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Quest Means Business

Top CEOs Make Equality Vow After Chauvin Conviction; More Than 400 People Reportedly Detained At Navalny Protests; New COVID-19 Cases On The Rise Worldwide; Biden: 200 Million Vaccine Doses Given In First 100 Days; Indonesian Navy Searches For Missing Submarine; Football Executives Apologize For Super League Plan. Aired 3-4a ET

Aired April 21, 2021 - 15:00   ET



RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: The Dow is now triple digits in the last hour of trade, some stocks, individual stocks are down. We'll talk

about those over the course of the program.

But the trend is higher. A bit of a wobble at the beginning, but nothing to worry about and it has been solidly up throughout the course of the day

after two days of losses.

The markets and how they're looking, and the day so far: a defining moment for racial justice. Now, Corporate America has urged to back up its

rhetoric on Black Lives Matter.

English football's billionaires cap in hand to the fans, abject apologies for the European Super League fiasco.

And Joe Biden says he is not ready yet to share America's vaccine stockpile with the rest of the world. The W.H.O. Special Envoy for COVID-19 with us

on this program.

We are live, of course, in New York, on Wednesday, the 21st of April. I'm Richard Quest, and I mean business.

Good evening. Tonight, activists and executives together, their message is clear: the fight for racial justice in America is far from over even, of

course with Derek Chauvin's conviction for murder of George Floyd.

The U.S. Justice Department says it is launching a civil investigation into the Minneapolis Police Department. At the same time, the activists are

calling on Corporate America to play a stronger role in the movement. The head of the National Urban League tells CNN, there is much work to be done.


MARC MORIAL, PRESIDENT AND CEO, NATIONAL URBAN LEAGUE: I believe that activism, which goes from the streets, to the internet, now to churches and

community centers, even new awareness in the corporate boardrooms of America, I think mean that we have to be determined to make sure that this

moment that we've witnessed, that we've been a part of turns into a broad movement for major change when it comes to systemic and institutional

racism in all of its forms.

It is essential for changing America. Leveling the playing field is the way we build bridges.


QUEST: The top business leaders are voicing their support. Apple's Tim Cook, has echoed Martin Luther King's call for radical changes in the

structure of our society. GM's Mary Barra says there must be more meaningful, deliberate change around race in America and Rosalind Brewer of

Walgreens Boots Alliance says racism is a poison that needs to be eradicated.

Of course, speaking out as a company is one thing and championing diversity at the corporate level, doing more than lip service is another. Companies

have far ways to go in elevating black representation.

Look at these numbers and ponder. There are only two black CEOs of Dow 30 companies, and even then, Merck's Kenneth Frasier is stepping down at the

end of June.

A new study from McKinsey finds it could take 95 years for black employees to achieve parity in the U.S. workplace. Andrew Pearce is with me, Managing

Director at Accenture Operations, and the U.K. Chair of the Executive Leadership Council. He joins me now from Lincolnshire.

I realize it is not simplistic, I realize that there are decades if not centuries, entrenched in this, but where is the improvement going to come?

ANDREW PEARCE, MANAGING DIRECTOR, ACCENTURE OPERATIONS: Well, first of all, Richard, it's great to be back again talking to you. Where is the

improvement going to come? The improvement has got to come by everybody being involved.

I think in the past, what we've seen, if you look at the networks, the various ethnic networks have been driving this, they had the intent, but

they didn't have any impact.

The improvement must come by changing the actual views and the advocates that we see in senior leadership that understand the challenge, and can

ensure and look around and say, hold on, the data is telling us very clearly there's something wrong here.

We don't have that representation. We're not doing enough to retain progress and develop people from a wide variety of backgrounds to ensure it

reflects the society around us and that means conversations --

QUEST: Andrew, why do you think this? Why do you think there is such a poor representation amongst the black community at the upper echelons of the

corporate world?

PEARCE: Well, this has been years in the making, right? It's not something that's going to change, but in essence, it's about opportunity. It is also

about belief. You know, there's that insidious racism of lowered expectation that people can't do the role.


PEARCE: Well, that's just not true. There are many people who are black and brown more than capable of being on boards in the C-suite, but don't have

the sponsorship.

People tend to actually have people on the Boards that look like them, have a similar background. So, we're not getting that sponsorship and

progression that's necessary.

And companies are waking up to that. They are realizing that that's wrong and they are creating advocates and reaching down, start calling people up.

But it's going to take time.

And I think in the past, there has been and you've already alluded to it, this tick box approach, which says, well, we've got policies, so that's

fine. What they've not realized is you need action. They need action, right at the top. They are talking about accountability as well at the top to

make those changes.

