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Quest Means Business
South Korean President Lifts Martial Law Order; Donald Trump To Attend Reopening Of Notre Dame Saturday; Syrian Defense Ministry Vows To Launch Counteroffensive; South Korean President To Lift Martial Law Order; Delta To Fly Stowaway Back To The U.S. On Wednesday; U.S. Supreme Court To Hear Case On Trans Youth Health Care. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired December 03, 2024 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:30]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: Good evening. Breaking news to bring you this evening. South Korean President Yoon Suk Yeol has lifted his
martial law order only hours after introducing it and following a tumultuous night in South Korea.
People on the streets of Seoul cheered when Yoon made the pre-dawn announcement around two hours ago. Yoon's Cabinet then gathered and voted
to end the measure.
So the martial law was enacted barely eight hours ago. Yoon is accusing his opponents of sympathizing with North Korea. Parliament, however,
immediately blocked the martial law decree. It was a unanimous vote. In other words, even his own party voted against him.
Paula Hancocks is with me, having been our South Korea correspondent for more than one or two years, I think is the way we will put that.
Paula, let's talk about what happened in the last two hours, and then we can reverse into why it all happened in the first place.
PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Richard, it really has been a remarkable night. What we've heard in the past couple of hours
is after that martial law decree was declared by President Yoon, the Parliament voted against it. You had a unanimous vote against this martial
law, and that included some members of President Yoon Suk Yeol's own party, 190 of the 300 lawmakers, they were the only ones that could get there in
the middle of the night and were willing to be part of this. And then shortly afterwards, we heard the president himself saying that he was going
to lift that martial law decree.
So the entire process really only took about six hours from when he decided that there would be martial law to when he acknowledged that he was going
to lift that, a remarkable six hours, where I think it is important to say it was positive in the fact that no one was injured because this is a very
serious declaration that the president made -- Richard.
QUEST: So that brings us to the core question: Why did he introduce martial law in the first place?
HANCOCKS: His statement said that he was doing it against communist forces in North Korea, against communist sympathizers. He was talking about the
anti-state elements, and then he talked about the opposition party. He talked about the Democratic Party which is in control of the Parliament in
South Korea, which has been effectively blocking him from carrying out his political agenda.
So what it appears, it is on the face of it because there may be more to this than we know at this point. We would like to hear obviously, again
from President Yoon, but on the face of it, it appears as though he took this decision to solve a political problem. It appears, and many experts
are agreeing with this at this point, that this was a political calculation or I should say, a political miscalculation, because there will be a huge
backlash. There has been a backlash against this.
But for the information that we have at this point, that appears to be what it was.
QUEST: Extraordinary, though I mean, there was no warning, no inkling. Nobody was ready for this and it seems likely, I don't know, you tell me,
there was no justification for it.
HANCOCKS: Well, it happened in the middle of the night. Even the United States, the strongest ally that South Korea really has, was not warned
about this. The other members of Yoon's party were not warned about this.
Now, we have heard from the leader of his own party who has since called for the Defense minister to be dismissed because he was part of this
decision as well and he was suggesting that it was the Defense minister that had advised him that this was the correct move to make. But this will
have repercussions.
The entire situation only lasted about six hours, but President Yoon Suk Yeol cannot go back to that time before he made that declaration, too much
has changed. There have been calls for his impeachment. There have been calls for him to be locked up.
[16:05:16]
Of course, these are from the protesters who were at the National Assembly. They are going to have a certain political frame of mind. But I think the
calls against him continuing will get louder.
QUEST: Paula, I am grateful. Thank you very much. Thank you. Paula in Abu Dhabi.
The protesters remain outside the Parliament Building. Some of them are demanding President Yoon's impeachment as Paula was suggesting.
The United States, it says it wants the situation to be resolved peacefully and according to the rule of law, which is no surprise, South Korea is one
of the most important allies to the US and the US has nearly 30,000 troops there. The military presence, which of course, is the deterrent from
attacks from North Korea and helps the United States counter China's influence in the region.
Ambassador Warwick Morris is the former British ambassador to South Korea. The former ambassador is with me now.
Do you have any idea what the president was up to here?
WARWICK MORRIS, FORMER BRITISH AMBASSADOR TO SOUTH KOREA: Well, no, I don't. It seems a very rash thing to have done, particularly in the middle
of the night and it looked like a throwback to the bad old days of pre- democracy Korea. It is just extraordinary how much has happened in so few hours and that now he is sort of back to square one, only in a much worse
position.
