Return to Transcripts main page
Quest Means Business
Europe Reporting More COVID-19 Cases than U.S., Brazil, or India; Trump Shifts Again on Stimulus at End to Chaotic Week. Aired 3-4p ET
Aired October 09, 2020 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[15:00:00]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS HOST: Good evening, the new locus of attention on coronavirus is the second wave that is currently hitting Europe. It has
more to go, and it is almost, if not, in some cases worse than it was at the beginning back in early spring.
Europe is now reporting more cases than the U.S., Brazil or India. The blue line is Europe. That is the seven-day moving average, and it is outpacing
the world's worst, excuse me, over the last few months.
The Czech Republic: cases are soaring in the Czech Republic. It is now the worst in Europe. That is the light blue. France tops 20,000 new cases for
the first time. So in France, it's worse than it was. The U.K. cases have more than doubled in the last week. The state of emergency in Madrid, and
all of those countries are above the spring peak.
Germany is threatening, it is out of control and talk of an exponential rise.
Salma Abdelaziz is in London. The important thing in fact, here, Salma, I find, we realize its complacency, and it's all part of the reopening. But
these numbers are worse than what was perceived to be the worst of the pandemic back in the spring.
SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN REPORTER: Absolutely, Richard, we are well and truly into the second wave and you've hit the nail on the head, it is compliance,
it is about fatigue. What are people going to do now?
If you look at those numbers, what's really worrying is that some of the countries that were doing the best in the spring, like Germany, for
example, they locked down early; now, they might be doing the worst in the winter. They are, as you said, warning of an uncontrollable virus spreading
through the country.
Another example, the Czech Republic, the Netherlands, they were reporting fewer than a hundred cases this spring at the height of the pandemic; now
they are reporting thousands daily, and that's what experts are saying.
The hardest part about this is going to be to get people to comply.
QUEST: Right. We'll talk about that, I guess in a second on the question of fatigue. But just complacency. I mean, in the sense that universities
reopened, children went back to school. In some countries like Germany, people are encouraged to go back into the office.
But at the same time, there has been mask wearing, there has been various measures. So it begs the question, what more needs to be done?
ABDELAZIZ: Well, Richard, this is I think, really the important thing. Where a lot of the cases come from? And we've heard this from Germany, from
the U.K., from France, from multiple places -- where a lot of these cases are coming from is not from schools. It's not from travel. It's from social
gatherings.
It's from going to weddings. It's from letting off steam at the bar. It's from meeting your friends in the pub after months of being in lockdown.
That's where the outbreaks are.
So what needs to change is normal life. What needs to change is people can't get excited about it being over, about being let out of the house.
They've got to keep compliance, as we said, and you have to stay vigilant - - Richard.
QUEST: Salma Abdelaziz there. The public tolerance, though, for continuing those measures on lockdown, the problem is the public tolerance. That's you
and me, by the way, tolerance is wavering, and we're not prepared to put up with it anymore.
So let's look at what they are doing in Madrid. The Spanish government has declared a state of emergency to maintain after measures struck down as
unconstitutional. In Scotland, local business leaders are screaming murder with confusion on new rules.
There's a cafe that serves alcohol? Is it a pub? When is a pub, not a pub? When is a cafe a pub in disguise? You get the idea.
And in the US, New York is seeing anti-lockdown protests with Orthodox Jewish groups suing Governor Cuomo over new hotspot measures.
Richard Haass is the President of the Council on Foreign Relations in the author of "The World: A Brief Introduction." He joins me from Rhinebeck in
New York. President Haass, the problem is sort of crystal clear. The solution is not because as the recent Council on Foreign Relations report
makes clear, the public aren't really prepared to continue with these mass lockdowns.
RICHARD HAASS, PRESIDENT, COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS: Look, I'm afraid you're right. And it's only going to get worse I think as we head into
winter, shorter days to cold outside so people will want to gather indoors. So the bad situations can get worse, and I think we're beginning to see
that.
What this suggests to me, until we have a combination of more disciplined behavior particularly with masks, obviously better therapeutic treatment of
those who have come down with the disease and obviously vaccines to reduce immunity in the first instance, I don't think we're going to get on top of
this.
[15:05:14]
QUEST: Right. But the recent report, improving pandemic preparedness for the future specifically talks about inherent weaknesses in the response.
Now, I realized that's up to the government level, but isn't one of these inherent weaknesses, firstly, leadership, but secondly, our willingness to
be led on this.
