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Quest Means Business

Beijing Slams US Ban On Chip Sales To China; UN Nuclear Experts Inspect Zaporizhzhia Power Plant; Russian State Media: Ravil Maganov Dies After Fall From Window; Lufthansa To Cancel Flights In Germany Due To Strike; Quest At The Met; Art Sales Rose 29 Percent In $65 Billion In 2021; Dow Flat As September Trading Begins. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired September 01, 2022 - 15:00   ET



RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: An hour to go on trading on Wall Street, and today with it being a holiday weekend, coming up, we're

extending our Summer Fridays into Thursdays, whatever next?

We're live tonight, from the Metropolitan Museum of Art here in the heart of New York. It is also the first day of September, and with that comes a

whole host of other issues.

Here is the market. Let's look at it. It's the fifth straight day of losses for Wall Street at the moment. We'll get to the reasons why and the

underlying thoughts and as the triple stack shows, although the Dow has picked up again, the NASDAQ is off over one percent.

The markets and the main events of the day: Beijing is condemning the US decision to ban chip makers from selling into China. That's one of the

reasons the market is down.

Thousands of passengers are stranded in Germany. Lufthansa's pilots are on strike.

And here at the Met, crowds are back. The Chief Executive tells me about the hard decisions that he had to make during the pandemic. The museum's

recovery tonight.

Live from the Metropolitan Museum of Art in New York. It's Thursday, it is September 1st, I'm Richard Quest. I mean business at the Met.

Good evening and a warm welcome to the Metropolitan Museum, New York's iconic art museum, one of the most famous in the world and we are


We were going to be here on Friday as you know, and then of course, Jay Powell had other views on that. So, we are here today, instead.

Extended Fridays: Behind me, you see the twin arch -- I can tell you, it was completed in 10 BC, so that means it must be 2,032 years old, the

Temple of Dendur, one of the thousands of priceless works, and this one --

You know, if you walk around the Met, you'll find something appropriate. How about appropriate for the economic mood at the moment. We think,

"Ugolino and His Sons" is a very fine piece worth looking at. It's by the French sculpture, Jean-Baptiste Carpeaux, and you can see the face of

anxiety, which of course is so familiar to Wall Street today.

Stocks are trying to recover, the Dow is up, but the NASDAQ is down. There are all the usual reasons that you and I have talked about all week have

led to what we're seeing in the market today, but there is a new wrinkle, which came out with the announcement from the United States that it was

banning the sale of AI chips to China.

Now, two companies, particularly AMD and NVIDIA, must immediately end exports of AI chips because of the possibility of military use.

NVIDIA is down almost 10 percent, AMD down five and a half. Gur La Monica is with me. I mean, should NVIDIA have seen this coming? Did we see it


PAUL LA MONICA, CNN BUSINESS REPORTER: I don't think a lot of people saw this coming, Richard. There were a lot of reasons to be worried about

whether or not chip stocks would be part of an economic slowdown, but you hadn't heard too many whispers of concerns about a crackdown on sales to


But as you alluded, the US government is concerned that some of these high- performance artificial intelligence chips could wind up in military use in China. NVIDIA says that this could hurt them to the tune of $400 million in

lost sales; AMD didn't quantify what kind of revenue hit there would be, but presumably there will be a big hit to AMD sales as well. Those two

stocks leading tech lower today.

QUEST: And this -- the actual underlying policy of banning AI chips to China. It's interesting, but it does -- I mean, it seems more protectionist

than perhaps we've seen from President Biden and I'm wondering why. What do you think is behind it?


LA MONICA: Yes, I am not a hundred percent sure why exactly the Biden administration might be taking this tone. Clearly, it is not as

antagonistic of a relationship between the US and China as we had had with the prior administration. And to that end, I think that's what's worrying

the market today.

It was only last week that we had this news that the US and China came to an agreement that would let China have their stocks that are listed on the

New York Stock Exchange or NASDAQ get audited by United States regulators if the US felt that there was a need to do so, and doing that led to this

big pop in shares with companies like Alibaba and Nio, all these big Chinese tech companies that there were worries, they would get delisted and

only trade once more in Hong Kong or Shanghai.

QUEST: Final question to you, Paul La Monica, what do you make -- I mean, we're heading towards our long weekend in the United States, and quite

often, that can be the moment for an accident to take place, but we wouldn't expect much between now and say Tuesday when things reopen.