QUEST: Right. But to be clear, to your knowledge, there was nothing brewing that would have led to this. Those of us, obviously not in the country or
don't follow it closely, might be surprised to know, but those in South Korea might be saying, oh, well, we could see it on the cards, but it
doesn't sit well. I see you shaking your head. It doesn't seem like even that.
MORRIS: Yes, I've not seen or heard anything to that effect. I mean, it has to be -- we have to remember that when he got in 2022, it was a tiny
majority. Closest it has ever been in a free election in South Korea and he has been up against it politically for most of that time.
He is also a hardliner, taking a hard line against North Korea, whereas some predecessors have tried to build bridges, but no, I really cannot see
the justification for that and it has frankly blown up in his face now and I would be rather surprised if he was able to continue long as president.
QUEST: So that was my next question. Is he done?
MORRIS: Very possibly, but I think that the good thing that has come out of this is that, you know, the Korean people, South Korean people showed very
quickly that they didn't want any sort of return to the bad old days. You know, they've been a democracy for nearly 40 years and an important
democratic country in Asia with, as you've mentioned important allies.
And I think, you know I lived there in the 1970s, the last five years of Park Chung-hee's military dictatorship, when there was something very close
to martial law the whole time.
Now nobody wants to return to that and people under about 40 years of age don't -- have never experienced that. They have lived under democracy.
No, I think he why he did it and I am still puzzled and what led him to do it? I really don't understand.
QUEST: What would you say is the strength of South Korea's democracy. The elections there are always -- they are always a bit fraught and they're
always a bit very noisy and certainly, if we look back at previous presidents, there has been no shortage of corruption and malfeasance.
MORRIS: There has -- yes, there has often been corruption or claims of corruption against presidents. Of course, they can only serve one term of
five years in South Korea, which is something that people talk about having changed, but it hasn't happened, so it is a very -- sorry, not a very long
time in which to achieve anything. And yes, there have been some corruption issues relating to this president, but that is not uncommon. I mean, that's
pretty much -- yes.
QUEST: Yes, so I guess we are all lucky that North Korea didn't take the moment of instability to do anything, or that other actors did not take,
maybe because it was the middle of the night, everybody was taken by surprise. Parliament did manage to meet and voted out that nobody was able
to capitalize on some very strange behavior.
MORRIS: Yes, that's a good point. It all happened so rapidly. There wasn't time, except, you know, there was time, I think for sort of South Korean
populists, certainly the people in Seoul who got up from their beds and went to the National Assembly and were determined, you know, to show their
sort of disgust at this situation.
The military, too must have found it very difficult for a few hours to know what to do.
[16:10:09]
And you know, they had the powers to do all kinds of things, but it sounds as if they didn't actually make use of those powers and they've now stood
down the martial law command.
QUEST: Would you, Ambassador, would you just put this down as a weird oddity. I guess, what we now need to understand particularly with the new
administration coming into Washington, number one, the ambiguity of the nuclear umbrella under which South Korea lives and the ability of China and
others to sort of make mischief whilst Donald Trump gets his feet wet under the table next time. It does not make for an easy time for the South.
MORRIS: It doesn't, but I mean South Korea has, you know, used to be called the shrimp between whales. It is no longer a shrimp. It can now stand up
for itself. The US and nuclear umbrella is very important but I think this actually will be over very quickly. And you know, governments are right to
be concerned.
Our own government, the US and Japan also, governments are right to be concerned. But I think it was really just a misjudgment, frankly, as I see
it from here by President Yoon, and it has blown up in his face and in some ways, South Korea may also be a bit stronger for it, the way the people
have reacted.
QUEST: I am grateful to you, sir. Thank you for joining us tonight. I appreciate it. Thank you.
Donald Trump is to return to the global stage, literally. He is visiting Paris this weekend for the reopening of the Notre Dame Cathedral. We will
talk about it in a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: President-elect Trump is to travel to Paris this weekend for the reopening of Notre Dame Cathedral. It will be his first overseas trip since
last month's election. It marks his return to the global stage six weeks before he will officially take the oath of office.
Donald Trump is wasting no time launching his foreign policy goals, including threatening to enter a trade war with neighbors, Canada and
Mexico.
Stephen Collinson is with me.
Stephen, we will get to Mexico and Canada. I just want to just look at this trip. This is just -- I am just -- whatever it is, float in a balloon,
Donald Trump seems to be elevating the relationship with France, not only by going there, but by the appointment of his in-laws, the convicted tax
fraud guy, Charlie Kushner, who Donald Trump sort of pardoned. He seems to be saying Paris and Macron, you're on the inside.
[16:15:27]
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN REPORTER: It certainly looks like that and it is I think, courtesy of some pretty smart diplomacy by the French who, like
other European governments have been trying to get inside Trump's inner circle ever since he was the Republican nominee.
