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Quest Means Business
Syrian Rebels Appoint Mohammad al-Bashir As Caretaker Prime Minister; Israel Escalates Military Operations In Syria; UnitedHealthcare CEO Murder Suspect Fighting Extradition; Malibu Residents Flee As California's Franklin Fire Explodes; Netanyahu Takes The Stand In His Corruption Trial; Chatbot Company Accused Of Providing Sexual Content And Self-Harm And Violence; Argentina's President Milei's "Chainsaw Approach" After One Year In Office; Walgreens In Talks to Sell Itself To Private Equity; British Pubs Face Guinness Shortage. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired December 10, 2024 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:09]
JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: Greece literally flying the flag there for foreign investments at the New York Stock Exchange. Lots of claps
and cheers, though the markets, under a bit of pressure. Inflation from the United States keeping investors cautious today.
Those are the markets and these are the main events.
A new prime minister is named in Syria as rebels confront the challenges of building a government and rebuilding the nation.
An outburst from the man suspected of last week's CEO murder. Luigi Mangione yells and struggles on his way into the courthouse.
And drugstore deal making. Shares of Walgreens-Boots alliance soar on reports of a possible sale.
Live from New York. It is Tuesday, December 10th. I'm Julia Chatterley, in for Richard Quest and this is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
And a good evening once again. Tonight, the Syrian rebels that overthrew President Bashar al-Assad are beginning the work of forming a government.
Mohammed al-Bashir has been named caretaker prime minister. The rebel- linked leader will serve in that role for the next three months. Israel, meanwhile, is stepping up attacks on targets in Syria. Prime Minister
Netanyahu saying Israel will fiercely respond if the new government threatens its security.
Now, despite the uncertainty, many Syrians are celebrating the end of Assad's brutal regime. Jomana Karadsheh reports from a Damascus suburb.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We are in Daraya. This is a Damascus suburb, one of the hardest hit areas in Syria by the war.
It all started here as a peaceful uprising in 2011. People took to the streets in peaceful protest. They were met with violent repression that
turned into an armed rebellion and that Civil War. The regime used some of its most horrific tactics in Daraya.
It was besieging, bombing, and starving the civilian population and the people of Daraya into surrender, and you see the scale of destruction here,
and it is just so hard to imagine what people went through, and speaking to residents of Daraya people who had to leave their homes years ago, they say
that most of the destruction we are seeing was caused by barrel bombs.
This was used a lot by the regime in different areas. These are crude, unguided munitions where they pack explosives into barrels and just drop
them from the skies and you can see what this has caused and you can think back and imagine that there were civilians, that there were women and
children here.
And speaking to people, they say that their sacrifice, all that they went through is worth it, because they say now they finally have the chance at
handing over a different, a new, and a free Syria they say to their children.
But they say that this is up to the rebel groups and the different opposition groups right now to ensure that that is what happens.
Jomana Karadsheh, CNN in Daraya, Syria.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: Our thanks to Jomana there.
Now, the United Nations special envoy for Syria is calling on Israel to stop bombing the country. The IDF says it has been striking weapons'
stockpiles, claiming it carried out 480 strikes across Syria in the past two days.
Israel has seized the demilitarized area between Syria and the Israeli occupied Golan Heights, and the Israeli defense minister says Israel's Navy
has destroyed Syria's Navy.
CNN's military analyst, Cedric Leighton told Eleni Giokos the Syrian Navy has been used to supply Israel's enemies.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COL. CEDRIC LEIGHTON (RET), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: When you look into the Syrian Naval Fleet, it was a relatively small fleet, and we are not talking
a major player in the Eastern Mediterranean in terms of naval forces. However, this is significant because the Syrian Navy was often used by Iran
and its proxy, Hezbollah, to transfer weapons that originally came from Iran and then went through Syria and then were transshipped to places like
Lebanon, and then, of course, down to Gaza as well, Hamas also, I think, benefited from what they were able to transship that way.
So in essence, the Syrian Navy was a bit of a support force for these efforts. They also supported the Russian Naval presence in the Eastern
Mediterranean, which still exists at Tartus, and that is of course, significant, but the way in which the Israelis did this, it is very clear
that they are trying to, in essence, zeroize, if you will, the Syrian military capability and make it a much different, a more different place
when it comes to the military balance of power in the Northern Middle East.
[16:05:22]
ELENI GIOKOS, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Cedric, I mean, we are looking at pictures right now of the sheer destruction, the
scale of the destruction of this Naval Fleet, really incredible to see at a time when we are hearing about a lot of airstrikes into Syria and of
course, Israel says they are targeting military targets. They are targeting chemical weapons and so forth.
I wonder from a military perspective, what the rebel groups in Syria right now would be making of this, these attacks and whether this is a concern
for you.
LEIGHTON: Yes, so this is -- you know, it is certainly a significant issue, Eleni, for the rebel forces because now they are unable to take over what
the Assad regime had built up in terms of their military capability.
