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Quest Means Business

US Adds 353K Jobs In January, Doubling Expectations; Ukraine's Army Chief: Design Of War Has Changed; Apple Vision Pro Mixed Reality Headset Hits US Stores; Iran's President Vows Strong Response Against "Bullies"; Closing Arguments Underway In Trial Of School Shooter's Mom; Andy Gotts On Pushing Photography Limits; U.S. Wages Grew 0.6 Percent In January, Up 4.5 Percent Year-On-Year. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired February 02, 2024 - 15:00   ET



RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: An hour to go before trading comes to an end. As my late grandfather used to say, "By jingo, just look at

that." The market is up like a rocket this afternoon. Meta is up. Meta is up some extraordinary amount. I'll tell you in a moment. It's up 20

percent. We'll get to all of those details, but it is a good day on market and the markets and the events of the day.

US hiring surpasses expectations. Job creation has become a robust machine for the US economy.

The first customers get their hands on Apple's Vision Pro Headset. Tim Cook was there. We will tell you whether it's worth it, well and how it all


And an exclusive piece for CNN: Ukraine's army chief bemoans the weakness of economic sanctions against Russia. We'll put it in perspective.

Live from New York, end of the week, it's Friday -- if I can speak properly, I would tell you it is Friday, February the 2nd, you can see how

the hour is going to go.

I'm Richard Quest, together we mean business.

Good evening.

The US economy has defied all predictions. Many more jobs, up to twice as many was expected, 350,000 were created in January, double on the line. The

employment rate held steady, it's 3.7 percent and December's job gains revised sharply upwards as well. All in all, it shows a job creating


Initially, the markets fell because of course, they are concerned about this will mean the Fed won't cut rates since it bounced back. A few

investors are now expecting rates to be cut in March that pretty much is off the table. Rana is with me.

First of all, Rana thank you for your kind, good wishes in our 15th anniversary. That is so kind of you.


QUEST: Rana, so what's driving the jobs machine? Because it's in all areas, all categories.

FOROOHAR: Yes, you know, Richard, I've got to say, I think we can make at this point, a pretty strong case for what Janet Yellen would call the new

supply side theory, right? I mean, this is Bidenomics. This is putting money into reindustrialization. This is, you know, consumer spending that's

robust, because people came out of the pandemic pretty well, because they were bailed out.

I just think we're seeing US policy following the pandemic that really has done much better than many other places around the world. Consumers are

feeling good, consumer sentiment has finally kind of caught up with the fact that the data has been changing for some time. And, you know, the job

numbers are supporting it.

So you know, this is really the kind of Main Street recovery that we haven't seen in a long, long time.

QUEST: It does mean -- I don't want to be a Jeremiah in all of this. But it does mean that the Fed will hold longer.


QUEST: Because this sort of job creation, and I noticed, you know, average wage is up 4.5 percent y-on-y.


QUEST: So you're going to want to avoid that feeding too much into inflation.

FOROOHAR: You are. You are, and we're going to want to see the next few months of jobs and where this goes, but right now, I just -- I never really

bought the story of out-of-control wage inflation.

I mean, I always thought we had more of a cost of living crisis and then inflation was making people feel, you know, hey, we're just not keeping up.

I agree that we're not going to -- there is no way we're going to see a March cut at this point. Maybe you're going to see a cut in the summer. But

it's also interesting, Richard that yes, okay, at first, stocks were, ooh. But then you saw certain companies, Meta surging back. You know, you've

seen the markets responding pretty well.

And I just think what's not like here? It kind of makes me think, you know, turning to politics for a moment, it makes me think, maybe the election

conversation isn't going to be, at least on the Trump side were you better now than four years ago? I think it may be more about social issues. I

mean, an economy like this is going to change a lot for the next 10 months.


QUEST: All right, look at this latest poll. Look at this latest poll. I know, maybe you can't see it, but I'm going to tell you. Views on the

economy, 48 percent still say it's in a downturn, 26 percent says it has stabilized.

I had forgotten that word that they used to describe this new recession, where people believe it to be a recession, but it's not actually.

FOROOHAR: The vibesession.

QUEST: Exactly, the vibesession, thank you. Thank you. I knew you'd be familiar with these latest economic theories. But the vibesession, the vibe

is not good, as I believe the teenagers say these days.

If the vibe is not good, doesn't that hurt him?

FOROOHAR: Well, I think the vibesession is and was temporary. You know, it takes -- as they say, it takes about a year of really strong data for

consumer sentiment to catch up. You're looking at -- you look at the Michigan Index, you're seeing that start to really tick up three months now

of positive data, people feeling better and better.