QUEST: Now, Goldman Sachs has released its diversity breakdown in the U.S. for the last -- for the last -- for the very first time. About three

percent of the banks executive and senior managers are black. Now compare that to JPMorgan, where the number is five percent.

The number of black people in the United States is roughly 13 percent. I know it's a chicken and an egg, but I can't see -- I can't see the

improvement when you've got supposedly meritocratic organizations like Wall Street, where really, they care about -- or the City of London -- is can

you make the money?

PEARCE: And you're right. And this is the point. There isn't real improvement. Right?

If you look at that data five to ten years ago, you'd have seen similar stats, probably slightly less, in fact. And I think what has changed, and

your point about corporate actually having a voice in this is that they are now looking at those stats, looking at that data, and realizing this isn't

right. We need to do something.

Now, the point is, are we going to have the same conversation in a years' time? In some areas, quite possibly.

QUEST: But, Andrew, if we look at -- and I hear what you say, and accept what you said that it's all about going further down the pipeline, if you

like, and preparing that way.

But are you in favor of targets? Do you believe like the 30 percent or do the other clubs, do you believe it's right to have a numerical target that

should be hit by a Board of Directors in terms of senior management, either for diversity, for sexual diversity, for gender diversity, for race


PEARCE: Well, okay, well, let's take gender diversity. And, you know, targets were set, very clearly targets were set. I know targets are

emotive, but targets were set and companies have actually publicly stated where they will be and what they want to achieve. And that is helping to

drive the conversation and helping drive the change.

Yes, targets are important. But you have to talk in a tone -- targets are goals, but I think it's important that people are measured and held

accountable against them. If their commitment is made, then you need to work towards that commitment and a goal can help focus that conversation.

Remember, it comes back to what you were saying earlier on -- the data. Utilizing that data is part of the issue, getting access to it, and

actually being accountable for it and making changes to it can help drive those conversations and help drive the change.

I have no problem with having goals. What I'm disappointed by is when goals or targets are talked about and then they are forgotten. It is time to

ensure there's a move.

QUEST: We'll talk more about this. I'm always grateful to have you with us, Andrew, thank you very much, sir.

PEARCE: Thank you, Richard.

QUEST: I mentioned just then, I talked about those numbers. The push for racial equality has prompted some soul searching on Wall Street. Matt Egan

is with me from New Jersey.

These are embarrassing numbers, aren't they? The workforce at Goldman is six percent black and they've got three percent in higher management. The

U.S. is 13 percent.

And I saw all the numbers sort of once again saying well, we realize must do better -- Matt Egan.

MATT EGAN, CNN BUSINESS SENIOR WRITER: Yes, Richard. I mean, I think these numbers tell a simple story. Wall Street has a diversity problem, a serious

diversity problem.

The fact that Goldman Sachs, just 49 executives and senior management people at Goldman Sachs are black is really staggering. This is Goldman

Sachs. This is supposed to be the, you know, preeminent firm on all of Wall Street.

We mentioned some of the other banks, JPMorgan, Bank of America. The numbers are not that much better there. They are at five percent. At Morgan

Stanley, it's only two percent of executives and senior managers who are black and we have heard from some of the leaders, Goldman Sachs CEO, David

Solomon, even he said that listen, there is a long road ahead, and he promised to make this a personal priority.


EGAN: I would say that just the fact that we actually have these numbers is progress of some sort because these banks and other companies, they've been

under pressure from shareholders to be more transparent about the racial and gender makeup of their workforce.

And the fact that they've actually released these numbers is important, because it's a way to hold them accountable. And it's a way to really show

that they need to make progress here. But clearly, Richard, more work needs to be done.

QUEST: So what work are they going to do? I mean, that's -- I read, as much as I could see briefly with the Goldman report, which is really a report on

sustainability. And it's not clear what they are proposing, as a way to make quantum change.

EGAN: Yes, I think it's a great question. I mean, David Solomon, he did say that they have one of their most diverse, you know, partner classes, and

that he is going to really make a real effort here.

But ultimately, we know that Wall Street is driven by, you know, financial incentives, and so you wonder if to really actually have meaningful change

here, whether or not there would be a way to sort of, you know, tight bonuses and other incentives towards meeting those medium and long term

diversity goals, because ultimately, that may be the only way to actually kind of drive that real change.

But you know, it's so important that these companies back up their verbal support for a Black Lives Matter. I mean, we've seen a whole bunch of CEOs

from Apple and Starbucks and Wells Fargo and elsewhere, they came out after the Chauvin verdict, and they talked about the importance of racial


But you know, just putting out statements, of course, is not nearly enough. I mean, banks, of course, need to do more to make sure that they are, you

know, providing loans to diverse communities and of course, that their employee base actually matches up to what the U.S. and the world population

looks like.

