9th and we do expect that the shareholders will fundamentally agree to that

split, which makes the Siemens Energy Company much faster and more focused.

And that's the beginning on how we are going to go about, as I said, the biggest transformation of all time in all three sectors. So, what does it

take? Well, first of all, take every complacency out of the way because there is no time to be complacent.

The second topic is we need to show our people the way so that they have a perspective of the future, that there is a life after COVID-19, so that

they know what's in for them.

The third thing is, it's about leadership. You know? You need to do what you say. And you need to go first if it comes to new territory and new

things and that's exactly what we're up to.

QUEST: All right. Joe, thank you. I appreciate it. Excellent to have you with us tonight on a full view on Siemens. Thank you, sir.

Now, in the United States, more states are rolling back plans to reopen their economies. You see it across the country.

California is shutting down bars in seven counties, including Los Angeles. Following similar steps in Texas and Florida, 36 states now reporting

rising numbers. Nick Watt is in Los Angeles to bring us up to date.

Nick, I was supposed to be going to Los Angeles next week on a filming trip, but the way things are going, things are not good there.

NICK WATT, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I'm not sure that trip is going to happen for you, Richard. Listen, case counts and hospitalizations are

climbing in this state. And that is why the Governor is taking these decisions, like closing down bars again here in Los Angeles and in six

other counties.

The bar issue is interesting across the U.S. We've got mayor -- the Mayor of El Paso today who was saying that, you know, a large chunk of the people

now testing positive in El Paso are younger, and he is blaming it on the bars.

We've got another bar up in Michigan where 80 people are connected positive tests -- 80 people who have tested positive are connected to just one bar.

So, you know, here in California, the issue, though, is this is a massive state. This is a massive economy of nearly 40 million people. And right

now, they say that we do have enough capacity in the hospitals so they're not really worried about that and they say that we have kind of lowered our

curve, but it's just going on and on.

And the number of people who are asking me, hang on a second, we did everything right. We closed early, we opened late. We've been wearing

masks, why are the cases still climbing? I don't have a good answer -- Richard.

QUEST: Well, I think we can -- yes. We can probably spend a good time over a drink coming up with that answer, but not in a bar. All right, thank you,

Nick. Good to see you sir. Keep well. Thank you.

One thing is now clear, tourists from Europe and including the United Kingdom will not be visiting the United States any time soon and vice

versa. So now, Europe has to come up with who will be visiting and a set of rules and regulations that make it possible. The tourists and the summer of

2020.

[15:31:54]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest as more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for you in just a moment. Barnes and Noble opens or plans to open its doors to readers

for the first time since the pandemic began, and the Chief Executive of Barnes and Noble on how things have changed, what people are reading, the

things that did and did not sell during the course of online, and what changes they will make?

And the U.S. deciding which countries will be allowed to visit the union. And once their borders reopen, the U.S. we're told, and pretty much

everybody knows, is not on that list, and the implications for that. All of that comes after I've updated you with the news headlines because this is

CNN. And on this network, the news always comes first.

China's taking serious action by placing 400,000 people into lockdown after a handful of coronavirus cases were found there, Beijing in Hubei Province.

Official said, earlier outbreak in the capital believe just spawned from a wholesale food market is basically contained.

A win today for abortion rights advocates in the United States, the Supreme Court narrowly blocked a law that tightly restricted access to abortions in

Louisiana. The critics said that almost a medically necessary and would have closed nearly every clinic that provides abortions in the state.

A separatist group said it's carried out an attack on the Pakistan Stock Exchange in Karachi. Four gunmen attempted to storm the facility on Monday,

killing at least five security guards. The government also killed and authorities say the attack is being investigated.

A French Quarter sentence the Former Prime Minister Francois Fillon to five years in prison, three of them suspended and have defined -- excuse me, he

was found guilty of misusing public funds by paying his wife and children big salaries for little or no work. His wife was also convicted. Together

they plan to appeal.

E.U. officials are finalizing the travel restrictions which countries will be allowed to enter the European Union and which ones will not. Diplomats

have given CNN a preliminary list, the 15 allowed in: including China, if they let tourists visit, they're notably excluded, of course, is the United

States where the infection rate is too high? Tom Jenkins is the CEO of European Tourism Association joins me from London. So, is that your

understanding too, of the other countries that will and will not be allowed within the bubble?

