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Quest Means Business
Russia Hosts BRICS Summit In Show Of Strength To The West; IMF: More Geopolitical Division Would Dent Global Growth; Mark Cuban: Race Is Between Kamala Harris And Elon Musk; Ex-Abercrombie CEO Indicted On Sex Trafficking Charges; U.S. CEO Turnover Hits Year-To-Date Record; Indians Take "Do Or Die" Journey To Live The American Dream; King Charles Heckled Inside Australian Parliament. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired October 22, 2024 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:43]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": So the market is closed, closing bells rung, and the market is down, not hugely.
At the end of trading, just off six points, but it had been bit jittery, down more than 200 at one stage during the session, although it did go
through 43,000 as well.
So this is one of those days where you pace your money, you take your choice, there's the market, and these are the main events of the day: A
warm embrace for Vladimir Putin. He is hosting the BRICS leaders in Russia in defiance of the West.
The IMF declares the battle against inflation is largely won.
And Elon Musk gets all the attention, but a new study says corporate leaders are actually shifting towards the political center.
Live from New York, Tuesday, October the 22nd, I'm Richard Quest, and I mean business.
Good evening.
We begin with the BRICS Summit in Russia, where Vladimir Putin is sending a strong, clear message, you can't isolate Moscow.
Putin is hosting a three-day event in the city of Kazan. There are four new members of the BRICS this year, and that includes Iran. Putin and China's
President Xi see the BRICS as a massive counterweight to the West, and they believe most of the world's countries are behind that effort.
Alexander Vindman is the former director of European Affairs for the US National Security Council joining me now.
Sir, grateful as always.
When I see those pictures of Modi and others, South Africa hugging President Putin, this is in direct contradiction, of course, to what the
West wants to see.
ALEXANDER VINDMAN, FORMER DIRECTOR OF EUROPEAN AFFAIRS FOR THE US NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL: Now, that's very true. Thanks for having me on, Richard.
This project, this Brazil, Russia, India, China, South Africa plus project is really a pet project of Vladimir Putin, and he's received the buy in of
other key authoritarian states like China that see some common cause in challenging the US led -- the Western led international order, the
democracy led international order.
And he's been trying to chip away at this world order program for years, and now, two-and-a-half years, more than two-and-a-half years into this
war, he's had probably his biggest kind of, you know, optic success in that he's had quite a few folks show up.
We were talking about 30 plus world leaders, about 25 percent of the global domestic product and almost 50 percent of the population show up.
So in terms of appearances, this looks like a big win. He had the UN Secretary General, Antonio Guterres, show up to offer a little bit of a
kind of a patina of credibility to it. So he is trying to demonstrate that --
QUEST: Right. How do they square this circle that you know, NATO, I mean, these are my words, not yours, but NATO is de facto fighting almost a proxy
war through Ukraine. Certainly, the EU is supporting, obviously Ukraine, as is the US at vast cost.
How do they justify cozying up to the man who has started an unprovoked war in Europe?
VINDMAN: So I think what you have, clearly is an access of autocrats and the, you know, anti-democratic curious coming to Russia to see what kind of
-- put out some feelers on what that kind of alliance, what kind of that relationship would look like, most as a bit of a hedge. Why? I think
because there's perceived opportunity, there's perceived weakness on the part of democracies around the world.
[16:05:07]
A lot of that has to do with the chaos emerging out of the United States in our political system. We are on the precipice of either the continuation of
this great experiment or something different and unknown, and that's something for the BRICS and the authoritarians exploit.
QUEST: Right, now, but you talk about the anti-democratic the curious or those, but let's say, for example, Malaysia, which has a fairly vibrant, if
somewhat lopsided democracy of sorts, but Anwar Ibrahim, the prime minister, who has his own very difficult past, is trying to join the BRICS.
When I was in Kuala Lumpur, he explained why.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANWAR IBRAHIM, MALAYSIAN PRIME MINISTER: We are great friends with United States notwithstanding, our differences on a number of issues, why can't we
be a friend of China and Russia, although we have some differences?
QUEST: Because when Russia is at war, a war in Europe that Russia started. In those circumstances, any act by a leader like yourself can be used by
the others as supporting.
IBRAHIM: Most countries are in touch with Russia. Most of the countries in Middle East, China, Africa, you can see the BRICS, Brazil, South Africa. I
mean, that's the position taken by the international community.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Are we justified, the countries that are in this Western coalition, of saying to people like Prime Minister Ibrahim or the South African
President Ramaphosa or others, those who are not with us are against us, and if you choose to continue this relationship with Putin, there will be
consequences in our own trade relations.