HAASS: I wish I could disagree with you, but I can't. Obviously, leadership is critical here and we've heard ourselves in this country, I'll speak
about the United States with very inconsistent messaging to put it gently. And obviously, there's a significant degree of cultural resistance.
That said, we can and should be doing better here, and we do have examples around the world. New Zealand, South Korea, Europe until recently, it shows
to me that there's a range of possible behavior. Taiwan, Vietnam, we have enough successes, that I think it's wrong to basically put this into this
is impossible; difficult, yes.
And you're right, it requires top down as well as bottom up behavior, and we have failed miserably on the top down department.
QUEST: On that issue, when we look, we can't have you on the program and not just turn our attention, when we look at the sort of flip flopping on
stimulus that the President has done just this week between one and the other on something so crucial. How damaging -- I mean, I was going to say,
is it for American leadership? But that's just about gone in the world. How damaging is it for the economy, do you think?
HAASS: Well, the markets basically go up and down depending upon the latest rumor about a relief package. It reinforces the message around the world
that the United States is not a serious country.
But look, at some point, we're going to have a degree of relief. We still again, though, we're not going to have real recovery until we get beyond
that, and we come back to the same combination, we're going to have to think about how we manage, not eliminate, not solve, but manage this public
health crisis, and then we're going to have to look at a lot of long term challenges in the United States.
We have Federal debt. I live in New York City, the degree of our urban and state debt is stunning. You've now got crime. You've got a flight of all of
the wealthier. Real problem with schools.
I mean, the problems in our cities are really mounting. So even if we have a relief package, no one should kid himself. That's simply one tool in a
pretty large toolbox.
QUEST: Again, I've been taken having read the summary of the report, "Pandemics are inevitable," says the report, "But the systemic policy
failures that accompany the spread of the virus were not."
Now, that's not rearview mirror stuff, in terms of just about the start of this pandemic, and how it got hold, because that's exactly the same thing,
as we're seeing in the prevention of a second wave, which is upon us.
HAASS: Absolutely. And also, this pandemic was predictable. All sorts of experts in the field, even people who weren't experts were saying it's a
question of when and not if. We did not have countries for the most part prepared. The only ones who seem to have been better prepared were some of
those who recently went through MERS or SARS or some other infectious outbreak.
And obviously, at the global level, we were unprepared both at the World Health Organization and the degree of national coordination, and we're not
done yet.
Look at the problems we're facing now with getting a global response to the emergence of one or more vaccines. Questions about manufacturing, questions
about distribution are still very much -- very much with us. So we are not out of the woods yet, and we still see an inadequate global response.
QUEST: Richard Haass, we just got a report from Beijing about Golden Week, and how the Chinese appear to have left it behind pandemic. Do you believe
the numbers from China?
HAASS: Well, by and large, anyone who has looked to China for the last couple of decades, is shall we say, skeptical about numbers, be they
economic, public health or anything else. China does have the advantage of being an authoritarian society. An authoritarian societies have the
possibility of enforcing a degree of social discipline.
So the idea that they are making progress, the idea that their economy is probably growing. I think that is true.
[15:10:02]
QUEST: President Richard Haass of the Council on Foreign Relations, thank you.
Now on a report from Selina Wang, Golden Week has just taken place and the Chinese authorities say far from being down in the dumps, Golden Week,
actually was 250 percent more than last year in terms of spend. Here is Selina from Hong Kong.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SELINA WANG, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): China just went on a massive vacation, swarming tourist sites, crowding airports and train stations,
scenes that are impossible in most parts of the world right now. It almost looks like life before COVID-19 with huge crowds like this at the Forbidden
City, standing shoulder to shoulder most with masks on, but some without.
It's a similar picture at the Great Wall, crammed along the winding wall, squeezing past each other in narrow quarters.
China just celebrated its Golden Week Holiday, one of the country's busiest travel periods. Normally, it's when millions of Chinese go abroad. But as
the rest of the world battles COVID-19, they are staying closer to home, boarding cruise ships, relaxing on beaches, hiking mountains and even
getting married.
During the eight-day holiday, 637 million people took trips within the country spending more than $68 billion. If we compare the first seven days
this year with the shorter holiday last year, that's a more than 20 percent drop in travel and spending. But it's still a much needed boost to the
economy which has been gradually bouncing back.
Local governments are even competing to attract tourists issuing travel vouchers and discounted tickets. But in cities like Beijing and Shanghai,
schools have asked students not to leave for the holiday, leading to busy parks in Shanghai like this one, with kids and parents mostly without
masks.