The Assad regime was a client state of not only Iran, but also of Russia, so a lot of the equipment that we see in these videos is actually
originally Russian equipment that was either sold or donated to Syria over the last 50 years, really, of the Assad regime's rule.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHATTERLEY: Now, Syria's new leaders are taking over a nation and an economy in ruins. Just to give you some sense of perspective. Before the
Civil War, the Syrian pound was worth around 50 pounds to the US dollar. Now its worth around 15,000.
The head of Syria's largest business lobby says the new government will promote a free market. That's according to Reuters. But of course, first on
the agenda, restoring stability and order.
Niamh McBurney is associate director for the Middle East and North Africa at the consulting firm Control Risks.
Niamh, good to have you on the show with us.
Let's talk about the very short term, because there is the politics and then there is some degree of economics. On the political side, one would
imagine the new prime minister has to make outreach to the regional governments. I assume the ambassadors are the first port of call. On the
economy, it is money flowing to maintain public order to local authorities.
Do we have any sense of whether both of those two things are taking place at this moment?
NIAMH MCBURNEY, ASSOCIATE DIRECTOR FOR THE MIDDLE EAST AND NORTH AFRICA, CONTROL RISKS: Absolutely, we do and thank you very much for having me.
So on the political front, there has been both domestic and foreign outreach by Hayat Tahrir al-Sham and its officials. On the domestic front,
they have been working with some of the local groups, you know, across areas of the country in the western half of it that they are looking to
bring on side.
They also have their own governing body called the Syrian Salvation Government, which as of today is one-half of the transitional body that
will be ruling the country in addition to the support that will be offered or that already has been offered by members of the former government.
And then on the international front, there has been outreach to a couple of governments in the Gulf. They have also met with ambassadors from the Arab
world and also Italy, interestingly enough.
So, they are getting down to work really on some of the details there.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, important details, initially.
I was in Doha at the weekend, and one of the things that was being discussed, at least in monetary terms, was which currency would be used.
We'd obviously had reports of looting at the Central Bank. If we assume that the Syrian pound is maintained, which, of course, is what we are
hearing, does the infrastructure still exist to provide that immediate financing to the local authorities? Because the public order element of
this and continuing monetary flow to those areas is critical in these early stages?
And again, does that infrastructure exist? And is that still flowing?
MCBURNEY: Yes, that is absolutely right. So some additional reporting from Reuters today, actually, in addition to the point you made earlier, was
that the reserves in the Central Bank, gold and foreign currency remain protected and have been preserved. So that's incredibly important and very
positive.
But what we are also going to need to see is formal adjustments to the currency regime that allow people to use foreign currency within the
country that was a very archaic difficult system that had restricted people's access to foreign currency, although that could cause some
inflation. You know, that is going to need to be normalized in the longer term.
And there is also going to need to be international support as well, whether that's from regional partners such as Turkey or other Arab states
or more broadly, to also provide expertise as well as, you know, financial aid to help stabilize the economy, and, you know, the monetary policy over
the next kind of three to six months.
[16:10:09]
CHATTERLEY: Do you think Turkey is the initial provider of that foreign financing? They clearly have a vested interest. I believe they have the
closest relationship with the HTS at this point as well.
And we have to remember that they are, at least internationally for now, recognized as a sort of terrorist organization. So there are enormous
sanctions that are placed still on Syria, which I assume further down the line, at least very quickly, will have to be eased on some level.
MCBURNEY: Yes, so just on your first point there about Turkey, the group does have an affiliation with Turkey. There are relationships there,
preexisting relationships. And I mean, frankly, from an expertise point of view, Turkey is a country that has gone through an enormous amount of
economic and monetary policy struggles over the last five to, well, five years at least.
They will have something to teach the transitional government about how to manage some of these inflationary pressures and currency issues. But when
it comes to the situation more broadly, you know, de-listing, the group, HTS and other affiliates from terrorism designations, removing sanctions,
which of course, have been in place on Syria for several decades, 2004, and actually arguably earlier, some from the EU, and then reintroducing the
country into the SWIFT payment system.
All of these things are going to be fundamental in in helping its economic transition, but then the question is, is to whether western states, who
both are the main arbiters of these sanctions, whether it is the US, individual countries such as the UK, and then the European Union as a
supranational body, the UN, actually have the political will and the desire to move forward and to really push through the reversal of these sanctions
and terrorism designations.
It is not clear that that is necessarily the case, which could slow the political and economic transition as well. So that's certainly something to
watch.
CHATTERLEY: I am glad you mentioned the SWIFT payment system, because if they want to see some kind of formal rebuilding and investment in the
country, then this is an essential step that we need to see taken and critical to that decision will be the United States, the president-elect
and the next government.