LA MONICA: I mean, I don't think we're going to get much over the weekend, necessarily Saturday, Sunday or Monday, but there is still tomorrow and

there is a jobs report tomorrow. So, don't head to the beach just yet. We need to see whether or not we have more strong job gains, which would be

great news for consumers, but would probably freak out the markets because it would lead to higher concerns about rising interest rates, inflation

fears, and an even more aggressive Federal Reserve at the end of this month.

QUEST: Paul La Monica in New York.

Paul, thank you, we'll talk more.

Other news that we are bringing and watching today: The United Nations nuclear inspectors have now looked at the nuclear plant in Ukraine.

The shelling of the plant has sparked fears of a nuclear accident. The IAEA says it wants permanent mission at the plant, and one of its two working

reactors was shut down today. It all has the IAEA head very worried.


RAFAEL GROS, DIRECTOR-GENERAL, IAEA: I It is obvious that that the plant and the physical integrity of the plant has been violated several times, by

chance, by deliberation.

We don't have the elements to assess that, but this is a reality that we to recognize and this is something that cannot continue to happen.

Wherever you stay, wherever you stand, whatever you think about this war, this is something that cannot happen.


QUEST: Sam Kiley is with me.

Sam, listening to that, and now hearing what they want to do with a permanent mission. How realistic is that? Will Ukraine and all Russia go

along with that, bearing in mind that today, the IAEA visit actually was delayed because of shelling?

SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think as far as Ukraine is concerned, they absolutely would like to see the UN monitors in

there physically, not just with the CCTV that exists in almost all nuclear power stations, but actually with their own people from the agency on the

ground, and the reason for that is it would help to be able to assess who is doing what because at the moment there is a sort of he-said-she-said

series of allegations going on.

But it was very revealing actually, a second thing or another thing that Mr. Grossi said after his visit there concerning the weaponry that they

identified when they were going in. Take a listen.


GROSSI: This morning, the situation was pretty difficult. But as I said, having come this far, I was not going to stop and with my courageous team,

we moved in.

There were moments where fire was obvious. Heavy machine gun, artillery mortars, two or three times were really very concerning.


KILEY: Now mortars and machine guns, the Ukrainians don't have them within audible range of Enerhodar or Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Station, and

indeed, they don't have any, the Ukrainians don't have any mortars from their locations, the positions they hold, could even reach that territory.

So, if he heard mortars and he had machine guns, which of course are much shorter range, small arms, then it could only have been Russian fire at

that location and that has been the consistent Ukrainian allegation.

Of course, the Russians are alleging that the Ukrainians had been firing back into and causing great danger to the nuclear power station and also,

you mentioned there in the intro, this very important aspect of this that during this visit another nuclear power station had to go on to its diesel

emergency power. That means, it lost power from the outside, from the Ukrainian grid and indeed the local power station that is supposed to back

it up and they had to go onto diesel cooling systems.


Now, if those diesel generators fail, you get a meltdown -- Richard.

QUEST: All right, and that, of course, Three Mile Island, Chernobyl. That, of course is exactly what is aimed to prevent in any way whatsoever.

Sam Kiley, joining us on and when there is more report, Sam, please come back.

Now, to a story that really brings together all that we talk about -- business, economics, geopolitics, and indeed, the war in Ukraine.

The Russian gas and oil giant, Lukoil has confirmed that the Chairman Ravil Maganov has died.

This is the interesting part: Russian state media says he fell out of the window of the hospital where he was being treated. Now, it's a case of

whether it was a suicide or otherwise, we don't know.

That's the latest in a series of deaths of businessmen in Russia, many of whom have opposed the war in Ukraine, as indeed did Ravil Maganov urging a

speedy settlement with Ukraine.

Since last January, at least five Russian businessmen have died, all reportedly of suicide. Masha Gessen is a staff writer at "The New Yorker"

and she joins me from Massachusetts.

This is -- I mean, you know, we don't know, and I'll preface that, we don't know. Did he fall? Was he pushed? Or did he jump? That's what we don't


MASHA GESSEN, STAFF WRITER, "THE NEW YORKER": Richard, that is very much the point. We don't know and we will never know, and that is how terror

works, right?

Terror works by creating terrifying uncertainty. The only thing that you're supposed to be certain enough in conditions of terror is that it can come

for you. In what shape it will come? Whether you will be poisoned, arrested, driven out of the country, and then hunted down, or whether you

will voluntarily or not quite voluntarily walk out a window, you don't know and that's part of what makes terror actually take.