VINDMAN: Yes, I don't think we could be so severe in the way we interact with our sometimes friends-partners, but we should be clear about the fact
that they are offering credibility to an aggressor, Russia, a Russia that's pursuing a project of empire building, which frankly a lot of these
countries have a history with, and that they're offering credibility to Russia and Putin.
And we should be clear about the fact that that is a significant divergence from the kinds of values that the West represents, that Indonesia aspires
to embrace, and that this is not advancing their agenda.
It is, of course, purely transactional. They're looking for arms relationships with whether it's China or Russia. They see some utility in
the national security -- the transactional national security that they could achieve in engaging with BRICS, but it is a mistake.
I think there is a whole school of thought around the fact that, short- sighted transactional relationships don't advance the agenda of democracies. There should be values primacy in the way we interact with the
world.
So we should caution them, more than that, but we can't -- we can't just cut them off. I think that that's probably a bridge too far.
QUEST: I'm grateful to you, sir. Thank you. It's a fascinating thing, particularly when we talk about countries like South Africa or India and
their closer relationships with Russia.
Grateful to you, Alexander. Thank you.
Because that's the political side. Well, the effects of these divisions that are now coming clear are laid bare by the International Monetary Fund.
The IMF has just released its latest global economic outlook. The WEO, as you and I always call it, it's put forward a downside scenario that could
occur if the US, EU and China all put tariffs on each other, which is highly likely if President Trump is elected.
Then there is the reduced migration in the West and tight financial conditions. All in all, the IMF says global growth will be cut by nearly
one percent next year and 1.3 in 2026.
Julia is with me. Putting this into perspective, I mean, bearing in mind where we are post-pandemic, should we be getting ourselves hot under the
collar by these numbers?
JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR, "FIRST MOVE": I was about to say steady on Dr. Doom. Can't we focus on the fact that they're saying that
the global inflation fight is almost over, and that they're upgrading the United States growth, and they went through the fastest rate cycle in four
decades and actually managed to come out without recession. In fact, it looks like we're going to avoid a global recession.
I think there's a lot of good news in this report, Richard. I get there's a big caveat over some of the things that you mentioned, too. But I think we
have to take a second to say, look, let's look at the bright side here and what was achieved, and then we can talk about the downside risks.
QUEST: No, no, no. You're looking in the rear view mirror, what's been achieved. I'm looking at the road ahead, and I take what I've seen with the
BRICS and I take this is being far more harbinger of doom, particularly with geopolitical and strategic issues of say, the Middle East.
[16:10:00]
CHATTERLEY: And unfortunately, I have to agree with you there. You're absolutely right. I know -- yuck. Yuck.
Show the chart, because I think we've got it. It was what you were saying. We're at this pivot point where, right now, the United States comprises
around half of the growth of G7 and that's the outlook.
So what happens politically in the United States may not be on the agenda later this week at the IMF and at the World Bank, but everybody is
wondering who is going to win this election, and quite frankly, one of them is more aggressive, and you've said it, the former president is on tariffs,
and we could see retaliation, but both of them are talking about protectionist policies.
The view, I think, generally, is that we are going to head into a period where trade is more of a drag, where there's going to be more protectionist
policies, and that is going to weigh on growth, as is the geopolitics, as is the potential limits to migration, or immigration as well, and all of
that could be a problem.
QUEST: So is this going to be a banner fund annual meeting? What do you what are you expecting out here? Because I know you are going down to DC
tomorrow.
CHATTERLEY: I think it's going to be an interesting one. Look, we're in a situation now where, look, we've come out of the pandemic, we've come out
of a period of high inflation, and we've done pretty well, and we're not talking about recession risks, so that's the baseline.
But overall, we're far more indebted than we were, and if we can't tackle things like six percent deficits in the United States, as a great example.
I mean, Richard, that's like recession or war period budget deficits, and yet we're talking about spending trillions more over the next four years.
If we can't tackle those, the next crisis is going to be that much worse, and that the toolbox is not as full as it was. That's the big challenge.
QUEST: No, no, no, no, no. They told us that the toolbox was empty. They told us that the toolbox was empty.
CHATTERLEY: And inflation was transitory.
QUEST: Exactly. But also they said that if interest rates went down to zero, we wouldn't have anything left that we could do to stimulate. Well,
they found things that they could -- well, it is called deficit spending, and it's left us with a big unholy mess.
One other point, though, the fact that inflation has come down so rapidly that shows it was a version of cyclical because of pandemic, supply chain,
et cetera et cetera rather than systemic. You're quizzically looking at me as if, no, I'm wrong.
CHATTERLEY: Well, you're right in that we had supply chain, we had monster spending, of course, to try and support people post pandemic. So that
fueled the inflationary wave.