Hundreds of millions of people going on vacation at the same time is a major test for China's COVID-19 strategy. The country hasn't reported any
locally transmitted cases since mid-August. Even Wuhan, the original epicenter of the outbreak has become a traveler hotspot.
Online agency, Ctrip listed this Wuhan landmark, the Yellow Crane tower as the most sought after Golden Week attraction, enticing them with this light
show. But some travelers like Chen, a 29-year-old who works in Beijing are still worried.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN, TRAVELER (through translator): Even though the epidemic situation has improved, I'm still very worried. Every day is different and the situation
may change. So, we should still wear masks and take good protective measures when we're on the train.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WANG (voice over): China has had a few flare ups in recent months but they were followed by lockdowns and mass testing measures. Now, the rest of the
world is watching to see if China can keep up its track record of no infections after the mass travel holiday, and if China will live up to the
government's message that the country has defeated the virus.
Selina Wang, CNN, Hong Kong.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: After the break, any constitutional trivial pursuit always has a question about the 25th amendment of the U.S. Constitution. It's the bit
where the Vice President takes over for the incapacity of the President.
Now Nancy Pelosi wants to basically have a say and change the 25th Amendment or at least change the law around it, after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:15:43]
QUEST: Hold on to your hats. Remember earlier in the week I told you about President Trump and his tweet withdrawing his stimulus negotiators? Well,
three days on and the talks are back on again, or at least President Trump told the radio presenter, Rush Limbaugh that the President wants a bigger
deal involving more than either Democrats or Republicans are offering.
The White House -- this is after upping the White House bid to $1.8 trillion. Now, that's still less than the Democrats want. The Republicans
don't want to go over a trillion. Investors like all of this. It's really quite weird, the level of dysfunction, but they seem to be enjoying it, at
least from an investment point of view. We have the Dow Jones at more than 140 points today, well, you can see from numbers.
You have the tech stocks that are also rising, and a slew of bank earnings that took place this week.
Doug Peterson is with me. President and CEO of S&P Global. He joins me from New York. The discrepancy, we have talked about many times between the real
economy and the stock market. But this is never greater than we're seeing at the moment, as the argument is over stimulus. Where do you think
stimulus is most needed?
DOUG PETERSON, PRESIDENT AND CEO, S&P GLOBAL: Well, first of all, thank you, Richard, for having us. Stimulus is needed to help create and protect
jobs. The last package of the PPP, the Paycheck Protection Program helped protect 13.5 million jobs. We've seen the SME, small medium enterprise
sector really hurting and the first program stabilized small jobs, and this is really important in helping stimulate the economy by protecting people's
jobs.
QUEST: This week was the end of the financial year, well, we've got the numbers for the end of the U.S. government's financial year. The debt rose
by $3 trillion. I mean, it dwarfs anything that's ever been seen before.
At what point should we be worried? I agree, I understand, not now. But at what point do we need to be worried about the rising U.S. Federal deficit?
PETERSON: Well, that what's most important is to look at the components of the economy, what sort of growth do we have? Because if you can grow, you
can actually outgrow the deficit.
The worst combination is to have an increasing deficit with no growth and inflation on top of that. We don't have the inflation right now. We have
very low interest rates, which is helping protect the liquidity of the economy and ensure there's a lot of liquidity available for banks for
organizations, but we have to look very carefully at what's going to be the growth output of the U.S. economy and that's why people should be looking
at the paycheck protection program, stimulus, et cetera because you want to get that growth trajectory.
QUEST: But I noticed from your note, you expect the U.S. GDP to grow nearly four percent next year and it won't be until late next year, that it will
have sort of evened out the amount of loss versus gain just on a nominal GDP basis.
But that doesn't tell the story, does it? Because when one in seven businesses have failed, and so many more are unemployed, you know, I worry
that we focus on the numbers, but not on the reality.
PETERSON: Well, you're absolutely right, because there's going to be a high level of unemployment that could stay behind. If you think about the drop
that we had in our economy of over 30 percent, now, we're going to see an increase of almost 30 percent again, this quarter. Those kinds of drops are
just something you can't believe in one quarter to see an annualized drop of 30 percent in the economy, the kind of shock that that brought to our
economy of job loss, of people that stopped investing, people that were worth saving on the one hand, but they weren't spending and they were not
investing at all.
This is what we have to see come back in the economy, investment and growth in jobs. People that have confidence in economy to invest again so that we
can see the job growth and the economic growth.
[15:20:05]
QUEST: Right, but Kevin Hassett, the former economic adviser of the President said that he believed we were on the edge of an economic cliff.