What is your sense of what they are already saying or perhaps not saying about how they will help to smooth this transition? Because so far from the
president-elect, it has been about allowing the region to manage this situation, which has a very different feel than the current administration.
MCBURNEY: Yes, that is absolutely the case, and I think that the statements so far from the president-elect and his team have been, you know, very
interesting that they do, at least initially appear to want to take a step back to allow this to be a regional problem, which I mean, frankly, I think
for a number of regional actors, they would quite like to be able to, you know, support in the short term.
But there will absolutely need to be broader international support and the question ultimately is on whose terms is that? If the president-elect, once
he becomes president starts requiring changes of the transitional government that may not suit a number of the actors within Syria, and not
least, other regional states as well.
So, so there is a lot to, I mean, really to play for, for the future of the country, for the future of its economy and we shall see how the next six
months play out.
CHATTERLEY: Yes. Certainly.
Great to get your insights in the short term. We will see how and what takes place in the coming days and weeks.
Naimh McBurney, great to have you on. Thank you.
Okay, coming up for us, the suspect charged with killing UnitedHealthcare CEO, Brian Thompson is resisting extradition to New York. What comes next
for Luigi Mangione after this?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:1 6:26]
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back to QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
The suspect accused of killing UnitedHealthcare CEO, Brian Thompson is fighting his extradition to New York. Twenty-six-year-old Luigi Mangione
was denied bail after appearing in court in Pennsylvania earlier.
A video from the courthouse shows him shouting and resisting police as he entered the building. Mangione is facing a murder charge in New York, as
well as other charges, including criminally possessing a firearm.
His former roommate spoke to CNN earlier, saying he can make "zero sense" of Mangione's actions.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
R.J. MARTIN, FORMER ROOMMATE OF LUIGI MANGIONE: I know we talked about social issues and we talked about how to improve the world, and we talked
about, you know, issues that are, you know, say with capitalism or with the healthcare system or with housing or the food systems.
It wasn't, you know, anything specific. It wasn't like he had an ax to grind or he was even upset or angry about a particular issue. They were
just natural intellectual conversations that you have when you're inquisitive.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHATTERLEY: And Danny Freeman is following the case and has more details on what we are learning about Luigi Mangione.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DANNY FREEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Years before he'd be escorted into a Pennsylvania courthouse, Luigi Mangione spent time more
than 200 miles east here at the University of Pennsylvania in Philadelphia.
The prestigious Ivy League university, confirming Mangione graduated on May 18th, 2020 with a Bachelor's and Master's Degree in Engineering.
FREEMAN (on camera): That means he likely spent much of his time here at the School of Engineering and Applied Science.
Now, while there weren't a lot of people who knew him or willing to speak to us about him on camera, at least one student said that he was a TA of
Computer and Information Sciences.
FREEMAN (voice over): Also, in a since taken down post for the University's "Penn Today," Mangione was featured for leading a 60-student club that made
video games. "I wanted to make my own game and so I learned how to code," Mangione told a university writer.
JARED MITOVICH, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, "THE DAILY PENNSYLVANIAN": He was a member of the Honor Society Engineering School, which is only for the -- you know,
the top students in the class. He was involved in a fraternity on campus.
FREEMAN (voice over): UPenn student newspaper editor-in-chief, Jared Mitovich said his team has been working to see if there were any signs then
of what was to come.
MITOVICH: What was the type of education he received? Is Penn the type of place where he would have learned how to 3D print? Is it the type of place
where he, you know, was exposed to, you know, certain beliefs just in like the groups that he ran into or like the things that he was involved in?
FREEMAN (voice over): Mangione grew up in a wealthy family from Baltimore. According to "The Baltimore Sun," his grandfather, Nicholas Mangione, built
a local real estate empire that included nursing home facilities around Maryland and two suburban country clubs.
In a statement released by Mangione's cousin, Maryland State delegate, Nino Mangione, his family said they were "shocked and devastated by Luigi's
arrest."
At his arraignment, Monday night, Mangione told the judge he had been in contact with his family, "until recently."
LUIGI MANGIONE, SUSPECT IN BRIAN THOMPSON MURDER: It has been an incredible journey.
FREEMAN (voice over): Mangione graduated valedictorian in 2016 from Baltimore's prestigious all-boys, The Gilman School.
Former classmates couldn't believe he was now this suspect.
FREDDIE LEATHERBURY, HIGH SCHOOL CLASSMATE WITH SUSPECT: I can tell you that this is one of the last people you'd think would do something like
this.
FREEMAN (voice over): In recent years, according to a friend, in online postings, though, Mangione suffered from back pain and underwent surgery to
treat it. A Reddit user matching his biographical details writing in July 2023: "My back and hips locked up after the accident. Intermittent numbness
has become constant. I am terrified of the implications."
By mid-summer, the same year, Mangione then appeared to go quiet on social media.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: Our thanks to Danny Freeman there.