So I think that they're going to have to do more to actually put action behind that verbal support -- Richard.

QUEST: Matt Egan. Matt, thank you, sir.

EGAN: Thank you.

QUEST: A massive show of defiance taking place across Russia today. Protesters gathered throughout the country in support of the jailed

opposition leader, Alexei Navalny.

Some carried signs that said, "Freedom to Navalny" while shouting "Putin is a killer."

More than 400 people have been detained according to the human rights monitors. Navalny has been holding a hunger strike since March and he is

now in a prison hospital.

The U.S. has threatened consequences if the Kremlin critic dies. But President Putin had his own warning if the West crosses what he called

Russia's red line.


VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): Whoever organizes any provocations that threaten our core security will regret this like

they've never regretted anything before.


QUEST: Well, there is the threat. Our senior international correspondent, Fred Pleitgen is in Moscow. First of all, before we talk to politics, tell

me where you are and what's happening, please.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Richard. Yes, we're actually right in the center of Moscow, just to give you an idea

of how tense the situation actually is here still at the center.

Let me get out of your way here. You can see along this -- which is one of the main boulevards here in Central Moscow, there is a row of riot police.

That sort of is there to prevent people from getting to the other side of the street, where you have the area around Red Square and the Kremlin.

Also down this road, by the way, is the Russian intelligence service, the FSB and a little earlier today, say about 45 minutes to an hour ago, the

protesters actually did try to get where that building is, and that's obviously something that the authorities here wanted to prevent.

There are still scattered protesters around the city. They are still marching in certain places, but the big crowds are really here a couple of

hours ago, when you did have tens of thousands of people here on the ground, as you mentioned, saying "Freedom for Navalny," all of it, so

obviously, very much criticizing the Russian President Vladimir Putin.

And all this, not just happening in Moscow, but also happening in various other cities across Russia. Navalny's organization saying that it was over

a hundred cities in Russia, where protests were being called and as you mentioned, well over 400 people have been detained so far.

We're going to have to wait until later to see the exact number. But certainly, it was very much a show of force and defiance, as you say, by

the opposition as they brought people here to the streets, obviously, to show that they are gravely concerned about Alexei Navalny, obviously very

sick right now in a Russian prison -- Richard.

QUEST: Fred, thank you. Fred Pleitgen is on the streets of Moscow tonight. Thank you, sir.

Despite the vaccine rollouts around the world, the highest ever number of new cases was recorded globally over the past week. The W.H.O.'s Special

Envoy is with me after the break and even as COVID cases rise, four-time Olympic champion Venus Williams says it is possible for major sports

tournaments to succeed this summer.

My exclusive interview with the tennis star next.




QUEST: A small rebound of stocks on Wall Street after two days of sharp falls. Two days of triple digit losses, and now we have a gain. Again, 257

point. It is travel stocks hitting hard as the coronavirus cases rise at record rates.

The World Health Organization says the highest ever number of new COVID cases was recorded globally over the past week, more than 5.2 million.

Now look at this chart and you'll see the spike. It shows the seven-day moving average of new cases worldwide. India and Brazil are driving much of

the rise. India is reporting nearly 300,000 new cases a day.

David Nabarro is the W.H.O.'s Special Envoy on COVID-19. David, it is good to see you.

David, you know, I guess there's an impression, particularly for those of us in the United States, or in the E.U. or in developed economies where

vaccination is -- I mean, I had my second vaccination yesterday, arms a bit sore, but everything is good. But the rest of the world is in a very -- is

in a very, very, very different situation.

DAVID NABARRO, W.H.O. SPECIAL ENVOY ON COVID-19: It is super tough. Actually, I look every day at the total number of people with COVID that is

reported to the W.H.O., and actually over the last three months, I've been getting progressively more concerned, because what we're seeing all of us

is a really rapidly accelerating situation, as you say the numbers are higher at the moment because of real expansion in infections in South Asia

and also in Latin America.

But just think back to before Christmas when the numbers were very high, driven by a lot of COVID in the United States. And they were high earlier

this year, driven by a lot of COVID in the United Kingdom and I think this is what we're going to see more and more is that the virus will move around

and surge in different places and it'll do it at intervals. But it won't be seasonal like flu does, which tends to come in the winter months.

This will surge any time, but it's going to go on surging and at times, sleeping, the virus is here to stay, Richard, it's not going to go away.


