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Quest Means Business
Plane Skids Off Runway In India, Killing At Least 16; Trump Signs Order Banning TikTok And WeChat In 45 Days; Hezbollah Chief Denies Any Involvement In Tuesday's Port of Beirut Explosion. Aired 3-4p ET
Aired August 07, 2020 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[15:01:09]
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.
ZAIN ASHER, CNN HOST: Hello, I'm Zain Asher in New York. Welcome to CNN's special breaking news coverage.
We are following two stories for you, the deadly plane crash in India, and the aftermath of a devastating explosion in Beirut. We will take you to
Lebanon in just a moment. But first, some breaking news out of India for you.
At least 16 people have been killed after a passenger jet skidded off a runway and broke into two in the southwest state of Kerala, and officials
now say the rescue operations at the scene are complete. The Air India Express Jet was attempting to land at the airport in heavy rain with 190
people on board.
The flight originated in Dubai and was repatriating Indian citizens stranded abroad by the coronavirus pandemic.
CNN's Vedika Sud is following the developments from New Delhi. So, Vedika, just walk us through what we know at this point. Update us on the rescue
operations so far, which are now complete it sounds like.
VEDIKA SUD, CNN PRODUCER: Absolutely. They have now been completed. It took three and a half hours for the rescue operations that were taken at
about 7:45 or a bit later because this mishap took place at 7:41 India time.
Now, what we do know is -- and you are right when you say that this was a repatriation flight. Now what India has been doing over the last few months
is creating an air bubble or a travel corridor with a few countries. There's been a mutual understanding between them to bring Indians who have
been stuck abroad due to COVID-19, so this was one such aircraft that was landing on a tabletop runway in Kozhikode in Southern India in the state of
Kerala.
And that's when, because of the heavy rainfall and low visibility that this aircraft skidded off the runway, and according to the Civil Aviation
Ministry, it actually plunged 35 feet down into a valley.
So that's what we do know about really happened. The rescue operations are over. Now the focus of course is at the hospitals and the medical treatment
that could be given to these passengers. There were about 190 people on board, including the crew, 10 infants as well.
We also do know that over 45 of these passengers are critically injured, so we are awaiting news on them as well at this point in time. Now, also, the
plane broke into two after it fell into the valley. There is a lot of debris around the runway right now.
Also, investigation teams will be leaving shortly for Kozhikode to understand what really caused this mishap -- Zain.
ASHER: Vedika, you mentioned that attention right now is going to turn to the hospitals. What sort of injuries do we know the people sustained? I
understand there are a number of people as you mentioned who are in critical condition right now.
SUD: Well, most of them would be because of the plunge that the aircraft took into the valley. It was fortunate for all of these passengers and crew
members that were involved, Zain, because the fact that this plane did not catch fire.
Can you even imagine the casualties we would be talking about if that took place? So that's something that the government has underscored. These
people are fortunate enough that during landing or when the aircraft took that plunge 35 feet down that this aircraft didn't catch fire.
Kerala is known really well for its healthcare system. In fact, it is one of the best in India. So, as far as medical attention to these people is
concerned, hopefully they would get the right treatment within the right time. But like I said, over 40 people still critically injured. We are
awaiting word on how they are faring as of now -- Zain.
ASHER: Forty people still critically injured. Vedika Sud live for us there. Thank you so much.
The plane involved appeared to be a Boeing 737-800. Keep in mind, this is a different model from the 737 MAX which was involved in two fatal crashes
last year.
[15:05:10]
ASHER: Air India Express operates an entire fleet of 737-800 NGs according to its website. The company calls itself India's first budget international
airline.
Richard Quest joins us live now. So, Richard, when you think about the damage here, the fact that this plane split in two, broke into pieces upon
impact. Vedika Sud was just saying that passengers are of course, very fortunate this plane didn't catch fire, but the fact that it broke into two
what does that tell us about the nature of this crash?
RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR-AT-LARGE: Well, you would expect the plane to break apart if it runs off the runway and then goes down a ravine
in the sense that the issue here is why did it -- why was it unable to stop before the end of the runway?
And obviously, we know it was heavy weather, the rain. Therefore, the runway, the phrase we use is contaminated, and depending on the approach
speed, the approach height -- all of these factors and variables will be looked into because the pilot has to come in at exactly the right altitude
at exactly the right speed if he is going to stop in time before the end of the runway.