Now, I mean, I assume you probably agree with that, but I don't know that there's enough will to pull us back from it.
PETERSON: Well, this is what's so important for us to think about a couple of different factors. Vaccines are absolutely critical and it is actually
encouraging to see that the private sector and the public sector are working so well together to develop a vaccine very fast.
And to get the vaccine out is going to help stabilize the economy, it's going to stabilize people's behavior and bring back some normalcy into our
lives, which will also help stabilize the economy.
Another factor has to do with the stimulus, and then there's another large factor, which is what about global trade? What are we seeing around the
rest of the world? And will there be a return to a normalized set of trade going around the world, which is also quite important for job creation?
QUEST: So good to see you, sir. Thank you, I appreciate it.
Now, to the 25th Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. It's the bit that allows the removal of the President. It's a very complicated piece of
legislation or constitutional law, but it basically says in certain elements of incapacity, he can be removed.
Nancy Pelosi, the Speaker of the House, was not specifically referring to Donald Trump and says the 25th Amendment needs to have more law.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): A President's fitness for office must be determined by science and facts. This legislation applies to future
Presidents. But we are reminded of the necessity of action by the health of the current President.
With this bill, the Congress honors our oath to support and defend the Constitution and protect the American people, and we uphold our
responsibility to preserve our Republic for generations to come.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: With me is CNN senior commentator and the former Governor of Ohio, John Kasich. Governor, thank you.
Well, we now really are heading into deep waters, aren't we? Where the 25th Amendment is -- I mean, you know, it is one of those pits of Trivial
Pursuit that comes up time and again. Do you think there are legitimate questions about the competency of the current President bearing in mind his
steroid treatment, his COVID, and everything else?
JOHN KASICH, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No. I don't want to get into this, Richard.
Look, you know, we are where we are. I don't know, a couple of weeks, three weeks, a month out from the election and I see no reason this kind of a
discussion should be going on at this point in time, to be honest with you.
QUEST: Right. Now, let's talk about --
KASICH: How is that for an answer? Richard, you never get a short answer out of a former politician. You just got one.
QUEST: I know. I was so amazed. I had to think twice before what my next question was going to be. I didn't have time to frame it. John, look, then
talk about what we have seen. This inability, and I'll guess there's blame on both sides and everybody is politicking before the election -- this
inability to get a stimulus package to those who need it. I bet your answer is going to be longer on this one.
KASICH: Yes, you know, it's really -- I never would have thought that we would be at this place. I would have thought that they would have done
something long time ago. But as this drags on, unfortunately, I think both sides are taking a look at, well, what's the political benefit? You know?
And I think that's really unfortunate. I just think the politics, the o grab for power, and everything is overwhelming, the kind of need for public
duty, service and all of that. And I think it's just terrible, because there are people who are really hurting out there, and they ought to hammer
out a deal and get this thing done, like post haste.
QUEST: Is that realistic? And you know, you're a politician yourself, and I applaud your values on this. But is it realistic when it's all to fight for
in 27 odd days -- 25 days to go.
KASICH: You know, Richard, I think it's possible. I mean, I hate to give you a political answer. I'm not -- I don't know. I know that the President
is pushing for it. I have heard that there are moderate Democrats that are pushing for it.
They say that they have not totally walked away from the table. So is it possible that they can reach some agreement? Yes, I think it's possible.
But I can't predict. I mean, if I were there, I'd be pushing to get something done. And when I was there, we did get something done.
So you know, it's a very bizarre time. But what's in the middle of all this, Richard is what's in the middle of politics, unfortunately, when it
becomes more sorted, and that's the fact that it is a pursuit of power by all parties. I want to be in charge, I want the power.
And it never really used to be that way. You know, it shouldn't be a zero sum game. You know, you win this election, we win the next one. But in the
middle, the meantime, we figure out a way to get along. That was my experience for the 18 years that I was in office. And, you know, pretty
much the way that that we were able to negotiate things for the eight years in which I was governor.
But I must remind you, Richard, I'm not a politician now. I'm a -- you know, I'm not, but I'm -- you know, I don't know what I am, I'm in between,
or maybe out. Who knows, we'll see.
QUEST: Oh, well, well, yes. You've decided to ...
KASICH: I am an observer.
QUEST: ... your support behind -- no, no, no, no. Let's not overstate this, Governor. Yes, you're still in -- you may not be, you may not be a
participant, but you're well and truly in the fora, and look, if there was a Biden administration, and you are supporting him, would you serve in a
Biden administration?