But Richard, look at the way that interest rates have risen in order to tame inflation. So it is cyclical, but we've got other factors that are
coming into play. We've got geopolitics, we've got a wave of technology. You and I always talk about this and the impact of artificial intelligence,
so -- and how we fund that, quite frankly, and how that impacts productivity going forward, never mind climate crisis.
So we're a lot more indebted than we were. We've worked out that we can be creative with the toolbox. I do have to agree with you for the second time
in one conversation, how unfortunate, when we need it. But we've also got a lot of spending to do and problems to tackle going forward, so it's going
to be a robust conversation, let's call it that.
QUEST: Well, that's the only thing I'm indebted to, is you. Indebted to you for coming on today. Have a good trip to Washington to the IMF.
CHATTERLEY: Thank you.
QUEST: Thank you very much.
And of course, I'm always indebted to you, dear viewer.
In a moment, the race for the White House is a battle for the billionaires. So there's the playing field and the ball is in play and the spending
continues to rise. QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:16:01]
QUEST: Elon Musk's super PAC now spent more than $110 million to help elect Donald Trump president of the US. Now, the billionaire, Mark Cuban says all
that money means the race is no longer between Trump and Harris, but between her and Elon Musk.
He told CNBC, the race is about getting the vote, and the Tesla CEO is funding that effort. You'll recall you and I have talked about the $1
million a day that Musk is giving away as part of a sweepstakes for registered voters.
Never mind the legality of that. That's enough matter for another day. Donie O'Sullivan is with me, and we're looking into all of these matters.
DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Richard, yes, Elon Musk has essentially decamped to Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. He's hanging out in the
crucial swing state there, trying to get Trump over the line in this election, and that's where we went this weekend to one of his town halls to
speak with some of his supporters. Have a look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elon Musk is the smartest man in the world.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elon is a genius. This is a one-time opportunity to see him.
DAVE FOX, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: I'm a super "Star Trek" geek. When those rockets came down, I'm like, you've got to be kidding.
CHRISTINE, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: I respect his opinion. I understand the way he thinks. Being an engineer myself, I can understand some of the quirky
things that maybe other people take the wrong way.
O'SULLIVAN: Elon Musk is holding this town hall happening here in Harrisburg, trying to get the vote out for former President Donald Trump.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
O'SULLIVAN (voice over): Musk is pouring tens of millions of dollars into getting Trump elected, even offering cash prizes to registered voters in
battleground states.
ELON MUSK, CEO OF TESLA: So every day between now and the election, we'll be awarding a million starting tonight.
O'SULLIVAN (voice over): This experts say could be breaking election law.
O'SULLIVAN (on camera): I've been to a lot of Trump rallies, but this has the feel of like part comic con party, right?
FOX: There's tons of young people, which I was like surprised that they could usually, you know, like, there's a lot of people like me at a Trump
rally, you know, like getting ready to drop over. These are Elon Musk's fans.
SHRAGA FEINBERG, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: He's so cool, man. Why not, right? I mean, he's just so inspirational. What an amazing guy. What I think he
offers is being able to use his platform to bring the truth to more people, people that may not otherwise even give a crap about politics.
DEVIN MOUSSO, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: With all the polarization that there is now, I feel like it's really tough to yank somebody out of their camp.
Everybody sees what the algorithms show them. I think most of the people that are big Elon Musk fans are probably on the side of Trump and all that
already.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, I voted for Biden, you know, in 2020.
O'SULLIVAN: You did?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I did. I did.
O'SULLIVAN: And what changed?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, I know when Trump was in office, I saw more money on my paycheck.
MOUSSO: I was definitely a bit of a Trump hater, I guess.
O'SULLIVAN: So 2020, you weren't a Trump guy?
MOUSSO: No, no, no. I think I was more on the down the middle, didn't really care about it. I felt everything's just too crazy. I don't want to
get involved.
O'SULLIVAN: Yes.
MOUSSO: And this is, I guess, is the most involved I'm getting. I haven't gone to any other rallies, and I probably won't. But --
O'SULLIVAN: So you haven't been to any other political event?
MOUSSO: No, not at all.
O'SULLIVAN: And you either, right?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, me neither.
MUSK: This might be the very last election that's a real election.
O'SULLIVAN (on camera): At some of these town halls, Musk has just been repeating election conspiracy theories.
MUSK: Statistically, there's some very strange things that happen.
DONALD BICKEL, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: I'm big into science. I do IT for a living --
O'SULLIVAN: Yes.
BICKEL: -- so I'm here to see Elon. That's literally why I'm here.
O'SULLIVAN (voice over): But not every Musk superfan is a Trump voter. Don Bickel is a Pennsylvania state government employee.