QUEST: Okay, so it becomes endemic, and the issue, David is, look, let's take a surge in the U.S. A surge in the U.S. will be or the U.K. will be

serious, but it wouldn't have anything like the same deadly implications because the majority of those who are at risk, the vulnerable are

vaccinated and the population will be vaccinated, by end of summer.

So the death element to this remains still in the developing world, when these things happen.

NABARRO: Now, it really has shifted, as you say, to being a developing world issue, but I'm expecting that variants will go on emerging after all,

there is a huge amount of this virus around in the world and it is mutating constantly, and we get variants being reported continuously, and it is

these variants that are the problem because it's really not at all, unlikely, and I want to say, it's almost inevitable that variants will

emerge that can evade the protection offered by the current generation of vaccines.

So whilst in the U.S. or the U.K., people are understandably feeling quite good about their situation, I'm going to say, please, don't imagine it's

gone away. Otherwise, you'll get caught napping.

This virus is very much here to stay and it's mutating. So the chances of a vaccine beating mutation in the U.S. and U.K. are very high. I'm not going

to say definite, but I'm going to say very high.

QUEST: Sure. Now, let's listen to the President because one of the big -- until that vaccine busting mutation takes place, vaccines are the answer.

This is the President.

The President was just asked whether he would -- since there is now a glut, apparently, of vaccine in the U.S., would he release some to the developing

world? This is what he said.


JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Look, there's other countries as well that I'm confident we can help including in Central

America. And so -- but it's in process. We don't have enough to be confident to give it and send it abroad now. But I expect, we're going to

be able to do that. Thank you.


QUEST: The ability -- I mean, COVAX is doing great work. The other countries, I mean, we're assuming once J&J and AstraZeneca is up and

running fully again, but it's still going -- we're talking months, if not several years.

NABARRO: Years, yes. Do you know the current rate of immunization in the world is 16 million doses day, plus or minus, to immunize the world at 16

million doses today will take two more years, at least.

So with the present implementation of vaccination, with the present supplies, we've got a long haul and there is plenty of time for these

horrible variants to come along and cause trouble.

So the only solution is to increase the amount of vaccine that's available and I'm really strongly focused on anything we can possibly do to get the

increase and that's where the United States is hugely important.

If the U.S. says we'll do everything possible to get vaccines everywhere, then you can be absolutely certain that the rest of the world will find a

way to follow suit.

I'm super pleased to hear President Biden saying that the key is, at the moment at least disposed to think about leading on giving vaccines to other

countries. So let's see the leadership go up a few more notches, because actually, this is a global problem, and without U.S. leadership alongside

the rest of the G-7 and the rest of the G-20, without that, it is going to be a tough one, you know, Richard.

QUEST: David, it is always a privilege to have you talking to us on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. I am grateful. Thank you, sir.

NABARRO: Thank you.

QUEST: Olympic organizers have delayed a decision on whether to let fans attend the Tokyo Games because of the virus. The organizers say it might

take until June for the decision if it is safe enough to open the venues to Japanese fans. We already know that international funds will not be


The four-time Olympic champion, Venus Williams, says it is possible for major tournaments like the Olympics to go ahead.

She is now working with the wellness company, Delos promoting COVID safe indoor spaces. I spoke to her for our broadcast exclusively where she told

me trust is the most important factor.


VENUS WILLIAMS, FOUR-TIME OLYMPIC CHAMPION: People are looking forward to going back to the things that they love and we've got the ability to do

that, whether it is concerts or just going back to work, which is you know, something we took for granted.

So I'm excited to partner with Delos to be able to help people to get back to what they love and it's something that can trust that they're going to

be safe while they do it.

QUEST: One of the fascinating things about you, of course, is your business and the various business bit a part of it. And you've really found yourself

tested during the pandemic, haven't you? In a way because we're a business program, in a way that so many business CEOs and leaders never expected to.

How did you find it?


WILLIAMS: First and foremost, we're about a year in now, right? And I think in some ways, it has become part of our new normal, right? You and me, we

are talking to each other. We would have never done this. We would have always been in studio. I would have been, you know, so this is our new

normal. So we've had to adjust.

And "Champions adjust," one of my favorite sayings from Billie Jean King, and we've adjusted to that and I think it's created so much more

innovation. People are rethinking their businesses. People are being forced to actually be better, you know, instead of waiting to make the change that

they would have made in 10 years, they are making them now.

QUEST: If you look to the Olympics, what's your thoughts now?

WILLIAMS: Wow. You know, I don't know that I look forward that far anymore. Is that bad?

I'd like to get there. Let's hope Wimbledon happens, right? I'd like to get back to Wimbledon first.