TOM JENKINS, CEO, EUROPEAN TOURISM: In broad terms, that's my understanding. The United States, unfortunately, for reasons which the news

has just been pointing out, is suffering a mild resurgence and this has disturbed the politicians in Europe. I think it's important to recognize

that the ban is currently in place. I mean, Europeans cannot go to America and Americans cannot visit Europe at the moment. The question is whether

they should ease this, this restriction. And it looks like it's going to be used for a few countries, but not the United States.

[15:35:05]

QUEST: The criteria for easing of course, was that there had to be equality, if you like, of standards, in terms of the rate of infection and

so on. And are you happy that sufficient countries are now involved in what one might call a mega Euro bubble, that Europe can have a half decent

summer season.

JENKINS: Europe will not have a half-decent summer season. It might have a quarter decent summer season. What the commission has done is really

stepped into the driving seat for the first time in three or four months and told the member states of the Schengen area that they really have to

relax their borders between themselves and they've also coordinated a response to the rest of the world and this is what was seen as a result of

this, the commission really taking control of the situation.

I have to say that the moment, this is not a good moment for international travel, even if there were no restrictions in place. There's not much

demand out there. And the sad thing is, is that the market for, the market for European-America is probably worth about $60 billion for Europe. And

the market for America in Europe is worth about $50 billion, and this is 110-billion-dollar business, which is currently going west. And I even if

they relaxed restrictions, we'd be very lucky to see a quarter of that business by the end of the year.

QUEST: Tom, looking at the guidelines that are being introduced, the Tall Care Guidelines, a lot of them are primarily what will my dog give you say,

you know, the sort of stuff we've had to do all along frequent washing of hands, wearing of masks, health declaration forms on arrival. But, but, but

are you concerned that once people get on holiday, as we've seen here in the United States, all that good wishes and well-being goes out the window,

and you have people on beaches in bars and cafes, to Verners and the like, and the rate of infection goes up again.

JENKINS: Well, I think that the, the main risk, frankly, in travel and as any travel, not international travel, I think, through ordinary. The

international travel is being, is being too detailed as being particularly pernicious. Any travel contains risks. Of course, people have to be

responsible. I think arguably, the biggest risk is at the transport nodes at the airports on the aircraft. But in broad terms, I think people have to

start enjoying themselves and I think the infection rate from these areas is not that high. I don't think you'll find that the infection rate that's

climbing at the moment is due to people enjoying themselves. I think it's due to other factors (INAUDIBLE).

QUEST: But I guess the, the issue here is how far tour operators, and destinations, and hotels are going to be enforcing. Yes, and that is the

word, forcing, these social restrictions and guidelines, rather than looking the other way, as there have been in say, many, many places in the

U.S. I mean, look, you saw the pictures from Bournemouth at the weekend, I think it was in the U.K. One nice weekend, and it all goes up in the air.

JENKINS: But the answer there, that isn't -- I feel like almost, you made me feel like a (INAUDIBLE) manufacturer here. I don't think -- I do think

tour operators were responsible for scenes in Bournemouth. I think you'll find that if tour operators are involved, and the ones I represent tend to

be slightly more culturally-orientated than the people, you take people to beaches, but I think if I, ultimately, there is an equation there, people

will sit there and decide whether the risk is worth the experience. And if they think the word risk is worth the experience, well go and do things.

And trying to ban them is pretty tough, and I think you're going to find the people who are most at risk and least likely to behave like that.

QUEST: Tom, well, as the summer progresses, we shall talk more, because this is one that --

JENKINS: I'm happy to be your hostage. Thank you.

QUEST: Thank you, Tom. Joining me. And just before we get to a break, you might notice is once again, like I've said several times on this program,

that you do find that the long tail of coronavirus is you do, it's like a tornado that goes through the body. And these run a rack of damage and

that's occasionally you'll see me cough my way through things but it's nothing to be concerned about as the doctors have told me.

[15:40:04]

As we continue, Brookstone is making major changes on the bookstores as well. The CEO of Barnes and Noble is here on the future of book browsing

and buying, in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: Mexico is easing the restrictions as that company -- as the country now starts to reopen. However, there will be those for whom, the long shut

down, and the very serious restrictions all became too much -- they won't reopen at all. CNN's Matt Rivers is in Mexico City.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MATT RIVES: Lines out the door usually mean a business is thriving, except this one the A Traves del Espejo bookstore in Mexico City is dying. Owner,

Silva Hernandez says, the truth is, we're really sad. Her mom first opened the shop back in 95. And for 25 years, it's survived earthquakes and

recessions and Amazon Kindles, but the pandemic proved too much and the government shut down the economy.