I think that as long as we have a pretty robust jobs market and we have wage inflation that's wages up, but not out-of-control, that is going to

just knock the vibesession out of the water.

I mean, it's just hard to think what the average person on Main Street wouldn't like about this economy at the moment. It's just a matter of,

okay, how much further does this go? What other sectors does it trickle into? The fact that we're seeing really positive news across all sectors

now, it is not just healthcare anymore. It's not just construction anymore.

QUEST: Right.

FOROOHAR: It's across the board, that's a big deal.

QUEST: I always hesitate to believe that economic laws have been rewritten. I mean, Alan Greenspan, with his irrational exuberance in the 1990s always

said he didn't quite understand the increased productivity. Well, we haven't even seen the gains and you and I have said before from AI, that's

still to come.

FOROOHAR: Yes. Absolutely. And you know, and some job losses may come, too, so that's a double-edged sword.

QUEST: Well, of course.

FOROOHAR: But you know, I think we are in a really positive moment right now.

QUEST: Rana, I tried to find the fly in the ointment. I'm not sure I succeeded in that one. But there we go.

Have a lovely weekend. I'm grateful for you as always.

FOROOHAR: Good vibes to you, Richard.

QUEST: Thank you.

Ukraine's top commander says Ukraine needs to prepare for a reduction in western support. There's an essay on, Valerii Zaluzhnyi says the

military must turn to emerging technologies to win -- unmanned weapons, drones and the like as the central driver.

And he said, Russia had significant advantage in mobilizing human resources. He also writes that sanctions on Russia aren't working. He

writes, "The weakness of the international sanctions regime means Russia in partnership with certain others, is still able to deploy its military

industrial complex in pursuit of a war of attrition against us."

Adam Smith, is the former adviser to OFAC, the US Office of Foreign Assets Controls. He joins me from Washington. I am grateful for you.

Now, this is tricky, because he is basically saying, the sanctions haven't worked in a sense that Russia -- you know, in fact, you may tell me that,

oh, they'll work in the long run, Richard, they'll work in the long run. But by that stage, Russia has created a military machine and has

circumnavigated the worst effects.

ADAM SMITH, FORMER ADVISER, US OFFICE OF FOREIGN ASSETS CONTROLS: Indeed, well, thanks so much for having me.

And you're a hundred percent right. The long run is not really what we have to play with here, it is the short run that we need to care about, that

Ukraine definitely cares about and it is undoubtedly the case that despite the incredible sanctions, the G7 coordination, the EU coordination and

whatnot, Russia is still fighting a war.

The pressure on Ukraine is significant and the sanctions have, I think, stopped it to a degree, but certainly not in a significant manner in a way

that would sort of --the troops are not backing up -- long story short.

QUEST: Right, nor has the economy collapsed in Russia, which is the other.

SMITH: That's true.

QUEST: So, you know, the ruble has recovered. There is economic growth of three-and-a-half odd percent. Now, you and I can pass about whether or not

they're fiddling the numbers, but as long as large parts of the world avoid the sanctions -- China, South Africa, India -- there are large numbers of

countries who are still doing business, and essentially, we failed on sanctions.

SMITH: Well, I wouldn't go to that. I wouldn't go that far.

I mean, the question I think needs to be is President Putin fighting the war he wants to be fighting? And because of sanctions, export controls and

other restrictions, the answer is clearly no, but he has to go to convicts to get his personnel out. He's got to go to third rate suppliers like Iran,

North Korea to get his technology. He's got to repurpose consumer products for military ends.

This is not the war of a digital sort of the military that President Putin was well vaunted in sort of fighting. But you're right, so long as you've

got parties out there who are willing to not comply with G7, EU, US measures it's going to be challenging.


QUEST: Right. So --

SMITH: But even so --

QUEST: Even so, yes, let's get away from, if you like, from the generalities in that sense, both from my questions and drill down. What do

you think could have and should have been added to the sanctions regime that wasn't for whatever reason?

SMITH: Well, it's -- I don't think it needs to be added more than just enforced, and I think the world is catching up to this. So with respect to

the oil restrictions, for example, there is an oil price cap limitation, sanctions, if you will by the EU, the G7, the US, Australia and others, and

the US and others are picking up the enforcement of that very, very significantly.

So it's still the case, as John McCain said that Russia is a country -- is a gas station masquerading as a country. I think that's a little of a

misnomer, perhaps, but it's still a one business town.