KASICH: No. I'm not interested in returning to Washington. Richard, you know, when you were a Governor, there's like -- you know, there's nowhere
to go from there. Being in a Cabinet or something like that, that just doesn't have any interest for me.
You know, if any of the Presidents had come and said, look, we need an envoy, you know, there's a crisis somewhere. And, you know could you step
in and help us here for a couple months, that's a different issue.
But in terms of moving to Washington and trying to have a Cabinet position, I'm not interested. You know, I have other things that I'm doing now that
are fascinating and meaningful to me.
QUEST: And finally, how difficult was it to make the decision to support the other party bearing in mind you had been a star within -- you are a
star within your own party. What's that moment like when you have to say, it's principle before party.
KASICH: It's always been that way from the day I first got into politics. Nobody says that I'm in a different swim lane. I've been able to work with
Democrats my entire career and I've always put the country before I put my political party. The party is, by the way, my vehicle and never my master.
But let me make one other thing clear to you, Richard, if Joe Biden wins this election, and if they start doing things that I think are not in the
best interest of our country, you're going to hear me criticize that.
I'm not all in with anybody. I mean, it's my job to take a look at -- the best I can, with you know, people that I can talk to figure out what I
think the best things are for our country. I supported Joe Biden because I think he can return civility and I think he can get people around the table
and solve problems.
If they decide they want to do it unilaterally, then, you know, they're going to have me as a critic, so we'll see where this all goes and you and
I should have a lot more fun talking about all of this after this election is over.
QUEST: Oh, you have an invitation. It's in the mail, by e-mail anyway, yes, we will frequently.
Governor, it is good to talk to you. The non-politician politician who is not a politician.
KASICH: Thanks, Richard.
QUEST: Good to see you, sir. And I appreciate it, as always, thank you again.
KASICH: See you again, Richard. Always a pleasure.
QUEST: We will. As we continue, the hurricane season just continues. We're now well into the later season, the number of hurricanes continues to
increase. We'll have a report.
It's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. Pretty glad you're with us at the end of the week on Friday.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:31:56]
QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. A lot more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for you this evening as we continue. The former FDA Commissioner is going to talk
about when it's time and safe to go back into the office. However, your office might be, and we'll discuss what precautions need to be taken. And
the power of a hurricane that's about to make landfall on the Louisiana Texas border.
Martin Savidge is doing certainly work down there for us. You'll hear from him as he's getting wet as the hurricane hits. All of that is still to come
after I've updated you on the news headlines because this is CNN and on this network the news always comes first.
The World Health Organization says that more than 350,000 new coronavirus cases have been reported worldwide. A new record. Europe is now reporting
more new cases than in the U.S. Brazil or India. France has top 20,000 cases for the first time. And cases are also on the rise in the Czech
Republic, Spain and the United Kingdom.
White House officials tell CNN that President Trump plans to hold an event at the White House on Saturday, barely a week after he announced he tested
positive for the virus. Mr. Trump has told Fox News is ready to resume campaign rallies and indeed may do so this weekend.
The U.N.'s World Food Programme has earned this year's Nobel Peace Prize. The committee praised the group which works to save lives and then
starvation in more than 80 countries. The organization said its mission is even more crucial because of coronavirus.
Hurricane Delta is now moving ever closer to the coast -- of the Gulf Coast of the United States, Louisiana and Texas. It's not a category two storm.
It is bringing with it considerable wind and of course a great deal of rain which would lead to flooding and that's going to be a real problem because
the area is still cleaning up from Hurricane Laura. Oil rigs in the Gulf of Mexico will be threatened. Laura struck us six weeks ago.
So far 92 percent of oil production in the Gulf of Mexico has shut down. Martin Savidge is in Lake Charles in Louisiana where the storm surge in the
dangerous winds just a few hours away. Martin, what's the latest situation, please?
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the good news is that this hurricane is weakened somewhat. It's gone from a category three which is a
major hurricane to a high category two. Still a very dangerous storm and still likely to have a storm surge. The good thing is the storm surge won't
be the problem here. It's going to be the winds and here's the reason why. And you already mentioned it.
Six weeks ago, Hurricane Laura came ashore at category four storm devastated this area. In the coming hours the winds are going to begin
pounding this area again. 95 percent of the buildings the mayor of Lake Charles says were damaged by the previous hurricane, which means they're in
no shape whatsoever to take the next storm that is now just a few hours away.