QUEST: One of the interesting things about this, of course, amongst many others is what happens next? Because the opposition, the Lukoil Chairman,

it was a sort of a lukewarm opposition to the war, as much as anybody ever could do that.

And I'm wondering, is anybody, do you think, going to take this further? Or will it just be figuratively and literally buried?

GESSEN: It will absolutely be buried. Here, I can be as certain as we can be of something that hasn't happened yet. But we know that not a single

politically motivated, possible murder, not a single suspicious death that has occurred in Russia, with the exception of the recent death by car bomb

of pro-Kremlin commentator, Darya Dugina has ever been investigated, and has ever been actually solved.

So, we know with as much certainty as we can know anything that this will be buried, and we will never know. And again, that's the point.

Now, what is the point of this terror? It is to communicate that opposition to the war is impossible any form -- mild form, veiled form, in a Kremlin-

friendly form, there's no such thing. Opposition will not be tolerated.

QUEST: And you know, as you were talking, I was just remembering one of the facts of this particular case, the closed circuit TV -- the CCTV --

apparently, was not working because it was being repaired. I am not sure, I would say "How convenient."

GESSEN: And how common, how incredibly common that this exact thing happens pretty much every time there is a suspicious death in Russia.

QUEST: Thank you for joining us, very grateful to have you with us and your perspective today. Masha Gessen, staff writer at "The New Yorker."


Well tonight, it's Quest Means the Met.

We're at the Metropolitan Museum of Art, an institution that suffered strongly and severely during the pandemic. You'll hear from the Chief

Executive how things have improved.



QUEST: One of the things about the Metropolitan Museum of Art is it is a cornerstone of arts and culture in the city, not only literally --

figuratively, but literally as well.

Because if you look, we are just at the edge of Central Park and the museum itself goes into the park, and as you can see, it is a classically

delightful, magnificent day. The perfect sort of end of summer day that you get into New York.

So, it all raises the interesting question for The Met itself, what makes this institution so important?

Why the Met?


QUEST (voice over): It is home to humanity's greatest achievements. Art from the Roman Empire, Ancient Egypt, Mighty Japan, with tons from Europe

and America of course; and it is all nestled in Central Park on Museum Mile amidst some of the most expensive real estate in New York.

The Met is a New York institution. It is much younger than its peers across the Atlantic, like the Louvre in Paris, the National Gallery in London.

Here, it's paying tribute to the American experiment, and its status is second to none.

It has an endowment of more than $3 billion, and each year the rich and famous line up for the Annual Met Gala, the gathering is the most important

night for New York fashion, avant-garde outfits galore, performances as intricate as the art itself.

Celebrities proudly casting off inhibitions as they pursue a new kind of beauty, and political stunts to fill the pages of newspapers.

The building is a work of art in its own right. It has been appropriated by the silver screen, many times, the Temple of Dendur in "Ocean's 8" and the

famous stone steps, "Gossip Girl."

The Metropolitan Museum of Art, The Met, whose reach and influence extends well beyond its art. It is a hallmark of the city in which it lives.



QUEST (on camera): Now, during the pandemic, The Met was not immune. Of course not. Indeed, there were no visitors here for many, many months, and

even with a large endowment and ability to have lots of funds, very soon, The Met was having to think the unthinkable, having to consider selling art

-- precious art.

But then finally, things reopened.

I spoke to the outgoing CEO of The Met, Dan Weiss, who told me, when he looks back at the pandemic, he talked me through how The Met survived.


DAN WEISS, OUTGOING CEO, METROPOLITAN MUSEUM OF ART: In the middle of the 2020 issues following closing in the pandemic, art museum and every museum

struggled with that question: Should we be allowed to sell works of art to pay the bills? And that was a question the profession of museums in the

United States was debating, because many of them who don't have endowment like The Met, were going to have to close and never open.

So, we resolved that issue at the time by allowing for the possibility that we would do that if we had to. But we did it very, very little and we

haven't had to since, and we almost never will.

QUEST: And where are you now in terms of the financial health, if you will.

WEISS: We are in a very good place. We immediately -- even then, we recognized we were losing revenue, so we had to make adjustments, and we

were able to do that in various ways. And now our operating budgets are strong.