But the Olympics, it'll be a great treat. Last year, it was shocking. Everything that was canceled. The Olympics were canceled, even the world's

-- so if I can make it there that would be a dream come true.

QUEST: But you're right, we have to get to Wimbledon first. I mean, what we've seen just in Australia, God, it was a good attempt. I mean, it really

-- they put every -- threw everything at it and more and still had problems.

Now, do you think it's even realistic to have a major tournament in a country that is so affected say as the United Kingdom or as England?

WILLIAMS: Yes, I believe it is possible, and Australia did an amazing job. And I don't think it was necessarily problems, I think it was about them

finding solutions, and making sure that there weren't any pile ups.

So in the case, if there was any sort of issue, there was protocol already there. There was process already there. And that's what made it a success.

So with that role model, you know, so forth between Australia and Craig Tiley who did an amazing job, I think -- I think Wimbledon will be able to


QUEST: And if Wimbledon goes ahead, you'll be there and if -- and if the Olympics which will go ahead, you'll be there.

WILLIAMS: That's the plan. Yes, God-willing.


QUEST: Lovely. Venus Williams and from one of sports all-time greats, to one of its biggest miscalculations. The super league, it has crumbled in

the face of fan fury and government anger, in a moment.



QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. A lot more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS tonight. You and I will be talking about billionaire bosses of top Premier League

clubs who have been forced to apologize for their role in the European Super League fiasco. And the pandemic surge appears to be over at Netflix.

Subscriber growth stalled, has locked down restrictions ease.

All of that still to come. Only after we've updated you on the news headlines, because this is CNN and on this network, the news comes first.

Minneapolis police leaders are pledging to cooperate with the U.S. Justice Department investigation. Today the U.S. Attorney General said the

department will look for possible patterns of discrimination and excessive force in the city's police department. It becomes 24 hours after former

officer Derek Chauvin was convicted of all charges in the killing of George Floyd.

President Biden says the country has now administered 200 million COVID vaccine doses under his administration. And he says the milestones being

reached on his 92nd day in office eight days ahead of schedule. He's also urged businesses to give employees paid time off to receive their vaccines.

Indonesia's military says it's searching for a missing submarine with 53 people on board. The officials said disappeared on Wednesday during an

exercise in the body straight. So far they've located an oil spill, which they believe came from the vessel.

Some of football's most successful clubs are assessing self-inflicted wounds and damage after the collapse of their planned Super League. Most of

them are now backed out of the lucrative new competition in deference to outrage fans. Look at the shares of Manchester United struggling to rebound

after six percent drop on Tuesday. Juventus was off more than 13 percent in Milan today.

And in London, this was the reaction from Chelsea fans. Cheering as you can see. Now some of the team's executives have been apologizing directly to

the fans. Man U's co-chairman Joel Glazer said we got it wrong. And we want to show that we can put things right. The club's executive vice chairman at

Woodward's announced his resignation and we'll go later in the hour. Liverpool's owner John W. Henry told his club's supporters, he let them



JOHN W. HENRY, LIVERPOOL OWNER: Goes without saying but should be said that the project put forward was never going to stand without the support of the

fans. No one ever thought differently in England. Over these 48 hours, you were very clear that it would not stand. We heard you. I heard you.


QUEST: Chelsea was one of the first clubs to reverse a course. Of course when we were talking yesterday. Alex Thomas is with me from Stamford

Bridge. Well, I mean, we were -- what do you make of today?

ALEX THOMAS, CNN INTENATIONAL WORLD SPORT ANCHOR: We will know what -- with 24 hours ago, Richard when just a few 100 yards away from where I'm

standing the other entrance to Stamford Bridge Stadium, ahead of Chelsea's Premier League game against Brighton. Fans staging impromptu protests.

Remember, they're still not allowed in to watch the games because of COVID restrictions.

But they wanted to get out and about. What they are now legally entitled to do and make their voices heard in protests at this proposed Super League

that now lies in tatters. We literally had to change our editorial line as we came away with your show because what seems like an impregnable 12 teams

forging ahead down their own path quickly led to all the English teams pulling out.

Six of the 12 proposed breakaway clubs. And since then, earlier on Wednesday, we've had both the Milan clubs withdrawn from the proposals, and

also Atletico Madrid as well. Juventus, Barcelona, Real Madrid still holding out. EUFA with the defined statements and missing the Super League

project can't go ahead for now saying it's still needed in football. But groveling apologies from five of the six English clubs including that

soundbite you play from John Henry, the head of the Fenway Sports group that also owns the Boston Red Sox.