And that also means, Zain, touching down on the runway in the landing zone. If he or she lands too late, then it is going to be a much harder braking
to stop before the end of the runway, and if the runway is contaminated, as it was here, that makes it more difficult.
So, the investigators will be looking at firstly what were the decisions being taken by the pilot flying, in terms of speed, approach, auto
throttle, reverse thrusters, all those sorts of things that the 737 has. Then they will be looking at the runway itself.
Was the runway in some way defective? Had the maintenance been done? Was that an issue? And finally, Zain, the airport. You have got to ask yourself
-- and if you look at this particular airport and this runway, runway 1028, there have been criticisms in the past about what's known as the runoff
zone or the runway safety area right at the end, which is supposed to be designed to stop any plane that's landed from rolling off too far.
ASHER: So the runway is going to be key in the investigation. Visibility just in terms of weather conditions. And as you mentioned, the speed in
terms of how the plane approached, and the height at which it approached as well.
QUEST: We know that the plane did a go-around. The pilot approached, clearly decided for whatever reason, we don't know that, to -- they weren't
comfortable, he or she wasn't comfortable then took the plane back in the air.
They then did a big loop, came around a big loop and then approached from the opposite direction. That could be very telling because now you are
talking about landing with the wind as opposed to against the wind.
If you land against the wind, then it is much easier to stop. If you land with the wind, it is much more difficult to stop. All these things will be
looked at as we get more details of the exact nature this landing.
But I don't think that the airport is going to get away with it in the sense of -- the runway is supposed to be designed so that if planes
overshoot, there is a type of collapsing concrete gravel at the end that the plane goes into and sinks down, and that's designed specifically to
stop the aircraft from running off a ravine, particularly in a dangerous scenario where you have a tabletop mountain like this.
ASHER: Right. So as you mentioned, it really will be -- one of the focuses will really be the airport and the quality of the runway, as you say.
Richard Quest live for us there.
QUEST: I think the first focus here, Zain, is going to be the pilot. The pilot, and the setup, and the information about whether the pilot had
received, how he or she interpreted it, and how they configured the aircraft for landing.
Flaps, slats, speed, auto throttle, the reverse thrust -- all those sorts of things. And then ultimately, did it land too fast.
ASHER: Richard Quest live for us there. Thank so much.
The clock is ticking on the future of TikTok and WeChat. President Donald Trump giving the companies 45 days to find a new owner or be banned from
the U.S. That story next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:11:57]
ASHER: An update on our breaking news, the deadly crash in Southwest India. Officials say evacuations are finished at the crash site of an Air
India Express flight that attempted to land during heavy rain. The passenger jet skidded off a razed runway and then broke into two.
Now, at least 16 people are confirmed dead including both of the flight's pilots. The flight was repatriating Indian citizens stranded in Dubai
because of the coronavirus pandemic, 190 people were on board.
Let's turn now to Beirut, Hezbollah is denying any involvement into that explosion at the Port of Beirut. The group's leader, Hassan Nasrallah
dismissed accusations that the organization stored weapons there. He added that a failure to fully investigate the disaster would prove Lebanon's
ruling class including him was incapable of running the country.
Ben Wedeman joins us live now from Beirut.
So, Ben, I want to start with some comments we got from the Lebanese President, Michel Aoun. He says that there are two possible causes of this
explosion.
Number one, negligence; number two, external intervention by a missile or a bomb. What evidence is there that this was the work of a bomb -- Ben.
BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: At this point, none. I mean, certainly, Lebanon being Lebanon and where it is in the Middle
East, one's first assumption in an event like this is that perhaps that there is some sort of belligerent action involved.
But in this case, beyond fake news and tampered video, there is no indication that foul play played a part. Now, there have been suggestions
there should be an international investigation to get to the bottom of this fire. But, we did hear President Michel Aoun reject that call.
And so, it is going to be down to the Lebanese authorities, in theory, to conduct this investigation. We understand that the Head of Customs, after
several hours of interrogation, has been arrested. Now, he is also the man who several times alerted the judiciary that something needed to be done
about the 2,750 metric tons of ammonium nitrate that supposedly was the cause of this blast.
And when it comes into investigations into high-profile assassinations and whatnot, Lebanon, Zain, does not have a very good history going back to
many decades, but I can just reel off a few high-profile assassinations where the real killers, the ones behind the people perhaps that pulled the
trigger never were brought to justice.