BICKEL: My appeal for Elon is a lot of the way he likes to break conventions. Working in government for as long -- I like to sometimes smash
the silos and just break everything down and build everything back up again. I had voted for Trump in the past. I traditionally vote Republican.
I don't think I'm going to vote Republican this time.
O'SULLIVAN: You don't think Musk is going to change your mind?
BICKEL: I mean, a meteor could strike me. It's possible.
O'SULLIVAN (voice over): Don says Musk's debunked conspiracy theories are dangerous.
BICKEL: I think probably Elon's problem is he's so down the rabbit hole what he is in X now that it's really hard to know what's right and wrong.
MUSK: There's always sort of a question of like, say, the Dominion voting machines.
[16:20:07]
O'SULLIVAN (voice over): At one town hall, Musk brought up Dominion voting machines a frequent subject of conspiracy theories.
MUSK: In my view, we should only do paper ballots, hand counted. That's it.
BICKEL: Here's the funny thing. Even with Dominion, there's still a paper trail.
O'SULLIVAN: Yes.
BICKEL: So you can still hand recount that. I've been working for the state for many years, and heck, my father before me, like Obi-Wan Kenobi, my
father before me, he worked for the state for many years. So I've -- I grew up as a state kid, and I know how the state works in a lot of respects.
O'SULLIVAN (voice over): Yes.
BICKEL: So, yes, it's kind of sad when, you know, people like me, who are considered like the, "enemy within" or the deep state, we're just doing our
jobs.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
O'SULLIVAN: Richard, it's remarkable, really, to go to one of these town hall events. Elon Musk, one of the world's richest men, the world's richest
man, who has control of such a powerful social media platform and now just playing such a critical role in this race.
And by the way, he's being very transparent. He says, if Trump gets elected, he's suggesting he wants to get a job in government. He wants to
clean up waste and improve efficiency in US government.
QUEST: I just want to talk -- the interesting thing about Musk is he has legitimacy, in a sense. Anybody who can run a company, A, that
revolutionized the EV industry; B, that manages to catch a falling booster rocket.
O'SULLIVAN: Yes.
QUEST: You know, you sort of end up with this perception that if he says that he can do that, and he does, then when he says about conspiracy
theories, he must be right.
O'SULLIVAN: That's really the case. And you know, you heard there from Don Bickle, who had -- a fascinating guy in that he is a Musk super fan. He is
a Republican, but he's not voting for Trump.
But he was saying, look, he was like, Musk is so great on so many of these things. And in some ways, his risk taking and his recklessness has led to
great things, but when it comes to some of the very specific points he's making about elections, is that a lot of it is conspiracy theories. And you
know, you really can see that Richard, when you open up Twitter, when you open up X and see Musk's Twitter feed, it's this mixture of the incredible
things he's doing, like catching rockets in the air, but then also posting and reposting just kind of total junk, you know.
QUEST: I'm very grateful to you, sir. Thank you -- not for the junk, but you know what I mean. Thank you very much. It is good to see you.
The 2024 race is fast becoming the battle of the billionaires. So as we already showed you, on the right, you've got Elon Musk, you've got Cantor
Fitzgerald's Howard Lutnick, Cantor Fitzgerald CEOs, the transitional co- chair if Musk is if Trump would accede. And the late casino magnate Sheldon Adelson's widow, she's donated -- Miriam. She's donated a hundred odd
million.
Now on the left, you've got Mark Cuban. You've got the LinkedIn founder, Reid Hoffman, and $90 million from the former New York City mayor and, of
course, of the eponymous agency, Mike Bloomberg.
But those donations from the biggies don't tell the full story of the allegiances amongst business leaders. A new study suggests CEOs have
actually shifted from moderately conservative to the center, and the reason is why?
Well, Reilly Steel is the author of the study. He's an academic and fellow and lecturer at Columbia Law. He's with me now.
Why have they moved? Is it because they're just rushing to thicker ice and safety?
REILLY STEEL, ACADEMIC AND FELLOW AND LECTURER, COLUMBIA LAW: It's a great question, Richard. Thanks for having me on.
So the causes of the apparent leftward shift among many corporate elites seem to be multifaceted. To some extent, we're witnessing a growing diploma
divide where, especially among Whites, educated individuals have shifted to the left. So what we're seeing in corporate America may be in part, a
reflection of that sort of broader changed American politics.
QUEST: But does this explain where they feel most comfortable?
STEEL: It's a good question. So you know, what does comfortable mean? I suppose you're talking about sorts of cultural norms, those sorts of
changes.