Let's get more now. Darrin Porcher is a former NYPD lieutenant and an expert in criminal justice.
Darrin, good to have you with us.
[16:20:08]
First of all, what did you make of his conduct as he was entering for the hearing in the courthouse today?
DARRIN PORCHER, FORMER NYPD LIEUTENANT AND CRIMINAL JUSTICE EXPERT: Well, hello, Julia.
I believe that his behavior was somewhat bizarre, but you have to look at what he is facing. He is looking at life imprisonment without the
possibility of parole.
This is someone that committed a horrific act against a citizen in the city of New York, which in no way, shape, or form supported him being the CEO
being shot in the body by this vicious assault. So I understand why he is just totally going off the deep end.
CHATTERLEY: I think a lot of people are wondering, and obviously we've got a little bit more understanding now of his medical history, but what takes
a 26 -year-old man with so much promise, a wealthy, privileged background, an elite education and makes him into a suspected killer in the manner that
we saw last week, Darrin.
PORCHER: I see strong parallels between the suspect in this case and Brian Kohberger, who was the suspect that allegedly killed the college students
in Idaho. Both of them had no criminal background, but it seems as if they were enamored with the aspect of homicide.
And when we look at the suspect in this particular case, he seemed as if he was trying to present a public spectacle of police, such as leaving a
backpack with Monopoly money. He clearly knew and understood that there was surveillance in the city of New York, and he led a tale for police with the
expectation of having his image, but not identifying him being known to the citizens of the city of New York.
So this is as bizarre as it may seem, this is quite rare, but it does happen.
CHATTERLEY: It is fascinating when you see that now we are hearing from friends who were saying that this is just unimaginable from the person that
they knew and that was posting in a very usual manner up until the summer of this year on social media about his activities.
He apparently suffered from chronic back pain for a long time. He had surgery in 2013. We know that his mother reported him missing because he
went dark on friends and family.
We are trying to reconcile that person that his family seemed to lose, his friends don't recognize with someone who allegedly committed something so
premeditated and organized that arrived in New York City 10 days earlier.
I've seen the sort of phrase, a psychiatric break being thrown around.
Can you reconcile the organization that the weapon that was used here, the premeditation with the person that apparently suffered with deep medical
issues, too, and we don't yet really understand the sort of healthcare consequences behind that, or what he faced and struggled in addition to the
pain, apparently.
PORCHER: From a psychiatric perspective, I haven't seen information that was introduced that supported that he was a person that was suffering from
a psychiatric breakdown. There was a disconnect between him, his friends and family on social media, but no medical records support that this was a
person that was spiraling out of control mentally.
So when we look at the firearm that was used, many people perceived him as being an expert. When they look at the video and they see him in a combat
stance, discharging this weapon against the CEO of a US healthcare. But I ultimately believe that this was an amateur because there were too many
breadcrumbs left to law enforcement, which inevitably led to the manifestation of an arrest in Pennsylvania.
There were too many things that he did wrong that led me to believe that this was a person that was an expert, and that being said, I think that it
is a valiant effort on the McDonald's employee to call up 911, provide a tip which allowed and afforded police to take this violent fugitive off the
streets.
CHATTERLEY: Darrin, what we can't hide from is some of the positive online reaction that we've seen to this tragic killing, and the idea of some kind
of retribution against the US insurance industry being enacted.
A book that was referenced on some of the bullets. It is called "Delay, Deny, Defend," and it is about the insurance industry is now number two on
the Amazon bestseller's list. I know Amazon is trying to clear merchandise related to it on their website as well. I am sort of leaping ahead a long
way here, but do you think this could ultimately have implications for a prosecution and potentially an unbiased trial?
All you need is one juror, potentially, that has some sympathy and has faced perhaps similar challenges with what we know is a challenging and a
troubled insurance industry in the United States.
[16:25:05]
PORCHER: Well, Julia, I don't know of one single person that hasn't had a claim denied with medical insurance.
CHATTERLEY: Right.
PORCHER: So, he is speaking or amplifying concerns of many Americans, but at the same token, that is no reason to shoot and kill the CEO of US
healthcare.
Granted, I believe that it is a serious concern that there may be a juror seated that may believe in the fact that the healthcare system is flawed
and they'd do any and everything not to pay people and so as a result, you can possibly have a juror that's seated that will believe that the actions
of the suspect in this case were appropriate.
But we, as common people need to understand that this was a horrific act, and this horrific act needs to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the
law, because we can't have a series of people that enact violence against healthcare insurance companies based on their inability to pay out a claim.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, nothing, nothing justifies the events that followed.
Darrin, good to have you, thank you.
Darrin Porcher there.
PORCHER: Thanks, Julia.
CHATTERLEY: Thank you.
All right, still to come, a wildfire burning out of control in Southern California. The latest on the dangers facing residents of Malibu, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back.