We saw this, of course, in the first term, President Macron of France, really tried to flatter and court Trump, and it worked for a couple of
years until the wheels came off and that is the issue here with Trump. Foreign leaders all try to position themselves as the Trump whisperer, the
person who gets least damaged by the president-elect's foreign policies, the extreme nature of them. But in the end, Trump is Trump, so all of the
effort is still hostage, I think to the rather capricious nature of the man who is going to be president in six weeks' time.
QUEST: And that brings us to this weirdness of the relationship with Canada and Mexico, and the tariffs. The way I look at it, he was essentially
negotiating. He set out his foreign policy and not only did he negotiate, they came running. Was that joke Trudeau saying -- he told Trudeau you
should become the 51st state of the union?
COLLINSON: Right and what he has done with not a great deal of effort is establish dominance certainly over Prime Minister Justin Trudeau who has
got his own problems, political problems in Canada and is facing a very uphill slog to re-election next year.
Trudeau rushed down to Mar-a-Lago. Trump doesn't see Canada and Mexico necessarily as allies or any of America's traditional allies. He sees
somebody else on the other side of the table. Every equation for him is a win and a loss, as you say, it is a negotiation and as the strongest
partner in most of these dynamics, Trump believes that the United States should make its demands.
Notice, he didn't go to Trudeau and say, look I've got a problem. There's too much fentanyl coming over the border. There are too many undocumented
migrants. He said, unless you do exactly what I say, we are going to damage you and we are going to damage the Canadian economy. That's the way Trump
works, and it is a way of business the world is going to get used to yet again.
QUEST: And we have the BRICS, as if this wasn't enough, he threatens the BRICS countries with a hundred percent tariffs if they go forward or try
and create their own currency as besides, as he describes it, the mighty dollar. He is not even in office yet, Stephen.
COLLINSON: Right. And I think you could argue he is setting himself up with some pretty easy wins here. Canada has said it is going to take some steps,
so Trump can turn around and say when he takes office, I've tightened the northern border. The idea that these BRICS are going to soon get together
and have their own currency seems rather far-fetched, so Trump can say, well, look, I stopped that.
So a lot of this is setting himself up with easy wins. I think the big question of the second term, however is, is that the only way that Trump is
going to operate? Is he going to be a little bit more hard line with some of these tariff plans? Is he actually going to go ahead and impose these
big tariffs --
QUEST: Right. Because --
COLLINSON: Carry on.
QUEST: Sorry, I just want you to just -- you piqued my interest with something, because when you talk to people about Donald Trump, they always
say the same thing, his bark is worse than his bite. He threatens, and actually, in the negotiating room, he always either backs off or a
compromise is reached et cetera. It is an opening gambit.
I wonder at some point whether he has to bite.
COLLINSON: Right, and those tactics become less effective if everyone thinks he is bluffing all the time. So he may well have to go further.
One thing, however, with Trump is, if you look at his history in the first term, whenever he has had to pay a political price himself on an issue, he
has rowed back pretty quickly. So if he were to impose massive tariffs on Canada or whoever, American prices suddenly went up. This is the man that
was supposedly elected to get prices down.
I think history tells us that Trump is quite concerned about his own political standing. That said, he is a lame duck president. He doesn't have
to run again. So perhaps his equation will change a little bit in the second term. But I think Trump's willingness to tolerate the political
impact of many of his economic policies, which could be damaging for Americans, is the key to watch next year.
QUEST: And we are so glad you're with us and you will be, again, and again and again --
COLLINSON: Thanks.
QUEST: -- over the next few years. It will be good to talk and get to grips with it. Thank you.
COLLINSON: Cheers.
[16:20:08]
QUEST: To Syria now where the US military has conducted what it has called a self-defense strike in Eastern Syria. Officials say it was unrelated to
the ongoing rebel operations there. This video shows further advances made by rebel groups as they begin to close in on the major city of Hama.
Ben Wedeman is monitoring events from Rome.
BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Richard, forces loyal to the Syrian government remain on the defensive with attention now focused
on the central Syrian city of Hama. The rebels have taken up positions north of Hama, a city where in 1982, the army and intelligence services of
then president Hafez al-Assad, the father of today's President Bashar al- Assad, killed more than 10,000 people during an uprising led by the Muslim Brotherhood. Hama was also the scene of huge anti-Assad regime protests at
the start of the revolt against Bashar in 2011.
Now the Syrian National News Agency is reporting that Tuesday evening, the government reinforcements have been deployed to the city in anticipation of
an assault by the armed opposition. Now, the rebel offensive is spearheaded by Hayat Tahrir al-Sham formerly known as Jabhat al-Nusra, considered by
the US to be a terrorist organization.