We have built good models, so we know over the next few years, what we can anticipate based on this pandemic, and we're managing.

For many years, we had a Pay As You Wish Program for everybody, and regrettably, over a 10-year period, the amount of people we're paying

declined dramatically. Not sure exactly why, but if we call that a social experiment, everybody can pay whatever they want and that will allow the

museum to thrive, it wasn't working.

We weren't generating the revenue, we needed to be The Met, and therefore we faced a choice. Either we changed the admissions policy to generate the

revenues that we need, or we diminish the museum because we don't have the funds we need to do the work we do.

And we decided that as a social experiment, if everybody is obligated to support us at some level, and admission's fee is a reasonable thing to ask

from people.

The American Wing, of course, has great collections of American paintings, but one of the things we're always interested in, is creating a "wow"

experience for the visitor where they can look down and see something really impressive, and throughout the museum, you see these vistas aligned

on some kind of an axis or that something you can see in the distance.

QUEST: I mean, I remember in the 2000s, in the 1990s, the really big exhibitions that would get millions of people coming through. How important

are they?

WEISS: We still do.

QUEST: Really?

WEISS: They are very important, because we use them as a way to create new and innovative programs for visitors who come all the time, they want to

see what's new and what's interesting. That's one reason.

They bring new audiences, and because every one of those exhibitions tells a story and create some new knowledge about something.

QUEST: This is a blockbuster.

WEISS: This is one of our most famous paintings. It isn't necessarily one of the greatest, but it is famous and it is a wonderful image of George

Washington at a historic moment in American history. There's almost nothing about this painting that is historically accurate, but it's still iconic.

QUEST: You've said it's not a competition between museums, but it is.

WEISS: Well, we pay attention to each other, I would say that.

QUEST: But how do all of you compete against the sovereign wealth funded museums? I am thinking of the Gulf, of course, in those parts of the world,

and Asia, where there are such large sums of money that you can't compete?

WEISS: No, well, in competing for access to say collections and the open market of acquiring works of art, we often lose to those wealthier rivals

as it were that you're describing, for sure, we don't have the kind of wealth that they have.

We don't compete with great museums for audiences. We don't really compete so much for staff. We compete for works of art that are rare and difficult

to collect. So, if there's a great masterpiece that we want and the Louvre wants it and they want it in Abu Dhabi, we may not win, but we will compete

for it.


QUEST: We will compete, and later, you're going to hear Dan tell us all about what makes a piece of art "Met worthy." That's the phrase that they


There are thousands of tourists, millions perhaps in New York at the moment. I'm wondering how many more will arrive on Lufthansa, bearing in

mind, there is summer travel chaos on the horizon for Lufthansa passengers. The airline is canceling hundreds of flights on Friday, that's tomorrow

because of a pilot strike.

And are you ready for this? A hundred thirty thousand passengers, you could be one of them who could be affected.




QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest at The Met Museum. There is a lot more Quest Means Museums this evening, along with QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. We'll be

talking in a second or three about the pilot strike at Lufthansa and what it means, why are they on strike this time, and sold out concerts,

blockbuster exhibitions, tourists everywhere -- New York is back.

So, what is the arts and culture seem like over here? At the moment, has it recovered? And if not, what more needs to be done?

We'll be back with that in a moment, only after I've updated with the news headlines.

Well, you know this bit, this is CNN and on this network, the news comes first.

A damning UN report says China's treatment of its Muslim population may amount of crimes against humanity. It documented arbitrary and

discriminatory detentions against Uighurs and other minorities in the Xinjiang region. Chinese government has called the findings invalid and


A US Federal Judge will rule later on whether documents seized from Donald Trump's home should be reviewed by a so-called Special Master.

Donald Trump's lawyers requested the independent review, but the hearing ended without a decision.

The Justice Department says giving classified material to a Special Master would harm national security and jeopardize its investigation.

And the US Republicans, Sarah Palin lost Wednesday night in a special election to fill a vacant House seat for the rest of the year. Palin had

been endorsed by Donald Trump. Of course, Sarah Palin is the former Alaska Governor, she lost to a Democrat who will be the first Alaskan native in US

Congress. Meanwhile, Sarah Palin herself is running to win the seat for the next full-term in November midterm elections.




QUEST: Lufthansa pilots are going on strike on Friday. That's just a few hours from now, wherever you are. The two main hubs it will affect, of

course, Frankfurt and Munich.