And so if we are able to sort of really crack down on the oil, I think that the ability for Russia to continue its operations will be difficult. And to

be fair, even in the oil side, it's true that India, for example, is purchasing a lot of a Russian oil, however, they're purchasing it in

rupees, and Foreign Minister Lavrov has complained that there's too many rupees that Russia has in Delhi and unable to spend it.

So it's certainly -- they're selling the oil, which is not necessarily good, but they're not actually getting the full benefit of that sale in a

way they would if they were getting dollars or euros.

QUEST: If you all the Ukraine head of army who says the sanctions haven't worked as well as they had wanted or hoped, and you're facing an emboldened

Russia, where they are -- their military industrial complex is performing faster than the West is supplying arms to Ukraine, can you understand why

he's so unhappy?

SMITH: Without a doubt. The war has continued. I can understand why he is upset about it. I mean, sanctions, I think we can all admit was never going

to be the only solution here and perhaps they were vaunted in a way that they didn't deserve to be.

But I do think more can be done and that more is principally on the enforcement side, and I think we're starting to see that gear up rather


QUEST: Good to see you, sir. I'm very grateful. Thank you.

Robust discussion on sanctions. Thank you. Have a good weekend. Thank you.

SMITH: Thank you.

QUEST: In this hour, later on, I'll be joined by the chair of the US Council of Economic Advisers, it is Jared Bernstein. He's going to discuss

today's job numbers with me and we'll talk obviously a little bit about sanctions perhaps as well.

The Apple Vision Pro is now on sale. It's Apple's first big product release since the watch. The CEO, Tim Cook is going all in. We'll have the report.



QUEST: It's the biggest story in tech today, the Apple Vision Pro, the company's first new product in seven years and it's on the shelves in the

United States.


PEOPLE: Three, two, one.



QUEST: Now, that's Tim Cook. He celebrated the launch at the Apple Store on Fifth Avenue. Two hundred people had lined up ahead of the launch. It

happened at eight o'clock this morning.

The Vision Pro is a mixed reality headset. Now, the thing about it is, it blends virtual with the real world. So it's an iPhone or TV screen that you

strap to your face. And it's around $3,500.00.

Clare Duffy was at the launch. What's so special about it?

CLARE DUFFY, CNN BUSINESS WRITER: Richard, when you put this thing on, essentially what you're seeing is images, digital images superimposed over

the real world and it also brings some of this Apple Magic, it's a bit sleeker, a bit more comfortable than other virtual and mixed reality

headsets that we've seen so far. But what you're getting in exchange is that hefty $3,500.00 price tag. But we did speak with folks in line today

who said that they felt like that price tag would be worth it. Let's listen.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are here to live a historic moment. The future has no price.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But for now, it must be pricey because there are no compromise over the technology used.

I'm ready to pay the price to try a new technology, yes.


DUFFY: As you're seeing there, there was a lot of excitement at the Apple Store this morning. You had as you said, customers lined up before the

doors opened, people cheering, people taking selfies with CEO Tim Cook as they let people inside.

And we talked to some folks inside who were trying out the Apple Vision Pro who essentially said that they felt like they were feeling and touching a

piece of the future. I want to show you one other conversation that I had with somebody as they were getting a demo -- Richard.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When you try it, it's very different. So like, I didn't see everything, but spatial videos are insane.

DUFFY: What are you seeing right now?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Actually, I can send an environment, Mount Hood, and I can see you, you look like a ghost.


DUFFY: I love that, "You look like a ghost." He was apparently seeing Mount Hood in Oregon and talking to me at the same time. But Richard, I will say,

Apple had hyped this feature before the launch that as an outsider, you can see people's eyes when they're wearing these things. It's supposed to make

it less weird to talk to them when they have the Vision Pro on, but I will say, it was still pretty strange.

As an outsider, it was hard for me to tell whether he could actually see me as he was talking to me.

QUEST: What do you think?

DUFFY: It seems strange. I mean, it seems really like a promising opportunity. The device is launching with 600 apps that were built

specifically for the Vision Pro, things like Disney+, ESPN, Microsoft 365.

But in my mind, what Apple has to prove here is once this cool factor wears off of this exciting new product, will people actually wear this thing on a

regular basis, use it in their daily lives, even though it's the sort of bulky, funny looking and really expensive headset.

QUEST: I tried Google Glass some years ago, so I know what you meant.