THOMAS: Can you imagine them going on American T.V. and doing that? They've completely misjudged the difference in culture around football. The most

popular sport on this planet, Richard.

QUEST: Stay with me, Alex. Stay with me. Don't go anywhere because football fans renowned for their boisterous chants when it came to European Super

League. And it was a unison no. That's why you saw them rejoicing when of course, it was all over to the scrapheap.

And fans are worrying the game of two halves is the haves and have nots, with the super rich calling the shots. Heedless of the working-class roots.

Look at this 1937 match between Everton and Arsenal.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Of course, in this game, it doesn't ever kick the scores ago. How would you like that three times a week?


QUEST: Eight pounds a week, $11 a week, that's roughly $3 million a week that Lionel Messi reportedly get -- makes playing Barcelona. Don Riddell is

with us as well as Alex. When you have the two best in the business, you're going to let them go at it.

And so Don, we'll come back to Alex in a second. Don, what was it? Was it the fans or was it rarely the prospect of government legislating? The

legislative solution that really sent the willies?

DON RIDDELL, CNN WORLD SPORT ANCHOR: I mean, I think the whole thing was just so badly planned and badly thought out. I mean, you would have

expected, Richard for a project of this magnitude, that it would have been rolled out in all its splendor, all the stakeholders would have been there

on television and in the media, selling it and explaining it and justifying it. And there was none of that.

And it quickly became apparent that they hadn't really consulted that many people before that point. So the fans were never consulted, they would

never have gone along with it. But I think what quickly happened was the void created by these 12 clubs and their ownership groups. The void created

by them not saying anything, was filled by the outrage and the backlash. And we got to a point very quickly where the backlash was the most powerful

in the United Kingdom.

Of course, half of the teams in this proposed breakaway group were from England. And once they backed out, that was it. These big continental, you

know, leagues needed the Premier League involved, and that wasn't going to happen.

QUEST: But Alex, it doesn't address the problem. And the problem is that there are the big clubs, I wouldn't say being bankrupted because they've

got deep pockets, but are suffering from high salaries and seem powerless which is what this was about, powerless to get more revenue and cap


THOMAS: But the big clubs have got themselves in this position, Richard. That's the thing, they're bleating about how they're suffering when -- yes,

the pandemic has caused some of that, but most it's actually been caused by not supporting football authority saying regulating agents and players


So it's become a greater part of their overall expenditure in not sharing out the T.V. revenues fairly and controlling budgets and pushing back

against financial fair play regulations from UEFA. Really, it's almost the greedy, consuming themselves.

QUEST: What about this idea that, Don, that FIFA and UEFA do not come to this table with clean hands? FIFA certainly from its history. UEFA has

money grabbed or left, right and center and to hear the somewhat intemperate language that of UEFA use really doesn't lie in their mouth.

RIDDELL: Right. I mean, they have emerged this week with, I guess, an element of credit because they were able to avert this particular crisis.

But you're absolutely right. People are now going to look at EUFA and say, well, how did we get into this situation in the first place? And EUFA were

only, you know, motivated to act when it was -- when it was their tournament, their event that was under threat.

People are now saying, well, are you going to be this motivated to tackle racism in the game? Are you going to be this motivated when clubs down the

line manipulate the rules of financial fair play? Of course, FIFA has its own game here, they have the Club World Cup which they would like to

expand. Of course, EUFA want to keep the Champions League as it is, although they have acquiesced somewhat, and proposed the new tournament

which is going to take place in a few years' time.

But of course, everybody's in it for themselves, Richard, I mean, that's the bottom line here. Everybody is in it for themselves. And yet again, and

we've seen it so starkly this week. It's the fans of these clubs, the lifeblood of the game, the people that provide the noise and the color and

the backdrop to all of this incredible drama we see on the field. They're never consulted, they're never asked.


RIDDELL: They are expected to basically put up with whatever is served up for them. And they're expected to follow along and support it (INAUDIBLE)


QUEST: OK. Controversial. Either of you jump in on this. There's one problem, Alex and Don. The fans don't own the club. If you have gone to the

stock market, the club is owned by investors, and the stock market and they can buy shares, and they can have that three shares and turn up at the

annual general meeting and make a fuss. So Alex, you're looking ready as if you're ready to attack.

THOMAS: Yes. I mean, in Germany, they do have a fan ownership model. And it's very notable that Bayern Munich with a one marquee club along with

Paris Saint-German in France, that didn't declare that they were going to join this. And we know that the other 12 were dearly loved by and so have

joined them and maybe would have gone their way if they had. But we know that if they knew it wouldn't pass because it's law in the Bundesliga, the

top division in Germany, that's the majority 50 percent and a bit has to be under fan ownership.