Meanwhile, the rebels are consolidating their grip over most of Aleppo, Syria's second biggest city. Regime forces largely abandoned the city
without much of a fight.
The area under the control of Hayat Tahrir al-Sham has more than doubled in less than a week, while the United Nations reports that almost 50,000
people have been displaced as a result of the renewed fighting.
Now, the Syrian Defense Ministry has vowed to launch a counteroffensive, but apart from strikes by the Syrian and Russian Air Forces, that
counteroffensive has yet to materialize -- Richard.
QUEST: Ben Wedeman in Rome.
As you and I continue tonight, South Korea's president says he will lift his martial law decree. It lasted only a few hours. And the question now
becomes, what happens to him? A report from Seoul in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:25:34]
QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. A lot more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS in a moment and our coverage of the breaking news in South Korea. We will get to
all of it after I've updated you with the news headlines.
President Biden says the history of slavery will forever link the United States to Angola. He delivered his remarks outside Angola's National Museum
of Slavery. Mr. Biden has been promoting US investment in Angola during the trip. He also announced more than a billion dollars of drought assistance
to Africans across the continent.
The Prince and Princess of Wales were amongst the Royals who welcomed the Emir of Qatar for a start of a state visit to the UK. Catherine has been
slowly returning to her duties following chemotherapy treatment. The queen, Queen Camilla is still suffering from a chest infection and did not take
part in today's ceremonies.
A New York jury is deliberating the fate of the former Marine, Daniel Penny, who was charged in the chokehold death of the homeless man in the
subway. Penny said he was protecting other passengers from Jordan Neely. If convicted, he could face up to 15 years for manslaughter.
US officials say an E. coli outbreak linked to McDonald's is now over. More than a hundred people were infected and one person died. The contamination
likely came from slivered onions served on the Quarter Pounders. McDonald's stopped serving the recalled onions back in October.
To our top story now, South Korean President Yoon's short-lived attempt to establish martial law. In Seoul, the public cheered his decision overnight
to lift the measure. The protesters remain outside Parliament. Some of them are now calling for the president's impeachment.
Yoon's attempt to enact martial law, well, all in all, lasted about six hours. He accused the main opposition party of anti-state activities and
sympathizing with the North. Parliament swiftly voted to block the decree and Yoon gave in to their decision.
Mike Valerio is in Seoul where it is early morning, half past six in the morning.
Well, you've had a busy night, haven't you, one way and another. So what do you make of what has taken place?
MIKE VALERIO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It is all sinking in, Richard. I mean, I think that the country feels whiplashed. We all started to look at the news
on our phones, and frankly I felt the same way. I asked a whole myriad of people this too, and we thought this was a headline coming out of North
Korea instituting martial law.
But at this very early hour, here in one of the nexus points of where this drama has played out, we are just a couple of meters away from the National
Assembly.
So let's show you the crowd that is here before sunrise. It has diminished, obviously, some people going to bed, but this crowd is expected to expand
as the sun comes up.
Richard, you should have seen this a few hours ago where there were at least two military Humvees that were on this street, and as soon as the
Parliament voted to overturn and suspend this martial law, the military vehicles started to move out and people were cheering.
Now, everybody gathered here is wondering what is the president's next move?
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
VALERIO (voice over): Soldiers clashing with citizens in a shocking scene outside of South Korea's Parliament as crowds chant --
(PROTESTERS chanting)
VALERIO (voice over): "Dismiss the martial law" after the country's president declared nationwide military rule the first time since 1980 in an
unusual late night TV address.
YOON SUK YEOL, PRESIDENT OF SOUTH KOREA (through translator): I declare emergency martial law to defend the Republic of Korea from the danger of
North Korean communist forces.
VALERIO (voice over): All this in response to a number of actions by the opposition, including rejecting a budget bill and attempts to impeach
officials from Yoon's administration. Yun Suk Yeol said the moves were intended to "incite rebellion" and accused opposition lawmakers of trying
to destabilize the country.
Broken windows and rifle wielding soldiers standing at the National Assembly Building as tensions between the presidency and opposition
lawmakers spilled into mass protests.
VALERIO (on camera): We're here in the crowd, and there are two military vehicles that are trying to get out of here. We are just a few blocks away
from the National Assembly.
There were some soldiers that were saying their military vehicles are trying to leave the area, and get back to their base. Protesters of course,
voicing their huge outrage and dismay at this moment.
VALERIO (voice over): The extraordinary measure, the president insists, was to do away with what he claims are groups sympathetic towards North Korea.