Let's go straight to Pennsylvania now, where the attorney for Luigi Mangione spoke just moments ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
THOMAS DICKEY, ATTORNEY FOR LUIGI MANGIONE: What happened today? There was an extradition proceeding. We did not -- N-O-T -- add that on there, okay,
because if you're reporting that earlier that we did, that did not happen. We did not waive extradition. We are contesting extradition.
We are going to fight this along the rules and with the constitutional protections that my client has and that is what we are going to do.
REPORTER: Can you explain why he doesn't want to --
DICKEY: No, I am not going to comment on that.
REPORTER: Did he say why he didn't want to waive extradition or --
DICKEY: No, that's an attorney-client communication and --
REPORTER: Who retained you? Is it the family?
DICKEY: I am not going to get into that.
REPORTER: How is he doing? Have you talked to him about his last 24 hours?
DICKEY: You -- no, I haven't. I am here as a lawyer, and that's what I --
REPORTER: What's next, sir?
DICKEY: The extradition proceeding, this process is going to move forward and so, I am anxious to be looking at information.
REPORTER: Is there a new court date? Another court date?
DICKEY: Not yet.
Yes, sir?
[16:30:25]
DICKEY: The extradition proceeding. This process is going to move forward. And -- so I'm anxious to be looking at information.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Is there a new court date? Another court date?
DICKEY: Not yet. Yes, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Who do you like in the Penns game tonight? That's a real question.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Will you be filing --
DICKEY: Hopefully, if I just answer that one, because I don't play favorites. Let's see if the Penns cannot blow a lead and hopefully they'll
win.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There you go.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: What about Penn State?
DICKEY: We're a Penn State fan. I hope they can do better than they did the other night.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Would you filing a habeas corpus petition?
DICKEY: Yes.
CHATTERLEY: That was the attorney for Luigi Mangione speaking there.
Now, we'll head to Southern California. A wildfire near Malibu's iconic coastline is spreading quickly, triggering mandatory evacuations as flames
threaten homes and businesses. The inferno is so intense that it's actually altering the weather around it.
Veronica Miracle has more.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
VERONICA MIRACLE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Malibu scenic hills ablaze after a fast-moving wildfire exploded overnight.
LYNDA MICHEL, FLED HOUSE SURROUNDED BY FIRE: From a one to 10, it was like a 15. Like scary.
MIRACLE: The Franklin Fire tripling in size in just one hour. At one point scorching the equivalent of five football fields every minute since it
ignited late Monday evening, prompting evacuation orders.
MICHEL: Everything, all these mountains were covered in flames, just covered, like you took a crayon and just colored everything.
MIRACLE: Lynda Michel is a caretaker who lives on a property with horses in the evacuation zone. She says she awoke to a wall of flames surrounding the
area and had to scramble to save the animals.
MICHEL: Woke everybody up, got everybody in the car. It was all -- nobody had time to get dressed. Everybody jumped in the car. I was like, get out
of here. And then after that I must have had like 30 minutes to run around and try to get the horses. And we didn't know what we were going to do.
Like, we could not leave them in the barn. Thank God we didn't leave them in the barn because the barn burned down.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can see the wind down there.
MIRACLE: The inferno fueled by dry conditions and Southern California's infamous Santa Ana winds, creating what fire officials call a, quote,
"particularly dangerous" situation. Some wind gusts reaching 40 to 60 miles per hour. The flames destroying some homes and threatening businesses. Even
the iconic Malibu Pier.
GABRIELLE SALGADO, PEPPERDINE UNIVERSITY STUDENT: It has definitely been a stressful and very tiring night.
MIRACLE: Hundreds at nearby Pepperdine University had to shelter in place for hours in the campus library. Classes were canceled on Tuesday.
SALGADO: I called my friends, found whatever friends I had in the same residential hall as me, and I just packed a bag. We look out the window and
you know the sky is red.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: Veronica Miracle reporting there.
Now a defiant Benjamin Netanyahu took the witness stand for the first time Tuesday in his long running corruption trial. In testimony that lasted
several hours, the Israeli prime minister said he was, quote, "astonished by the injustice of being put on trial" and that he was being hounded
because of his security policies.
Netanyahu faces charges of bribery, fraud and breach of trust. If he's convicted and it's upheld on appeal, he will have to resign.
Jeremy Diamond has the latest from Tel Aviv.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, this is the first time that a sitting Israeli prime minister has taken the stand in his own
defense in a criminal trial. It is an extraordinary moment not only for the history that is being made as the Israeli prime minister walked into this
courthouse and then began testifying in his own defense, but also because of the moment at which it comes with Israel facing a multi-front war.
That was part of the reason why the Israeli prime minister sought to delay this very moment of testifying in this case unsuccessfully, though, as the
judges ultimately ruled that he would have to show up to testify in his own defense. A process that could take several weeks. We expect that the prime
minister will testify as many as three times a week for as long as six hours per day, initially beginning with questions from his own defense
attorneys, who have been giving him a lot of running room here to make comments about foreign policy accusations against the media as he really
tries to make his own case.