There was the 1982 assassination of Bashir Jamail, the President-elect at the time; 1987, Rashid Karami, the Prime Minister who was killed when a
bomb was put on his helicopter; 1989, Rene Moawad, the President of Lebanon killed while in his car here in Beirut by a bomb. No one ever got to the
bottom of that.
Rafik Al Hariri, former Prime Minister of Lebanon on February 14th, 2005 -- killed. There is an international investigation into his murder, and in
fact today, that investigation carried out by the Special Tribunal for Lebanon was supposed to come out with its verdict, but it didn't.
[15:15:39]
WEDEMAN: And so whether any sort of investigation, international, Lebanese, or otherwise, will get to the bottom of Tuesday's massive
explosion is anybody's guess.
ASHER: All right, so Ben, so clearly people have good reason not to be hopeful, based on what you are saying, and the list of examples of
assassinations that you just reeled off to me, but do you think that this time might be different at least because of just the sheer amount of
international attention and pressure this time?
WEDEMAN: Certainly, the anger you hear and see on the street is deep and intense. And certainly people more than ever want to see an end to this
endless cycle of corruption and inaction and decay and decline that we've seen with the economy in free fall, the local currency has lost much of its
value, prices have gone through the roof for ordinary Lebanese.
But we've seen before -- October 17th of last year, massive street demonstrations going on for weeks, people chanting (speaking in foreign
language), which is Arabic for everybody -- meaning "everybody out." They never left.
And going back to February 2005, in the aftermath the assassination of the former Prime Minister Rafik Al Hariri, the so-called Cedar Revolution. It
did manage to pressure the Syrians to pull out of Lebanon. But in terms of changing the basic political system of this country, which is based upon
the sectarian division of political power, that has not changed in decades. Perhaps it will this time, but it's hard to say for certain.
ASHER: Either way, it is certainly a tall order. Ben Wedeman live for us there. Thank you so much.
There are so many urgent concerns in Beirut right now from providing food and shelter to the displaced to making sure overwhelmed hospitals aren't
forced to turn people away. But as our Arwa Damon reports, the families of those still missing are dealing with the most excruciating situation of
all.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Could there be anyone left alive? It's a hope dozens of family members of the
missing cling to. Knowing that it is unlikely, but not wanting to accept that their loved one could be gone.
Others are laid to rest. Lives, utterly shattered in the trail of destruction by Tuesday's explosion in Lebanon's capital city. Those who
survived are trying to pick up the pieces.
Glass and debris crunch below the feet of an army of volunteers, stepping in where the government is not, attempting to clear the rubble of billions
of dollars of damage.
They urge each other on, but for others, it's all just too much.
The intensity of the emotional rollercoaster that is being Lebanese, has left them hollow shells.
"What should we feel?" Asks one resident, "You can't feel anything in Lebanon, there's nothing to be sad about it anymore," he says.
As the cleanup continues, a rage grows across the country at how a new disaster could happen, still without any clear explanation or apology.
As French President Emmanuel Macron toured the wreckage, the first foreign leader to set foot here, he was surrounded by hundreds of Lebanese calling
for revolution, urging him, begging him do something. He vowed that France would stand with the Lebanese people, but cautioned its leaders.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
EMMANUEL MACRON, FRENCH PRESIDENT (through translator): The requirement of a friend in times of need is to rush to scene when times are hard, but not
to hand out blank checks to assist them, not trusted by the people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DAMON (voice over): From outside and inside the country, demands for answers grow louder, as calls emerge for an independent probe into the
explosion. This is not just about accountability or how the country is going to rebuild emotionally and physically. It's about how it is going to
find its soul.
Arwa Damon, CNN, Beirut.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ASHER: Lama Fakih is the Beirut Office Director for Human Rights Watch. She is there now and joins us via Skype. Lama, thank you so much for being
with us. I am not sure if you heard, but my correspondent, Ben Wedeman was just saying that, you know, Lebanon doesn't exactly have the best track
record when it comes to investigating foul play. Do you have any feeling, though, that perhaps this time is different, that maybe this time we might
just get a sliver of transparency?
[15:20:27]
LAMA FAKIH, BEIRUT OFFICE DIRECTOR, HUMAN RIGHTS WATCH: The public has no confidence in the Lebanese government's ability to investigate this tragic
explosion, which took over 150 lives on Tuesday.