Hours later, Yoon forced into reversing his decision after lawmakers voted to overturn his order, leaving a rattled South Korean public reeling from
the political chaos.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[16:30:42]
VALERIO (on-camera): So just again, to set the scene, Richard, over my right hand shoulder, you see a banner in Korean and it says impeach the
president of South Korea now. I think even at this early morning hour, you can hear it in the background palpable anger. People from grandmothers to
students to, you know, corporate office workers asking themselves and asking us, why did our president take us down this road?
So we're waiting to see if we hear from South Korea's president at all today and if he can give us more justification or shreds of evidence from
his speech why exactly he did this, and people are wondering how many days left does he have in office.
QUEST: I know that's a valid point because one is left wondering, one of several things, and I don't know, believe me, Mike, I don't expect you to
have the answer. Number one, is he feeling well? Is he sort of unwell? Number two, does he have intelligence information the rest don't have? And
number three, has he just lost it?
VALERIO: And we're not going to speculate about that. But it is worth pointing out for the record, Richard, that nobody knew about this. We talk
about the ironclad alliance between the United States and South Korea. Biden administration had no heads up about this. The head of President
Yoon's political party had no heads up about this. What was the progenitor of this whole thing?
You know, we have a -- he's a weak president. His approval rating in the low 20 percent margin for the past couple of months now. Did he do this to
quash dissent, to have the impression of being in control and powerful? Is there something looming that we have not heard about yet? That's going to
be our mission, our reporting mission over the next couple of hours, just it has taken so many people aback and really left them with a feeling of
anger -- Richard.
QUEST: What time did we wake you up in the morning?
VALERIO: I was asleep so I could do a school report at 6:00 a.m., and I looked at my phone and I thought it was, honest to God, I thought it was
North Korea. So I woke up around 10:00. But no worries. It's what we are here to do. This is who we are at CNN. We are on the ground and ready to go
whenever news happens.
QUEST: Oh, absolutely, mate, you're staying there. You ain't moving until this thing is finished. That's what we do. Thank you, sir.
Mike Valerio in Seoul for us tonight. And we'll be there as indeed will the whole team be there.
Now President Yoon's popularity has plunged since he took office in 2022. Series of scandals, controversies, now calls for the impeachment.
Heesoo Jang is the assistant professor at the University of Massachusetts at Amherst.
All right, Professor, what do you make of what's happened overnight? Is it weird? Does it make any form of political sense to you?
HEESOO JANG, ASSISTANT PROFESSOR, UNIVERSITY OF MASSACHUSETTS AMHERST: Hello. Can you hear me?
QUEST: Loud and clear.
JANG: Thanks for having me. First of all, I do want to mention this should not come as a surprise. South Korea has been witnessing authoritarian moves
and the erosion of democratic institutions for some time now under the current administration, from repeated vetoes of accountability measures,
systemic failures in governances. These have been building blocks leading up to this moment actually.
The declaration of martial law is not an isolated incident. It's the culmination of a broader pattern that many, including more than 4,000
academics in the nation, have been warning about.
QUEST: Right. But is he doing it or did the president do this through some sort of authoritarian desire to, you know, he's a fascist in all but name
only? Or does he genuinely believe there is this risk from the North, that there are infiltrators and there are conspiracies?
JANG: Well, as far as I know, I haven't heard President Yoon speak about that, so I can't mind read. However, I do want to say that President Yoon's
declaration of martial law is a turning point. This moment is unprecedented since South Korea became a democracy in 1987. As you know, we've never seen
democratic rights just stripped away like this so completely, so suddenly. And for the first time in our country's democratic history, the
foundational freedoms of its citizens have been just dismantled overnight.
[16:35:04]
QUEST: So, Jang, do you think he just thought I might get away with this? Do you think he just thought, hang on, let's have a go and see what
happens?
JANG: Well, thanks for that question. I hope not, despite everything that's happening, I do remain hopeful. What gives me hope is the resilience
demonstrated by South Korea's democratic stakeholders during this national crisis. For the past six darkest hours, we've seen citizens have been
mobilizing. Journalists have been breaking critical stories. Lawmakers voted to lift martial law. And the military has shown signs of
responsibility after the vote.
So these actions, in my opinion, prove that while the government may try to suppress democracy, the people and institutions are upholding it and are
very much still alive and fighting back.
QUEST: The relationship that exists between military, government and the chaebols, the very powerful, corporate giants, is often murky and yet
throughout that murkiness, there is a very robust democracy that does see change in government, that does see parties win and lose, doesn't it?