But of course, the amount of connecting traffic through those mega hubs is extraordinary, 130,000 passengers could be and will be affected. Anna

Stewart is monitoring events.

Why are they on strike?

ANNA STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, this is an ongoing dispute about pay and this is not the first time you have had Lufthansa pilots striking

over the summer. We had one earlier in the summer.

And similarly, the disruption caused by that one was vast, 130,000 on passengers and practically all flights from Munich and Frankfurt were


At last cost, Richard, it's estimated that a 24-hour strike for Lufthansa costs between 25 million and 30 million euros. Now at the heart of this

one, the pilots represented by the union want a 5.5 percent pay rise. They also want their pay to keep up with inflation thereafter.

And this is clearly something that has not been agreed on. Lufthansa are in talks now for weeks and weeks. They did offer 900 euros more per month for

pilots. But that has not been agreed to. Richard.

QUEST: This is going to be emblematic of other issues with wage demands.

Sticking just with Lufthansa, the level of chaos, what do you expect?

STEWART: I'm expecting this to be probably as chaotic as the last strike that we covered. I spoke to lots of passengers there. And as you know,

Frankfurt, of course, and Munich are big airports, particularly for connections.

The long haul customers, people that start their journeys before the strike starts and often, if they have not been keeping a check on the emails and

messages, find themselves stranded and unsure what to do.

The last time, just given the magnitude of this sort of strike, it's very hard actually for the airline to be able to communicate with each and every

customer about when their flight will be revoked.

People I spoke to last time were saying, actually, the flight we are going to get won't take off for another two weeks. Well, that does not work. I

need to get home tomorrow.

And people wondering, what are their rights in terms of refunds?

Can they book into a hotel?

So there will probably lots and lots of questions on Twitter. I'm actually already seeing some now.

QUEST: Then maybe tomorrow you will answer some of them. I mean, not on Twitter. You can find out the main themes from that. We can talk again

about that later. Anna Stewart, I'm grateful, thank you.

More from The Met in just a moment.

The role of the celebrity, both the event and the personality, and how it is a museum and sure that that which is within is really up to snuff. We

will talk again to the CEO, about (INAUDIBLE) at The Met Gala.





QUEST: Today's museums have a difficult balancing act between the need for academic and artistic superiority, in a sense, the finest pieces. But also,

you've got to get people in through the front door to actually make them want to come here and have exhibitions.

Hence, of course, the blockbuster exhibitions that we saw so much in the 1980s and `90s and are still extremely popular today. For instance, just

today, just behind me in another hall, it would take you a half an hour to find it in a place that's so big but this is the scene earlier.

These are the lines for the "In America: An Anthology of Fashion," incredibly popular. People coming to see it. It ends this weekend, which is

maybe why so many people are trying to get a last gasp at it. This exhibition explores links between period fashions and history.

So what is the role for the museum?

How do you determine what is worthy of going on the walls of The Met?

They call it Met worthy and it's to the CEO, Dan Weiss.



QUEST (voice-over): What determines that that is worthy to be on the wall?

DANIEL WEISS, CEO, METROPOLITAN MUSEUM OF ART: So every object in this collection, every single one, has a curator who is responsible for it and

making judgments about what hangs on the wall.

And even though it seems to you like there are many, many things, there is a competition for wall space. And many, many things don't make it because

they are not distinctive enough, they are not good enough, they are not important enough, they don't have a story.

Every object in these galleries, if you are with the curator who made that judgment, they would tell you why it is there. But they are almost always

artistically significant; they are the best example of the genre that they are.

QUEST: How often does somebody say, this needs to be in the collection or this is a modern piece or whatever and you think, that is a load of


WEISS: Well, there are discussions with curators all the time.

QUEST: Do you disagree with them sometimes?

WEISS: Sometimes, yes, for sure. I'm not an expert in what they do, so I respect them. But that doesn't mean -- I have the right to ask them and we

all have the right to question, well, why do you think that's important?

Do you think it's Met worthy?

Why do you think it should be in the museum?

QUEST: Oh, you've just used the phrase.

WEISS: Met worthy.

QUEST: Met worthy.

What does Met worthy mean?

WEISS: Among the best of its kind in the world, of enduring importance and worthy of the kind of public attention it's going to get here for


QUEST: You can have one piece from the collection, any piece at all, we will lend it to you. You will give it back when you pass.