QUEST: Yes. I mean, we'll be talking later in the program, the average length and tenure of a CEO. They are -- a lot of CEOs are scared of their
own shadow, let alone boards of directors and shareholders. And I'm wondering, when at an election time like that, do they know where to sit?
STEEL: Yes. I mean, it's a good question. I can tell you that the sort of starkest sort of leftward shift, I think, has been among the senior
managers, people like vice presidents, those sorts of folks, sort of not senior, senior executives, but you know, sort of more mid-level executives
and those people are actually not just leaning towards the center, but leaning towards the left.
Whereas CEOs are a little bit more like center right. So it could be that CEOs are kind of responding to what's going on among sort of other people
that they're working with.
[16:25:10]
QUEST: A lot of the CEOs we try to interview on this program run a million miles when you actually try and pin them down on difficult political
issues. But as we've also talked to people like Richard Edelman on this program, who says, no, eventually you have, as you are CEO, you do have to
take a position. You have to take a position on the difficult issues of today.
STEEL: Right, right. Yes.
QUEST: Well, related to that, related to that, do you think that there is now a nomenclature difference between when we talk about conservatives in
the old traditional and we talk about conservatives today?
STEEL: Sure, I mean what it means to be a conservative has, I think, with Trump, changed the sort of Edmund Burke style conservatives that used to
see in previous eras are perhaps fewer in number than the sort of modern style of conservative you see with Trump, which is more populist, and you
see that in the sorts of shifting political allegiances from what we used to see and now.
QUEST: What do you think the biggest risk is now for CEOs in this environment? Looking at your study and your research about how they've
shifted, what do you say is their biggest risk?
STEEL: Well, you have demands from various different stakeholders, competing demands, basically cross pressure. Sometimes you have one set of
customers that are more conservative demanding one thing, you have another set that are more liberal demanding another and that's true of the sort of
employees and managers as well.
To try to navigate that environment, I think would be very challenging.
QUEST: I'm grateful for you, sir. Thank you for joining us tonight. Thank you.
STEEL: Thanks for having me, Richard.
QUEST: QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. The former chief executive of Abercrombie & Fitch has been arrested on sex trafficking charges.
The allegations against Mike Jeffries, we'll talk about it next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:30:04]
QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. Together we have a lot more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. We'll be live in Sydney to explain why King Charles hasn't been
as warmly received by everyone during his state trip to Australia, and why top CEOs are losing their jobs at a record rate.
We'll talk about that, but only after the news that we've got to because this is CNN and on this network the news always comes first.
The IDF says it has killed the possible heir to Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah. The Israeli military said Hashem Safieddine died three weeks ago
following an airstrike in Beirut. Hezbollah has not confirmed those claims.
Rudy Giuliani must turn over his valuables to two former Georgia election workers. He had falsely accused them of helping rig the 2020 election
results. They sued for defamation and won in a $150 million judgment. Giuliani must now give them his Manhattan penthouse, his wristwatches, and
various sports memorabilia.
The teen accused of carrying out a mass shooting at his high school near Atlanta, Georgia, last month has pleaded not guilty despite authorities
saying that Colt Gray had already confessed to the crime. Two students and two teachers were killed, and Gray has been indicted on 55 counts related
to the shooting.
Initial tests reportedly suggest Liam Payne had exposure to cocaine before his death last week in Argentina. The initial toxicology report was
revealed by the Associated Press, which cited an unnamed official. Investigators say the singer's body is to be released once the final report
is published. The popstar fell to his death from a hotel balcony in Buenos Aires.
Mike Jeffries, the former CEO of Abercrombie and Fitch, has been arrested on sex trafficking charges. It's alleged that Jeffries and two others
exploited young male models over many years during sex-themed parties that involved a variety of drugs, alcohol, and Viagra.
Now, the various schemes allegedly lasted from 2008 to 2015, and prosecutors shared details of the indictment a short while ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BREON PEACE, U.S. ATTORNEY FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK: On more than one occasion Jeffries and Smith either directed others to inject or
personally injected men within an erection-inducing substance for the purpose of causing the men to engage in sex acts the men were incapable of
engaging in or unwilling to engage in.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Mark Morales is in New York. Mark is with me.
This is interesting, isn't it, in the sense we've known these allegations have been swirling around for some months now. But they've now gone to this
next stage. What happens now?
MARK MORALES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT CORRESPONDENT: Right. And as you say, these are really disturbing details that were unsealed as part of this
indictment earlier today, and as you mentioned former Abercrombie and Fitch CEO, Mike Jeffries, along with two others are charged in this 16-count
indictment. The charges include sex trafficking and international prostitution.