JANG: Yes, and I do want to mention that I see these events that have been unfolding in South Korea through a lens of a global trend of these kinds of
actions. Now, while historically the decline of democracy has been marked by, for example, sudden collapses in countries with low to moderate
economic development, this doesn't explain the recent patterns in the United States and South Korea, as you know, and we're seeing backsliding
happening gradually and impacting a broader range of nations like South Korea.
QUEST: Right. So with your experience, what do you think happens to the president? And does he resign? Does he get kicked out? Is he impeached? How
do you think it plays out now?
JANG: So back before the president lifted the martial law declaration, if the president did refuse to comply with the National Assembly's decision,
this would have provided grounds for impeachment. But now that he did lift officially the martial law, we'll just have to wait and see.
QUEST: I'm grateful for you. Thank you very much indeed for joining us. Appreciate your time. Thank you.
JANG: Thank you so much for having me.
QUEST: Now, the important point here is South Korea is an important U.S. ally and one of its key military partners in the region. So Washington was
caught off guard by the political instability and bearing in mind that President Biden is actually in Angola on a state visit, it gives you an
idea of the precariousness of the position.
We'll discuss it with Oren Liebermann after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:40:24]
QUEST: The political crisis in South Korea apparently caught U.S. officials by surprise, along with everybody else. President Biden was asked about it
in Angola and told the reporters he was only just being briefed on the situation. The Pentagon said it was monitoring developments.
South Korea is hosting around 30,000 U.S. troops.
Oren Lieberman is with me.
So you've got the 30,000 troops. You've also got the implied nuclear umbrella under which South Korea lives. You've got a huge, vast swathe of
U.S. armaments over there as well. What do you make of it all?
OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think first this all happened so quickly that I don't know that there was time for the U.S. to
make dramatic and major force posture or military changes, but certainly you could see it in the surprise of the reaction of the U.S. Frankly, I
think the North Koreans were probably just as surprised.
There were some military-to-military communications for all the reasons you just mentioned. South Korea is an incredibly important ally with a very
large U.S. military presence and that doesn't even count all the civilians who are tied to that.
Now, at least from the U.S. Military perspective, they are still monitoring how this all plays out and they are monitoring just across the border if
North Korea decides to take any sort of action to try to take advantage of the situation especially because the South Korean president blamed the
North for what he saw as the problems that he says led him to declare martial law.
So without a doubt it is still an incredibly sensitive situation, one that could have profound effects on U.S. national security. But right now, at
this point, Richard, it doesn't look like it has had major changes. The U.S. is still watching closely, again, South Korea is in touch with the
U.S. and now after the initial surprise, does this end well?
QUEST: I guess the answer to that is, what's the alternative?
LIEBERMANN: Exactly. This could have gone, and look, it's certainly not over yet. Could still go in different directions and that's what the U.S.
is watching very carefully.
QUEST: Right.
LIEBERMANN: And I think that's why you're not seeing the U.S. make big statements at this point. Certainly there are elements of this that are
awkward. The U.S. hosted a democracy summit earlier this year in South Korea and this is not what you want to see after something like that but
that is part of this. Go ahead.
QUEST: Yes. I just wanted to talk about it, I mean, the unknown in all of this is Donald Trump. I mean, not that he's president yet but he seems to
be involving himself in many different foreign affairs issues concerning tariffs trades, Canada and Mexico and everywhere else. We haven't really
heard from him on the South Korea, but he has been very vocal in the last administration, his last administration about this idea of South Korea
paying its way almost mercantilist. They buy more stuff type of thing.
LIEBERMANN: And they pay for the U.S. presence there. They pay the U.S. to have 28,500 troops and thousands of others. Now I think that idea has come
up here and there along the campaign trail. It hasn't been one of his big issues unlike, for example, what to do with Ukraine, what to do with Gaza,
what to do with Lebanon. But it is still something that could very profoundly affect the relationship between the U.S. and South Korea, not
just on the military level but just about every other level as well should he choose to press that issue, frankly, press that button again.
QUEST: Oren Lieberman at the Pentagon, I'm grateful to you, sir. Thank you.
Now, this is a fascinating story. So there was this stowaway who caused chaos on a Delta flight is set to be returned to the United States. First
of all, the stowaway gets across the Atlantic, then there are two attempts to bring her back. She's Russian. And both failed. Now they're going to
have another go.
Mary Schiavo is going to explain who and why, and what and how.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:46:49]
QUEST: A Paris airport official says that Delta Airlines will return the stowaway, the woman who got on board a flight to France last week and will
return her on Wednesday. She's a Russian national and she will be escorted by two French security officials.
She sneaked aboard the Delta flight from New York to Paris without a ticket. There have then been two attempts by Delta to return her to the
U.S. Both were aborted.