"It's a bookstore," she says, "we don't make a lot of money, normally, then we had to close which means we couldn't pay rent, so the owner asked us to

leave." Her story is as tragic as anything you'd find on her shelves but amongst small business in this city, it is a familiar narrative.

One local Chamber of Commerce estimates of the roughly 400,000 small businesses here some 40 percent won't survive, forcing more than 1 million

people out of a job. A short walk from the bookstore, keeping people employed and the neighborhood well fed has turned into a mantra of sorts

that at Expendio de Maiz. They've managed to stay open during the crisis just.

Chef Ana Gonzalez says I see so many places closed and I just feel fortunate I still have work right now. Sales are way down and they've all

taken big pay cuts and even as the economy is starting to reopen, they're not sure what that looks like. "Day by day people have less money," says

Co-Owner Jesus Turnes, even if they open everything if there's no demand, it won't matter. This year is rough. But they know it's rough for everyone

and good food helps. So, they're determined to try and see it through.

A good book can also help which is why Silva slashed prices and invited people in one last time. She says, the closing doesn't feel real. "I am

happy to see so many people coming to say goodbye," she says, "it's a nice tribute because my mom loved for books to be cheap and accessible to

everyone." Her mom's chosen name for the shop: A Traves del Espejo, means "through the looking glass," a literary reference to an imagined world.

It's an apt name these days with the real world so different than it was before. Matt Rivers, CNN, Mexico City.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[15:45:19]

QUEST: In Europe, gas providers are turning to green hydrogen to power factories and fuel vehicles. Here's John Defterios with this One Global

Energy Challenge.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN DEFTERIOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Here at the Oragiallo Pasta Factory near Naples, 50 years of Italian culinary tradition meets innovation. Earlier

this year, these machines grinding out (INAUDIBLE) and spaghetti were powered by a new fuel -- hydrogen mixed with natural gas. A cutting-edge

experiment in Europe that showcases green hydrogen as a clean energy source of the future.

MARCO ALVERA, CEO, SNAM: This is happening, and it's happening faster than we all expected.

DEFTERIOS: Mixing hydrogen and industrial production is a trial being taken by one of Europe's largest gas providers now. There is growing pressure

from energy companies to change their business strategies and tackle climate change. Snam believes it might have the answer. By introducing just

10 percent of hydrogen into its existing gas network, the company believes CO2 emissions will be reduced by five million tons annually. And it's

betting that within three decades, green hydrogen will provide a quarter of Italy's energy.

ALVERA: We think it will get to between three and five percent in 2030, and we see it getting up to 25 percent by 2050. We see cost allowing for this

revolution to happen without really much need for subsidies or taxes. And so, it's a way to fuel the Green Deal.

DEFTERIOS: Producing green hydrogen from renewables remains expensive. The electricity produced by solar panels and wind turbines splits water into

hydrogen and oxygen through electrolysis. The hydrogen then flows to factories and service stations, it can power industrial production, fuel

vehicles or be stored for future use. But amid greater public demand for countries to feature clean energy, and any coronavirus recovery packages,

several governments are announcing green hydrogen projects as part of economic stimulus plans.

MORRY MARKOWITZ, HYDROGEN AND FUEL CELLS PROGRAM, DOE: There's a greater recognition that we need to do something now, we cannot wait. Costs are

coming down and they're coming down dramatically. While also consumers are looking for more greener products and that together is creating that bad

advantage that we hadn't seen in the past.

DEFTERIOS: With cost fall in and experiments like here the Oragiallo Pasta Factory, green hydrogen could become a major player in the global energy

system. John Defterios, CNN.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:50:46]

QUEST: We're talking about books this evening, a new chapter for book shops on both sides of the Atlantic as they get ready to reopen. Barnes and

Noble, and Waterstones both owned by Elliott Advisors are taking various measures to keep customers safe, it's the usual ones of social distancing

workers, sanitizing stations, but quarantining, touched books. Jim Jones is the CEO of Barnes and Noble and Managing Director Waterstones joins me from

London via Skype. James, I find this fascinating, the, the quarantining of touched books, how can you do that -- I mean, I know you can do it

physically, but how do you make it work practically?