And what they did was they created this elaborate scheme where they wanted to do two things. They found vulnerable men who wanted to get into the
fashion industry. They wanted to climb this industry that's been notoriously difficult to navigate, and in exchange for that they dangled
the possibility of an opportunity in exchange for sexual favors.
But it went way beyond that. What they did was that they turned these vulnerable men into the centerpieces of these elaborate sex events, and it
was at those events where they would have these men either wearing costumes or performing sex acts. And this is where they would give them a whole host
of drugs. It went from muscle relaxers, all the way to what you just heard, drugs that would help them perform sexually.
Now, to get to your question as to what happens next --
QUEST: Now -- but, well, I assumed, as this case went its merry way through the judicial system, there's going to be a strong defense on the grounds
either, A, it's not true, or B, consenting adults.
MORALES: Well, lawyers did speak to me today briefly and what they said was that they were going to make their arguments in court and not through the
media, but it's also important to know that when prosecutors bring this case, they don't do so lightly. They have witness interviews from dozens of
ones that they spoke to. There's also travel records, financial records.
[16:35:01]
This was not an easy decision for prosecutors to bring this case. And if they have it, then it's going to be a really, really tough, tough battle.
QUEST: When would you expect this to come to trial?
MORALES: Well, that is a ways down the road. The first thing we need to do is they presented in court today. They will be here in court in New York
later on this week. And that's where they will have to have the opportunity to plead either guilty or not guilty but as far as when this goes to court,
that -- it's so much legal gymnastics that has to happen between now and then. There's a lot of room and a lot of time for even more charges or
superseding indictment because as prosecutors said today, their investigation into this is not over.
QUEST: The -- I know you've done quite a lot of work, of course, on the Jeffrey Epstein cases. And there's a variety of other following on from Me
Too. Give me your gut feeling of where this one stands. And the reason I ask, Mark, is because Abercrombie and Fitch very much, you know, a
revolutionary retailing story of the 1990s and the noughties with half- dressed male models standing in the door and the smell of perfume wafting from within.
MORALES: Right. And as I said, this is a very big deal. You had federal authority saying at the press conference today that this was a very well-
known retailer that you had their CEO using his power influence and wealth to coerce some of these men, some of them unwilling to go into this sex
parties and to become essentially victims to be trafficked either to other states or internationally.
And this is something that the federal government does not take lightly. We've seen this happen especially recently with a lot of different cases
where we're looking at the sort of larger web and larger extent. So this is something the federal government does not take lightly.
QUEST: I'm grateful for your time, sir. Thank you very much.
2024 has been the year of CEO turnover. The number of chiefs leaving their jobs so far is at a record. Nearly 1500 according to the firm Challenger
Gray and Christmas. Many of those spots are being filled now with white men. It comes as some firms in the U.S. back away from diversity efforts.
Allison Morrow is in New York.
Allison, even as I was reading that, I was questioning myself, am I doing one plus one equals three? We know the diversity, DEI, rules have changed.
We now see this. Have I come to a conclusion that is not justifiable with the facts?
ALLISON MORROW, CNN BUSINESS SENIOR WRITER: Not at all. And just to be clear, this is not a knock on white guys, Richard. You know, this is
basically a shift in momentum. You know, women have made a ton of progress in the C-Suite over the last few decades, but still only account for about
10 percent of the Fortune 500 in terms of CEOs. So -- and now it's fallen off a bit.
The rate of female CEOs replacing the male CEOs who are stepping down is falling. Increasingly you have more men taking over women's positions as we
saw with CVS Health last week when Karen Lynch was forced out.
QUEST: What's going on? I mean, what's it all about? Is this just a cyclical change or is it your gut that something else is happening
underneath?
MORROW: I think there's two things going on. I think there's the cyclical change from the pandemic that we've seen. You know, this is a time no one
wanted to change CEOs in the middle of a global health crisis. Everyone was dealing with remote work, supply chains. We're in an upheaval and so it was
a time for a steady hand.
Now that the pandemic is kind of in the rear view companies are taking the time to say, OK, what is our strategic vision going forward and is this the
time to change the CEO? And then on top of that, you've got kind of corporate muscle memory kicking in in a politically uncertain environment,
and that's kind of what we're seeing now.
You know, there's been a bit of a permission structure created to not think so much about the optics of diversity, equity, and inclusion because of
various legal and social media campaigns against them.
QUEST: But I still can see, I can hear boards, board of directors, sort of looking around saying, oh, good lord, I've only got one woman, better got a
few more women on the board if only to keep the activists, the dark conversation.
Now, of course that's an exaggeration, mass exaggeration. Most boards now do have not just a DEI, but they have monitor very closely the correct
composition because that's what they're their investors demand and that's what their customers want.