CNN's aviation analyst Mary Schiavo joins me.
The latest one had six U.S. air marshals around her. I'm not surprised Delta decided not to fly her. I'm not sure why they think that she won't be
troubled tomorrow?
MARY SCHIAVO, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Well. exactly. I don't know why they would assume that since there will be two French accompanying her. We don't
know what they are. I assume that they are official. I assume they're law enforcement, but we don't know that. And, of course Delta is in a difficult
spot. If you're an airline and you transport someone to another country on an international flight without a proper passport or the proper visas, or
sometimes for any other reasons, if you're on a banned list, et cetera.
The airline is responsible financially and otherwise to remove that passenger from that country and take them back. So Delta is on the hook
until this is finally resolved.
QUEST: I mean, I can see a scenario where eventually they end up having to charter a plane because, I mean, the last thing Delta wants is a passenger
being -- coming to be, you know, tied to the seat or whatever, and becomes like a prison, a prison flight, which is what they would do in a case that
they had to fly back on a chartered plane or a prison plane.
SCHIAVO: Exactly. And so the video that's circulating on social media of someone took a picture of this stowaway lady on the first flight back, I
mean, she was flailing around and yelling, and there was some poor woman seated next to her, well, Delta bears responsibility if that woman was
hurt. So Delta is in, you know, between a rock and a hard place here. But it all could have been avoided if they, you know, checked her ticket,
checked her passport, checked her visa, since she's not a U.S. citizen and the visa could indeed be required for France. And so I agree with you. I'm
surprised that they're now going to try a third flight.
QUEST: So let's go through. All right. Let's just humor me, if you will, mom. Humor me. So the first bit is you've got to check it. Well, she
obviously didn't do that. She then goes to TSA where you have to go and show identification. We don't know what happened there. She then has to go
through the security. Well, she probably did that. No one really looks at that. But we don't know how she got past that I.D. barrier.
You then get to the gate. Now, assuming it's Kennedy, so they could well have been using the new biometrics, they could have well have been using a
piece of -- how she then jumps onto the aircraft and then loo-hops for the whole flight. I mean, there's enough blame to go around.
SCHIAVO: Oh, there's lots of blame to go around. And now the TSA is saying that she slipped between two facial identity stops between two posts.
[16:50:07]
Well, wasn't somebody there? Wasn't there a barrier? But TSA has now bragged but by gosh, we got two bottles of water out of her luggage. So she
at least put her carry ons on the belt and they got two bottles of water.
QUEST: Mary --
SCHIAVO: I find it amazing that they're bragging.
QUEST: Mary, I'm glad you mentioned this because let's just (INAUDIBLE) if you've got a moment or two more. The thing that's infuriated me about this
is this TSA, not nonchalance or insouciance, but this version of, we're not commenting, we don't comment on security procedures. This is a massive cop
out, and they are just hiding behind we don't comment on security procedures. I do wonder and somebody is going to cop it.
SCHIAVO: Right. And every checkpoint in America must be covered by closed circuit television, by video, and it must be recorded. They know exactly
what happened. They have the tape. They can see her on the tape. So it looks like they're doing a little scrambling and, you know, covering their
backsides before they actually comment.
QUEST: I mean, fascinating. I can't wait. We'll never will see the final report. But thank you. Thank you for joining us. Thank you.
Now a major case before the U.S. Supreme Court could determine whether state bans on transgender healthcare for children are constitutional. It's
a case that challenges Tennessee's ban on puberty blockers and hormone therapy for transgender minors. It also imposes civil penalties against
doctors violating the law.
CNN's Paula Reid reports on this high profile case.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Last year, Tennessee Republicans voted to make it illegal for transgender youth to be
prescribed certain medications or treatments for gender dysphoria.
L. WILLIAMS, PLAINTIFF: I couldn't imagine that I would be headed to the Supreme Court.
REID: L. Williams a teen identified, only as L. in court documents and speaking to us in shadow, was one of those directly impacted by the law.
She and her parents sued Tennessee after the ban disrupted her treatment.
At the start of adolescence, something to you felt like it wasn't quite right. Why was that?
L. WILLIAMS: Well, it was because essentially I was born in a male body and I am a woman, and that's incredibly uncomfortable for me.
REID (voice-over): Her parents, Brian and Samantha, had no idea.
SAMANTHA WILLIAMS, PLAINTIFF: I was surprised but I was never -- I was still like, from the very beginning, supportive, like, OK, this is what's
going on with you. We're there for it.
REID: And debated whether this was all just a phase.