JIM JONES, CEO, BARNS AND NOBLE: I think the reality is actually with books. It is very easy, partly because our stores are not as busy as other

people. I mean, we're not like a supermarket or a food retailer -- I mean with crowds of people. Book buyers are you know, at this time of year

there, it's a relatively quiet place and they come into our stores and if they do pick up a book and choose not to buy it, we just asked them to put

it down on a trolley. The trolley is, when they get full, we just wheel them into the back and leave them there for a few days. I mean, it, it

sounds as though it's sort of complicated it frankly, couldn't be any simpler.

QUEST: No, but you'll go through a lot of books. I mean, if it's, if it's a popular book that you've picked up, looked at, and then put by, but I

understand what you're saying. Essentially, though, what I'm also interested the sorts of books people bought online, versus the sorts of

books that just simply didn't move.

JONES: Online, it was fascinating. I mean, people were buying, really, the obvious books, the classics, they were reading the big fat books, the

books, clearly that they've always intended to read, and books they knew about. So, it was we looked at the bestsellers, and we knew every single

book, and now that we've got our stores reopened, we can see again, a more normal bestseller lists where we're constantly surprised by what by what

appears. It's the new books. It's the book that got the great review. It's the person who went on radio. And those are the books that people discover

in bookstores, but somehow don't seem to be able to find when they're browsing online.

QUEST: And I have complete failure. Because I didn't manage to read the Jane Austen that I'd set my heart and I was determined I was going to take

the advantage of reading during the pandemic. I think I'm not alone.

JONES: Well, perhaps, but you were probably still hard at work. I think it's an astonishing amount of reading that clearly has gone on and that's,

you know, be one of the great positives of, or one of the few positives of this period. Books have I think, demonstrated their worth both to

entertain, to amuse and to educate, and we've seen extraordinary demand online.

QUEST: Jim, just before we finish in also, we always like to ask just how's the business doing, if you like? And how -- when we look at the business

and the ability. You know, obviously, there have been numerous government health schemes one way and the other. But do you come out of this pandemic

with the company fundamentally? The foundations, OK?

JONES: I think we are challenged, it's clearly not easy when all of your shops are closed. In the United States with Barnes and Noble we use that

time very productively. We, we had our core booksellers there, working away and they, they tied it up and actually removed all of the furniture within

our stores, what we call relayed them. So, if you go back into a Barnes and Noble, you're likely to find a completely transformed store. So, that was a

positive.

I think my biggest worry is that we will come -- we will reopen onto high streets and into shopping malls and the like, where many of our neighbors

would have fared less well, and we require our neighbors, we, you know, people shop not just for the single store but for the overall enjoyment to

being in a community environment. And if too many other retailers have disappeared, that will be tragic and will actually impact us as well. No,

it has not been easy but, but we've come out of it much, much less scathed than I think many other retailers.

[15:55:25]

QUEST: One book I should read -- if there's one book that I should read before the end of the year, which one is it?

JONES: Well, I've just finished "Parallel Lives" by Phyllis Rose, which was is a portrait of five marriages. And as all of us or many of us, spent so

much more time at home, and perhaps we're examining our marriages more closely, it's a wonderful portrait, and I enjoyed it greatly and in the

very good humor of our own household. I found it -- I thoroughly recommend it. Phyllis Rose, "Parallel Lives."

QUEST: I shall -- here's the promise, because we always do a promise: I will read that book, and the reason I'll read it particularly, is because

my own wedding had to be postponed. My own marriage had to be postponed because of COVID. So, as Chris and I plan for next year, or sometime at

some point, that will be a book I'll take with me. James, it's great to have you with us. I appreciate it so much. Let's talk again.

JONES: Thanks very much!

QUEST: And the markets. Going to show you very quickly where the markets are, as I love you and leave you for tonight. Good strong day. Best of the

day. Look at that, I do believe, we are at the best of the day. Gain of nearly two percent. A lot of it is bowing, optimism? Nah, not so much. Some

special factors have really pushed the market up today. And you see that with Boeing because of the NASDAQ versus the Dow.

That is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, as always -- feeble -- I hope

it's profitable.

END

END