But one piece to take home for the rest of your life, which piece is it going to be?

Which statue?

Which --


WEISS: It's a wonderful question. My answer would be a little bit surprising. There is a small bronze, a Hellenistic bronze, that was made

about the 3rd century BC, of a dancing woman, completely enshrouded, as she is spinning in her dance. And it was made in Greece or Egypt, during the

3rd century BC.

It is a remarkable work of art because of its subtlety and its brilliance. It reminds me of why I love art, that every single gallery here has things

I'd love to take home if I were given that opportunity. But that small object connected with me early in my career and has been a long time


QUEST: Here, we have a ladle from 1777 in silver. I'm sure some would say it's a very important ladle.

WEISS: Yes, somebody would.

QUEST: I look at it and say, it is a ladle.

WEISS: Well, our curators would say, if you read the label and take a look at it, you will see it's one of the best examples of what it is ever made.

And there's a story behind it. Some of these objects were made by Paul Revere, the great American patriot, who was a silversmith.


Some of these objects are just the finest of their kind ever made.

QUEST: You've got The Met Gala. You have these very, very famous events that are all about celebrity, fame, money, benefactors, donors.

How do you prevent it from just becoming an elitist institution?


QUEST: Bearing in mind, the fame of the place.

WEISS: Well, it's a great question. It's a really good question. We work really hard to get people comfortable with coming up these steps.

Most of us can remember the first time we came here, the bottom of the stairs, looking up at this great place, wondering, is this for me?

What will happen when I go inside?

Are they going to let me stay?

Am I going to be embarrassed?

Am I going to be asked to leave?

How do we make sure we get them inside and make clear to them we want them here?

That is hard work because it's an intimidating place. And without us making that effort, most people will assume it is not for them. But it is for

them. That is why we are here.


QUEST: Intimidating and brilliant at the same time. The Met here.

Now the New York's post pandemic revival is in full swing. Hotel rates are through the roof. It is now getting more difficult to get in to see some of

the more popular shows and there are still seats elsewhere. Rents are skyrocketing.

If you were at classic cocktail party chitchat in this city, it's how much is the rent, how hard it was to find somewhere to live.

However, Broadway tendencies have not yet fully come back. Less than half of the pre-pandemic attendance but that might just be depending on which,

which we are going to. Live music is thriving. The pop singer at Harry Styles -- 15 shows, 15 shows at Madison Square Garden.

My sister and my daughter went to see it. Said she thoroughly enjoyed it, packed to the rafters. Anyway, Billy Joel's residency at Madison Square has

sold out more than 80 nights.

So here at The Met, the visitor numbers are recovering, still well below pre-pandemic levels.

Genevieve Smith is the features director for "New York Magazine;" is with me now.

Give me an overview, in terms of how you think not The Met per se but the arts and culture has recovered now in New York?

GENEVIEVE SMITH, FEATURES DIRECTOR, "NEW YORK MAGAZINE": So "New York Magazine," it's a 50-year old magazine. We've been around since 1968. And

we've covered the culture of the city from the get-go, both the culture that is in places like this and also just the culture, lower case culture,

of how people behave and what the trends are.

It did feel, obviously, when the pandemic started and everything shut down, we saw tons of businesses and restaurants close. We saw nightlife kind of

dry up. But it certainly feels like it is back.

There's so much fantastic stuff going on. In our new issue, we have our fall preview issue, where we talk about the arts, restaurant openings and

theater that's going on. It does feel like there's a lot of exciting ferment (ph) in the city right now.

QUEST: And I have several of the issues here, which I'm looking forward to reading over the weekend, when I'm out on a long weekend. And, of course,

this also -- this is one your staples -- we will leave that for another day.

I guess, what's different, in your view, what is different, before and now?

SMITH: I would say one of the things that I think is different is there's a real thrill in being around other people. I have not gotten over it. When

I go to see theater, I saw theater last night, I've seen it several times in the last few months.

And there's such an excitement to be together, seeing something live, not mediated by a screen, having this feeling that anything might happen. And I

think that's the excitement that people get when they are going to see Harry Styles or Billy Joel or the tiny night clubs and deejay nights and

stuff like that, that have opened up across the city.

QUEST: You raise a very valid point, which is the big and the popular, the Billy Joel, the Harry Styles, they can fill Madison Square Garden.

"Hamilton" is doing great guns; "Funny Girl," my sister was there, said it was packed.