[15:35:03]
SAVIDGE: And I want to show you some of the video that we got from a drone that may demonstrate just what it looks like. You have the blue tarp,
They're famous in the aftermath of storms. They're the way that people try to cover their roofs that have been damaged. There are so many blue tarps
now. It almost looks like a blue sea in some areas of Lake Charles. So again, it shows you that this is a community that is fragile, that is
broken, that is devastated and now faces this very severe storm.
Then there's the debris, there is tons and tons of debris, most of it unsecured, everything from parts of buildings to the interiors of homes, to
power poles, tree limbs, and on and on and on. All of that becomes potentially missiles in the high-wind speeds that are anticipated, they
would easily hurt anyone outdoors. And they will be a battering ram for the structures that are still here.
And then lastly, I'll point out the Citi Bank building because it's been almost a landmark of destruction in Lake Charles ever since Laura came
ashore, a high-rise building in which almost every window was shattered or blown out. It's now been replaced with plywood. And when you look at it, it
looks like a skyscraper built out of wood. How it will stand up to the weather that's now moving in, no one is clear.
A mandatory evacuation order is in effect and for the traffic we saw yesterday, many people are heating it with good reason. Their homes may not
survive a second storm. And many have decided the best course is to leave. Richard
QUEST: Martin Savidge is in Lake Charles and we'll continue to watch and monitor as the hurricane makes landfall. And we see the effect that it has
on those structures. Martin, thank you. After the break. Working from home, I've been doing it for now six to seven months. The possibility in some
cases of doing it a great deal longer. One or two companies are now saying, Microsoft for instance, you can work from home forever if you're in the
right category.
After break, the FDA Commissioner -- former FDA Commissioner (INAUDIBLE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: The second wave of coronavirus cases, that's now hitting much of the world means that many more people will be working from home. A great deal
longer than they first thought. Microsoft for instance has just told some employees that they can work at home forever, which is the biggest company
so far to make the announcement. Ford and the retailer target of tall stuff, remote working will continue until June 2021.
[15:40:05]
QUEST: Margaret Hamburg with me, the former FDA Commissioner and to President Obama joins me from Washington via Skype, Dr. Hamburg, the
ability -- I mean, this second wave that is now hitting Europe, and I assume as the -- we're seeing the beginnings of it here in the United
States, this second wave, the amelioration of it will best be handled by a vaccine sooner rather than later.
MARGARET HAMBURG, FORMER COMMISSIONER OF FOOD AND DRUGS (via Skype): Well, that's correct, you know, but I think we have to recognize that should we
be so lucky as to get a vaccine and I think we will be and I think we'll be learning more about that in the relatively near future. It will take time
for people to get vaccinated, we'll start vaccinating priority groups, those at highest risk, you know, frontline, health care workers and other
frontline workers.
The elderly, those with comorbidities, who are at greater risk, and then move out to others in the population. So, we're going to be having to do
those public health measures like social distancing and mass wearing, washing hands and not engaging in mass gatherings or large group parties
for quite a while still. But we can start to in a thoughtful databased way begin to open things up more in a vaccine will surely make a difference.
QUEST: Do you think that the FDA's new stricter guidelines that they introduced apparently over White House objections this week over the
introduction of the vaccine, thus implying it will be early next year? Do you think that restores some of the credibility of the organization?
HAMBURG: I hope so, you know, the FDA is an extraordinary public health agency. It's a science-based regulatory agency with a mission to promote
and protect the health of the American people and beyond. And it -- and its career staff, including extraordinary scientists, physicians, and public
health experts are really experienced, really dedicated, and they have the utmost integrity, they want to do this right.
It will be a difficult challenge to balance risks and benefits, but I have great confidence in them. And I hope the American people will too.
Politicians should step out of the way and let the science go forward.
QUEST: It's taking the FDA a great deal longer to approve AstraZeneca to begin their trials. You'll remember, of course, the Oxford trial, which was
halted in the U.K. suspended, but has been restarted in Britain, but not over here in the U.S. Is the FDA sort of -- what do you make of it? Are
they playing overly cautious? Why do you think they will be so to get things going again?
HAMBURG: Well, I of course am not on the inside are privy to inside information about this product in the safety review. But what it tells me
is that the FDA, as it should is taking a safety issue seriously, they want to examine it and they want to review it in the context of all of the
experience with this product and related products, because having a vaccine that is effective is crucial. Having a vaccine that is safe, is also
crucial.
And we need to make sure that both are true, and also that that the public will have confidence in the decision making within the agency.