Meta, the share price is up 20 percent. Bearing in mind what happened with Zuckerberg on Capitol Hill, why -- what's happened today? What have I


DUFFY: Yes, Richard it is really striking to look at the share price. Mark Zuckerberg's net worth raised about $30 billion in just the time between

breakfast and lunch today. And what we're talking about here is Apple or I'm sorry, Meta's really stunning earnings report last night, as well as

the company announced its first quarterly dividend and a $50 billion dollar share buyback last night.

But what that report last night really showed is that the company's year of efficiency turnaround plan really was working. The quarterly earnings

report last night showed that profits from the December quarter were up 200 percent. There were some promising signs for the company's core advertising

business as well as its investments in artificial intelligence.

And so what I think you're seeing is that while Mark Zuckerberg faced harsh words on Capitol Hill on Wednesday, he was forced to apologize to the

parents of children who are harmed by his platforms. He's not necessarily facing any material consequences -- Richard.

QUEST: And the dividend, good Lord, could Meta be growing up and actually paying a dividend? I'm grateful to you. Thank you very much indeed.

Money, money, money, money, money, money, money, money -- the fight against counterfeit money is a real headache for all central banks and it seems the

ECB is on the right track trying to sort it all out.

The ECB says only 16 counterfeits were detected per million real banknotes in the last year, slightly, but still lower than the pandemic. So can you

tell if your precious euros, greenbacks, sterling or whatever are real? Looks can be deceiving. It's all about the sound, the feel, and it could

all tell a lot.

I spoke to the counterfeit expert at the ECB who showed me how to use almost all your senses to spot what's real and what's not.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It starts with the feel, so banknote paper has a particular feel. It is strong, even the sound when you move it in your

hands, is crisp and firm. It's not like any ordinary paper.

You notice that, don't you?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, so this is the sound of real money. This is fake.

So then we have things that you can feel with your hands, like those lines along the margins. That's also meant for the blind, and for the visually


There is more to see, and the only special, the tilt part. If for instance, you look at the emerald number as we call it down here and let's look at it

in comparison.

Now it's got the name emerald number for a reason.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because it's emerald green, isn't it?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And as tilt the genuine note, you will see that there is a bar -- a rolling bar moving up and down, virtually, you can.

QUEST: Yes, yes, yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is the counterfeit able to match that?

QUEST: Not at all.


QUEST: But how much of all of this is you being one step ahead of the counterfeiters, in a sense that, you know, you're only as good as your last

detection of the one because they're going to catch up and then you need to be one stage ahead.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, that's an illusion that the counterfeiters are very eager to catch up. In fact, the counterfeiters do as much as they have

to, and not a step further.

QUEST: But would you accept that, if I take this out to a shop now, 99.5 percent, it's going to get accepted?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, I wouldn't define a certain percentage. But yes, you have every chance of it being accepted that one and worse quality than

that, because of the lack of attention.

QUEST: Thank you very much, sir.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're welcome.

QUEST: Thank you. Thank you. Don't worry about that. I'll take of this.

I'll buy you dinner.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm afraid I need that back. One is my own, the other is evidence.


QUEST: The security around the area where the counterfeiting work is done is quite extraordinary, but for obviously, strong reasons.

Now we spoke about Russian sanctions earlier in the program and the backlash against Russia for its war in Ukraine is starting to hit the

Russian diamond industry.

Both EU and G7 have slapped bans on Russian diamond imports, that would squeeze the supply of something that's already rare. Luckily, lab grown

diamonds, oh, I do love a lab grown diamond, are becoming more possible and acceptable.

So now, Think Big looks at how the industry is emerging in the UAE.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice over): To source diamonds, miners have to dig deep, forming some of the world's largest manmade pits or there's this.

MOHAMED SABEG, CO-FOUNDER, 2DOT4 DIAMONDS: To access the diamond, we just need to open the chamber. That's a beauty.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice over): Mohamed Sabeg co-founded 2DOT4 DIAMONDS in 2022. They're the first to produce, cut and polish lab grown diamonds in

the United Arab Emirates. The country is home to one of the world's most important trading hubs for diamonds and now, it is stepping into


SABEG: Our idea was to bring the mine to the consumer where the diamond will be produced, made locally, and sold locally to the market. What else

can be better than opening this kind of facility in Dubai?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice over): The UAE was the world's largest importer, and third largest exporter of diamonds in 2022 according to the World Bank.

For those who witnessed the opening of Dubai's Diamond Exchange 20 years ago, this is an unexpected feat.

AHMED SULTAN BIN SULAYEM, EXECUTIVE CHAIRMAN OF DUBAI MULTI COMMODITIES CENTRE: Dubai was already coffee market, it is a tea market, a gold

industry. Before diamonds, it was seen as an impossible situation.