We have a legacy of impunity in Lebanon. We know from our work at Human Rights Watch that human rights violations, that war crimes have
continuously gone unpunished in Lebanon, and that's why Humans Rights Watch has made a call for an international investigation into the events that led
to the explosion on Tuesday.
ASHER: The Lebanese President, Michel Aoun has rejected calls for an international investigation. He says that simply, there is not going to be
one at this point, so without that, can there be any accountability, really, in this investigation?
FAKIH: I think there is still room for the international community to play a role in trying to encourage the Lebanese government to have an
international investigation and the importance of that investigation.
There -- it needs to be more transparency about the arrests that are taking place, and the concern of course is that low-level officials will be
brought in, arrested, potentially tried and convicted. But those that are truly responsible for this atrocity are not going to be held accountable.
So we would say to President Aoun that Lebanon should open its doors to independent expert investigators who can clearly set the record straight
about what happened on Tuesday.
ASHER: Approximately 300,000 people are going to be displaced because of this explosion. What should the Lebanese government do to make sure those
people at least have their basic needs met in the interim?
FAKIH: That's right. So we have seen failings from the Lebanese government not only in allowing this incident to occur, but in the aftermath of the
incident.
Even today and yesterday, as cleanup has started across the city, you can see residents pouring out to support their neighbors. But the government is
absent. We don't know initiatives by the government to ensure that people can return to their homes, that people that have lost their homes have
adequate shelter before they can rebuild.
We have not seen promises for adequate, you know, compensation for individuals who have lost their property, their homes and their businesses,
and this is all at a time when Lebanon is reeling from an entrenched economic crisis.
ASHER: So without, you know, Lebanon stepping in and helping those people, what happens to them in the meantime?
FAKIH: We are seeing that Lebanese are relying on one another. There have been a number of grassroots initiatives, civil society initiatives, just
regular citizens coming out of the woodwork to support one another. But it's not going to be enough.
And there will be a donor conference and additional pledges that are made to support the Lebanese in light of the events on Tuesday, and we are
urging donor states to look for ways to ensure that their funding is actually going to the individuals that are providing services on the ground
and not being funneled through the government.
And again, there is just a complete lack of trust in the government's ability to respond to people's needs in the aftermath of this tragedy. We
have seen that the government has failed to provide critical information to individuals about how the keep themselves safe and healthy in light of this
massive seismic explosion, and we have seen a complete absence of a willingness to take responsibility, just completely, you know, passing the
blame, you know, from one individual to the next.
This is not what Lebanon needs in order to recover from this tragedy. We need real, sound leadership, and that starts with a transparent
investigation into what transpired that led to this tragedy and ensuring that those people are held responsible.
ASHER: Lama Fakih, live for us. Thank you so much.
FAKIH: Thank you.
ASHER: Tensions between the U.S. and China have been turned up another notch. President Donald Trump has moved to ban TikTok and WeChat from
operating in the U.S. if they are not sold by their Chinese parent companies in about 45 days.
China's Ministry of Foreign Affairs has slammed the decision saying the U.S. is using its power to oppress non-American businesses. Donie
O'Sullivan joins us live now.
So, when you think about WeChat specifically, I mean, there is not really the equivalent in the U.S. In China, people use WeChat for absolutely
everything. They use it to communicate. They use it to hail taxis. They use it to make transactions. This ban by the U.S., how much of a blow is it, do
you think, to Tencent?
[15:25:38]
DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN BUSINESS REPORTER: Yes, I mean, you know, there are a lot of WeChat users here in the U.S., particularly among Chinese expats
and Asian-Americans. But you know, this sort of tit-for-tat over TikTok, really, China does not have the moral high ground here.
They ban most American social media companies from operating in China under Beijing's strict censorship laws. But, certainly, the Executive Orders that
Trump signed on Thursday night here, it's certainly an unprecedented move and posture from the United States when it comes to the internet.
And I think it could mark the beginnings basically of an online Cold War. Obviously, this story, Zain is much more than about one or two Chinese
apps. It really is about the future of the internet and services all of us use every day, whether directly or indirectly.
ASHER: Donie O'Sullivan live for us there. Thank you so much.
The U.S. Intelligence Community's top election official has just issued a statement outlining foreign attempts to undermine the country's
presidential vote in November. It outlines alleged activity by China, Russia and Iran.
The report says that China prefers that the President -- the current President Donald Trump does not win reelection, while Russia is apparently
working to undermine his Democratic rival, Joe Biden.