But what about the off-Broadway and the avant-garde, the new stuff that's out in places like Rockland and Queens?

SMITH: It's the best time to see that stuff.

QUEST: But is it thriving?

Is it thriving or is it suffering from, if you like, lack of investment in terms of the widest sense?

Because so much was put into the big stuff.

SMITH: I don't know. I think that's always the best spots in New York, are the small underground. I think they're absolutely thriving. And there's

just a real exciting creative time happening in New York. There is just a lot of experimentation in art.


You know, one thing that happens in a lot of places, when a lot of places close down, new places open up. And you are seeing a lot of really cool

underground things right now.

QUEST: With that underground scene, how does New York, what does New York need to do next?

What is the number one trick?

Because taxes are going up, it's all becoming very expensive.

What is the thing that New York needs to do to remain preeminent?

Because I was in the (INAUDIBLE) in Dubai and you see the money that they are spending there.

Can New York live on its laurels or does it need to invest?

SMITH: I mean, I -- absolutely it needs to invest. To me, you mentioned it earlier, rent is going up really high. I would say that investing in places

for young, creative people to live, young people generally --


QUEST: Berlin, Berlin is the example of how to do it. New York --


QUEST: -- I don't want to be laughing but New York, you have to come and struggle.

SMITH: Sure.

QUEST: There is not a huge amount of support that will help you through.

SMITH: Sure, totally, absolutely. Arts grants, more places to live, I would love it. I love it all.

QUEST: Right, final thoughts: shows that I must see.

SMITH: Oh, man, let's see; "Into the Woods," if you can get tickets, it's fantastic. "A Strange Loop" is amazing.


SMITH: I dare you to get tickets to that right now.

QUEST: I forgot to ask him, we had the author, of course, on the program on Friday. So I forgot to get --

That was a miss, wasn't it?

What else?

SMITH: You've got to get tickets.

QUEST: What's the one thing, if I said to you, OK, you can do one thing in New York today, just one thing?

SMITH: Oh my gosh, that is too much pressure.

QUEST: One thing.

SMITH: Oh, gosh, well, you are right by Central Park and today's actually a beautiful day, so I think that if I would do one thing, I would be

walking outside right now. Thank you so much.

QUEST: Absolutely, thank you and coming talking to us. Thank you very much, indeed. Very kind of you.

As we continue tonight from The Met, art, as an investment, the number of times I've been told when I've looked, oh, it'll go up in value, sir.

Well, does it?

Or should you just buy what you like and leave the money to somebody else?




QUEST: I might be stating the obvious but The Met is the home of many works of art, some of which are, of course, indeed priceless.


The 2 million works of art that they have here, there and everywhere, many of them are paper works, by the way, and they are stored elsewhere, 5,000

years of history, tradition, all within that collection.

Now it lightly gained in value last year because art sales were up 29 percent last year. It's a recovery from the pandemic, when the $65 billion

market, 20 percent of it is now online, extraordinary, 20 percent of sales are online.

So the most expensive, Picasso's "Woman Sitting Near a Window," $103 million. It was nearly double the painting's estimate. The second most

expensive, Jean-Michel Basquiat created the painting, "In This Case."

It was created, oh, my goodness, it was created in 1983 and it sold for $93 million. You have to go back to 2016 to find the -- I think it's the

Leonardo da Vinci, which is the most expensive work of art that has ever been sold at auction. Rahel Solomon is with me.

The core question, is art a good investment?

RAHEL SOLOMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it depends on who you are, because if you are looking to beat the markets, for example, over the last year,

well, you had no problem. That's just because the markets were just in terrible shape.

To add to that, U.S. market sales for art really outperformed. Sales increased 33 percent, Richard, in 2021.

That was just over $28 billion. I wonder when sort of doing the research for this, what could it have been because of inflation?

Of course, the ill of global society right now and the relationship between art sales and inflation is actually not very clear. It's mixed evidence, in

terms of whether inflation outpaces art or vice versa.

QUEST: But recession will crimp people. But if you are paying $100 million with these fascinating inflationary sales, you can see the connection, in a


If you spend $30 million, $40 million, $50 million, do you worry about recession?

SOLOMON: Well, I think we are talking about high wealth and ultra high wealth individuals, for sure.


SOLOMON: I think what's really interesting, Richard, is that 80 percent of all art sales are concentrated in three countries: U.S., U.K. and China.