We can't replicate what works for Botswana, which sits on so many mines or South Africa. It took some infrastructures. It took a tax free environment.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice over): China, the United States and India are currently the largest producers of lab grown diamonds according to expert

rankings. The UAE's diamond production doesn't compare to these major players, but as companies like 2DOT4 set up shop in the United Arab



SABEG: And you can have a look inside, you will see how it's beautiful.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice over): The question remains, will the country transcend diamond trading to become a key player in production.

BIN SULAYEM: And maybe in twenty, thirty years, a lot of these mines would have run out. Most likely, you go for the lab grown and there is a market

for that.

Sixty years ago, you tell someone this is a synthetic or a lab grown diamond, they won't even look at it. It has to be natural.

Millennials generation, Zed, then Alpha, it's a whole different thing. So the industry has to adapt.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice over): 2DOT4 says it had a total output of 10 carats in 2023, but expects production to be five times higher this year.

For Mohamed, the beauty of making the hardest object on Earth lies in its fluidity.

SABEG: The beauty of this industry is a mix of technology and art. The diamond is something amazing. It's something beautiful.


QUEST: Breaking News: Turkey's Central Bank governor has resigned. Hafize Gaye Erkan was the first woman to run the bank and brought in by President

Erdogan to radically overhaul monetary policy after years of low rates and political interference and the sky high inflation.

Now Reuters are saying she cited a need to protect her family and amid a reputation assassination for her resignation.

In just a moment, the dignified transfer of three US soldiers. Their remains have returned to home soil. President Biden says he is readying a




QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. Together, we'll have a lot more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.

President Biden's top economic advisors. One of them will be with us to discuss the blockbuster job numbers.

And also, the vibe session and the president are getting credit.

And the celebrity photographer Andy Gotts is taking pictures of everyone from Elton John to Dolly Parton and told me about the one famous face

that's eluded him.

We'll get to all of that but only after the headlines because this is CNN and here, the news always comes first.

Greta Thunberg has been cleared in London of a public order offence. She and four others were arrested in October outside an oil and gas industry

conference. A London judge ruled that they were not given reasonable time to move to an area set aside for protesters.

A massive explosion rocked Nairobi overnight killing three people and injuring 280. The blast came from a truck carrying gas and spot fires

throughout one district. Kenya's deputy president said an investigation is underway and those accountable will be held responsible -- those

responsible will be held accountable.

Russian courts have handed out the first LGBT related convictions. One man was found guilty for extremism by posting a picture of the LGBT flag

online, and others found guilty of a rainbow flag earrings. Russian law prohibits anyone displaying the symbols of organizations that considers

extreme, that includes social media.

The actor Carl Weathers, best known for his role as Apollo Creed in the enormously successful "Rocky" movie has died. A 50-year career in movies

and television included roles in "Star Wars" series, "The Mandalorian" and the co-starring role with Arnold Schwarzenegger in "Predator", he was 76.

The bodies of three U.S. service members killed in Jordan are back on American soil. The president and the first lady attended what's called the

dignified transfer. The U.S. is blaming Iran backed militias for the drone strike that took their lives. The U.S. president says he's decided on a

response but he hasn't given any further details. U.S. officials say multi- phase counter strike is expected soon.

Iran's president has warned in return, his country will respond strongly to bullies. Our chief U.S. Security Correspondent Jim Sciutto. He is with me.

Let's roll.

We'll break this into two if we may. Because the stories are related. But I don't want to conflate. First of all, the dignified transfer that we are --

that we've seen. It is the ultimate responsibility for those who paid the ultimate price.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: And that's primarily what this was. It's a powerful moment for those families, the

ultimate loss, the ultimate sacrifice, those three service members and the families who have to greet them, the remains as they come home. It's

something that is always personal for the president in particular, his son was a veteran, did not die in combat but did die of brain cancer, which his

family blames on burn pits he was exposed to during his service, his deployments abroad.

I will say as I was watching this, Richard, to another element is here and that is, this is exactly what this president does not want to see happen in

large scale in the Middle East. He does not want this war that began on October 6th with those horrible attacks Hamas attacks to expand but it --

but it is expanding.

You have the Houthis attacking shipping. You've had repeated attacks by Iran backed militias on U.S. service members, these the first deadly ones,

and they just show the danger of escalation and expansion of this conflict which this president has said explicitly. He does not want to see happen

and yet, is about to respond to those attacks. And that in itself is an expansion.