QUEST: We started talking about at the beginning of this program, whether it is possible for people to follow the necessary protocols to prevent
coronavirus, as fatigue hits hard. And we're seeing it in Europe. And we were talking at the beginning of this program that it really is about
people just don't seem to be able to follow the strictures necessary to keep this down, particularly in Europe and now in the U.S. Do you think
that that's the case? We just can't do it?
HAMBURG: Well, we can do it and we must do it. That's how we're going to fight this virus and they're really -- we cannot rely on a magic bullet
whether a new therapy or a vaccine. It is those fundamental public health measures hopefully augmented by, you know, biomedicine and new medical
tool. But yes, we have to keep at it, you know, the fundamentals apply. It doesn't mean that we can't go out of the house, but it means when you go
out of the house cracks to social distancing and wear a mask.
[15:45:02]
HAMBURG: It means we have to have systems for testing and here in the U.S. I hope and trust that our systems are getting stronger and that we are
having new better diagnostics as well but systems for testing done properly and married to the necessary public health interventions of isolation,
contact tracing and quarantine can also help to tamp this down.
QUEST: Doctor, very grateful to have you on the program tonight. I appreciate it. Thank you. After the break. Well, whoever wins the -- to
become head of the company to the WTO, the World Trade Organization. It'll be a woman (INAUDIBLE) both in just a moment about. It's QUESTS MEANS
BUSINESS. Good evening to you.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: History is being made at the WTO. Whoever becomes the new head. It will be a woman down to the last two finalists after having winnow down
from the previous shortlist. Now we know it will either be and Ngozi Iweala of Nigeria, or Yoo Myung-Hee from South Korea. Now as he's the trade
minister, and she told me recently, she believes she's the right person for the job.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
YOO MYUNG-HEE, SOUTH KOREAN TRADE MINISTER: Historically speaking, when we had the global crisis that actually led to transformation in global
governance and debt, could it be a moment of opportunity for another big bomb. And in some sense, this COVID-19 crisis has forced us to reflect upon
what is needed from the multilateral trading organizations invested to be done. So, this could be a moment of opportunity for WTO reform and
improvement.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: (INAUDIBLE) Ngozi Okonjo-Iweala, former finance minister of Nigeria and second in command at the World Bank. She joined me from Geneva, and she
said that a new toolkit was needed for the WTO and she has the right tools.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NGOZI OKONJO-IWEALA, FORMER NIGERIAN FINANCE MINISTER: The WTO has not been able to complete a multilateral-negotiations for some time. The dispute
settlement system which underpins it is has been paralyzed, and its rules need to be updated to take account of modern 21st century challenges like
the digital economy, the green economy. It also needs to work to be more inclusive to take account of micro medium and small enterprises and women.
[15:50:05]
OKONJO-IWEALA: And finally, in COVID, we're in the middle of COVID-19. The WTO has rules that could actually help small and poorer countries access
vaccines and medical equipment. So, these are the challenges that the WTO confront. And what happens is that I have the bundle of skills that could
help solve these challenges. My political skills, from my time as a minister, and also as number two at the World Bank, I have strong
managerial skills from having been the managing director of operations at the World Bank.
So, I could bring that to, to the WTO. I have strong negotiation skills. So, trying to bridge the gap between countries. I think this is something I
can do. And I'm -- I also know about trade finance, which by the way, Richard, is a very important subject for developing countries. Finally, I'm
the only candidate working at the intersection of public health and trade because right now I'm working in GAVI, I'm the chair of GAVI, which is
trying to work on vaccines, COVID-19 vaccines that could be the answer to this pandemic.
QUEST: So far, the animals between say, for example, the U.S. and everybody else, the tariffs that have been brought in suggests that the largest
members don't necessarily want to do deals that alone, multilateral deals. How do you propose to bring them together?
OKONJO-IWEALA: Well, first of all, Richard, the director general of the WTO has what I call soft power. And I've termed it that because I think this is
the ability to work with members to support them and get them to agree with each other to move negotiations forward. Now, we always focus on the
differences between members. But I want to take a step back for a moment and say, what are the common things that members share? We have to build
trust.
One of the things missing in the WTO is a trust, there's a trust deficit between larger members or between developed and developing countries. And
to repair that trust you have to be practical. You've got to work on confidence building by getting results on certain negotiations, on certain
work programs.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: And as they say, may the best woman win between the two of them. A big part of the global health emergency has been how to actually get what's
needed to those who need it most. Dubai's transport hub is the largest in the world as a big one in the Middle East. It has made a specialty out of
logistics. And CNN's John Defterios went to visit it.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN DEFTERIOS, CNN BUSINESS EMERGING MARKETS EDITOR: From high above the Jebel Ali poured into by giant containers are being loaded up to keep trade
moving during a global pandemic. On the ground trucking companies face a crisis like no other as the wheels of commerce slow way down due to an
historic drop in demand. Umberto De Pretto's trade association represents more than 3/1/2 million of them.