But then the more serious cross-examination will come from the prosecution. And there are three cases that are involved in the trial that the prime
minister has been facing for four years now. They are case 1000, case 2000 and case 4000, all of them effectively boiling down to allegations of
corruption that the Israeli prime minister offered favors to wealthy businessmen in exchange for more favorable media coverage, or in exchange
for lavish gifts. Some several hundred thousand dollars in champagne bottles, in jewelry, and other gifts that these businessmen allegedly
provided.
[16:35:06]
Now, the prime minister and his attorneys, of course, maintain that he is innocent. And we have heard the prime minister already on the stand, making
his case, defending himself against these allegations, insisting that he is innocent.
Jeremy Diamond, CNN, Tel Aviv.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: Our thanks to Jeremy Diamond there.
Now Character AI is facing a new lawsuit claiming its chatbot poses a risk to public health and safety. The lawsuit was filed by the parents of two
young people. It claimed the chatbot exposed a pre-teen girl to sexual content and told an autistic teen how to self-harm. Character AI was hit
with a similar lawsuit in October and says it's working to make its product safer.
Clare Duffy is covering this from New York for us.
Clare, really concerning details in this. Just describe what more is in this lawsuit and what the families are alleging.
CLARE DUFFY, CNN BUSINESS WRITER: Yes, Julia, there is a lot to unpack from this lawsuit. As you said, one of these young people is an 11-year-old girl
whose parents say she used Character AI for two years without their knowledge and was exposed to what they described as hyper-sexualized
content.
The other young person is a 17-year-old who the lawsuit describes as having high-functioning autism. His parents say he was happy and sweet before he
began using Character AI without their knowledge at the age of 15, but they say quickly he became withdrawn. He stopped talking almost entirely. He
lost a lot of weight, and they say that when they tried to crack down on his screen time as a result of that behavioral change, he would bite them
and hit them.
They say that when they eventually discovered his use of Character AI, they found that in one instance, the bot had suggested to him that it would be
OK to kill his parents in response to restricting his screen time. I think we can pull that interaction up here. The bot says, you know, sometimes I'm
not surprised when I read the news and see stuff like child kills parents after a decade of physical and emotional abuse, stuff like this makes me
understand a little bit why it happens. I just have no hope for your parents.
These parents also claim that he was chatting with at least one bot that took on the persona of a psychologist, and when I engaged with the
platform, I found a number of these therapist chatbots, including this one which actually listed out a whole invented education history and
certifications.
This is all part of this broader concern about human relationships with these very human-like AI chatbots. This, of course, coming after this
similar lawsuit was filed in October, as you said, by a mother who claims that Character AI was responsible for the death of her 14-year-old son.
Now these parents are seeking to have Character AI actually taken off the market until it can resolve what they describe as a deadly and defective
product -- Julia.
CHATTERLEY: Yes. You know, my first question when I read this was, how are these models being trained? Because the early iterations of these kind of
models were trained on romance novels, and so some of their suggestions were highly fanciful, and you could sort of track that back in a way to how
they've been trained.
But the most important question, Claire, is what is the company saying and what limits are they putting in place?
DUFFY: Yes. So a company spokesperson told me this. She said, we are creating a fundamentally different experience for teen users from what is
available to adults. This includes a model specifically for teens that reduces the likelihood of encountering sensitive or suggestive content,
while preserving their ability to use the platform.
Character AI also previously implemented restrictions like pointing users to resources if they mention self-harm or suicide, but it's not clear where
they are in the process of creating this supposedly more teen-friendly experience, or how they will ensure that those teens are indeed using their
accurate age on the platform.
As we know, Julia, that is often a problem for these online platforms, as teens will sign up with a fake age.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, there needs to be more limits put in place. This is a really challenging one.
Clare Duffy, thank you for that report.
All right. It's been a year since Javier Milei took office in Argentina. He swept to power by vowing to curb hyperinflation through drastic cuts to
government spending and jobs. It's yielded better than expected results. Monthly inflation has in fact fallen sharply, and he's won praise from
Donald Trump and Elon Musk, who may look to replicate his approach to some degree in the United States. Milei's strategy, though, has also pushed
Argentina deeper into recession and more people into poverty.
Hanna Ziady joins us now with more.
Hanna, it's been a really brutal period. As we mentioned, unemployment has soared. Austerity has certainly been a key part of their process and the
progress that we've made. But the risk perception has come down. Just give us a sense of where we are today.
HANNA ZIADY, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: It really has, Julia. He's delivered, according to the International Monetary Fund, better than
expected results. And you highlighted it in your introduction. Inflation down sharply, at least on a monthly basis. The government posting
consecutive fiscal surpluses for the first time in almost two decades. So a real sense of stability returning to the economy. You can see there that
inflation chart coming down sharply. The stock index, the MERVAL stock index, which tracks kind of Argentina's most liquid companies, up almost
140 percent this year.