Evan Perez joins us live now. So the international community, Evan is basically saying that there are now more attempts, in fact there was in
2016 to undermine the U.S. election. What more do we know?
EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR U.S. JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Zain, while this is an extraordinary statement from Bill E Evanina who is the top official
in the Intelligence Community trying to help thwart the efforts of foreign countries and their efforts to interfere in the 2020 election. This is
essentially an assessment of what we are seeing so far.
We will go through the three countries that they have mentioned in this assessment. The first one being China, and according to this Intelligence
assessment, China prefers that President Trump, whom Beijing sees as unpredictable, does not win reelection. The Chinese have been expanding
their influence efforts, this assessment says, ahead of the November 2020 elections to shape the policy environment in the United States, pressure
political figures it views as opposed to China's interest and deflect and counter criticism of China.
As far as the Russians are concerned, according to Bill Evanina, the top Intelligence official dealing with this issue, he says that Russia is using
a range of measures to primarily denigrate former Vice President Biden and what it sees as an anti-Russia establishment, and of course, this is
consistent with what the U.S. Intelligence community says the Russians were up to back in 2016 when they were trying to elect Donald Trump, trying to
aid Donald Trump's election and trying to hurt Hillary Clinton's campaign.
Interestingly, in this assessment, the Intelligence community also mentions Ukrainian Parliamentarian by the name of Andrii Derkach who has been
spreading anti-Biden propaganda, sharing what he says were leaked phone calls and trying to propel this idea that Joe Biden was part of some
corruption back during the Obama administration. This is being identified as part of the Russian effort to undermine Joe Biden's campaign.
As far as the Iranians are concerned, Zain, the Intelligence assessment says that the Iranians are simply trying to sow discord, divide Americans
ahead of the November election.
This is again a very extraordinary statement to be made publicly just a couple months away before the votes are cast here in the United States.
ASHER: Yes, less than a hundred days to go. Evan Perez live for us. Thank so much.
PEREZ: Sure.
ASHER: All right, in a moment, back to our breaking news from India, more than a dozen people are dead after a plane skidded off the runway. We will
speak to our aviation expert on this after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:31:58]
ASHER: All right, an update on our breaking news for you. Rescue operations after a plane crash in India are now over. At least 16 people were killed
including both pilots. An Air India Express jet skidded off the runway while attempting to land at the airport in Kozhikode and broke into two.
The flight began in Dubai and was bringing home Indian citizens stranded abroad by the COVID-19 pandemic. We are joined now on the phone from New
Delhi by Hardeep Singh Puri. He's India's Civil Aviation Minister. Hardeep, thank you so much for joining us.
So, what -- it is extremely difficult and tragic time. Just walk us through the rescue operation so far. I understand that they have been completed.
What is going to be key in this investigation in terms of figuring out why this crash occurred?
HARDEEP SINGH PURI, CIVIL AVIATION MINISTER OF INDIA (via telephone): Well, as you said the rescue operations are now complete. The flight came in
around 7:30 p.m. Indian Standard Time. It was a rescue and an evacuation flight as part of the Vande Bharat rescue operation which we are doing for
Indian nationals who are stranded in different countries.
The flight had 190 passengers according to the manifest. Kozhikode is a tabletop airport. The weather conditions were not good. The pilots had
tried to land earlier and then did a turn-around. The aircraft would not be brought to a halt by the end of the runway and there's a 35-feet drop in a
gorge.
Fortunately, the plane did not catch fire because that would have made the rescue operation just that much more difficult. The latest figures we have
is that 16 passengers on board including the two --
ASHER: Hardeep, can you still hear me? Hardeep, can you still hear me?
All right, it looks as though we lost Hardeep Singh Puri, India's Civil Aviation Minister joining us on the phone to give us an update. 16 people
dead from this plane crash, dozens of people wounded. He mentioned that visibility, weather certainly played a role in this. We'll try and get him
back in the next sort of 25 minutes of the show.
Right now, Mary Schiavo joins me live now. She's a former Inspector General for the U.S. Department of Transport. Mary, I'm not sure if you were able
to hear what the India's Civil Aviation is actually saying there but he did touch on an important factor and that is because of the monsoon and the
heavy rains that certainly made visibility that much harder.
My question to you is, would the -- would these be the sorts of weather conditions that the pilot would have had a significant amount of experience
flying in or not?