QUEST: If he doesn't respond, I mean, he's going to but so it's a somewhat moot question, he would be excoriated in the election.

SCIUTTO: He would be but it's not primarily a political judgment. Certainly, politics always plays a part in an election year, but it's a

deadly attack on U.S. forces and U.S. presidents of both parties for years whether in an election year or not have responded with military action in

retaliation for such attacks.

But you are right, that this is an election year. S,o everything is viewed through a political lens.


And there is another piece which is not political, Richard, which is -- which is a substantial and fair question, is U.S. deterrence against Iran

working? You know, has the collection of responses so far, the military assets in the region, the carrier groups, the nuclear submarine and the

attacks on the Houthis, the threats to Hezbollah, etcetera. Has that worked to him this in?

You can argue it hasn't, at least to the extent that this president wanted, these are deadly attacks. Those three soldiers came home in caskets. So,

genuine questions about how and if he adjust that deterrence policy going forward.

QUEST: Jim, I'm grateful, thank you, sir.

SCIUTTO: Thanks.

QUEST: Closing arguments are underway in Michigan courtroom. The mother of the high school shooter Ethan Crumbley, she's on trial for alleged

manslaughter. She's admitted she bought the gun along with his father. Ethan Crumbley then killed four classmates in 2021 using the gun, there

were seven others wounded.

Michigan prosecutor's arguments substantially is she was grossly negligent for giving her son a gun and failing to get him mental health support when

she knew or should have known of his problems. The prosecution asked in cross examination how Ethan came to have the deadly weapon.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That gun was gifted by you and your husband to your son on November 26th.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How about when you posted on Instagram his new Christmas gift?

CRUMBLEY: Correct. And I explained yesterday that it was for him to use at the shooting range. We didn't just hand on a gun as a, here you go son. It

was something he could use when we went to the range as a family together.


QUEST: Jean Casarez is with me. We're in the final furlongs now aren't we on this case?

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We are. The defense is in the midst of their closing argument right now. Very, very, I would say emotional in the

sense for the defense saying that there were no signs, jury, to these parents, to Jennifer Crumbley of mental illness.

You can believe beyond a reasonable doubt that he was a very skilled manipulator and he fooled his parents. But you can't say that they saw a

mental illness. And then, she points to Jennifer Crumbley, she would never buy him a weapon if she thought that he was mentally I'll. Let's listen to

the defense closing argument just happened a minute ago.


SHANNON SMITH, DEFENSE ATTORNEY FOR JENNIFER CRUMBLEY: Clearly it was not foreseeable to Mrs. Crumbley, because there's no one in the world,

including Mrs. Crumbley who would have let a school shooting happen and let what happened on November 30th take place.

Not only ruining the lives of so many families and victims and taking the lives of four young people, but also ruining her own son's life and ripping

his life right from her as well. She would be the first person on the planet who would have never let that happen in a million years.


CASAREZ: So, now, here's the prosecution opening statement. It is the elected county attorney for Oakland County, Michigan close to Detroit,

Karen McDonald.


KAREN MCDONALD, OAKLAND COUNTY PROSECUTOR: She could have sat at home on the way back from the meeting. She goes right by her home to see where the

gun was. She could have sat on the way back to work. She could have searched the backpack. She could have asked her son where the gun was, she

could have blocked the ammunition. She could have blocked the gun, she could have taken him home. She could have taken him to work.

He could have gone with that, he was door dashing. She could have told the school that they just gifted him a gun. She could have embraced her son.

She could have said, can we talk to her for a minute alone. She could have looked at him and said, I care about you. I love you. She could have at

least acknowledged he was in the room. She told us all about her son being in crisis previously and asked him for help.


CASAREZ: Well, actually, after that meeting ended at the school that day, a couple hours before the mass shooting, she did text her son and she said

are you OK? And she said please know you can talk to me about anything. I love you. The final words her son ever said to her because there's been no

contact at all, he said I love you too.

QUEST: The thing is, all of that can be true. But can it make the -- can it jump the chasm to the point where they say which of course is exactly what

this case is about, she should have known or was grossly negligent about whether or not he was going to use the gun to murder.

CASAREZ: You know, let's look at the facts. There was nothing that was spoken of even in that school counselors meeting that he could commit a

mass murder.

QUEST: Right.

CASAREZ: They thought he could commit suicide possibly, suicidal ideations was actually what the counselor was concerned about.


QUEST: I guess, you know, in this country, I suppose I can hear viewers saying, well, come on Richard in the United States, if you've just given

someone a gun, you know, knowing -- I don't know, it's a tough one this one, Jean.