BRIAN WILLIAMS, PLAINTIFF: I asked lots of questions, had a lot of pushback, you know, asked probably a lot of the questions that people are -
- who are in opposition to this case are probably asking, you know, is this a phase? What does this mean?
REID: They got her a therapist and eventually started treatments.
L. WILLIAMS: It's been very helpful. Life changing even. For some people, it's even been life-saving.
REID: The Tennessee ban forced doctors to stop treating transgender patients like L. with treatments that included puberty blockers and hormone
therapies.
S. WILLIAMS: It was just purely political. It was, let's use these poor kids and these families as a pawn. And like we just want to be able to take
her to the doctor.
REID: Roughly two dozen similar laws have been enacted in recent years in Republican-led states. Now, L.'s case, which was joined by two other
families, is before the U.S. Supreme Court.
CHASE STRANGIO, LAWYER: When I go before the high court, I'm not going to be thinking about myself as the first transgender lawyer.
REID: Chase Strangio will make history as the first known transgender person to argue before the high court on behalf of teens like L. The other
side of this case, the state of Tennessee, has gotten support from groups like Do No Harm and Dr. Stanley Goldfarb, who believes this treatment
should not be available to minors.
DR. STANLEY GOLDFARB, FOUNDER, DO NO HARM: We feel that children just are really unable to do this in a way that involves informed consent primarily,
and that many of them are just children that are very troubled.
REID: We pressed him on why patients like L. claim their lives have benefited from this treatment.
GOLDFARB: There's a huge placebo effect. Anytime a patient is told, you know, we're going to help you with this medication, you're going to feel
better, it's going to be the answer to your problems, there's often an acute response that's positive to it.
REID: But L. says that explanation belies her experience.
Supporters of this bill say it's too easy. You're saying there's nothing easy about it.
L. WILLIAMS: There isn't anything easy about it.
REID (voice-over): L.'s parents, who have had to travel as far as Ohio to continue her treatment, have not ruled out moving to another state if this
case does not go their way.
[16:55:05]
B. WILLIAMS: You have, you know, strong career ties and neighborhood that we love and a house that we love.
S. WILLIAMS: Kids have friends.
B. WILLIAMS: Kids have friends. I don't want to pull them out of school and go to another state. It's just, I don't know, we shouldn't have to do that.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: We should watch closely when that case is heard.
A mixed day on Wall Street. I do need to update you on how things have gone. Small gains for the S&P 500 and the Nasdaq to fresh lows. The Dow is
-- it was down but it's only off 76 points. It's everybody's trying.
Now people trying to make sense of markets. Here on this program, well, we all relied for years on the wisdom of a man called Art Cashin. The Wall
Street veteran passed away this week at the age of 83. He was a fixture at the New York Stock Exchange, known by everyone, including ourselves.
I spoke to him, for example, in 2012, when the U.S. was headed towards the fiscal cliff and he put the moment into perspective.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ART CASHIN, WALL STREET VETERAN: History is replete with that, unfortunately, you may well recall that World War I started because
everybody believed no one would be foolish enough to go into it, and yet they marched one step at a time, saying the other guy will give up first,
and that's what's happening potentially in Washington, D.C.
QUEST: Is there a cheerful note on which to finish this?
CASHIN: Yes, it's Friday and the weekend is about to begin.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Art Cashin, who died.
We'll have a "Profitable Moment" in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: I was tempted for tonight's "Profitable Moment" to talk about the events in South Korea but the reality is we don't know whether the
president was mad, bad, sad or glad. And we don't know the reasons why or whatever happened. So I don't think it's very fruitful to do that. Instead,
tonight's "Profitable Moment," the stowaway.
All right. So the woman gets past the I.D. check. She gets past the gate, gets on the plane. She loo-hops the entire flight from Kennedy to Charles
de Gaulle. And then two attempts are made to bring her back. And not surprisingly, Delta says, oh, hang on, we're not having her on the plane.
She's going to cause a ruckus and chaos. And now they're going to try again tomorrow.
I don't know whether they'll succeed tomorrow because why should they? They haven't been able to do it the last two days. My gut feeling says they'll
probably end up flying her back on her own plane. But there's just so many things we don't know about this case. And we want to know.
Well, I want to know because that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope
it is profitable. We'll be back with you tomorrow.
JAKE TAPER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.
This hour the NFL makes its decision. But did the league go far enough or too far in punishing the Texans linebacker responsible for a late illegal
hit on Sunday? The Texans general manager has weighed in with some colorful language.
Plus, the White House blindsided as chaos unfolds in South Korea, the country's president declaring martial law. Troops marching on the
parliament building. Protesters filling the streets.
END