[15:35:11]
MARY SCHIAVO, CNN AVIATION ANALYST (via Skype): Most likely. I mean, these are recurring weather conditions in India and worldwide and pilots are
trained. The pilots are with modern aircraft like the Boeing 737 800.
And they have onboard weather radar, so you can see the storm systems as they move across the field. Obviously, you get up to date weather briefings
from the tower and that's required that they do that. But the onboard weather radar does give you a clear indication.
However, accidents including runway excursions and overruns are usually caused by more than one thing, weather is a factor but can also be that
your speed, your decision point. At what point did they have the ability to make a decision to go around? Do they have the weather information? Did
they have a current weather radar reading in front of them? Was the runway grooved to increase the traction? Did they deploy all the equipment?
For example, these boilers which are usually automatically deployed, but they have to be set and whether arrestor systems at the end of the runway,
the EMAS System, the Emergency Materials Arrestor System, which is literally like sand at the end of the runway to help you stop.
So, there are many, many factors that the minister in the investigators will be looking at. And hopefully we'll be able to glean some lessons and
improve aviation.
ASHER: All right and -- all right. Mary Schiavo, can you stand by for us? We do appear to have the Minister of Aviation back Hardeep Singh Puri.
Hardeep, but looks like the line cut off there.
So you were talking to us about visibility about monsoon concerns in terms of the weather with both of those pilots.
Update us on the conditions of those who have been taken to the hospital. I understand that there are over 40 people who are now in critical condition
SINGH PURI: Well, the figure I have back then is that we have 16 fatalities and 170 people in hospital. You know, they have suffered injuries in
varying degrees. I don't have the exact number of serious injuries but as we speak, we are getting reports in. As I said, they are all receiving
medical treatment in a government hospital and in different private hospitals in the area.
And in a -- in an hour's time, we will have our investigating team which will inquire into the causes of this tragic occurrence in the air. Another
team will be going out at five in the morning. This time its 1:30 in the morning in India, the flight takes off in another half an hour, the first
flight, followed by another one at 5:00 a.m.
This will include people, representatives of Air India, the Airports Authority and the Aircraft Accident Investigating Bureau. And I'm sure that
we will get to know what the precise reasons were for this tragic occurrence so that the appropriate lessons can be learned and to prevent
such occurrences from ever recurring again.
The rescue operations have been completed, all the people who are in the aircraft have been taken to hospitals and they are receiving medical
treatment. Even as we speak, the -- I mentioned that the weather conditions were not good. This is the monsoon season with rain. And the pilot had
attempted a landing earlier, which he had to then do a turn-around and then this tragedy occurred.
This is as I mentioned earlier, maybe you lost the line then. This is a tabletop airport and that poses a challenge for the pilots, but because of
the weather conditions, I think this was exacerbated. But we will get to know the exact causes for this mishap when the inquiry gets underway in a
few hours' time.
ASHER: And a key factor in terms of determining the cause will be the black box says. How soon do you think authorities will be able to download the
information in both of the black boxes and share it with people around the world who, no doubt, want to get to the bottom of this as well?
SINGH PURI: No, absolutely. I have no doubt that they will be able to access these and the results of the inquiry will definitely be processed,
the facts will be processed and the report will definitely be available.
ASHER: So those pilots likely would have had a significant amount -- well, you know, you can go into this. A significant amount of experience in terms
of flying in these types of conditions.
[15:40:13]
ASHER: How much of experience would they have had in these weather conditions, heavy rains, monsoon especially when it comes to landing in a
tabletop runway?
SINGH PURI: Well, both the pilots were extremely experienced. In fact, the lead pilot is a former Air Force officer. He was -- you know, a highly
experienced and very well trained professional. And Indian pilots are used to, accustom to landing in these kinds of weather conditions. I would not
want to speculate as to what precisely happened on this occasion, but as I mentioned, the inquiry will be able to get down to determining the precise
causes. I have no doubt on that.
ASHER: And in terms of the wreckage, how important will the debris and the actual plane and what's left of it, the wreckage? How important will that
be in terms of the investigation as well?
SINGH PURI: Well, I think all factors become relevant and material. And you know, the -- it broke at the fuselage and the plane broke into two under a
pieces, the debris, all that will be analyzed along with the black boxes.
And I'm sure that the investigators who are highly experienced individuals in this will be able to determine the precise causes in order to be able to
ensure that the appropriate lessons are learned.