CASAREZ: It is. But it's a -- it's a community where there's hunting, because the dean of schools said that every fall that students go out

hunting with their parents in the morning before school class, and they send out a notice every year, do not come to school in your camo and be

sure you don't bring your hunting rifle with you to school. So, that's the state of mind of those jurors also.

QUEST: Thank you, very grateful. Thank you.

CASAREZ: Thank you.

QUEST: It's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, the celebrity photographer Andy Gotts has photographed just like every celebrity you can imagine. He shares the

tricks and trades and the vision behind his unique style.


QUEST: We all know when it comes to photography, it's the getting the perfect shot. That's the goal. And no one knows that better than the

celebrity photographer Andy Gotts who has captured everyone from Elton John, to Dolly Parton there.

And you might have seen his work at the National Portrait Gallery or Vogue magazine. And it's currently available to see his work at the Animazing

Gallery in Las Vegas, he joined me on the line. And I asked him what makes his photos unique.


ANDY GOTTS, CELEBRITY PHOTOGRAPHER: I think my selling point is I try and do something no other photographer has done before. So, I look into three

shoots, faces, expressions, tone in any actor, any singer. And then, I then approach my sheet trying to not emulate or not copy anyone else's work.

Because there's no point I'm so unique in my career. Because I'm the only celebrity photographer that doesn't edit their work, that doesn't

Photoshop, there's no tweaking or liquefying, softening.

QUEST: So, I'm just looking at some as we're talking, then you have to give so much greater emphasis to the lighting that you can work with at that

particular moment. If you're not going to fiddle around with it afterwards, or artificially create an environment that is not conducive, then you

really only get one -- I mean, when I say one shot, you know what I mean?


GOTTS: Exactly. I mean, I approach my sheet in one of two ways.

QUEST: Right.

GOTTS: Either I want someone to look quite, let me say, not happy. Let's say, more serious, more thought provoking, more innocent. And there's

another side, I want a huge look, quirky, silly, funny.

So, I needed to I need to create a lighting that would work on everything. And I did come up with a working environment of lighting way back in 1989,

which is still exactly the loading process I have now.

Because as you said, you know, there's no tweaking involved. It has to be very flattering to a lady and as also, be very endearing for a gentleman,

so you have to tick all boxes really.

QUEST: So, the person dead or alive, that you didn't photograph.

GOTTS: Oh, so I told my mother, I was born 10 years too late. Because in my -- in my formative years of photography, we lost the big names. I thought

Jimmy Stewart, Burt Lancaster, you know, Gregory Peck, I mean, those are still living people now. I know it never gets.

QUEST: Go on.

GOTTS: (INAUDIBLE) time from public life.

QUEST: Anyone you'd care to tell me?

GOTTS: People like with Gene Hackman.

GOTTS: Gene Hackman, I mean, he's still alive and kicking, but I'll never get him because he's chosen to, you know, he's his career, he's bowed out

and he plays golf. And he doesn't want anything to do with that.

So, he's someone I wish I had shots. Jack Nicholson, again, he doesn't do shoots anymore. He's someone I'd love to have shot because I think he was a

powerhouse of an accent.

But I'd say if I can go back in time, I wish I'd have done Burt Lancaster.

QUEST: Well, you may not get Gene Hackman or others. I am available.

GOTTS: My fees are not high. I'll make a deal.


QUEST: Always available for an offer with the right price. Coming up after the break, the chair of the U.S. Council of Economic Advisers, there he is,

Jared Bernstein braving the cold, sir. I promise I will not keep you waiting long. We'll be with you after the break to talk about today's

strong job numbers.



QUEST: Now, some breaking news to bring to your attention, the federal judge that's overseeing Donald Trump's 2020 election interference trial has

now canceled the March 4th start date. And the reason it's to do with logistics, because proceedings are on hold as Donald Trump continues to

appeal his claim of presidential immunity, which of course is going all the way to the appeals court and then on to the Supreme Court. In fact, we're

waiting for the appeals court to give their ruling of the district appeals court, and then it'll go on to the Supreme Court, no doubt.

Returning to our top story today, the U.S. added a staggering 253,000 jobs last month, a CNN poll still shows that people are unhappy with the

economy. And only 26 percent of people think they're starting to recover from the last few years.

So, joining me now is the head of the U.S. Council of Economic Advisers, is Jared Bernstein who is at the White House.

Sir, look, I mean, the numbers are good. Everybody agrees, the job numbers are good. But you're not getting the credit for them yet.