You've been in the industry for three decades if you've seen anything like it?
UMBERTO DE PRETTO, SECRETARY GENERAL, INTERNATIONAL ROAD TRANSPORT UNION: Never. Never before have we seen such a -- such a crisis with a reduction
globally of 16 percent of our turnover equaling over $670 billion. No, it never be taken such a hit.
DEFTERIOS: The message to governments support road haulers and embrace change so vital goods from medical supplies to food keep on trucking.
Damage to trade like the COVID-19 pandemic itself has spread across the world, but it's particularly acute here in the Middle East, stretching to
Far East Asia, road transport trade in this region is expected to drop more than 20 percent.
The chairman of Port Operator D.P. World said they limited the fallout after investing $4 billion over four years into digital technology. In the
first half cargo traffic was down less than four percent.
SULTAN AHMED BIN SULAYEM, GROUP CHAIRMAN AND CEO, D.P. WORLD: (INAUDIBLE) was always there. People were allegedly used. When COVID came through the
matter of life and death. So, people started to use technology.
DEFTERIOS: The IRU which manages the U.N.'s tier carneys system that governs cross border shipments wants the industry to ride the next wave of
innovation. The all-digital E-tier system.
PHILIP KHOURY, CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, ADSO LOGISTICS: With the E-tier we're learning that --
DEFTERIOS: Philip Khoury, General Manager of ADZO Logistics has tested a pilot program with regional retailer landmark. Goods in this truck bound
for Jordan will be customs cleared electronically before departure. Protecting the health of drivers and customs officials at border crossings
and saving enormous time.
PHILIP KHOURY, CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, ADSO LOGISTICS: Prior to tier the average waiting time was around one, two free days. All goes well.
[15:55:02]
KHOURY: Today we're talking about three to four hours. So, we're happy. Customers are happy. The haulers are happy. The clients are very happy.
DEFTERIOS: It was Winston Churchill was quoted as saying never waste a good crisis. And that applies here with the technology. They're finding it saves
about 35 percent in both transit times and costs.
DE PRETTO: The moment we have this, it means intermodal transport becomes much more simple. It means door to door transfer becomes much more simple,
much more efficient, safer, cleaner in every sense and secure.
DEFTERIOS: A silver lining emerging out of COVID-19, kick starting an industry that's suffered terribly from this global pandemic. John
Defterios, CNN, Dubai
QUEST: Oh, profitable moment after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Tonight's profitable moment. So, more people will be working from home for longer, that seems to be the by choice, or because of necessity.
Remember, at the beginning of this crisis, when we -- where we basically started broadcasting from the living room. And the picture that we showed
you, of course, was my living room, I was sitting there and behind me, you could see the wall and the picture with the painting, and everything else
behind me.
There you are. And that was it. Since then, of course, now we have this glorious picture that you now see behind me, we're back in a room, we're
back in the studio, and we have a shot. Well, don't be fooled. Still in the living room. Actually, in the living room with the kick -- with the camera,
being in the kitchen. All is not as you might think. But this is the way it's going to be for the next few months. And we'll manage honors, we'll
keep going.
Because that's just what we've all been trained to do over the last few weeks. In the living room at home, making the best of it all. That's what
working from home means. And it also means allowing ourselves those moments to say, this is how it's going. And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for
tonight. I'm Richard Quest in the living room, whatever you're doing the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable. I'll see you next week. Have a good
weekend.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: And welcome to the second hour of THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper. We're continuing this hour with breaking news. President Trump
planning to hold an event at the White House tomorrow despite the fact that he is infected with the coronavirus. It's a stunning and potentially
reckless move. Given the nation's top infectious disease expert Dr. Anthony Fauci called the White House event many believers responsible for the Trump
administration outbreak.
A quote, "super spreader event." Trump's physician commander Sean Conley said yesterday he expected the President could return to public engagements
as soon as tomorrow. We're not sure what that is based on. We still do not have answers to basic questions about the President's health such as is the
President still contagious? Has the President tested negative since being treated?
[16:00:02]
TAPPER: When in fact -- when exactly did he last test negative? When did he contract the virus? basic questions.
END