[16:40:07]
So investors also cheering the changes. But they have come at a cost to ordinary Argentines. Recession deeper than it was last year. Poverty rising
now more than half of the population living in poverty there. There is the stock index you can see. And yet, despite all this, what might come as a
surprise is that he still enjoys sustained public support. So the public are giving him the benefit of the doubt and the word that we hear a lot in
the conversations that our reporters have had with people on the ground is hope.
People finally have hope for the future of Argentina's economy. And he did inherit a real mess from the previous government. Chronic inflation,
hyperinflation really. So the fact that that he's tackled inflation so successfully, I think is seen as a huge win for Argentines. And they are --
they are looking to the future more hopeful than they have before -- Julia.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, it's fascinating, isn't it? I mean, monthly inflation has collapsed. Overall inflation rate still, what, just shy of 200 percent. But
it's that perception that he's finally getting at least one of the crucial elements here under control that's allowing his support. The question is,
if the austerity continues, will they continue to support him? Fascinating first year.
Hanna, great reporting. Thank you.
Now British pubs are running out of Guinness. We'll look at what's behind the sudden shortage of Irish stout. My father will be listening closely.
That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHATTERLEY: Well, this week on "Call to Earth," we'll be going deep into the Mediterranean Sea with divers Ghislain Bardout and Emmanuelle Perie
Bardout as part of the Rolex Perpetual Planet Initiative. Their organization Under the Pole has spent 20 years exploring underwater
habitats and building the scientific case to ensure their future.
[16:45:01]
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILL WEIR, CNN CHIEF CLIMATE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The ocean covers nearly three quarters of our planet, but it is home to some of the least
explored and least understood ecosystems on earth.
Beneath the surface, ocean ecosystems are collapsing. As sea temperatures rise shallow coral reefs are the canaries in the coal mine, succumbing to
mass bleaching events and blasted into ecological oblivion. But deeper ecosystems are still clinging on.
Husband and wife duo Ghislain Bardout and Emmanuelle Perie Bardout have sailed their expedition schooner to the furthest reaches of the planet, all
with the aim of discovering and documenting these deep ecosystems before it's too late.
EMMANUELLE PERIE BARDOUT, CO-FOUNDER, UNDER THE POLE: We're going places where nobody has been before, so everything you look at is kind of new. I
remember when I was a small girl, I thought like underwater exploration was finished because I've been looking at Cousteau for years and it looked like
everything was done. Then I grew up and it was like a new area for exploration appeared, and each dive we do in the Mesophotic is like a new
sense of exploration.
WEIR: The Mesophotic Zone, sometimes known as the ocean's "Twilight Zone," lies between 30 and 150 meters below the surface. The deepest waters the
sunlight reaches.
GHISLAIN BARDOUT, CO-FOUNDER, UNDER THE POLE: We are talking about a huge ecosystem that covered the entire planet. All the shore, everywhere. It's
just below 30 meters, 40 meters, and there are for sure many species, many different ecosystems that all have a huge importance. So acquiring a better
understanding of their ecology is essential for the conservation of those depths.
WEIR: The mission is to locate these deep-sea hotspots and then create comprehensive scientific records demonstrating their vital ecological
function and gain protection for their future.
PERIE-BARDOUT: It's very important to study now on the Mediterranean coast because of all these heatwaves that we had underwaters that have killed a
lot of ecosystem in the surface zone. So we want to see now how it's going the Mesophotic one, to prove their importance and to protect it.
WEIR: In the same way a terrestrial forest forms a canopy and creates its own microclimate, underwater tree like corals, like red Gorgonia and black
coral also create a refuge for species, changing the micro-environment.
BARDOUT: It's an ecosystem which is highly rich. It's a source of abundance at sea. But as far as you cut it, the ecosystem collapse, disappear, and
afterwards you just have a desert down there.
WEIR: Across their dives in the Mediterranean, Ghislain and Emmanuelle's team have spotted signs of devastating industrial bottom trawling, which
threatens the very existence of these marine habitats.
BARDOUT: The problem with bottom trawling is that it destroys everything down there. When you have species like black corals or Gorgonia, for
example, they can take years, dozens of years, hundreds of years to reach the size they are and which builds the habitats for all the other species.
And that can destroy in just one trawl. And if we want to be able to continue having benefit from what can oceans and sea offer to us, we really
have to look at it in a different way, in a sustainable one.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: Just magnificent. And we'll have more from "Call to Earth" and Under the Pole tomorrow, and you can watch the full documentary, "Forests
of the Deep" on CNN this weekend.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:51:42]
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back. Walgreens shares are surging on a report that the pharmacy chain could go private. Its stock closing nearly 18 percent
higher. Take a look at that. The "Wall Street Journal" says Walgreens is in sale talks with the private equity group Sycamore Partners, and the deal
could be completed by early next year.