JARED BERNSTEIN, CHAIR, U.S. COUNCIL OF ECONOMIC ADVISERS: Well, in fact, if you look at some of the most recent indicators of consumer confidence or

consumer sentiment, they're actually moving in the right direction with some speed.

So, this morning, we learned that one is closely watched measure of sentiment was up 13 percent in January, and that's after an equally large

bump in December. So, it's up 30 percent over the last two months, the consumer confidence measure also got a nice pop.

Now, what's happening here is that the benefits of a very strong labor market, as we learned this morning, along with easing inflationary

pressures are raising the pay, the real pay, the real buying power of working families, and they're starting to feel that that's beginning to

show up in some of these indicators.

QUEST: That phrase vibe session that you'll be familiar with where people are sort of saying, we don't feel it, the vibe doesn't feel good. And can

you turn that round in 10 months?

BERNSTEIN: Well, I think that that my point is that we're already seeing some movement in that direction. So, look, I'm not going to declare whether

a vibe session has begun or is over or is in the middle or what, that's all -- you know, that's -- I believe that phrase comes off of TikTok.

What I'm telling you is that if you look at the very closely watched measures of consumer sentiment, we are starting to see the gap between the

real indicators of the economy strength, whether it's job growth, easing, inflation, lower costs, and some key areas including gas, eggs, milk, T.V.,

air fares, and rising real pay, that gap is starting to close and somewhat reliably so, it's not just a week or two, it's a few months within that gap

is coming -- is coming down some. And that's exactly what you would expect if these benefits, these gains are reaching American families.

QUEST: The Fed yesterday in its statement, and indeed the chair in his press conference, it was interesting, because he is, you know, these strong

numbers of which today's jobs numbers is greater grist to the mill does suggest cuts in interest rates will be slower, and more -- and further out

than perhaps you'd have hoped.

BERNSTEIN: Well, we do not comment on a Federal Reserve interest rate policy, we consider it extremely important for them to be independent. We

know how economies have been just deeply damaged when that independence is compromised.

What we have seen already is some key interest rates coming down a bit. Mortgage rates, of course, were peaked at around eight percent and were

last seen a little bit below seven.

My expectation is that that rate will continue to come down some this year. But what really matters to working households right now is are their

incomes rising or their incomes or their wages, are they beating inflation?

We learned this morning that wages were up strongly in January. We don't have inflation yet for January, but we know for the past nine or 10 months,

wages incomes have been outpacing inflation, and that's giving family some much needed breathing room.

Add that to the measures this president has taken to directly lower costs, health care, prescription drugs, the cost of health coverage, clean energy

and you see some real breathing room for American households.

QUEST: If we look at the totality of the U.S. economy, it is actually in an extremely robust, strong position. There's one thing that happens that, you

know, the relationship with Congress, and the ability to get things done between.


And I'm thinking about things like aid to Ukraine, or tightening sanctions on Russia, which, of course, the entire range of things that the

administration would like to do. How difficult do you think that's going to be returning the economic screws?

BERNSTEIN: Well, in one way, I'm fortunate in that, I do economics, not politics. But of course, you know, here we are in Washington, I worked for

the White House. So political economics is, of course, my purview.

I think the way to think about this, Richard, is that we've been talking about what a strong economy this is, we've been talking about the

importance on building the progress that we've made, progress in easing prices, we have a job market that is just as tight as strong as it's ever


The last thing we'd want to do is to kick the ball in our own goal, to hurt the progress we're making with partisan squabbling. So, this president has

long believed that we ought to be able to get together on a bipartisan basis and achieve many of the priorities you just took us through.

QUEST: I'm grateful to you, sir, Friday afternoon, thank you for taking time to talk to us and have a lovely weekend.


QUEST: We will take a profitable moment after the break.


QUEST: Tonight's profitable moment. Every night on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, we finish with the bell. This is how it came about.


QUEST: The bell came from our first show in the studio, when we were doing a story about hotels or something like that. And then spoke producer, Matt

Percival said we need a bell, let's get about, let's go to the hotel next door to the studio. And so, we borrowed their bell.

And during the program, I just sort of hit it several times. And it became one of those things that just became part of the bell. And this is the

original one.

There are also bells in London, and at the CNN Center. And I think there might be (INAUDIBLE) spare one.

I use it as available prop or as a hump in a logically device. It's a punctuation mark. It's a point of making reference. It's when we want to

make something clear.


And when we want to make something clear, we have the bell. Thank you, Pamela. Would you believe it? Today is the one day I left it on my desk.

And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, you know the rest, I hope it's