The cockpit voice recorder, CVR and the digital flight data recorder will be retrieved by the investigation team. And I'm sure that in the coming few
hours, we will get a much better picture of what precisely happened.
ASHER: And in terms of the heavy rains and the monsoon, conditions, how much of that impact -- I understand that the rescue operations have been
completed for the time being, but how much did that actually impact the rescue operation itself the fact that the weather was so bad?
SINGH PURI: Well, you know, we got to this unfortunate incident took place around 7:30 Indian Time, within a few minutes as we got the information,
teams from the NDRF, the Disaster Rescue Force and all concerned agencies, the local authorities, the DDC Airports Authority people, the fire brigade
when they reached the spot, we were -- it was fortunate that the plane did not catch fire. And I'm sure the pilots took preventive action on that,
maybe shut off the engine and they were able to avert and prevent a much larger tragedy, which would have unfolded if the aircraft had caught fire.
The rescue operation took a few hours. And as I said, they were able to extract everyone from the aircraft so that everyone is accounted for. Over
about 170 persons were rushed to different hospital and the fatality count I have which I would regard as being authentic based on feedback that we
have from the Director General of Police and the other agencies, the head of the NDRF team, we are putting that at 16 right now.
I'm not aware of the precise condition -- medical condition of some of those who have been injured as to how serious they are. All kinds of
figures are being mentioned. But as I said, it's better to go by the confirmed figure which is 16 casualties, several injured and we will get a
clearer picture I think in the coming hours.
ASHER: Right, 16 confirmed dead, several people injured and you will update us on the conditions of the wounded as soon as you can. Thank you so much.
Hardeep Singh Puri for joining us.
Mary Schiavo is still with me as well. So, Mary, this type of plane Boeing 737-800, is this an easy or a difficult plane to land in conditions like
this? You think about the heavy rains, the visibility issues, also the topography, the fact that this was a tabletop runway?
SCHIAVO: Well, you know, Boeing prides itself that the 737 series -- you know, as an easy series of aircraft to fly.
[15:45:01]
SCHIAVO: However, in monsoon conditions in very wet conditions, and we learned a very important piece of information from the minister this --
just then, and that is that the pilot had previously attempted a landing and had gone around.
So that's important for several reasons. One, the pilots had a chance to assess the situation. But then, you know, they also learned that for
whatever reason they could not complete that landing.
Most likely, they did not actually touchdown because that was very -- it would be very difficult to get up enough speed to take off again, so they
didn't go around. And that brings into play what's called situational awareness, then the pilots decision making. And a lot goes into that, the
information that they have available, the conditions at the runway.
And then one thing that will also be important was what was at the end of the runway? Did it have these arrestor beds, these EMAS Systems, which in
the 10 years ago, there was another very similar accident in India and it had this arrestor system, it had sand at the end of the runway, but the
plane went right through it. And it was another one of these tabletop runways and it went into a ravine but it caught fire and most people died.
So all these factors will come into play. But most important will be what were the pilots seeing and assessing in the cockpit before they made the
decision to set the plane down. Because once it's on the runway, you know you're at the mercy of the runway and your machine. Is your aircraft going
to brake? Are you going to have braking and will it stop? Those are the -- those what happened in the instant you touched down, you've got to rely on
equipment and machines.
ASHER: And the pilots thought process, we'll get that from the voice recorder. Hopefully that will be downloaded and released soon. Mary Schiavo
live for us there. Thank you so much.
Days after the massive explosion, protesters are showing their outrage in Beirut. We'll hear how they're demanding the government be held
accountable.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ASHER: At least 154 people were killed by Tuesday's explosion in Beirut. Lebanon's health minister says another 5,000 were hurt. The catastrophe has
overwhelmed the city's hospitals and sparked some clashes between police and protesters.
Let's bring in Maha Yahya in Beirut, the director of the Carnegie Middle East Center. Maha, thank you so much for being with us.
So, a lot of people obviously saying that -- you know, it is time for change in Lebanon. Lebanese people are angry. What is the best way for them
to channel that anger in order to bring about change do you think?
MAHA YAHYA, DIRECTOR, CARNEGIE MIDDLE EAST CENTER: Hi Zain, thank you for having me.
I think in a number of ways and they're already happening. People are not just angry, they are livid. What we witnessed on Tuesday is literally a
manmade earthquake due to negligence and corruption and the rot that is now at the heart of the way the country is governed.