MORROW: Absolutely. And I think that is still broadly true, but we're starting to see a bit of a pushback. And I think ultimately there would
have been a bit more head scratching and pushback from external forces saying, well, shouldn't we get, you know, a person of color, a woman in the
top job?
[16:40:10]
And I think that the way the U.S. corporate American trends have been going, it's just not as big of a priority as it was in early 2020s.
QUEST: It's an absolute minefield, to talking about it in all different ways. Right. Thanks. Glad to have you with us. Thank you.
MORROW: Thank you.
QUEST: News that I must bring to your gentle attention. McDonald's stock is down very sharply, plunging in fact after the Center for Disease Control,
the CDC, warned of e. Coli outbreak. The shares have fallen more than 8 percent since the Closing Bell. The CDC says most sick people reported
eating Quarter Pounders. It says it's investigating which ingredient is the culprit. And before anybody thinks that this is all rather a ho-ho, ha-ha
story there are some very, very dramatic, serious side effects. One death has so far been linked to it.
Coming up in a moment, young Indians are immigrating illegally to the United States. They also want the American dream. The route that they are
taking in just a moment. QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: There's a new and interesting twist to the immigration debate taking place in the United States. Now it seems the southern U.S. border is
attracting more and more migrants from India, and many are paying smugglers top dollar in search of a better life.
CNN's Ivan Watson reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Hiking through jungles and crossing rivers. A video vlogger from India showing his
trip through Central America to the U.S.-Mexico border.
Nearly 100,000 Indians crossed the border illegally into the U.S. last year, a journey many Indians call the "donkey way."
ANKIT CHAUDHARY, LAW STUDENT: Donkey Way is an illegal route which is not allowed by the USA government. It's a route which is going through many of
the countries and then we will jump the wall of USA.
WATSON: Ankit Chaudhary is a 24-year-old law student who dreams of migrating to the U.S. to escape joblessness in India.
CHAUDHARY: I have no other option due to unemployment.
[16:45:02]
WATSON: And he's not the only young Indian desperate to leave. Many Indian cities have districts like this.
This is one of the consequences of India's high youth unemployment. Entire neighborhoods of businesses dedicated to helping young Indians move
overseas.
(Voice-over): Amid consultants who help Indians get visas to study abroad, Chaudhary says you can also find smugglers who specialize in the donkey
route.
We can go here and find someone and pay money to be smuggled to the U.S. here.
CHAUDHARY: Yes. Yes. They will smuggle the person illegally in U.S.
WATSON: How many people have you sent on this donkey route journey to the U.S.?
(Voice-over): At least 150 to 200 people, he says. For around $48,000, this agent will fly you to El Salvador and smuggle you over land to the U.S.-
Mexico border. He shows me this video of some of his clients squeezing through the border fence.
These are your customers?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Both. Two of them.
WATSON (voice-over): The number of Indian migrants crossing the border into the U.S. surged over the last five years. But two Indian smuggling agents
now tell CNN they've all but stopped sending migrants to the U.S. in the last couple of months after a Biden administration executive order cracked
down on asylum applications.
In September, Customs and Border Protection reported the lowest number of migrants crossing the U.S.-Mexican border since 2020.
That's little comfort to Rajeev Kumar. Last year, his brother left the family farm for the donkey way to the U.S. Kumar says Indian authorities
returned Malkeet's body nearly five months later after he was shot dead by criminals on a river bank on the El Salvador-Guatemala border. The family's
lone surviving son now farms these fields alone.
RAJEEV KUMAR, MALKEET'S BROTHER (through translator): People here know they will die from unemployment, so they think it is better to go and take the
risk. For people here, it has become do or die.
WATSON: A vicious cycle of poverty and illegal migration that's emptying out communities in this part of India.
Ivan Watson, CNN, in Haryana State, India.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: We will be in Sydney in Australia in just a moment as much as the King Charles has spent his last day of the trip, of his state visit. The
crowds were more welcoming than the Australian parliament where he was heckled. You're going to hear more about that in just a moment.
This is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. How popular is the king?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:50:26] QUEST: King Charles has been meeting well-wishers in Sydney on the last day of the king and queen's visit to Australia. They were at the Opera House
trail. Wonder weather. They did a barbeque and all sorts of things. And then -- but of course the previous day, Charles wasn't as warmly received
after addressing parliament on Monday. An indigenous senator told him you're not my king.