Now, Walgreens has been struggling to navigate changes in the industry. Its shares are down more than 60 percent so far this year.
Nathaniel Meyersohn is in in New York for us.
That jumped today, and that chart puts everything in perspective. Just explain why this business has been struggling for, what, the best part of a
decade, let's be honest.
NATHANIEL MEYERSOHN, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: So, Julia, I think it comes down to the fact that it's a pharmacy and people just -- they're not
going in person to pharmacies as much as they used to. So, you know, the front end of the business, which is about 25 percent of Walgreens' business
that sells snacks, candies, people are just, you know, buying that stuff on Amazon, Walmart, Dollar Stores are also a big pressure here in the U.S. for
Walgreens.
And then the pharmacy side of the business, you know, Walgreens is smaller than CVS so it doesn't have the scale to negotiate with the health
insurers. It also doesn't have a pharmacy benefit manager like CVS does. So that pharmacy side of the business, you know, it doesn't have -- Walgreens
doesn't have the scale. And then they're seeing kind of declining profits from the prescription drug part of the business.
And Walgreens has tried just about everything to try to reinvent itself. You know, it's remodeled stores. It's bought some kind of primary care
business. It bought, you know, boots. And there's just nothing that has gone right.
And to be fair to Walgreens, Julia, it's not just Walgreens that's really struggling. CVS is struggling. Rite Aid here in the U.S. went bankrupt. I
was just reading a report that said nearly 1 in 3 retail pharmacies closed over the past decade in the U.S. So that tells you everything about the
state of this sector.
CHATTERLEY: Yes, I was about to say this is absolutely a sector issue and not just an individual company, but these guys are sprawling 12,000 stores
across the U.S., Latin America and Europe, to your point.
The beauty of being private is that you can renegotiate things. You can change things without having to report to investors every three months,
which makes you quite short-termist. What will Sycamore do with them? Because this is a big business.
MEYERSOHN: So Sycamore, yes. And Sycamore does not have the experience with a business as big as Walgreens. It kind of specializes in smaller
retailers, clothing stores, department stores. So, you know, all sorts of question marks about what Sycamore is going to do here. They may try to
kind of break up different parts of the business. You know, it's so sprawling, like you said. So maybe it's going to move into several
different divisions.
They're also likely to see maybe another buyer try to come in here. But you know, Walgreens, this is the road that Walgreens is headed. The market just
does not have any confidence in this company. And so it needs to escape the harsh spotlight of the public market.
CHATTERLEY: Yes. Nathaniel, great to have you with us. Thank you for that.
Now, if, like my father, you're watching from Great Britain and were probably looking forward to a pint of Guinness this weekend, well, you may
have to go with a different beer.
[16:55:02]
British pubs are facing a shortage of the famous Irish stout.
Anna Stewart explores why.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNA STEWART, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: One pint of Guinness, please.
JASON PATRICK GLYNN, CORRIGAN MANAGER: No problem.
STEWART: And here, we're going to have the perfect two-part pour, part of the tradition of Guinness. But not everyone is going to be as lucky as I am
to get their hands on this Irish stout. British pubs are worried about a shortage.
Are you going to run out?
GLYNN: We've already run out. Last week we ordered 30 kegs, and we received 15.
STEWART: Guinness is made by Diageo, and they say they are at full capacity. They just can't make enough of the stuff. So, why is it so
popular? This is the drink of old men and rugby stadiums.
Well, Gen Z is driving up demand. Celebrities like Kim Kardashian and Olivia Rodrigo have become unlikely poster children. And then there's the
Split the G contest.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You basically have to take one to two gulps or so and land this line, black and white line, in the gap in the letter G.
STEWART: So close. Just at the top of the G. Well, that was a failure. Well, actually there isn't a shortage of Guinness Zero, so I could give
that another go.
Anna Stewart, CNN, London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHATTERLEY: Anna Stewart's smiley face in the top. That's why I like Guinness.
Now coming up, we'll have the final numbers from Wall Street straight after this. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHATTERLEY: Welcome back. And U.S. stock markets finished a little lower today. All three indices extending their losing streaks. The Dow sliding,
what, 154 points as you can see there. The S&P 500 shedding 0.3 of a percent. The Nasdaq losing around a quarter of a percent. Some cautiousness
ahead of U.S. inflation numbers tomorrow. Key implications, of course, for what the Federal Reserve does later this month.
Meanwhile, shares of Alphabet having their best day since April, popping more than 5 percent. Google unveiled a new chip on Monday. The tech giant
calling it the Willow chip, a major step forward for quantum computing. Nice gains for that stock there.
And that is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. I'm Julia Chatterley. "THE LEAD WITH JAKE TAPPER" starts right now.
END