You can't have foreign owners coming in completely taking over the club. So there is a way it can work. Yes, that does restrict the commercial

opportunities. And that's where business and sport clash. But there is a way forward as Don says, and as -- and yearly even though he's been stabbed

in his own back by his own culture has said, it's just too much of a bad culture, a lying, cheating, snake culture is, as it was described by

Ceferin, the UEFA president as well.

That does need to change. I think more fan representation on boards would be a good way to go. We're a long way away from that happening.

QUEST: And finally to you, John. Finally, one of my -- one of the producers had described it as sort of like asking your spouse for a divorce. And then

turning around five minutes later and saying, oh, do you mind if we stay back together again?

I mean, I'm not sure I buy that because there's emotion involved. And at the end of the day, all the clubs as they go into the Champions League, as

they go into the work of all the clubs and all the pairs, they just have to get on with it now, don't they? Or do you see, Don Riddell, lasting damage?

RIDDELL: Well, they're certainly going to be reputational damage. I think there's -- there wasn't much trust in football anyway. I think there's

going to be even less now. But the end of the day EUFA are frankly thrilled that these clubs didn't leave.

They need them in the Champions League because then their tournament has more value. So, I think everybody will just kind of have to sort of, you

know, make up and get back on with it because ultimately, they do all need each other.

QUEST: But a large counseling. Good to see you both gentlemen. Very grateful you took time tonight to go through this in more detail. Thank


You find yourself questioning why you're signed up to so many streaming services, you're not alone. Netflix subscriber numbers were a little soft

last quarter. Now the shares are off seven percent.



QUEST: The Clarion is a call to earth in anticipation of tomorrow's Earth Day. An exclusive interview with the chief executive of Conservation

International, M. Sanjayan. He joined me a few days ago, we discussed the formation of a brand new initiative to protect more of our oceans than ever



M. SANJAYAN, CHIEF EXECUTIVE OF CONSERVATION INTERNATIONAL: The Blue Nature Alliance is a partnership or an alliance of five core partners right now,

including Pew Charitable Trust, we've come together in order to double the amount of oceans under conservation management. 18 million square

kilometers of ocean within five years. It's probably the largest single conservation effort in terms of size and speed out there.

QUEST: Is it one big large area or is it a bit over here, a bit over here, a bit over here, a bot over there?

SANJAYAN: Well, if you want to maximize biodiversity, as well as human benefits, it's got to be a bit over here and a bit over there. Right now on

the books, we have about six million square kilometers of ocean that we're actively working in. One just happened in November, Tristan Da Cunha in the

middle of the Atlantic Ocean. If you put it all together, it's two acts, the size of the United States, so it's quite large.

We're talking half a million to three, four million square kilometers per bit. So we're talking the size of Texas, you know, multiple times the size

of United Kingdom, that sort of thing.

QUEST: I'm a practical person, how do you enforce the conservation? Because you're talking about overfishing, you're talking about pollution, you're

talking about shipping. So, how do you enforce and police such conservation?

SANJAYAN: Well, this is a good question. I mean, it's difficult terrestrial land in the oceans, it can be very difficult. You can track these things. I

mean, satellite technology is getting better.

But we have examples where tuna boats that are going in illegally have been caught in these very large marine-protected areas in the middle of the

Pacific. Were just watching the pattern of the boat making big loops from satellites, tells you that the up to no good.

QUEST: Is it that bad? Bearing in mind, we had 10 years of the most appalling global recession. We're now coming out of COVID where the IMF

agrees that the emerging markets in the developing world, by far are going to bear the long term economic brunt of this. Now you're introducing what

is inevitably going to be another hardship for those of the poorest to go about earning their livelihoods.

SANJAYAN: The question is not how bad it can be. The question is how good it can be. Monterey Bay, California, I did my PhD right there. If you look

at the condition of the bay and the rebounding of wildlife, and the amazing economy that is happening right there because of the protection of that

protected area, you can see the positive benefits of conservation. It's all about improving the connection of that marine-protected area to that local


Nearly always, you know, if you have a constituency for it, you're not going to have the kind of damage that you will see when no one cares about


QUEST: You can protect by dealing with rather than by avoiding.

SANJAYAN: That's the lesson for conservation. Me going out and telling people, you know, save the oceans because you should love, it is not

enough. Communities, people, countries need to value it in the long run if we're going to have sustainable funding for ocean conservation. That's what

the Blue Nature Alliance tries to do.