Lidia Thorpe shouted, give us back our land. Here you can hear her. Give us back what you stole. And here's what she said after she was shunted out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LIDIA THORPE, INDEPENDENT AUSTRALIAN SENATOR: We'll continue to resist the colony until we have a peacemaking treaty, where we can celebrate this
country together. We don't need a king from another country to dictate to us what we do here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Now, Ruth Wynn-Williams from our affiliate Nine News is in Sydney. Ten to 8:00 in the morning. She's outside Admiralty House, which is the
governor's residence, where the king and queen are staying.
And look, Ruth, it's a little -- I mean, nothing new in the allegations as such. It's just embarrassing and there's not much the king could do about
it, is it? He has to just sit and take it.
RUTH WYNN-WILLIAMS, CORRESPONDENT, NINE NEWS: Embarrassing because it happened inside our federal parliament. There are questions over how she
was able to erupt like that on such an important day with the eyes of the world watching our parliament. As always, in Australia, though, there is
robust debate. The federal opposition leader is calling for that independent senator to step down. The prime minister says she -- a
Republican prime minister, I should add, says that she doesn't represent all Australians.
And the king, well, as he does, he just took it in stride. Protest is nothing new to him and he carried on with the engagements for the rest of
the day and he didn't seem too fazed.
QUEST: Now, have we take a look at the state of Republicanism in Australia? It was always said that once the late queen had passed on, that, you know,
Australia would go for a republic. But the reality is, as we saw from the voice referendum and the last one, it's not going to be easy to find a
referendum vote that you could actually guarantee winning.
WYNN-WILLIAMS: Australians don't have a particularly good track record with a referendum. That vote referendum that you were referring to were right on
the one-year anniversary. That cost our government half a billion dollars to put on and it was a complete flock. As far as becoming a republic, the
Australian Republican Movement decided they were going to dub this the farewell tour. They put out a video at the beginning of this whole tour
before the royals arrived in Australia.
They were acting like they were really going to pump up their campaign, but we havent seen much of them at all. What we have seen is really big crowds
at all these public events. The Opera House yesterday was huge and it was beautiful and iconic out in the sunshine. Recent polling does show that
support for the Republicans in this country has actually dropped over the past 25 years. It's only at about 30 percent at the moment. When I've been
talking to people as this five-day tour has gone on here in Australia people are saying things like, you know, we've got real cost of living
issues here in Australia. There are bigger issues, better things to spend money on, and as far as people on the street here in Australia, what they
care about, that's at the heart of things for them.
QUEST: OK. Quick final question for you this morning, for you all morning. Look, do you think that a King William, William and Kate, are Australians
to some extent looking forward to the possibility of having King William and Kate as their leader?
WYNN-WILLIAMS: Richard, if the scenes here are anything to go by, yes, very much so. I think people here in Australia, there's a real sense of
nostalgia during this tour. The pomp, the ceremony, the things we saw at our federal parliament in Canberra. People really enjoyed the show. I do
think that King Charles had an air of informality about him on this tour.
[16:55:02]
He was brilliant meeting the people, spending a lot of time chatting to people. As he systematically work that crowd, there is a real feeling here
that he's paving the way for the monarchy to really ramp up a game here in Australia that William and Catherine will be a very well-received by the
Australian people as King Charles certainly was especially in the latest stages of this tour when people really got behind him.
QUEST: I'm really grateful. Have a lovely day. Beautiful weather there as always. Thank you very much for joining us. Thank you.
And we will take a "Profitable Moment" after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Tonight's "Profitable Moment," the palace always says the same thing. It is up to the Australian people to decide if and when they're
going to become a republic. But if you just look at the tour of his majesty, the King and Queen Camilla, well, Ruth summed it up. It does look
like they're gearing up for a bit of support. After all, Australia, the first realm for the king to go and visit since he's become monarch.
Whether or not this survives and how long it goes and all these sort of things are questions for the future. But the one interesting fact time and
again, Australians have had crucial referenda on important constitutional issues and somehow result has always managed to fall apart whether it be
the last monarchy or the voice. Australians just seemingly always managed to stay the course and stay with what they have.
And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I am Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable.
"THE LEAD" is next.
JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.
This hour the former CEO of Abercrombie and Fitch under arrest and in court today on charges of sex trafficking. Sources telling CNN that the
indictment details how he and his associates allegedly targeted young aspiring models. We're breaking down all the accusations. Plus Rudy
Giuliani facing the consequences of his actions around the 2020 election. A judge now ordering the Trump ally to turn over all of his valuable
possessions to two election workers whom he defamed.
But what about those Yankees World Series rings? Does he have to turn those over? What about the place in Florida? I have questions.
And leading this hour, we're only 14 days, that's right two weeks from election day. And today, both candidates are were making their pitch to
undecided Latino voters.
Let's go straight to Detroit, Michigan, where CNN's Jeff Zeleny is ahead of Obama's second rally.
END