The order being U.S., China and U.K., for the last year.

So we are talking about a very small group of ultra high wealth individuals. But I would argue, clearly they've been shielded from some of

the woes that we've seen in the markets this year, because, on average, Americans have lost $0.5 trillion in the market freefall this year. But

clearly, that's not a crimping demand for some in the art world.


QUEST: Then you get to the whole thing where the likes of you and me, we see something in a shop or an art gallery or it's a modest -- not Met

worthy but modest. And you are told it will be a good investment, it will go up in value. But you don't really know.


SOLOMON: You really don't know because, to your point, art goes up and down. But also, the value of certain artists go up and down. So you don't

really know.

That's why they say, buy what you love. I would add, art is in the eye of the beholder. So what you find priceless, some may not, although I find

that hard to believe because you have a certain palate, a certain eye.

QUEST: Oh, I'm very traditional. Give me the Monets, the Renoirs, not the --


SOLOMON: All impressionists for me, too.

QUEST: I suppose one could be dismissive and say, I'm sort of chocolate box top, you know?

The cover of a chocolate box.

Funny, I want to ask from you the same sort of question about how you are finding, how you find New York and the culture scene at the moment, the

ability to get out.

Can you feel that recovery?

And can you also feel the level of apprehension over what is coming next?

SOLOMON: I don't know about apprehension.

Can I feel the recovery?

Absolutely. It's the fact that you can't get a table anywhere; certainly not me. Maybe you but you can't get a table anywhere, that there are lines


You pointed out earlier in the show that Harry Styles sold out all 15 of his shows. I mean, the demand for life and getting out is certainly there.

The apprehension about what's coming next in the markets and in the economy, harder to sort of really put your finger on.

QUEST: Since you look at this every day, going into a long weekend, where are we?

How worried, how worried?

SOLOMON: Oh, I think the markets are totally freaking out. I think that's the technical term for it. I mean, we have a rough few weeks, to say the

least, heading into September and heading into the fall, until we start to see --

QUEST: So it's not over yet?

SOLOMON: Absolutely not, absolutely not. So just buckle up and enjoy the ride and enjoy some good art.

QUEST: Thank you, good to see you. Thank you for coming up here.

Now there is the last few moments of trading on Wall Street, which I need to update you with. The Dow is flat. Look at the numbers. You will see, the

Dow is 61 -- it's doing absolutely nothing.


But that's not really where the issue is. The Nasdaq is where the issue is. Look at the Dow 30 and the components, the pharma giant Merck and J&J are

leading 2 percent higher.

Boeing struggles at the moment. Boeing is down 4 percent and that is one of the reasons.

What's interesting is that Boeing is down 4 percent, then those gains by other stocks like Amgen, Merck, McDonald's really are ramping it up because

you and I have spoken about it many times, Boeing is the largest component in terms of value on the stock market.

So that's the way the market is looking. As we continue on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, we will have a "Profitable Moment" from The Met. Summer Fridays,

by the way, we've got another Summer Friday tomorrow. Tomorrow, we will be at Grand Central Terminal, not station. I will explain all that tomorrow.

Grand Central on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS tomorrow.




QUEST: Tonight's "Profitable Moment" from The Met: of course, being a business show, it has to be about money.

The financing of arts and culture in our societies is Byzantine, it's difficult and it's discriminatory, there's no getting away from that. You

have the very large institutions, like the National Gallery, the Louvre and The Met, which have strong, big endowments, which are well publicly funded.

Then you have the smaller institutions, the local museum, the local art gallery, the village fete, if you will. And there, of course, it's a very

different kettle of fish.

And then what do you buy, too?

Well, look at the contributions we individually make. Here at The Met, if you live in New York, you are not obliged to pay to come. In fact, nobody

is obliged to pay. But if you live in New York, you don't pay to come to visit The Met.

Quite right, too, I pay my taxes.

But visitors and tourists?

There is a donation requested. The problem is, when you did not pay, well, then The Met and others suffer. The pandemic showed us just how fragile our

cultural institutions are, how they need to be nurtured and protected.

And even if institutions like The Met are sometimes seeming to be awash with money, there is always the next place.

And that is our program from The Met. Tomorrow night, we are at Grand Central. That's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest at The

Metropolitan Museum of Art. Whatever you are up to in the hours ahead, I hope it is profitable.