[15:50:03]
YAHYA: Tomorrow, there are plans for mass protests. Irrespective of COVID- 19, I think we're going to see a lot more people down on the streets, so there will be a lot of pressure from the bottom up.
A lot of the groups that are under operating under the broad coalition called the October 17's revolution, which began in October 2019 are coming
together to form a broad -- sort of an oppositional front to also push for change. There are groups working on a kind of an economic -- socioeconomic
and political plan and vision for how to get Lebanon out of the mess it's in.
But there will be an incredible needs, a real need for international pressure, because nothing that the Lebanese can do on the ground will lodge
this current leadership that holds all the levers of power. And many some hold guns, nothing will lodge them unless there is sufficient international
pressure to get them to allow transition of government in place and allow a change, a transformation and the way the country is run.
ASHER: So you think that that's really the key here? That's what's going to make the difference, the idea of international pressure? I mean, the whole
world is watching Lebanon right now.
But here's the thing you know, President Michel Aoun has already said that there's not going to be an independent investigation under his watch. And
also, he's intimated this possibility that this could have been the work of, in his words, a missile or a bomb, given that that's the sort of
language and rhetoric that's being used already.
You know, and people are certainly skeptical of it. How confident are you that there is going to be any accountability here?
YAHYA: Quite honestly, if there is no international oversight or involvement in the investigation itself, it's not me, it's the most of the
Lebanese will not -- I mean, they have -- they will not believe whatever comes out of this investigation.
Right now, the Lebanese have really lost confidence, have zero confidence in their political leadership and the president himself and the entire
political past. So, and they are holding them accountable. They are blaming them for the mess that the country is in. They are blaming them for the
catastrophe that happened on Tuesday for the devastation that Beirut has witnessed.
Almost half the city was affected by the explosion. 300,000 people were made homeless, this is catastrophic.
So the fact that the same people who are being blamed for the explosion are actually investing themselves, there's something bizarre about this. So, I
don't think that people will believe it.
Now, this idea that there was a missile attack, the story goes back and forth. And some groups buy into it that it was a missile attack against a -
- you know, ammonium -- the ammonium nitrate that was somehow belonged to Hezbollah, or that Hezbollah had a hand of this.
I think this is just pure speculation at this point. We won't know anything unless there's a serious investigation that has some international elements
involved in it, and only then would that investigation have any credibility.
ASHER: Maha, given that the economy was already in freefall, I mean, Lebanese people have been suffering for quite some time, who is going to
pay for the reconstruction of Beirut?
YAHYA: This will only happen with support from the international community again. The country does not have the capacity, its -- the economy, as you
said was in freefall.
Actually, the -- just prior to the explosion, the currency had lost 80 percent of its value. Inflation in June alone was 90 percent. The price of
basic goods like sugar and wheat and flour -- sorry, sugar, flour and rice had gone up in an astronomical manner.
People have lost their incomes, when the currency is devalued at such a rapid rate, the wealth destruction is massive. The poverty rate had gone
above 50 percent of the population.
So, and you know, there was no way out. Already, there was a heavy need for IMF involvement, the government was in deep negotiations with the IMF.
So without international support, the -- we cannot -- Lebanon cannot rebuild and cannot reconstruct, there is no funding for it.
[15:55:07]
YAHYA: And no amount of support that comes from the diaspora, which is what's happening now. And from civil society, which is also what's
happening now, that is not sufficient or sufficient.
We're talking about, I think, $5-10 billion worth of rebuilding and reconstruction.
ASHER: Gosh, yes, that is certainly a lot. I mean, Lebanese people have been dealing with so much for so long. It is certainly time for change.
Maha Yahya live for us, thank you so much.
Time for a quick break here on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, we'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ASHER: Welcome back. A final reminder of our top story tonight, a deadly plane crash in India. Authorities are saying that 16 people were killed.
That includes two of the pilots, both pilots. An Air India Express plane overshot the runway while attempting to land at Kozhikode International
Airport. The plane split into two, broken half, there was 190 people on board.
Speaking to me just a few minutes ago, the country's Civil Aviation Minister said the pilot tried to land the plane, turned back and then made
the crash landing.
He also confirmed that weather and visibility may have been a factor in the crash given that it is monsoon season. The flight originated in Dubai and
was repatriating Indian citizens stranded abroad by the coronavirus pandemic.
We'll have more coverage of this story in the coming hours ahead. For now, I'm Zain Asher in New York. "THE LEAD" Pamela Brown is next.
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