QUEST: Extraordinary, beautiful pictures, and a beautiful endeavor. And we'll continue showcasing inspirational stories like this as part of our

initiative. And you join in, please. What are you doing to answer the call? Just use the #calltoearth. Tell me about it. I'm interested.


QUEST: Netflix shares are down more than seven percent after disappointing earnings after the bell last night. New subscribers came in short of

expectations. The shares have turned negative for the year. They did have a 65 percent gain last year. But that's obviously on the back of pandemic.

Frank Pallotta was on the earnings call. And what did you learn?

FRANK PALLOTTA, CNN MEDIA REPORTER: Well, what I learned is that Netflix is really trying to figure out where it's going to go next. And I think what

it's really trying to do is have global domination here. Right now, it was a bad quarter. You know, they missed their subscriber numbers, it wasn't

great. But they can really keep going forward. Because they're Netflix, they have a huge lead over their rivals.

And to them, they kind of feel like this is a corrections quarter where they had a huge pull forward last year. And now they're just really trying

to catch up with those comparisons.

QUEST: OK. But at the end of the day, let's take the U.S. just as the largest single market. How do they arrest what is seen as a slowdown or


PALLOTTA: They don't I mean, if they've hit a wall in the U.S. they have to find other markets in which they have not penetrated yet. And it's a global

company. It's a global network. They're trying to be more than just the U.S. and Canada. And the U.S. and Canada, they might have already peaked.

But another place that Netflix could possibly start thinking about is other ways to bring in revenue.

Maybe there's other different ways. Maybe they get into advertising, maybe they get into, you know, becoming a digital hub for even other streaming

services. Reed Hastings, the CEO has said that's not really going to be the case. He said that he doesn't believe necessarily Netflix is going to get

into advertising. But another place that they could really make some more money if say subscribers stagnate is by cracking down on password sharing

and get some of the subscribers who aren't paying because they're sharing their mother's account.

QUEST: I don't know what you're talking about. The -- at the end of the day -- at the end of the day, of all the new streaming stuff services and that

includes our own HBO Max, of all the streaming services, who's doing well?

PALLOTTA: Netflix is doing well, Disney Plus is doing well. Those are the really top two. But the other ones are all starting to kind of get some

strength as well. You talk about HBO Max which is owned by Warner Media, they are moving forward with many huge like theatrical type of films on

their streaming service. But right now the game is between Netflix and Disney Plus. They have a ton of subscribers. But you can't forget about

Amazon Prime Video who has a ton of subscribers as well.

QUEST: Yes. Well, I was surprised that's when I was watching something on Amazon Prime, pop adverts.

PALLOTTA: Yes, no. They -- the thing about Amazon Prime is it's very much kind of like Apple in a way where it's tied to a bigger product. Amazon

Prime Video is really tied to Amazon Prime. While Apple's really tied to their hardware. Netflix and Disney Plus or more your true blue content

companies alongside, you know, NBCUniversal's Peacock and HBO max.

QUEST: Good to see you. Thank you, sir. The last few moments of trade on Wall Street. Going to show you. The Dow has bounced back from its two-day

slump. It's up more than 300 points. Best of the day so far. A big boost from IBM and the Dow Chemical Company, both are at more than three percent.

Apple shares are just squeaking in. The company's big product reveal yesterday. Microsoft's up about one percent.

It's on its way to becoming a $2 trillion company. And there you have it. Dow on the top, P and G at the bottom, Verizon at the bottom as well. But

that tells you all you need to go between consumer packaged goods and utilities like Verizon, McDonald's for fast foods. That tells you where the

markets excitement is today. We have a profitable moment after the break.


QUEST: Tonight's a profitable moment I told you earlier. Yesterday, I got my second vaccination or second vaccine on the Pfizer vaccine in that arm.

It's a bit sore, but otherwise, all is well. I went to one of the largest vaccination sites in the city. The Javits Center, a vast vaccination

factory. But what struck me was the fact that it was just an empty, a steady stream of people but many dozens of vaccination stations that

weren't in use.

People hanging around waiting. The armed forces just guiding people who had gotten there. What it told me, of course, is that we are heading to a

position as the President admitted and Dr. Fauci admitted where there will be a glut of vaccine in the United States before too much longer. And that

means the priority has to be for those countries that have more than they need to start distributing to those that need it.

In Southeast Asia, the level of vaccination is pitifully poor. Across parts of the Middle East, it is distressing how few in Africa is just a law unto

itself. It is only by the rest of us recognizing that this endemic pandemic, if you like, can only be solved or at least dealt with when

everybody at least has a decent chance of getting vaccinated.

And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, nearly forgot I hope it's

profitable. The Dow is (ph) up. Goodbye.